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I have no real interest in who runs America but this ad is awesome. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=e9deLGjrf-A

Why the cigarette?  And that slow motion smile?

I think we can agree, that's a pretty creepy advertisement. Herman Cain seems to me to be the GOP draft pick... He's from "outside the system", he's black, and, well... I guess that's about it.

I have absolutely no interest in politics, but I have this feeling that nobody's buying it, and the GOP is going to get trounced next year. The only exception is if people see through the bullshit and take up an interest in Ron Paul. But then, he doesn't really represent the GOP.

What is a "draft pick?"

that is a weird ad. Hey is that the guy on Cain's staff who made a big deal out of not buying health insurance. He claimed it was some kind of government tyranny. Of course now he has cancer and is 400k in debt. And of course I and other tax payers are stuck with the bill.
Freakin hypocrites, what happened to "let him die".   

He's in the system alright. He used to work for the Federal Reserve. You could get no closer to an example of a puppet.

Puppet of what? 

The republicrat party, the establishment, the system, the bankers, the matrix, "they"... it goes by many names. It's the system of control that keeps you thinking inside the box, that makes you feel like you have a choice.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xbp6umQT58A

lol slavery again.  You are nothing if not consistent  ;)

If you spend 13 minutes of your time watching the video, I'll not use the slavery analogy in argument with you again.

But only if you pay attention, and report back here with your thoughts.

Conspiracy pap droning on for 13 minutes and 10 second.  Total disregard for history - after the first 25 seconds he just makes stuff up.  The Pope is a slave? Trade unions protesting job losses are masters?  Lots of videos of whipping with totally delusional comment.  Whoever made this regards history books as works of fiction and makes his own up as well.   Boris Johnson is shown - is he in the slave or master list?  He is of immigrant stock, self made man and is mayor of London with a reputation for shagging everything female with a pulse.  Surely he must be a master?  But if he is a master, why is he always being abused and why doesn't he make other people do the work?  A policeman shot someone in a subway station.  Was that a crime or something his master told him or is he a master?  Apart from the trade unionists protesting job losses, no masters are identified.  Its over and the silly sod forgot to say who the masters are?  

Its a sad video in that it assumes calling people names makes you superior to them.  You call people "livestock" or "sheeple" and think that proves you are more clever than they are.  What it actually proves is that you are comfortable calling people "livestock" and "sheeple" and that tells us more about you than about the people you are trying to denigrate.

Do you personally really believe this stuff? 

Reminds me of

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/b0b_22/akward.gif

Sounds like your filters are fully engaged, I shouldn't have expected anything different.

The masters are the human farmers, those who sustain themselves through the coerced payment (taxes) from the productive individuals.

Can you make a short list of the specific historical inaccuracies to which you refer? I'm curious what you take issue with.

The filter is reality.  The internet is awash with people with theories from marxism to the lizard masters.  That video was just one more.

Do you personally believe that you are "livestock" with an owner?

So, no specific historical criticisms?

In the same way that some animal farmers provide some level of freedom in order for their livestock to provide better milk and meat, some human farmers (bureaucrats) provide some level of freedom in order for their human "livestock" to provide more tax revenue.

Bureaucrats are poorly paid public employees.  Are you seriously saying that the clerks in the local department of motor vehicles own you?

I noticed that all of the articles about Cain hail his achievements as Godfather's Pizza CEO, but neglect to mention what those achievements were. He cut the chain from 900 stores down to 400 and got rid of thousands of employees. Does it really take a business genius to recognize that the way to make your chain profitable is to close all of the locations that aren't profitable?

Now he has a tax plan that will raise the hell out of taxes on minimum wage earners... like Godfather's Pizza employees.

I wouldn't want a guy like that to be the boss at my workplace and I sure don't want him to be the boss of my country. Forced to choose between shit and double-shit sundae with shit cherries, I guess I'll take Obama. Well, actually I'll vote third party, but still.

Isn't a cigarette like super bad in that spot?

Every politician creeps me out.

"I noticed a huge control apparatus." <slow creepy smile> "I'd like to test it out on you this January. Please yank my lever or punch my chad."

where do you put them?

Don't bother. If your "third party" isn't making a serious effort, then why vote for them? Obama is smart and a successful campaigner. I think of him as more of like chocolate sprinkles on the shit parfait that is US politics. He's better than voting on a political loser.

Democrats are getting more and more conservative. If I vote for them, I send the message that I support that shift. If enough people drop the Democrats and vote for far-left parties (haha I know), it sends the message that voters won't put up with their bullshit. It's not even about having a specific third party candidate I like, since I know he'll never win anyway. It's about trying to build support so that we will either have such a candidate in the future, or we'll have Democrats that seem like they're even still vaguely part of the left-wing. Neither are very likely, but with our country at a point where Dems seem open to ideas of gutting Social Security (a political death sentence 20 years ago, even for a Republican), it's worth a shot.

I don't see the parties as left vs. right. I see them as (mostly) intellectual vs. willfully ignorant. Sure, the Dems are shifting toward the WI, and the smart Dems have to work with the tools (pun intended) they have. Face it, the USA has crossed the Rubicon of idiocracy and will never be as good as it once was, but we can only change things for the better by getting the smart folks together and agree to stop listening to the dumbasses of the world.

Wow, can you be more disingenuous? The clerks at the DMV are to the line cooks at McDonald's as politicians are to CEOs.

Yes, the politicians own you, and with the cooperation or ignorance of a small number of people, can cast a magic spell (law) and turn you into a criminal, lock you in jail, or execute you.

Except they get a living wage, health care, and retirement.

If I had to choose, I'd rather be owned by the guy who gives me that than the one who gives me minimum wage and a coupon for 10% off a turkey at Christmas.

So if I become a politician, that means I own people.  Seems a valubale reward for little effort!
 
Do you have any statistics on how many people I own as a parish councillor?  What about a member of parliament - do they get to choose which people they own or is it random?  Is there a "no way I don't want that fat stinky guy" option as part of this ownership scheme?

Is Sarah Palin a politician and does she own people?  I know she used to be but now she sells books.  Or did she lose the people she owned when Obama won in 2008?  Were they given to Joe Biden perhaps?  

I think he's referring to George Carlin's suggestion that "they" own you. It's a provocative notion, but he didn't believe it or he would not have been so outspoken.

You're happy being a slave. That's great, good for you. I'm not, yet you give the slavemaster money to make sure I'm a slave too. Fuck you.

Just preserving this as pretending you are a slave is pathetic. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wage_slavery

What do you mean by this?

Do you also see a similarity between taxation and slavery?

Do you notice that the comparison was used to justify real slavery?

So? There is a fundamental difference between "wage slavery" and slavery. "Wage slaves" can always choose to leave and find some other way to feed themselves, whether it's becoming an entrepreneur, finding a better paying job, etc.

Still waiting for you to tell me how moving into politics would allow me own people. 

Still waiting for you to clue me in to concrete historical inaccuracies in The Story of Your Enslavement.

Since I'm not a hypocrite, I will also answer your question (with a question). What does "ownership" mean to you?

[/quote]
 What does "ownership" mean to you?
[/quote]

Means you can kill it without fear of retribution

Yes, finding a new job when everything you're qualified to do pays the same shitty wage. Sounds viable. Almost as viable as becoming an entrepreneur on a sustenance-level wage working 18 hours a day.

It's all about CHOICE, even if your choice is between abject shit and a pie-in-the-sky dream that, pretty much by definition, can only be realized by a tiny fraction of the populace.

In the first 30 seconds, he announces that the fear of death is the big problem of society.  In my experience, its people who are willing to die for their beliefs are the big problem - not the ones who are afraid of dying.  He descibes an "enclosure" movement as covering all Europe.  It didn't - Ireland never had one and as far as I know it was an English/Scottish thing.

As for ownership: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ownership

You claim to be a slave.  Who is it that owns you?

At first, I was going to dispute this, but upon second thought, this seems like a good partial definition of ownership. I would say that owning an object means you can do anything you want with it, up to and including destroying it.

I would argue that this definition fits the relationship between the fictional entity known as the State (and those that make decisions in its name) and its citizens.

Circular logic.  In a democracy, the people own the state.

Not a historical inaccuracy, a difference of opinion. Do you truly claim that humans are not alone among animals (as far as we can currently tell) in fearing death and future loss?


You truly hear exactly what you want to hear. He says nothing about Europe. Here is what he says:


Emphasized in the quote is my answer to your question of "ownership". That same model is used today, but replace "peasants" with "citizens" and "warlords" with "governments".

In what meaningful way?

Can you please answer my question? Do you also see a similarity between taxation and slavery?

Watch the whole video.  The enclosure mistake is later.

And the first 30 seconds is historically inaccurate.  There is no record of a passive people anywhere that was taken over by malicious masters.  The record is of religiously inspired militias, who's members are happy to die for their cause, taking control of territories.  That's also what you see today when states break down.  Its the guys who are happy to die for their beliefs are the big issue - not the guys who would prefer to stay home and watch TV.

I have. What time? I think you're also taking the term too literally, it doesn't necessarily apply only to the so-named movement in England.



You're completely missing the point. The people stay home and watch TV because they are afraid of death, injury, imprisonment. Otherwise, they would be out there fighting for their freedom, not sitting at home in a cage of their own making.

Only in the most ridiculously pedantic technical sense.  

Wage slavery, on the other hand, can and has produced actual, verifiable living conditions very similar to those suffered by slaves.

I know which one of those concerns me more. The one that actually happens.

You must have no friends.  People stay at home and watch TV because they are broadly happy with the system even if unhappy with their current finances.  If that changes, you have riots in the street.  Unarmed demonstators are facing soldiers in Syria right now.  They are being killed.  People who believe right is on their side will die for that belief.  Read up on the history of Protestants and then come back telling me that Protestants sit at home watching TV because they are afraid.

So, choosing to work a wage paying job, even if you have few other options (for whatever reason), is akin to slavery.

However, being forced at gunpoint to hand over a percentage of your earnings, no matter from where they are derived, is nothing like slavery whatsoever?


Can you give me an example of wage slavery being imposed by entities not sponsored and given privilege by a nation-state?

Taxation doesn't happen!?

Alright, I give up, you guys are hopeless and I have better things to do.

Again, you're basically saying that a guy who works 90 hours a week for company scrip that he can only spend in a store where bread costs $20 a loaf is less of a slave than a billionaire who pays 15% taxes on his capital gains.

How is it even possible that your brain works this way?

Seeing as how every example of big business in recorded history has existed under a government and that you'll equate any inevitable association with government as being granted privilege, then no, that would be impossible.

Can you give me absolutely any reason in the world that profit-driven businesses wouldn't still commit these profit-seeking behaviors in the absence of government?

Picking cotton for your master no doubt.  I hope you don't get whipped too much.

At any rate, the OP is wrong.

This is the greatest political ad ever:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jU7fhIO7DG0

Hahaha that is awesome. I like when he orders me to "listen up!"

But who could forget the greatest campaign meltdown ever. Enjoy.  :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBe2yn4fhtw