Bitcoin Forum

I'm banned on #solidcoin so I miss out on all the fun. But someone just sent me this:

https://i.imgur.com/LXtge.png

Not surprising, since SolidCoin is not a decentralized crypto currency. But the fact that CH/RS can arbitrarily muck with the amount of base generation coin just boggles my mind. The price of SC/BTC is too low because miners are generating too many coins? No problem, let me change the coins generated from 32 to 5 for the next 5000 blocks. WTF? Is this a crypto currency that you expect merchants to accept OR is this just monopoly money for 10 year olds?

I know the SC supporters will all come here and explain why this is a good thing. That's pretty much expected. But in the end, it doesn't really matter because we're really not arguing about the same thing. SolidCoin is not even in the same ballpark as Bitcoin/Litecoin anymore.

Oh wow.

Why are people still mining Solidcoin!?

Greed, basically.  It won't last.

I wonder he is gonna continue taxing his miners at full value  ::)

Maybe you could share your facts if you have them? What are the reasons why you are holding back your "facts"? Maybe you don't have any?

You have started the flooding, just check the quote above :)

So far Solidcoin with all it's silliness it's more valuable than litecoin. Also, don't you think enforcing control will make it last a little longer? Longer than litecoin for example.

I think this idea would push if further than Bitcoin.

Now if only there was someone in control we could all trust.  hmm.

Is there a way to vote for this?

Wow, what a joke.

at a certain point you'll be generating 0.1 coins per block, to raise coinhunter's existing coin price lol

Proof or FUD?  :D

SolidCoin supporters already know SolidCoin is very different to other Crypto Currencies, that's kind of why we're SolidCoin supporters in the first place... ;)

I'm not going to explain why the coin generation rate change is a good thing, people will have to make up their own minds about that, although I do agree with the reasoning behind the decision.

Yes, RS & the trusted nodes do have the power to change the client and the rules around block generation and there is nothing optional about this change, as the trusted nodes will upgrade to the new client and reject blocks from the old client. Continuing to run the old client will not work, which is different to if you decided to change the rules of Litecoin or Gavin decided to change the rules of Bitcoin. In those cases, people could carry on using the old client and reject your changes. Is it good for RS and the trusted nodes to have this sort of power? That all depends how much you trust them I suppose.

As an aside, I think Litecoin is small enough for you to get away with changes like this at this point, but if Gavin tried to mess with the arbitrary constants of BitCoin I think there would be a rebellion and you'd probably end up with most people not adopting the new client.

However, I'm not here to discuss the relative merits of Bitcoin, LiteCoin and Solidcoin or even the concept of trust. I'm here to correct some errors in your assertions and other assertions in this thread:

1:The Coin rate will change "Somewhere between block 45000 and 50000", exact block to be announced later.

2: The change to block generation will not take effect in Beta 8, it will take effect in a planned future release which does not yet have a version number decided.

3: The change is not "for the next 5000 blocks", I think you are being confused by the "Between blocks 45000 and 50000" part. Once SolidCoin changes to 5SC base generation per block, it will be permanent and is highly unlikely to ever change again (although it will still be possible if need be).

Thanks as always for paying such careful and close attention to the SolidCoin project and helping us spread the news of our changes. For more information, please visit the SolidCoin Wiki:

http://wiki.solidcoin.info (http://wiki.solidcoin.info)

I see. So the plan is to permanently reduce generation from 32 to 5. Doesn't this unfairly benefit early adopters? I thought one of SolidCoin's goals was to be fair to everyone. Also, can you explain the benefit of this change? If we ignore the fact that early generated coins will now be worth more, changing number of solidcoins generated in each block from 32 to 5 is in the end basically just moving the decimal point. What's the rationale behind this?

This is such bullshit. Why would the future world economy trade their government-controlled currency for a coinhunter-controlled currency? It is the same, narrow-minded view that Satoshi thinks will work for him and his BTC millions. What happened to the libertarian ideals behind these currencies? Are they really pseudo-libertarian ideals just like the wallets are pseudo-anonymous? Now SC has its band of early adopters who will spout the benefits of their currency to high heaven to encourage the gullible to scrounge for coppers that make the earlier coins worth gold.

God damn so many of you are self-serving greedy sons of bitches.

The rationale, in a nutshell, is that on the current base generation number of 32 there are too many coins being generated too quickly. We underestimated the number of miners there would be in the initial phase of SolidCoin 2.0 and now are in the position where the market is flooded with coins which are being mined for nearly zero cost and for which there are not enough buyers.

SolidCoin aims to achieve a value where 1SLC = $1-2. Even with all the stuff we have planned, this is never going to happen with the current generation rates, so action needs to be taken. Cutting the generation rate increases the cost to produce a SolidCoin and restricts the number of new coins being created.

With regard to being "fair", all I can say to you is that this has been announced in advance with plenty of warning. Everyone still has a chance to become an early adopter right now, and in fact it's much cheaper to become an early adopter now than it has been in the past.

Mining difficulty is relatively low right now and we're chucking out high value blocks like there's no tomorrow. The price of SolidCoin on the exchanges is also extremely low, much lower than it was when the chain was shut down a few weeks ago, so there has never been a better time to become an early adopter, either by mining yourself or buying up huge numbers of cheap coins - take your pick. I can't really see how we could make it any more "fair".

What i dont understand is why noone noticed that earnings dropped massivly in the past time.. No not due to diff raise but because of a simple factore.. in the beginning of SC2 the trusted Nodes took but a few seconds to mine their special blocks.. now they take almost a minute. While the chain is waiting for them nothing else gets done hence miners work for nothing, at best, dont mine and hence just waste time.. and this time wasted is but one of the ways to stop the stupid inflation in Solidcoin.. i hope SCs little Botnet wil come out again and drive the diff to more than 100k in order to have more than 64coins per block..

...

Well, I may not agree with Solidcoins' goals and all that's behind it, but for the trolls around this forum complainting about centralization, i guess you can all go blame BCX and Artforz and their lame attempts to kill it...
Besides it's funny to watch all the troll threads popping up and the Solidcoin price raising.

BCX and Artforz are failing big time. That's what you get when you are attacking something out of pure rage and lose the focus on what really matters.

...You do understand that difficulty is an attempt to cap the coin generation rate....right?  Even though SC has been broken since V1 with the asymmetric difficulty adjustments, thats the point of difficulty.  The number of miners has no effect on how many coins are produced, outside of the initial difficulty ramp up, but that was ALWAYS going to happen due to SC's broken difficulty algorithm.

If you "underestimated" the number of miners, that means there are people getting access to coins, not less.  All this does is make the early adopters get a MASSIVE boost in what their mining was worth compared to new miners.

My best guess is you meant to say:  "We expected more people to be mining with SolidCoin to get coins spread out to everyone, but it turns out it was just a few hundred dumbasses, and a small group of people that broke our fearless leader's shitty algorithm to mine more than 50% of the coins."

Not sure where you're getting your information, trusted nodes take about 1 second to generate their special blocks and it takes maybe 5-10 seconds for the trusted block to propagate through the network.

If you're saying what I think you are, you're suggesting that we should abandon the entire concept of trusted nodes, which has allowed the network to keep working normally despite being under attack, to gain a 10-20% improvement in mining efficiency? This is not a great suggestion.

There is no SC Botnet, although I have seen this misinformation spread many times throughout this board so I doubt there's much I can say to convince you there isn't. But there just isn't.

Well duh... how is he supposed to get rich unless he makes his millions of coins worth more? BTC, FBX, and LTC don't have that problem. Too bad FPX is kind of abandoned. LTC & BTC FTW.

lulz! good one!

The number of miners or amount of hashpower should have no effect on rate of coins being generated.  That is the whole reason for difficulty.  Bitcoin has managed to keep rate of generation generally predictable and even despite massive swings in utilization and hashing power.

The idea that a block chain (any block chain) needs a "glorious leader" with ability to revoke previously generated coins, frack around with generation rate, kill entire network, institute a 10% "king tax", and force mandatory changes is pathetic.

There is no need.  There is no benefit to anyone save the glorious leader.

ScamCoin isn't a crypto-currency.
ScamCoin isn't peer to peer.
ScamCoin has no future.

I'd say they're succeeding. It's because of them that there is no source code released, even though it was promised a long time ago. CH is scared to death what will happen if the source code is released and real attacks occur.

No they aren't... If keeping him from releasing the source code is considered a real successfull attack why are you contradicting yourself on your last sentence saying that only when he releases the source code the real attacks will occur?

Logical thinking isn't your thing, is it?

Maybe it isn't your thing.  Lack of source code means SC has no legitimacy.  Hell it doesn't even have a valid license for the Oracle property it is stealing.

These attacks even without source code have shown flaws in the network.  This likely means the source code will never be released or the release will be further delayed.  That undermines any remaining confidence in the network. 

That's what you say, but looking at what's happening from the outside and whitout having any real interest on the way things unfold, it's not what I see... Only BCX and his puppies, like you, see it that way.
You are all butthurt because Coinhunter doesn't let you guys belong to his little circlejerk, and everyone with half a brain already understood that.

Ten98, this doesn't make any sense whatsoever. There's no reason to target 1SLC = $1-2. What is that a target for a month, a year, 5 years, 100 years? How can you possibly set that target? And why would you when your goal is to replace the dollar? Why not let the market decide? You could easily just call it 1NSC (new solidcoin) where 1NSC = 10SLC and have that be your base coin. Then if a SLC is only worth, $.1-.2, your NSC will be worth $1-2.

This move is made by someone who does not understand economics. CH/RS may be an advanced coder (though I'm starting to doubt that seeing his hashrate bug fix/unfixed/refixed issue), he has no clue about economics and market dynamics. He's manipulating the market and artificially increasing the value of SC (just look at btc-e.com) and totally screwing over any chance of his coin succeeding long term. Yeah sure, it's a GREAT pump and dump scam, but that's about it.

To all SC supporters, make sure you cash out your SC and make some money. CH/RS has rewarded you guys well by effectively made your SC work 4x-5x times. Take advantage of that before SolidCoin dies.

Seems like the economic noob's currency is still much more successful than the one from the pro  ;)

Please define success. Does the price on btc-e define success?

Bernie Madoff made a ton of money before he was put in jail. Was his business a success before it all fell apart?

You are right, we should only consider long term... But why then everybody here states, that SC failed?  ???

I wonder what happens if the majority of people don't download the update with the change?

Does the non updated client generate 32 coins or do the central nodes smack the end nodes down and only award 5 coins or invalidate their blocks completely?

Gotta love the total lack of democracy, no opinion, just I'm going to do it, and even worse if you can't vote with your client like bitcoin.

All the fervent solidcoin supporters seem very sheepish anyway.

1. Premine 13 million SC
2. Arbitrarily raise difficulty to make SC more expensive
3. Sell premined coins
4. Massive temporary profits

Would you buy from the Central Bank of Hugo Chavez or the Central Bank of Robert Mugabe?  CH thinks you will.  This is amazing.  Instead of printing his own money (inflation), CH thinks that by deflating his currency he can in effect do the same thing to the market and not have it collapse.

Well, good luck with that.

The trusted nodes (which really should be called the RealSolid fiat nodes) will not validate any block it considers invalid (and thus goes against RealSolid rather fickle and every changing wishes).  Thus you can mine forever and even periodically find blocks but those blocks will not become part of the valid chain and thus are worthless.

Even worse if somehow you did get a block signed it appears RealSolid can simply retroactively invalidate that block and make the coins generated worthless.

Sounds like it's perfect for the likes of North Korea, Iran, Cuba, and Venezuela. Maybe that's his target market. Make the leader and his preferred cronies rich (doled out over time and can be switched on a leader's whim). Change the rules without any democratic process. Kill any success of any unwanted individuals. Forget scamcoin, how about dictatorcoin? 

Hi My name is RealSolid aka Ben Bernanke. I can make as many coins as I want.

In fact.. my buddy and I would like to go to Vegas and blow my money on Blow and hookers. Who is to stop me? I print money and make coins however I see fit

Agreed. You may not agree with the economics, but at least there's economics behind it other than 'let's change the output to try to jack up the price'.

Fiatcoin is ok, but it's lacking a very much needed socialist/tyrannical spin. I never though I would have need for a rabid conservative opinionist, but they are great at that stuff.

The difference is Ben Bernake doesn't get to decide that he needs a better pay check or an all expenses paid hookers and blow Vegas trip and start stuffing his pockets with freshly minted cash as it comes off the presses. He also doesn't get to put them into a special coffer that only he gets to manage and promise everyone that they will be doled out to him incrementally over time while the coffer is kept topped off by a tax on the entire economy for an annual all expenses paid hookers and blow Vegas trip.

In theory someone who became a trusted node through having a wallet balance > 1 million could opt not to update their client and continue validating old blocks.

Of course there's two problems with that:

1.  I'd bet the code doesn't actually support people becoming trusted nodes based on wallet balance - i.e. if you got your wallet balance over 1 million you'#d still not generate the even blocks.
2.  Reducing the production per block helps ensure noone other than RS/cronies will get to be a trusted node in the forseeable future.

And of course the above is part of the reason he can't release source because:

1.  It would make clear point 1 above,
2.  People could make modified clients to get around some of his rules.

That's clearly the plan. The selected few (plus, to a much lesser degree, the few early miners who mined during the first 24h giveaway) take it all.