Bitcoin Forum

Are we finally seeing some interest towards ProgPow? One of the main developers of ProgPow has been invited to the Ethereum Core Devs meeting 47 (Friday 28 Sept 2018).

Lets all fight for the best outcome!

Facts:

• Ethereum mining profitability has never been as low as it is now 0.015/0.018 usd/day per 1 mhash. (https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/ethereum-mining_profitability.html#log)
• Ethereum difficulty has risen this year to extreme highs (as seen with ASICS on networks such as xmr/dash/zcash)
• POS implementation will take at least one more year. Securing the network right now with POS is just not safe. POW is the better option for the foreseen future. So don't use this as an argument against making the network ASIC resistant.
• Most of the loyal Ethereum miners are being hit the hardest. Turning their rigs to XMR or even off.
• ASICS are not better for securing a network compared to GPU. People think an argument against GPU's is that they use more power and ASICS are more efficient. But this argument is invalid. Miners will continue to expand untill they are at their peak power. Whatever the machine. Total Ethereum network power stays the same.
• A huge part of the Ethereum (mining) community is asking for this hardfork. Only the initial investors (mostly not miners) are being able to vote on this issue? Yes you invested initially in Ethereum, congrats, we are here now supporting the network 24/7. Please, Listen to us.

https://github.com/ethereum/go-ethereum/pull/17731
https://github.com/ethereum/pm/issues/58
https://www.reddit.com/r/EtherMining/comments/9jcehr/developers_finally_actively_discussing_and/

Too late now, last ETH dev meeting no one seemed to care about any change. They'll find out when they're "Secure" network drops insanely and starts suffering 51% attacks, exchanges are not going to be happy.

We have the time untill october 30th, I don't see why this should be impossible to implement. The dev's also know this.

ProgPow seems to be pretty power hungry. Have tried it on BCI.

Not really more than ETASH for the little I tried

Your "facts" are completely full of contradictions.  You say that difficulty has risen to extreme highs yet then say loyal Ethereum miners are being hit the hardest and leaving. How can hashrate be shooting up yet everyone is leaving?  You also gloss over the drop in profitability.  The loss of profitability isn't because of the algo;  Its not hard to see that hashrate has doubled since this time last year, and the value has been cut in half.  Not to mention block rewards decreasing.  I have yet to see any proof of these ASICs.  There is the Bitmain E3 that is slightly cheaper than 3 1080tis and has slightly better power consumption, hardly a game changer.  People who think changing the algo on Ethereum will be a silver bullet are sadly mistaken.  It won't make the hashrate drop and it won't increase the price.

The difficulty has risen to extremes, the network was doubled in just 2 months (see: december-february https://etherscan.io/chart/difficulty)
Loyal (small) ethereum miners are being hit the hardest, and leaving. You only can't see that directly because you dont know what machines are comming online at the same time.
The loss also ofcourse has to do with the pricing!

Pleas remember this. Back when the (XMR) Monero developers forked their coin for comming asics, they hashrate dropped by 60% and stayed there. (https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/monero-difficulty.html)

The fact is, you don't exactly know how many ASICs are mining on Ethereum now. But that is another discussion. Fix it before it is too late.

But we agree on the price. ProgPow wouldn't affect the price of Ethereum.

ProgPow algo is new and based on my experience using this algo its fine with Nvidia cards.

Ethereum right now is going to 3rd rank crypto in CMC which I think it would be hard for ethereum to recover this position unless if they become a ASIC resistant but like the other said it's impossible to happen.

I think we should not forget that IF one day some Entity or Government tries to stop Crypto because it has gotten out of control,  than it would be SO easy to track ASIC farms , Networks (aka Crypto's) would get rekt. We should continue striving for GPU's to do our voting so there will always be people all over the globe securing the network!

This is one of the main reasons why most of us joined Crypto in the first place. Decentralized remember guys?

absolutely

1gpu = 1 vote

Is this you Satoshi?   :D

1 vote!! vivia la gpu!!

Don't worry people GPUs are here to stay, I have been saying this for some time despite all the negativity and FPGA and ASICs hype.
They have many use cases outside pure hashing. New markets for them are emerging and algos like ProgPoW will give them new life.
And we also have XMR devs which I admire for their dedication.

Yeah fluffly and the xmr devs are a model to follow

So, okey. Lets ETH would begun the true profitable coin with this new algo. What we`ll see 1-2 weeks later? All the miners that now are mining another coins would go to mine ETH. So, difficulty grows tothemoon, profit becomes as usial, miners coming back to their coins.
There are really huge amount of cards now. And miners becomes clever and clever. They mine profitable coins and swap coins then its necessary.
New algo cant change anything.

not everyone wants to change coins every week because some asshat doesn't want to actually work.

from what im seeing.. time to take notes. and will watch the shitstorm unfold.

keep in mind when buddy went to russia, 300k eth changed hands. these guys up to funny money business. ... watch a lot of weak hands get out.

problem is u hold .. may be lead in the end. if not it will be gold. so it's the gamble... but when devs don't do there work and people are saying shit with no good real response. fuck em.

You make no sense , if eth beomes profitable again due to half the hash removed as asics are kicked that affects and increses the profitablity of ALL coins. 

hash that comes back to ether is removed from other algos and coins which drops the hashrate there and with constant price more profit.

now if you had said all gpus will flee other algos due to the fpga and asic sccorge I would have given more credibity.

I can tell you this when eth forks other algos will fork too to stronger anti asic anti fpga algos so its a positive trend in either case

Average difficulty for October 13, 2017:  31031.012
Average difficulty for February 28, 2018:  3052.568

Am I missing something here?  Doubled in 2 months?  Think about it next time you cherry pick your stats.  To be quite frank, I don't care how many alleged asics there are mining ETH.  I'm sure it pales in comparison to the 1000 GPU farms out there mining it.

Where exactly is the proof that there are a bunch of asics out there:  https://etherscan.io/chart/hashrate

Hashrate pretty much increased with the price of the coin.

LOLOLOL  That is like saying that everyone should have a few marijuana plants in their house because if the government(s) ever tried to crack down on weed (or insert drug of choice), "it would be SO easy to track farms."

From the last dev call (not this one) it didn't seem like Vitalik was at all concerned about changing the algo.

Even if they are finally convinced and decide to switch the algos it won't be for at least another year or so with the next fork. I think the next update will be called Serenity and after that it will be Casper.

Unless there is some 51% attacks or some huge centralization issues with these ASICs, I don't think there will be an emergency hard-fork to change the mining algo.

Yes you are missing something, although the sales of GPUs plummeted in 2018, the ethereum network hashrate increased astronomically from 110k-120k in Oct 2017 to 250k - 300k in march to september 2018. Many people noticed the large increase in the ethereum network hashrate and had speculated that there are ethereum ASIC miners. This was confirmed when Bitmain announced in April 2018 that they will be releasing ethereum ASIC miners. Bitmain had been "testing" (secretly mining) them for around 5 months before the announcement.

I mean anyone who can read the difficulty charts in a time of gpu scarcity a near 100Th increase is more gpus than nivida sells in a year lol.  So many ostriches on this forum they must work for bitmain no one is legitimately this dense

The main reason why your ideas are erroneous is you are equating ethereum difficulty to ethereum network hashrate.  An increase in ethereum difficulty doesn't always mean that there is an increase in ethereum network hashrate, other factors can also lead to an increase in ethereum difficulty eg. the difficulty bomb.

the bomb was delayed wtf are you talking abou
https://etherscan.io/chart/hashrate
the hash rate is at 260k ghs righ now, it trippled from 90ghs or when the first difficulty bomb was delayed
asics hit the network that sept oct and quickly ran the network to 150 ghs , them a seccond wave took the network to 230k ghs  ghs from dec to march , which coincidentally was during an intense gpu shortage.  

for refrence 150k ghs is the equicalent of 6million gpus , thats the hashrate  rise the last 7 to 10 months

remeber profits have been down all 2018 since we are in a bear market unlike n 2017 a year of record gpu profits miners bought 3million Gpus total in 2017.

so where did this magical 6 million gpus come from this year?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.hothardware.com/news/gpu-market-q4-crypto-miners-3-million-amd-nvidia

Its simple logic buddy , its not rocket sience just follow the numbers

asics attacked and killed off gpus.  the over all market capped dropped from 1.2 trillion to 300 billion

the industry can not survive without gpu coins.

simple math

Does "eg." mean anything to you? The difficulty bomb is just an example of one of the other factors, apart from network hashrate that can cause an increase in network difficulty. Stop ignoring them in your analysis of the ethereum network difficulty.   

Wait a bit. This algo will be applied to ETH or for all coins?
Ok, some hash will move from other coins to ETH and profit will grow for all coins. Then the miners will power on their rigs if profit will become nice again.
I dont believe in big profit for a year at least. It`s time to move out all the shit that came in crypto last year.

3 million gpus worth of hash removed from the ethereum network(conservatively) would not be replaced for at least two or three years at current profit levels, profits would at least tripple for existing miners especially if etc, metaverse and a host of other coins fork along with ethereum.

we all know they are followers not leaders, etc especially basically duplicates every change ethereum makes or at least follows a similar update pattern.

Thats what I am saying, it would be naive to think if ethereum successful forks to progpow and the hash rate goes from 270gha to say 150ghs, other coins won’t fo the same.

the precedent is there, after xmr forked to cn7 we saw a host of cn coins , pretty much all the profitable ones fork to different variations of cn.  Even etn forked but had to fork back due to thier low hashrate being susceptible to 51% attacks becuse they never got thier targeting adjustments in