Bitcoin Forum

If you had bought gold from 1978 to 1982 you would have lost a whopping +84% of your money on gold, that's how volatile historically gold is,

Yet we're frequently told the world is coming to an end, that BTC is too volatile, yet on the other hand, we're told that GOLD is 'virgin marry herself' of perfection in a real asset.

BTC has many shortcomings, but it was 'FIRST' and that means a lot in the world of TECH, it always has and always will.

Let's look at the historical thing on 'First', back in 1984 there was Lotus 123, a spreadsheet for IBM pc's, it was the holy-grail of software, they were 'first', yet there was also visicalc on the early apples years earlier, so they really weren't first,  but Mitch Kapor founder of Lotus said "If you want to be rich in the PC biz, you just need a garage, a computer and $5 million bucks" [ The joke here is the the $5M was for marketing, as that is secret-sauce of 'success' ]

The world of BTC isn't much different than early 1980's, today if you want to be rich in BTC, you need a garage, and mining racks and of course 'free electricity'. China isn't giving electricity away for free anymore so lots of miners have had to pull the plug, everywhere including Canada, and USA, even I have pulled the plug for time being, given that power cost/profit parity is now zero-gain, even in the GPU world for alt's. It doesn't pay to mine, the only thing that I see that pay's is running super-servers for alt-coins that pay you to run secure transaction servers.

Another thing said about 'TECH' is  ...

1.) You got to be first
2.) You got to be the BEST
3.) You got to be the fastest

Well BTC was the first and it ain't the best, and it sure is HELL is not the fastest, thus there is lots of room for improvement, if your 3 of 3, then you become a billionaire, if your one of the three then its easy to make millions.

Today we're not even close to a "BEST" bitcoin clone, and we don't even have anything to consider as the 'fastest'

ETHEREUM is a fucking DOG, forget about it,

99% of all the shit, is a BTC clone, with virtually no added value to the software, a complete re-write, once the problems are well known will be required, to establish 2 or 3 above

I think in this area of "BEST", privacy/security should be considered as the TEST, as BTC is NOT private, it ain't secure, and it sure as hell ain't fast.

My personal favorite is ZEN/ZCASH world with maximum security, and especially the fact that they have 1,000's of secure & super-servers all over the world completely detached and encrypted, and the people hosting these servers get paid in crypto so there is an incentive, in BTC there is no incentive as mining is the incentive, but it doesn't pay to mine, so eventually the servers for transactions have no incentive to stay on the grid.

Everything is FINE folks, BTC is going to be just fine, but remember BTC is the end-all, be-all it was just first, and PEOPLE really need to be working on the next generation shit, and forget about putting band-aides on the geriatric dinosuar,

Hmm,

Do you know what happens when the price of gold decreases,
the utility use of it increases.

Meaning more gold is used in Jewry , more gold is used in electronics, more gold is used in dentistry.

Basically the lower prices gold has other uses absorb it supply and help maintain price over time.

Bitcoin only real use is as a payment system , no matter it's price.
Many fools try to say btc is a store of value, the recent 80% loss in value should give those idiots a clue.
  
Low Price BTC is used as a payment system , the higher btc price the less effective payment system it becomes, as transaction fees become excessive.
BTC HAS NO OTHER REASON FOR EXISTING, and no other usage to offset a price drop.

BTC is INFERIOR TO GOLD & SILVER, because of it's lack of utility and dependence on ASICS miners that can't maintain profitability due to an energy waste issue that has been completely ignored since 2013.

If the ASIC miners quit, btc dies, no one can quit and your gold quits being gold.

Gold's other uses remain and no one needs to spend millions of dollars per month to keep it running like btc.

Lol. I don't agree with you at all op. You are trying to state that Bitcoin is based on an archaic technology which is why it needs to be abandoned in favor of coins which have better technologies behind them, but you are sorely mistaken.

99% of the world population associate the cryptocurrency market with Bitcoin for many reasons. Not many people recognize Ethereum or Ripple which are 2 of the best cryptocurrencies in the market at the moment.

Bitcoin has been the king of this market for a long duration of time for obvious reasons and I am confident that it will stay as the king forever. No coin comes close to Bitcoin in terms of popularity levels.

the unfortunate thing is that everyone wants to own more bitcoin and they all know two things. first is that if the price is lower then they can  continue buying more of it compared to when the price is higher. and second is the unfortunate fact that they know whenever there is a manipulation and FUD, they can make a lot of money from the market by shorting bitcoin and/or buying it cheap at the bottom.
so what we end up seeing is a lot of FUD calling bitcoin dead. and it has been going on for years. there is even a very long obituaries page for bitcoin from all the biggest cases of them calling bitcoin "dead"!

yes, bitcoin is called digital gold on crypto investment, forever bitcoin will live like gold even though the price is so fast changing but bitcoin will be the best for the future

true, except that nobody has ever been FUDing gold half as much as they are FUDing bitcoin and not even at the same large scale!!! so i think it is safe to say that when bitcoin drops like this despite all the circumstances it is performing well in some ways!

Hard to compare with gold because there is global demand by governments and has been around for over a thousand years. When bitcoin is used by governments, it will pump like hell

BTC is the new gold - Absolutely wrong statement!

Gold has been used since ages for investment as well as for making ornaments and related things! Bitcoin is not an investment - Get this fact straight!

People who are crying over the falling price, are investors of bitcoin who are here because bitcoin shown potential to make them rich! They don't see the potential now and crying foul because they are neck deep into debt.

Bitcoin is a currency system which should be used as a currency. However, my advice to the investors is, take advantage of the discounted price now!

Gold is a physical commodity and gold is not a currency strongly so at that. So there is more attention giving to the situations of cryptocurrency that gold

The Bitcoin market is much younger than the gold market, or any other. It is therefore always easier to criticize it until he has proven itself.
2 or 3 weeks ago the Gold price went from €40k to €30k within a week, nobody was blaming gold as "dead".

Sure Bitcoin isn't perfect but as you said we have plenty of room from improvements. Yes, Bitcoin isn't private, isn't fast, etc this is where the altcoins come to be complementary. I prefer Horizen (ZEN), for its privacy and its resilient network with maybe more nodes than BTC. People who participate with a node get an equal share of 10% of the block reward too

Please stop calling Bitcoin as a gold.

It seems as though the commenters above are right,

Bitcoin, when cheap, is a means of payment. 
 
Bitcoin, when expensive, is a store of wealth (simply because it cannot be a means of payment.). 
 
But it seems that Bitcoin is almost as volatile when it is a store of wealth (expensive) rather than a means of payment (cheap.).
 
Makes me wonder whether Bitcoin Cash then is the true Bitcoin...

If certain people fud gold as much as they do to btc, gold wouldn't cost what it costs today. I think it's silly to compare gold which has its purpose to bitcoin which is ultimately a digital currency that has different purpose than gold. Fair comparison would be other cryptocurrency who aren't doing so well either.

I would say that this comparison of Bitcoin with gold is wrong because to my opinion these are two completely different categories. And saying that Bitcoin is new gold probably isn't meant literary, more to get picture od the value for the users.
Anyway, Bitcoin is risky as any other investment, you haven't to count on volatility all the time and that from time to time you could face possible losses. No one hasn't ever guaranteed that Bitcoin will bring only and exclusvely profit. Afterall, the choice is always yours and it isn't good to blaim others for wrong estimations and decisions.

Btc is a completely different kind of asset. Btc can't be compared to gold, although it's may become as much worthwhile to hold. The deflative nature of btc will allow it to surpass gold in the future.

Gold is very different than Bitcoin. We shouldn't really compare both of them because the differences is quite obvious.

To me, bitcoin is another form of precious gold and even bitcoin is considered to be as digital gold. Though bitcoin is highly volatile in price, in fact, it is its natural quality in the crypto world. But guys we cannot totally mix bitcoin with the gold cause bitcoin is the digital currency and it has different nature.

maybe they said "gold is dead" back in the time too. how are you so sure nobody said it? the thing about bullshit is that it doesn't really stored in the history. for example if that website never started the "bitcoin obituaries" thing we may not have known that there were a lot of people bullshitting about bitcoin all these years and bitcoin is not even 10 years old yet. now imagine if it was as old as gold, all this will be forgotten by then as if nobody ever called it "dead". every one of them would praise bitcoin as if they have been doing it all along :D

BTC is limited and it will end soon and the price rises to $ 10,000. This can happen in the next 5-7 years. I think you don’t need to compare with gold, because Bitcoin has noble goals

The use case of good cannot be compared with that of Bitcoin not to mention how long and what it took gold to stand firm till date. To me, Bitcoin is still in the infant stage and still got a long way to go before it can be compared to gold.

Haters gonna hate. And yes, it's a pretty viable association, 'cause BTC is called digital gold know. Doesn't really matter for anyone who knows a bit more than "journalists".

All coins from the top 30 are very promising and thanks to them you can earn a lot of money

I am believe people who always talking about current price is people who bought bitcoin at highest price and right now they suffering loss on their portfolio. They should not panic with this bear market because most investment market drop the value too. I am believe bitcoin is long term investment and it will profitable in the future if we keep hold it

That is true, i think it is because the price of gold is stable. Even if gold price down, it will going down with a slower rate.
Different with cryptocurrency, cryptocurrency have possibility to falling down greatly in the market because it's price is not stable.
Volatility is the main characteristic of cryptocurrency, and the main difference with fiat currency and gold.

Sorry, I only see one use for BTC, and that is to move wealth during war.
Take the holocaust, if it were to happen today, people couldn't hide diamonds/gold on their person, the Nazi's now scan for all this stuff, so people need a way to move their wealth out of regions of war and start over.

For 1,000's of year in ASIA people kept a bag-of-gold on hand, and during an attack, farmers would grab the gold, and a little food the family and run like hell, and start over.

Today its still this way, but NOW governments are in control, and they plan to "Asset Forfeiture" everything

I don't see bitcoin as a 'bank', I see bitcoin a CONDUIT and nothing more, GOLD is great cuz you can bury it, you can't bury BTC, and its 1/2 life is no longer than the time it takes to crack ECDSA -SecP256k1 ( 12 years on average to break a new NSA algo ), but for short term moving wealth BTC, is where its at this point in history.

But GOLD isn't stable, its historic volatility is just like BITCOIN today

The only thing that can be said for either is BUY low and SELL high, this HODL non-sense is for maroooooons.

Like I mentioned above, BTC is only as good as the ALGO for encrypting the key, and NO algo ever released by NSA has gone for more than around 10 years before its cracked. 

Well fiat-currency is backed by MURDER, CIA with its ownership of the worlds drug trade, only exists to force the world to use US-DOLLAR to trade heroin, cocaine, ... US-MIL forces the world to buy oil in USD, this is the power of FIAT, BTC has no such power.

GOLD of course is not backed by death,

Most likely the future of crypto is a super-computer that has an incredibly powerful encryption algo, that is the only way to make crypto-currency safe, but on the other hand the little-people will always make a PGP, and one-up the GOV, and the GOV will always come out with a new SECP256-k1, and the NSA will continue to have 'satoshis' feed new cryptos unto the sheeple.

The comparison is that both have a 90% volatility risk in their recent history.

NOBLE GOALS? Pray tell what are they?

BTC is a religion, its founder is a ghost, the promoters are get rich-quick conmen who prey on the dumb. BTC is much like Scientology.

There is the technology of BTC which is 'good' in the sense of code that works, but the people involved in BTC are 99% get rich quick con-men, really PONZI-PEOPLE. BTC is not a ponzi, but those who promote the exchanges, and all the non-sense associated with HODL are Ponzi-People.

BTC cannot rise like the past, because the balloon has lost its hot-air, the rise in 2017 was from FED FIAT, and credit-card debt, both have been taken away from the party. Now idiot will have save their penny's to buy BTC to get a rise, don't count on the rich investing in BTC as those would did, and the majority would sell out if they could cover that did buy in, BTC still has a long way to go down, before it can even stabilize and find its mean-reversion.

Yes gold market ups and downs but not in such a way whole year down and down that's why people's are panic and in tension and taking some wrong decision as market again drop down because predictions at end of this year and start of next year market of his top.

If you bought GOLD in 1978, and HODL your gold until 1982, you would have lost near 90% of your wealth.

Historically GOLD has performed exactly as BTC is performing now, because then and NOW its speculation ran by FOMO, BTFD, and just plain ignorance that causes parabolic gains.

Parabolic gains, always come back to earth, like Gold, like Bitcoin.

Bitcoin and gold both are not same they are much different in nature. Although many people called bitcoin as a digital gold, in fact, bitcoin is a digital cryptocurrency which is used for making payment and transaction. Gold has a physical structure and people made ornaments by this but bitcoin has no physical existence.

you can't compare bitcoin and gold
both are different commodities
gold has the use of jewelry and investment
whereas bitcoin is a tool for transactions from anywhere to anywhere
and one more thing bitcoin can't become jewelry
so please stop calling bitcoin as New Gold

well, referring the thread title you might say "Gold has been around for millennia and when it was down 90% Nobody said >Gold is Dead<, what about bitcoin?"

I answer, that bitcoin has not been around for millennia and that is the difference, don't you think?

Yeah Bitcoin is called digital gold of crypto world and it will become more protensial in future and price of Bitcoin will increase very much. That's why we love Bitcoin and all crypto investor believe on Bitcoin value.

 Older people are more trusting gold because it is already tested and proved, so i can surely think that gold would never loose its value completely.

Here's a good read about Gold's bubble and its historical burst (https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the-day-gold-died-2013-04-16) or this one (https://stepupmoney.com/your-gold-investment-can-be-actually-a-dead-asset-heres-why/)This article was written in 2013, so yes, Gold has its fair of share about being declared as dead because the price plummeted. So your argument is flawed at the very beginning.

This is one of the most annoying comparisons that has been going on for far too long.  Gold and Bitcoin are not the same thing and there should really be no comparison.  A proper portfolio should be well diverse and having both gold and bitcoin can often make sense.

Well the PRESS or the past two weeks has been declaring BTC dead, and obviously the draw-down of BTC was to be expected, nothing goes parabolic, without a collapse to follow, but like GOLD its not going away, simply mean-reverting to its TRUE VALUE, before the idiots came to the test post Jan 2017 and drove up the price with credit-card debt, and FED-FIAT for free. Now there is no MORON money coming to the table, so the  VALUE of BTC will more reflect its value as a means to move assets from A to B during a crisis ( think war ), GOLD can no longer be used and diamonds with the advent of modern body scanners, so now the only SAFE way for people to move vast wealth when they flea a country is with something like BTC, so its NOT going away.

People with wealth will crawl back to it once they see it mean-revert, just like gold has had a safe- band at $1200 for a long time, but it could drop to $1k tomorrow, but that's ok

For now the problem with btc is it could possibly drop back to $400, I think $1400, but $400 is possible;

Lastly the NOTION of INVESTING in BTC is a zero-sum game, its a 50-50 roll of the dice, there is NO  certainty of future value, thus according to Satohsi Math ( Kelley Criterion ) F=2*P-1, when P=0.5, you invest ZERO in something, once BTC falls below its MEAN-REVERSION level then its possible that the P, will go one way or the other,

The problem for now is the UP side is that a WAR tomorrow could drive BTC up but its not likely, on the other hand BTC will continue to draw-down as the idiots are force to close-out.


...

BTC for mining is OK, get it for free, especially early, but now its too late to mine, an S-9 Antminer ( bitmain ) will fetch you a loss of $1/day today, so its no longer profitable to mine. Difficulty could drop, but with so many S-9's laying around dormant it will be easy for people in places with cheap-electricity to pick them up, so for most people btc mining will never again be profitable.

IMHO the only profitable way to play BTC is to hack it, and get it for free, runn GPU class mining rigs to find 'lost' pristine SATOSHI pre-2013 coin, is far more profitable than mining. I call this the BTC inflection point, where metal-detecting on the beach looking for lost gold, becomes MORE profitable that scanning the same detector on a river in an old gold mining area. Most people aren't looking for lost-coin, in time that too will dry up, like all things that do, I suspect we'l soon see HW/SW packages sold by china for searching for lost bitcoin gold-dust.

The comparison was that they both in recent historical history have seen near 90% total loss of value, that is as far as the comparison has gone.

If you dispute this reality, then what is a mother to say?

The reason for this OP post is that I have read far&wide in the past weeks that "BTC is DEAD", because of the 90% collapse in its total market capitalization, well then why haven't I seen that logic for gold? Well its because people are more comfortable with gold, and its not going to go away, well if your smart enough to HOLD it physically in your possession ( like they do in Asia ).

I think that is possible to have a crypto-currency, that is safe, secure, and private; The problem is bitcoin was not designed for that purpose, it was designed to be tracked, it was designed to be controlled, it was designed to be taxed.

People talk a lot about 'community' here but what they mean is status-quo corporate communtiy ( the true owners of the deep-state ), SHA-256 is NSA, ECDSA-SECP256k1 is NSA, everything about BITCOIN is NSA, which means that they have the back-door, as never in my lifetime have I seen NSA release a public-domain algo, where they didn't hold a back-door.

Libertarians such as the early promise of Satoshi, believed in 'power of the people', but its clear now that BTC doesn't empower people it empower criminals ( exchanges ), and it isn't safe, secure, or private.

CORE must make a decision, come out with a SECURE/PRIVATE bitcoin, or accept the fact that some new COIN will become the 'coin of the people'.

Crypto is great, crypto is the future, but there is a war, between absolute control of everything  by BEZOS/JACK-MA, and the little-people; Posting here is like being in the hornets nest, but people need to wake up, and choose the blue or red pill.

Bitcoin price is much better than gold. Early 2017, bitcoin price at $900 and right now at $4300. Its still profitable except for people who bought at highest price. But many people panic and selling their bitcoin at cheap price and i am believe bitcoin is better than gold because its digital and more flexible.

Wow, what can I say???

I can go yesterday, today, and tomorrow anywhere and sell GOLD 24/7, anywhere on earth,

With btc, I need to find an asshole (exchange) who trades, and maybe gives me 20% haircut both directions,

You go ahead and buy your BTC, and I will buy gold. :)

When I could mine btc for free it was a good deal, but BUYING btc was always a fools game, per the kelley-criterion. You don't place bets on 50/50 odds. BTC is rolling the dice, its NOT investing, the price support of BTC has no historic basis, the entire PONZI could evaporate tomorrow.

For gold its pricey right now, but below say $1100 I would accumulate,

On the other hand I would not BUY btc for any price, like I said it was MEANT to be mined for free, that's how it was designed, this day-trading  ( &HODL) bullshit was created by assholes to fleece sheep.

GOLD has a stable floor price, but BTC has no floor, it could go to zero anytime. ZERO

you must be really naive to think that people put higher value on gold compared to bitcoin on a bitcoin forum that you start such discussions and then tell others that you are buying gold instead of bitcoin :D

 :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Couldn't agree more!

I like to compare gold and BTC as well, I often use this comparison to assure people that BTC is not dead and it will not die. First of all, both these assets are scarce and that is the biggest benefit. Some day, we will mine both of this completely and what do you think that will happen to the price? Gold is a metal, shiny metal that people gave value to at some point in history. Then it penetrated the market and everyday functions and it takes the primate of the market. The same thing is happening with BTC. It is steadily being implemented in different segments of life and it is here to stay.

I do not understand why people try to compare Bitcoin with gold. They are completely two different instruments that are used for completely different things. Such a comparison is as pointless as comparing companies shares to fiat money.

that's really true bro. but what makes me wonder. there are some of my friends. who saves. their assets in gold bro. because they see that investing in gold is more profitable than investing in bitcoin bro. even though such thoughts are very wrong

i think nobody dont talk gold is dead because gold have the physic form. it makes the people who have the gold have the opportunity to use it in another way. like the jewelry and anything else. how about bitcoin? many peopel said that bitcoin is abubble because of this. bitcoin just used for digital currency. nothing else.

I think this quite different that when the price of gold decrease people wouldn't says gold died because gold has been became an valuable commodity since thousands of years ago and people also consider gold as good investment tools even for long term gold still good but for bitcoin if people says bitcoin died when the price fall because most people still doubt about the future of bitcoin that whether bitcoin will survive or not