Bitcoin Forum

Thoughts everyone. In general we really should be focusing and promoting the original vision of Bitcoin and Crypto as a Peer to Peer system. Vs as a means to invest in to get more FIAT. The Fiat system is a failure, so why should be keep feeding the bear.

Don't you all want to get your economy back and become more independent from central control.

Why or why not you want this to happen? thoughts.

This will take time. Humanity is going to transition from government controlled money to independent (p2p) money. The concept and implications themselves are world changing, and people simply take time to adapt, even after learning about it (which is still far from done, even after 10 years of BTC).

Of course we want to quickly get rid of the State messing with the money anytime they want, and inflating it because they need people to be in eternal debt "to stimulate the economy"...

What is important for me is that Bitcoin allows peer to peer transactions, not that it requires them. So long as this is true I have the advantage of being able to conduct direct peer to peer transactions when I wish, while keeping the convenience and utility of other arrangements (such as lending platforms and "banking" services) the rest of the time. The future is not all-or-nothing because financial transactions occur for myriad reasons and in innumerable situations. What Bitcoin provides is greater flexibility in addressing those situations than was possible with centralized fiat systems. That is part of what gives it enduring value and the opportunity to supplant centralized fiat systems going forward.

A lot of friends here who  once used the bitcoin in an online investment think is a Ponzi scheme for it been majorly use by some scammers promising high returns. Sometimes it's difficult trying to teach an old dog a new trick, because he thinks he knows it all. The only convincing evidence for them is until I Lambo with my bitcoin trade, by then it may well just be above their reach. The truth is that: Men have not been hit economically to point of desperation, until then they will continue to cherish the fiat.

the fiat system is a pretty bad one and in many countries it is corrupted but it still won't go away because fiat is not something that just dies one day even if bitcoin was at mass adoption stage and every one was using it for their day to day transactions, fiat would still be around because bitcoin is an additional option and is not meant to replace anything.

Initial, the intention of many investors is because of the peer to peer payment system but as time goes on,  when the price of bitcoin continued to increase and a lot of hodlers gaining from it, the main interest shifts from the payment system to profits. Since we man are opportunist and greedy,  we urspe the opportunity.

Although we all know that the fiat system may be used in corrupting people than using decentralized Bitcoin that have peer to peer transaction system which is having transparency to anyone. After the barter system, fiat was found and created, until now it has existed.
I think it takes some time to bypass the fiat over Bitcoin. Because Bitcoin needs mass adoption and of course to become legitimately used as a payment system. As of now, let's accept the fact that we can only use in trading and holding.

Why is it that many hates the use of bitcoin as store of value / investment? it isn't ignoring the fact that we can use it as peer to peer system. Everyone is free to use it with the choice that they want to, as the original vision as p2p or as an investment.

Bitcoin means freedom and that's why we, as users has the freedom of choice whether to use it as an investment or payment. The payment usage isn't even forgotten, there's nothing wrong if everybody will use it as both.

Everyone wants fairness, and in particular this system also grants everyone the right to access and transparently see others about FIAT. The FIAT system is becoming obsolete, and most people use hard cards for paper money replacement services. This may be one of the significant changes if crypto is accepted worldwide.

It takes time to develop the infrastructure for a peer to peer payment system where you can pay for daily goods without fiat. Also, making money attracts more people which is good for bitcoin

firstly fiat has many many bad things. bitcoin should not be trying to attain FIAT status. it should not add more silly features to make it FIAT-esq by bloating up the txbytes which end up reducing the transaction count/utility potential.

pandering features towards big business and services while ignoring the concept of individual control is not a aim developers should be striving for

secondly bitcoin should remain as the open other choice to fiat. EG an escape route away from fiat. as oppose to trying to make it into and to replace fiat

bitcoin wont become the "one world" currency. and if it did. it will be a worse situation than the fiat situation average joe is stuck in today

doing silly things like shout out Myspace systems cant handle the membership so how about try facebook is not going to make myspace any better. and the same goes for the guys saying bitcoin cant handle X so try a different network

bitcoin should get back to being the slim, lean transaction protocol that just sends funds from one address to another. allowing more transactions per second, meaning more people able to transact. and also implementing a proper fee mechanism where those that spent their funds with least confirms pay higher price as a way to only punish spammers and make the spammers the ones that find other networks a convenience.

in the real world people only spend with their visa card 1-2 times a day on average. so yea bitcoin does not need to push average joe over to other networks. it just needs to push a small NICHE of spammers off the network and into "convenience" services and networks. bitcoin does not need to punish every user with higher fee's during spam/high demand. as a fee mechanism will just make those regular spenders pay the price while not harming the occasional shopper with surprise new higher fee costs

as for the blockchain data itself. there are multiple ways to handle it without having to pressure people to give up their individual control. again pushing people into vaults/custodians is not the future bitcoin should aim for

rigth now, we need both Fiat and BTC together, we can't dump fiat and go BTC all the way, we need time for that.

Exactly, Fiat will not be replaced by BTC anytime and globally the governments will not allow for this as their main motto lies on corruption, that's the reason a lot of government are still holding crypto currencies by banning them. that's why they have kept it as a secondary option.

In my opinion fiat and bitcoin cannot be compared and compared, because these two currencies have different worlds. In my view, bitcoin is more suitable for digital transactions, but fiat is more suitable for real transactions

There are lots of special features are there in the development of Bitcoin and it can be definitely don't know by lots of people and still many people don't know about Bitcoin system and its technology development it will not recognised by lots of people still now.

I sympathize with your point, but it's impossible to separate Bitcoin's network value from greed. Its scarcity of supply means that as demand rises, so does price. Inevitably, that means speculators entering the market to capitalize on those gains.

It's not just about gaining fiat money either, but about purchasing power. At some point, Bitcoin will hopefully become a popular unit of account with its own self-sufficient economy. At that point, holders won't need to sell for fiat money to realize gains. They'll be able to spend their bitcoins for anything they need.

There are very few people who don't look at Bitcoin as profit. And we can not blame anyone about it, because everybody needs current money to live. I am sure who understands about cryptocurrency knows that this system is better than traditional. But unfortunately, we are not responsible for accepting. And without doubt one day they will be forced to use this system and this time is not far away.

Yea unfortunately the majority in the world dont care about bitcoin, they
are blind to what it can offer. They are too busy either trying to survive,
are so wealthy or are in the middle going through their daily routine.

We can still use bitcoin as a peer to peer payment system but the bitcoin
ecosystem is not yet evolved enough to realise this. As long as we BUY
bitcoin it will be used as an investment. When we can earn bitcoin and
widely spend it then the ecosystem will be better.

I'm one of them who think it would be better to take bitcoin as p2p currency. Why should we take it as investment opportunity? Why most of the people aren't still willing to use bitcoin as a daily life currency? Those 2 questions are related one with another. As long as bitcoin is highly volatile, it will not be accepted as a daily life currency. Merchants may have some option to get approx $$ value, I'm not sure if it exists but I am sure that there was an ICO which aims to take bitcoin as payment from customer and pay fiat to the seller. It may be a solution but still it's not fulfilling the objective of p2p. We have to depends on other. The possibility of being bitcoin used as a daily life currency instead of fiat is likely low and one of the resistance is the volatile nature of bitcoin which is being occured because of taking it as an golden chance of making profit. I'm not against it though. Just I think the future of bitcoin in this way.

Bitcoin main purpose is peer to peer with no central authority controlling our transactions which is proved in all 9 years of bitcoin existence

maybe it yes, bitcoin will created for all people that want to peer 2 peer system, as we know there are many things in blockchain and bitcoin that work peer to peer. the real thing will not happen right now, but i think in the future we will see about this

In ideal form p2p, there shouldn't be an intermediate for a transaction or payment process but it is impossible to achieve. By saying p2p, people mean that this intermediate's fee rate has to be less enough to be ignored and the intermediate's control on the system should only be enough to make the process or transaction. For example, the intermediate shouldn't know persons' identity and keep assets on its own internal system.

Every people have their own choice to decide whenever they want to do what kind of transaction they want to.

For me, I just want use bitcoin as investment purpose, of course every people have different way to do but IMO, it's the trully way of cryptocurrency being created !

So this way, I think every system will still have weaknesses, however, as well as this P2P, you say P2P systems are only to be invested so that they can produce more FIAT, then disfigure the FIAT system. maybe what you mean is you want a system that monopolizes the economy in other systems.
I dont think that your goal will be right on target.

It will be better for terms of economics but is humanity ready for this? If there will an election about BTC acceptance, make sure 90% will not want to accept it. Because most people do not even know what is going on with money system. Suddenly we should not expect the transition to digital money.

If you are allowed by the govt, mostly they will have an access to your fund. Therefore, it's not decentralized. Isn't crypto's one of the purpose is to ensure decentralization in currency/payment system?

The Satoshi vision for Bitcoin was for it to function as a alternative P2P payment network, as stated in the Bitcoin White paper. Satoshi realized that centralized payment networks and even government reserve currencies was highly ineffective in a changing global financial system and that most of these centralized payment options was corrupted and exploiting people.

Satoshi then developed this software to function as a alternative option, if people wanted to break away from these systems. Now, most people are not using it as a payment option, but rather as a speculative commodity.  ::)

That is actually the ideal situation that all should be looking forward to but then we can not deny that this is not yet happening at least on the massive scale and in fact there is no guarantee that this is going to be the prevailing scenario in the near-term and even long-term basis as there are many impedimenta and factors that have to be considered first. We can not get away the control of the state just with the kind of money or medium of exchange we are using...no it can take more than that. Maybe decades from now this can be a big reality but not for now...and this is why many people are craving for institutional money to come to prop up the price of Bitcoin and the whole cryptocurrency market.

I agree with this statement.
I dont think the majority of humans on this planet can grasp this concept of BTC, let alone a total transformation to digital money.
It will need to become much more widely accepted before it can be viewed as anything other than a P2P at this point.

Yup! That's right but sad to say there are so many hindrances for btc to be used on Peer to Peer transactions, main examples of these are the  oppositions such as the private and national banks, the ones who hate the concept and can see loopholes on it and the lack of interest of fellowmen. So, even how hard we advertise crypto it will be still hard to achieve the mass adoption if these problems will not get a solution.

However, I can say that the growth of crypto community looks fine. Different blockchains are already used for various industries, new investors are coming, top crypto such as btc, eth and ltc got more popular; I know that we're way too far to crypto revolution but at least we are making progress and that's already a thing you can be proud of.

i also agree that bitcoin and any other cryptocurrency must be used as a P2P system rather than what we are having right now.
but we also cant deny the fact that as of today a P2P system will be hard to initiate since there is still a lot of people who sees cryptocurrency as a means of investment rather than a form of currency.
therefore we still cant stop them from converting it to fiat in order to be useful for them.

I don't want to say that the current monetary system is a failure at this moment because aside from its negatives, it gave also some positives to humanity. Now that a new monetary system has been created, it will take time for the people to use this system. Its complex and there are some establishments that need to eradicate in order for this system to be implemented world wide.

Well, Bitcoin has been created for a peer to peer system. It has been created so that these third party establishments will be remove.