Bitcoin Forum

Just a Question that has me stumped and maybe someone with more knowledge on the Financial aspects of trading can help me out.

So i Do a lot of trading on Bittrex. I have been dabbling with a low dollar amount(Below $100) to minimize any stupidity on my part and losing it all lol

So no matter what i do i can't seem to understand how the price rise in BTC market affects altcoins like Dogecoin dropping in price.

Seems when BTC goes up in value Doge drops....What am i missing?? Seems it would be plain as day but i'm not a pro in trading obviously.

Can anyone Enlighten this Idiot? lol
Thanks.

Altcoins do not follow the Bitcoin to the nearest percentage. If BTC increases +2% it doesn't mean the altcoins will to increase by 2%. The evidence is more obvious if you look at a graph over the long term. You may see better that the trends are the same. (don't just look at dogecoin)

Perhaps a reason DOGE is going down when BTC is going up is that people are selling their DOGE to buy BTC.

All of that is the way the market works. Bitcoin goes up Alts down, Bitcoin goes down Alts goes down, Bitcoin is stable, Alts can be stable or even up
When bitcoin goes up it means the demand of bitcoin is getting higher, while you see DOGE pair BTC which means those trader also have demand with Bitcoin by sell their DOGE.

There are altcoins that are highly dependent on bitcoin, and there are those that do not depend on it. Accordingly, you could compare the charts of the currencies you are interested in and understand how dependent they are. The price of some altcoins can also move in the opposite direction from the bitcoin.

Yes this could be the 90 percent chance in all the reasons out there.
Sell altcoin buy bitcoin and try to ride the wave.
It just happens and you should just go with it.

Before it was different, but with the addition of so many altcoins specially Tether the trading system is changed.
It could have been Bitcoin up then altcoin down then it goes vice versa.
But now the system is different.
Bitcoin up sell to Tether then buy another altcoin which had been dumped by other to buy bitcoin. It made a lot of difference. There is an escape pod by now which is Tether and it is equal to USD.

It shouldve been sold for Doge (using the coin you are trading) which makes the Doge price goes back up but that is not the case now. A safety pin has been added and they can stay with Tether to wait for Doge to go deeper until they buy. The pump is being hold.

It is how market goes in past time, when altcoin down because of bitcoin increased. But now, that thing not always happen, because sometime if bitcoin down, altcoin down too because people not want to lose more assets.

Not all altcoins are following the steps of the king, "Bitcoin". For some reason, the demand and supply plays a big role in the market. If you can observe how the orderbook works, it explains it. Also, sometimes some altcoins as I've noticed, are having a delay as to price pumping.

This is the best logical answer here. Investors do shift their positions to where the money is.

So if bitcoin is making a good run, investors will sell their DOGE and move to bitcoin and ride the wave for as long as they can. If the price of bitcoin then goes down, they immediately liquidate their positions and then spread it out again and maybe goes back to DOGE.

Besides that, not all traders will sell the altcoin to buy bitcoin because they can hold the altcoin or they can lift the price so they can get double profit. Everything can happen in the market, but as you said, not all altcoins are following bitcoin price because some altcoin can increase whenever bitcoin is down or up. So you need to choose the right altcoin to still make a profit from both bitcoin and altcoin.

I tried looking for some type of correlation and there really wasn't one I could find which would help my trading.

Basically Bitcoin goes up (or down) and alt coins go up (or down).
Bitcoin goes up and altcoins go down (or vice versa)
Bitcoin goes nowhere... altcoins go up/down.

The only correlation I noticed was that altcoins generally go up in much higher percentages than Bitcoin. So BTC can be only up 2% but alts can be up 10% or so.

You ask about correction only, part you'll see when price goes up/ down in long term period. Most people will see the habit and will follow it but I can say everything has pattern and all pattern can see from history. Try to analysis all part and see future as risk.

You must approach the USDT and BTC market differently.

In the USDT market the most pairs follow the trend of BTC/USDT. If BTC/USDT goes up most other USDT pairs will do the same and same for when BTC/USDT goes down.
But this isn't the case in the BTC market. If value of BTC goes down the most other coins go down. Cause people sell alts to get into the increasing BTC market. If BTC is about to crash most people sell of and put some money in alts which make them increase.

So just keep in mind well that if you trade to increase your crypto value then you must keep in mind BTC up => alts down and BTC down => alts up. This isn't always the case but 75% of the cases it happens this way

You can try decentralized exchanges or verified yourself in exchanges that provide fiat trading if you're not a pro yet because you may win and you may lose a lot on impulses either it BTC or USDT they both volatile. USDT does not have that much volatility but still fiat is more steady. I prefer Bitstamp though verification might take long time or just yse DEX exchanges EtherDelta or an upcoming DexAge platform would be nice choice.

When we trade on BTC/altcoin pair we should be analysis price of BTC and that altcoin, and this is make trading activity become more complicated, so to make more easy to trade we have to choose trading pair crypto with stable coin. There are alot of exchange that provide pair of DOGE/USDT like OKEX, Poloniex, Gate.io.

Any stupid told you that if BTCitcoin raise then alt coin also raise instantly? I don't think so. Even during dump bitcoin few alt coins pumped huge. So really alt coin always not follow bitcoin trend. Price depend on volume and buy demand. If doge coins volume low means there is not very much buyer. So even bitcoin pump there is no chance to pump doge instantly. Increase buy pressure and increase volume means that coin is going to increase price. Every coin have individual community, so you should follow them if you want to be a trader. But if bitcoin stay stable then you can expect slowly altcoin would follow the trend. So don't expect that all alt coin will follow bitcoin trends instantly.

It is a good thing if it doesnt follow where bitcoin goes.
It means it is an independent coin.
Trading with that coin will be a lot of risk since only Doge traders can help you.
But it may be a lot more profitable if you are in the right direction.
 
While on the other hand if you are trading another coin that is going with the flow of BTC there are a lot out here who can help just by technical analysis of BTC then input the same at what coin you are trading.

If anything, alts are beginning to decouple from Bitcoin by quite a bit- Litecoin and Ethereum spearheaded our recent move upwards from the low $3000s for BTC, and BTC lagged a bit behind the movements of those and other altcoins. There’s definitely still some sort of correlation between BTC and alts like Doge, but it’s beginning to weaken somewhat and you should not count on it.

Not only DOGE, every time bitcoin starts climbing altcoins suffer decrease in volume and market cap.
The market goes with the strongest, and that's why they sell their alts to buy more bitcoins.

Not all, but most. Simply because most of the liquidity is due to the altcoin:BTC trading pairs not altcoin:USD.

It could be because:
1. because people might have set some offers to sell DOGE if it reaches a certain pricepoint in USD or BTC.
2. Because it just happens that someone sold a significant amount of DOGE hence the drop.

When the growth of Bitcoin is insignificant, there is a growth of altcoins, but when the growth is sharp, spontaneous, a psychological game begins, everyone wants to be together with the locomotive. At this point, the sale of altcoins and the purchase of Bitcoin begins.

The pattern you've described isn't always the case actually, and in fact, if you look at the entire month of February, Dogecoin has been trading in a very tight range with BTC, around 50-52 satoshi per dogecoin. This has kept the same when BTC was 3400 and the same at 4180 just a few days ago.

So what you're seeing in dollar value is really just because BTC is going up or down. Hardly anyone trades DOGE with USD.

Adding to it, when ETH goes up, XRP falls down. But, in two days, XRP value will certainly have a growth as like ETH. Hence, when ETH raises, buy XRP, and sell them off when XRP value goes up. This often happens. The second one, when Bitcoin value increases and you have bitcoin in your wallet, please set profit percentage low and sell them off to USDT. USTD value remain stable. This will certainly profit you.

There is a close relation between the price of bitcoin and the altcoin market. You will see that in most of the exchange the relation is the inverse. If the see the price of bitcoin market going up, then the price of altcoin market starts to go down (like you said, btc price going up doge going down). This is because when the price of bitcoin starts to go up, people starts to dump the altcoin and invest on bitcoin to make some quick profit. So btc starts to rise and altcoin starts to drop. This is just a short run case.

Well, I also noticed this analysis but most likely altcoins were swinging too when the Bitcoin price move. I don't see any opposite reaction of altcoins compared to bitcoin. If you have looked at the graphics price chart design in coins market cap, bitcoin, and altcoins having the way.

One way to look at it is how the market is willing to offload some of their holdings (e.g. DOGE) in order to participate on other fast movers like Bitcoin. It's just two things when Bitcoin is having a price rally, if Bitcoin goes up and some coins goes up as well then we see that BTC has influenced some of the coins in the market to go up with him. But if Bitcoin goes up and some coins goes down then the hodlers of these coins have sold their position to participate in other cryptocurrencies. Typically coins who don't really have any worth at all are the subject to this kinds of bull runs.

It's your notice which you can try to develop into a strategy.
Test it and then probably you can benefit from it

Long story short: Money flows among bitcoin and other coins. Why does it flow between Doge and Bitcoin is not the right to question. I prefer to look in the bigger picture and understand the main idea without any additional noise. Money flows to bitcoin from altcoins because there is no other possibility other than intervening by big financial institutions.

I've learned a fact while trading that when BTC rises some of the other altcoins will start to tumble down or stabilize and when BTC stabilizes, alts will do upside rally. But when BTC drops, most altcoins will drop as well due to panic sellers wanting to cash out their BTC. So they basically sell off their altcoins and just buy back when lower, or just sell their BTC only.

You don't need to call yourself an idiot because you don't understand how the trade works. Well profit in a trade is not gotten by the amount in usd added to the coin/token but the percentage growth that differs one coin from another. For example, you can be holding bitcoin which got 1% growth and decide to buy ethereum because you believe it will get higher, let's say ethereum gives you 5% growth, you can now switch back to bitcoin and make 4% profit.

You need to go back to have some lectures on how to trade even in bear market, the problem is not from the Exhcangers but you if really you want to understand the market and how is works you really need to calm down take your time to study and understood TA and also FA which is technical analysis and fundamental analysis.

OP should learn the structure of trading before trying himself in real trading. I suggest using demo accounts for understanding the principles of a trading, platform and later he can try himself with real funds. If ETH gains 4% value in price then it is impossible to see BTC on the previous price before this pump.

Did you just make a claim that the market is not meant for newbies, but then suggest to take trading classes on Whatsapp and Telegram lol? Seems to be a lot of talk from someone who wasn't even able to give a decent answer.

In my observation when Bitcoin is rising its price value some of the altcoins are also increases their value but majority of the altcoins are decreasing their price while Bitcoin was increasing. In short there are dependent altcoins in bitcoin and some are not.  So in Doge I remembered when bitcoin kicked it price value, Dogecoin also got increased its value.

I see there are many explanations in this thread, some of them are good, others without any logic. You have trading pairs, in your situation you have btc/dollar pair and btc/doge pair. In situation where bitcoin is rising against dollar, it doesn`t not mean that doge is rising against dollars (it can, it can stay the same or drop). Now when bitcoin price is higher, doge can`t worth 50 satoshis like before it needs to drop in this case, but price in dollars for doge will have to stay the same. This is the simplest explanation I could think of, I hope I helped.
If you wish to know more you need to read about currency correlations and to try to understand all that much better, after that you can apply most of that in crypto.

I personally feels it depends on the coin. So we can't just say this is how a coin works. Some coins pumps or dips whenever Bitcoin pumps while some does the same towards the direction of Etherum. And for some coins, they are not influence by either Etherum or Bitcoin.
But for one thing I know, altcoins prices are majorly affected by traders.

It is a matter of supply and demand that affects the price of each coin. Some misunderstands this and believe that bitcoin is the master that can affect the price of most of the altcoins. Well, you should learn how to read indicators. It helps you a lot in trading.