Bitcoin Forum

What mixer do you recommend I use, bestmixer or chipmixer?

Can't speak properly about BestMixer as have never tried it, but I do see from their FAQ that it has at least improved a little over the traditional model of mixing that the majority of active mixers are using... there's more randomness probability (choice of pools, up to 10 receiving addresses) but these options are still to me inferior to ChipMixer.

For example:
- max 10 receiving addresses. With ChipMixer, you can break your balance up in many more chip denominations.
- Preset of transfer delay. This still means you get coins newer than what you send. With ChipMixer, you get preloaded chips, so you're actually getting OLDER coins (older utxos) than what you sent, and you can sweep the chips any time you want. This is a big breaking factor in chain analysis.
- lowest service fee of all. ChipMixer is pay what you want... you can even pay 0.

I'm interested the 100% blockchain analysis proof claims. Haven't looked into it but it does seem unlikely, especially when their methods don't seem to be that much different from the old mixers. Improved, but not different.

This.
Obviously i'm going to be biased, but this mixer seems to be using the traditional mixing model, which, in a recent paper that was posted in Technical discussion (Can't find it anymore, if anyone has a link to it, i'd be delighted!), was shown to be really insecure in protecting your actual privacy.

As far as i can see, Bestmixer is simply building on that old outdated model, and i don't really see any significant improvements as to why this should give more privacy?

This. When using the 'recommended' fees on Bestmixer.io, you pay anywhere between 2-4%. If you're running any sort of business where you're working with margins, i don't see why you would ever use bestmixer over Chipmixer.


Another thing that makes me really, really itchy about Bestmixer is the fact that they have these different pools, "Gamma" pool when you pay 4% fees, without any proof to their users that these are radically different from the "pleb pool". There's a lot of trust and confidence involved here for results that will (or rather should) never be visible. Hmmpfh.





But in the end, i don't know... You should probably do your own research and use whichever one you like/are personally comfortable with.

I think you're referring to this thread: Breaking Mixing Services (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5117328.0)

OP should check this post above you will get which one is the best mixer here on the forum.

Chipmixer has unique style of mixing and according to the thread from "Breaking Mixing services" Only chipmixer services is couldn't be broken.

So OP can decide which one is the best.

The entire discussion in this thread will be like,

ChipMixer campaign participants : - ChipMixer
BestMixer campaign participants : - BestMixer
People who don't ever mix coins : - ChipMixer [I agree with them because ChipMixer has been around for a good time and they are already more than famous on bitcointalk as compared to bestmixer]

I agree. Obviously people who are affiliated with/have used a service personally are more likely to advocate for it.

I personally think that it's not necessarily that there is a clear cut answer, but rather what features you want to use. And research on that front needs to be carried out by the individual who is using the mixing service, e.g. whether you'd like to have private keys (chips), or simply have funds sent to an address.

At the end of the day though, I think that all else being equal, and you're looking at the two options, the objective thing to say is that Chipmixer has a much longer history and track record of being responsive and reputable, compared to other mixers that have just popped up. They may still be legit, but there is a higher risk.

My thought exactly.

The only thing I can say is that as long as the mixer is a legitimate player within the crypto space, give them a try with small amounts first and see which one offers you the best possible service.

The good thing about more competition is that mixers have started to innovate by adding new features that make each individual mixer stand out from the rest and appeal to a certain group of users.

I'm obviously going to recommend ChipMixer, but here's a list of alternatives that you can consider: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2827109.0
The mixing space is much more than just ChipMixer and BestMixer.

You are right and that's very logical. I think it will be nice to see opinions from others who aren't participated in their sig.
OP personally I can highly recommend this two: Bitblender and chipmixer, they are both amazing, bitblender is on game for years, the most older one I can remember is cryptomixer and they really have up to 2500 bitcoins as they clain because it was really verified but because of this verification, don't think they are very safe for your privacy, otherwise they are trustworthy.

Chipmixer for being online for the longest time and already build up a good reputation in the cryptocurrency market.

While bestmixer is a new service that still needs to prove its worth and gain a good reputation.

Chipmixer only supports Bitcoin so if you're looking to mix other coins like BCH and Litecoin then bestmixer is the place to go.

Upon searching who is the best mixer, the bestmixer or chipmixer.

So, at my research, you can conclude which better among them.

 Mixer:                                 Promoter/Manager:        Trust Rating:                               
BestMixer                             bestmixer (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1721098)                   -2: -1 / +0
ChipMixer                             ChipMixer (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1003345)                 20: -0 / +2       

Now, you can decide which is better among them all.

---

But here is mine if you are going to ask me.

BitBlender (https://bitblender.io/)                              blender (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=229601)       2: -0 / +1

Trust level doesn't decide which one is best and moreover bestmixer got negative reputation for spreading fake information about a wallet so it has nothing to do with their service on the mixing.

Bitblender is only working on TOR so I don't think it is reliable for everyone to use.

While I might consider that negative on bestmixer's account I won't because the person that gave it is in the chipmixer's campaign.

When somebody who is being paid to promote a competitor gives negative feedback to you that feedback becomes irrelevant. At least it's how I see it.

Why don’t we all check the reason of the negative trust instead of the user who gave it?

Let’s not “ad hominem” the feedback system.

If the feedback is accurate, it doesn’t matter if it was satoshi or Bitconnect’s CEO who gave it.

I don't know where you got the trust ratings but adding ;dt to the link shows the following results:

ChipMixer (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1003345)   94: -0 / +11    https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=1003345;dt (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=1003345;dt)
Bestmixer (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1721098)  -4: -2 / +0    https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=1721098;dt (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=1721098;dt)
BitBlender (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=229601)  2: -0 / +1    https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=229601;dt (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=229601;dt)

Ok, 3 ratings out of ChipMixer's rating are for running the ChipMixer signature campaign but after all it is still in favor of ChipMixer (+8 vs. -2 vs +1)

After all it's up to you which one you feel more comfortable to use.

Chipmixer all the way!

I do always go to the things which have been here for long rather than entrusting a new service.Im not saying they arent capable and trust-able but
i do much prefer on where do community usually uses.

Basing on trust issues between mixers forum account.You can already see the obvious answer related to this question.

Let not the many ChipMixer campaign participants like myself sway the opinion, as pointed out above, it's not just 2 mixers, and it's really down to the user's objective to choose what's right. Privacy is the prize at stake, and you can't afford to overlook your options if you're serious about it.

Don't forget, basic behaviours also help increase the levels of privacy. It doesn't matter if you mix and tumble and in the end identify your coins by reusing addresses or even staking identities to addresses (I do this myself for practical economic reasons but I wouldn't do those things to txs and coins I'd like to keep private).

Also, there are more wallet options like Wasabi Wallet, Samourai, etc. that give you more privacy control as you transact.

Choose what's best for your needs. As far as I know chipmixer only offers bitcoin mixing on the other hand bestmixer offers more coins to be mixed.

Now when we do talk about fees BestMixer offers

https://bestmixer.io/en/fees


While chipmixer offers " Pay what you want"  "It mean you set how much value our service is to you."


In short both systems are good when it comes to privacy of your coins. The only thing that differs right now that I know is that bestmixer offers more services while chipmixer offers freedom when it comes to fees.

Coin shuffling has been gaining some momentum lately, which is a good thing, but at the same time, contributes to network cluttering the more popular these privacy enhancing wallets become.

I like the fact that through ChipMixer I can redeem loaded private keys of different amounts that have been created like a day or so before. This makes it more difficult to link it to me than a regular mixing job would, where you either withdraw your coins right after the first confirmation, or wait a couple of hours. In both cases your 'clean' coins move after your initial mixing job.

Surely chipmixer seem to be in the top of the list with how long it has existed and with the reputation it has built over time with its signature campaign handled by one most reputed user of this forum, darkStar_ . But because of the focus on bitcoin particularly, other mixers like bestmixer are also having advantage for having variety of coins mixing.

It's possible to de-anonymize Bestmixer's mixes by subset-sum analysis by looking in/out amounts.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5117328.0

Can you post it here? I don't want to install a Tor browser.

I'm curious to see if you got a list based on output size (which is as intended!) or have you been able to link funds coming out of ChipMixer to funds going into ChipMixer?

Obviously, it's possible to list all inputs with the same size as chips. I'm still not convinced this is a bad thing, it's designed to be like this:

Personally,i prefer bestmixer,to me atleast it seems safer,i have no problem paying the 0.5% fee (for me)to make sure my coins are properly mixed.Plus i hate how on chipmixer if you said 0.05691 you get a 0.05 chip and thats all.

Overall it is BestMixer for me 100%

I've only used bestmixer myself but I'm sure you can't go wrong with either of them.  However chipmixer only deals with bitcoins so if you have altcoins bestmixer is for oyu.

I just had a look and it doesn't appear to make any link between funds coming out of ChipMixer to funds going into ChipMixer so it seems to show that ChipMixer works.

You should be getting a 0.032BTC chip, a 0.016BTC chip and a 0.008BTC chip. (you lose the 0.00091BTC as that can't fit in a 1 mBTC chip). 0.05BTC chips don't exist and never have.

So i lose close to 6-7$ Depending on the amount i mix.

With bestmixer i lose less than 4$,and i think anonimity is much better on bestmixer,plus the unique code is really good since it gets me loyalty discounts.

Then stick out with it if you do much prefer on using it but i cant deny that most people here do choose up the older ones which is Chipmixer.

Or you could just send 0.056BTC, get the 0.032BTC, 0.016BTC and 0.008BTC chip (as explained by DarkStar) and pay exactly 0BTC fees for that. Keep the change (the $6-7) and buy a beer with it, or use a different mixer just for that, donate to your charity, whatever... :)

But feel free to use the mixer you like the most. Cheers.

Yep. The "chain" or link between the funds is still broken.

I fail to see how this is something that's worth to be shouting from rooftops. Especially coming from a competitor, this seems like a pathetic attempt to smear Chipmixer's name, for no good reason at all.

If i give you my deposit adress - will you be able to determine which chips i received? Unless the answer to that is yes, (which i doubt, (and you certainly don't prove that on your .onion)), i don't understand what all this commotion is about.

been using chipmixer for a while and its the preferred method, very much thanks to premixed chips.

I can after 1 confirmation  to chipmixer already move my funds.

With bestmixer, im not sure now if this was bestmixer or another service, but i did a blockchain analysis, basically i just looked up my transactions and they went straight from A to B to C.

Where A and C was me. I dont remember the details now, but it was a VERY obvious failure in mixing as all i need to check was the transaction on any blockchain explorer to see exactly where the coins went.

Maybe someone else noted this in past and can confirm which mixer it really was?

I also think chipmixer should add some random minimum fee, i only recently noticed it was a pay what you want service lol. I think this would enhance the privacy further.

They deal with chips with fixed amount, so that wouldn’t really work. The only way I could see that working is if they, for example, created chips of 0.0998 BTC for those who deposited 0.01, 0.0319 for 0.032 and etc, or something like this (chips lower than input to collect the difference as fees), but that’s not really their idea. A “pay-what-you-want” fee structure usually serves as a good marketing strategy.

Their sympathisers and shillers should be excluded from the polls then if we want the truth.

I remember that I've participated in 2 rounds of Best Mixer review campaign here approximately  a year ago.
The service looks fine but they set 2h delay by default. That can be a problem if you need your coins fast but forgot to change the delay. Later I needed some mixing service, read about ChipMixer, did not understood how this chip thing works and came back to bestmixer with the understanding that is is not that good but it is fast and simple.

You won't find a lot of campaigns where the participants really know what is the product. There are some who really use ChipMixer on a regular basis, so people talk about the experience with the product, it's something natural. You can check the ChipMixer thread there is always a participant answering questions. Not to post "great project" or any kind. And guess what, they do it with other mixers.

But since we're at it and you're interested to get the truth like you say.

People compare fees but, lol seriously? Is it that need to be compared? Are people looking to save a buck with the risk to give up their privacy?
Privacy, Hello! Isn't it what is most important? Yes right? Now I would suggest making some searches because if you think all mixers work "great" I can assure that it's not the case.

I think it's a fair thing to do when Bestmixer's fees range from 1% (but usually start at 2.5% by default) and go up to 5% for their Gamma pool, with no proof that it actually improves privacy.
Meanwhile Chipmixer offers 0% fees, and the same level of privacy for all of their clients..?

Almost forgot about their fees per adress and tx fees;

Which means that if i were to mix 0.001, i'd pay a whopping 32% in fees. (v ≈≈≈0% w/ chipmixer, if i were to accelerate a low byte tx that is obviously..)

You say that it is more profitable to use chipmixer, while all his transactions are easy to track down!
I'd rather pay 50% commission to bestmixer, but no one would know that I got the money from the mixer!

There is no proof of either one of those statements that you're making.

Please, show me proof that you can link a deposit adress of Chipmixer to an output accurately, otherwise, you're spouting nonsense.

There is no proof that Bestmixer actually hides/conceals *every* trace of it's internal mixing that's leading to the output you're receiving. of course it would be impossible to prove a negative, but i don't think anyone has extensively looked into this, or researched it.
(And we all know what happend to dozens of mixers in the past who said similar things.. (Not only were transactions able to be traced back to the mixer, they could accurately be traced back to the user who initiated the transfer.))

Also, what exactly would be the added benefit of someone not knowing your money came from a/"the" mixer? You're afraid of being labeled as what exactly?

That’s funny for you to say after this post: Breaking Mixing Services (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5117328.0)

Quoting it:

While the author doesn’t explicitly quotes BestMixer’s name, it is clear that BestMixer works exactly as the other traditional mixers (except that they charge huge fees for some “extra privacy” methods that no one can confirm if it works or if it even does anything at all).

http://chipstatdethbuwk.onion/

What is the purpose of using a mixer?
Naturally, I do not want anyone to know that I used a mixer.
Unfortunately, chipmixer does not give me such confidence.

You base your statements on conjectures.
Although in the case of chipmixer, we see simple evidence that their entire system works against their customers.

Quoting a previous post from this same thread:

I got the impression that you are intoxicated by the service in which you participate in a signature company.
I mean, everyone can find out that you received coins from a chipmixer and just hang a suspicion flag on your funds.
Imagine that you are an anonymous alcoholic)) And here you understand that anyone can easily find out this information))
Then from this equation you need to throw out the word "anonymous" is not it?

And so you're assuming that everyone who uses Chipmixer is an "alcoholic".  That's quite the assumption to make.
Assuming something =/= correlate with reality.
The only way someone can "find anything out" is by assuming that everyone who uses Chipmixer is (in your case) an "alcoholic". logic and law simply don't work that way.



You tell me. It's unclear to me what exactly you use a mixer for.

No, You'd rather pay a 5% flat-fee, and trust that Bestmixer.io actually gives you coins out of their "Private-Investor" pool (which has got to run out sooner or later?), for what reason exactly? You're afraid of being labeled/assumed as an "Alcoholic" (?) I mean... Be my guest.

Again, you're trusting their word that these coins won't be able to be traced back to their mixer, or any of their operations, but that just seems very vague to me. Coins are always "Traceable" (up to a degree).
((I wouldn't be surprised of most of these "Investor" coins are bought on a KYC exchange..?))

Anyhow, if you place that much trust in Bestmixer.io to leave absolutely no trace on your coins, for whatever reason you might have, i'm not stopping you from using them.
Just don't spout unclear nonsense about your competitors for whatever reason you have, without any real evidence to back it up.

Why? enlighten me on how exactly Chipmixer deanonymizes it's userbase?

This is something that is hard to decide. Using it or not, if yes which one if not then its ok.

If you have some doubt about it then use this one

https://i.imgur.com/S74ZpHi.jpg

1. I will ask you again, why use a mixer?
2. I think talking with you is something useless, because you participate in the company signatures of chipmixer and you get paid for each message, which means you are not objective in your opinion.
3. If your statement that bestmixer buys coins on the stock exchange is true, then this is great news.

1. To break a link between funds/transfers.

2. I'm just correcting you on the lies you're spreading.

3. Is it though? That means that "the stockexchange" knows exactly/could know exactly which coins are from Bestmixer, and knows exactly where they are going.
Law enforcement could easily get that information, and voila, there goes everything you've been paying such premiums for. (And all the attempts at obfuscating the source (the user who initiated the transfer) of the funds, not to mention.)

That's another third-party you need to blindly trust. (While they (the exchange) doesn't/don't have any incentive NOT to cooperate, etc.)

That's just how i see it though. I'd love to know why and how you think this is "great".

How can the exchange understand that the funds came from the mixer? Your statement is a lie!
What is the advantage of getting coins from the exchange? Huge volumes on exchanges, coins are mixed there better than in any mixer!
Thus, the exchange itself is a mixer, only on a large scale.
Now, having this website http://chipstatdethbuwk.onion/, any service can mark a transaction that has been sent from chipmixer as suspicious.
It seems to me that soon there will be an official ban from the state bodies on the use of such services.
What will you say then?

I repeat once again - this is bad when someone knows that your funds came from the mixer.
This is just my subjective opinion.

Great. Don’t use any mixer them.

Send your coins from a darknet market to your favorite exchange, and then to Coinbase. See what happens when a government/police wants to know who are you. I’m sure the exchange (that stores your IP, KYC information, history of deposits, trades and withdrawals) will back you up. ::)

I mean, seriously? Exchanges over mixers? I’m starting to think you are just trolling us at this point.

Believe me when I say that anyone with enough time, motivation and resources can get almost any mixer pool of addresses after some time. I doubt most mixers do more than send you coins from their wallet, and then use the user’s deposit coins/address for future transactions w/ other costumers. And that’s extremely easy to analyze.

These guys should make their fees more transparent.

If you really care about anonymity, why not use two mixers in series?

For sure if they can do it for free. :D

If my transactions do involve thousand of dollars then doing mixing on series wont be a problem even if you do just waste some fees  ;D

No business would give out free service. hehe. My choice will be always on Chipmixer.

I think that the members here will eventually support ChipMixer.. You will keep seeing peoples engage here wearing the signature compaign of ChipMixer which is not  appreciated -_-.. Let only the platform users who had a real experience talk.. Don't just support ChipMixer because they are paying you for wearing a signature.

Maybe it should be better if YOU stop supporting shady exchanges just because you are being paid to hear a signature. :)

Many of the ChipMixer's campaigners already used the mixer (myself included). And most of the ones who didn't don't support it just for the sake of their signature, but because they are unique. While 100% of the other mixers do basically the same thing, ChipMixer has a completely new business and mixing model (PWYW fees and chips). That's what makes it so special.

On the other side, Yobit... Yobit Scam Accusation megathread. "Normal" modus operandi or shady practices?  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5134358)

P.S: stop post bursting for you 20 posts/day campaign quota. That's also not appreciated.