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Bitcoin => Bitcoin Discussion => Topic started by: Stedsm on May 17, 2019, 02:20:26 PM



Title: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Stedsm on May 17, 2019, 02:20:26 PM
A question came in my mind that with the current fee storm that's taking down everyone's morale not to use BTC for smaller amounts as the fee would get so high (even much more higher than the transaction amount itself) and if possible, we may even see the fee values get above $100 once again for even least amount transactions, here I'd like to ask you whether you would buy a coffee worth $1 - 2 (and more as it differs country to country as well as cafe to cafe) when you currently need to pay the exact amount in fee (like $1 or more to get assured confirmations)?


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: OmegaStarScream on May 17, 2019, 03:11:42 PM
Check Flexa's app (https://flexa.network/wallets). It got released a few days ago and apparently, it's supposed to serve exactly this purpose.

Personally, I wouldn't use this app because it's clearly the way to centralization and I also wouldn't buy coffee at this point because of the confirmation times, fees, etc.

Clearly, the best solution here would be the lightning network but that's far from being finished.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: mk4 on May 17, 2019, 03:23:40 PM
I would, as I assume that if coffee shops would actually accept BTC on-chain payments, they probably wouldn't require confirmations for a $2-$3 transaction? It would be very desperate for a person to attempt to do a double-spend transaction just to be able to save like $2-$3.

If they'd require confirmations though, with a quite congested mempool like right now? Hell no(assuming they don't accept LN payments).

Clearly, the best solution here would be the lightning network but that's far from being finished.
Unfortunate. I was hoping last year that LN would be ready to use for your typical non-technical person before the next bull run. Not saying that a bull market is about to start, but I'm not confident about this happening if ever a bull market comes this year. Probably 2 years more for LN to be ready(just a rough guess, don't quote me).


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Beerwizzard on May 17, 2019, 03:34:33 PM
First of all for now, 30 cents worth of BTC was enough for me to get confirmation approximately in 10 minutes. Also, such things as LN are designed to simplify such "coffee transactions". And this solution becomes pretty popular.
The other question is that why should you pay those $2-3 in BTC while there is a chance that tomorrow it could become a $4 worth of BTC? At this point it seems much easier to pay in cash.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Ailmand on May 17, 2019, 03:38:07 PM
I don't want any hassle so if the cost of a coffee that I'm going to buy is that low, I would rather use cash to buy it. I won't complicate things when there is actually an easier way for me to buy with no fees needed. I would use it when purchasing goods at a higher cost which is worth the fee.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: CryptoBry on May 17, 2019, 03:54:02 PM
First of all for now, 30 cents worth of BTC was enough for me to get confirmation approximately in 10 minutes. Also, such things as LN are designed to simplify such "coffee transactions". And this solution becomes pretty popular. The other question is that why should you pay those $2-3 in BTC while there is a chance that tomorrow it could become a $4 worth of BTC? At this point it seems much easier to pay in cash.

Aside from fees, we are right now in the speculative fever so why waste your Bitcoin just to have a coffee? I would rather hold my small bitcoin and see where this bull run is going to. And yes this is the problem on the currency side of bitcoin people are not daring to use the bitcoin just to buy anything and on the side of the merchants they can be disappointed to realize that not many are actually using bitcoin to buy something from them. Is there a solution to this? There is and that is to make bitcoin not volatile but the problem is how to make it like that...any idea?


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: lukew on May 17, 2019, 03:59:20 PM
Aside from fees, we are right now in the speculative fever so why waste your Bitcoin just to have a coffee? I would rather hold my small bitcoin and see where this bull run is going to. And yes this is the problem on the currency side of bitcoin people are not daring to use the bitcoin just to buy anything and on the side of the merchants they can be disappointed to realize that not many are actually using bitcoin to buy something from them. Is there a solution to this? There is and that is to make bitcoin not volatile but the problem is how to make it like that...any idea?

Whilst it is treated as a speculative tool, it will never become stable. Whilst tens of thousands per day are made from a high price, it will never be a feasable currency for small purchases, or larger ones really.

There is a solution but 99% of this forum would reject it, it would clash with the view that Bitcoin is a perfect currency and everyone should just use it.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: bhabygrim on May 17, 2019, 04:03:08 PM
It all depends on the situation if there wouldn't be a transaction fee then why not,
But if it would cost me more then why would I even do it?
I could just use Fiat rather than spending more by paying with crypto.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: hatshepsut93 on May 17, 2019, 04:05:57 PM
I don't see any problems with buying coffee with my bank card at the first place (even though I almost alway use cash), so the idea of paying with Bitcoin for my daily purchases isn't that important to me - I view Bitcoin as a tool for saving money that gives me full control over my money, so I can sleep well knowing that the government or the bank won't freeze my account just because they can. When Bitcoin will become truly competitive for daily purchases and will be better then fiat without any drawbacks, then I'll start considering using it for buying coffee.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: xvids on May 17, 2019, 04:09:59 PM
If I could easily pay it without any delay and no other fee or I could also get a discount using crypto then why not.
But if not then what's the point in using my crypto? Specially now that the price has been so actively fluactating?


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Duzter on May 17, 2019, 04:13:31 PM
I will go with the Flexa's app, and if that isn't available for my country surely I'll make the direct payment in bitcoin with equal amount of bitcoin as fee if the coffee is worth it and I'll go with this if there is only bitcoin accepted. If fiat is accepted and has got lower price compared to bitcoin I'll go with fiat. Transaction fee was a big issue with small scale transactions which contribute to a large volume of trades similar to the usage on daily needs.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: traderethereum on May 17, 2019, 04:16:14 PM
No, I don't want to buy a coffee with bitcoin right now because I cannot find any local store which accepts bitcoin for the payment.
Until I can find that cafe, I still prefer to use fiat to buy a coffee because bitcoin is not yet accepted in my country.
I think the fee to buy a coffee will not too high because we only use $1-$2 to buy the coffee and if we could buy with bitcoin, then I would gladly to give it a try.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Jet Cash on May 17, 2019, 04:19:45 PM
I think people need to get used to the fact that there is no one perfect payment system. They need to continue with the ability to select from multiple options such as credit card, debit card, cash, online bank transfer, and the parasities like Ebay. Crypto currencies are another facility that has been added to the mix, and gold and silver coins are making a comeback as fiat currencies start to lose credibility. Choose the method that suits the product and the payment requirement. If you want to visit your neighbour across the street - do you get the Lambo out of the garage, or do you just walk across the road?


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: coolcoinz on May 17, 2019, 04:20:10 PM
I would do it using LN. It's much cheaper this way. The only problem is finding a place that accepts bitcoin and then hope they are taking LN payments. You got like 10% chance that they do. :( It's still to early. I have ordered food for bitcoin though and it works fine. I don't care though. I used my BTC to buy a nice automatic coffee machine last year and I love it. I don't need to order anymore. That's what I call money well spent.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Haunebu on May 17, 2019, 04:30:35 PM
Firstly, I don't drink coffee. I would not bother ordering coffee currently since I basically would end up losing more money than if I would have purchased the same item through FIAT. The situation would be different if the extra TX charges through BTC would be minimal(Hopefully in the near future through LN).


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: jak3 on May 17, 2019, 04:35:04 PM
With the current Technology, I won't be even thinking about buying something which is less than the transaction fees as it does not make any sense that I am going to send some low amount for some Shady business. Maybe this is going to improve on the upcoming versions Like The Lightning network or maybe something, even more, cooler than that.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Beerwizzard on May 17, 2019, 04:43:36 PM
First of all for now, 30 cents worth of BTC was enough for me to get confirmation approximately in 10 minutes. Also, such things as LN are designed to simplify such "coffee transactions". And this solution becomes pretty popular. The other question is that why should you pay those $2-3 in BTC while there is a chance that tomorrow it could become a $4 worth of BTC? At this point it seems much easier to pay in cash.

Aside from fees, we are right now in the speculative fever so why waste your Bitcoin just to have a coffee? I would rather hold my small bitcoin and see where this bull run is going to. And yes this is the problem on the currency side of bitcoin people are not daring to use the bitcoin just to buy anything and on the side of the merchants they can be disappointed to realize that not many are actually using bitcoin to buy something from them. Is there a solution to this? There is and that is to make bitcoin not volatile but the problem is how to make it like that...any idea?
By the way I'm sure that solution would come by itself.
We just need BTC to grow and increase its market cap. Then from one point it would be less volatile and more stable so we could use it without warrying that tomorrow it would increase in price. This is just like attempting to change the price of a coin with $1bln MC and a high volume and $1k MC and small volume: in 2nd case even 100$ investment may multiply its price while in the 1st case even 1000$ would have no impact. The same thing gonna happen with BTC at one time.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Genemind on May 17, 2019, 04:55:12 PM
We're purchasing goods for convenience but if it will cost us too much, then I would better buy it through fiat.
It would only sound pricey if we'll pay higher than the usual price of the goods that we're buying.
We should value our BTC especially now that the market is running profitably. Better use fiat if necessary.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: r1a2y3m4 on May 17, 2019, 05:03:26 PM
No, the situation right now is a good sign for the whole cryptocurrency. There was a major uptrend for bitcoin and all other cryptocurrency. Although there was a correction, at least we can say that we are now slowly gaining some profit out of the market and slowly bitcoin is recovering. There was a correction early April and a month after it gone wild(I'm talking about the recent pump). Holding bitcoin is my primary objective.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: kryptqnick on May 17, 2019, 05:17:17 PM
A question came in my mind that with the current fee storm that's taking down everyone's morale not to use BTC for smaller amounts as the fee would get so high (even much more higher than the transaction amount itself) and if possible, we may even see the fee values get above $100 once again for even least amount transactions, here I'd like to ask you whether you would buy a coffee worth $1 - 2 (and more as it differs country to country as well as cafe to cafe) when you currently need to pay the exact amount in fee (like $1 or more to get assured confirmations)?
Yesterday I payed 4 dollars for transferring 0.015 BTC. Compared to this amount, I accepted the fee, even though it was pretty high. What helped me accept it was that the price went up significantly, so for selling 0.015 I got enough to fully compensate the sadness associated with the fee. If it was coffee, though, I totally would not do that. It's crazy to pay more in fees than for the real thing. Something really should be done about the fees, and it seems like the LN is not the best solution.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: NeuroticFish on May 17, 2019, 05:35:24 PM
Check Flexa's app (https://flexa.network/wallets). It got released a few days ago and apparently, it's supposed to serve exactly this purpose.

Personally, I wouldn't use this app because it's clearly the way to centralization and I also wouldn't buy coffee at this point because of the confirmation times, fees, etc.

Clearly, the best solution here would be the lightning network but that's far from being finished.

From what I see, it does the job. And they've moved fast enough to be one step before LN.
Indeed, centralization is bad. But I expect that even LN will be used by a big % of the Bitcoin users in a centralized manner. So at the end, keeping a couple of $ in their app for having at hand for a coffee is okay imho.
I would use such solution if done properly (instant "transaction", which is possible since it's off-chain), and accepted by a big number of merchants I buy from.
(It would be imho a good replacement for the cards that use fiat kept at banks.)


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: uneng on May 17, 2019, 05:37:59 PM
No, because as far as I know there isn't any third party service fulfilling this task. This Flexa Network works only in select shops, not useful for common people who drink a coffee in popular pubs and snack bars, far from the gourmet hipster areas.
Debit cards would be another option, but I don't see any affordable options. Or they aren't available in my area, or their fees are expensive, making it much more benefical to exchange btc into fiat to buy a coffee and similars.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: FIFA worldcup on May 17, 2019, 05:38:52 PM
A question came in my mind that with the current fee storm that's taking down everyone's morale not to use BTC for smaller amounts as the fee would get so high (even much more higher than the transaction amount itself) and if possible, we may even see the fee values get above $100 once again for even least amount transactions, here I'd like to ask you whether you would buy a coffee worth $1 - 2 (and more as it differs country to country as well as cafe to cafe) when you currently need to pay the exact amount in fee (like $1 or more to get assured confirmations)?

For sure, i will not buy a coffee or anything on which i have to pay same amount as a transaction fee. I think this is one drawback of bitcoins where it is not feasible to make small payments of 1 or 2$ or even less. We have to pay transaction fee and the cost will become double in this case.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: dothebeats on May 17, 2019, 05:57:29 PM
I think not, but I will certainly take this opportunity to buy high-valued items while the price of 1 bitcoin is high. Buying coffee is the least of my concerns, especially using bitcoin. I can buy coffee easily using my debit cards and my cash, and I don't even think coffee shops around me accept bitcoins already so yeah. The fees are also ridiculously high for a single purchase of a $4 coffee so I don't think it's really worth it at all. Well if I could make money out of that coffee perhaps that's a purchase I'd like to take, lol.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: franky1 on May 17, 2019, 07:56:08 PM
alot of people are blaming fee's on these things
1. "blockchains are broke/cant cope"
2. "mempools are too full"
3. "fee's are using an ebay-esq/auction model, not a plane/train ticket model"

all of this is nothing to do with technical flaws of hardware or physical issue. but purely due to intentional code limitation and suppression to make bitcoin look bad.

from 2009-2015 there has been a known number that bitcoin could handle upto ~4200tx (7tx/s) but with the inception of new bloated transaction formats the average tx size has increased. yet the block size buffer has not increased to compensate for increased adoption over the last 4 years
in april 2018 (AFTER the last price drama subsided) the average transaction size was ~500bytes. right now its more like 700bytes
meaning on average 40% less transaction count per block is getting confirmed
2009-2015 alot more transactions were around the 250byte area.
this alone shows that without even considering blockspace buffer, there are 200% less transactions atleast able to go through now than there were 4+years ago (byte for byte)

due to lack of any STRUCTURED fee mechanism there is no way to actually guarantee that paying X will get a tx confirmed in X blocks. so the current model even in its auction based mode is a failure where the mempool even with transactions paying a certain amount are left waiting far passed peoples estimates. because the fee model is based on guesses/estimates with no structure of assurance.

implementing a structured fee mechanism would actually help, it would take the guess work out of it, reduce the unassurances, and make people change their habits in regards to how they transact. all of which would help everyone from the users and the pools.

the fee structure, block limit and wishy washy code of unassurance is not due to 'blockchains are bad' or 'blockchains dont work' but due to developers making intentional decisions to avoid making positive changes. instead they just want blockchains to look bad to promote alternative networks for commercial gain and make ROI for the investors that paid their salaries


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Pipdips on May 17, 2019, 08:10:56 PM
No I will not buy coffee using Bitcoin. I still use fiat for buying coffee and everything else.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Tylev on May 17, 2019, 08:12:48 PM
A question came in my mind that with the current fee storm that's taking down everyone's morale not to use BTC for smaller amounts as the fee would get so high (even much more higher than the transaction amount itself) and if possible, we may even see the fee values get above $100 once again for even least amount transactions, here I'd like to ask you whether you would buy a coffee worth $1 - 2 (and more as it differs country to country as well as cafe to cafe) when you currently need to pay the exact amount in fee (like $1 or more to get assured confirmations)?

For sure, i will not buy a coffee or anything on which i have to pay same amount as a transaction fee. I think this is one drawback of bitcoins where it is not feasible to make small payments of 1 or 2$ or even less. We have to pay transaction fee and the cost will become double in this case.
Yes, it is still very uncomfortable and very expensive. If you want to buy coffee for Bitcoin, it will not be an easy task. You will spend a lot of time and actually pay double the price. Then what's the point of doing this? Moreover, we believe that Bitcoin will continue to grow well in price. If Bitcoin does not significantly improve the situation with the high transaction costs and transaction time, then most likely it will be used primarily for making expensive purchases.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: worldtraveller321 on May 17, 2019, 08:41:30 PM
yes but  a small amount, as i think it is important to get BTC moving around in the Network, makes its gain traction and get more in views. only way to encourage people to get into crypto


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: pixie85 on May 17, 2019, 08:59:27 PM
If I have to pay double to get it I won't spend Bitcoins. I'm not that dedicated to spreading the word to pay double and wait for a confirmation just to show off.

Usually people who stand in line behind you aren't too happy when your card gets stuck or you can't find coins in your pocket. I wouldn't dare to make them wait 10 minutes for my transaction to go through.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: rdbase on May 17, 2019, 09:06:45 PM
I thought we wouldnt be having this problem with high transaction fees again since the last time it happened over a year ago with $20 worth of bitcoin to send any amount even if it was $1 in bitcoin. ::)
With the introduction of the lightning network and the increase of full nodes werent these going to stop the gouging of high miners fees being paid out by bitcoin users. :-\


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: rdluffy on May 17, 2019, 09:40:23 PM
Not today, I use BTC as a investment, and I'll only spend BTC if I really desperate
Let's wait for lightning network, and see what happens


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: stfN2128 on May 17, 2019, 09:52:53 PM
yeah why not, but just btc which i had changed from some staking coins  or masternode coins before. my btc longterm investment will stay untouched on my trezor wallet :)
but enjoying little things from time to time is always a good choice  :)


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Youghoor on May 17, 2019, 10:18:18 PM
Looking at the transaction fees needed for a Bitcoin transaction to be confirmed, It will not be a great idea to buy a coffee using Bitcoin. It will be advise to use Bitcoin for transactions which involves you sending more than $20 worth of Bitcoin than transactions less than $20. And looking at the current state of the crypto market, no one will buy coffee using Bitcoin, because Bitcoin is regarded as a investment currency than a normal digital money used for exchange of goods and services.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: minersday on May 17, 2019, 11:08:23 PM
Bitcoin currently is consider as a financial asset than as a digital currency so it will be very hard to see people buying coffee with their bitcoin. Personally I will never use my Bitcoin to buy coffee because it will expensive making the transaction. I invest in Bitcoin rather than using it to make purchases of goods.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Cuk0ng_bitc0in on May 17, 2019, 11:13:46 PM
we can use crypto wallets like LUNO or others when buying a coffee using BTC.  I thought.  there are no fees for each BTC transaction.  but.  as long as there is still Fiat, I will use it.  buying BTC using BTC now only creates new sensations.  cooler.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: muratsink on May 17, 2019, 11:43:29 PM
I don't want to buy anything of small value using BTC.  I don't think the cost is expensive, but I think that BTC is very special.  I don't want to sell BTC for small items.  I choose BTC to buy property, cars, or item that has a great value.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: mrjohanr on May 18, 2019, 12:26:44 AM
I would not use it for small payments, for that there are alternatives.

Although it represents a great advantage for high transactions compared to banks.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: gentlemand on May 18, 2019, 12:44:19 AM
Though I'm all for affordable on chain usage I do wish the coffee thing would bog off forever. It should never have popped up in the first place.

I would hope the people who were around in 2009/10/11 who came up with it recognised that the empty and effectively free chain they had was because of the luxury of their obscurity rather than the final intention.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: FlightyPouch on May 18, 2019, 12:51:17 AM
It is not a problem to use Bitcoin buying coffee but the problem is what you've said, fees will eat up that payment. I know there will be a solution to these but I think, for now, some exchanges will do. In our country, you will be able to transact Bitcoin in the same exchange without any fees. It is amazing and it can solve this problem, the problem is whether the store will be using the same app or if they will be accepting Bitcoin in their store.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: maxreish on May 18, 2019, 04:12:27 AM
I don't want any hassle so if the cost of a coffee that I'm going to buy is that low, I would rather use cash to buy it. I won't complicate things when there is actually an easier way for me to buy with no fees needed. I would use it when purchasing goods at a higher cost which is worth the fee.

Absolutely. I wouldn't mind paying $1-$2 for a cofee in cash instead of using my btc. Transaction confirmations for btc is too slow just like what others are saying. Spending my btc just to buy a coffee is a sign for a massive adoptation but also needs improvements for the transaction fees and other things. For things like this, there are more valuable things that is worth to spend our btc aside from coffee.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: BossMacko on May 18, 2019, 04:17:48 AM
Yes if i am outside the house and planned to buy a coffee and if its available to purchase using Bitcoin why not? Its just mean that crypto is being accepted bit by bit. The time for that will soon to happen i believe people will use Crypto  sooner or later .


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Astvile on May 18, 2019, 04:31:30 AM
Using small amounts when fees as high like what we are experiencing now.Fees are too high not convinient specialy for small time users and for doing micro transactions.Coffee just cost 1-5$ and youll gonna pay a 10-15$ fee i would just go home and just drink water for free at home


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Pattart on May 18, 2019, 05:08:37 AM
First of all for now, 30 cents worth of BTC was enough for me to get confirmation approximately in 10 minutes. Also, such things as LN are designed to simplify such "coffee transactions". And this solution becomes pretty popular.
The other question is that why should you pay those $2-3 in BTC while there is a chance that tomorrow it could become a $4 worth of BTC? At this point it seems much easier to pay in cash.
Thats the mindset of investors lol. many users prefer to use bitcoin for investment rather than for currency, they can get a greater value the next day than to spend their bitcoin. I think that's a different problem.

Let's focus at  side the user of bitcoin as a currency not an investor. Of course LN is very useful for all of us for the speed of transactions. of course I will use bitcoin if fee and speed confirmation are good enough for me


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Snaic on May 18, 2019, 05:52:27 AM
No, bitcoin is not yet convenient for making small and fast purchases. When buying coffee, we will be delayed for a long time if payment will be made in Bitcoin. Yes, and overpay almost double the price, taking into account the amount of the fee, I do not see any point in this. Better to just pay cash. And why pay with Bitcoin, if we assume that it will soon continue to grow in price?


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: DoublerHunter on May 18, 2019, 07:30:10 AM
I think when you are buying coffee or anything can be considered using Bitcoin with micropayments cannot be a great idea for now(I'd rather pay cash). But I think not the only Bitcoin is accepted here, but there are also some do accept altcoins for exchange of their goods at some coffee shops. Some solutions are made for bitcoin to be used in micropayments like Segwit wallets for having low fees transactions. Spending a small amount of bitcoin with high fees is totally insane, I prefer to keep it and save.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: loopes on May 18, 2019, 07:38:13 AM
A question came in my mind that with the current fee storm that's taking down everyone's morale not to use BTC for smaller amounts as the fee would get so high (even much more higher than the transaction amount itself) and if possible, we may even see the fee values get above $100 once again for even least amount transactions, here I'd like to ask you whether you would buy a coffee worth $1 - 2 (and more as it differs country to country as well as cafe to cafe) when you currently need to pay the exact amount in fee (like $1 or more to get assured confirmations)?
Actually bitcoin fee can be set as we want. I ever recieved little amount of btc which sent with very low fee, the one who sent that BTC to me said that he set too low amount of fee so he was afraid that the transaction will be canceled, but the transactions is successful. I think I would like to buy coffee or anything using btc if its allowed because this is more practical.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: LogitechMouse on May 18, 2019, 07:43:47 AM
At this moment, transaction fees are way higher compare to the price of the coffee itself so you asking me if I will buy a coffee using Bitcoin. I would say no.

We know already that the price of Bitcoin is going high and aside from that, the transaction fees are getting higher too. The best solution at this moment so that we can use Bitcoin to buy good is Lightning Network but there are few users who are using it at this moment.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: serjent05 on May 18, 2019, 07:47:29 AM
I would buy coffee with BTC even at its current txfee.  There are third party apps that will at least nullify the fee if we used it at their platform.  Centralization, I believe it is essential for Bitcoin to proceeds.  There is one body that govern a country and that is the government.  If we wanted Bitcoin to be accepted  Bitcoin start ups must abide the government existing and possibly new rule.  We have a third party company here that enable us to pay for  our bills, game codes, remittances without charging us any transaction fee if we buy Bitcoin in their platform.  Transfering it to external wallet is a different story of course.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Kakmakr on May 18, 2019, 07:54:25 AM
Absolutely not at the current moment.  >:(  Have you seen the Mempool lately? …. when last did you do a small transaction with Bitcoin?

I bought something small yesterday and the site gives a 10 minutes grace period for the 1st confirmation. I used a SegWit address for the payment and I only received the 1st confirmation in 34 minutes.  >:( <Paid the highest fee that Electrum allows>

The end result... Transaction got cancelled and I was asked to use another payment method to buy the item. If the vendor accepts 0 confirmations, then I would still not do this, because of the high fees.  :P


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: serjent05 on May 18, 2019, 09:22:53 AM
Absolutely not at the current moment.  >:(  Have you seen the Mempool lately? …. when last did you do a small transaction with Bitcoin?

I bought something small yesterday and the site gives a 10 minutes grace period for the 1st confirmation. I used a SegWit address for the payment and I only received the 1st confirmation in 34 minutes.  >:( <Paid the highest fee that Electrum allows>

The end result... Transaction got cancelled and I was asked to use another payment method to buy the item. If the vendor accepts 0 confirmations, then I would still not do this, because of the high fees.  :P

This is one of the reason why, for now, we need a third party apps for our transactions.  Good thing Apps like Spedn is around so we can pay with our cryptocurrency and no need for the confirmation since the transaction is processed at the back end.  There is a need to promote cryptocurrency and Bitcoin is known for payment method, if we use the decentralized way of paying the goods such as the quoted example, it will bring a negative impression to Bitcoin thus making Bitcoin image bad as payment method.  Until an update is made to hasten the transaction and confirmation of Bitcoin in-chain or LN is fully functional, I think we have to rely on a centralized third party payment application that enable us to pay with our cryptocurrency. 


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: tegarp90 on May 18, 2019, 09:36:05 AM
I'll do it when bull run coming because the price will be quite cheap in btc.
Or the coffee seller will adjust the price of the coffee based on the live chart


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: shesheboy on May 18, 2019, 09:55:03 AM
Oh yes why not ?  What wrong with buying a coffee using bitcoin ? When bitcoin itself is legal currency and already being use on almost anything .if your concern is about the fees or the transacting time well its fully dependent on the price of bitcoin  .

 If the fees were a bit expensive i think im not going to buy a cheap or a single coffee but ill buy the expensive one or ill buy more coffee so that the expensive transaction fee will be more worth it .  And its not our job to wait , once we pay we should get the item and leave  .


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: goaldigger on May 18, 2019, 09:57:21 AM
A question came in my mind that with the current fee storm that's taking down everyone's morale not to use BTC for smaller amounts as the fee would get so high (even much more higher than the transaction amount itself) and if possible, we may even see the fee values get above $100 once again for even least amount transactions, here I'd like to ask you whether you would buy a coffee worth $1 - 2 (and more as it differs country to country as well as cafe to cafe) when you currently need to pay the exact amount in fee (like $1 or more to get assured confirmations)?

Almost all of the crypto people wanted to use crypto as their main currency but if you would dig deeper, it will depend on the situation. For example, if the market falls and all of the coins turn red, people would choose to hold than to buy and waste every satoshi. If a coffee would cost the same as its fee that the price would look like its doubled, i dont think people would still buy it. Not unless bitcoin is on moon.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: bitcoin-shark on May 18, 2019, 11:05:36 AM

yes i personally would use bitcoin also to make small purchases like a coffee in a bar, how? using a debit card that allows the use and the change of crypto into fiat as for example wirex...


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Ferris419 on May 18, 2019, 12:15:34 PM
Though I can bear the transaction fees but I wouldn't buy a coffee through bitcoin at this point. Because Bitcoin transaction speed yet to be fast enough! I would love to use Bitcoin as a payment method but Bitcoin really needs to be improved! Recently I have seen a coffee shop who takes Bitcoin payment and also WES token payment. Some people bought coffee through the crypto payment and I would do that to test the experience. But basically, I wouldn't do it in regular life.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: bitbollo on May 18, 2019, 12:33:11 PM
no.
tx fee doesn't worth the effort. plus it's much harder have btc and not a couple of USD/EUR in pocket.
I think that we will never pay any coffee anymore with bitcoin ;)
 


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Pipdips on May 18, 2019, 02:44:18 PM
Let's say that you purchased a bunch of coffees back in the day when the price of one BTC was valued at a mere $100. You bought $100 worth of coffee for friends and family. Pretty cool? Well today, one BTC is worth approximately $6,300. In retrospect, that is some expensive coffee! With those prices, that would be the equivalent of a $400 regular coffee, or a $800 cappuccino?
 
No thank you. I will hold onto my BTC and watch it's value grow, not go down the drain.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: ryzaadit on May 18, 2019, 02:49:54 PM
Oh yes why not ?  What wrong with buying a coffee using bitcoin ?
I will get arrested in my country if i making a payment using cryptocurrency. Payment system using crypto, not yet legal at here for bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies, only for a few months ago my government makes regulation about cryptocurrency. It's a good steep at least my government already try to see the development of cryptocurrency.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: piebeyb on May 18, 2019, 03:00:15 PM
if according to my view is to buy a cup of coffee using bitcoin it will indeed look complicated because the cost is not small to make transactions, but of course why only buy a glass of coffee using bitcoin, why not try to buy coffee shops using bitcoin and enough for you can drink coffee every day  8)

but obviously, for smaller transactions to buy something cheap with bitcoin it's not feasible, but maybe people want to buy lambo with their bitcoin rather than coffee


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Indamuck on May 18, 2019, 03:06:10 PM
there is still a lot of arguments about this:  Some people think bitcoin should mostly be a store of value used for transferring larger amounts of wealth while another group still believes it should be used for small daily transactions like coffee.  If lightning doesn't catch on to the public we still have many new altcoins with interesting scaling technology.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: pixie85 on May 18, 2019, 08:28:01 PM
Let's say that you purchased a bunch of coffees back in the day when the price of one BTC was valued at a mere $100. You bought $100 worth of coffee for friends and family. Pretty cool? Well today, one BTC is worth approximately $6,300. In retrospect, that is some expensive coffee! With those prices, that would be the equivalent of a $400 regular coffee, or a $800 cappuccino?
 
No thank you. I will hold onto my BTC and watch it's value grow, not go down the drain.

This is a double edged sword. What if you bought coffees and the price tanked to $50 per coin? You got a 50% discount on your purchase. Things like that happen every year. If you bought something in december 2017 like a car you got it almost for free because 6 months later Bitcoin was worth 70% less.

You can hold on to your coins and check the portfolio in 5 years to see you can't even buy a decent meal with all your coins.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: olamidey on May 18, 2019, 09:15:30 PM
Anyone buying coffee with BTC should be aware of the transactions feess and shouldn't complain. Definitely, coffee will be cheaper with a.more costlier fee to send BTC. So not advisable. Twill be crazy to buy Coffee with btc and it picks up, and you found the present value can be a warehouse of coffee. Why not invest and trade your BTC instead of this mind boggling coffee issue


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: alpacapone on May 18, 2019, 09:19:14 PM
I wouldn't because I get more perks using other methods like my Cash App card which gives me $1 back every cup of coffee I buy. If there was a prepaid card you could fund directly with BTC that offered a similar perk, I would consider it.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: vhns222 on May 18, 2019, 09:25:20 PM
i think people will do it i mean use btc in their everyday life if the price will stabilise for example if we have a situation when BTC price is 100k and it canges only 0.1-0.2 % then user will now there will not big lose but now you can pay 0.5 btc as a 4000$ but afther week  it become 7000$.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Twinkledoe on May 19, 2019, 07:49:55 AM
I wouldn't because I get more perks using other methods like my Cash App card which gives me $1 back every cup of coffee I buy. If there was a prepaid card you could fund directly with BTC that offered a similar perk, I would consider it.

Aside from that, the transaction is easy peasy using your coffee card (i.e. Starbucks Card). If I'll use btc for smaller transactions, the fee might not be reasonable enough to use crypto payment method. Aside from the fact that you need to wait for the confirmation of your transaction. Maybe, I'll use this method if I'm traveling and crypto payment is one the easiest option to take.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: sngwinner on May 19, 2019, 08:04:05 AM
I don't see why I should use btc to pay for $1 or $2 coffee when only the transaction fee only can pay for the coffee when I pay with fiat. Moreover, I see btc as a valuable asset and will only trade it for something worth that value otherwise, I will only change it to fiat and spend my cash


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: bering on May 19, 2019, 09:31:28 AM
Depend on the fees itself and currently indeed the transactions fees might be made some difference because if the fees lower i think everybody are willing to buy some coffee use bitcoin but if the transactions equal to coffee price or higher i don't think people will buy it


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: 1Referee on May 19, 2019, 01:31:57 PM
Bitcoin's main-chain currently is beyond the stage where it's worthwhile using it for $1-$2 payments, and with how the crypto market as a whole seems to bubble up, the situation isn't going to improve at all. Another thing that I noticed is that speculators seem to randomly pick a super high fee while they don't have to do that at all. This inflates the fees unnecessarily, but hey, what can you do about it? It's a free fee market.

I'm perfectly keen using Lightning for smaller transactions, which I have been doing quite intensively already the past few months. It felt kinda weird after a whole week of not sending a single main-chain transaction to wait for a confirmation again, because once you go Lightning, which is a Ferrari, you don't want to go back to your old rusty bike with a flat tire again.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: munareal on May 19, 2019, 02:58:30 PM
I for one will not use my precious Bitcoin to buy coffee. I am keeping my satoshis to build up my  Bitcoin holdings and I will not use it as a payment method. I keep them as a future investment.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: xWolfx on May 19, 2019, 04:04:22 PM

This is a double edged sword. What if you bought coffees and the price tanked to $50 per coin? You got a 50% discount on your purchase. Things like that happen every year. If you bought something in december 2017 like a car you got it almost for free because 6 months later Bitcoin was worth 70% less.

You can hold on to your coins and check the portfolio in 5 years to see you can't even buy a decent meal with all your coins.

But if merchants set up a payment system that instantly changes the BTC to fiat then it won't be that much of a difference, since the price is live and it gets calculated as soon as you perform the transaction.

For a win-win situation that is by far the best way to do things. At least for now while Bitcoin stabilize.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: BitHodler on May 19, 2019, 07:16:48 PM
Definitely not. I use what's the most convenient for me in local situations, and that's fiat. Bitcoin is too expensive and inconvenient to use. I don't know why people keep forcing themselves to use it for coffee payments.

Another point of importance is that in some countries spending Bitcoin (or any other crypto currency) is considered to be a taxable event, which adds more problems than it solves.

Bitcoin evolved into something that represents gold and no longer a viable small payment network it once was. No scaling = limiting usage so we have to accept that. I wish it was different, but lets hope LN will give us that.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: pixie85 on May 19, 2019, 08:46:51 PM

This is a double edged sword. What if you bought coffees and the price tanked to $50 per coin? You got a 50% discount on your purchase. Things like that happen every year. If you bought something in december 2017 like a car you got it almost for free because 6 months later Bitcoin was worth 70% less.

You can hold on to your coins and check the portfolio in 5 years to see you can't even buy a decent meal with all your coins.

But if merchants set up a payment system that instantly changes the BTC to fiat then it won't be that much of a difference, since the price is live and it gets calculated as soon as you perform the transaction.

For a win-win situation that is by far the best way to do things. At least for now while Bitcoin stabilize.

You misunderstood. The guy I was answering said that it's not worth buying anything because bitcoin could go up in value and you will lose your potential profits.
It's not about losing some profits while the transaction is processed but losing value in the long term like the pizza guy did. Most merchants use processors that convert bitcoins to fiat in an instant.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Yakamoto on May 19, 2019, 09:12:00 PM
Let's say that you purchased a bunch of coffees back in the day when the price of one BTC was valued at a mere $100. You bought $100 worth of coffee for friends and family. Pretty cool? Well today, one BTC is worth approximately $6,300. In retrospect, that is some expensive coffee! With those prices, that would be the equivalent of a $400 regular coffee, or a $800 cappuccino?
 
No thank you. I will hold onto my BTC and watch it's value grow, not go down the drain.

This is a double edged sword. What if you bought coffees and the price tanked to $50 per coin? You got a 50% discount on your purchase. Things like that happen every year. If you bought something in december 2017 like a car you got it almost for free because 6 months later Bitcoin was worth 70% less.

You can hold on to your coins and check the portfolio in 5 years to see you can't even buy a decent meal with all your coins.
To my knowledge, a lot of companies are very quick to exchange their Bitcoin because of the exact reason you mention. Maybe, at best, they could use the drops in the fiat value to write off some of their taxes in the form of capital losses, but I can't think of a lot of companies that want to write off their revenue as a capital loss. I'm pretty sure that Steam/Valve had this exact issue when they began to accept Bitcoin a year ago, where it kept going higher and then it started to crash and they (very rapidly) cut their acceptance for Bitcoin. I almost guarantee that they were seeing this as a loss of revenue, and it probably hurt them more than it would most other companies due to the fact that they still have to forward the money earned to developers for games. It squeezed their margins, and that wasn't something they could regularly deal with, I guess.

As for OP's question, I don't drink coffee, so I can't say that I would be interested in purchasing coffee using Bitcoin.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Gi01 on May 19, 2019, 09:29:49 PM
I will only use Bitcoin to buy coffee when Bitcoin is recognised worldwide as a currency and it is used easily for every activities of daily living.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Best Dreams on May 21, 2019, 10:33:16 PM
I for one will not use my precious Bitcoin to buy coffee. I am keeping my satoshis to build up my  Bitcoin holdings and I will not use it as a payment method. I keep them as a future investment.
It is good to keep holding then to use because we know value of bitcoin is increasing with the passage of time so not good to use for purchasing something like this, coffee we can buy with using small amount of cash then it is not good to use our precious saving and investment for the sake of anything so my decision is holding instead of buying coffee.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: BlackFor3st on May 22, 2019, 12:59:57 AM
Though it is very crazy to think that you are going to pay more in transaction fee compare to your order knowing that coffee is very cheap. There is a little chance that I am going to buy coffee using a BTC but if I have no other option then maybe someday I will be willing to pay 100$ transaction fee while paying like 2-5$ for coffee.

There are other currencies that is more suited in paying small transactions but in the current condition of bitcoin right now. It's fee is higher especially if you are going to execute small amount of transaction like 1-10$ only.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Pasaway2701 on May 22, 2019, 03:05:24 AM
I don't want any hassle so if the cost of a coffee that I'm going to buy is that low, I would rather use cash to buy it. I won't complicate things when there is actually an easier way for me to buy with no fees needed. I would use it when purchasing goods at a higher cost which is worth the fee.
I agree. It is not worth to pay the fee to buy a cup of coffee and just having a hard time to process it if you have an amount on your pocket. Better to used it on more worth things or even invest it or just keep it on wallet for it to grow while the price is pumping.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Cryptohistory7 on May 22, 2019, 03:16:45 AM
As people move towards adopting the use of BTC and other cryptocurrencies especially in their everyday lives and routines (especially also if merchants begin to use blockchain projects and Altcoins in their payment processes), they'd be less resistant towards paying for simple purchases like coffee with BTC. Many projects are also have digital wallets that are linked to a debit card so that you can convert your cryptocurrencies and make purchases instantly on fiat terms at physical stores at little to no transaction costs and foreign exchange fees even, so buying a coffee using BTC or any other cryptocurrency may become more convenient than using fiat eventually!


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: Initscri on May 22, 2019, 04:14:46 AM
If the coffee was good ;)

In all honestly though, yea, I would. Currently. And I probably would regardless of the price.

I have a certain reserve of Bitcoin that I call my "MOON" bitcoins. Essentially, the Bitcoins I pretty much want to hold onto no matter what.

And then I have a fund which is produced solely from the work I do. That, I'm more willing to pull from for things like daily items. I also think it's beneficial for the BTC economy in general, when Bitcoin is used to buy staples. I mean, the digital currency was invented primarily as a way to pay for things, not a value store.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: ralle14 on May 22, 2019, 05:27:26 AM
I would if I don't have to wait for a confirmation so I could use a low fee for all of my transactions because if I made hundreds of transactions with the current recommended fee it's worth at least $100 or close to that amount. I could be saving several cups of coffee if I use a different payment option. If there's a coffee shop near me that does off chain transactions i'll be happy to buy one.


Title: Re: Would you buy a coffee using BTC during current times?
Post by: cipherhut on May 22, 2019, 06:09:43 AM
Lol ;D In today's scenario selling BTC is like selling a kidney when another one failed, so besides that hold, it for now!