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Other => Meta => Topic started by: Polina_21 on July 21, 2019, 04:14:15 PM


Title: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: Polina_21 on July 21, 2019, 04:14:15 PM
Recently, one of my friends' bitcoin talk account got banned without any reason. He had earned 3 merits for his posts. He felt very bad about that. I felt that if any account is banned, atleast some message should be displayed with proper reason for the Ban or a warning before a Ban. This will help them to know how they can improve on that.

Also, I have one doubt, all the merits he earned is it lost? Can he transfer to others?

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: bitmover on July 21, 2019, 04:23:41 PM
Merited are wasted by merit sources every day because they do not find good posts to merit..

Your "friend" probably plagiarized content, which is the main reason for ban. If that is the case, it is over for him. If not, he can try to open a thread on meta and ask moderators to review his case.

However, the earned merits cannot be transferred in any case.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: arbiter5 on July 21, 2019, 04:24:58 PM
Quote from: Polina_21 on July 21, 2019, 04:14:15 PM
Can he transfer to others?

If we were able to transfer merits after a ban, where would your "friend" transfer his old merits?  :thinking: ???

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: CucakRowo on July 21, 2019, 04:30:25 PM

To op.
Mind to share with us your friend account names? Perhaps we can check it together.

And what kind of banned notification your friend have? Is it permanent ban or perm-band?

Quote from: bitmover on July 21, 2019, 04:23:41 PM

Your "friend" probably plagiarized content, which is the main reason for ban. If that is the case, it is over for him. If not, he can try to open a thread on meta and ask moderators to review his case.

However, the earned merits cannot be transferred in any case.

Agree. Ask your friend (refers to OP) to create clarification thread in meta.



Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: rosezionjohn on July 21, 2019, 04:40:41 PM
If I am not mistaken, your friend can still log in to his or her account even after being banned. Why not tell him or her to try to send 1 merit to you? In that way, we will also know who your friend is and find out the real reason for the ban.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: Pffrt on July 21, 2019, 05:08:31 PM
Quote from: rosezionjohn on July 21, 2019, 04:40:41 PM
If I am not mistaken, your friend can still log in to his or her account even after being banned. Why not tell him or her to try to send 1 merit to you? In that way, we will also know who your friend is and find out the real reason for the ban.
Banned accounts can't merit anymore, when merit system was introduced, it was possible to send merit from a banned account, but later, theymos fixed this bug. Otherwise, many more spambies could make higher rank accounts.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: Samayuki on July 22, 2019, 10:38:29 AM
Quote from: arbiter5 on July 21, 2019, 04:24:58 PM
Quote from: Polina_21 on July 21, 2019, 04:14:15 PM
Can he transfer to others?

If we were able to transfer merits after a ban, where would your "friend" transfer his old merits?  :thinking: ???
Yea its better to lock down merits on banned accounts forever,once blocked its gone

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: Byakuga on July 22, 2019, 03:11:13 PM
Unfortunately its a yes, it will be another kind of spamming if banned accounts have the access to send out merits,just think about what will happen

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: tranthidung on July 22, 2019, 04:31:11 PM
I have not seen that banned accounts can send their sMerits out to others or not? Banned accounts can be used in view-mode only, and can not post anything, but to send sMerits, how about that? Just curious that banned accounts can be able to see Merit button or not, if they can see it, they can send their sMerits. If they can see Merit button, but can not send their sMerits, it is a bug of forum, and should be fixed by disbable merit button with banned accounts (permanently banned ones). For accounts that don't receive a single merit, they don't see Merit button.  :-X

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: 2double0 on July 22, 2019, 05:00:21 PM
Quote from: Polina_21 on July 21, 2019, 04:14:15 PM
Recently, one of my friends' bitcoin talk account got banned without any reason. He had earned 3 merits for his posts. He felt very bad about that. I felt that if any account is banned, atleast some message should be displayed with proper reason for the Ban or a warning before a Ban. This will help them to know how they can improve on that.

Awww my kiddo, 3 merits ??? Ummaaahh!!!!
The oldest and most reasonable cause for getting banhammered these days is plagiarism. Tell me one thing, even if he gets to:

1. Transfer his merits to someone else

Then he would probably misuse them by making a new account and sending all to themselves or to you, maybe?

2. Find and merit good posts

Oh no! But I am banged banned, why would I take the pain of doing that? Get lost you all, I am done (that banned guy's responses).

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: rhomelmabini on July 23, 2019, 03:07:55 AM
Surely it was wasted and by the way, moderators will not ban users without any reason, if it's permabanned that means he did plagiarized a content. AFAIK the reason for the ban is indicated on the account of the user and there is an email there to appeal for the ban.

Don't make some doubt over it, if the ban is deserved for him that's it, he can appeal though but he/she present that himself/herself is an asset to the forum. Ban members can't transfer it, why ask about it? Do you need those sMerits? Earn those in your own way.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: stadus on July 23, 2019, 05:28:02 AM
Quote from: bitmover on July 21, 2019, 04:23:41 PM
However, the earned merits cannot be transferred in any case.

Good to know if this is true,  because they might just sell their merits since their accounts are not already usable in the forum.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: LoyceV on July 23, 2019, 05:43:19 AM
Quote from: Polina_21 on July 21, 2019, 04:14:15 PM
Recently, one of my friends' bitcoin talk account got banned without any reason. He had earned 3 merits for his posts. He felt very bad about that.
So he didn't feel bad about being banned, only about the 3 Merits? Let me guess: he can easily create another account, but getting more Merit is difficult? Just to be clear: creating another account to post anywhere else than in a ban-appeal thread is not allowed after a ban.

Quote
Also, I have one doubt, all the merits he earned is it lost?
Those Merits aren't lost, they're still used to highlight good posts.

Example:
Quote
Merit received by vphasitha01 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2124069) Banned! from January 24, 2018 until July 19, 2019 (source (http://loyce.club/Merit/history/2124069.html))

http://loyce.club/Merit/history/img/2124069_blue.gif
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Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: Pmalek on July 23, 2019, 09:29:30 AM
Quote from: Polina_21 on July 21, 2019, 04:14:15 PM
Recently, one of my friends' bitcoin talk account got banned without any reason.
99% of banned accounts are banned without a reason according to the banned users.

Quote from: Polina_21 on July 21, 2019, 04:14:15 PM
I felt that if any account is banned, atleast some message should be displayed with proper reason for the Ban or a warning before a Ban. This will help them to know how they can improve on that.
If it is a permanent ban he surely received a message saying that he was banned for plagiarism or spamming (those are the most common reasons) and an email address where he can appeal the ban. 

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: tranthidung on July 23, 2019, 09:40:35 AM
I knew about the vphasitha01 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2124069) because that guy and me was in the same race to Full Member rank. That guy actually hit Full Member rank before me, he/she is actually a constructive user, so I am curious why he/she banned permanenty. He/she even did not care to create ban appeal. I don't know that he/she knew about new procedure to unban constructive users whom have good net-effects or not. If yes, he/she might come back and create ban appeal.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: Polina_21 on July 24, 2019, 02:49:27 AM
He got a message saying that he is permanently banned probably due to spam or plagiarism. Attaching the image of the message he received -
https://i.imgur.com/Hx6xeHx.png


And how and where he can create appeal on "Meta"? He did appeal on the email provided on the image but he did not get any response from them.

He tried giving merits to others and he is not able to give them as well, the merits are wasted.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: Polina_21 on July 24, 2019, 03:03:32 AM
Quote from: tranthidung on July 22, 2019, 04:31:11 PM
I have not seen that banned accounts can send their sMerits out to others or not? Banned accounts can be used in view-mode only, and can not post anything, but to send sMerits, how about that? Just curious that banned accounts can be able to see Merit button or not, if they can see it, they can send their sMerits. If they can see Merit button, but can not send their sMerits, it is a bug of forum, and should be fixed by disbable merit button with banned accounts (permanently banned ones). For accounts that don't receive a single merit, they don't see Merit button.  :-X

Yes, he can see the Merit button but he is not able to send sMerits to any posts. That is the problem!

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: Polina_21 on July 24, 2019, 03:18:05 AM
Quote
So he didn't feel bad about being banned, only about the 3 Merits? Let me guess: he can easily create another account, but getting more Merit is difficult? Just to be clear: creating another account to post anywhere else than in a ban-appeal thread is not allowed after a ban.

He felt bad that his account is banned even after not spamming or doing anything wrong. And where is the ban-appeal thread? Where he can find that?

Quote
Quote
Also, I have one doubt, all the merits he earned is it lost?
Those Merits aren't lost, they're still used to highlight good posts.

But he tried to send his merits to some good posts but he was not allowed to send it.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: tranthidung on July 24, 2019, 03:52:56 AM
Quote from: Polina_21 on July 24, 2019, 02:49:27 AM
And how and where he can create appeal on "Meta"?
Creating only one account, and use only that account to create a ban appeal thread in Meta board.
Remember to give enough basic details of banned account:
- Account name
- Profile link
- Ban message, that includes type of bans (temporary or permanently); and potential reasons of bans (spamming, plagiarism, etc.).
- Most constructive posts and / or threads that user made before the ban. It will gives forum moderators proofs to assess that user's net effects. Staffs will do their own research, but it is also helpful if that user can show off his or her most constructive things. If he or she even can not find a single constructive post or thread, it means that user does not have good net effect.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: rhomelmabini on July 24, 2019, 04:18:05 AM
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1926895.msg51830829#msg51830829
That is the report of @Heisenberg_Hunter to the newbie member Jace Lee (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2610883) as you input it on the image below of who the member is.


Quote from: Polina_21 on July 24, 2019, 03:18:05 AM
He felt bad that his account is banned even after not spamming or doing anything wrong. And where is the ban-appeal thread? Where he can find that?
@Polina_21 your friend really did plagiarism, he can appeal though by creating a new account in the forum but posting is solely to the appeal and nothing else.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: stadus on July 24, 2019, 04:42:15 AM
Quote from: tranthidung on July 23, 2019, 09:40:35 AM
I knew about the vphasitha01 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2124069) because that guy and me was in the same race to Full Member rank. That guy actually hit Full Member rank before me, he/she is actually a constructive user, so I am curious why he/she banned permanenty. He/she even did not care to create ban appeal. I don't know that he/she knew about new procedure to unban constructive users whom have good net-effects or not. If yes, he/she might come back and create ban appeal.

Based on my observation, there's a lot of accounts which are constructive posters but they are still banned.
The common reason is plagiarism, or what I can always see as their excuse is they don't know it was an offense and it was an old mistake.
Sadly the forum rules says the punishment of that is a perma ban.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: tranthidung on July 24, 2019, 04:57:11 AM
Quote from: stadus on July 24, 2019, 04:42:15 AM
Based on my observation, there's a lot of accounts which are constructive posters but they are still banned.
The common reason is plagiarism, or what I can always see as their excuse is they don't know it was an offense and it was an old mistake.
Sadly the forum rules says the punishment of that is a perma ban.
Since the ban wave started around April this year, due to unknown plagiabot, lives become easier a little bit for perma-banned users. Only easier if they have good net effects, because if they are positive-net-effected users, they might get a second chance, with perma-ban uplifted, and replaced by temp-ban with signature ban for 1- or 2-year period. I think that kind of second chance is fair enough.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: Coyster on July 24, 2019, 06:06:59 AM
Quote from: stadus on July 24, 2019, 04:42:15 AM
The common reason is plagiarism, or what I can always see as their excuse is they don't know it was an offense and it was an old mistake.
Most times many good posters probably started off in the forum as shit posters, and had one or two plagiarised posts, hence as they developed here and brushed up their posts, they forgot about those posts they copied and pasted at the beginning of their sojourn on the forum, and sadly if it's found, it's a permanent ban, it doesn't matter how useful they've become, the forum wouldn't bend it's rules for that, except on few occasions.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: stadus on July 24, 2019, 07:07:16 AM
Quote from: Coyster on July 24, 2019, 06:06:59 AM
Quote from: stadus on July 24, 2019, 04:42:15 AM
The common reason is plagiarism, or what I can always see as their excuse is they don't know it was an offense and it was an old mistake.
Most times many good posters probably started off in the forum as shit posters, and had one or two plagiarised posts, hence as they developed here and brushed up their posts, they forgot about those posts they copied and pasted at the beginning of their sojourn on the forum, and sadly if it's found, it's a permanent ban, it doesn't matter how useful they've become, the forum wouldn't bend it's rules for that, except on few occasions.
There are members who got banned but made an appeal and actually they get their account back but with some restriction, like they can't use signature for years, but that's alright, I mean you'll accept that as the sentence was reduce. However, it's sad to say that majority didn't even care, they just accept and go, maybe create a new account and start from the beginning.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: Heisenberg_Hunter on July 24, 2019, 07:42:16 AM
Quote from: Coyster on July 24, 2019, 06:06:59 AM
Most times many good posters probably started off in the forum as shit posters, and had one or two plagiarised posts, hence as they developed here and brushed up their posts, they forgot about those posts they copied and pasted at the beginning of their sojourn on the forum, and sadly if it's found, it's a permanent ban, it doesn't matter how useful they've become, the forum wouldn't bend it's rules for that, except on few occasions.

Either how good the poster becomes over the time, their primary intention would have been to spam, plagiarise and to get a higher rank certainly joining signature campaigns. If they would have come here for the sole purpose of contributing something they would have never copied other user's post. Copying from a news article without properly mentioning the source is completely different than copying a forum member's post. Jace Lee have used text spinning and tried to make the post as his own post which isn't really appreciated. I don't report newbies who forget to add a link to their post if they have shared a news article since in the beginning most of us wouldn't be really aware of posting a link.

Some prominent solid posters who were temporarily banned for plagiarism have copied other person's post and tried to make the post their own which certainly deserves a permaban even how good they would have changed over time and how well they have contributed to the community after that.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: tranthidung on July 24, 2019, 01:12:35 PM
Such users mostly come from account farms, and they are don't care about their posts (contents, quality), or too lazy to spend a couple of minutes to read previous OPs, and previous posts, to brainstorm ideas, and to compose their on-topic posts; or they don't have enough time to do all those steps because they have hundreds accounts need to publish shit posts every day.
Quote from: Heisenberg_Hunter on July 24, 2019, 07:42:16 AM
Either how good the poster becomes over the time, their primary intention would have been to spam, plagiarise and to get a higher rank certainly joining signature campaigns. If they would have come here for the sole purpose of contributing something they would have never copied other user's post.
Yes, it's different at somewhat extent, but there are common reason of plagiarsim. That is to steal words or ideas of others in order to get financial benefits. For whatever, signature campaigns, bounties (plagiarise to hit post quota); or to steal others words (such as Whitepaper, OPs, etc.) to lauch scam projects (for example).
Quote
Copying from a news article without properly mentioning the source is completely different than copying a forum member's post. Jace Lee have used text spinning and tried to make the post as his own post which isn't really appreciated. I don't report newbies who forget to add a link to their post if they have shared a news article since in the beginning most of us wouldn't be really aware of posting a link.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: AdolfinWolf on July 24, 2019, 01:15:22 PM
Quote from: Polina_21 on July 24, 2019, 03:18:05 AM
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So he didn't feel bad about being banned, only about the 3 Merits? Let me guess: he can easily create another account, but getting more Merit is difficult? Just to be clear: creating another account to post anywhere else than in a ban-appeal thread is not allowed after a ban.

He felt bad that his account is banned even after not spamming or doing anything wrong. And where is the ban-appeal thread? Where he can find that?

Quote
Quote
Also, I have one doubt, all the merits he earned is it lost?
Those Merits aren't lost, they're still used to highlight good posts.

But he tried to send his merits to some good posts but he was not allowed to send it.
If you're banned you're probably not going to be able to send them anymore, but the ones you received 'publicly' on your posts will still be visible.

There isn't a single thread. He either needs to open his own topic on this board, or send a PM/email to theymos. banappeals-w6pquw43@theymos.e4ward.com


Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: darklus123 on July 25, 2019, 08:54:39 AM
First of all, someone is not getting banned for no such reasons.

If I am not mistaken also the merit should not go to waste since even if the account got banned the post will remain and can still be read by other users who might need the information. Unless if the merited post was the reason why that certain account was banned (it might be plagiarized or etc.)


An appeal should be made to make it quite formal. Mods right now are quite open minded right now when it comes to perma ban appeals.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: Polina_21 on July 27, 2019, 03:25:55 AM
He did appeal for Unban but nothing happened. Thanks everyone for sharing your thoughts.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: Nnuego on July 27, 2019, 07:51:38 AM
When merit account is banned, the merits in it, it's all gone. I believe accounts are been banned with reason, maybe your friend go against bitcointalk rules for his account to get banned. Opening a new account to earn merit is the way forward

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: stadus on July 27, 2019, 09:40:41 AM
I think we have gone further here with some repetitive answers, I think the OP has to close this thread as I believe answers have satisfied already the question.

Title: Re: Will Merits get wasted if the account is banned?
Post by: CryptopreneurBrainboss on July 27, 2019, 09:42:06 AM
Quote from: Nnuego on July 27, 2019, 07:51:38 AM
Opening a new account to earn merit is the way forward

Don't get misguided as opening a new account doesn't gaurantee your stay on the forum. if caught your case will be treated as a ban evasion which results to that account getting banned too. Officially a ban simply means you're no longer welcomed in the forum that includes your alts although an exception of just one which has to be used only for the purpose of an appeal is welcomed.


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