Bitcoin Forum

Hello, right now i use bitstamp and binance. They both charge me 0.005 bitcoin fee when i transfer bitcoins from my account to another address. The problem is that i do that regulary with very small accounts and there is no way around it. And basicly paying fee as big as the money im transfering is well, not good. So what are the pages with lower fee ? Maybe 0.001 fee ? This page can either support paypal/credit card buying of bitcoins OR i can just transfer big money from bitstamp. So, what is the lowest fee page that will allow me to transferHello, right now i use bitstamp and binance. They both charge me 0.005 bitcoin fee when i transfer bitcoins from my account to another address. The problem is that i do that regulary with very small accounts and there is no way around it. And basicly paying fee as big as the money im transfering is well, not good. So what are the pages with lower fee ? Maybe 0.001 fee ? This page can either support paypal/credit card buying of bitcoins OR i can just transfer big money from bitstamp. So, what is the lowest fee page that will allow me to transfer bitcoins ? bitcoins ? Also i want them to allow me to transfer about 3€/3$, binance for instance wont allow to transfer such small amounts.

This is an issue with these exchanges. They just charge what they want when 2% would be enough.

Try trading your BTC for a cheaper coin, such as LTC, and withdrawing it. You will lose a lot less. And then you can send it to another exchange that has cheaper BTC withdrawal fees. Trade it back for BTC and withdraw.

TryNinja , 3 euro can't be easy moved and converted between exchanges just to receive them in btc. You gave him a methodologic way to solve his problem, but he will get 0.0000000....€ so it will be better to left them in the exchange as they can help paying fees for future orders.

I thought binance has the lowest withdraw fee of 0.0003 btc per order and it may get lower if you use bnb to pay the fees.

Buying €3 in BTC, to withdrawal and do something with it sounds like a waste of time. I don’t think there is any exchange that allows that. Most even have a minimum amount for purchase. I gave him the solution if he ever wants to put more in BTC and then withdrawing without having to pay $4 every time.

Binance has a withdrawal fee of 0.0005 BTC and BNB has nothing to do with that (BNB discounts are related to trading fees, not withdrawing fees).

These exchanges are really ripping people off. There are no logical reason to charge that much high fees yet they do it. Charging 0.005 BTC is crazy even 0.0005 BTC is also crazy which Binance do anyway.

Even these days I send BTC with 0.00000128 BTC fees and they get confirmed in less than two hours (max).

Get rid of those exchanges. And move the coins in your private wallet like one which you can manage using Electrum. Just check this chart when you are in need of making a transaction and use the fees that really require for you Tx

https://i.imgur.com/1zVZaDT.png
https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue/#0,2h

For a legacy wallet anything under 1MB will be confirmed in less than 20 mins.

OP made a typo. Both exchanges charge people 0.0005BTC in withdrawal fees.

It may seem high, but both exchanges did not increase their withdrawal fees in 2017/2018 when the base network fee for Bitcoin hovered between 0.001-0.002BTC. It means that they lost on every single withdrawal that their users requested, which is what people don't think about.

Coinbase works with dynamic withdrawal fees based on the level of network congestion; currently they charge you like 0.00002BTC, but in 2017/2018 there were short periods where they charged even over 0.002BTC.

Every fee model has its pros and cons depending on how congested the network is. Currently Coinbase's dynamic fee model is the best for people, but when the fees spike up, Binance's fee model will stand out as being the cheapest.

It should really be dynamic but i doubt that those big popular exchangers might not consider on implying it up but i agree that Binance fee is somewhat the cheapest.

A little bit off-topic on here that shitty exchange Yobit.net does have a standard fee of 0.0012 btc already for a long time- this is the most ridiculous highest fee i've ever seen
which it doesnt changed up no matter whats the current basic network fee. 8)

I remember quite well. In late 2017, Binance's  withdrawal fees also reached somewhere in the range of 0.001BTC. Binance does change it's withdrawal fees though not very often to match the trend. Just less than a month ago, the fee was at around 0.0003 BTC, right now it's 0.0005 BTC.

About a week ago I did make a withdrawal from Bitmex using the minimal fee of 0.0003BTC but the transaction would take several hours to get it's first confirmation unlike in the past month when it would get confirmed within the next 2 blocks. I believe binance also slightly raised their fee based on the recent rise on the minimal fee required for the transaction to be confirmed within the next block or 2 blocks.

Remember this exchanges sometimes process transactions with more inputs and outputs than our normal transactions that may have 1 input and output so sometimes the fees change considerably.

If you are buying very small amount of bitcoins from your euro then using exchange is not a great idea,you can use the currency exchange section of our forum and for such small amount there won't be any need of escrow if you are willing to go first with any trusted persons here.Yes the withdrawal fee are way higher from the current transaction fee but they are providing service to make profits so its business to them so don't expect them with no fee.

I think no one addressed OP's issue so far. Everyone is talking about Exchange charging high fees but OP wants to know the substitute to bitstamp and binance for sending btc:


So OP you have to understand the difference between exchange and wallet. It is not advisable to use Exchange to send/receive bitcoin. Use Exchange to buy bitcoins. Once bought, withdraw these to a wallet and use the wallet to do transactions.
There are lot of wallets to choose from. If I mention any particular here then it may sound biased so I am going to give you general overlook. So there are basically four types of wallets - Web/Desktop/Mobile/Hardware. Web wallets are mostly centralized and you won't be given private keys so real ownership of funds will lie with the wallet, not you. Exchanges also work like Web Wallets. Since you don't have problem using Exchanges to keep money, Web Wallets will be best for you in my opinion. Web wallets are easy to use as compared to other type of wallets and fees are relatively less than Exchanges (mostly network fees).

Choose your web wallet from here: https://bitcoin.org/en/choose-your-wallet
If you are new to bitcoin then I would recommend using this site to learn everything about Bitcoin.

Well I think dynamic fee model should be the one to stay. Pay only that requires. Why would we expect to pay less fees to the exchanges when the fees was around 0.001BTC or more.

Yes but for every output you are not paying that exponential amount of fees of course. For a segwit address I think every output costs 138 sats and for legacy address every output costs 268 sat or something for 1 sat/Byte. And these days a 1 sat/Byte Tx does not take more than 2 hours to confirm. But for every output they are charging 50,000 sats which is crazy amount.

As much as I hate suggesting leaving your coins on an exchange for any length of time, if you are only going to be buying 5 bucks worth of BTC at a time, then withdrawing every 5 bucks separately is going to cost way too much in exchange fees. You'd be better off leaving your coins on the exchange until you have $30 or more and then withdrawing all at once. Another option would be to save your fiat up until you have $30 and then buy the BTC all at once. Either of these options will also prevent you from having a wallet filled with multiple small UTXOs which will cost you more fees to consolidate in the future.

Alternatively, avoid the exchanges altogether and trade peer-to-peer on this forum or a DEX, and then there is no withdrawal fee.

I don't think i wrote it clear enough what i am doing, so i will try to write it better this time. I do this:

1) deposit an amount to bitcoin/binance from my credit card. Usualy i deposit 15€, 30€, it could even be 100€
2) then i make small withdrawals, basicaly i send small amounts of bitcoins, up to 5€ to different adresses.

That is all. I cannot make smaller withdrawals, there is no way around it. And when i withdraw 5€, basicaly i pay 3€ fee. This means if you add it all up, if i make 20 withdrawals together totaling 100€, i lose 60€. I am trying to avoid my own wallet because this seems like a lot of work to do. I would be happy to pay for instance 0.001 fee, but 0.005 for my purpose is a lot. Is there any page that has less fee then binance and bitstamp ?

All the exchanges charge a lot for bitcoin transfers.

If you are transferring from exchange to exchange, you might want to convert to something like ethereum or litecoin, make the transfer, and then convert it back. Both are liquid enough so you won't lose out on the spread as long as you exchange back into bitcoin immediately.

As always crunch the numbers first to make sure you are saving money before you go ahead.

Those are your only two options, pretty much. You can try other exchanges, but you will still end up paying huge amounts in fees, even if slightly less than what you are paying currently.

Downloading, verifying, and installing Electrum (for example) can be done in less than 10 minutes, even if you don't know how to verify files and have to follow the step by step guide. Another 10 minutes and you can have set up a new wallet and have your seed phrase backed up on paper. Once you are sending from your own wallet, you'll only be paying a few cents per transaction instead of several dollars. 20 minutes to save $60 seems worth it to me.

With exchanges, you can't but with "o_e_l_e_o's suggestion" you can withdraw a lot lesser than that.

It's actually quite the opposite.
- In addition to what "o_e_l_e_o" mentioned above, you can easily group transactions (send to multiple addresses with a single TX) and save even more fees down the road.

I set up Electrum and now when i try to send coins from bitstamp, it always says invalid address. I even tried the testnet thing and its same there, invalid adress. Whats the problem ?

Let me guess, your address starts with bc1...? This is a new address format which makes your transaction fees cheaper, but unfortunately isn't yet supported by many (lazy) exchanges and websites. Create a new wallet but this type select "Legacy" instead of "Segwit", this will create a wallet with 1... addresses.

This is the reason why XRP is being used by some just to withdraw funds outside and then to their banks because its cheaper it doesn't even cost $1. I guess you can say withdrawing BTC going to your personal wallet for long term holding has a price to pay.


That is what could happen for some of those who are just buying at every dip, until the consolidation ends he can then send his BTC outside which at least he will just do it once.

Thank you, this was indeed the problem, i didnt choose legacy (program was very helpful by not telling me what to choose and putting the wrong choice first, this is what pisses me off with software everytime). Anyway it would appear that it worked, i sent 0.001 bitcoin from bitstamp and now im waiting for it to appear. Then i will try sending it. If this works, this is going to save me a lot of money.
Sorry for sounding noobish but .. how safe is this ? I dont know why i feel safer when im using bitstamp/binance, now i just use a computer program

Segwit it's not the wrong choice. It is actually the best one, since fees are cheaper and it helps the Bitcoin network. BUT... many services are just lazy and take forever to implement support for it. Most big companies already support Segwit. The "Legacy" option is only the "right choice" if you need to use these "outdated" services, since this address type has full compatibility.

You mean the Electrum wallet? Very safe. Everyone that gets screwed using it are people that made mistakes and didn't follow the basic rules for being safe. A few tips:

1. ONLY download Electrum from ELECTRUM.ORG (triple check the URL!!!!).
2. Verify the signature of the file to make sure what you downloaded is legit. It's not hard and there is a tutorial here (https://bitcoinelectrum.com/how-to-verify-your-electrum-download/).
3. Any questions or worried if something is legit or not? Create a thread here and let people help you.
4. Do NOT download random stuff from the internet.
5. When copying an address to send coins to it, paste it and then TRIPLE CHECK it to see if it's the right address. Some malware in the internet change the addresses you copy to malicious ones.
6. Do NOT send your private-keys or backup seed to ANYONE.

Thank you for all the answers, you have been very nice and helpful, which i cannot say for many many forums. Thank you for that from my heart, kindness in todays world is not something you see often.
So now i sent a very small amount of couns from bitstamp to my electrum wallet. I think it was 0.001 bitcoin. After a while electrum saw that coins. And now i sent a tiny amount to one of those adresses that i often send. Right away it saw them but it has to verify them. In electrum i had a choice of number of blocks, basicaly fewer blocks meant fee will be smaller. Did i understand that correctly ? Anyway, now i need a way to calculate what the fee is when i transfer small amounts from electrum to those adresses. Bitstamp fee is not a problem anymore because i just send 30€ worth of coins at once, pay that 3€ fee but after that i can make transactions from electrum with small fee. Still, i would like to know what that fee is, just out of curiosity. And safety is not an issue since i work with such small amounts, i can afford to lose 30€ as long as the chance is very very small.

And i just checked and the bitcoins got through. Now i just need to write down the amount of coins and send and how many come out on the other side, to see what the fee is. Thank you again !

The fees suggested by Electrum are always changing since it's calculated based on the network usage. When the Bitcoin mempool is full (many transactions waiting to be confirmed) the fees rise. You can pay the amount you want, but how fast it will confirm depends on how much you pay in comparison to other transactions in the network.

It's a bit complicated in the beginning. But if you don't mind paying a little bit more in some cases, just choose what Electrum recommends you. Or you can see how much some websites recommend to you and try to decide according to them.

https://bitcoinfees.earn.com/
https://bitcoinfees.info/
https://coinb.in/#fee

No, it's the opposite :)
- In order to get your transaction to be added to the first few blocks, you'll have to pay a higher fee.
- "TryNinja" already covered other parts but if you still have questions, you can refer to "official documentation of electrum (https://electrum.readthedocs.io/en/latest/)".

First of all, in Electrum, go to Tools -> Preferences, and check the box titled "Edit fees manually". I'd also change the "Fee estimation" drop down to "ETA".

For a general ball-park figure, I use the https://coinb.in/#fees site suggested above. You can ignore all the complicated sliders and just look at the bottom number in the blue box, currently 5 Sat/Byte. That's usually a good bet if you aren't in too much of a hurry and want your transaction confirmed within an hour or two. You can just punch that number in to the "Fee" box on Electrum.

If you want to have a bit more control, then use the fee slider in Electrum to choose how many blocks you want to wait before confirmation. A block is 10 minutes on average, but in reality can sometimes be much quicker or much longer than this. If you really need the transaction confirmed quickly, move the slider all the way to the right. Electrum will aim to confirm it within the next block, but you'll pay a larger fee (but still way lower than what you are paying from the exchange). If you are in no hurry and can wait all day for the transaction to confirm, move the slider all the way to the left to save yourself as much money as possible.

Ok so without changing any settings i made a transaction. In electrum it said -0.00042216 and the adress i sent to received 0.00041520. So if i got this right, the fee was 0.00000696 bitcoin which is 0.046€ or like 0.060$ which is basicaly nothing. Now i set it to edit fees manualy but this fee is so low as it is, that i am very very pleased. Thank you very much to all for your help. This is gonna save me tons of money

That sounds much better, and is in the right ball park of what you should be expecting to pay for a standard 1-input-2-output transaction when the mempool isn't backed up.

If you are interested to find out exactly what you paid in fees, you can right click on your transaction in Electrum and click on "Details". It will tell you an exact fee near the top left of the new box that pops up. You can also right click on the transaction in Electrum and then click on "View on block explorer", and it will take you to a webpage which shows you all the details of your transaction on a block explorer webpage. Somewhere on that page (depending on which block explorer you are using) it will tell you the exact fee you paid, in either bitcoin or satoshi/sats.