Bitcoin Forum

https://cointelegraph.com/news/venezuelan-bolivar-trading-volumes-on-localbitcoins-hits-new-record-high

Any thoughts or ideas?

Currently, Venezuela is facing a terrible crisis and embargo from abroad.
The Venezuelan government has tried to launch the peso to stabilize its finances, attract foreign currencies and break the embargo, but this did not achieve the desired results. People tend to hoard foreign currencies and bitcoins, which are more stable than local currencies. Perhaps that is the reason for the high transaction.

If may be good if you provide your thoughts in the OP, in order to open a debate as to the specifics you want to discuss …

Venezuela has a galloping hyperinflation as we know, which causes the population, the fraction that can, to move away from the Bolivar, and shift to the USD when possible, to the extreme where the USD is a common currency for everyday life in many areas.

Additionally, those that have a bit of technological background use crypto (BTC and others, including stablecoins) in order to try to slow down the impact of hyperinflation on their savings, and, if possible, skim a percentage from the benefit (if any - not going to happen this week for example) in order to live off it, or at least complement their household incomes. The proportion of the population that is capable of managing BTC is not massive, but large enough to show on LocalBitcoins a a trend for those who dare venture the crypto path.

Note: Forget the Petro (a government centralized invention that bears no value outside its borders, and little within).

Venezuela's official currency is facing the highest inflation in history, people seem to have lost all faith in the government.The financial crisis in Venezuela has led to serious consequences for the economy. Bitcoin has solved many of their consequences and will likely replace the Venezuelan currency.
Bitcoin's rising demand in Venezuela also makes it much more likely that they will replace these national currencies. People are still trying to do whatever they can to get USD, gold and Bitcoin to ensure their lives.
Every Venezuelan citizen is looking for a more stable and stronger currency, maybe that's why they chose bitcoin.

Pardon me but a thought that might be common with others is, if you have a country or even a nation with lets say bountiful resources, money etc etc.. why would you be so reliant on someone else's governement?

Recently we have seen a similar surge in bitcoin trading volume from Hong Kong when the protest against China was on full swing. Protesters thought that China may ban them from banking services and hence they converted their HKD to Bitcoin to protect their capital amidst all these unrest!

Probably a similar thing is ongoing in Venezuela as well! Not the protest but due to the devaluation of the national currency Bolivar, Venezuelan people is trying to protect their capital and maintain their purchasing power. The reason can be anything but capital protection is one primary reason due to which we are seeing more trading volume in Venezuela! But really, a concrete reason is hard to conclude!

Economic crisis is the biggest problem for Venezuela now so cryptocurrency is their best option. I heard that they made their own currency named Petro. By the growing of Bitcoin in Venezuela, i think their own currency will grown too.

Its a good thing to see that wherever there is a financial crisis, the government is turning towards crypto, there are pros and cons for this but the governments of developed countries should understand the importance of it and try to implement blockchain in their system.

The majority of people in Venezuela are too poor they won't be able to afford to buy bitcoin. The economy there has collapsed so people can't even earn enough to buy food.

The only rich people are the ones connected to Maduro's regime, and I guess they are carefully trying to hide their money in the form of bitcoin so that when the regime finally collapses they can get out unscathed.

Venezuela is country that isn't not really a progressive one when it comes to economy, then why their leaders prefer choosing cryptocurrency as their mode of payment? It made me more amaze for their leadership, because of the open minded leaders which has adopted on the system that crypto has; even if it was recently encountering several downturns. Their people towards the economy, was strongly motivated on how crypto works on particular advantages that provides financial freedom to all individuals.

it is obvious that bitcoin adoption is growing everywhere and that means more trading volume on every exchange that you look at in any country around the globe.
but the small rises or even small spikes that sometimes we see in localbitcoins volume is not something to get excited over and start an article about specially when you convert the volume to another currency you are more familiar with like USD!
when you look at the volume in Bolivar it looks big (209 billion) but when you convert it to USD or even BTC (607 bitcoin) then you can see how small it is in comparison with volume elsewhere.
in fact when you convert it to BTC you can see there is a big decline in the volume compared to the beginning of the year!

The same metric to gauge interest over and over again for the same country. Not that I'm discrediting Venezuela's progress on everything crypto-related but apparently LBC is not really reliable anymore and the stats that they are producing/showing are somewhat unreliable. Even though that's the case, Venezuela is still showing progress in cryptocurrency adoption.

Only the rich and influentials are converting their local currencies to Bitcoin in order to save their fortune. Poor people won't have that kind of financing capability to buy Bitcoin.

It is Bad to hear about a country, so rich with natural resources has come to this state. Corrupt politicians and bureaucracy have to be blamed.

Every year inflation in Venezuela increases more than 10,000%, so a record in bolivar trading volumes is irrelevant. They're trying to use USD, and a trading volume in USD would be more relevant

those who bought bitcoin however are also going to experience misfortune when the price of BTC will crash. a lot will take profit because of them panic buying. these rich influentials if not aware of the of the risk will be forced to dump back to USD in loss. they're fucked in both ways. 

its hard to run a government when politicians around the president are advising different things, all these because they want Guaido to be their leader. so it has to appear like the country is in turmoil for Guaido to take over.

This is the same data that is represented in the article referenced in the OP, but in BTC (despite what the chart’s title says – it doesn’t seem to adjust properly when switching between VES and BTC):
It tells a different story … BTC trades on LocalBitcoins in Venezuela seems rathe stable since June 2019, and a third since the beginning of year. Of course BTC has doubled in price this year (in relation to a stable FIAT).

All in all, interpreting with precision a chart of the kind when both the currency (way more in a single direction) and BTC (way less) have wide shifts in their relative value, is not a simple task.

Note: Historical data in VES is only present since halfway through 2018 (in BTC it goes back to 2013), when the Bolivar Soberano was reconverted from it’s prior form.

The country is now embracing the idea of cryptocurrency because their government is in turmoil right now at least the people are doing something in their own to lessen the inflation that their country is suffering right now, but I think the volume of BTC is below right now so I think they are buying other cryptocurrencies that are cheap, well there are still people switching to Bitcoin but mostly I think Altcoin is popular in Venezuela right now,

Well, that spike from February 2019 was because of them that are starting buying BTC only but many can not afford the price value of it so they are inverting to other cryptos.

What can I say... I give my condolences to Venezuelans who have to live in such a terrible economic situation... The government does not seem to be doing good in terms of improving the situation as well. No wonder people sell their almost worthless fiat for something valuable like Bitcoin. Then again, since exchanges report fake volume sometimes, perhaps this data is inaccurate as well. It's also sad that the government is trying to push that Petro pseudo-crypto, whereas it's clearly not helping the situation. As far as I know, the majority of the population is leaving below the poverty line and unemployment is at 30%. Unfortunately, in such a terrible situation, I don't think Bitcoin can help Venezuela or vice versa.

Sometimes it is really a little funny to me when Bitcoin connects with Venezuela in every way possible, either as the savior of the entire monetary system of the country or as some straw of the salvation of ordinary people. Although the percentage of unemployed is very large, the minimum wage in August was only $2 (https://www.efe.com/efe/english/world/venezuelan-minimum-wage-hits-rock-bottom-2-00-a-month/50000262-4053749) which is really not enough for any kind of life. It should also be noted that more than one million people have left the country in recent years.

Bitcoin can't help Venezuela, they need a lot more than that, above all, they need a miracle - and we all know that miracles happen very rarely, especially if you have bad relations with the masters of the world.

Well taking it off subject back to the dumping btc. If you look at btc being dump, people will look as it is a problem since its driving the price down but in reality in the future i think it could create a higher distribution rate than it is now which in turn drives up the price. Gets it away from weak hands and maybe into stronger hands and turns it into more into a main stream currency and a storage of wealth. The beauty of bitcoin or any "altcoin" in that matter is that it's almost a neutral currency. It's goes around lots of barriers that may be there with other Fiat/currency.

I don't think it would provide them with lots of benefits, though it is evident that they have their leaders who are pro-cryptocurrency, it is still a good thing that their leaders should focus on maintaining the good economy first before they try to grasp new technology, because for me, how could we excel if we aren't really aware and perfected the basics of maintaining good economy? But also I consider the chances that they might find the best way to make their economy good with cryptocurrency.

miracles doesn't happen when a country's situation is like Venezuela against the masters of the world who just want to milk the country. UK and US are against their current leader. their government doesn't have much option since Chavez death but even so they can still be the top oil exporter.  the country can produce more oil for China but these UK and US doesn't like that. and they will bring Marudo down. but BTC will serve their economy to be stable. they do have the resources, they can ignore all if they are just unified.

One thing we should always remember is that Bitcoin cannot solve problems with governments. The Venezuela's government f%^^&ed up the local

economy and hyperinflation is killing the local currency. Today you can buy 3 bottles of milk with say 1000 Bolívar and within a couple of hours you

can only buy 2 bottles of milk. So what do you do... you shift your Bolívar into something that would protect the value of your local currency, so

that you can buy 3 bottles of milk with it, even after the value has dropped. The Bitcoin price gradually goes up, so you get even more milk for the

bitcoins that you bought before.  ;)

Right but the question still isn't answered.. If you have milk, bolivars etc etc.. then why are you so reliant on another govt?

Would you mind stopping with your political agenda? What you say is utter garbage, and it will force me to debunk you. This gets annoying after doing it for years...

This has nothing to do with "embargoes", don't bring that utter crap. China doesn't use or care for the USD, we send them crude OIL, in fact we are in debt to them for over 60 thousand million USD or such huge amount it would be cheaper for them to just take us over Hong Kong style and be done with it (and we would probably live better as their colony than under Maduro anyway).

Next is Russia, they also don't care for the USD. Maduro was quick to give them what little gold was brought by Chavez back in the day, in exchange of weapons, and who knows what else...

America threatens anyone dealing not with Venezuela, but with certain Venezuelan individuals, its quite the list, all related to Maduro and his cronies, Padrino, Diosdado etc, and all from the untouchable "nomenklatura". Any regular Venezuelan not related to them, can still do business just fine. Too bad the government is the one that authorizes who does business and who doesn't...

However, this doesn't concern neither Chinese nor Russians (and various non-aligned), which are the main "friends" of Maduro anyway.

To put it short, the reason of our misery is only one: The economy (https://mises.org/wire/what-venezuela-needs-prosperous-future). It is not a foreign cause, but an internal cause. The economy is strangled by those in power. There are of course other factors, such as the rampant crime and corruption, but lets keep this focused.

You bring Guaido, but he is nothing more than a symbol if at all. The political opposition is powerless in a country that imprisons and kills dissent. The very reason Maduro will remain eternally in power unchallenged, and millions giving up hope and leaving the country.

As for Localbitcoins, the reason there is so much movement, is because of traders. No, not all transactions have to do with Venezuelans living in Venezuela exchanging for their daily needs. There are people (many not even living within) making lots of money with the terrible distortion this "command" economy produces.

Reality is, people do not use bitcoin in the street, or merchants receive it at all. You DO see (now that its "legal") some things with prices listed in USD, but aside VES, NOTHING else. Not even petros, petros simply do not exist in the street save for the one infamous chain store owned by who knows whom which is closely tied to the government and uses a very disadvantaged exchange rate you might end paying twice for the same thing than if you exchanged your petros for bolivares before going... But that's the typical Venezuelan merchant tradition: 100%+ gain or none, which is also why they HATE competition and depend on the State strong-arming them out of existence (yet another tradition).

If the "masters of the world" wanted the country, they would have taken it already. Fact is, they don't care. Trump is very happy doing, whatever, and the UK? They never had a presence or remote interest in this place. The OIL cartel is more than happy that Venezuela's production went under 1 million barrels per day (from 3 million, 20 years ago). All thanks to mismanagement, corruption and the broken "command" economy that ruined almost everyone, including State owned companies.

Hyperinflation, product of printing, caused by Maduro's overbudgeting. Because the free market means US imperialism and that is the root of all evil, and socialism cannot tolerate such a thing as people deciding things for themselves, they MUST OBEY THE STATE, or else...


Want to get close to the truth? Read this article: What Venezuela Needs for a Prosperous Future (https://mises.org/wire/what-venezuela-needs-prosperous-future)

Venezuela is always on the news because this country has become the so-called "poster child" on how a misfortune to a country's economy become the catalyst for some people to adopt and use Bitcoin as part of their survival strategy as the whole economic system is ravaged by gargantuan and seemingly insurmountable problems left and right. The recent high in trading bolivar to Bitcoin is just one of the symptoms that there is really a big problem with this country. However, one thing I realized is that Bitcoin can be doing well when there is something unfortunate happening like this one in Venezuela...now we can look at this positively or negatively depending on what lens to focus with. Definitely, Bitcoin will continue to be a premium digital asset in Venezuela for as long as the government could not be able to rein in the running away inflation and other related problems of the economy.

Venezuela in the last few years experienced a severe economic crisis that made the Bolivar currency fall and not worthless. so to be able to survive the people began to look for alternative means of payment that are more powerful and finally they chose bitcoin. so do not be surprised if the demand for bitcoin in venezuela is increasing. and the Venezuelan government will also make its own crypto called PETRO. making petro coins will be pegged with oil. We know Venezuela's biggest income comes from oil.

I think bitcoin helps Crypto users in Venezuela go through the government's breakdown and can help them buy food and supplies from other countries. It can also help them store their assets when their money is virtually devalued

When country faced economic crisis situation maybe they will take other solution with their payment way like adopting bitcoin as legal currency, last year Venezuela faced with bigger economic crisis and they are trying for receiving bitcoin to get positive payment transaction and get economic back to normal and get much benefit again.

The Venezuela is still facing crisis and it is because of the corruption of their president that causes hyper inflation where their money become worthless. This financial crisis lead to fled by their citizens to another country. Their governement are now also using bitcoin in terms of mode of payment. It is good to then because their have advantages that they keep getting.

It’s not quite that simple though. The state oil company, PDVSA, is having real issue managing to get paid for their petrol in a currency. EEUU sanctions on Venezuela affect their banks, and the possibilities of getting paid in USD, and are therefore reaching out to crypto as a form of avoiding the payment blockade. It’s therefore not a happy choice in a gee wiz look how cool type scenario, but one that confronts politics with the country’s needs, being the general polulation the one who suffers.

The crisis in Venezuela has been going on for a long time. Unfortunately, Petro could not change anything in the country. People want stable money, and Bitcoin seems to be a good fit. However, this is only a temporary solution, because the government is obliged to do something. Perhaps the adoption of Bitcoin as an alternative currency may help, but Venezuela is unlikely to take such measures.

The way I see it, it's only the rich in that country that will be able to invest in Bitcoin, the poor ones will be finding it difficult because the price of Bitcoin is high there. So, I don't really see how it's going to change things there, they should add more focus on fighting for a better economy and a good government to make things better for the country and the poor.

Bitcoin can't magically change a country's economy, something more has to be done, unless they will invest heavily in Bitcoin (more than other countries )  and hold till the price bubbles and they sell it, maybe that will have some impact. I doubt Venezuelan alone will be having power to pump bitcoin prices at least to the current ATH. If they will be able to do anything similar to that and making profits from their own pump then I believe bitcoin may give them some chances to find a immediate recovery from economic crisis in permanent manner too.

it's not surprising why bitcoin concentrations tend to be higher there compared to petro, I'm surprised they cut petro reserves to only 30 million barrels.

movement in localbitcoins is also a reaction of its citizens regardless of the economic burden of embargo sanctions faced by the government. I still believe they are still noisy with panic, and don't know how long they will be able to minimize international sanctions and gradually recover.

Could be some multi millionaire company trying to buy at Venezuelan territory.

Or maybe their government or some local citizen that become rich. Who knows since it's unknown the source of it.

Also a pump dump could be the reason for a sudden buy adoption.

Someone is definitively trying to achieve greatness using bitcoin which is a good thing.

That makes sense.

Well, I can't imagine a big company or a country govt trying to control Venezuela through this event and somehow it is possible.

I find the volumes on localbitcoins not that telling, especially with how it doesnt show why the coins have been bought. I'm leaning towards speculative buying and selling rather than people buying Bitcoin as safe haven.

Another thing is that due to their fiat currency losing purchasing power constantly, the increasing volumes on localbitcoins are kinda deceiving because in USD the volumes haven't actually gone up, but have been trending down.

The issue about the Venezuelan should have been fix all this while but their government is extremely not taking the right measure and he's running the country through his pride which I believe was one if the reason whooy the US President administration required sanctions on Venezuela and freezing of their government assets in the United States.

Venezuela people are in a good position if they are going to embrace bitcoin as mass volumes are being bought up in record numbers right now.
Have you seen those purses made out of bolivars? ;D
They have the cheapest electricity in south america and are using this to mine bitcoin like crazy. ;)
Congratulations to them if they can adopt it as a stable and reliable currency for their country.
All the power to them! 8)

PDVSA still gets EUR and USD via proxy countries. Most of the export to the US stopped when Trump seized Citgo anyway. It is very unlikely they are using crypto for anything. Of course they would love if others used petro, but the international trading partners won't.

Of course Trump's actions were the perfect scapegoat to cover the economic ineptitude and disaster from the "socialists", and that is exactly the official propaganda: that absolutely everything is the fault of USA. But it isn't, and most people don't fall for it, we might be oppressed, but not idiot.

If Trump hadn't done nothing, the situation here wouldn't have improved either; and yes, the fault would still lie in the USA... Most of you will never have to live this, so naturally you won't get it. But those that survived the eastern bloc soviet union days, might understand. Even if USA dropped the sanctions against the individuals from Maduro's regime, nothing would change, and they would STILL be at fault. These sanctions only pissed those corrupt fellows that kept spending fortunes in USA. Stomping in the misery of the people, those close to the regime just love spending fortunes in Washington DC, New York and Miami, and all of that with dirty money from Venezuela, THE REASON everybody else is piss poor and miserable earning 2$ or such per month. If anything, just revoking their visas and kicking them out was commendable. Rest is meh. They still live here like kings away from the impoverished masses, and often travel to other countries that give them the same treatment.

If you've got a currency that's failing in spite of those resources, you might not have much choice other than to either borrow a ton of money from another country or adopt its currency in place of yours.  That's exactly what Venezuela is doing. 

I can't say I understand the entire political situation in Venezuela, but it's my understanding that the political system is very messed up and those resources have been mismanaged along with many other things, which has led to the hyperinflation situation they're going thru. 

Bitcoin might be getting hot down there, but it's probably not being used as money.  People with money to save might be converting it into bitcoin as a store of value, but it's not clear to me if that's the case.  I just don't think it's being spent for everyday goods.

Hey all of you who talk crap, do any of you live in Venezuela? Of course you not!

I live in Venezuela and I can talk properly about what's going on in my country, more importantly, I belong to an organization that is putting the skin in the game trying to promote Bitcoin in my country.

Bitcoin is undoubtedly a method of payment that is becoming increasingly popular in Venezuela, all thanks to the legal framework that the government is trying to create, and you know what's best we don't give a damn.

The truth is that Venezuela has not broken any records in a long time.

The problem is that journalists use bolivars to measure Bitcoin purchase transactions but do not take into account the country's inflation. A more adequate measure of the volume is to use the dollar, with its value indexed after the open market (generally known as the black market) BSF/USD conversion.

Using the data provided by Yadio.io (https://yadio.io/), a website that tracks the actual price of the dollar-based on Bitcoin's buy/sell transactions through LocalBitcoins gives us a better perspective.


According to their data, 294,682,299 million dollars were exchanged in a year, this gives us a figure of at least 24.56 million dollars exchanged each month, 5.66 million dollars a week and about 800,000 dollars on average per day.

That's at least $33,640 every hour, that's a tiny amount of money compared to big exchanges in other countries.

Bitcoin is being used by average people in Venezuela, and this solid data shows that their buying interest has not ceased despite having gone through a brutal bear market, we are using Bitcoin as a tool to protect ourselves from this corrupt government, as intended by Satoshi Nakamoto.

The numbers in Bolivars are nothing more than a proof that bad money will always be exchanged for good money and that bad money will always lose value and more of it will be needed to obtain good money.

Source: https://yadio.io/

Bitcoin and other digital currencies are providing a lifeline to many people in the troubled Latin American country of Venezuela

In the conditions of such a high hyperinflation, Venezuelan citizens were simply forced to look for an alternative to their national currency. But given that the price of Bitcoin is extremely unstable, it would not be entirely reasonable to buy it to save money. It would be much more reasonable to buy US dollars for this. I think that Bitcoin was bought more by those people who hoped to increase their capital, due to the alleged increase in the price of digital gold.

One slight correction, Citgo was never seized by the US state or anything else.
Furthermore, the Office of Foreign Assets Control has declined Conoco's claims of shares in Citgo because it might go against the sanctions imposed by the Government.  So at this point, Citgo is quite safe and is making millions in profit (https://www.reuters.com/article/us-citgo-results/citgo-quarterly-profit-jumps-on-boost-from-higher-refining-capacity-idUSKBN1YA21N).


As always s story about nothing.
If you make a graph of how many bolivars people of Venezuela have spent for bread it will look like they are eating x1000 more bread that three years ago.
I really wish coindance would have the option of showing not only VES and BTC but also the volume in USD, so we could have a better view.

They could have implemented something as simple as that but they haven't and therefore encourage yellow journalists, if you genuinely wish to follow the evolution of the Bitcoin market in Venezuela use yadio.io is a site run by Venezuelans who truly understand what's going on.

https://yadio.io/

The Venezuelan situation is by far the most meaningful example in Bitcoins 10 years of it being used by to protect themselves in a hyper inflationary economy. this is why we do what we do. Bitcoin is directly helping people escape the worst possible financial situation a person can experience. Before Bitcoin, there was more even more misery for people with crap governments. The people switching to Bitcoin have no reason to trust government currencies again. they will use Bitcoin for the rest of their lives. this is part of how the different layers of adoption globally takes root.

Venezuela is the country which is passing the worst momentum in its History, It's horrible to see when this type of Oil-based country is suffering a financial crisis and people are being deprived of their basic needs, So cryptocurrency could be a good way to make cover this situation, but I don't know how much it could be helpful for this purpose, We know their Government has tried to lunch to Peso based crypto for the foreign investment but it was in a vain, that project couldn't see the light of success, Basically they are in this position for the International embargo so they have to set again oil oriented cryptocurrency, I think that could be a good thing for them.

Good to hear from a person who actually live in Venezuela, all the news i hear is from the media or some half ass hear say from those media and it is good to hear who is living and see your perspective of things who know much better than anyone in this forum, good to hear that you have a team who is promoting bitcoin to the general masses who are not aware of it and hopefully the government will create a legal framework and help the citizens recover from the situation you are going through.

Peace bud.

In my opinion this shows at a small scale what it could happen at a larger scale when the fiat currency system fails, people are going to do everything that they can in order to protect themselves and if the currency created by the government becomes so useless like what it is happening in Venezuela then they are going to use everything that they have at hand to protect their wealth, that is why I think that if we get another crisis like the one we saw in 2008 the adoption of bitcoin will go through the roof.

The fact is that Venezuela has huge problems with other countries that support sanctions and therefore this country has a very poor economy and practically no value of the national currency.  I think that the situation can dramatically change if not only people accumulate cryptocurrency on their own, but the state apparatus must make a decision in support of Bitcoin and other higher-rated cryptocurrencies, and not launch its own national cryptocurrency, which cannot show good results  in the current situation in the country.  I believe that the use of cryptocurrency on a national scale will bring more benefits than the use of fiat currencies of hostile countries, such as the United States.

The economic sanctions that Venezuela is enduring are not really the reason this is happening to them, the economy of Venezuela was in a really bad shape already and the sanctions are just helping to show the weakness of their economy, but I think you are missing my point, when things get so bad people are not really going to look for the approval of the government for their actions, in fact cryptocurrencies could become illegal at that point but it will not matter because if people have to choose between obeying an unjust law and assuring that they will have money tomorrow to eat something then they will always choose the latter.

Oh yeah, we can all switch to bitcoin and a miracle will happen

Let me ask you something, how do you think that these will happen just because of the use of cryptocurrency:
- the government will suddenly have more money to spend
- food and basic necessity stuff will suddenly appear in shops
- hundred of thousands of jobs (and well paid one) will be created
- the whole infrastructure will be repaired (and I'm not talking only about roads here)

Even if you would concentrate only on the money...

Venezuela's GDP lost somewhere around 100 billion (that's yearly).
In 5 years that's 500 billion lost, or...value of all the bitcoins mined today if the price would be 25k$.

And don't forget, BTC has a long list of countries which it is supposed to save...