Title: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Hydrogen on December 30, 2019, 10:14:39 AM Quote WASHINGTON, December 19, 2019—Debt in emerging and developing economies (EMDEs) climbed to a record US$55 trillion in 2018, marking an eight-year surge that has been the largest, fastest, and most broad-based in nearly five decades, according to a new World Bank Group study that urges policymakers to act promptly to strengthen their economic policies and make them less vulnerable to financial shocks. The analysis is contained in Global Waves of Debt, a comprehensive study of the four major episodes of debt accumulation that have occurred in more than 100 countries since 1970. It found that the debt-to-GDP ratio of developing countries has climbed 54 percentage points to 168 percent since the debt buildup began in 2010. On average, that ratio has risen by about seven percentage points a year—nearly three times as fast it did during the Latin America debt crisis of the 1970s. The increase, moreover, has been exceptionally broad-based—involving government as well as private debt, and observable in virtually all regions across the world. “The size, speed, and breadth of the latest debt wave should concern us all,” said World Bank Group President David Malpass. “It underscores why debt management and transparency need to be top priorities for policymakers—so they can increase growth and investment and ensure that the debt they take on contributes to better development outcomes for the people.” According to the report, the prevalence of historically low global interest rates mitigates the risk of a crisis for now. But the record of the past 50 years highlights the dangers: Since 1970, about half of the 521 national episodes of rapid debt growth in developing countries have been accompanied by financial crises that significantly weakened per-capita income and investment. “History shows that large debt surges often coincide with financial crises in developing countries, at great cost to the population,” said Ceyla Pazarbasioglu, the World Bank Group’s Vice President for Equitable Growth, Finance, and Institutions. “Policymakers should act promptly to enhance debt sustainability and reduce exposure to economic shocks.” The analysis found that this latest wave is different from the previous three in several ways—it involves a simultaneous buildup in both public and private debt; it involves new types of creditors; and it is not limited to one or two regions. Some of the increase in debt has been driven by China, whose debt-to-GDP ratio has risen 72 points to 255 percent since 2010. But debt is substantially higher in developing countries even if China is excluded from the analysis—among EMDEs, it is twice the nominal level reached in 2007. Those characteristics pose challenges that policymakers haven’t had to tackle before. For example, nonresident investors today account for 50 percent of the government debt of EMDEs, considerably more than in 2010. For low-income countries, much of this debt has been on non-concessional terms, and outside the debt-resolution framework of the Paris Club. Under the circumstances, policymakers should develop mechanisms to facilitate debt resolution when it becomes necessary, according to the report. Greater debt transparency would also help. https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/press-release/2019/12/19/debt-surge-in-emerging-and-developing-economies-is-largest-fastest-in-50-years .... Somehow I get a feeling neither central banks nor governments of the world, will make a legitimate move to address these issues. As global debt accumulates and negative attributes associated with inflationary money exert more destructive influences upon job markets, economies and living standards. Is there a chance we'll witness an exodus from inflationary models towards more deflationary paradigms such as gold standards or bitcoin? Its no big secret that investment banks prefer inflationary models as it makes it easier for them to create profits through inflating balance sheets. This translates to pro inflation / pro fractional reserve banking being taught as universal standards in colleges as standard curriculum. Purely due to the profiteering potential it offers banks, rather than it being stable or sustainable over the long term. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Harriti on December 30, 2019, 12:17:45 PM Somehow I get a feeling neither central banks nor governments of the world, will make a legitimate move to address these issues. As global debt accumulates and negative attributes associated with inflationary money exert more destructive influences upon job markets, economies and living standards. Is there a chance we'll witness an exodus from inflationary models towards more deflationary paradigms such as gold standards or bitcoin? Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Hydrogen on December 30, 2019, 12:44:46 PM You are too funny. So far, there have been many crises so far, and we have all taken steps regarding the supply of fiat money. There have been no real steps taken to address deficit in the USA or EU much less on a smaller scale in developing nations. all economists know Bitcoin is a scam. No one manages it Economists in the current era are often less reliable and accurate than broken clocks and weather predictions. They predict recessions, that tesla's stock will fail and people should short it. And other nonsense across the board on a regular and routine basis. What economists purportedly "know" is vastly overrated and not something most people take seriously anymore. That said who are you who would claim to speak for "all economists" some of whom are very much pro crypto and pro bitcoin. Don't be too naive to think that bitcoin can help the whole world prosper! It is the tool to kill those who think like you. Bitcoin intoduces free market competition to bank and government monopolies. This incentivizes banks and states to be more proactive in addressing negatives prevalent in their respective sectors. Its a win/win for everyone including banks and governments so why oppose it. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: panganib999 on December 30, 2019, 12:52:40 PM Well, banks have the sure proof backup plan called "gold" in their hands. Iirc, banks have actually been hoarding gold for quite sometime now, and I believe they have the ability to withstand the recession that may come and up due to the huge debt the world has accumulated so far. Plus, I believe that in talking about profits, letting a market crash happen while they stand together with gold would bring them more profit and honestly, it's already been quite some time since the debt has been announced to be over the top and yet, the top brass has done nothing to appease the problem. As for bitcoin being a possible answer, I doubt that. Gold and Bitcoin has a clear cut difference in terms of volatility, and gold stands above bitcoin this time.
Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: alyssa85 on December 30, 2019, 01:33:28 PM It's mainly happening in China - but the Chinese seem to be allowing some of these companies to default to make investors more careful about whom they lend to. See
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-12-26/china-s-government-is-letting-a-wave-of-bond-defaults-just-happen Quote China’s had another record year of corporate bond defaults. That’s not a crisis. It’s a plan. A decade ago, defaults almost never happened, but that wasn’t because companies in China were always healthy. It was a reflection of the tightly controlled financial system, where companies were often linked to the government and bonds were largely bought by state-owned lenders. Authorities have often stepped in to ensure that financially troubled enterprises didn’t crash into default, out of concern over social unrest in the event of job losses or missed payroll payments. This system imposed little discipline on borrowers. Now global investors are coming into China’s bond market. Though many companies are still state-backed, policymakers are getting more comfortable with defaults. Without them, bond buyers would have little incentive to make a careful assessment of a company’s creditworthiness. They had corporate debt defaults of $130.7bn in 2019. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: 1Referee on December 30, 2019, 02:53:07 PM Plus, I believe that in talking about profits, letting a market crash happen while they stand together with gold would bring them more profit and honestly, it's already been quite some time since the debt has been announced to be over the top and yet, the top brass has done nothing to appease the problem. That's not going to work. Gold isn't the ultimate safe haven asset people think it is. If a global crash is artificially initiated, it will also tank the value of Gold because most of the actual price discovery happens on derivatives markets, and what are they used for the most? Right, it's speculation, not for safe haven purposes. Gold doesn't automatically pay your debt or bills. In order to get that done, doesn't matter who it concerns, it will need to be sold for fiat. The most in-demand asset will be fiat. Everything else will very likely suffer and bleed for years straight. Bitcoin will fall as well. The only people who think that Bitcoin is a safe haven asset are those within the space, the rest just considers it to be a wild west casino. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: tartibaya on December 30, 2019, 03:31:49 PM People spend money all the time. Is it always right to buy something? Necessary needs can be taken but luxury consumption is too much. What Bitcoin can do in this case. Inflation can be a means of control. A fairer distribution of economic power can be achieved with more limited money.
Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: jkpj22 on January 02, 2020, 10:57:02 AM Gold is and always was hedge against bad things happening. If we are to experience a crisis, it will keep going up.
However I agree with one thing - hoarding gold is not gonna save your ass. It has no liquidity. How do you want to pay with it? If there is nobody to give you money for it, then it's useless to you at the end of the day. Anyway, buying gold is still the best thing you can do. And buying real estate too. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Darooghe on January 02, 2020, 11:32:18 AM I foresee one viable option, money is debt and debt is money. the current fiat system has to go. No more paper value, All bank accounts to zero. no more Mortgage, Loans or other forms of debts, nothing to payback, but then what's your 5 bucks gonna get you? For the only way to eliminate the self imploding debt, is to kill the monetary system. A group of cryptographers named Satoshi Nakamoto, created a emergency exit, BITCOIN. "Let us be rid of the debt, and by the same token, instate a one world currency unit. Then we shall control not only the economy of one country, but the world."
Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Hydrogen on January 02, 2020, 12:59:25 PM I foresee one viable option, money is debt and debt is money. the current fiat system has to go. No more paper value, All bank accounts to zero. no more Mortgage, Loans or other forms of debts, nothing to payback, but then what's your 5 bucks gonna get you? For the only way to eliminate the self imploding debt, is to kill the monetary system. Hey didn't that work for the tv show Mr. Robot? ;) If debt is wiped out across the board. It could also wipe out retirement plans, food stamps, welfare, pensions, health insurance and other state funded programs people rely upon for survival. There was a reason behind a sharp increase in fatalities after the USSR defaulted on its deficit. Russians lost their state funded pension plans and had no alternatives. There appears to be confusion as to what happens when a state cannot pay its debt. I think the best analogy is a bank or large corporation going bankrupt. Whatever side effects or outcome, they may not be pleasant. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Wexnident on January 02, 2020, 03:30:28 PM I actually doubt they're even gonna make a move. Honestly, They're just pretty much letting it accumulate. Sure, they're trying to pay it back, but let's be honest. Them paying it back means loaning more, which really just kills the notion of them actually "paying it back".
I foresee one viable option, money is debt and debt is money. the current fiat system has to go. No more paper value, All bank accounts to zero. no more Mortgage, Loans or other forms of debts, nothing to payback, but then what's your 5 bucks gonna get you? For the only way to eliminate the self imploding debt, is to kill the monetary system. A group of cryptographers named Satoshi Nakamoto, created a emergency exit, BITCOIN. "Let us be rid of the debt, and by the same token, instate a one world currency unit. Then we shall control not only the economy of one country, but the world." Easy to say mate. Do you even know the possible repercussions of the action you just want to do? That's like literally killing off the entire market. And honestly, even if we start doing it now, It would take yeaars to implement. Like literally. That's overhauling literally everything the entire world has stood for in the past decades. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: squatz1 on January 02, 2020, 04:27:15 PM I foresee one viable option, money is debt and debt is money. the current fiat system has to go. No more paper value, All bank accounts to zero. no more Mortgage, Loans or other forms of debts, nothing to payback, but then what's your 5 bucks gonna get you? For the only way to eliminate the self imploding debt, is to kill the monetary system. Hey didn't that work for the tv show Mr. Robot? ;) If debt is wiped out across the board. It could also wipe out retirement plans, food stamps, welfare, pensions, health insurance and other state funded programs people rely upon for survival. There was a reason behind a sharp increase in fatalities after the USSR defaulted on its deficit. Russians lost their state funded pension plans and had no alternatives. There appears to be confusion as to what happens when a state cannot pay its debt. I think the best analogy is a bank or large corporation going bankrupt. Whatever side effects or outcome, they may not be pleasant. Yeah people don't really understand that you can't just remove debt because there is always someone else on the otherside of the debt. The person that is owed the money. Even in the US -- most of the federal debt isn't owed to people or corporations, it's owed back to the US government -- as it's owed to the Social Security and Medicare Trust fund (pretty sure Medicare as well, but I know SS) So instead of just wiping away the whole system and starting fresh -- which teaches nothing to people -- you have to focus on the problem head on. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: wheelz1200 on January 02, 2020, 04:34:38 PM The problem also lies in the fact that as a global society it has become the norm to live in great debt and believe it's not that big of a deal. 100 years ago this was not the case. People used to take pride in working for everything they got instead of just living on credit. The financial institutions have now taken advantage of this and now we are in a very unstable predicament.
Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: panganib999 on January 02, 2020, 05:27:33 PM That's not going to work. Gold isn't the ultimate safe haven asset people think it is. If a global crash is artificially initiated, it will also tank the value of Gold because most of the actual price discovery happens on derivatives markets, and what are they used for the most? Right, it's speculation, not for safe haven purposes. Gold doesn't automatically pay your debt or bills. In order to get that done, doesn't matter who it concerns, it will need to be sold for fiat. The most in-demand asset will be fiat. Everything else will very likely suffer and bleed for years straight. Bitcoin will fall as well. The only people who think that Bitcoin is a safe haven asset are those within the space, the rest just considers it to be a wild west casino. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: abhiseshakana on January 03, 2020, 04:47:31 AM Somehow I get a feeling neither central banks nor governments of the world, will make a legitimate move to address these issues. As global debt accumulates and negative attributes associated with inflationary money exert more destructive influences upon job markets, economies and living standards. Is there a chance we'll witness an exodus from inflationary models towards more deflationary paradigms such as gold standards or bitcoin? Discussing the exodus from the fiat system to the gold system or the adoption of full bitcoin we must discuss the impact of increasing global debt accumulation on the global economy and the economy of a country. Significantly increased debt accumulation will pose a risk of increasing financial stability in the short term, namely economic tightening by developed countries to reduce debt from fiscal policy to increase interest rates, which in turn is an increase in the exchange rate of its currency. In the end, developing countries and poor countries that absorb debt in the form of dollars from rich countries will experience debt swelling. Will the swelling of debt and all its problems bring the awareness of many state governments that the fiat system is very vulnerable and is a failure especially when the US starts printing dollars without gold collateral, and then moves on to bitcoin? In my opinion, the answer is no. Because one of the symbols of a country's sovereignty is its national currency. It is impossible for a government to surrender its authority to a decentralized system. Unless it is because of TINA (there is no alternative) as happened in Venezuela because it received a total embargo from the United States. Switching to a gold-based system is more likely to be done by some countries in the long run. Some Islamic countries have started to initiate currencies with gold guarantees. But preparing the network transition infrastructure from a fiat system with a new system will take a long time. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: hugeblack on January 09, 2020, 03:39:58 PM Unfortunately, the politicians who borrow them are the people who pay the bills.
Many of these politicians are corrupt and no one is emulating them for their punishment, but rather impunity, especially in developing countries. Therefore, the return to gold is highly unlikely, especially with the inflation of these countries ’spending and exchange. The least solution is to erode the value of the currency and thus print more money. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Linkkoin on January 09, 2020, 04:17:37 PM In my opinion, the answer is no. Because one of the symbols of a country's sovereignty is its national currency. It is impossible for a government to surrender its authority to a decentralized system. Unless it is because of TINA (there is no alternative) as happened in Venezuela because it received a total embargo from the United States. Switching to a gold-based system is more likely to be done by some countries in the long run. Some Islamic countries have started to initiate currencies with gold guarantees. But preparing the network transition infrastructure from a fiat system with a new system will take a long time. EU had proven, that in some cases resigning from own currency could have been harmful in case of crisis. Spain or Greece suffer damages from the last (a decade ago!) financial crisis, and as they could not manipulate its own currency and are unwilling to make really hard reforms. Yet as long as Bretton Woods agreement is still in force, it is hard to believe that going back to the gold standard or switching to BTC as the worlds currency (instead of USD) will happen in the next several decades. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Captain Corporate on January 09, 2020, 04:20:56 PM The debt situation world has will eventually be solved one way or another, there is no possibility that debt of this size can go unnoticed and just continues to grow. What will happen in the future, the world will have 100 trillion? 200? 500? There must be an end to it eventually and I don't know how it will happen or when it will happen but I am %100 certain it will happen. My money is on the fact that people will start to live in a more crypto currency way of life, earn the money you have and spend the money you earn type of way without debt and without needing any mortgages or debts. Thats on individual side, there is also the wall street companies that get billions of dollars in debt all the time and never pay it off and just keep postponing the payments of the debts until they can't be paid and than they just get bailed out, eventually it will reach to a level where they can't be bailed out anymore and even if that means hurting the economy badly, someone will punish them for their greed and let them go bankrupt with thousands of people who had money there but at least stop similar things happening again in the future.
Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: avikz on January 09, 2020, 05:46:18 PM Unfortunately, the politicians who borrow them are the people who pay the bills. Many of these politicians are corrupt and no one is emulating them for their punishment, but rather impunity, especially in developing countries. Therefore, the return to gold is highly unlikely, especially with the inflation of these countries ’spending and exchange. The least solution is to erode the value of the currency and thus print more money. I too agree that returning back to gold standard is highly unlikely! But we also need to understand that, it doesn't stop banks and institutions from buying more and more gold to stack up their underground lockers! So the demand of gold is not going to decrease! Rather, in current situation, this trend of buying gold is likely to increase and we have already started seeing a surge in Gold's price. So it really doesn't matter if gold standard is coming back or not, but it still remains the best hedge instrument during uncertain times! Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Theb on January 09, 2020, 07:41:59 PM Just an FYI if a great recession comes that will trigger an inflation similar to Venezuela even "deflationary" assets are not safe from inflation simply because these assets are still have an equal value to its fiat counterparts. During these times we will also see a lot of people liquidating their assets for cash so definitely it will drag down the prices of these assets just like what happened to the stock market and other markets during 2008 the crypto market will still be vulnerable from this basically you won't really expect any kind of asset to become a safe haven when the demand for money is greater than investments. So the only ones who will really prevail are the ones who still have a lot of extra cash lying around in their pockets where they can buy of these cheap assets when the time comes.
Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: outatime1 on January 10, 2020, 02:22:51 AM The gap between the rich and poor keeps getting wider as the wealthy control the political establishment. The poor are faced with high medical costs, student loan debt, high interest rates on credit cards, and low wages.
The system is designed to fail. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: iamMhew on January 10, 2020, 06:14:49 AM The increase in the amount of Debt are expected if the GDP increases as well, whats alarming is the Debt to GDP ratio. If it continues to increase significantly or constantly in a triple digit until it reaches the amount of GDP level, then that would be critical for it comes along a great debt cost. And it shows also that investors turns into creditors coz they have low confidence in the economy. Every economy has this metrics and its the role of the government and also the central banks to put some measures in this new trends in order to control any risk that could adversely affect their economy. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Bezobraznike on January 10, 2020, 06:53:00 AM The population of the world in 1950 was 2,556,000,000! Today 7,500,000,000! Nobody could predict that, like nobody could
predict that debt will rise so fast, same like inflation, and all other things. This system is can't be apply on global level, it's why we need digitalization, why we need Blockchain! Blockchain provides an immutable record, consider how helpful that can be for all of us who are fair and honest! In public sector Blockchain can be used for voting, all kind of records, paper documents can become history! Insurance, healthcare, gaming, supply chain, imagine revolution that Blockchain can make! Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: abhiseshakana on January 10, 2020, 03:18:40 PM EU had proven, that in some cases resigning from own currency could have been harmful in case of crisis. Spain or Greece suffer damages from the last (a decade ago!) financial crisis, and as they could not manipulate its own currency and are unwilling to make really hard reforms. Yet as long as Bretton Woods agreement is still in force, it is hard to believe that going back to the gold standard or switching to BTC as the worlds currency (instead of USD) will happen in the next several decades. I think the cause of economic problems in Spain and Greece is because of the debt crisis not because of adopting the euro. Although the Euro adoption effect means to generalize the economic standardization of all member countries which in fact the economic conditions differ from one another. This can be seen from the differences in policies taken by the European Union towards the debt crisis of Spain and Greece. Although the process of transition from the fiat system into a gold currency (money with intrinsic value) takes a long time at least by starting to use the gold currency will stop the depravity of our economy and initiate improvements in the global economic system. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: airdnasxela on January 10, 2020, 03:42:16 PM We cannot escape debt. A country with debt is normal. It only becomes so bad when the country have so much debt that their economy is falling. How come a country becomes free from debt when almost all people who lives in there have debts? Whether you are poor or rich, you still have debt. The richer you are, the higher debts you have. The difference is that, poor can't pay their debts because they don't have sufficient money. While rich people have debts yet they still have a lot of money.
Unfortunately, the politicians who borrow them are the people who pay the bills. Many of these politicians are corrupt and no one is emulating them for their punishment, but rather impunity, especially in developing countries. Therefore, the return to gold is highly unlikely, especially with the inflation of these countries ’spending and exchange. The least solution is to erode the value of the currency and thus print more money. I too agree that returning back to gold standard is highly unlikely! But we also need to understand that, it doesn't stop banks and institutions from buying more and more gold to stack up their underground lockers! So the demand of gold is not going to decrease! Rather, in current situation, this trend of buying gold is likely to increase and we have already started seeing a surge in Gold's price. So it really doesn't matter if gold standard is coming back or not, but it still remains the best hedge instrument during uncertain times! Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: davinchi on January 10, 2020, 04:56:05 PM This reminds of the climate change topic and the corporate shamers that try to make it look like its the perfumes that we use that somehow changes the world, hell there was even a thesis regarding how "farts" are actually much worse to our climate than it people imagine it is considering there is close to 8 billion people in the world right now compared to less back in the day so even that should be considered.
However, reality is 100 companies create 70% of the problems in the climate change, if those 100 companies suddenly vanished we would have 70% better climate in our hands. Same with debt, it looks like individuals have a lot of debt but this trillions of dollars are not because of individuals, its the companies that do not pay their debt on time and live with debt on their sheet. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Shasha80 on January 10, 2020, 04:58:32 PM It is true that the global wave of debt is the largest, and this is not a good thing for the world economy. Many countries
are experiencing a crisis economy and one of them because it has a debt that is so large. And even sadder now most people have think of debt as a lifestyle and also have a debt is considered normal. Whereas the right life, a life that is free from debt. According to me we should avoid debt, because if we are accustomed to debt it will make us poor. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: chip1994 on January 10, 2020, 05:37:13 PM Gold is and always was hedge against bad things happening. If we are to experience a crisis, it will keep going up. That's a good idea but it's old, and that's the idea of the old people who didn't have bitcoin before. Now that things are different, we have a different kind of non-physical assets with limited supply. So buying Bitcoin will be quite reasonable when you live in a world of technology, gold will not make us as much profit as bitcoin. that's what I'm sure of because the price of bitcoin is more powerful now than Gold, like the Iranian rocket launch on the US base. :)However I agree with one thing - hoarding gold is not gonna save your ass. It has no liquidity. How do you want to pay with it? If there is nobody to give you money for it, then it's useless to you at the end of the day. Anyway, buying gold is still the best thing you can do. And buying real estate too. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: justdimin on January 11, 2020, 05:21:12 PM There is a big big difference in gold and whats about to happen with the whole Iran versus USA thing tho, I mean I know debt is a lot and inflation is caused due to debt and other stuff so in any normal day you are right, gold is a great thing to invest into against inflation and against anything bad, hell betting on gold in case Trump gets reelected is also awesome as well, at the very least makes sure you won't be at disadvantage in that case.
However, and even tho I doubt this, USA goes to war with Iran, Iran is one of the few nations in the whole world that has a gold backed currency and they have insane amount of golds, it is actually illegal for them to take it out of nation for the regular people so not only national bank has a lot of gold but people do have a lot of gold as well, so if all of that gold actually goes out of nation due to a war, we will see gold price dropping a lot. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: ChrisPop on January 11, 2020, 05:34:50 PM I have learned through study that accumulated debt will reflect harshly in the economy sooner or later, in a form or another. Especially the United States debt is at crazy high historical rates nowadays and once the debt bubble bursts in my opinion we're going to see a massive cascade effect not on the US economy but on a global level as well.
Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: target on January 11, 2020, 05:44:59 PM But why would Iran export their gold as well? It isn't something that can benefit them as well since the oil they have are much needed outside their country. I have learned through study that accumulated debt will reflect harshly in the economy sooner or later, in a form or another. Especially the United States debt is at crazy high historical rates nowadays and once the debt bubble bursts in my opinion we're going to see a massive cascade effect not on the US economy but on a global level as well. In a form of WAR is probably to most possibility. Its like a person with deep neck debt, his patience are gong to be very shallow that an ant bite can cause a brawling to anyone. With a growing population that needs to be fed while political instability forces a president to take sides just to please the party. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Febo on January 11, 2020, 06:57:33 PM Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Man do you need articles to know this? Just look around you. 50 years ago you go to bank to take a loan if you build house. Today when you go buy car they dont even want to sell you unless you take it on debt. Economy we have is totally degenerated. Use now to pay tomorrow. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Theb on January 11, 2020, 08:44:48 PM I have learned through study that accumulated debt will reflect harshly in the economy sooner or later, in a form or another. Especially the United States debt is at crazy high historical rates nowadays and once the debt bubble bursts in my opinion we're going to see a massive cascade effect not on the US economy but on a global level as well. That is in fact true not only because financial institutions from the US have holdings directly in markets of other countries it also spreads a massive FUD for investors that is why it has a cascading effect on the global markets. Just observe how the NASDAQ moves daily you will see that other markets are also affected especially when they move on a significant quantity. The US being the most powerful country affects everything especially the economy of other countries. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: TheCoinGrabber on January 12, 2020, 06:39:47 AM Well the banks do have a back-up plan. It's called government bailout. ;D
Gold is and always was hedge against bad things happening. If we are to experience a crisis, it will keep going up. That's a good idea but it's old, and that's the idea of the old people who didn't have bitcoin before. Now that things are different, we have a different kind of non-physical assets with limited supply. So buying Bitcoin will be quite reasonable when you live in a world of technology, gold will not make us as much profit as bitcoin. that's what I'm sure of because the price of bitcoin is more powerful now than Gold, like the Iranian rocket launch on the US base. :)However I agree with one thing - hoarding gold is not gonna save your ass. It has no liquidity. How do you want to pay with it? If there is nobody to give you money for it, then it's useless to you at the end of the day. Anyway, buying gold is still the best thing you can do. And buying real estate too. Or maybe use the profits from bitcoins to buy gold? Yes I believe crypto is the future but so far gold is still a very trusted asset, one that people fall back to in times of uncertainty. I doubt it'll ever really make profit, it's just for safekeeping since humans seem to find it valuable. When people talk about backing currencies, they think of backing it with gold (like it used to), not crypto. Or in some cases, crypto backed by gold. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: abhiseshakana on January 12, 2020, 04:11:43 PM I have learned through study that accumulated debt will reflect harshly in the economy sooner or later, in a form or another. Especially the United States debt is at crazy high historical rates nowadays and once the debt bubble bursts in my opinion we're going to see a massive cascade effect not on the US economy but on a global level as well. The government usually looks at the debt ratio of total GDP to measure debt in a safe or crisis position, debt limit in unsecured conditions is 60% of total GDP. But I think the government should try to look at things from a different angle. In 1998 Indonesia's debt ratio was also at a safe point, only when the value of the rupiah against the dollar suddenly plummeted. Indonesia failed to pay off its foreign debt. As a result, Indonesia has been paralyzed and has a monetary crisis. So learning from Indonesia's case study of debt ratios or data on paper cannot guarantee that a country's debt is safe especially if the foreign debt is owed. Debt in the form of foreign direct investment used for government infrastructure projects, state-owned enterprise projects, and the private sector, is very dangerous for a country because of the potential for foreign exchange losses. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: heidikim on January 12, 2020, 09:52:22 PM Global debt is growing. Why do you think? Because the production value is falling. Inflation-related measures will be taken. That's a big problem. We won't be able to stop it if it keeps making money from it all the time. What is really valuable is production. Production labor should have more money.
Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Harlot on January 12, 2020, 10:26:56 PM Debt in the form of foreign direct investment used for government infrastructure projects, state-owned enterprise projects, and the private sector, is very dangerous for a country because of the potential for foreign exchange losses. I think the most recent example for this is what China is doing to other countries on what they so call "debt trap". The Chinese government will loan out money to countries they know that wouldn't be able to pay so when they default to that loan they will control the assets they have as collateral. This is how countries like China are taking advantage of other countries who are short in money and they are just losing more when their real aim is to just have a stable economy. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: 1Referee on January 13, 2020, 09:26:54 AM When people talk about backing currencies, they think of backing it with gold (like it used to), not crypto. Or in some cases, crypto backed by gold. It's the perfect recipe for failure. The whole point of crypto is that you verify, and not trust. How can you verify that Brinks actually has enough Gold in its vaults to back up whatever Gold backed crypto? I don't want to trust on an "independent" entity doing the verification part and they then release a report that says they are backed. If I can't see that they are backed myself, their words hold no value. Bitcoin is Bitcoin. You can verify everything easily and fast with how transparent this whole system is. Why go back to something we try to get rid of? ::) Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: drlukacs on January 13, 2020, 10:46:35 AM People spend money all the time. Is it always right to buy something? Necessary needs can be taken but luxury consumption is too much. What Bitcoin can do in this case. Inflation can be a means of control. A fairer distribution of economic power can be achieved with more limited money. Bitcoin is now considered the most popular digital asset and also the easiest to trade. Besides, it also addresses the problem of inflation because its supply is limited so people cannot use it to waste like fiat money. That's its strong point and it is being traded a lot and being bought and held by many people to avoid being affected too much by the economic downturn. actually bitcoin can help people like us out of poverty if we buy and hold it until the economic crisis occurs.Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: Linkkoin on January 13, 2020, 12:46:05 PM It's the perfect recipe for failure. The whole point of crypto is that you verify, and not trust. How can you verify that Brinks actually has enough Gold in its vaults to back up whatever Gold backed crypto? I don't want to trust on an "independent" entity doing the verification part and they then release a report that says they are backed. If I can't see that they are backed myself, their words hold no value. Bitcoin is Bitcoin. You can verify everything easily and fast with how transparent this whole system is. Why go back to something we try to get rid of? ::) The most important is that with cryptocurrencies if you send them to your own cold or hardware wallet it belongs to you unless it is stolen). With buying/trading precious metals in many countries (unless you get it with much worse spread) you just get a confirmation that you are an owner of some ounces of eg. gold in a gold bar stored 1500 miles away from you. When really needed you will have no access to such gold or it will be captured by authorities (as it already happened in the USA in 1933 with Executive Order 6102 by F.D.Roosevelt). Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: TheCoinGrabber on January 13, 2020, 01:01:50 PM When people talk about backing currencies, they think of backing it with gold (like it used to), not crypto. Or in some cases, crypto backed by gold. It's the perfect recipe for failure. The whole point of crypto is that you verify, and not trust. How can you verify that Brinks actually has enough Gold in its vaults to back up whatever Gold backed crypto? I don't want to trust on an "independent" entity doing the verification part and they then release a report that says they are backed. If I can't see that they are backed myself, their words hold no value. Bitcoin is Bitcoin. You can verify everything easily and fast with how transparent this whole system is. Why go back to something we try to get rid of? ::) That's true but I think governments are more likely to go back to the gold standard (and claim they actually have the gold to back it up) than to adopt Bitcoin. Almost every government plan for their own crypto seems to insist on backing it with a physical asset, for example Venezuela's sham petrocrypto. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: el kaka22 on January 14, 2020, 03:51:21 AM I am pretty sure debt in big corporations increase as well and this is not just us that causes this. I mean sure avarage person has more debt right now compared to 50 years ago and sure we have been getting bigger and bigger inflation which results with our income to be bigger (only slightly) and of course our debt to be bigger (much bigger than increase in our salary) however considering companies are investing billions into stuff to make even more billions in return could be a problem as well.
Just recently amazon opened up places in 7 new nations, that must have caused them billions of dollars easily but eventually they are in 7 more nations now and that would result with a lot of profits in the long run, that kind of stuff increases debt but also increases future profits as well. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: abhiseshakana on January 14, 2020, 10:30:06 AM That's true but I think governments are more likely to go back to the gold standard (and claim they actually have the gold to back it up) than to adopt Bitcoin. Almost every government plan for their own crypto seems to insist on backing it with a physical asset, for example Venezuela's sham petrocrypto. Stable coins are a win-win solution not only to overcome crypto volatility problems but also for the interests of a country that often feels scared by the decentralized bitcoin system. A stable coin whose gold collaterals should have a certain amount of gold is the same as the crypto that was made. Gold reserves should be owned by the central bank in the form of gold bars or contractual rights, but there are Some countries' gold reserves are only calculated based on asset audits and are not already mined or have become gold bars. In accordance with the concept of a sovereign wealth fund whose principal is who has the gold, he is sovereign, far above the currency of any country. Based on an audit of precious metal assets contained in the bowels of a country (not yet mined) the country issues securities (state securities). With state securities, the central bank can print 10x 100x money from securities. So the money create depends on the policies of each government. If the government makes gold-backed cryptocurrency but it's not tied to the actual gold value as collateral, then this is not a cryptocurrency expected by their people. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: merchantofzeny on January 16, 2020, 11:12:36 AM I am pretty sure debt in big corporations increase as well and this is not just us that causes this. I mean sure avarage person has more debt right now compared to 50 years ago and sure we have been getting bigger and bigger inflation which results with our income to be bigger (only slightly) and of course our debt to be bigger (much bigger than increase in our salary) however considering companies are investing billions into stuff to make even more billions in return could be a problem as well. Just recently amazon opened up places in 7 new nations, that must have caused them billions of dollars easily but eventually they are in 7 more nations now and that would result with a lot of profits in the long run, that kind of stuff increases debt but also increases future profits as well. I think the problem is what kind of debt is being accumulated. Corporations take calculated risks before they get into debt so we can safely not think about those. The problem is consumer debt, which have a higher likelihood of not getting paid. They've made it extremely easy for people to take out loans. One person defaulting might not seem much but multiply that over the population and you have a problem. I can't even imagine what happens if they decide to write-off all those student debts. We know debts don't simply get written-off, the government would find some other way to get that money back. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: doomloop on January 16, 2020, 05:36:26 PM I am pretty sure debt in big corporations increase as well and this is not just us that causes this. I mean sure avarage person has more debt right now compared to 50 years ago and sure we have been getting bigger and bigger inflation which results with our income to be bigger (only slightly) and of course our debt to be bigger (much bigger than increase in our salary) however considering companies are investing billions into stuff to make even more billions in return could be a problem as well. Just recently amazon opened up places in 7 new nations, that must have caused them billions of dollars easily but eventually they are in 7 more nations now and that would result with a lot of profits in the long run, that kind of stuff increases debt but also increases future profits as well. I think the problem is what kind of debt is being accumulated. Corporations take calculated risks before they get into debt so we can safely not think about those. The problem is consumer debt, which have a higher likelihood of not getting paid. They've made it extremely easy for people to take out loans. One person defaulting might not seem much but multiply that over the population and you have a problem. I can't even imagine what happens if they decide to write-off all those student debts. We know debts don't simply get written-off, the government would find some other way to get that money back. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: merchantofzeny on January 17, 2020, 07:58:05 AM snip I think the problem is what kind of debt is being accumulated. Corporations take calculated risks before they get into debt so we can safely not think about those. The problem is consumer debt, which have a higher likelihood of not getting paid. They've made it extremely easy for people to take out loans. One person defaulting might not seem much but multiply that over the population and you have a problem. I can't even imagine what happens if they decide to write-off all those student debts. We know debts don't simply get written-off, the government would find some other way to get that money back. I don't live in the US but my understanding is that these student loans are owed to the government, that the gov't already paid the universities, right? If the Democrats win and they do "write-off" these debts they'd probably increase taxation which I think is unfair for those that have already paid of their student loans since they're practically being made to pay for other's. Those of the irresponsible ones who took out money for useless courses like gender studies and end up babysitting dogs. >:( Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: iram3130 on January 17, 2020, 08:08:23 AM Every country has its own crisis at this moment. It looks like there is another recession hitting us harder than ever and I dont see any country is willing to stabilize it. USA has its own drama running with Iran and Impeachment, UK is busy in Brexit, China is busy in making disputes with its neighbors and Putin is busy in getting more powers. Sometimes I fear what will happen if all of the world thinks that we dont need a government anymore..!!!
Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: TheCoinGrabber on January 17, 2020, 09:33:50 AM That's true but I think governments are more likely to go back to the gold standard (and claim they actually have the gold to back it up) than to adopt Bitcoin. Almost every government plan for their own crypto seems to insist on backing it with a physical asset, for example Venezuela's sham petrocrypto. If the government makes gold-backed cryptocurrency but it's not tied to the actual gold value as collateral, then this is not a cryptocurrency expected by their people.I'd agree with that. If that crypto would be tied to a resource, then it should be based on what the country currently does have, else it's really just speculating. Why peg it to a supposed amount of resource that is not even sure exist? The main reason people are thinking of backing currencies with metals like gold is that they are already tired of the current system where currencies are just traded around like stocks. Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: wxxyrqa on January 17, 2020, 05:45:35 PM It seems to me that the existing problems with the economic downturn in almost every country were brewing by themselves, because we are starting to spend more money than we earn. In times of technological progress, there was an increase in the productivity of any production and any business, which brought good profit and therefore each worker received the corresponding payment for his labor. And today, for example, in my country, the chief engineer receives a salary 4 times less than a simple barista in a metropolitan cafe. Based on this, the question arises: Who influenced the gross product of your country, engineer or barista? This situation will spread and intensify throughout the world. the state is being manipulated by all available opportunities and printing extra money, and therefore inflation will gobble up all citizens' incomes. It seems to me that only cryptocurrency can fix these problems.
Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: RealMalatesta on January 18, 2020, 02:16:29 PM Countries going back to gold backing is not something they can do anymore, they have abondened it so long ago that not many countries are at a level where they can get that much gold. They have printed money out of thin air for too long, think about what the USA government would have to do if that was tech case, they would have to get trillions of dollars worth of gold and that is not an easy task to achieve, there are few nations like china and Germany that can do something like that because they don't have huge deficits like the other nations.
Backing with bitcoin would be very difficult as well because the reality is price of bitcoin is volatile and unregulated and decentralized, meaning you can never have certain amount of bitcoin, it could go down or up and change your calculations Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: LUCKMCFLY on January 18, 2020, 03:58:46 PM Only by zooming in on the global economic situation, everything is shrinking, and the debt continues to increase.
Quote Our debt-ridden world economy continues to stack up more IOUs. According to recent estimates, the global debt is now around $ 253 trillion or 322% of GDP - a record high that Bitcoin is wagging its finger at. It is notable that now one of the best alternatives to global debt is Bitcoin, although some economists classify it as a high-risk investment, it is essential to have it today, as a protection measure. Adoption will quickly be a fact, knowing that it can be used as a possible refuge value, people will not hesitate for a second to do so. Source: https://beincrypto.com/alternatives-bitcoin-becoming-necessary-world-debt-reaches-record-253-trillion/ (https://beincrypto.com/alternatives-bitcoin-becoming-necessary-world-debt-reaches-record-253-trillion/) Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: whyrqa on January 19, 2020, 11:08:01 AM Only by zooming in on the global economic situation, everything is shrinking, and the debt continues to increase. Of course, I agree with you that Bitcoin is already a good alternative, even if the degree of risk is very high. Nevertheless, it is necessary to take into account the fact that only certain people have access to Bitcoin, because most lack knowledge and a certain level of practical experience. Almost 95% of the citizens of a particular country will have the results of their financial situation exactly as their governments allow them to have. And given the current attitude of officials towards cryptocurrency, humanity will continue to suffer from unprofessional actions of the government and from their manipulations.Quote Our debt-ridden world economy continues to stack up more IOUs. According to recent estimates, the global debt is now around $ 253 trillion or 322% of GDP - a record high that Bitcoin is wagging its finger at. It is notable that now one of the best alternatives to global debt is Bitcoin, although some economists classify it as a high-risk investment, it is essential to have it today, as a protection measure. Adoption will quickly be a fact, knowing that it can be used as a possible refuge value, people will not hesitate for a second to do so. Source: https://beincrypto.com/alternatives-bitcoin-becoming-necessary-world-debt-reaches-record-253-trillion/ (https://beincrypto.com/alternatives-bitcoin-becoming-necessary-world-debt-reaches-record-253-trillion/) Title: Re: Global Wave of Debt Is Largest, Fastest in 50 Years Post by: abhiseshakana on January 19, 2020, 11:15:09 AM It seems to me that the existing problems with the economic downturn in almost every country were brewing by themselves, because we are starting to spend more money than we earn. In times of technological progress, there was an increase in the productivity of any production and any business, which brought good profit and therefore each worker received the corresponding payment for his labor. And today, for example, in my country, the chief engineer receives a salary 4 times less than a simple barista in a metropolitan cafe. Technological advancements and the industrial revolution 4.0 brought drastic changes in industry trends, where developments were no longer linear but exponential in nature. This revolution is a disturbing era of innovation, where this era is developing very rapidly, thus bringing the transformation of the labor market in a more dynamic direction that results in the transformation of industries by sector. This results in a change in business character, where there are some types of conventional jobs that are disappearing, but new types of jobs, skills, and expertise have also emerged. The industrial revolution 4.0 can be a special threat to workers who do not have the skills to adapt to new types of work. Because every society undergoing this industrial revolution is not ready, they have to be confronted with a new system or job. In the era of the industrial revolution 4.0 much human work could be replaced by robots or artificial intelligence. Recurring and memorizing work has begun to erode by the development of automation technology, robots and artificial intelligence. there are some human skills that are not easily replaced by machines such as empathy, creativity, and analytical expertise on complex problems. Therefore, to become a superior human resource in the current technological era, individuals need to hone this ability by continuing to take advantage of technological developments. In the case of the head of engineering whose salary is smaller than a barista can be analyzed from the entity of the company and the ability of the individual. Jobs in the production department that are repetitive and memorize are very vulnerable to be replaced by robots, with the aim of producing cost efficiency. But it's different if you become an engineering at an offshore oil company, of course, the salary will be greater, because of the complexity of the problems and problem solving that might be faced. While the barista profession involves creativity, senses, aesthetics, and interactions with customers that cannot be duplicated by robots. Baristas in coffee shops are the key products produced that can attract consumers, so the salary is high. Quote Based on this, the question arises: Who influenced the gross product of your country, engineer or barista? For now, the contribution of labor (engineering) can affect the GDP of a country but without an increase in skills, it is impossible for a worker to continue to survive doing repetitive work that has great potential to be replaced by digitalization and automation in the future. In the future, baristas can also be an influential factor for GDP if the government is seriously working on making the coffee shop icon a country and a culture of drinking coffee socialized en masse. So the totality government is working on starting from coffee plantations, drones to cultivate coffee, coffee garden water systems, coffee transportation modes, coffee packaging industry, civet coffee producers. Only from which side do you see. Quote This situation will spread and intensify throughout the world. the state is being manipulated by all available opportunities and printing extra money, and therefore inflation will gobble up all citizens' incomes. To turn the wheels of the economy, citizens must make as many projects as possible. We take the example in the country of China, in Guangzhou, almost all the trees were installed with chips just to measure oxygen levels and other air data. It seems that it is not something very important when the project is run by the government because as long as it can turn the wheels of the economy, it is beneficial for the community and solving problems even though it looks unreasonable that the project will be financed by the Chinese Government. In China, project-based money printing and business culture are supported by the government with easing regulations but the money is still carefully monitored and business preparations prepared from upstream to downstream. |