Bitcoin Forum

In the below 6-minute video, it is explained why Bitcoin is a fraud where a gift record is falsely presented to the public as a market item.

https://youtu.be/LlPwmW4XphE

Stop watching BS.

Printing out dollar backing by loans? That's BS.

Well, You've already solved a big mystery about Bitcoin... Congratulations.
So why are you still here?
Yes bitcoin is a fraud and you shouldn't be here anymore. Go and find new things for you.

very strange if there is someone who hates bitcoin but still likes being in the bitcoin community, Your place should not be here, I'm sure almost every bitcoin holder already knows the benefits and risks when using bitcoin, maybe you are a person injured because of bankruptcy in bitcoin  ;D :D

The explanation on this video is totally BS! I think who created this video totally hate bitcoin because he only learned it lately and cannot afford to buy because its too valuable like gold, go and make another video entitled "fiat is fraud".

What's wrong with hating frauds? What's wrong with warning people about frauds? Especially people in a community that has most fraud victims?

Fiat currencies are fraud? Based on what have you concluded that? On corrupt governments abusing fiat monetary system? That's like saying that houses and cars are fraud because governments are destroying them in wars.

Fiat currencies are not fraud. They are actual market items that grant its holders the non-monetary repayments, which realises prior to every loan payment, as explained in the video. Cryptocurrencies on the other hand, are records (gift records/scheme membership records) that are falsely presented to the public as market items. For that reason they are fraud. This won't change by calling someone hater.

How many people are already rich with Bitcoin, How many people are having a hard time in economic life.
Bitcoin is the best solution for people today, you need to know that.

1. 5 People Who Became Rich Because of Bitcoin, And Their Stories. (https://medium.com/datadriveninvestor/5-people-who-became-because-of-bitcoin-and-their-stories-1925ef6934fe)

I saw a new YouTube video made on January 10, 2020.

https://zizihub.com/0bc4.jpg

Bitcoin has evolved from 2009, very far from the ridiculous videos made, by irresponsible people.
It looks like you need to get to know Bitcoin even further in this Forum and also out there.
Bitcoin is currently the most trusted and honest in the whole world.

that's what you need to remember.

People are not rich with Bitcoin - that is with a record, but with actual market items that were invested into the Bitcoin scheme because investors were lured into a false belief of records being market items. Regarding trust. The fact that people trust in other people's intentions to give their market items for free to someone just because this gets recorded numerically on the blockchain, doesn't make blockchain records market items.

No, the author of that video and OP must be feeling like they need to save the world from the financial destruction that Bitcoin can be bringing to all of us who are here in this industry. And maybe the intention can be valid but no thanks we don't need at this time better luck next time around. People who think that Bitcoin can just be another scam or a ponzi that can crash later should look back at the voluminous 10-year history of this asset. Definitely, Bitcoin is staying here for the next 10 years while its critics can already be in the kingdom come.

Thank you for exposing banks in your video... At 0:34 the video mentions the dollars are created by giving out "loans" in this case it was $10,000. What the video failed to show is that the repayment of that loan isn't $10,000 but rather a standard interest rate will be applied on it... So when only $10,000 were "created" the "Borrower" in the real world would have to return back $12,500... The $2,500 which didn't even exist in the first place will have to be repaid. That's how economic debt increases every single day... That's how banks are a scam! You are returning something doesn't even exist yet...

Moving on to Bitcoin not having an "Economic value". Let's define first what is "Economic value"? Simply put


Consider the agent buying a service from a miner... The service is moving Bitcoins from one address to another which requires POW ^{( proof of work )}... The currency paid for this service is FIAT. In simple words, the agent is paying for the hashing power he is technically renting... So my question to you now is how is bitcoin a fraud again?

everyone has different opinions, if you don't like bitcoin then it's a good idea to find a new place and tell this to people who don't know bitcoin. if you attach to this forum I think you are misplaced, here is the scope of crypto and when you make a rejection then you must present information that has a high argument.

It's not the financial destruction that Bitcoin can be bringing to people, but just the classical transfer of market items (economic value) for the majority to the minority. Bitcoin is simply the same old value-redistribution scheme dressed up in a new uniform. These schemes work because people always fall for the get-rich-quick plans no matter how nonsensical they are.

Hi, thanks for the first non ad hominem comment.

Why would interest have to be paid monetary? Interest is just the cost lenders charge for borrowing money and this charge can be paid in a number of non-monetary ways — in goods, services, bonds, stocks, commodities... So, if the banks would stop creating new dollars and completely abandon them as means of exchange, the borrowers would simply pay the interest in some non-monetary assets.

Regarding the economic value of Bitcoin. There is none. Bitcoin is just a record, while an economic value exists outside the record - in market items, as explained in the video. The agent buying a service from a miner simply means that miner uses electricity to transfer record from one virtual address to another and to maintain this record. And this obviously  doesn't make this record a market item with an economic value.

According to who exactly? The agent decides what's value for them... In bitcoin's case, it's renting the "hashing power" that is the market item...


No matter how you try to spin it, at the end of the day you will have to pay back to the bank in form of "cash". That's why we have an ever going debt. No matter what wording you want to use you will end up with an ever-increasing debt... This "system" has scammed people for centuries it's about time it is replaced by something better. No economist will even try to argue about the ever-going debt... You will never see this figure go down and that's a fact... https://www.economist.com/content/global_debt_clock

and even after more than a week people are still wondering why Google (owning Youtube) keeps on removing a lot of cryptocurrency related videos on youtube platform. THIS is the answer why! they are simply cleaning up a lot of garbage like what OP posted from their platform to make it cleaner .

Hashing power is simply the power a computer uses to maintain the record. Power is indeed an economic value, but this value has already been spent for said purpose. It is not stored somewhere for the bitcoin holders to utilize it in the future. A miner simply invested the power (electricity) to maintain the record. His/her investment is his/her gift to the people that have virtual addresses associated to this record. The record itself is economically valueless as it just contains alphanumerical symbols that point to themselves.

Regarding debt. There is nothing wrong with debt as it is just agreements between people and such agreements exist from the beginning of times. Given that the population grows the debt agreements grow as well. The problem is government debt, which is political question that has nothing to do with whether something is or is not market item, or whether it has or has not economic value.

Why does it need to be stored? If you look at bitcoin from a technical perspective you are basically getting "unspent Outputs" which you can "spend" in future, so that point is satisfied if you ask me... We can argue all day about this as "value" is something subjective. We all believe 1$ is 1$ cuz of our "Collective Subjectivity". This article^[1] (https://hackernoon.com/what-gives-cryptocurrencies-value-d5e8aee1466d) sums up the whole situation beautifully do give it a read...


Agreed. But when the "Money" in question is being created out of thin air at One's will then it will end up in one big clusterfuck!

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Source:
[1] https://hackernoon.com/what-gives-cryptocurrencies-value-d5e8aee1466d

It's because they are looking for another opportunity to ruin bitcoin's reputation, they are thinking how they can change people's perspective. They don't understand that despite of that people are still into bitcoin because of it's capabilities and potentialities to change their life into something better, they underestimate it without even looking on people's experiences on it which is great and amazing. People these days should open their eyes and minds that people judge something they can't even reach, they hate something they can't have and we have to accept and respect it. We can't avoid the risk because it's part of our journey and sometimes our decision never turns out great but our differences between those kind of people is that we never let it as a hindrance to achieve our goals. Also, people mistake bitcoin as fraud because it was being used to deceive people and into other illegal activities, they don't analyze the difference between the two.

You are constantly missing the point of the video. Bitcoin, from a technical perspective, is a record in a database associated to a virtual address of an individual. Economic value is a thing outside the database, a thing that is actually owned by that individual. And now the point: if there is nothing outside the database, then no economic value exists and nothing is owned by the individual. In the case of stocks, apples and dollars, the things that are owned are: equity, want-satisfying power, and the right to non-monetary repayments. In the case of Bitcoin, nothing is owned outside the database. There is only a record in this database what exists. So, that has nothing to do with subjectivity, but with the fact that Bitcoin is simply a record confirming that one individual gave a gift (an economic value outside the database) to another individual.

No, your lack of ability to understand bitcoin's technical side isn't my issue but rather yours... "Unspent Outputs" are what you would say Bitcoin's "market item" is... Do give Bitcoin's whitepaper a read and once you understand the concept of "Unspent Outputs" we can continue from there...

P.S I like how you are ignoring the points I made about FIAT.

the 5 minute video has made millions of bitcoin users leave bitcoin, it sounds ridiculous to make a video as detailed as this to knock us all down, how much do you get to make a video like this and worth sharing, even though I don't think anyone will listen to you, it looks like the I say not all people think the same way, maybe you think differently so you never know we are all here for bitcoin and we also don't know why you are here, we don't want to fool you here

You are using semantics to ignore the point. A member of a Ponzi scheme can also call his/her membership stakes "Unspent Outputs". But that doesn't change the fact he/she owns nothing beyond the record of these stakes.

P.S. You point about FIAT is besides the point. Money is not created out of thin air. It is the record about the existence of money what is created out of thin air. Money is loan, and loans are created out of collaterals, general abilities of borrowers to repay them and bank's equity.

Lol... Just because you don't like the answer doesn't mean I'm ignoring your point or using "Semantics"... This whole arguing is pointless as I said above... There are more than 1 "market items" in my opinion in your's it maybe none... The whole idea of "market item" is based on "Opinions"... smh...


Semantics much...? See how easy it is to play this game? By your definition " It is the record about the existence of money what is created out of thin air. " Then Fiat money is also a fraud since it represents a number in a database and has no real market item to represent...

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I'm gonna spectate for now and see what others have to say about this...

Playing games is what you do. My point is simple: opinions reside in mind, records reside in databases and market items reside outside minds and databases.

Fiat money is a market item in the form of non-monetary repayments derived from loans, collaterals and bank's equity. Records that inform us about ownership, quantity, and name of this item reside in bank's databases.

Bitcoin, on the other hand, is just a record. A record without market item. It is a record that informs us about the fact that one gave his/her electricity, money, goods or services as a gift to either, community that holds blockchain addresses (maintenance purposes) or to a particular such holder (fake trading purposes — in reality scheme membership fee).

So when you traded some actual market items for bitcoins you didn't actually bought something, you didn't bought another market item. You simply entered the fraudulent scheme and got the membership stake in it. After that, all you have is hope that you will get out more market items than you paid in.

Video edited to take into account points of this discussion.

First of all, I've watched a minute and already do not agree with the video.

They say dollars are representation of market items owned by you. So when you own a dollar bill you don't own just paper but a record of ownership that is equal to woning an item of value.
Not really. An item of value is widely accepted and will continue to be. If you have a bottle of alcohol, you can be 100% sure that it will continue to be valuable whatever happens. Even in a state of war or recession people will want alcohol to clean their wounds, start a fire, create molotov cocktails, prepare medicine, clean paint marks, or simply get drunk. Try doing the same with paper money. They are only a representation of items of value in a perfect world, where the government is in power, there's no war or civil unrest, and the economy is booming.

Indeed, watched the video itself. And If we follow the principle of the person who wrote this video or at the very least put it up, then fiat will be a scam or a fraud too. To be honest, fiats aren't stable too if anything. They fluctuate and are volatile though not as much as bitcoin because of the high usage. The same will happen to bitcoin provided that it is accredited and is used globally. All this hate puts bitcoin on a bad spot, not so sure why people are so into putting bitcoin down.

Partial reserve by banks and printing fiat out of thin relying on the reputation of a state air is nothing else but a legalized scam.

I did not even go to the link and watch it if I do I will just be supporting all these lies, you are lucky this forum is unmoderated or else you will get ban for spreading lies, I pity you because you are ten years late to broadcast this if Bitcoin will die it would have done so in its early years not when it is moving fast in adoption.

This was pretty retarded.

LoL considering that USD has a market item because it has a physical form and bitcoin doesn't.

Well, since you are stupid enough to believe this bull crap, I'll make a market Item for bitcoin too:

https://images2.imgbox.com/b7/71/0cjtklCX_o.jpg

See? Now bitcoin isn't only a digital record anymore it has a market item too. (whatever the fuck that means)

The video says that a record is representation of dollars while dollars are the non-monetary repayments. It is pretty simple.

Name one lie in the video. You can't because the only one lying is you.

This is not a market item. This is a record putted on paper medium. Market item exists outside the record. There is nothing outside the record that is owned by the person holding this paper. Meaning, this paper is a gift record confirming that the person entered the Bitcoin scheme.

don't you have some Drama or War Movies there?sorry but i am not watching BS on youtube so if you cannot offer us some good to watch then better GTFO here ,why staying here while you are not believing in this?

lol if there is one lying here,surely its you and your video.

Yeah, that's really weird to find someone here, that he doesn't like bitcoin, I mean, if you just don't like it, then just stay away from this community, we don't need a negative impact about bitcoin, we already know the risk about using cryptocurrencies and we're aware about that all.

Many people think that bitcoin is a joke however everyone on this forum believes in bitcoin and its future. In fact, there are many rich people thanks to bitcoin and bitcoin has a very beautiful future.
I think that with just one regulation in favor of cryptocurrencies from the government, the price of bitcoin will certainly increase.

Like I have said. Name one lie in the video. It cannot be simpler.

What's wrong with warning people about frauds? Especially people in a community that has most fraud victims?

I do not even waste by time clicking on this video or you want to get views by posting it here.

Bitcoin can never be killed and if you think it is a ponzi fraud than it is better you to leave from here and join a bank full of paper notes.  :D

Since you pretend to be a "youtuber" that can't even bother to write your argument in plan text here but rather advertise an url hoping to increase views, Why don't you search in there for "fractional reserve banking"? You say fiat is not a fraud? You are in for a big shock. About 90% of fiat money doesn't exist.

But every satoshi is unique and accounted for, even if some will never move again, they are still there located in the blockchain for everyone to see.

You think printing fiat can buy all bitcoin? Just try it, you will only hyperinflate your fiat that way, while bitcoin remains still spread in many hands. You would cause a little pump at most, that will correct itself. So go ahead, convince a government to ruin their coin doing this.

So people are buying digital assets, just like online game items. But unlike online game assets each satoshi is unique. You can't just hack a database and make more appear out of thin air, its secured, more than fiat, where a gov can actually "print" as many as they want, just like you could spawn endless of the same item in a game if you are the admin.

Bitcoin is so useful, that its got its actual market price after 11 years of people like you insisting with the same lies. And yet, it exists, and people are still are trading their fiat for it.

I already explained why FIAT is not fraud. You ignored the explanation and just said that 90 percent of FIAT doesn't exist, which is nonsensical since FIAT is the liability of the banks and the right of its holder written in the balance sheets of the bank and granted prior to every loan payment.

Regarding the satoshis. This is just one of the two names (bitcoin is the other) for the blockchain records that confirm membership in Bitcoin scheme. When you give your electricity or some other market item as a gift, you are recorded with the numbers called bitcoins or satoshis. So people are not buying "assets" - asset is something that exists outside the record. People are buying membership stakes in a classical Ponzi or pyramid scheme.

Bitcoin does not die. I don't know what such a video means. Because there can be many negative things about bitcoin. But bitocin still serves its purpose. An alternative value is trasnfer bitcoin. I think it makes sense to invest.

FIAT's history (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_money) suggests otherwise...


Looks like a daylight robbery to me... Steel from the poor. Keep the Rich in control...


See how he ignored ya? He is here to argue for argument's sake... More of a troll if you ask me...

In my honest opinion, if you yourself doesn't even like bitcoin, you should not be here anymore because this forum is all about bitcoin. Do not spread a fake information because people here might believe in you. You can just walk away if you do not have a good thing to say about bitcoin. Bitcoin is a Fiat and not a fraud.

If you want to know the objective truth, you should not only watch a few videos on youtube, especially short videos which are highly subjective and one-sided. Such videos will not teach you something. And a fraud? Take a look around with more inquisitive eyes and you will know who is the fraud in our current system.

I don't know if you have been paid by someone to curse crypto nor to think that you just have to cause FOMO or fraud here dragging noobs to catch your play. Because I'd never think that was supposed to happen in the future knowing the reality that we are in moving into crypto adoption.

The youtube account looks suspicious and obviously doesn't have the credibility to make this kind of video about cryptocurrency or bitcoin.
I think he posts this video to gets view on youtube from the users here in the forum.

Also, the video doesn't explain anything, it doesn't have evidence of the claim that the bitcoin is a fraud or pyramiding scheme it just says that it is.
Bitcoin is digital cash so basically doesn't have a physical form but it does have its value in the market how could you explain Paypal and cards, which is also just a record or just what you called thin air.

They don't know the full potential of bitcoin to become the best digital currency that can help us in everyday lives and in the future. We should become open-minded about the things that can bring changes and improvements in our lives. I just don't get that they judge bitcoin without having or even using it in the first place. But we have nothing to do about them, we just need to promote bitcoin for other people to become interested too.

Nice try with this video.It essentially shows that people should adopt Bitcoin.So Mary can give the apples to Peter for Bitcoin and then get some shares with her Bitcoin to multiply her Bitcoins leaving the Dollar multiplier through loans on the sidewalk.You should inform yourself better what the Dollar is these days and what Bitcoin really represents.If you are a Dollar believer or a believer in any FIAT money that is your choice.As it is our choice to believe in decentralised money.Time will tell.The next recession/depression is around the corner.But if you want to stick around here try to get some education.There are a lot of good posts regarding this topic.What money represents, what a FIAT money system is, how banks work, what fractional reserve lending is.

actually, we are in a decentralized and illegal market. so we can do anything we can make a profit. People who say that bitcoin is a scam, they can never make money from bitcoin because they are afraid that they will be scammed. As for me, I think bitcoin is a scam but this scam will not cost us money, it will make us more money if we find a good opportunity to buy bitcoin. Those who understand bitcoin will make money from it through smart trading, so the important thing is how smart we are to make money, in terms of meaning, it no longer matters.

Yes, perhaps this is partially true. But, it seems to me that the author of the video hates bitcoin too much - he is wrong in this. Because fiat money is not an alternative, it is even worse. We chose Bitcoin because we understand what we are doing and what we want.

true but wrong ? if he hates bitcoin that much then he will said bad things to it , so i also think that he is wrong . not only this guy but many btc haters on the past make false statement about btc .

fiat money is an alternative yes if you use other medium of exchange the most but for a common person we mainly use a fiat so fiat money is not an alternative currency to us but bitcoin and crypto is . its true people use btc because btc is more flexible to use than fiat

I think a person like this is just a fool who doesn't know much about bitcoin but he considers himself an intelligent person so he makes videos like this to drop bitcoin into the public, but I'm sure everyone in this forum doesn't easily believe such nonsense because we knowing well about bitcoin and bitcoin has changed our finances into more privacy.

Hey either the person who made this video missed out to invest into bitcoin when it was few hundred dollars assuming it's scam and now making this video out of jealousy or else he might have invested at the peak of bull run post which he is yet to get his returns and made this video out of frustration. Kindly ignore this videos.

from what I see bitcoin is very useful in my opinion, but many also do not like bitcoin

The video seems to have been taken down. Perhaps it was disinformation, because it has been proven a long time ago that you can make an asset valuable just by buying and selling it. Just like how people discovered platinum and oil and started trading with those. It's just that in bitcoin's case, it's monetary properties are mathematical instead of physical. It's not like I can make fake bitcoins and undermine it's value.

It seems like that or maybe the creator of this video is a hater of bitcoin to begin with. I don't know if this is due to trust issues or some major issue that puts him into that state and give him the courage to create this video.

Will kill? Do you think you are the first person who is saying that thing? Do you think that that video is the first video saying bitcoin is a fraud? NO! there are tons of them both videos and articles but did it kill bitcoin? NO too they just helped in spreading bitcoin awareness. I get it that you hate bitcoin but stating that it will eventually kill is a no-no for me, some of older videos existed for years how long till it "eventually kill" bitcoin.

Nobody stops us from sharing every ideas that we're having for bitcoin, but sharing offensive and generative acts stating against bitcoin was totally a devastating thoughts. I considered him as a FUD maker who just fooled out to something that deceived a lot of people. Hopefully, it won't affect to those innocent for cryptocurrency because I felt that the effect is really a disease.

Just 30 persons who have watched the video and there is no one who subscribe the channel, so I don't believe at all.

And I believe this kind person who just spread bad news about bitcoin because he hasn't knew bitcoin as a whole and I'm sure he hasn't got anything from bitcoin. Most likely, he just person who know bitcoin on the internet and never try to find more about it. Simply will just like this, I'll believe if there is anyone who tell that bitcoin is fraud or scam if he has tried to own bitcoin, but there is no one. But I'll believe if there is someone who has got a lot of money from bitcoin because there are many proof about it.

The person behind that video is literally an ignorant. He just made that video only for himself. I am sure he just wanted to be famous through the use of posting malicious video about bitcoin without knowing that if what he said will eventually turn out a lie he can be put inside the jail by thr crypto team because that is "libel." For those who had watched the video please dont easily believe on that video without any proof.

I think someone wants to add more views on that video.  Honestly, I don't bother clicking the link.  If that is too urgent then he can just post the list of reason why Bitcoin is a fraud.  And presenting this kind of negative stuff about Bitcoin is normal for those who really don't understand what Bitcoin is and how it  is valued in the market.  Aside from this one, others also say that Bitcoin is a Ponzi scheme and isolating the Bitcoin case not comparing it to other which if they do will found out that everything in the market is like a "ponzi scheme" which will nullify their claims about Bitcoin.

No matter what you believe about BitCoin, it can be traded and there is a lot of money to be made if one can predict the price swings !!!

I finally gave in and bought some BitCoins.  Even if they go down in the long term, I can be out of the market whenever needed.  For now, I can take advantage of the price spikes  ;D ;D ;D   Just get a good secure Wallet like Electrum and start trading

https://i.imgur.com/C1qWPII.png

Basically, with people already rich with knowledge about bitcoin and cryptocurrency, it is hard to just provide a thread that will aim to turn the table suddenly. I hope OP, you should first have the strong source of information about this, because bitcoin is proven in different ways, and cryptocurrency supporters will just hate people spreading this kind of thoughts, though, I am not against your opinion, I highly appreciate if you support bitcoin because believe me or not, it doesn't have intention to bankrupt people because it isn't the same with your banks.

My opinion on this topic may be a bit unpopular in this community: at least in the first part of the video, there is some truth in it. But the general conclusion is wrong, and the point that it's similar to a ponzi is blatantly false.

OK, let's discuss that:

That video is basically about the discussion of the "intrinsic value" of Bitcoin. First, as the video correctly states, Bitcoin's value comes "out of thin air" because it depends entirely on the willingness of people giving a "market item" (be it fiat, dollars or anything else) for it (I actually disagree of that being a "gift", it's an economic exchange like buying a collectible, for example). People buying bitcoin are expecting to be able to sell it at least for a similar value.

However - and here the video is correct - it can not be guaranteed to Bitcoin "hodlers" that they will be able to re-sell the BTC for the same value. This is basically the "price stability" problem I have discussed in several occasions. In my opinion, this problem can only be solved with adoption as a currency. If there are merchants willing to sell you an item for a fixed price in BTC (which is currently very seldomly ocurring) and guaranteeing this price for some time, then you would have the guarantee that you could exchange your Bitcoins to "market items" for a forseeable value (I proposed a system to do that (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1926913.0) some time ago). Speculation and hodling wouldn't solve the problem because the price instability would persist even if BTC is worth 1 million USD.

But now to the conclusion that Bitcoin is a "fraud" or "ponzi". No, it simply isn't, period. Frauds and ponzis have the characteristic that they promise you a return. That's why they collapse, not because them not having an "intrinsic value". They collapse because old buyers depend from an increasing amount of money put in from new buyers to pay the "promised returns". Bitcoin can perfectly work with a totally stable influx of money and other market items, because it doesn't depend on increasing returns.

Bitcoin isn't promising anything. Bitcoin "bulls" and Bitcoin scheme operators may be promising high returns, but this isn't a problem of Bitcoin itself. These bulls/scheme operators may be scammers, but they're not Bitcoin.

ABSOLUTELY WRONG !!!!

A Ponzi Scheme can appeal to the GREED of people, that invest hoping for a higher return.  A " Promise " is not required, a strong hope or expectations of gains can make a ponzi scheme.  No one cares if it is a promise, or a good sales job.

People buy BitCoin because they expect its price to go to the moon.  Exactly the same as a Ponzi Scheme.  And BitCoin is absolutely dependent on someone willing to pay a higher price.

You can have your own opinion on weather it is a Ponzi Scheme or something better, the but what this guy posted above is WRONG, WRONG, and just plane WRONG.  Never listen to people that post bad information.

Hard Facts

Thanks to the posts of other members here, I don't have to watch the video.

So probably the video contains the FUD that it describes about bitcoin and probably describing it as a ponzi. Know the difference first between that and distinguish why bitcoin is far from that description.

in my opinion it depends on us to judge for ourselves, what we feel when we invest in bitcoin, is the bitcoin that we feel is deceptive, or are we even excited .. make conclusions on yourself .. !!

The low-quality video spills its inability to be a reputable means of argument. First off, cash is actually made out of thin air. The government prints such to regulate the flow of the money in the market, and is intentionally inflationary. They could print it as they wish, and its value is only backed by the government's words, or some say their gold reserves.

People just think it is a Ponzi scheme because they are uneducated of what Bitcoin really is, and what it is capable of. No one controls Bitcoin, unlike Ponzi schemes which has a team offering you something that they clearly know has no value. Bitcoin is not made to be a scheme, it is made to be an alternative means of payment. And the price increase to such level we have now is only because many people trust in it, and therefore hold it.

Another FUD right? But we don't care about them. You can see bitcoin price has been increasing currently and at least it will makes there is no one/thing which can be able to kill bitcoin. As long as the people or user still believe that bitcoin is have a value then bitcoin will always be alive and also if the internet and electricity still be there bitcoin will be alive. Bacause of that I will not believe if there if there is someone who stated that bitcoin will be die not for those reason.

People also buy stocks, gold, houses, or even stamps because they expect their price to go to the moon ;D Are they all Ponzi victims?

You can't forbid people to speculate on the value of goods and assets. But the essence is that the following statement is wrong:
Those that want the price seeing to go to the moon are dependant on that, yes. But again: They're not Bitcoin. The "greedy speculators" are a (certainly not small) class of Bitcoin users. But there are other classes of users, e.g. those using it for international transactions or on the black market. For them, Bitcoin is also useful if the price falls a bit. It would even be useful for certain groups if the price crashed to less than a dollar per unit. ;D

One of the biggest challenges for Bitcoin is to achieve these "non-speculator" user groups to eventually constitute the majority of the Bitcoin user base. It's a long way to that, but steadily growing adoption "as a currency" could do the trick.

And currency is what most of people agreed to use and deemed to have value because people says so meanwhile paper money is just made out of thin air and backed up by nothing. There are some people out there that are still thinking these paper money backed up by gold but truthfully speaking they are just few decades behind because paper money is no more backed up by anything other than speculation debt and loan. Using the same logic I could say paper money is the same bullshit and even worse it can't even record anything but just a useless paper with fancy colour.

For so many time bitcoin been killed, been tagged as not worth it but see it's still gaining popularity and gets attention by different countries. It will depend on how we will take advantage on it's use and importance. Its been useful for me and been a good investment vehicle. Don't be swayed by FUD make our own research is needed.

do not like bitcoin and assume bitcoin is a fraud that is your right. but you shouldn't make that post in this forum. those of us in this forum are people who believe in bitcoin. although bitcoin has made some people suffer losses but I'm sure there are more people who benefit from the presence of bitcoin. many people achieve financial freedom because of bitcoin. if you feel disadvantaged investing bitcoin it's your fault not bitcoin.

Posting bitcoin is something of a fraud in bitcoin community.
I can tell you have the courage but also foolish.

You know there are a lot of bitcoin supporters here and would bash anyone who tells bitcoin is something that is just a fraud.
You might not like it but sorry, that is how it is here.

Try anti-bitcointalk.org. That is, if there is one.  ;D

What is the purpose of this article about Bitcoin, if you are not interested in Bitcoin then you are here to prove what it is, do not see about a problem that judges the whole system.

My advice stop watching content like that because it will damage your own mind and create a mental block for yourself.
But if you fully trust what is in the content it is your right. Let's toast to see the triumph of Bitcoin in the future.  ;)

I think that the infrastructure of Bitcoin and the cryptocurrency community/following have grown way too large and successful to go away anytime soon. There are many merchants that now transact with cyrptocurrency. Adoption of cyrptocurency is starting to make it's way into major corporations like Facebook who is at the helm of congress trying to get representation and approval for its Libra platform, that could potentially increase adoption significantly.
Here is an a short video explanation presented by CNBC a major news and media outlet giving a sweet presentation on the value of Bitcoin and why it isn't fraudulent.

 Digital Currency Has Real Value — Here’s Why | CNBC
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwEXxC_rIHA

Just my two cents   :-\

With this your greatest discovery you shouldn't be here, if you can't find answers yourself you will end up believing in what you here from others, just exactly what you watch in the video, how fraud can it be when digital currencies are triumphing every where? You need to learn a lot

Yes it is not a fraud. Instead of believing in what he has watched in the video he should gain more knowledge about this discovery. This greatest innovation is changing the life of common people in many ways. It is also true that there are fraud traders in this market but the business itself is not fraud. The time will come soon when everyone will be familiar with this digital currency, it will reach to the further heights of establishment and no one can deny the use and importance of it.

Bitcoin has been killed so many times by so many people but it’s still standing firm against all odds. I don’t say bitcoin has no odds but I also admit and say it’s the future way of transferring value from one person to another. Governments and other centralized financial institutes fear bitcoin and there is some reason for this fear.

Yes indeed. Many have tried to kill and destroy the bitcoin's reputation but no one succeed. I cant say that this is tge future way of transferring money or it will totally replacing the fiat because nobody can predict what will happen in the future but as long the bitcoin is here we should be thankful because even if it cannot replace the traditonal way of banking at least it may help and imorove our banking system.

I never watch your video anyway because I am certain that you are not a pro bitcoiner because you just called bitcoin as a fraud, that's a total BS. Lots of people are killing bitcoin already if they see it drowning and almost to the bottom but if it start to rise up again they just suddenly changed their minds.

Unfortunately, the truth is that bitcoin will not be able to fight the existing economic system.

It's strange because he wants the attention of the Bitcoin enthusiast community that's why he's here trying to prove his point yet most people here already know what are the risks of investing Bitcoin. A fraud is those ICO projects who keep promising to their investors yet they were the first one to scam them.

Thanks for sharing this video. You should spend some time and read the whitepaper of Bitcoin to help you understand some basic concept of Bitcoin. But on a more serious note, how can i fraud be in existence for 10 years without experts proving that it is a scam? This shows that you don't have enough knowledge to make you understand and know what Bitcoin is ...

You'll have a good time reading this Bitcoin Obituaries (https://99bitcoins.com/bitcoin-obituaries/), in fact it stated in the site that Bitcoin died 379 times already. Government have their fears in this, because they're never gonna know what's going on behind the scenes of cryptos due to anonymity. You can never blame or hate those countries that banned them although I was just thinking of that they should at least just require KYC, though I hate KYC policy.

Thanks for your video,  and i don't have interest to watch that,  because all of that are just a fake and useless. All of that are already disccus on 2015 . Haha.

Now bitcoin is scam because many people become rich,  and even big companies already accepting this scam coins that still exits in decade,  and this is scam because many countries recognize bitcoins.

This is scam,  so go away here haha

I just don’t really know why some people are fond of coming here to post contents that doesn’t making any sense. Well, I didn’t even watch the video you posted because I’m not ready to give views to some dumb people, and moreover this post is by a newbie, so why should I even believe it? If you think that Bitcoin is dead or whatsoever, you should quit and look for something else doing.

For the fact you’re still a newbie (that’s if you truly are) I’m just going to end it here with the assumption that since you’re still a newbie you just don’t know what you’re saying so you need someone to correct you and teach you what you don’t know.

While there are some people that want to have an open discussion about their point of view there are also many people that just love to troll, this is a bitcoin forum in which the majority of the users are holding some of it, how do you troll us? By saying that bitcoin is a fraud and that is nothing special that is how, as yourself I am not going to waste my time watching the video, if anyone wants to make an argument they should write it here since this is a forum and we can do exactly that.

its  a forum and its okay to post anything here  ( bad or good ) but if its something that is already offensive and against the rules , dont worry because so many mods are active that patrol here to sort things up  . there was also a saying that says dont feed the troll   . it means that you should not reply if you think they are only trolling so that the issue wont grow anymore  but if you are sport and love to counter them then why not  ?  just enjoy posting

Governments will never accept decentralized cryptocurrency else they would lose there financial control. KYC policy or centralized cryptocurrency like xrp are government encounter to bitcoins. True crypto lover dont like kyc nor centralized cryptocurrency.

Avoid seeing these dirty things. A hater is always a hater. Negativity against bitcoin is nothing new. Many have tried before and still they trying. But Bitcoin is growing just like itself. Why don't they say something against the banking system? Why don't they say something about government printing money everyday? I believe Bitcoin, that one day everyone in the world will use Bitcoin.

Btw This channel has no subscribers. It is understandable by looking at it. What is the purpose of this video.

I don't know what's the point of posting and saying it here. I bet you know that majority if not everyone in here is into crypto and we see Bitcoin as something good, beneficial to us. So saying such thing here makes no sense because you won't get anyone here that will believe and will go on your side. If you think Bitcoin is a fraud, don't bother giving time here. Just let us do what we want. Now that you've said what you want, and you got your video to increase the views, I think that's enough for you?? Do you think we will believe what you've said?

Why are you even here? Why don't you piss off. Btw the robot voice makes me not want to even listen to the shitty video. Wtf is a gift item? Bitch I can spend my bitcoin on anything I want right now without bs from banking systems and restrictions. With fiat I wait so long to be paid and have payment "clear" it takes days sometimes. Also fiat continuously weakens by like %5-%8 a year because of inflation. Fiat loses value all the time. Better buy gold and sell small amounts when you need fiat.

Did you just register to this forum to argue like an idiot? Please get a life. Go learn a skill or something. Go better yourself. If you don't like bitcoin that's fine. Why you waste your time on something you do not believe in I don't know. I think it is the attention you get.

One funny video.
To gather negative attention people can go to any level. Just for some views on a youtube video.
Thanks for making my day.
Please create more videos like this on a centralised platform and when you get banned come back to this forum to cry.

Nomatter what the video said, nothing can kill bitcoin, it is immutable and unstoppable. If it is that easy to kill or stop, most of the governments could have easily got this achieved for very long time. There is no truth that can kill Bitcoin, my friend

I don't know if this video is made by you or not, I don't know if this is really your purpose but with the years and support bitcoin gathered through years, can we still call it a fraud? There are a lot of people like on the internet and I don't know why do they hate bitcoin so much.

If you think about business, you could always expect market competition and in some cases, some people would like to destroy others just to win the competition. This is also what I understand the creation of this video. Then, if we think that this how bitcoin/crypto it looks in the future it is really disappointing but I believe it won't and we have already justified it.

Not agreed,If you research it thoroughly will find BTC is decentralized and independent no one can control it.Frauds and scam everywhere even government is fail to stop the frauds but can minimize the frauds.

Bitcoin future is bright,still government and financial institutions against the BTC but rising rapidly and people switch to get in BTC. Main reason to get in BTC is financial freedom and its users are globally connected and make transaction independently.

People who think of bitcoin as a scam or as a ponzi scheme are those who know little about it really. Too much speculation without any evidence is really toxic. We can't really stop them from thinking that bitcoin is a scam but we can enlighten them at the very least of what bitcoin truly is and what it has in store for us. What they would do with the rest of the information is up to them.

I don't have enough MB to watch such shitty shit. Bitcoin is gold and anyone who thinks otherwise should quite trading and offload their portfolio for us who hold it as a digital gold.

Yes this is true. People are very afraid to take risk thats why when they heard any bad news regarding unto something they will automatically refuse to try it and see it for their selves. And also when there are something new they also refuse to try because of their negative mindset like for example here in crypto world. They are afraid to try because they are concluding that what we are doing here is a scam.

Gold and bitcoin both worth investment but depend with investor soul, if some investor wanna get much profit and ready faced with big risk they will take participated with investing in bitcoin and altcoin, some time have investor not ready faced with big risk and likely for investing with gold because never have lower price.

i dont think he really understands the major principles of blockchain technology

Hey
I think instead of seeing these videos one should first learn all the facts about Bitcoins and then make the conclusion about them , themselves . .
You cannot just go and get affected by people's opinion , people are gonna hate bitcoins and they are gonna spread the hate and people tend to move like sheep I would say you rather look for yourself how it is and what it is .

If bitcoin will be killed, according to what he said then he's better to leave the bitcoin community? but he's still here sharing negativity as its 100% wrong. As you said bitcoin is really gold or probably better than it, just people didn't realize that for now, but they will change their minds in the future when bitcoin will dominate the financial market and it increases hugely, it's just a matter of time.

That video is annoying wow. It was totally bais and ignorant and really showed a lack of intellect and though which just made t even more irritating. It was cringy listening tonight robot voice talk bs. It was like the bs hose was on full rip spraying the bs all over drowning us in it so quickly we can barely think.

You say very little and just leave a link. Your argument is crap and no one should pay any attention to what you say. If you were serious you would leave your full thoughtfully written uot opinion instead of bait. Did you even understand the video?

Bitcoin is not a fraud and it will be nearly impossible to kill it. This is first of all because bitcoin is decentralised which means that there's no central authority that could be brought down to destroy the system. Also, it can work even if all the technology goes down as the mining can literally be done with a peace of paper and a pen if the difficulty goes really down. That's why btc is wonderful.

You can quit it. OP doesn't even know what a fraud is.

the crime of getting money by deceiving people

So who is getting all that money? Satoshi Nakamoto? That's a good one!

is this a provocation, I don't want to watch it, it's better if I don't feel the need to watch it, for fear it's provocation .. !!

Although there a lot of fraud people linking to bitcoin but bitcoin itself is never a fraud and i know people in this community can prove it. No one can kill bitcoin ecxept for the people themselves when they chose not to use bitcoin anymore as a currency or even as an investment.

It is not our concern if someone view bitcoin as a fraud, they are just proving that they do not fully understand cryptocurrencies specially bitcoins. There is ignorance because they do not know what they are saying. I just ignoring people who saying it is scam because I do not want to hear their opinions. They are just tarnishing the whole cryptocurrency market.

If the world turns out to be against bitcoin it is simple and easy to compromise,  the life of bitcoin depends on the demands of people  that use it, if fear, uncertainty and doubt could drive that demand, surely, bitcoin could lose momentum. I suggest stop watching the video and focus on innovations and development that has positive effects on bitcoin.

I've seen the contents of the video, it's clear the contents don't understand about bitcoin. It's okay to be a bitcoin hater,
but please doesn't need to be a provocateur. If you don't like bitcoin, please leave this forum, and do what which you think
is right. No need to share videos that are less useful in my opinion, for me as a bitcoin believer does not exist that can kill
bitcoin. And bitcoin will survive for long time.

Yes, it is always good to share positive things relative to bitcoin than the negative or the things that are distracting from the reality. When the super computer from Google got innovated the headline was this will make the bitcoin network crash. This created panic and the truth is understood later that it can't be crashed that easy.

enjoy your watching,but i wont spend my precious time for this BS video.

i can enjoy watching too many Good movies and videos,there are also many articles about crypto that enjoyable to read and not this kind of stuff.

if you are not into Bitcoin then better go out of this forum because this is for bitcoin supporters and not Fraudsters .

The only reason that I will believe that bitcoin will die is if everyone will stop using bitcoin, and satoshi himself announce it but it its just a video created by an enthusiast I wont even believe anything about it, lots of people predicting something but no proof

If you don't trust Bitcoin then why have an account on this forum? Nowadays people try to misinform people at any cost, so that they never go beyond their economic status. There is nothing wrong with warning people, but this is not warning, just manipulation. It cannot be fraud, given that the market already exists as a means of payment and people have made a lot of money investing in BTC. It is just a manipulation for people to sell their investments and the BTC price to fall.

it would be stupid for OP to think he can convince anyone here that BTC is a fraud.  big people in the real world business are now becoming an BTC enthusiast like Draper and Elon Musk. how the hell is this war being BTC as fraud going to win now that there are also government officials claiming to own some BTC.

that video is not going to result to something like people will hate BTC. thats not happening.

He thinks that he can manipulate the mind of people here, he didn't know that we all knew it and we are already aware of it and that we don't need his suggestion and concern, if  he's afraid of the Bitcoin then he's free not to join and not to do crypto at all, he can always leave here and to never invest in crypto.

It is the internet. It's gonna be either plenty of trolls or those who encourage people. There will be FUDs. I got dozens of receipts already in my wallet when I tend to convert my BTC to fiat which is equivalent as to selling it.
No matter how hard we try to stop the manipulation, there will be people that'll just go straight up panic out of crypto.

I agree with you,  government doesnt have any power to control bitcoin as it is decentralized which make it more strong and independent. Bitcoin cant be kill easily as it is now continously growing and getting better now. 

Nothing can simply effect this market in any way. All the posts and videos about Bitcoin and Blockchain end are mere useless stuff. Try to follow the authentic sources and sites. Also the personal research can give you the best knowledge of what is the future of Bitcoin. Just turn your focus from such baseless predictions and assumptions toward how you can take benefit of this technology.

The truth is only useless for those who deny it.

Well, I've seen a few more people here talking about the bad side of Bitcoin but they are still here in the forum. Looks like they need to be educated since they don't know what they are doing.

You need to understand that people can say anything when they hate Bitcoin. There are lots of people who didn’t get the opportunity to invest in Bitcoin when the price was low so they are now pissed when they hear people mention it. Just like someone I know that’s always angry for that same reason, sometimes he wants to invest in Bitcoin but he’s afraid that he might lose his money, and if the price should go up then he gets pissed that he missed it and then he starts getting angry and saying Bitcoin BS. He just wants to make money and he doesn’t want to lose, he’s also not ready to take the risk.

So, don’t listen to what haters are saying, you should do proper research and make the decision yourself.

True. It is better to ingnore those who see the good thing with the bad eye. Their job is to create a fud with a baseless issue. They have tried to stop Bitcoin before and now still continue. But they are not getting success. Bitcoin is moving at its own pace. They do not have the ability to stop bitcoin. Through this video, he knows exactly what OP means. We do not benefit by watching their shit videos. So I think ignore is a better option.  

Well, let them stay here the way they want it. The more they stay here, the more they will be convincing themselves that they are fooling themselves. There is no perfect program, there is nothing in this world that is perfect, and if bitcoin has a bad side, all of the other things too. The thing here is that the haters always look at its bad side rather than its bright side.

Most of those that criticize bitcoin are only repeating the points of people that do it because they know that bitcoin is a shift on our understanding of the economy, banks and money in general, they do not understand the economy and how the financial system is rigged to benefit those at the top and no matter what you do they will always have the upper hand, bitcoin changes all of that, that does not mean there are not going to be very wealthy individuals but at least we are all operating under the same rules.

Bitcoin is not a fraud it similar or more or less the same as PayPal. It is a form of payment online that is acceptable by many countries.
Referring to the use of Bitcoin as a payment instrument, its use compared with cash, debit, credit or ACH has these significant advantages:

Faster
Less expensive
Immutable *
Public audit trail
More trustworthy

It has its own economic value (https://sosgurus.com/what-is-economic-value) in the market place
Immunity from manipulation
* Some individuals argue that immutability is not always a benefit, because arbitration and reversal is unenforceable. This is a common misconception. Contracts, warranty rights, arbitration, or rescission can be added by agreement before a transaction, and a mechanism exists for this purpose.

But sometimes, immutability is a profound benefit—and it cannot be added to legacy payment instruments. This is because they are built upon a model of centralized, authoritarian trust. An ‘authority is in a position to alter the historical record. With massively distributed crowd-source trust built on math rather than personal reputation, history is a more reliable record of the facts.

The transaction of bitcoin is open and transparent, which is exactly what we want.

It's the choice of society and people, just like Darwin's theory of evolution.

In my opinion, cryptocurrency and bitcoin will not disappear, it will always exist.

If you think bitcoin will disappear, you shouldn't be here. You can look at other things.

If anything - Bitcoin has the most transparent and verified way of working/existing as a system. The blockchain is awesome! Nothing to worry about.

Very strange indeed and you can imagine that this individuals actually owns bitcoin! What's the aim, sometimes I wonder. They become an ilagentb9f fud in anywhere they discover crypto enthusiast to gather. One question is,

Are these persons really needed here?

I best guess funny enough is that, I think they are actually needed. They come to spread the fud that would make us stronger and more united. You know, the link is stronger with the adverse situation it most have endured I  time. These persons can actually be those that actually trick the weak hands to sell so they could accumulate some sats. Savage strategy but, a true crypto enthusiast knows better.

Very strange indeed and you can imagine that this individuals actually owns bitcoin! What's the aim, sometimes I wonder. They become an ilagentb9f fud in anywhere they discover crypto enthusiast to gather. One question is,

Are these persons really needed here?

I best guess funny enough is that, I think they are actually needed. They come to spread the fud that would make us stronger and more united. You know, the link is stronger with the adverse situation it most have endured I  time. These persons can actually be those that actually trick the weak hands to sell so they could accumulate some sats. Savage strategy but, a true crypto enthusiast knows better.

It is transparent in a way but I don't think it is the most transparent system there is because the system doesn't reveal who is the person behind the address. Also, bitcoin is too big to die now to be honest.

Two types of Bitcoin killers are  Governments and hackers. You'll hear things like governments will ban it or hackers will take it down. Technical attacks damage the network, while political hurt Bitcoin holders.

yes, of course the people who have benefited a lot from bitcoin, they will not be disturbed because for them news like that is stale. not a few people are trading crypto and they are still here today. the point is there is nothing that can change a person's mind if that person can make a profit with crypto. maybe the person who made the post above can't benefit from crypto and maybe he always fails.

The truth that will eventually kill fiat money. If governments keep printing out free money from their money tree. The negative consequences of hyper inflation will happen.

I don't think that Bitcoin as a Currency will die. Remember Bitcoin is not a company promised you to increase your income and it is not for business and also it is not for a profit oriented. It is a digital currency for buying and selling of goods and services. Bitcoin has come to stay, and I also don't think that Bitcoin will bow down for fiat currencies because nobody control it. Either the fiat currencies will bow down for Bitcoin. The individual Countries can't tell the users of the currency to stop using it.

The video your provided is just to damage the good Image of the currency. Various Governments have tried their best to eliminate Bitcoin but they can't. Therefore, for Bitcoin to eventually died, that means, the whole internet will be dead.