Bitcoin Forum

In September 2019, Gallup released a poll in which 49% of Americans believe the U.S. economy would fall into recession, 9% higher than the one polled before the 2008 financial crisis. The world situation is turbulent after entering 2020. US-Iraq conflicts continue, the China-U.S. relation on a tight rope, coupled with the broken out of regional financial crisis over the years, the public’s fear of recession is growing. The rising price of insurance assets also indicates that more people are preparing for the financial crisis.

Since the value consensus of Bitcoin has been formed and is widely acknowledged, many people chose Bitcoin as a safe-haven when regional financial crisis occur. However, as Bitcoin transactions become increasingly dependent on centralized exchanges, some regions set limitation on Bitcoin transactions by controlling exchange platforms. The advent of VDS once again frees up the privacy in Bitcoin transactions, we can convert Bitcoin safely into Vollar through VDS’s resonance trade. When you choose Vollar as the property category, its build-in decentralized and distributed trading mechanism will transform your Vollar into the type of wealth you desire in a secured manner.

Vollar is the only circulating medium in VDS ecosystem. Bitcoin can be converted into Vollar through resonance trade, and Vollar can be converted into any currency through the built-in decentralized OTC function. Similarly, you can exchange fiat for Vollar with OTC and then convert Vollar into Bitcoin. Every function is decentralized within VDS, so your transactions are completely free.

Bitcoin can not only be freely traded but also appreciate in value after being converted into Vollar. First of all, VDS utilizes blockchain technology to allow everyone to build their cash flow channel through multi-layer interpersonal fission promotion. This is called the Trust Stamp system, through which everyone can get a continuous flow of cash while VDS gets an exponentially growing user base. As the users grow rapidly, so will the demand for Vollar. Meanwhile, VDS also incentivize people to build super master nodes with high income such as transaction fee and issuance rewards to expand and maintain the stability of the network, and enhance user experience. The construction of super master node takes 10,000 Vollar as a deposit. After the establishment, super master node will receive a steady stream of income, and consequently with the decrease in circulation volume, the 10,000 Vollar deposit will also appreciate in value. Super master nodes will continue to grow, which cast a positive control of Vollar circulation and make the market in short supply, price will inevitable climb. In conclusion, VDS not only start a channel for Bitcoin holders to achieve freedom of wealth through resonance trade, but also conduct a permanent value-added wealth management for those who participate in VDS ecosystem.

The biggest impact of the outbreak of financial crisis on people is not only the asset depreciation caused by inflation, but also the decline in employment. It is not enough to simply choose a safe-haven to deal with financial crisis, we need to ensure our source of income. VDS turns interpersonal relationships into cash flow through the Trust Stamp System from which we can obtain a steady stream of revenue. Or we could build super master nodes to provide network service to earn profits. In response to the centralized financial crisis, a decentralized Bitcoin may be the best choice as safe haven. VDS brings decentralization and freedom back to Bitcoin and boost potential appreciation. These two march together and complement each other.

Thinking that economy will belly up is not really something new, it is a 3000 year old tradition in humanity because unfortunately finance never lets us down when we expect it to let us down.

Just because we lived the 2008-09 era do not think that it was the first one, in the past thousands of years of humanity there has always been bubbles and there has always been crashes that go beyond everything we see on regular days right now when you live in a decent nation, even the biggest roman empire of the time had hard time paying for food, water and wine the basic things for life in those times. Sure there will be another financial crisis one day, but that doesn't mean we have to do anything different with our lives, because it will happen and it will leave.

I've been thinking in a very similar way. I am not American, but I do believe that the world economic crisis is on its way, and this one might hurt more than the previous one. I think it might even bring the end of fiat with the dollar collapsing and major currencies following shortly afterward. If this happens, all of the assets and currencies might be down for a while, and I am not sure Bitcoin is an exception. In the aftermath, however, Bitcoin might be the savior for reasons you've covered (mainly since it's not susceptible to hyperinflation as it doesn't have an unlimited supply). In that situation, however, a solution to make global adoption truly possible would have to come asap.

what some statistics tell you people believe doesn't matter. 100% of them could believe something happen and that thing can still not happen or vice versa.

that is not true at all. bitcoin transactions have never been dependent on centralized exchanges and will never be. bitcoin remains the same decentralized currency that doesn't need any third party to be "transferred". nowadays people choose centralized exchanges to trade bitcoin and dump their fiat for bitcoin but the transactions still remain independent.

just another garbage altcoin

Appreciate your optimism. But still, I’d much prefer to ensure my source of income.

Disagree, statistics are for scientific analysis. I doubt it you never take statistics into consideration before making decisions.
You buy or sell Bitcoin from exchanges is part of the transaction where your cash flow can be traced.
I recommend you read more about the project before calling it garbage altcoin.

Bitcoins is not the safe heaven in any case .
I love bitcoins but when we talk about the financial crisis we need to understand that the values are gonna fall , values of everything, even bitcoins , therefore one must understand that they should not keep all their savings in a volatile market because sooner or later it might change the value and cause great distress .
It is amazing for trading and in the days of crisis one can rely on bitcoins for a job I would say , since am not sure if the government will be able to provide one , even right now they are not able to do anything.

Today we all know that the cryptocurrency is one of the most popular currency today and many people would like to join into the world of crypto because they see the possible earnings we can get on this. Even the cryptocurrency is encrypted and decentralized we cannot deny that there is a possibility that it is getting hacked even the technology is getting more stronger and secures still the people that are knowledgeable into the world of technology too are improving. Some of them are making some study and learning how they can break the rules.
Still, many people want to make investments on it, but we all know that the crypto is risky too because the market price is very volatile and you cannot complain if you lose your money because it is decentralized. We are looking forward to earning, and one of the keys to success is the knowledge always look and aim for the goal to make earning if you think it is enough just rest and if you are still confident you may go and pursue your profit.

Sounds like a Vollar advertisement disguised in an article to me.

Moving from Bitcoin to another currency doesn't help with anything and won't make anything better. Bitcoin is great the way it is today and whatever you'd like to talk about, with the exception of a few coins such as Monero, pretty much any coin you'd like to talk about is more "centralized" than BTC..

For me it is the best asset you can own during hard times. Send all your wealth to a piece of paper, put it in your pocket and go wherever you'd like around the world without any fear of someone finding out you've got a ton of metal or a bag of banknotes with you. The anti inflationary structure of it also guarantees there's no way someone's going to pour a billion BTC into circulation at any given time. Is there anything better than this to own to protect our wealth from the crisis? :)

hmmm I'm quite doubtful about this one, if digital currency is not the safe haven in financial crisis then what?

You are right values are gonna fall so what do you need to do? Assets like precious metal are going to increase in price, physical assets will get the same too. Once the financial crisis is on, the digital world will shake receiving a lot of injections because no one has the control to it. We see the world getting high-tech and so digital assets will be a thing, I'm not saying to buy bitcoin when such thing happens but telling how good bitcoin in escaping that event coz virtual and real world are different. Guess there will be more affordable cryptocurrency when that time comes, bitcoin will soar and so its transaction fees too.

Everything can happen during a financial crisis, any financial market will be affected but since bitcoin moves on a different trend and market I think it can be a safe haven for investors since it doesn’t connect directly with the economy of one country. We can’t say this thing confidently but if you’re living to a country under the hyper inflation right now maybe bitcoin is indeed the safest currency for you, we didn’t know unless we experience it.

I think global recession and economic breakdown is already happening and on its way to become full blown, with the above points duly noted by the poster above, added to the fact that the deadly NCOV corona virus seems to be spreading into different countries and region and there seems to be no cure and no stop to it, with china affected I am pretty sure that the rest of the world have started getting an impact to china meltdown. Bitcoin still remains the last hope if all thins currency and economy goes south.

I don't think we are close to calling Bitcoin a safe haven for investments yet. Many experts have said the same. Bitcoin is still trying to find its price. Will it be worth $10.000 per coin, $100.000 per coin, or $1.000 per coin. We still don't know.
The volatility and scalability still keeps Bitcoin back. Big investors don't want to risk losing 15% of their multi-million investments in the space of a few hours. And Bitcoin can do that, or it can do the exact opposite.

One day we will get there but it is going to be a bumpy road and patience will be needed.

I don’t think value of crypto with real utility will fall, even in the times of crisis, that’s when we’re in desperate need to find something to lean on, right?

People always said that investing in a digital currency like cryptocurrency is not a 100% win win for the investor. Cryptocurrency is very risky and is difficult to handle because of its volatility in the market. Plus those conflict between the world's economy and the problem that each and every country experiences. Poverty and NCOV are the main factors in market economy this year and we can't deny that people are looking for a safe haven for their money. But as you can see, it is an advantage of the crypto as virus spreads and indirect contact with money is necessary. So in some other way, it is good to invest money in crypto and it still has a disadvantage like instable price in the market.

Diversification of assets is the only real safe haven. This includes gold, silver, Bitcoin, tins of sardines, and some sort of mobile home.

I would say the same, Bitcoin can be seen as a store of value like gold but it's much newer then gold and since the community is still small (if you compare to other assets like gold) it's price is still easy to manipulate. I believe it will become more and more safe but you can't say already that it's the only safe heaven.

In any type of crisis it has been shown in history that gold is the safe asset, which functions as a refuge of value par excellence, currently the economic conception has changed giving cavity to digital money and that better than Bitcoin, which represents money , it has more ease of transfer and is not complicated when handling large quantities.

Due to the circumstances that began at the beginning of the year in many countries, they have seen Bitcoin as a safe haven, in fact the expansion of the coronavirus virus has negatively impacted the stock market and the ones that remain the most are bitcoin and gold. In fact, those are some of the reasons why Tim Draper left the stock market to join the Bitcoin market, since he found that the stock market was very foamy.

As BTC was created after the last financial crisis, we still need to see the reaction of investors during the financial crisis. If the demand and trading volume is going to skyrocket when stocks turn red for a longer time - it would be sufficient. So far in few countries struck with the local crisis the local reaction seems to be in favour of safe-haven asset class for BTC.

The question is - if investors will use Bitcoin as a safe haven asset of course - are we going to see a sudden massive dump and panic sell once crisis will be over?

in fact, what happens during the World Crisis is very difficult to explain, since people suffer more, and oligarchs accumulate their capital and not a single billionaire has become a millionaire because of the crisis.  And governments are just printing new money, and people are losing their savings.  I believe that cryptocurrency in this regard is really preferable to paper money.

I don't think that Bitcoin it's best investment itself that can save you from crysis because Bitcoin is also risky without guarantee of profit.
However it could be very helpful if you are wise and experienced investor and especialy if you combine it with some other assets.
One of the triggers for creating a Bitcoin were exactly financial crysis that repeated in.cycles created by banks and traditional financial system. However, Bitcoin itself can't be the solution for world finances but it can be helpful on an individual level.

Bitcoin came as a currency but it has been treated as a speculative product due to its continuous fluctuations. BTC is gradually losing its supremacy in the crypto currency market, but yes it will bounce back more harder than before.

Crypto is extremely risky because of its volatility, So for me it's not the best safe-haven when it comes to financial crisis.

Exactly this.  Just because 8000 years ago 100% of people believed the earth was flat, did make it so.  Just because 1000 years ago everyone believed "heavier than air flight was impossible" didn't make it true.  Statistics about people's beliefs do not change any facts.  Just as in September 2019 if 49% of people think a recession will occur with 6 months (for example) doesn't mean it will.  

As he said, bitcoin transactions NEVER depend on an exchange.  Sure if you want to purchase bitcoin, one may need an exchange.

Is it a safe haven?  Certainly more so than fiat.

Just a bunch of nonsense.

But how exactly can we send all our wealth to a piece of paper and put it in our pocket?

That's right, it's too risky, but looking at the history of this decade, the price of bitcoin tends to rise and multiply. It could one day become more valuable, even vice versa, worth the high risk. We must prepare mentally, not only ready to profit but also must be prepared to lose.

For me it is the best asset you can have during difficult times. In all types of crises it has been shown in history that gold is a safe asset, which serves as a haven for nominal value, now the economic conception has changed to make room for digital money and better than Bitcoin, which represents money, has more ease of transfer and is not complicated when handling large amounts. Is there anything better than this to protect our wealth from the crisis

The opinions of the ordinary Americans about the future of the US and global economy doesn't matter at all.
You can't predict a global crisis with polls asking the people about what they think or feel about the future.
Please don't try to pitch this Vollar (VDS) project in a thread that isn't about this topic.There are "Announcements" and "Project Development" sub-forums.You can post there without trying to secretly advertise this project.
Bitcoin is not a safe heaven,because it's price isn't stable.

Agree, that's why I don't think majority of americans will select bitcoins since they might fall on the trap of volatility and there are other safe options for them to select and that is gold which is more secure than bitcoins, But if they can withstand the risk of the bitcoins have trust on it then maybe it's good since imagine if the scenario will come and they will find a best asset to hide their wealth then maybe for that bitcoin will be chosen and it could possibly pump up.

We are in a little crisis right now and all financial assets, including Bitcoin are on a downward trend. Gold went down over 2% just yesterday. Stocks are at a low point and they are in a position where they haven't been for 20 years. Bitcoin and the crypto industry aren't immune to this either. From almost 10k Bitcoin is now down to 8.8K.     

I wouldn't go as far as to say that. I do agree, American opinion tends to be severely lacking in world view, but at the moment, with crypto and Bitcoin concentration in the US still a relatively strong presence, it's got to have some effect. As long as many of the Bitcoin nodes, much of the mining and majority of actual use (if not, perhaps, even trading and speculation) is mainly in America, their says definitely going to have some impact. 

But yeah, eff, the vdollar crap.

There is no such thing as "SAFE HAVEN" when it comes to investing because any asset goes up and goes down. It will depend on how you will entry and exit in the market and how long can you hold your asset.

Wait, is this some kind of another altcoin advertisement and inserting a topic like this. Good advertisement but that will  not work here :).

I used to believe that Bitcoin was a safe haven. But now there are more evidences that it isn't.
https://beincrypto.com/bitcoins-safe-haven-status-tested-amid-coronavirus-driven-market-decline/
https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2020/02/28/remember-when-bitcoin-was-supposed-to-be-good-as-gold-it-isnt/#56f331ae26d8

It would depend on the condition of blockchain technology at the time of that crisis. If its market value would be stable by that time, there is a chance that it would be a safe haven because at this moment, its market value moves a lot making it risky to put your money in it which would immediately turn into an investment, simply contradicting the concept of a "safe-haven" which secures your money without any form of risk present.
Its market volatility is a huge factor which makes it not a good safe haven for one's money. It could be a gold source of income as an investment but one should take the risk before earning profit. There are times wherein its market price would fall, despite of the chances for recovery, it won't be convenient for a person especially amidst of a crisis.

The financial crisis is coming and we'll see Bitcoin will be once and for all be tested with the stock market recession. But the banks may hold it off much longer with lower interest rates and quantitative easing.
The recent stock market crash with S&P and Dow Jones dumping, could be the beginning of it and also even Gold went down. Worrying times for fiat system cause Bitcoin might just overtake it.

The price of bitcoin is expected to rise if the financial market is good but since the OP is having a doubt about bitcoin being the safe heaven in the wake of a financial crisis i really do not think so, the financial market is falling for the past week and that is exactly the same we saw in the bitcoin market and considering those circumstances you cannot call it a safe heaven.

One of the triggers for creating Bitcoin is financial crysis that is repeatedly repeated. Bicycles were created by banks and traditional financial systems. Everything can happen during the financial crisis, every financial market will be affected but because bitcoin moves on different trends and markets, I think this can be a safe place for investors because bitcoin is not directly connected to the economy one country. However it can be very helpful if you are a wise and experienced investor and especially if you combine it with several other assets.

Yeah, when there is somethinf bad happening in the world most likely there is a pump on which coin? Bitcoin definitely. I personally consider bitcoin as one of the safe haven if there is a financial crisis but taking also the risk of having it. It is safe because you stored the value somewhere  but the risk of volatility stays. For theae past week, I guess it's prettt natural from speculation to movement to unexpected low.

Exactly, during crisis everyone will look for ways to make money, sure some people will help others but some will very much not. And this last group will also look for ways to protect their funds and I think bitcoin will be one of those safe havens, it's what it was created for anyway

You guys are unaware of the Bitcoin price manipulation? If yes, then you probably will be lost easily in the future if you tend to believe that Bitcoin is untouchable. Heck the price is not always what we expect it to be because manipulators know it already and all we have to do is to ride with their movement but if you have an experience about of this price manipulation then you might save a lot of money in the future.

Anything can happen during a financial crisis, any financial market will be affected, but because bitcoin moves on different trends and markets, I think it can be a safe haven for investors because it is not directly connected to one country's economy. However, it can be very helpful if you are a wise and experienced investor and especially if you combine it with several other assets.
One of the triggers for creating Bitcoin is the financial crisis that repeatedly occurred. The cycle created by banks and traditional financial systems

It is not enough to simply choose a safe-haven to deal with financial crisis, we need to ensure our source of income.

That depends very much on where you live. In some countries, where you have major inflation, for sure that Bitcoin is preferable then paper money.

In a financial crisis, the people will turn to the store of value assets like metals (gold, silver). One can argue that BTC is a poor store of value when it's price fluctuates 20% from week to week.
Sure it's good for combating inflation in Venezuela, but in this Corona outbreak, we saw nothing that would draw a conclusion that BTC has replaced metals (And that it will ever will).
Why?
In the affected areas people were preparing for the worst, they bought food, supplies, masks, and the ones who had more money - gold&silver. Stuff for the armageddon day.
And what will be the store value of BTC when the power is out? (One of the things they were preparing for). No electricity = no real-life use of BTC.

Am I for the mass adoption - sure, all the way. Should it be used as inflation combating decentralized asset - hell yes! For speculative trading - yes, if you like to gamble and looking at graphs.
Store of value - no freaking way!

My 2 cents.

I am not hundred percent sure about this, but I feel that Bitcoin would be a really good option for anyone that goes for it. Bitcoin shouldn’t be the only thing to be considering , there are lots of other assets that you should look into if you’re afraid to invest in Bitcoin. Gold has always been another good option to consider apart from bitcoin and some experts have said that gold is a better safe haven than Bitcoin.

I would prefer to invest in Bitcoin because I know that as time goes on the price of bitcoin will keep going up. From 2008 that bitcoin was created to now the price has been going up. Every year the low for the cryptocurrency is always higher than what it was in the past and that’s because the community keeps growing. I know that in the next years more people will discover bitcoin and start investing in it and it will keep on growing.

If the economy would fail globally, everything else will also follow, and so cryptocurrency like Bitcoin. Financial challenges are evidently situated in different nations in today's economy but Bitcoin somehow strives to keep a value that is beneficial at some point so its enthusiasts. However, if the economy would fail completely globally, it's possible that Bitcoin would also strike its lowest. And so to be realistic, Bitcoin may be a safe haven for now but I don't think it would still be by that time, I don't think that there would be a safe haven anymore. Yet, Bitcoin has this surprising volatility character, so who knows, maybe it would be the solution when nothing seems to be the right haven.

Actually, I’m talking about VDS. This crypto project turns interpersonal relationships into cash flow through the Trust Stamp System from which we can obtain a steady stream of revenue.
Of course, I would much prefer crypto than paper money.

I agree with you. There are a lot of people who think that investing in bitcoin will make them rich overnight, which, obviously is not the case. There will always be some dumb people around you who'll think like that So it's better that you avoid these people to get rid of getting blamed when they face the reality, lol. The main thing is to make a decent amount of profit you have to be patient.

I also believe in holding long term as the space and technology is new, crypto with true utility fixes every issue money has.

The psychology of people is so arranged that the majority wants to get as much as possible, while putting as little effort as possible. And sometimes it’s very difficult for such people to explain that bitcoin will not make them rich in a couple of days.

Agreed.
Bitcoin isn't a get rich quick scheme.
Bitcoin is a get free quick scheme.

Can we switch back to VDS?

Current situation proofs that the best save haven is gold, unfortunately

It isn't as simple as that. You need to differentiate between gold delivery contracts, and physical gold. Even in physical gold rhere are differences between gold coins,bullion and scrap. Another consideration is the gold/silver ratio. At the moment, it is looking as if silver will show the greatest gain and the best security. This is why Jamie Dimon has bought so much of it.

No, Bitcoin and crypto as the store of value aren't dead just because they had a super shitty day. In the coming months the world will see what anti-fragile means.

You're right. In the race of global asset rebound, cryptocurrency is no doubt the well-deserved winner.

Right now in countries with very high inflation such as Argentina, Venezuela and Nigeria, if Bitcoin can be seen as a safe haven despite the pandemic, since the local currency as the bitconi grows and the dollar also, the value increases significantly. , bitcoin is even preferred over gold due to the enormous ease of making transactions, buying and selling.

Yes, that's right, bitcoin is the best safe-haven in difficult times

I believe that BTCitcoin and Gold will be one of the assets that investors are most interested in and we can see how much we can respond in the recovery of the economy.
It is my optimistic thought after seeing to specialists spreading it on the most recognized bitcoin and blockchain blogs.

I agree, there can be no absolutely safe currency or type of investment. There is always a risk and no one is safe from it. Therefore, you cannot invest all the money in one thing and you cannot remain without a fallback.

During difficult periods investors used to consider gold as a safe heaven for centuries but if you look at the price of gold right now, you really cannot call it as a safe heaven as the price of gold has risen many folds in the past decade, when it comes to bitcoin i have no idea whether people will consider it as a safe heaven, it all depends upon how major financial institutions see the bitcoin market.

Even bitcoin price have seen many cycles of uptrend as well as downtrend in the past year, so it can't be considered as a safe heaven, but the thing is that government holds the money supply and literally at any time they can print any number of currency notes which isn't good for those who believe Fiat system is safe.
Even we have seen in case of gold the price doesn't depend on its rarity, rather it depends on the supply and demand of gold just like Bitcoin.