Bitcoin Forum

Which one will you select? And why?

A real question and discussion. NO Promotion.

I just want to receive more thoughts from the people of worldwide. Because we all know, the cloud mining industry has been harmed by some scam platforms.

What is wrong is those scam platforms, not the mining model of mining.

Objectively, cloud mining indeed can help users who have no enough money to buy machines or no places to setup machines mine crypto. Not every miner has enough money or places to do that.

So, i would like to know, what is the good cloud mining that the market need?

I hope the cloud mining market can be better with more reliable platforms.

Just going to answer this for the less-informed readers: Pretty much a no brainer lol. Mining with my own machines of course, if I actually want to make money. Cloud mining services are either a scam, or NOT profitable. If I wanted to get scammed or lose money, then cloud mining.

Not sure why you're asking this when you're promoting a mining hardware site though. 🤔🤔

I'm also going to make that choice, cloud mining has been exposed and there's not one decent and legit cloud mining now, but there are thousands of miner mining using their machine,  on mining by own machine you can make your own choice what to mine and calculate the profitability. You also have the option to sell your miner when you want to stop mining.

Not your equipment - not your property.
To make things more clear, imagine this: You mine 100$ monthly, will you rent your mining equipment for 90$ monthly? While you are making 100$ + you payed a lot in these equipment + you have to take care of them. Logical answer would be no. You would only rent if it's beneficial for you, that's how cloud mining works. They make mining beneficial for themselves, not for you. You pay them, then your contract becomes unprofitable and then they decline your contract while leaving money in their own pocket.
Or if still hashnest exist, you may mine and trade with their hashes (they are legit cloud mining company, under Bitmain's management).

So in overall, mine yourself with your own equipment. At least if nothing, you will be able to sell them.

You have guaranteed profit if you have a machine or mining rigs because you can pick your own coin and configure your mining cost, on cloud mining you are at the mercy of the cloud mining company, if they go down, your investment will go down the drain and you will lose a lot but as long as you have your mining rig you are in potential profit.

if there were a real business that actually had hashrate and were mining bitcoin then it would have made a lot of sense to invest in such a business. i have done it in the past (a long time ago) with GHASH.io and it makes sense since the user doesn't have to worry about maintenance, cooling, electricity cost, even legality of mining where they live.
but the problem is that "cloud mining" stopped being legit a very long time ago and from maybe around 2015-2016 every single cloud mining has been a terrible Ponzi scam.

Is this even a real question? Or it is more a way to promote your business?

I find sit hard to believe that somebody who is advertising a mining gear shop would ask things like "what is better".
Better in what way, in what cases?
We have som many options to consider, from location, budget, time to put into this, tariffs (if any) on gear and far more that you won't find an answer.
Would somebody with 20c/kWh be able to "home" mine? No! Would somebody with 2c/kWh but only 50$ in his wallet afford a miner?

Because we also have a cloud mining service that can let users mine if they have no mining machine or have no enough money to buy a whole miner. If we provide the real mining for users with our own mining farms. Do you still think cloud mining is a scam? im just curious.

I know many miners were harmed by some scam cloud mining platform, they closed the contract in 2018, so lots of miners ended their mining contract and wasted money. Or some platforms had no mining machines, just cheating users. So, i mean, if there is a cloud mining platform that promise they wont close users contract during period even thought the mining profit is lower than electric fee. Also it has real mining farms, will you choose to believe it and why?

So if users want to mine but they have no enough money to buy a whole machine or they have no place to setup their machines, what do you think will they can choose? is there any better choice?
Also, as i know, hashnest no longer belong to bitmain, bitmain has a new cloud mining platform--bitdeer.
So there is a question: If a cloud mining is under a real mining machine company and have their own machines in farms, can show you the real pictures of mining, will you choose to believe it?

So i have a question: if there is a cloud mining platform that has been operated for 6 years under a mining machine company, has own mining farms. users can withdraw after mining any time, will you choose to believe it?

I think that many scam cloud mining platform like hashflare or genesis-mining disrupted the reputation of cloud computing and led to lots of miners in 2018 lost their money then began to hate cloud mining. The industry need more legit and reliable companies to join.

A real question, sir.
I just want to know users' real thoughts about cloud mining or mining with machines. Because cloud mining is so popular in China now and i would like to know more thoughts from people of worldwide. We need to know more people's thoughts. No promotion, just discussion.

If we are talking about reputation and profitability, and a cloud mining site has both of this, why not people will be in a hurry to subscribe to its plan, but a new cloud mining company would have a hard time setting up a reputation because there are so many fake cloud mining in the past that scammed investors, so can you give name of new cloud mining now, for us to check.

If I don't have enough money to buy machines or a place to set up I might as well buy coins that I want to mine, cloud mining scam is very rampant and at least if you are buying your own machine, you have a return of investment and you can see your investment, and you can always resell it.

This one: oxbtc cloud mining: https://www.oxbtc.com/, which in under PandaMiner and has been operating for 6 years in China. Pls check and tell me what you think.

I dont understand, the scam platforms indeed disrupted the good development of this market. That led more and more investors choose to buy coins not cloud mining even though the cloud mining is more stable.

The whole mining market is not a stable one. Cloud mining also takes part of that instability. How can you define it that it's more stable?
As i can't also get the point of how cloud mining is popular in China. Do chinese users uses platforms that we don't actually know? Just for discussion and not for promotion, can you state a list of reputable cloud mining farms in China with some proofs of credibility ?

Cloud has the worst reputation in this forum and it would be hard to build a business without enough garantes.

Was supposedly to say the same thing though.He do talks about cloud mining but it isnt really that pretty obvious that he's promoting that Pandaminer. LOL!

Going back on topic this is indeed a no brainer that if you do have the money then better to have or mine with your own machine but we know it wont really be that
cheap so a few does really have the capability. Cloud mining is never been considered as an opportunity for people to take.Why would dive into things
that you do look which isnt profitable for you?

And how do you know cloud mining is popular in China? Do you have any proof of it being popular there and not in the US?
It's quite ironic that the Chinese page of bitdeer, for example, si showing the prices in $ and not yuan  ;D

Can we finally after 5 years of the constant myth of everything related to bitcoin being big in China and not somewhere else?


Oh, a tear! And another one!
The Robin Hood of bitcoin mining, the benefactors of the poor, the cloud mining companies.
Oh, how disgraceful of me to think that you're not after the poor people who can't buy miner money and you give them zero guarantees and in a case of a dump you even terminate their contract because of energy bills, how could I not see how good and helpful your business is.
You just think of fleecing a bit the ones that don't have enough money to be fleeced by others...


7.5% difficulty increase (so 7.5% revenue (not profit)) decrease for 1TH/1PH whatever your unit of measurement is and at the same time a nearly 20% drop in BTC price..
If you call that stable, how do you picture something unstable?

Cloud mining now needs trust, because in the past so many cloud mining have scammed investors with their hard-earned money, they deceived people that by buying hash power people can earn Bitcoin passively without doing anything, until they realized that all are just ponzi scheme and all are just lies.

Why do i know the cloud mining is popular in China? because we are a China-based mining company. There are lots of cloud mining platforms in China now, like Bitdeer, OXBTC cloud mining, Hashnest, Hashbox, also many others that have no English names.
About "stable', i mean the cloud mining is more stable than buying crypto.

I totally agree with your point. That is also what we are thinking about. How can a cloud mining platform make miners trust them again. What can we do? Any suggestion?

If i want to promote PandaMiner, i will introduce our mining machine rather than asking your thoughts about cloud mining.
i just want to know how can cloud mining platforms get people's trust again?

What if the cloud mining platform would not end the contract? Indeed many scam platform terminated their contact in 2018 and harmed many miners. But if you want to know, you will find there are still some companies that would not terminate their contract even in the bull market. Its your prejudice for all platforms.

So here's my 2 cents;

I personaly see all cloud mining platforms as scams, or fraudelent at best.
And here is why; cloud mining platforms are business like any other, and they sell a service, which roughly translates to:
- buy a contract for X, and receive Y amount, ROI Z guaranteed.

But ask yourself, if Y+Z are more than X, as all of them promise, why sell the service at all? Why not just mine and make more than X will provide?

If a platform guarantees a return they are likely a scam, you can't guarantee mining earnings.

The scam usually comes from selling contracts and not having the physical mining equipment, they claim to have the miners but in reality they just pay you what a miner would have earned if it was mining.

As for the Y+Z > X, if the company is real they will be mining for themselves (with hashrate they haven't sold or hashrate they have allocated for themselves). But as a business, you want cashflow. Y+Z in 6 months might be greater than X, but if you sell a contract today for X you get X today without having to wait 6 months.

If the company buys $500k of  miners that will produce 10PH and they sell that 10PH for a 1 Year contract somewhere around $450k, they get another $450k they can use to buy almost another 10PH, at the end of the day almost every contract company charges you for electric either at the end of the day or included in the purchase price. So in turn they get their original capital back, get enough hashrate for themselves (or they can sell it off) and in 1 Year the equipment belongs to them and you as the customer pay for the electric. If they only mined, they would pay 500k upfront, have to wait for the mining income to come in before they can do anything else and also pay the electric bill for that mining.

Think of it like annuities, you get paid a little bit every day, would you take a slight loss in the long run to get a large payout now? And before you answer remember having cash now = you can use it now without waiting.

How can a user have this guarantee?
Just because you've been in business for 4 years?
Gox also was for a long time a good exchange, and since we're talking about mining, does BitClub ring a bell?

If you really want to defend cloud mining and come with arguments on how about this:
Show us how much a user would have to pay for 1th two weeks ago and what the earning are and how are they looking now!
With bitdeer you're making a cent per day with 1th, with an s17 you're in red with the electricity fee!

Are you promoting a cloud mining company I bet you are you are trying to convince us that cloud mining is still worth investing when in fact it is not, you can do a poll and majority of us here will vote it's not worth or even profitable to invest in cloud mining they just launch market their plan and after a few months then just vanish.

Let's not talk about the scam platform but let us explore the halving, after the halving, the scenario will be quite different from the present situation, cloud mining will not be profitable as it is now, even if the cloud mining is legit it will have a hard time keeping up with the plan they first offered to their subscribers, there would be a lot of changes and on the plan.

After Halving Hashrate will drop. Difficulty will drop due to old miners are going away like S9s.
Cloud mining is very risky because there was so many cloud mining that has been collapsed before. Once you have physical hardware its different. You know that you own something. At least machine. Profitable or not you still own the asset. I would vote for holding physical machines in some professional facility or at home.