Bitcoin Forum

Bitcoin fell some days ago and many were of the opinion that, there's no need to hold the said cryptocurrency because it was not able to stand against the coronavirus epidemy. During the crash, the percentage of the fall was more on Bitcoin than the fiats(stocks), but reasons be that, The US Fed injected into the crashed market $168bn which in percentage is more than the current investment on Bitcoin. Possibly, this was the major reason while the fall was more on Bitcoin.

“It may sound crazy, but I think it takes $700bn to over a $1tn to stabilize the markets. The last few weeks are a prime example of why digital assets, namely Bitcoin, have a place in the global markets.”   Bill Herrmann.  (https://cryptognt.com/wilshire-phoenix-ceo-speaks-about-168b-us-fed-injection-and-crypto-correlation/)

No doubt that Bitcoin is a Safe Haven and not what others speculated about it being weakest  during the crash.

Do you still insist that Bitcoin isn't a Safe Haven?

Being too optimistic or pessimistic is not always good. It is a fact that you could lose a lot of money in the bear market or the recent dump, more than if you hold other assets such as gold and things like that. It's easy to say and discuss whether it's a safe haven or not but if you're feeling that your portfolio is losing -50% of its value, I bet you'd feel anxious and fear for the worst.

The best practice would be to manage your risk properly and never invest something that you can't lose, exit and enter the market at the right moment, and you'll get the profits. Bitcoin will 'win' in the long run because of the supply and demand law, but you can only live in the present.

In the time of a Global Pandemic , Bitcoins have helped people in a variety of ways , for me safe heaven is not price but the ability of a investment to bring good results.
Who says one cannot earn when the price is low ?
Who says one cannot earn through bitcoins during a quarantine?
Bitcoins is the one helping people the most when all the government jobs and private jobs are shut down and people are helpless and don't know where to get funds from .
It is a safe heaven .
And it will stay like that despite it's price.

Absolutely correct, this resulted to series of panic sales from holders who seem to be hit harder during the crash. We're not against such move but hold for a long-term still give more than in panic sales. The facts should be clear enough for cryptocurrency holders or investors: "get rich quick aren't available anymore and anywhere around Cryptocurrencies". Long-term is the answer even at loss.


 :D yeah, "live in the present" matters a lot to humans but never to forget to live for tomorrow.

Bitcoin is as safe haven for who have understood its circumstance. Not for who only expect high return from bitcoin. We should know very well regarding volatility of cryptocurrency especially it's more on bitcoin. It would become hell for someone if they bought on $20K and they do not sold and price become at $3K. Holding bitcoin isn't the identity of the intelligent always and I had realized that. Who can take real time decision, obviously bitcoin is haven for them either price drop or grow.

Simple answer to this simple question, do you want change of the current financial system? Do you invest based on the technology the is written on the white paper? Or, are you here because of fiat gains?

The Debt problem now is creating more children slaves in the future. To win against it, hodling bitcoin means fighting banks! Bitcoin is created to fight banks and not an investment scheme. Changing our mindset today will free our children tomorrow. Think about it.

I know we deal on the present and lived happily with big gains but is that really your sole purpose on coming out on earth? There are a lot of things money can't buy. Time is more valuable than anything else, so why not share your time to make an impact of how to shape the future for good. The time to ACT is NOW! Don't waste time on your selfish mindset. Be Open Minded and let us all be free.

I personally think bitcoin could be a safe haven against hyperinflation, but probably not against a recession(at least in the short term). I know bitcoin dropped A LOT in just a day compared to other assets, but let's not act like gold didn't drop significantly too. Knowing that gold has been the "safe haven" since who knows when.

I am now trying to reevaluate my initial stand on this. The recent huge drop of Bitcoin's value is a clear reminder to all of us that the safe haven that we used to consider is not really something that would defend our money' worth whenever there is a crisis. Just recently, everything was falling. What if those who are into the traditional market went into Bitcoin believing that it is the best option to control the free-fall of their value? They would have jumped from the frying pan into the fire.

For the sake of argument, in the traditional market the government, in coordination with the central bank, could inject a huge sum of money to somehow put stability to the market which is otherwise already swirling down the drain. What do we have like this in Bitcoin? Government bonds for now seem to be a safer option. Well, that depends on where we are viewing things.

Your type is what we need right now, you're absolutely saying the whole truth. We'll need to fight back these oppressors from the world, they're everywhere even in my country Nigeria. They have kill the whole system and enslaved us and our children yet unborn, we need freedom and we must be free from their tyranny. Take a look at  this:

(off-Topic reply)
"The N10.59 trillion 2020 budget in December 2019. Meanwhile, the budget, which is 18.8% higher than that of 2019, is largely expanded to service debt."  Facts  (https://nairametrics.com/2020/01/10/nigeria-spends-1-31-billion-to-service-external-debt-in-2019/)

The strongest force for Bitcoin is Bitcoin community and not those who fall in love when there's bitcoin bubble and turns hatred when it's at bloodbath. Standing with Bitcoin will help take over our freedom form these selfish individuals and institutions who derive pleasure in enslavement. Let's be on records that we will all fight with the last blood until what belongs to us come back to us.


Definitely, we must tell the truth that: Bitcoin is the only SAFE HAVEN and nothing more.

The issue here is that so many exchange products are hurting Bitcoin, I doubt that some of these exchanges even have their customer Bitcoin, so a time like this they use it as opportunity to make the most out of the market, remember they always win, because when you buy you pay trading fee and when sell you will still pay

Haters are saying the truth, the reason they hate bitcoin because they don't believe in bitcoin.
They are certainly laughing at us now because bitcoin had dump a lot and they will feel they are right, but we believers would feel the opposite way of course.

just let them do their thing, you can't please everyone, haters gonna hate.

The price went down 50% in the last month. This is literally the worst time to say that Bitcoin isn't weak.

This is a fallacy, and one of the oldest one in the cryptosphere.

According to the IMF, inflation in Venezuela reached 200,000% in 2019^[1], when you ask the average venezuelan if they use Bitcoin they'll tell you "wtf is dat?","i don't know how to use it" "i don't like it". All you hear is people using fiat like USD or Euro and other payment processors such as Paypal, bank transfers or Zelle (source: got some friends there). I mean, seriously, that country is fucked (and any other developing country with hyperinflation), the last thing the people living in that hell need is to put their hard-earned money on a crypto that could crash 30% overnight.

So, no, BTC isn't a safe haven for hyperinflation.

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1. https://www.imf.org/external/datamapper/PCPIPCH@WEO/WEOWORLD/VEN

Those people are mostly playing on stock and afraid with fluctuation of bitcoins, maybe they are laughing for now but in the other hand but I think they are also victim on the recession since if they are playing with stock market for sure they lost their money since the current situation there is burning as hell.



Many people have different opinion since we have different opinions for this matter and yet not all people use some bitcoins so provably majority will go for gold especially if they see how bad the crypto market these days.

what do you expect from them ? they are called haters because they hate it and they will just lie . for us lovers of bitcoin we know the truth . im also a bitcoin lover but to call bitcoin a safe haven for your money is not alright in me . btc is risky/unstable  thats why but if you mean safe heaven to avoid the risk of using a fiat/physical medium due to the virus infection that is happening right now then yes . we must use btc or even not btc but as long as we avoid any physical contact/touching for now to avoid the risk of infecting the deadly virus .

Stocks are not "fiat" and I'm not sure if this is a language barrier or a misunderstanding on your part.

I seriously don't understand your reasoning here.  Maybe I'm not up to speed on what the Fed is doing, but where exactly did they inject that amount of money?  Even if the Fed bought $168 billion worth of stocks, which I'm sure they didn't, it still wouldn't be enough to keep the entire stock market from nosediving, which it did and probably will continue to do.  And given that bitcoin receives zero support from any government, I'm not sure why you'd consider it a safer haven than stocks, for instance (I don't consider the stock market to be a safe haven, btw). 

I think OP really needs to think about what a safe haven asset really is.  It's something investors buy when there's too much volatility in other markets--in other words, something that's not going to crash.  It's an asset that probably isn't going to lose money for the investor.  Now I ask you: do you seriously think bitcoin is a safe-haven asset?  My answer would be a resounding NO.

It might not definitely be the best option especially today with it's low liquidity and that the USD is definitely superior in this case, but it's an alternative. I'd personally take a chance of a 30% crash overnight compared to a guaranteed daily drop of a certain percentage.

But being a hater already means that their opinion is biased ( for most ), The fact that they don't believe in bitcoin is already a lose lose and you will know the old shit they will talk about it.
They could be laughing today but we'll see their faces in the future. lol. The recent dump is already an indication of a huge push up of the price that will cause a spurt hitting the medias.

HATERS GONNA HATE, we cannot do about it anymore.

Believe me, that is a typo error from my end. Stocks are different from fiats, it might interest you to know that: I came around from stock and pretty have some average ideas on it.
 

That money was injected into their financial system and it was 82% higher than all the investment made into Bitcoin so far. You can check the article for clarity in the OP.


1Bitcoin =1Bitcoin: this make me believe that it is a safe haven. Bitcoin was made for p2p exchange and not a currency.

Being DELUSIONAL is not good.

The LIE of BitCoin as a safe haven asset and Digital Gold is dead.   Investing on HOPE and emotion is a sure way to get wiped out.

The problem is the people here, they are all reinforcing each others hopes of dreams of getting rich, which does NOT allow them to see reality. 

You can ignore reality, but you can not ignore the CONSEQUENCES of ignoring reality      The financial losses will be just as real no how much you guys try to deny it and follow each other off the cliff.

Hard Facts

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This is NOT, NOT, NOT a typical crypto up and down...

Bitcoin only has a history in a BUBBLE economy, where everything has been going up ( never in up in a straight line, but generally up ).   Bitcoin has never been tested in an economic CRASH before.   Now that this test has come, the lie of Bitcoin being a safe haven, or Digital Gold has been exposed.   The CRASH is going to get a lot worse, and BitCoin has a lot further down to go. 

TOTALLY OBVIOUS FACT:   Do not believe every whitepaper you read   :D :D :D :D  More people are selling than buying.   Any rational person would be VERY WORRIED right now.   I have invested into Bubbles before, and lost a bunch of hard earned money....    But I was rational and honest about my stupidity, educated myself, and never made that mistake again.

Hard Facts

I agree with you. The thing with centralized money or business is that the market doesn't dictate the rules there that much, and by pouring money it, setting a fixed price of something and similar things it's possible to make it seem like things aren't that bad. But where do you think these 168 billion dollars came from? I'm almost sure they were just printed because right now there isn't exactly an area from which you can pull out some gov support and take it elsewhere. Eventually, such actions are bound to lead to hyperinflation, and I fear that it might actually hit the USD this time. Bitcoin doesn't feel safe these days, but I am being patient and holding it as I don't believe there's anything safer anyway.

It also rose 40% this year and we are just 3 months in. Is an asset that rises 40$ in 3 months and then falls 50% weak? I wouldn't say so.
Shitcoins like XRP or BCH lost more than 300% from their peak values and at the same time Bitcoin is only down 70%.
It's also worth mentioning that the stock market shut down during the crash.. Bitcoin did not and kept falling.

I think it would be best to look at the circumstances carefully before concluding anything. We may see bitcoin right now as a coin that is losing its potential on being a safe haven for investors yet if we are going to look back at its history, crisis kept on occuring for bitcoin but still it was able to revive and regain all that it has lost or come back stronger than before. If we are going to be optimistic at bitcoin's current state, we should then consider it still as a safe haven. With the upcoming halving, things might change for the better so it would be best if we would stay tune and stay faithful with our investment on bitcoin.

But really, I don't know how come some people have speculated that price will drop before halving and here we are with price down that it has been said as the effect of corona virus. Can we say perhaps that TA has a way of working with sentiment?
Anyways, I'm thinking better days are coming for bitcoin soon as we enter the halving.

WRONG, WRONG, WRONG...

Everyone already knows about the halving, and any benefit from that is ALREADY priced into the market.

Welcome to the NEW REALITY,  whatever you knew before is OVER.    BitCoin is crashing in an economic crisis.    I just wonder at what price level more people like you will figure it out  ;D ;D ;D

Of course, the dumbest people will be the LAST to figure it out.  Yeah, even a fool can see reality once it punches him in the face 🙉🙉🙉

Hard Facts

I am not surprised people still have doubts about the safe haven status of bitcoin, gold has been a safe haven for thousands of years and the dollar has been a safe haven for decades, bitcoin is still too young and the decrease in the price we saw was without a doubt used against bitcoin to challenge that notion, but most likely as the market cap of bitcoin becomes bigger and the governments find no other way to get out of the crisis than to print money the safe haven status of bitcoin will become clearer for everyone to see.

There are a LOT of possibilities:

1.  People will see the obvious decline, and SELL bitcoin as their stocks go down, as they get layed of from work, and need the money more than ever.

2.  People see the obvious selloff in BitCoin, and the fear feeds on itself, the bubble pops, and the price of BitCoin crashes more than you could ever imagine.

3.   Bitcoin never was a safe haven, only a bubble, and crashes along with stocks, fiat, and every other speculative asset.

ASSUMING that this is going to have a great outcome is a special kind of stupid 🙉🙉🙉

Hard Facts

It will always be a great outcome for someone. Unfortunately, not everyone can be a winner. There has to be losers. This is a zero sum game, remember? For every seller there must be a buyer on the other side. So, one of the two will profit in the end.

People shouldn't have to keep thinking that Bitcoin is gonna safe at all, that is why it is at high risk because any time of the day you can possibly be loose. We have to accept it, not all the time we think that bitcoin is safe. Just like what happens now, should we have to think like that? Of course, a feeling of a human being should have to prevail and that worries may exist knowing that we can be lost if this trend gets worse.

We don't need to hide anything, it is much better to tell someone what would possibly you will get in investing crypto rather overly thinking that it will generate money all the time.

It  could be considered as a safe haven for those who has a ton of wealth. Bitcoin could be good to hedge their wealth in this time of crisis. But for average joe, during this pandemic, perhaps they are selling to have cash to buy and stack up food and water, that's it.

Bitcoin is still in it's infancy, it's never been tested in this kind of situation, but we will have to see, so far with the recent dump, it doesn't look very good. However, people are going to realized it sooner or later, that Bitcoin can be a good leverage, IMHO.

FOR THOSE NOT AWARE:    BitCoin had a HUGE advertising campaign trying to sell BitCoin as " Digital Gold ",  a safe haven and better than gold.   That LIE is now totally exposed and debunked.   Of course, there are a bunch of people here that have " faith ", and " beleive ", that are willfully blind   that reject reality until it punches them in the face.

Hard Facts

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NO, NO, NO

Even if you are very wealthy, losing MORE THAN HALF of your wealth in BitCoin in a few weeks is NOT, NOT, NOT a safe haven.   That is a disaster, and means you have made very poor investment choices.

Hard Facts

People just like to see btc as a safe haven, not that this was indicated in the wp.... or maybe I miss that part, but to me, i always thought it too risky to rely on something so volatile as safe heaven, when the market is good, it is possible to earn a lot from btc but not hold your savings on it, because of this type of unforeseen situation that we are currently facing,
Btc is good investment to increase your money and cash out whenever you can, using it as safe heaven is out of the equation for me, at least not now, maybe when there is more stability.

In this whole situation, once again, metals came out with the least losses, gold lost about 8%. Bitcoin has lost about 40%, and this is a lot, especially against gold.
Still, cryptocurrencies do not yet have the weight that conservative assets possess.

Blind optimism is dangerous, and I don't think it will lead anyone to any good at this point in time. Even though bitcoin prices are tanking every day, I still see the previous prices of $4000 - $5000 as the best entry price for bitcoin, and this is only for those who are brave enough to hold their bags for quite some time. You can still play the "invest and forget" game with bitcoin if you think that it is worth it in the end, or if your wallet allows you to invest and bear the truth of seeing red streaks on graph day by day.

Why not invest Bitcoin if you have money that you can afford to risk and either to lose. The risk is really high since from the start and we can't deny the fact that many people had suffered losses than those who gain. But this will not even bother the others because those people who lose their money are those people who don't know anything about crypto, they are quitters and panic sellers. Quite possible that they usually end up losing because they doesn't actually what they doing and they just think that investing crypto is giving them profit assurance which is not in a real scenario.

That should be right because some investors are panicking and they can be a loser if they sold at a loss price. Bitcoin still a good investment only if you believe on it but if not then probably bitcoin is not a safe haven at all. Having a positive mindset and a positive goal with bitcoin is a must, and if you see a cheaper price then its another opportunity for you to buy.

In my opinion, the safest shelter is gold under the pillow. Namely, so that it is in your possession, and not in the bank, or in storage with third parties.
Cryptocurrencies suffered too much from the fall, I did not even think that this could happen.

I think that almost all investments are safe haven, like when you invest in stocks you can hold your stock to make sure that you get the dividends. In currency investment however, we shouldwait for a time to sell what we are holding and buy back when the price goes low.

What a DUMB and IGNORANT statement.   Stocks are going down the fastest in history.  Those that own typical stocks will lose MOST of their wealth in this downturn.

Why would anyone give such bad advice ???

Hard Facts

Well, Bitcoin's price is based on the sentiments of the investors and its fundamentals so if the investors felt panic because of a pandemic like COVID-19 they will immediately sell their holdings causing the price to go down. There are no asset right now that survived the down. Even the Gold who remained on the rise at the middle of the pandemic went down too days after.

We don't know TBH but it can and it cannot. Bitcoin and the crypto market already have a place in the global markets already because it already has a huge market cap but not as huge as the other stock markets out there who has at around a billion to even trillion dollars :D.


They've said that it is the weakest one during the crash but they forgot its main feature which is the volatility. They know already that Bitcoin and crypto market is volatile so it is normal already that it will go down more than the stock market which is less volatile.

I'm not insisting but at the same time, I'm not agreeing that Bitcoin is a safe haven.

Yeah, maybe all of the investments are really a safe haven especially if the thing that you are gonna invest is legit and after a time there is an assurance that you will be able to get or earn your profit of eaiting because of the investments that you have been done. Just like for what you have been said that the investing on stocks is good, yes definitely it is really good because we all know that stocks is more likely here in the cryptocurrency.

Well, it isn't since we all know what a safe haven investment is though I know for a fact that even if it is not a safe haven, it did give a lot of investors, a lot of people a profit in the long period of time. If bitcoin continuously increase and did not fell last week, the same as last year and the all the time it was in existence, I can assure it would be safe haven. With the volatility of it, it is not a safe haven.

For us that has bitcoin during this pandemic, bitcoin is really a safe haven for us. When we think, we gat no money at hand, we convert our bitcoin to fiat to sustain us. Those that has no idea about bitcoin, won't be able to understand how safe haven it is having bitcoin presently during this lock down.

I don't care what haters say about bitcoin. I still believe that bitcoin is still a safe haven in this situation. Moreover, the spread of
the corona virus is increasingly widespread, and the spread of the virus can occur through fiat currency. I am increasingly convinced that
bitcoin can be safe haven, because all bitcoin transactions are done digitally. So it's safer to use bitcoin now on payments. Bitcoin can
also be safe haven for people who are laid off from work in the real world, because to prevent the spread of the corona virus everyone
must stay at home. And with bitcoin we can make money from home.

I agree i also like that you tell safe haven. I would invest 70% my money on BTC rather then using it on banks.
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