Bitcoin Forum

"When governments seize emergency powers, they never give them up. Under the pretext of monitoring and tracking the spread of the disease, government mass surveillance via mobile phone tracking risks becoming normalized. Algorithmic bias now goes beyond academic studies as opaque algorithms can and will decide who can travel and work in places like China, and will no doubt soon decide who lives and who dies from the virus. Is this the world we want our children to inherit?"

https://cointelegraph.com/news/this-is-our-last-chance-to-protect-our-privacy-amid-the-covid-19-crisis (https://cointelegraph.com/news/this-is-our-last-chance-to-protect-our-privacy-amid-the-covid-19-crisis)

Tracking mobile phones in Korea worked to contain the virus though. They did it just when someone infected who was in the plane, they contact all those in the plane and let them isolate themselves. This is sort of a very effective to them. We might not like this survellance as we want privacy but this works in this kind of crisis. 

I think the problem with people nowadays is that they are too paranoid about government authorities getting emergency powers even if it's approved by their Congress or allowed in their Constitution . I don't know if that is the result of getting used to so much democracy. I think the emergency powers granted in times of crisis like COVID-19 has some restrictions to avoid authorities from abusing it.

While it is still early it is better to follow the rules and law of the government about the spreading of the virus because most of the people today are now staying at their homes and already bought a lot of foods and things they need like the mask and alcohol because the outbreak are still exists and also we are looking forward to the front and backlines that will still protect the economy on and also as a person it is better to stay at home enjoy with your family because of this and if you have a family member on the frontline always love them because we can tell until the virus are still gone.

I think the tracking thing can be done in a safe way without exposing people to more dangerous risks. It should be very transparent, anonymous/private, safe/secure, immutable, trustless/permissionless, censorship resistant etc... Normally in societies, people who lose these good features/right are the dangerous ones, right? 
Thankfully, real cryptocurrency have most/all of the features hardcoded or as a principle

You can have a privacy with your own private life some people still live with double/triple life even when all the surveillance of big brother.  But amid the covid crisis, you ought to be traced and should be transparent because you register on a mobile network provider, your name is there and data can be useful for the country and the government.

You can have a life of a garbage truck driver for the eyes of the public but you can be a big crypto investor in a DEX that doesn't collect KYC, that's privacy.

Most countries have been tracking mobile phones for many years already, some were even using it to track protestors. But there's a threat that coronavirus will normalize this, that regular citizens will start supporting it and even developed countries known for their democracy and freedom will be more like China with its mass surveillance.

Tracking the location of your mobile device isn't dangerous for anyone.Hacking everyone's mobile device and gathering access to all the information and applications inside is the real danger here(and I doubt that it might happen).
Countries with a long democratic history in the western world can't turn into dictatorships that easy.
High tech solutions and algorithms can help for some aspects of the pandemic,but they are not a panacea.
By the way,mobile device tracking isn't effective at all.I don't ware my mobile device all the time.
If I leave my device at home,nobody can track my real location.

Leaving mobile phones at home is one way to solve privacy but that would make you difficult to contact as well. So many crimes had been solved due to tracking mobile devices so weighing in whether which has more advantage many of us may prefer to be located. Unless of course if a person doesn't want to, he could always have a choice of just using untraceable ways.

Goverments are always doing the worse to control. We all know we cant escape it even for demo countries but we got used to it.

For as long as the tracking is for the benefit of the people themselves and the larger society in general, I don't find this absolutely offensive and inexcusable. As much as we should be given the privacy that we need, I guess there is still some form and extent of tracking that is necessary in our growing society. Again, for as long as it is used in a good way and not to stifle opposition, limit freedom, pry unnecessarily on too personal affairs, and so forth.

All also do not want this to happen, we as human beings are obliged to help others at least remain at home with the current situation, but this can also have positive and negative impacts for the sustainability of cryptocurrency in the future, because with this COVID-19 it is not impossible that the country will adopt a policy to legalize cryptocurrency in the country to inhibit the rate of weakening of their country's currency so that bitcoin can be an alternative too gold to stabilize the price of the currency. Always always maintain health because it is not impossible we are also threatened by this COVID-19 virus.

The problem of government seeking emergency powers didn't start at the people, it starts with the opposition. These people from the opposite party will do anything to make these emergency powers looks like a threat to the economy and society, when the sole purpose is to address the fast response from government decisions to contain the pandemic.
If tracking of phones to easily locate PUI's and PUM's to immediately contain the virus, so be it. That's 10x better than just disinfecting the whole place.

this is nothing new though, if anything this only proved that our privacy didn't exactly exist before either. the infrastructure to track people using their mobile phones was already in place and they were already doing it. the only thing that changed was that they flipped the switch to turn it from small scale (monitoring many) to massive scale (monitoring everyone). and all governments have been doing it without exceptions...

I don’t see a problem tracking our mobile phones yet. As a general rule, such actions by the government are illegal and this already protects the privacy of citizens. If this is carried out, then it is in our own interests as a necessary measure. Of course, there are cases and abuse of this right by officials. We have the right to appeal such actions. However, in any case, we can refuse to use a mobile phone and the problem will be automatically solved.
Extraordinary powers can be introduced only for a strictly defined short time. In a democratic society, enough checks and balances are provided so as not to be afraid of usurpation of power by individuals or bodies.

Isn't it just like monitoring the countries you can and can't go depending on the current state of affairs at that time? If so, then I'm all up for it. Especially with how the example of China gave us where they unilaterally let residents of Wuhan travel all around the globe to seek refuge. Look at what that caused no? And you're putting the moves of the government way too deep. It's just to prevent the spread of the virus. Why did the matter of life and death even come up? I mean, you as a governing body would not want a virus to spread towards your own jurisdiction right? Sides, these answers come up because of the lack of strategy to upvote privacy. Yes, some are developing, but without it bringing an overall good effect towards the country, I doubt it could be a potential plus on the peoples books.

Definitely, the government have a better plan for us and we should follow what government tell us to do. It is for the safety of every people to prevent ourselves to the virus and also slower the transmission of it from one person to another person. Emergency power is required during times like this, so that people will be disciplined and help the government overcome this crisis. Let's just support and help our government instead of saying something useless, say something that will not help for the greater good. Also take care of yourselves so that you will not get infected, because most of our frontliners are already tired and they also have families that are waiting for them to come home. Don't be stubborn, stop being against the government because our life is at risk. Simple rules and simple regulations, do not go outside, and isolate yourself if you experience some symptoms.  

It's actually dangerous if not done transparently and properly. I believe this things should be decentralized, private/anonymous, safe and transparent. Everyone should be involved in supervising one another to prevent abuse.
There will be problems If this get into the wrong hands or if those incharge turn evil.

Our government would as much as possible wants to monitor its people, for them it's the best way to make the world a safe place to live.
However, if the government is corrupt, this is what gives us trouble as they know us and they can monitor us.

I don't know if we can really have some privacy because our government is centralized, they on what they want to do to their people as long as it follows to the law they created.

Emergence power is really required these days to fight this crisis, and we should not complain about this as it fights for the greater good. Privacy is a valuable thing but this becomes nothing when you're dead.
As long as they are using the power to track and restore the normal situation it would be good, but if these exceeds to what we really need now then that might be the time that we should speak out.

Then what do you call to the social networking sites? do you also have privacy on those? are you sure about the terms and conditions you have checked during registration? lol. My point is it is better to keep of infos with the government to keep everyone on track of legal actions.

This has been practiced by many nations even prior to the COVID-19 pandemic. They have been monitoring us without our consent, and will be likely the norm in the future. Of course we don't want this, because as people we all do want to protect our privacy. But at this crisis? I think it will bring more good to us as it might help to contained those who are affected.

But somethings we complain are allowed in the constitution especially in a democratic country except if it is a country that is not democratic. These are ways of social control since people have given authority to the government to rule over them. Tracking devices have been around for long so it is not new.

I would argue that knowing your home along with your identity and traveling habits (which could still be determined even if you don't bring your phone all the time) could be quite dangerous. I would suggest you check out The Great Hack (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Hack) on Netflix; it demonstrates how seemingly irrelevant data could be weaponized. One more thing to consider is that while the data exists, it could be mishandled and/or stolen.


Anonymity would defeat the purpose of contact tracing, and while fair, I don't think it's a good idea for everyone to have the ability to track everyone else.

The pandemic made me rethink privacy issues as well. In my country, the measures are not that drastic yet (I mean people are advised to stay at home as much as possible but nobody tracks whether they actually do that), but it does have a negative impact on the spread of the disease as some people who are supposed to be on self-isolation because of being suspected or even having COVID-19 don't care and walk around freely. I am against human rights violations if it comes to censorship, abusing the usage of information that was taken from users under the pretense of protection or if violence is involved. However, if the data is truly used only to make sure that people who most definitely have to remain home don't do that, I now find it justified. Moreover, while a person can hold Bitcoin without any self-identification, one cannot really use it much without providing the ID one way or another.

Yikes....that's not where the problem lies at all.  The problem is governments having way too much power, and technology is facilitating them spying on their citizens more than at any other time in history, and this all does frighten me. 

I don't dance around my house with no clothes on and the shades up so everyone can see.  I like my privacy even if I'm not doing anything wrong, and I hate that governments have so much power to monitor what people are doing--they're always going to come up with a reason why it's necessary, but we're all going to suffer the effects eventually.

Emergency powers.  You have to love it when you can just level up and do whatever the fuck you want with the snap of a finger.  You better believe they're not going to want to give that up once the emergency passes.

They are using this situation to force people into submission.

I read about countries trying to get rid of cash, make people stay at home and fining them for going out, even if they're healthy, which is like curfew.

Some countries in Europe are also trying to give more power to their police so that they can jail you much easier, even if you're not doing anything wrong but going where they don't want you or if they suspect you might be sick.

I has to be done. There are just people who can't control themselves and walk out their doors and start playing basketball and betting and the likes. If they aren't going to be controlled, in few days these people are dead after spreading the corona to their kids. The goal is to stop corona virus from spreading, if they don't listen and sell the steetfood they cooked on the sidewalk the authorities might as well just shoot them before they can't infect others.

So you support the government giving itself more rights. Is there a limit to this? They already have the power to detain you, serch your house, seize your belongings, take over your bank account, fine you, you're already like a slave and still want them to be able to do more? I don't get it.

Next time a government will say there's a threat when there's realy no threat and force you to stay indoors thanks to all these new acts and agreements.

I value my privacy but this situation that we are currently facing is really alarming and the government needs to be on top of the game. Otherwise, many people will suffer and die. If you have nothing to hide, I guess you will agree with this kind of approach to tackle the situation efficiently and in faster way. If you are a good citizen, you will follow such protocol because it is for the benefit of the whole community. What Korea did is a systematic way to avoid wasted effort of finding those persons of interest. It will save tons of resources from the government's end.

Many people will wake up with this crisis, and at the end, centralized organisms will die, centralized controllers can't keep hurting people anymore, they already did a lot of damage in all different ways, It is time for the people to claim their privacy and power back! blockchain is one of those powerful tools in favor of humanity.

Let's admit it. Tracking have become a very helpful way of containing the virus because the government are able to easily find those people who had physical contact with each other as well as those who had contact with the same place of the infected person. I think that as soon as this crisis would end, the government would also stop this activity, because as we all know, people would want privacy as well as to protect their assests be it digitally or not. It will also backfire to them if there will be something like that.

It seems to me that today there are a lot of unfounded accusations or statements that should not be made at a particular time when there is a global problem due to coronavirus.  I completely agree with you that the actions that governments take are very effective in containing and fighting the virus.  besides, it is necessary first of all to think about, And who else, if not the government, will carry out this work.  in the face of existing problems, people themselves will not be able to organize themselves to overcome the coronavirus without state assistance.

There is a limit to it of course. But we really can't guarantee they'd not cross that fence. There is no such thing about bank secrecy and not allowing them to search my house and detain me for whatever reason. They can always do whatever they want if they really will do it we've seen it happen before.

IF they say there is a threat and they are all bringing troops with them, I'd believe I'm gonna be in trouble if I get out or probably I will run away from them.

Each person always has the opportunity to break their gadgets, throw away credit cards and get away from mass surveillance in the mountains / desert / under a different name of an inaccessible area, and live without using any means of such tracking. But as practice shows, for the most part, such fighters with the government are not able to do anything at all but write posts about surveillance on the Internet.

I think the solution to this is new internet, we all know that Data is the new oil and there is no way we can prevent government from wanting to control every aspect of our lives. 'People need to start accepting this as a norm because we are the one that sold ourselves cheap. When you use Google, Facebook and all these services free of charge, forgetting that there is no free food anyway, you pay with you data

@OP, my answer would be definitely not. I'd never want my children to be spied upon be it today or later some time for any reasons but I guess the global Government unity has got enough strength and power to stop us from even getting out of our doors during this pandemic. I truly understand the reasons behind stopping us through a lockdown and having us literally locked down in our homes and it also gave all of us an opportunity to spend some time with our family, but how many of us can remain home (without working if our jobs used to include a lot of manpower, kinda physical work) and let our family stay away from hunger? Even if you get out to buy grocery, you still get punished with a stick struck on your ass badly so to make you understand that we are all almost slaves of these Authorized Bodies which can control us any time they want, any way they want. I'd die rather than living my life that way if that's going to be the future of mine.

Agreed, it can be argued they were already doing it and the only thing that is changing now is that they are publicly admitting they can do it and that they will do it in order to curb the current crisis, but as some people have stated the problem begins when this crisis ends because governments always look for ways to keep those emergency powers and refuse to take a step back, we will have to see if after this crisis history repeats itself but I have very little doubt that will be the case.

Such a scenario is possible only if the coronavirus plunges the whole world into anarchy and kills 95% of the population. And even if this is so, the rest will not last long without centralized health care either. Therefore, you always need to remember the consequences before dreaming about something.

As much as I am not the type that likes the government looking into my business and I like staying private in some ways, I still have to admit that this might be a good strategy to trace those that have these infections by knowing who they came across and things like that.

The world is in a very bad situation with this pandemic, just look at how we are all living now; we are all now staying doors and no longer living the kind of life that we were used to living before, no going outside because of fear. So, I will always be in support of whatever it takes to stop this virus from going further, it has destroyed the lives of many already.

This is our last chance to guard our privacy within the COVID-19 crisis as there's no drug for the disease. that's why so as to stay our body healthy we'd like to take care of privacy and protect privacy Otherwise nobody are going to be shielded from the virus. the planet are going to be in additional crisis later.

Swiss blockchain startup launches privacy testnet to resist NSA-level surveillance
https://cryptoslate.com/swiss-blockchain-startup-launches-privacy-testnet-to-resist-nsa-level-surveillance/ (https://cryptoslate.com/swiss-blockchain-startup-launches-privacy-testnet-to-resist-nsa-level-surveillance/)

"Kushner’s team seeks national coronavirus surveillance system"

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/04/07/kushner-coronavirus-surveillance-174165

It dont really work when you leave that phone at home.  If you are infected you should stay at home and countries have inspectors to check that. You dont need any other surveillance tools while you already have them.

The learning start for really protecting your privacy.

Imagine that you have a job at a small Walmart store. One day when you come to work, the store manager calls everybody in to a meeting to inform them of new store policy. The new policy is that every WM associate must wear a gun, and must shoot at least 3 customers that day.

You have two choices:
1. Obey the store manager, and harm people;
2. Quit.

In the Nuremberg trials, where German Nazis were tried for war crimes, German commanders, etc., were found guilty of war crimes, even though they were under orders. In other words, commandants of concentration camps were found guilty of excessive force crimes, especially those that harmed or killed people without a real reason, and were executed for it.

In America with the Coronavirus threat, there doesn't seem to have been any court trial showing that CV is the threat that it is claimed to be. This means that all the media blab is hearsay. In fact, much info is coming out that shows anything from "official" numbers being blown way out of proportion, to the idea that the numbers are less than, say, 2017 and some other years.

The point is, police have no reason to enforce anything outside of what they normally enforce, except that they want to harm people in the same way the Nuremberg commandants were found guilty of.

How to protect from excessive force? All - 100% - of the police and other law enforcement officers out there are people - men/women. If any man/woman harms you or takes away your freedom for any non-reason at all, especially when their non-reason is hearsay, you have the right and duty to sue them and their bond (without which they can't act in government office at all).

But you have to know two things and use your head about these two things:
1. You must sue them. It won't happen automatically;
2. You must sue the man (not the police officer) for hindering you in your exercise of your life, just as you would sue your neighbor if he came over to your house and forced you to do anything.

The suit must involve monetary compensation for sure (his bond), and maybe prison time depending on the way he treated you.

If you haven't started, yet, one of the best places I know to start getting info about how to do it is right here - https://www.youtube.com/user/765736/videos. But you have to be a bit dedicated.

Understand that, because of our training in school, our mindset has been manipulated so that we don't understand what our rights really are, and where and how they are situated in life. Here is one of the best places to get a general idea, but it is over two hours long, and you will have to be committed to listening and thinking - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0GFK_5dQFk - or you might as well forget about freedom.

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