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Other => Off-topic => Topic started by: JollyGood on October 11, 2020, 09:18:00 PM



Title: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: JollyGood on October 11, 2020, 09:18:00 PM
https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/onesport/cps/800/cpsprodpb/ACF2/production/_114847244_goat_race_nadal_wins.png



FEDERER

NADAL

DJOKOVIC




Rafael Nadal won his 13th French Open today means he has 20 Grand Slam wins equalling Roger Federer. Both have 3 Grand Slams more than Djokovic.

Have your say here in this thread..




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Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Yaunfitda on October 11, 2020, 09:41:09 PM
Hard to say though we will be the GOAT amongst this three. But in so far as Grand Slams goes, Nadal can overtake Federer and then Djokovic will do the same in the next 2-3 years. In seems that Djokovic seems to be the fresher of the 3 so he has better chances of staying for the game more than Federer and Nadal. But Nadal could be consider as the best in clay surface, no doubt about it.

But if Djokovic bested the record and won the most Grand Slams then my vote goes to Novak Djokovic. Also in the total weeks as number 1 Djokovic is second behind only to Federer, but as I have said, he also has the potential to break that, he just needed like 40 weeks to stay in the number 1 spot. And he seems to be unreachable despite the lost to Nadal in French Open this year. He will remain as number 1 at the end of the year.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: tyKiwanuka on October 11, 2020, 10:39:31 PM
For me this would be Federer, but not because of any numbers. He just is the most talented one to ever walk on a tennis court. Watching him play, it felt so effortless what he was doing and he basically had no weaknesses and could do it all (forehand, one-handed backhand, net play, good/precise serve, effective slice) on any surface. His sheer numbers are surely a bit inflated, because he was in a league of his own until Nadal was more competitive on hard/grass and Djokovic showed up on the Tour - the era when Fed started to peak was rather weak looking back (Roddick, Hewitt, Safin, Nalbandian, Davydenko etc.). But you won't find a player as gifted and elegant on court as him.

Nadal and Djokovic are more the working class, though they have lots of talent of course ;) They are physically stronger, but this is not about talent, it can be learned/trained. I think Djokovic actually has tremendous numbers, because he had to deal with Nadal/Federer throughout his whole career and only in the last 2-3 years those two were fading a bit. But his style of play is not what I consider goat-ish, same goes for Nadal apart from clay.
And personality-wise Federer is above them as well, because he is such a likeable guy, well spoken and always a gentleman. Nadal is a very nice person, but kind of shy of course. Djokovic is just very fake imo and an attention whore.

My personal GOAT is Fernando Gonzalez though ;D


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: rhomelmabini on October 11, 2020, 11:02:37 PM
Not that a fan of Lawn Tennis sport but my cousin was and all I could ever hear on her was she loves watching Rafael Nadal playing on the court not that she has a liking on him but of course the way the guy plays the game. As we grow this goes on my mind that this guy (Nadal) was the best in his league. This wasn't just my opinion at all but most likely just a bandwagon onto what my cousin use to tell me. To be honest, I watch some of his games and I think he has the talent to be the GOAT.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: JollyGood on October 13, 2020, 09:47:08 AM
It will be tough to decide but I think it will be between Federer and Nadal having said I think the winner of most Grand Slams is not necessarily the final benchmark. Even if Nadal finishes his career with more Grand Slams than Federer he will not be able to overtake his weeks at number one record or beat the 100+ titles that Federer has won.

Federer has 103 ATP titles whereas Connors has 109, it is safe to say that Federer will return to beat that and retire on or after winning 110 and if he does not Nadal will never catch him because he has just 86.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: swogerino on October 13, 2020, 11:09:33 AM
I am undecided between Nadal and Federer but I am going for Nadal as lately he won the most prestigious title of red sand fields the Roland Garros tournament.Federer is great too but during the years I think he has not been as constant as Nadal and that is why I choose Nadal as the greatest of all time until now.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: btc_angela on October 13, 2020, 11:30:51 AM
I am undecided between Nadal and Federer but I am going for Nadal as lately he won the most prestigious title of red sand fields the Roland Garros tournament.Federer is great too but during the years I think he has not been as constant as Nadal and that is why I choose Nadal as the greatest of all time until now.

What do you mean not consistent? Federer has been and that's why Nadal and Djokovic is chasing him. One of his weakness though is clay, which is Nadal strength. But it's hard to really gauge at this point who is the greatest amongst the three, there are so many factors that needs to look at, specially how dominant they were during their prime years, who has been in the number one position for many years, the opposition they face.

And I agree with @tyKiwanuka about the personality of Roger and Rafa as more likeable, as compare to Djokovic which is someone consider the 'villain' amongst them. So I will be biased and say that Roger to me and then Rafa.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: casperBGD on October 13, 2020, 11:35:10 AM
i would say Federer, it is not due to numbers, it is that his play is tennis at what it is, elegant and attacking play
Nadal and Djokovic are a bit defending players, where more running is doing the job, and it is maybe interesting to watch, but not as elegant, as tennis should be

when watching Federer, especially on the clay, you can see that he is not trying to catch all the points, where he should do more running than what a gentleman do, it is what a tennis in the first place should be, you made a bad move, and opponent shot was good enough to punish that, go on and play another one, and not chasing the ball, fight it back without watching, and trying to prolong the point on all matters

saying this, i am a fan of Nadal, so to speak, would like him to crash Federer numbers, but do not think that this would put him at GOAT position, in the eyes of tennis audience


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: tsaroz on October 13, 2020, 12:02:12 PM
These three are legends themselves. I'd consider Federer and Djokovic to be the legends of their time as Nadal is always in shadow of either Federer or Djokovic. Federer was once an unbeaten player until the younger Djokovic beat him. It's a surprise how long Federer is playing and competing with youngsters. It's about time for Federer to retire while Djokovic rule for some more years. Nadal would always be the king of clay.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: 7788bitcoin on October 13, 2020, 07:51:39 PM
Federer was once an unbeaten player until the younger Djokovic beat him. It's a surprise how long Federer is playing and competing with youngsters. It's about time for Federer to retire while Djokovic rule for some more years. Nadal would always be the king of clay.
As a fan this is the best time for sports fans as three legendary players competing against each other for over a decade which is unprecedented in the history of Tennis and we just cherish their skills and the best person win the tournament, if not for their competition we would not see such odds and any upset against them is a very huge thing as the odds will be really huge for the underdog and any other opponent facing these three legendary players will be a huge underdog.

Personally i am a huge fan of Federer and in clay there is no one in history better than Nadal and Djokovic on his day is unbeatable.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Findingnemo on October 13, 2020, 08:56:02 PM
I am not really a fan of Tennis but I watched some videos the internet, Djokovic is still at the top compared to the other two players in terms of player's ratings. on the list from http://www.espn.com/sports/tennis/rankings

Even though he only has 17 grand slam titles and 83 career titles he made it in less time span among other current players so he could be the great player in my opinion.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Johnyz on October 13, 2020, 10:01:58 PM
They are all good players but only one who are lucky enough will win the title. They beat each other before but for this one I’ll go for Djokovic here despite of being on a lower position. They all have the skills its really hard to place your bet so choose wisely, though I’m not a big fan of tennis I still see this sport as exciting.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Strongkored on October 14, 2020, 06:03:56 AM
Roger Federer is attractive player and he's the type of player who not only waits for the ball at the baseline when he is in front of the net makes the game interesting as well as his backhand one-handed and currently many players do it with two-handed including Nadal and Djokovic.
It is difficult to choose who is G.O.A.T among them, they have their own records, Nadal is still very likely to surpass Federer's achievements as well as Djokovic, they become legends and an inspiration to many young players.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: leea-1334 on October 14, 2020, 07:44:22 AM
Djokovic is ok and I bet he will overtake the other two in time but somehow in my mind it is always Federer,,, like ty I think Djokovic recent actions in trying to split tennis has hurt his reputation at least for people like me who never understood why he is trying to do that. Whereas Federer and Nadal to me are just always about the sport itself. Thoughts?


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: jostorres on October 14, 2020, 08:41:00 AM
These three are legends themselves. I'd consider Federer and Djokovic to be the legends of their time as Nadal is always in shadow of either Federer or Djokovic. Federer was once an unbeaten player until the younger Djokovic beat him. It's a surprise how long Federer is playing and competing with youngsters. It's about time for Federer to retire while Djokovic rule for some more years. Nadal would always be the king of clay.
I think the most hard working player of the three is actually Rafa Nadal and you can see while Federer is flashy and Novak is more like a machine in work but the guy who works hard for his points and doesn't feel like he is naturally as talented as Novak or Federer. It is similar to how I love Ronaldo over Messi not because Messi is inferior but because Messi is god gifted while Ronaldo is a product of hard work an made in gym.

Love how guys are sharing their opinion and also depends which phase of the career of the three plays we have watched the most because I have been watching fed express since childhood and I might be his biggest fan but that said we cannot den that Rafa works the hardest among these three and steals my vote this time.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Daniel91 on October 14, 2020, 08:59:54 AM
These three are legends themselves. I'd consider Federer and Djokovic to be the legends of their time as Nadal is always in shadow of either Federer or Djokovic. Federer was once an unbeaten player until the younger Djokovic beat him. It's a surprise how long Federer is playing and competing with youngsters. It's about time for Federer to retire while Djokovic rule for some more years. Nadal would always be the king of clay.
I think the most hard working player of the three is actually Rafa Nadal and you can see while Federer is flashy and Novak is more like a machine in work but the guy who works hard for his points and doesn't feel like he is naturally as talented as Novak or Federer. It is similar to how I love Ronaldo over Messi not because Messi is inferior but because Messi is god gifted while Ronaldo is a product of hard work an made in gym.

Love how guys are sharing their opinion and also depends which phase of the career of the three plays we have watched the most because I have been watching fed express since childhood and I might be his biggest fan but that said we cannot den that Rafa works the hardest among these three and steals my vote this time.

I think that before answering the question of who was the greatest tennis player of all time, we should first determine the criteria for that selection.
Will we just look at the number of GS wins, or all the tournaments won, or the win-loss ratio in a career etc.
I would like to remind you that in the past GS were not as important as they are today and that probably the greatest tennis champion of the "old age", Rod Laver, did not play them all and thus missed the opportunity to win many more GS, probably more than 20.
And what about Bjorn Borg who interrupted his entire career at a time when he was the best and when he could have won a lot more tournaments, including GS?
Do you think we really should only look at GS and ignore all the other circumstances in choosing GOAT?
I think it is impossible to compare different tennis eras and that we can only choose the best tennis player of this age.
Personally, I think that the final decision on that will be made by Nadal and Djokovic in their mutual duels in the coming years.



Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Cnut237 on October 14, 2020, 10:13:52 AM
It is of course difficult and a highly subjective decision on which there is unlikely to be a consensus. For me, we have to break it down, which simplifies the question.

Nadal is the GOAT on a clay court. I don't think there can be any serious objection to that.

But who is the GOAT across all surfaces? It can't be Nadal, he just hasn't won enough of the other grand slams - his superiority on clay masks the fact that he's not quite up to the standards of the other two on other surfaces.

So Federer 20 vs Djokovic 17. I'd say Federer edges it.


I think it is impossible to compare different tennis eras
This is a valid point, which is often brought up in GOAT discussions. I would argue though that whilst we can't compare talent very easily, we can certainly say that due to improved diet, fitness, strength, speed, and with highly qualified support staff... modern players can get more out of their talent than could players in the past. So their standard of play in general is better.


~

Incidentally, tennis balls are a great way to protect yourself from goat attacks.
https://benstennistips.files.wordpress.com/2018/11/always-use-protection-when-youre-horny-goat-with-tennis-balls-on-horns5.jpg


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Porfirii on October 14, 2020, 10:23:24 AM
Three are the top, but to me, Nadal will be considered the greatest. No one has a crystal ball but it's just my hunch...

Trying to be logic here and not subjective, I would say that IMO he is the most humble of the three and therefore he may try to better himself harder. I've been following him since he was a child.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: babygun on October 14, 2020, 10:28:19 AM
For me there is no doubt that Federer is the GOAT. He has the most natural talent of them all. It would even make no difference if Nadal or Djokovic would win more grand slams than Federer.

I hope that Federer would be able to win 1 or more grandslams. Even though he is 39 years old, he is still able to compete at the highest level. After 2012, some people were saying that he would never win a grand slam anymore, but the proved them wrong!


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: notblox1 on October 14, 2020, 05:04:37 PM
Good question.
Let's look how old each of them are and who has more chances to play tennis longer if we don't count any potential injuries:

Roger Federer
8 August 1981 (age 39)

Rafael Nadal
3 June 1986 (age 34)

Novak Djokovic
22 May 1987 (age 33)

Federer is the oldest guy here and most likely he will end his tennis carrier first, and if we look at ATP rankings and points he is 4th in the list with lot less points than top 3 players.
My bet for GOAT would be for Djokovic or Nadal because they have years to catch up and make new records.

Djokovic is better h2h with Federer (23 vs 27) (https://www.atptour.com/en/players/atp-head-2-head/roger-federer-vs-novak-djokovic/F324/D643)
Djokovic is also better h2h with Nadal  (29 vs 27) (https://www.atptour.com/en/players/atp-head-2-head/novak-djokovic-vs-rafael-nadal/D643/N409)
And Nadal is much better than Federer in h2h (24 vs 16) (https://www.atptour.com/en/players/atp-head-2-head/rafael-nadal-vs-roger-federer/N409/F324)

This just confirms that Federer can not be GOAT and it will be decided with Nadal or Djokovic.
Depending on what ground they play Nadal can be better like shown in last match when he destroyed Djokovic 3:0, but remember that Djokovic is still better h2h  :)

https://i.imgur.com/UuT0IT6.png
https://www.atptour.com/en/rankings


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: JollyGood on October 14, 2020, 09:02:57 PM
Some excellent posts being made while discussing the question I asked. Keep the posts and views coming in.

For me the answer is clear: Federer is in a league of his own followed by Nadal in second place and Djokovic is third.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: coinlocket$ on October 14, 2020, 09:33:26 PM
Djokovic will probably end with more titles since Roger and Rafa are near the end of their career but he will not will be the goat, he will be the one with the most wins probably and we cannot say "He has more wins he is the best in the history"

Imho the GOAT is Roger even if I liked more Nadal and yes Nadal could be already over Roger if he hasn't so many problems with his injuries.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Cnut237 on October 15, 2020, 11:19:45 AM
For me the answer is clear: Federer is in a league of his own followed by Nadal in second place and Djokovic is third.

I do think Federer is the greatest, and as others have said this can't be determined purely on number of grand slam wins.

But Nadal is certainly greatest on clay... so if we are talking about greatest overall tennis player, it can't be Nadal because his record on other surfaces doesn't match Federer or Djokovic.

We need to make the clay/all surfaces distinction... because even if Federer is the greatest overall tennis player, he still wouldn't be favourite against Nadal on clay.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: casperBGD on October 15, 2020, 01:22:34 PM
For me the answer is clear: Federer is in a league of his own followed by Nadal in second place and Djokovic is third.

I do think Federer is the greatest, and as others have said this can't be determined purely on number of grand slam wins.

But Nadal is certainly greatest on clay... so if we are talking about greatest overall tennis player, it can't be Nadal because his record on other surfaces doesn't match Federer or Djokovic.

We need to make the clay/all surfaces distinction... because even if Federer is the greatest overall tennis player, he still wouldn't be favourite against Nadal on clay.

yeah, Nadal is a king of clay, and Roland Garros, but regarding other tournaments, it is much more closer situation

clay - RG
Nadal has 13 titles, first behind is Borg with 6 titles, and no other player has more than 3 - pretty clear and well known situation

grass - Wimbledon
Roger has 8 titles, but Sampras is close with 7 and Djokovic could even catch him with 5 titles at the moment - Roger so far, but never know, Djokovic could end up with more titles at the end

hard - AO
Djokovic is the best with 8 titles so far, Federer has 6, and behind them is Agassi with 4 - seems that Djokovic will be best on AO for a while

so each of the three has the tournament where he is the best at the moment

hard - US open
Federer has 5 titles, as well as Sampras and Connors, but what is interesting that "king of clay" has 4 titles in New York, one more than Djokovic, who has only 3

so, US open could make a difference, who finish the best there will have two tournaments where he is the best one :), and that could be a decision maker on this one


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: JollyGood on October 15, 2020, 02:13:46 PM
I absolutely agree with you. Nadal is the greatest clay court tennis player. Borg was considered the greatest clay court player but he walked away from the game at his peak with 6 back to back after French Open wins, 5 Wimbledon wins and 4 US Open losses. Since Nadal has had longevity and more titles on clay it stands to reason why he is the greatest clay court player.

Overall though, his record cannot take him above Federer when all events are taken in to consideration especially the number of titles won.


For me the answer is clear: Federer is in a league of his own followed by Nadal in second place and Djokovic is third.

I do think Federer is the greatest, and as others have said this can't be determined purely on number of grand slam wins.

But Nadal is certainly greatest on clay... so if we are talking about greatest overall tennis player, it can't be Nadal because his record on other surfaces doesn't match Federer or Djokovic.

We need to make the clay/all surfaces distinction... because even if Federer is the greatest overall tennis player, he still wouldn't be favourite against Nadal on clay.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: fiulpro on October 15, 2020, 05:02:01 PM
I do think that age would actually be considerably very important but then again all the players are experienced here.

I personally believe that : Djokovic would eventually beat them up to the top but then again if we look at the stats , it is going to take a while.
For me the answer is clear: Federer is in a league of his own followed by Nadal in second place and Djokovic is third.

I do think Federer is the greatest, and as others have said this can't be determined purely on number of grand slam wins.

But Nadal is certainly greatest on clay... so if we are talking about greatest overall tennis player, it can't be Nadal because his record on other surfaces doesn't match Federer or Djokovic.

We need to make the clay/all surfaces distinction... because even if Federer is the greatest overall tennis player, he still wouldn't be favourite against Nadal on clay.
Exactly
We have to analyze everything here , even for the future I believe Djokovic would be able to beat them eventually. Plus at the same time right now a statement was made how he was under the pressure of his coach so he wasn't able to do well.
Mental health plays a great role too here.

Apparently people are so set on Rafael because of his experience and scores.

https://tennishead.net/novak-djokovic-is-younger-but-i-am-going-with-rafael-nadal-says-top-twenty-star/ (https://tennishead.net/novak-djokovic-is-younger-but-i-am-going-with-rafael-nadal-says-top-twenty-star/) they are all set on Djokovic getting out of the rounds soon , but who know ? Maybe he can turn things around.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: JollyGood on October 18, 2020, 07:31:21 PM
Right now though all three of them are playing and there are many scenarios about what could happen. As unlikely as it might seem what cannot be denied is the possibility none of them will ever win another Grand Slam again and the younger players step up just as Thiem and Zverev did in the US Open. We have to wait to see what happens at the next Grand Slam which is the Australian Open, it will go ahead if there are changes to governmental quarantine procedures.

There is a long way to go before this GOAT might be settled  ;D


For me the answer is clear: Federer is in a league of his own followed by Nadal in second place and Djokovic is third.

I do think Federer is the greatest, and as others have said this can't be determined purely on number of grand slam wins.

But Nadal is certainly greatest on clay... so if we are talking about greatest overall tennis player, it can't be Nadal because his record on other surfaces doesn't match Federer or Djokovic.

We need to make the clay/all surfaces distinction... because even if Federer is the greatest overall tennis player, he still wouldn't be favourite against Nadal on clay.

yeah, Nadal is a king of clay, and Roland Garros, but regarding other tournaments, it is much more closer situation

clay - RG
Nadal has 13 titles, first behind is Borg with 6 titles, and no other player has more than 3 - pretty clear and well known situation

grass - Wimbledon
Roger has 8 titles, but Sampras is close with 7 and Djokovic could even catch him with 5 titles at the moment - Roger so far, but never know, Djokovic could end up with more titles at the end

hard - AO
Djokovic is the best with 8 titles so far, Federer has 6, and behind them is Agassi with 4 - seems that Djokovic will be best on AO for a while

so each of the three has the tournament where he is the best at the moment

hard - US open
Federer has 5 titles, as well as Sampras and Connors, but what is interesting that "king of clay" has 4 titles in New York, one more than Djokovic, who has only 3

so, US open could make a difference, who finish the best there will have two tournaments where he is the best one :), and that could be a decision maker on this one



Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Assface16678 on October 19, 2020, 06:12:38 AM
Not really a follower of this sport but I do see and heard these names most of the time when I am reading sports-related article. I made a few readings about these three and Roger Federer is more often being compared to Jordan in this sport. Supporting this claim are his titles, likewise with Djokovic and Nadal. But this is how legacy works, Federer left a deeper marks to the fans of tennis among the three. But given these are subjective opinions, and there's no actual basis, there will be biases for sure. All I know is that these three legends are having their own marks to this sport in particular.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: imstillthebest on October 19, 2020, 06:55:58 AM
Not really a follower of this sport but I do see and heard these names most of the time when I am reading sports-related article.

your not a fan of this sport but you like reading sport article , that shows that your into other sports ? i dont read sport article and im not really onto sports but i dont know why im familiar to the name nadal or rafael nadal  .

 the guy wont be famous if he isnt playing good so im rooting for this guy more than the two which im not also familliar with  . the two wont be compare by nadal if these two arent good .

 match will still be unpredictable but this can be one of the greatest battle of all time if three legends are going to head to head for each other  .


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: ampere on October 19, 2020, 07:45:43 AM
For some reason this has always been a fiercely debated question because to a large extent I like Federer. Federer mastered grass competition and also won on clay, but Nadal has won on clay and grass at an immense ease to such an extent that Nadal is always called the king of clay.

Djokovic to be honest is unlucky to have played in this Era, most finals he has lost has been to Nadal or Federer for almost a decade now. I think in my own opinion that only Nadal and Federer are the G. O. A. T, While Federer is a world class tennis player


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: JollyGood on October 19, 2020, 03:51:16 PM
Total votes so far: 9

Federer: 3

Nadal: 4

Djokovic: 2


Just 9 votes have been cast, surely there are more coming soon ?


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: TheGreatPython on October 19, 2020, 08:38:16 PM
There might be different opinion as people who like Grass play will always vote for Federer because there has been no better player than Federer on grass but some who fancy clay court long rallies will prefer Nadal because Nadal at clay is more like crocodile in the water and it is literally impossible to beat that guy on his surface. Then there are people who like Djokovic because of his hard court plays and also the ability to maintain good level on other two surfaces.

I would always vote for Nadal because he is just too good and the way he made Djokovic actually look like a joke was just amazing and please I respect Djokovic a lot but that match was really something else and Djokovic was really not injured or anything but just got outclassed on CLAY.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: posi on October 19, 2020, 09:31:08 PM
For some reason this has always been a fiercely debated question because to a large extent I like Federer. Federer mastered grass competition and also won on clay, but Nadal has won on clay and grass at an immense ease to such an extent that Nadal is always called the king of clay.

Djokovic to be honest is unlucky to have played in this Era, most finals he has lost has been to Nadal or Federer for almost a decade now. I think in my own opinion that only Nadal and Federer are the G. O. A. T, While Federer is a world class tennis player
I love all the 3 players listed but I consider Djokovic not fit for this category and it not because he unlucky as you said but due to his health status which affect him lately especially during the as French open final. However, it was reported that the more he play increase his condition.
I consider Nadal the greatest of the three but I read that he and Federer are more focus on the tournament ahead cause they still a long way to go.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Emitdama on October 21, 2020, 08:07:21 AM
I am not really a fan of Tennis but I watched some videos the internet, Djokovic is still at the top compared to the other two players in terms of player's ratings. on the list from http://www.espn.com/sports/tennis/rankings

Even though he only has 17 grand slam titles and 83 career titles he made it in less time span among other current players so he could be the great player in my opinion.
For sure and Djokovic gaining so much success in such a short span of time is also the reason of unwanted hate he gets sometimes and I have never remembered a tennis match between Djokovic and Roger where the crowd was cheering for Djokovic while Roger is the all time favorite in any match so this makes me feel like Djokovic gets less respect than what he deserves. Similarly when a match is played between Djokovic and Nadal there is no doubt who's the favorite.

I also like that Djokovic plays all three surfaces tournaments while Federer skipped the French open and even US open recently which is not something you will ever see Djokovic doing at all so that makes him the GOAT in my opinion.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: okala on October 21, 2020, 08:22:43 AM
https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/onesport/cps/800/cpsprodpb/ACF2/production/_114847244_goat_race_nadal_wins.png



FEDERER

NADAL

DJOKOVIC




Rafael Nadal won his 13th French Open today means he has 20 Grand Slam wins equalling Roger Federer. Both have 3 Grand Slams more than Djokovic.

Have your say here in this thread..




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I will go for federe 3 at any time and as a world champion the other two are always running after just to make the mark in the tennis championship which will end up and as waisted efforts at the long run because federe is well prepared for the league.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: JollyGood on November 02, 2020, 11:52:09 PM

Total votes so far: 13


Federer: 4

Nadal: 5

Djokovic: 4



This is very tight, the members who voted have so far been unable to select a winner that stands well above the other two. This debate will go on for a long time, many years after all three retire...


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: JollyGood on November 09, 2020, 09:07:46 PM
This thread deserves a bump


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Bekuciwu9 on November 09, 2020, 09:23:59 PM
For me this would be Federer, but not because of any numbers. He just is the most talented one to ever walk on a tennis court. Watching him play, it felt so effortless what he was doing and he basically had no weaknesses and could do it all (forehand, one-handed backhand, net play, good/precise serve, effective slice) on any surface. His sheer numbers are surely a bit inflated, because he was in a league of his own until Nadal was more competitive on hard/grass and Djokovic showed up on the Tour - the era when Fed started to peak was rather weak looking back (Roddick, Hewitt, Safin, Nalbandian, Davydenko etc.).

When you think about it, numbers of all 3 of them are a little bit inflated compare to some previous generations due fact that there is no big difference as before in terms of surfaces. Back in the 80s and 90s it was a huge difference to play on grass or let's say hard surface.They slowered some of them, like grass and by doing that it was possible for even Nadal to win Wimbledon.


Djokovic is just very fake imo and an attention whore.

Djokovic is trying too hard to be liked, and that never works. He just doesn't have charisma, and you can't learn that,either you have it or not.But its also true that when you looks he leads in head to head vs both Nadal and Fererer,and that could also be argument for some that he is GOAT.

Regarding the question, even if Djokovic or Nadal surpass Federer in terms of grand slam wins, for me he will stay the GOAT. But my favorite player is Pete Sampras, i loved rivalry between him and Agassi.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: examplens on November 09, 2020, 10:45:38 PM
OP, I am not sure why is important how much quarterfinals the played. Completely irrelevant.
It seems this pool also has doubt. completely equalized

https://i.ibb.co/r0H41tZ/image.png (https://imgbb.com/)

all three are excellent and they definitely took tennis as a game to another level. it is most clearly seen in the fact that for years now, none of the others has been able to follow them.
But a few facts. Federer (I like his style), most of his winnings is from the time when both Novak and Nadal are so young, and they were not serious competition for him. He also has a negative relationship with indirect encounters with both of them. Novak is positive here, they had more wins in matches against Rodger and Nadal.
Nadal is so dominating on RG, but that's it. it may be tough to say but on that side, it is a bit limited if we compare it with Rodger and Novak.
Djokovic has a positive score against them, he wins all possible tournaments except OI I think.

Djokovic is just very fake imo and an attention whore.

Djokovic is trying too hard to be liked, and that never works. He just doesn't have charisma, and you can't learn that,either you have it or not.But its also true that when you looks he leads in head to head vs both Nadal and Fererer,and that could also be argument for some that he is GOAT.

I am not sure to do you recognize the word charisma when we talking about these three players. I hope you don't think that Rafa's preparation for the serve has anything with charisma or anything, to me it’s more disgusting to watch.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: JollyGood on November 10, 2020, 10:12:56 AM
OP, I am not sure why is important how much quarterfinals the played. Completely irrelevant.
It seems this pool also has doubt. completely equalized
It is just a statistic because at Grand Slams it also something that people factor in because it is the only tennis tournament that has a winner based on the first to win three sets (best of 5 sets).

In fact Federer reached a record 36 consecutive Grand Slam quarter-finals between 2004 Wimbledon and 2013 Roland Garros. That is a record unmatched and will probably never be broken.

Also Federer has won an a record 20 Grand Slam singles titles (joint with Nadal) and a record 31 Grand Slam finals (10 consecutive, and another 8 consecutive – the two longest streaks in history), 46 semi-finals and 57 quarter-final appearances and with them being the best of 3 sets they are always going to be factored in and really classed as irrelevant.


Djokovic is just very fake imo and an attention whore.

Djokovic is trying too hard to be liked, and that never works. He just doesn't have charisma, and you can't learn that,either you have it or not.But its also true that when you looks he leads in head to head vs both Nadal and Fererer,and that could also be argument for some that he is GOAT.

I am not sure to do you recognize the word charisma when we talking about these three players. I hope you don't think that Rafa's preparation for the serve has anything with charisma or anything, to me it’s more disgusting to watch.
The serving and serve receiving preparation that Nadal employs is really baffling. Why on earth would somebody be so superstitious that they feel they have to tug at their underwear and then wipe the same fingers on their nose and then tuck some hair from the outside of their ears to the inside or having short hair feel the need to touch their ears?

Strange


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Cnut237 on November 10, 2020, 01:27:20 PM
The serving and serve receiving preparation that Nadal employs is really baffling. Why on earth would somebody be so superstitious
A lot of sports people do have these superstitions. I think it's all about establishing confidence and a feeling that you are in control. Imagine entering a high pressure contest against a player or team of similar ability to yourself. You are a great player, but so is your opponent. You can influence the outcome of the match, but you can't control it by yourself, because your opponent has a say as well. Superstitions of the 'if I do x then y' variety can help to establish confidence by creating a mental environment in which you have control.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: codegnome on November 10, 2020, 01:43:31 PM
It can vary a lot. You should really just include the statistics, because they don't lie. Still, I think many people also have certain sentimental memories. Who cares if someone has won 140 titles or 139?
Then you cannot say player A is better because he has played more tournaments. You should look at the level of difficulty, so also look against who played which opponent, on which surface, how many sets he has lost.
There are many interesting statistics to unleash. And even then you cannot come to a winner. I think that with feeling Federer has won the most hearts in the tennis world.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Bekuciwu9 on November 10, 2020, 04:24:51 PM
The serving and serve receiving preparation that Nadal employs is really baffling. Why on earth would somebody be so superstitious that they feel they have to tug at their underwear and then wipe the same fingers on their nose and then tuck some hair from the outside of their ears to the inside or having short hair feel the need to touch their ears?

Strange

This is common thing among famous athletes, most of them have weird superstitions. Observe tennis players and you will see that they often have some weird ceremony before serve. Very common is also that they dont step on any lines. Serena Willaism doesnt change socks between matched, she always uses same ones, Federer always have 8 racquets and uses 8 bottles of water, Jordan wore same shorts under his main one from 1982 up until end of his career.

I forgot to vote, now just did and voted for Federer. My opinion is that even if  if Nadal and Djokovic both win more grand slam titles, that wont change who majority people consider to be greatest of all time.



Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: examplens on November 10, 2020, 09:40:54 PM
It is just a statistic because at Grand Slams it also something that people factor in because it is the only tennis tournament that has a winner based on the first to win three sets (best of 5 sets).

In fact Federer reached a record 36 consecutive Grand Slam quarter-finals between 2004 Wimbledon and 2013 Roland Garros. That is a record unmatched and will probably never be broken.

Also Federer has won an a record 20 Grand Slam singles titles (joint with Nadal) and a record 31 Grand Slam finals (10 consecutive, and another 8 consecutive – the two longest streaks in history), 46 semi-finals and 57 quarter-final appearances and with them being the best of 3 sets they are always going to be factored in and really classed as irrelevant.

but that means he had a lot of lost matches. the fact that someone has the highest number of lost finals can't help them to be promoted as greatest of all time. Rodger is older than Novak and Rafa, so he played a little bit more Grand Slam tournaments, it is not insignificant facts.
Of course, it can be ignored his constantly high level of quality for years. Plus little luck with injuries, I can't remember when Rodger had a long break due to injury.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Twinkledoe on November 10, 2020, 09:53:42 PM
The serving and serve receiving preparation that Nadal employs is really baffling. Why on earth would somebody be so superstitious that they feel they have to tug at their underwear and then wipe the same fingers on their nose and then tuck some hair from the outside of their ears to the inside or having short hair feel the need to touch their ears?

Strange

This is common thing among famous athletes, most of them have weird superstitions. Observe tennis players and you will see that they often have some weird ceremony before serve. Very common is also that they dont step on any lines. Serena Willaism doesnt change socks between matched, she always uses same ones, Federer always have 8 racquets and uses 8 bottles of water, Jordan wore same shorts under his main one from 1982 up until end of his career.

I forgot to vote, now just did and voted for Federer. My opinion is that even if  if Nadal and Djokovic both win more grand slam titles, that wont change who majority people consider to be greatest of all time.


Voted for Federer also. And at the moment, he has the highest votes here. But wonder, only few votes in the poll. Or maybe, some of them have no preference who's the greatest. But these 3 names really got their huge fan-based around the globe.

And talking about superstitions, I guess that's normal for athletes. They believe in particular ritual that they need to do in order to win their game or just be comfortable with their game.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: JollyGood on November 10, 2020, 10:08:18 PM
The only two serious injuries I can recall are when he hurt his back in a Wimbledon semi-final against Raonic and that was when Murray went on to win the tournament - back in 2016. He had an operation on his knee and then returned to action but skipped several tournaments to recover until Wimbledon but he already had back surgery by then.

During the same period Nadal was suffering from an injury, both players were injured and not playing tennis while they recovered from injuries but met up for the launch of the Nadal Tennis Academy in Spain just months before the 2017 Australian Open and neither would have believed that the two of them would be in the final. I think that 5 set final in the Australian Grand Slam 2017 that Federer won was one of the most exciting tennis matches I ever saw. That fifth set that Nadal was leading 3-1 in the final set but had his serve broken twice by Federer and when he won Federer became the first man to win at least five singles titles at three different Grand Slam tournaments.

That was an absolutely classic match in the Australian Open final in 2017 that was played at the highest level - well worth a watch. Here is a link to final 5 games with Federer losing 3-1 at one stage but coming back to win 5 straight games and becoming champion: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmpLSW47MPQ

You are right though, apart from that period in 2016 and also early this year Federer has been almost free from injury throughout his career, probably thanks to a genetic make-up from sports playing parents. Nadal has been suffering from foot and knee issues all his professional career and Djokovic has had elbow and other issues too.


It is just a statistic because at Grand Slams it also something that people factor in because it is the only tennis tournament that has a winner based on the first to win three sets (best of 5 sets).

In fact Federer reached a record 36 consecutive Grand Slam quarter-finals between 2004 Wimbledon and 2013 Roland Garros. That is a record unmatched and will probably never be broken.

Also Federer has won an a record 20 Grand Slam singles titles (joint with Nadal) and a record 31 Grand Slam finals (10 consecutive, and another 8 consecutive – the two longest streaks in history), 46 semi-finals and 57 quarter-final appearances and with them being the best of 3 sets they are always going to be factored in and really classed as irrelevant.

but that means he had a lot of lost matches. the fact that someone has the highest number of lost finals can't help them to be promoted as greatest of all time. Rodger is older than Novak and Rafa, so he played a little bit more Grand Slam tournaments, it is not insignificant facts.
Of course, it can be ignored his constantly high level of quality for years. Plus little luck with injuries, I can't remember when Rodger had a long break due to injury.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: SaShiRaJaVu on November 10, 2020, 11:07:35 PM
but that means he had a lot of lost matches. the fact that someone has the highest number of lost finals can't help them to be promoted as greatest of all time. Rodger is older than Novak and Rafa, so he played a little bit more Grand Slam tournaments, it is not insignificant facts.
Of course, it can be ignored his constantly high level of quality for years. Plus little luck with injuries, I can't remember when Rodger had a long break due to injury.
The consistency to play at the highest level for a very long period of time alone will make Roger Federer the greatest of all time, the tricks and the skill level and the style of play is far superior than anyone else and these three players dominated tennis for over a decade and my favorite player is always Roger Federer but legacy wise these three are far ahead of the pack and probably the best players who ever played the game.

Becoming injury free is not just luck, it is hard work, determination and taking care of the body and Roger Federer excels in that department.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Bekuciwu9 on November 11, 2020, 08:59:06 AM

Becoming injury free is not just luck, it is hard work, determination and taking care of the body and Roger Federer excels in that department.

That is true, if you take care of your body, you have better chances of be injury free. But sometiems some players simply have bad luck and are prone to injuries, and that is part of the sport.Many good talents are ruined because they didnt have luck with injuries,that is how it goes.

About Djokovic,i think that vegan diet didnt help him at all.Then he also had some type of guru with him that i think also messed up with him a bit.Alternative lifestyle is not good for pro athletes i think,and if he didnt go that way he would dominate even more.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: JollyGood on November 11, 2020, 10:54:44 PM
Superstitions are rife in sportsmen and sportswomen around the world but Nadal seriously takes it to a whole new level, I mean every serve he is about to receive and every time he serves and let us not forget putting plastic water bottles down near his chair facing a certain direction and making his way to his seat after winning or losing games walking across certain court lines and so on... it is really excessive but if works for him then why not I suppose.

Like you I also voted for Federer, I have never ever seen a complete tennis player but have to say the closest to perfection in my opinion has to be Federer. He is a great player on the court and a great ambassador for tennis and charitable causes off the court. I know Nadal and Djokovic also have charitable causes they support their own foundations like Federer but on court in my opinion Federer overall is the best of these three, Nadal is second and Djokovic third.


Voted for Federer also. And at the moment, he has the highest votes here. But wonder, only few votes in the poll. Or maybe, some of them have no preference who's the greatest. But these 3 names really got their huge fan-based around the globe.

And talking about superstitions, I guess that's normal for athletes. They believe in particular ritual that they need to do in order to win their game or just be comfortable with their game.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: AliMan on November 11, 2020, 11:10:35 PM

Becoming injury free is not just luck, it is hard work, determination and taking care of the body and Roger Federer excels in that department.

That is true, if you take care of your body, you have better chances of be injury free. But sometiems some players simply have bad luck and are prone to injuries, and that is part of the sport.Many good talents are ruined because they didnt have luck with injuries,that is how it goes.

About Djokovic,i think that vegan diet didnt help him at all.Then he also had some type of guru with him that i think also messed up with him a bit.Alternative lifestyle is not good for pro athletes i think,and if he didnt go that way he would dominate even more.

Some studies says vegan diet all alone cannot sustain longer when your having sports activities, you should mix it with lean meat instead. You can turn to fish if you don't want poultry animals which feed with processed feeds. However, if you're talking about the ability of these athletes I believed Nadal is more energetic and powerful over those mentioned guys.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: JollyGood on November 25, 2020, 03:12:45 PM
Total votes so far: 21 Votes Have Been Cast


Federer 9

Nadal 7

Djokovic 5



The poll is very close but seems to be heading the way I thought it would. I always thought Federer would win, Nadal would be second and Djokovic third. The poll is open and has not closed so members are requested to keep on voting.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Bekuciwu9 on November 25, 2020, 04:05:09 PM
Some studies says vegan diet all alone cannot sustain longer when your having sports activities, you should mix it with lean meat instead. You can turn to fish if you don't want poultry animals which feed with processed feeds. However, if you're talking about the ability of these athletes I believed Nadal is more energetic and powerful over those mentioned guys.

Nadal is probably physically most dominant tennis player ever, he is a beast so its not even close comparison between him and those two other guys.It is a miracle that he is still so good when you think that he is already 34 years old and how much he uses his body in every match.What Cristiano Ronaldo is in footbal, thats Nadal in tennis.

Djokovic should really give up on that vegan crap and  start eating normally.Professional sport is not healthy in general and you can make it even worse if you dont have proper diet.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Daniel91 on November 25, 2020, 04:21:20 PM
Total votes so far: 21 Votes Have Been Cast


Federer 9

Nadal 7

Djokovic 5


The poll is very close but seems to be heading the way I thought it would. I always thought Federer would win, Nadal would be second and Djokovic third. The poll is open and has not closed so members are requested to keep on voting.

GOAT will not be determined by any polls but by the final result of all three at the end of their tennis careers.
Given that all three players are still playing, I would say that everything is still open, although I give a small advantage to Djokovic.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: casperBGD on November 26, 2020, 07:09:43 AM

GOAT will not be determined by any polls but by the final result of all three at the end of their tennis careers.
Given that all three players are still playing, I would say that everything is still open, although I give a small advantage to Djokovic.

agree on this one, but do think that we will never have clear answer on this question, even if someone else announce either of the three as the greatest of all times, it would never be a definitive decision, that all will agree on, because one could always think that his favorite is GOAT, no matter what other are saying, and differences are too small to call clear decision

for me, no matter what, although I am a Serb, it would probably be Nadal, due to the fact that he has lowest level of talent, but most work included in his success, I think that Djokovic with Nadal's level of training, and his talent for tennis, would be unbeatable for years, but he is lacking training obviously
and Federer is for tennis aristocrats, he is something different for the two, and who likes Federer and his playing style, would never agree that either Nadal or Djokovic is better


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: JollyGood on November 26, 2020, 12:13:36 PM
Total votes so far: 22 Votes Have Been Cast


Federer 9

Nadal 7

Djokovic 6


Things are looking in interesting in the poll because the gap between Djokovic and Nadal is closing  :o


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: Cnut237 on November 26, 2020, 12:31:47 PM
Djokovic should really give up on that vegan crap and  start eating normally.Professional sport is not healthy in general and you can make it even worse if you dont have proper diet.

I'd disagree. I think the diet has definitely helped Djokovic. The veganism yes, a lot of other dominant sports stars are vegan, Lewis Hamilton as an example.
But the biggest dietary difference for Djokovic was when he ditched gluten. That's what turned him into a relentless winning machine.


Title: Re: Tennis G O A T: Who Will Eventually Be Considered the Greatest of These Three?
Post by: JollyGood on November 27, 2020, 09:33:15 PM
Djokovic can eat as many vegan meals as he wants but he will not be able to beat several records that Federer has to his name. Fantastic player is Djokovic but his regular gamesmanship where he feigns injury in order to confuse the opponent is very well documented. Federer and Nadal, did they ever fake an injury? I cannot recall even one time.

When he finally retires he will probably not be in touching distance of Federer and Nadal.


Djokovic should really give up on that vegan crap and  start eating normally.Professional sport is not healthy in general and you can make it even worse if you dont have proper diet.

I'd disagree. I think the diet has definitely helped Djokovic. The veganism yes, a lot of other dominant sports stars are vegan, Lewis Hamilton as an example.
But the biggest dietary difference for Djokovic was when he ditched gluten. That's what turned him into a relentless winning machine.