|
Title: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: suzanne5223 on October 24, 2020, 11:45:47 AM https://i.postimg.cc/2jxYmrQT/1.jpg (https://postimages.org/) What brought up this issue was the conversation and people's opinions after the Paypal announcement of integrating buy, sell, and hold of cryptocurrency. Understandably, the decentralization of cryptocurrency is what makes it the liberty of the people from the government/economic meltdown and there also some discussion that the government's stance towards Bitcoin was the reason why Bitcoin is not mainstream of payments. I once read from a legendary crypto enthusiast once that for crypto to be mainstream a little sacrifice(centralization) will be needed which come to pass in Paypal crypto announcement and conditions which led to a lot of discussions in crypto communities. We are the one claiming the government's stance towards crypto hinder crypto mainstream and Paypal shift to crypto seems to bridge the gap. Below are the important statement posted on the Paypal newsroom (https://newsroom.paypal-corp.com/2020-10-21-PayPal-Launches-New-Service-Enabling-Users-to-Buy-Hold-and-Sell-Cryptocurrency). Quote The migration toward digital payments and digital representations of value continues to accelerate, driven by the COVID-19 pandemic and the increased interest in digital currencies from central banks and consumers. PayPal Holdings, Inc. (NASDAQ: PYPL) today announced the launch of a new service enabling its customers to buy, hold and sell cryptocurrency directly from their PayPal account, and signaled its plans to significantly increase cryptocurrency's utility by making it available as a funding source for purchases at its 26 million merchants worldwide. With the quoted messages the question is should we welcome centralized bodies like Paypal or not since its operation will not be different from a centralized exchange and payment site?Mainstream adoption of cryptocurrencies has traditionally been hindered by their limited utility as an instrument of exchange due to volatility, cost and speed to transact. However, the promise of advanced technological platforms offers the possibility of mainstreaming digital currencies. According to a survey by the Bank for International Settlements, one in 10 central banks – representing approximately one-fifth of the world's population – expect to issue their own digital currencies within the next three years. "The shift to digital forms of currencies is inevitable, bringing with it clear advantages in terms of financial inclusion and access; efficiency, speed and resilience of the payments system; and the ability for governments to disburse funds to citizens quickly," said Dan Schulman, president and CEO, PayPal. "Our global reach, digital payments expertise, two-sided network, and rigorous security and compliance controls provide us with the opportunity, and the responsibility, to help facilitate the understanding, redemption and interoperability of these new instruments of exchange. We are eager to work with central banks and regulators around the world to offer our support, and to meaningfully contribute to shaping the role that digital currencies will play in the future of global finance and commerce." Building Understanding and Adoption of Cryptocurrency To increase consumer understanding and adoption of cryptocurrency, the company is introducing the ability to buy, hold and sell select cryptocurrencies, initially featuring Bitcoin, Ethereum, Bitcoin Cash and Litecoin, directly within the PayPal digital wallet. The service will be available to PayPal accountholders in the U.S. in the coming weeks. The company plans to expand the features to Venmo and select international markets in the first half of 2021. The service is enabled in the U.S. through a partnership with Paxos Trust Company, a regulated provider of cryptocurrency products and services. Increasing the Utility of Cryptocurrency in Digital Commerce Beginning in early 2021, PayPal customers will be able to use their cryptocurrency holdings as a funding source to pay at PayPal's 26 million merchants around the globe. Consumers will be able to instantly convert their selected cryptocurrency balance to fiat currency, with certainty of value and no incremental fees. PayPal merchants will have no additional integrations or fees, as all transactions will be settled with fiat currency at their current PayPal rates. In effect, cryptocurrency simply becomes another funding source inside the PayPal digital wallet, adding enhanced utility to cryptocurrency holders, while addressing previous concerns surrounding volatility, cost and speed of cryptocurrency-based transactions Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: 20kevin20 on October 24, 2020, 12:08:13 PM for crypto to be mainstream a little sacrifice(centralization) will be needed It's a big sacrifice. Bitcoin is here to avoid centralization, it just doesn't make sense to welcome it this way.I understand there are so many merchants that'll allow Bitcoin payments which is great, but I'm not sure it's going to be Bitcoin you'll be paying with. Without full control over the coins, it's just like PayPal created a virtual Bitcoin and allowed you to use it. I'm really curious to find out if the "purchases using Bitcoin" are going to be done over the blockchain or PayPal takes the BTC and gives you virtual ones. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: hulla on October 24, 2020, 12:13:19 PM What I'm about say will hurt alot of crypto enthusiast but we need to be realistic cause if we by any means we wants Bitcoin and others good cryptocurrencies to succeed in becoming the mainstream we have to open our arms for some centralized bodies which I see Paypal as one of them since we also use centralized exchange site sometime but people are not to use them as wallet or exchange site but for payment.
Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: Fundamentals Of on October 24, 2020, 12:27:25 PM If the price for adoption is that Bitcoin is going to be centralized, I'd rather bid good bye to it. Bitcoin is decentralization. Bitcoin is decentralized or else it is not Bitcoin at all. It is just either a decentralized Bitcoin or nothing at all.
But other centralized apps, sites, payment systems, businesses, etc accepting Bitcoin does not mean Bitcoin is now stripped of its decentralized nature. It does not alter Bitcoin at all. Nothing has changed in Bitcoin. Paypal is not the only way for decentralization supporters to buy, sell, and make use of their Bitcoin. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: XCANA on October 24, 2020, 12:37:47 PM For adoption sake we should embrace this once to see the effect. PayPal will act as an exchnage to enable the purchase of Bitcoin among it customers or in other word, they will give customers (clients) Bitcoin as an "I own you". Though, this might seem out of point but becasue of their huge number of clients around the world let drift a little to observe this moment of Bitcoin with PayPal Inc.
Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: pooya87 on October 24, 2020, 12:39:13 PM it depends on "how" they enter.
we welcome anybody or any company that wants to adopt bitcoin as a currency. there are a lot of centralized companies that have done that (eg. Microsoft). there is nothing wrong with that, just like any individual a centralized "body" is also free to adopt bitcoin. BUT when they come in and want to become something like a "bitcoin bank" by adopting bitcoin, then that is a big malicious move in my opinion. that is what PayPal seems to be trying to do. they want you to give up the freedom you gained by using bitcoin again and rely on them once more! Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: Upgrade00 on October 24, 2020, 12:41:54 PM Bitcoin has a couple of unique qualities which makes it stand out such as; decentralized, pseudo anonymous, immutable, transparent. If it was accessed using centralized platforms like PayPal, all of these qualities would be undermined:
• It would definitely become centralized as the platform would control the funds stored on them, • There is a KYC process involved in setting up an account so users are not anonymous by any means, • As it is centralized transactions can be blocked, reversed, and accounts can be frozen. I would not call these small sacrifices as Bitcoin would be losing most of its core values. But, such Bitcoin adoption cannot be stopped and would keep happening even after PayPal, Bitcoin holders should ensure they do not use Bitcoin as a regulated currency. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: tranthidung on October 24, 2020, 12:48:58 PM To simplify things, I can tell you it is a two-sided partnership.
Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: joniboini on October 24, 2020, 12:49:25 PM As far as they don't allow the users to withdraw the coins to their own wallet or if they don't give a key for the address I think it is dangerous. You probably don't buy any crypto at all and just a text called "Bitcoin" while the platform milk you from the fees (or as somebody mentioned above, a 'virtual bitcoin' that already exist on other platforms such as binary options). I'd never use a platform like that. It is not a problem of centralization or not, it is a problem if verification and making sure they don't rip you off.
Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: mk4 on October 24, 2020, 01:52:04 PM It's a big sacrifice. Bitcoin is here to avoid centralization, it just doesn't make sense to welcome it this way. Unpopular opinion: As long as we have the choice to hold our coins in a non-custodial manner, I really have not much problem with it. Unless the day comes that non-custodial services becomes as easy to use as custodial services, then custodial services will still be widely used. Because let's not kid ourselves, not everyone is tech savvy enough to do the things we do. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: hatshepsut93 on October 24, 2020, 02:15:14 PM BUT when they come in and want to become something like a "bitcoin bank" by adopting bitcoin, then that is a big malicious move in my opinion. that is what PayPal seems to be trying to do. they want you to give up the freedom you gained by using bitcoin again and rely on them once more! I don't think PayPal has a malicious intention of taking away the freedom of Bitcoin users, if they did, they would have been active in Bitcoin field years ago. They simply want to make money just like what they do with fiat. This doesn't mean that their service is good or safe to use, I just don't think there's any malicious intent behind it. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: CODE200 on October 24, 2020, 02:27:53 PM BUT when they come in and want to become something like a "bitcoin bank" by adopting bitcoin, then that is a big malicious move in my opinion. that is what PayPal seems to be trying to do. they want you to give up the freedom you gained by using bitcoin again and rely on them once more! I don't think PayPal has a malicious intention of taking away the freedom of Bitcoin users, if they did, they would have been active in Bitcoin field years ago. They simply want to make money just like what they do with fiat. This doesn't mean that their service is good or safe to use, I just don't think there's any malicious intent behind it. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: sheenshane on October 24, 2020, 02:44:35 PM I don't think PayPal has a malicious intention of taking away the freedom of Bitcoin users, if they did, they would have been active in Bitcoin field years ago. They simply want to make money just like what they do with fiat. This doesn't mean that their service is good or safe to use, I just don't think there's any malicious intent behind it. I can't give more details of what the intention of PayPal upon embracing Bitcoin. As I read in many articles, you can't transfer your Bitcoin and it should be on your PayPal account only. So, what is the purpose of buying Bitcoin that you even don't have full control over your key? Unless, if you trust this centralized company which is PayPal don't hold your crypto. The only thing that has been benefited Bitcoin is just to have worldwide awareness that might possible to have mass adoption. It's great news that PayPal opens their arms to cryptocurrencies at least, for them, it's a pure business because they know that Bitcoin was now on the mainstream. There are too many ways to buy Bitcoin that you will own the keys, if you care about your privacy avoid PayPal this isn't for you. We still are thankful, through PayPal, it has an impact on Bitcoin price and now pumped the price. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: Nalbo on October 24, 2020, 02:52:19 PM No one owns or have a full control over bitcoin. The freedom and the security provided by the extensive network is what makes bitcoin make popular.
People can have different views on bitcoin and with it's primary developer missing, they can define the objective of bitcoin to be anything. For most, bitcoin has been a limited resource that's rare and is going to increase in price by folds, much faster than most other things. For them, any positive news are welcome. But who believe bitcoin as the leader of decentralization and power of peers, they'd believe bitcoin's going into wrong hands. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: Bttzed03 on October 24, 2020, 03:15:57 PM Expectation:
1. People will realize the importance of a currency that's not controlled by the Government. 2. People will understand how fuck up fiats are - how it's not really backed up by Gold and how Central banks prints them so easily. Reality: 1. Most people don't give a fuck whether what they're using as currency is just a piece of paper with no real value. 2. The convenience centralized platforms provides is more important than the value of decentralization. To be frank, part of the blame why BTC isn't going mainstream without these centralized platforms like Paypal is on us. How many of us have truly supported P2P marketplaces and exchanges? How many of us blames the developers for not giving us the same experience as Paypal, Amazon, Binance etc.? Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: ChrisPop on October 24, 2020, 03:21:39 PM I think we shoud look at the centralized entities adopting Bitcoin like a mainstream. Before we go into full decentralization people need to feel "safe" about Bitcoin. Big names like PayPal putting their reputation on the line by offering crypto-related services like payments and asset holding features is certainly an assurance for users.
Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: cabron on October 24, 2020, 04:26:52 PM Whatever development is a good development. I think centralization had gradually started since the CEX accumulating our KYC data and this paypal not just accepting BTC but also acquiring CEX will collect more data from not BTC users to the ones who started using. It helps bitcoin to be well known though and whether we welcome them or not, its not up to us because all these are opensource. There really is the need to use DEX because they are up to chase those DEX users, the government is catching up with the dex users. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: kryptqnick on October 24, 2020, 04:47:06 PM I'm closer to welcoming such steps than being outraged by them. I don't like Facebook's Libra project and would not welcome such a huge privacy risk and this company getting even more powerful. That's too much, and it barely counts as crypto adoption. I also hate big US banks that both invest in cryptos and say bad things about Bitcoin. In general, I wouldn't feel comfortable with their projects. But companies that are adopting Bitcoin and allowing people to use it more are good for crypto adoption. I get it, they're centralized, don't care about privacy and are profit-oriented. But if with their help Bitcoin becomes more accessible and usable, it's worth a shot.
Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: bL4nkcode on October 24, 2020, 05:17:00 PM Any adoption from any kind of company is good and nothing to worry about for the centralization issue, but I'm not good with existing digital payments acting as a wallet/exchange that doesn't let its users send bitcoin/crypto to others.
Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: bitbunnny on October 24, 2020, 05:33:38 PM If we want to see better adoption of Bitcoin and further development regulation and some kind of monitoring are needed. I wouldn't say that would automatically mean centralisation but from my point of view it would mean better protection and security as well as legal certainty, especially for companies.
Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: fiulpro on October 24, 2020, 06:11:12 PM I do believe we can add a lot of points too here :
- they can handle cases and legal fights with he government and the people in regards to cryptocurrencies - they can make sure that no one , literally no one has control of mining power - they can make sure that whales and other holders don't cumulatively influence the price - they can make sure that bitcoin projects and other crypto projects are not being tackled by the governments out of nowhere and banned overnight But we are missing something : This is something that we can only wish when we would be living in a ideal world , a world where there is no corruption and no evil. Even a single corrupt person in that centralized body can make the whole crypto community suffer , they can influence the price themselves or make laws which would be eventually bad for us. We don't live in an ideal world , we cannot trust people , that's why it's decentralized in the first place. Any centralized body feels the need to dominate after a while. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: verita1 on October 24, 2020, 09:59:59 PM A Mainstream adoption as PayPal says is definitely coming soon.
I like the fact that consumers on Paypal will be able to instantly convert their cryptocurrency balance into the fiat currency of their choice at no additional fees. Just as merchants will not have any additional fees, transactions will be made with fiat currency and with current PayPal rates. The step forward by PayPal to digitization was inevitable. The covid19 pandemic has sharpened banking services. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: MCobian on October 24, 2020, 11:49:15 PM I don't think it is a problem with the centralized company adopting Bitcoin, because to be honest Bitcoin requires a centralized platform
like Paypal to increase popularity and awareness on Bitcoin. As we all know Paypal users are very much, so this could be the beginning for Bitcoin to be accepted as payment. Even without Paypal accepting Bitcoin is not a problem, Bitcoin will still exist and grow, but maybe the development is not as fast as if Paypal accepts Bitcoin. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: AmoreJaz on October 24, 2020, 11:58:51 PM What I'm about say will hurt alot of crypto enthusiast but we need to be realistic cause if we by any means we wants Bitcoin and others good cryptocurrencies to succeed in becoming the mainstream we have to open our arms for some centralized bodies which I see Paypal as one of them since we also use centralized exchange site sometime but people are not to use them as wallet or exchange site but for payment. we need popular platforms to include btc or crypto within their payment system. that is, if we want btc or crypto to become mainstream. anyway, as mentioned, it is not that users can directly send their crypto to another entity. the receiver will still receive the amount in corresponding fiat (ex. USD) and not the crypto payment itself. so somehow, there is some control about the usage of crypto. I don't think it is a problem with the centralized company adopting Bitcoin, because to be honest Bitcoin requires a centralized platform like Paypal to increase popularity and awareness on Bitcoin. As we all know Paypal users are very much, so this could be the beginning for Bitcoin to be accepted as payment. Even without Paypal accepting Bitcoin is not a problem, Bitcoin will still exist and grow, but maybe the development is not as fast as if Paypal accepts Bitcoin. let's admit it, the integration of crypto in PayPal will increase crypto adoption. the news itself somehow made a significant impact in btc market. how much more when PayPal users are already actively using crypto within the system? think of the millions of users that are already onboard with this company and if crypto is readily available on this platform, people will try to utilize at some point. if PayPal will be successful in this inclusion of crypto, chance that other big companies will follow through. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: pooya87 on October 25, 2020, 04:42:32 AM BUT when they come in and want to become something like a "bitcoin bank" by adopting bitcoin, then that is a big malicious move in my opinion. that is what PayPal seems to be trying to do. they want you to give up the freedom you gained by using bitcoin again and rely on them once more! I don't think PayPal has a malicious intention of taking away the freedom of Bitcoin users, if they did, they would have been active in Bitcoin field years ago. They simply want to make money just like what they do with fiat. This doesn't mean that their service is good or safe to use, I just don't think there's any malicious intent behind it. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: acener on October 25, 2020, 05:08:33 AM Crypto or Bitcoin was created to be decentralized to give us freedom and now you are asking us to accept it warmly and embrace it being centralized to be on mainstream?
They are making it to gain control and to monitor us it is like asking something to be redesign for it's purpose just to be accepted by society. But for me it is not that bad unless people would really forget it's main purpose we still have a choice to choose we could still use our own wallet to be decentralized and doesn't need those centralized system since we have been doing well before they even step up and accept Bitcoin. They aren't forcing us to use them we are free to use whatever wallet we want for our crypto. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: ilovealtcoins on October 25, 2020, 04:03:31 PM Bitcoin alone is already a means of payment and it is in direct competition with any form of global payment in the world because of the advantages of transferring money quickly and having small fees when sending large amounts.
Paypal has a much higher cost than Bitcoin. The integration of Bitcoin in Paypal's system helps them benefit from transaction fees. Bitcoin on Paypal does not lose the decentralization of Bitcoin because not all of us choose Paypal to transfer money. Talking about the benefit of Paypal for Bitcoin, which is that it is free globally, Bitcoin will become legal because it is regulated in the law, Bitcoin has more liquidity from users on Paypal (this has will cause Bitcoin to rise in price). Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: Assface16678 on October 25, 2020, 04:18:29 PM That is because Bitcoin is lacking support from governments of many countries which slows down the adaptation of this technology. Third parties are backed by governments due to regulation and centralization of it. Bitcoin is already a mode of payment but we in order for it to be accepted by more masses, something should help it acquire more popularity and reliability, third party networks would be a huge help to spread awareness of such technology. I believe doubt plays a huge role why many countries are still against this industry and if something will put trsut in it, it would be influencial and may trigger a motion called domino effect.
Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: eaLiTy on October 25, 2020, 04:42:00 PM I understand there are so many merchants that'll allow Bitcoin payments which is great, but I'm not sure it's going to be Bitcoin you'll be paying with. Without full control over the coins, it's just like PayPal created a virtual Bitcoin and allowed you to use it. I'm really curious to find out if the "purchases using Bitcoin" are going to be done over the blockchain or PayPal takes the BTC and gives you virtual ones. It looks like PayPal will be providing virtual coins and there is not transaction going through the blockchain and with that i really do not want to even it BTCitcoin, they created a trading platform essentially to stay in the business and since they have a much bigger user base they might be thinking that there will be users that will lock their money purchasing their virtual BTCitcoin ;D.I am yet to fully understand their business model, whether they will be investing on the behalf of the users because literally it does not make any sense if they are not allowing users to withdraw the coins. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: DooMAD on October 25, 2020, 05:17:48 PM You aren't alone in not feeling particularly welcoming. I'm certainly not giving them any business, Bitcoin-related or otherwise. But as the same time, the network is open to anyone to join, even if some of us aren't fond of their business practices or their previous conduct towards Bitcoin and users of Bitcoin (which won't be forgotten).
Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: suzanne5223 on October 25, 2020, 05:42:26 PM I wouldn't call centralization as little sacrifice, unless paypal allow it's user to send Bitcoin to anyone with Bitcoin address and pay merchant from our own Bitcoin wallet directly. The whole operation will be performed by Paxos which is the owner of Paxos Gold stable coin.If the price for adoption is that Bitcoin is going to be centralized, I'd rather bid good bye to it. Bitcoin is decentralization. Bitcoin is decentralized or else it is not Bitcoin at all. It is just either a decentralized Bitcoin or nothing at all. The price of the adoption is not centralized mate cause Bitcoin has already gained adoption but if we want it to be mainstream some centralized bodies will step in. But other centralized apps, sites, payment systems, businesses, etc accepting Bitcoin does not mean Bitcoin is now stripped of its decentralized nature. It does not alter Bitcoin at all. Nothing has changed in Bitcoin. Paypal is not the only way for decentralization supporters to buy, sell, and make use of their Bitcoin. for crypto to be mainstream a little sacrifice(centralization) will be needed It's a big sacrifice. Bitcoin is here to avoid centralization, it just doesn't make sense to welcome it this way.I understand there are so many merchants that'll allow Bitcoin payments which is great, but I'm not sure it's going to be Bitcoin you'll be paying with. Without full control over the coins, it's just like PayPal created a virtual Bitcoin and allowed you to use it. I'm really curious to find out if the "purchases using Bitcoin" are going to be done over the blockchain or PayPal takes the BTC and gives you virtual ones. The positive things that may come out of it is the reason why I think we need to give them a chance since the transaction will be operated through Paxos.Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: davis196 on October 26, 2020, 12:51:03 PM I wouldn't call centralization as little sacrifice, unless paypal allow it's user to send Bitcoin to anyone with Bitcoin address and pay merchant from our own Bitcoin wallet directly. Paypal will allow such transactions on their platform only if they get a big share of the transaction fees. Unfortunately the vast majority of Bitcoin users don't mind more centralization,since they don't care about decentralization and independence.They just want to make money. The "decentralization fanatics" are a minority that might leave the BTC community,if Bitcoin becomes more centralized,due to the centralized entities,which are acquiring more control over the BTC market. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: DooMAD on October 26, 2020, 12:58:41 PM Unfortunately the vast majority of Bitcoin users don't mind more centralization,since they don't care about decentralization and independence.They just want to make money. The "decentralization fanatics" are a minority that might leave the BTC community,if Bitcoin becomes more centralized,due to the centralized entities,which are acquiring more control over the BTC market. I don't see that happening. Even if more people are choosing to use Bitcoin in the wrong way, that doesn't directly harm those of us who use it correctly. Anyone holding their own keys will always be afforded censorship resistance and full autonomy over their wealth. It's the people who are unwittingly handing over control of their wealth who are going to inevitably get screwed over, have a really bad experience, or generally be left with the wrong impression about how Bitcoin works who are going to end up leaving. And that's their loss. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: 20kevin20 on October 26, 2020, 01:33:13 PM The positive things that may come out of it is the reason why I think we need to give them a chance since the transaction will be operated through Paxos. Right, maybe I seem a bit too skeptical about centralized parties, but this sudden turn from being against BTC to supporting it all of a sudden by not only one or a few companies but so many in the past year seems just too sketchy for me.Unless the opposite proves to be true, to me it seems like it's just a plan of theirs. Could very well be that they simply gave up as Bitcoin is slowly gaining a lot of ground, the old "if you can't beat them, join them" idiom. But until then, I can't help but keep questioning this sudden wave of BTC support. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: Casdinyard on October 26, 2020, 01:40:57 PM The positive things that may come out of it is the reason why I think we need to give them a chance since the transaction will be operated through Paxos. Right, maybe I seem a bit too skeptical about centralized parties, but this sudden turn from being against BTC to supporting it all of a sudden by not only one or a few companies but so many in the past year seems just too sketchy for me.Unless the opposite proves to be true, to me it seems like it's just a plan of theirs. Could very well be that they simply gave up as Bitcoin is slowly gaining a lot of ground, the old "if you can't beat them, join them" idiom. But until then, I can't help but keep questioning this sudden wave of BTC support. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: imstillthebest on October 26, 2020, 01:58:36 PM should we welcome centralized bodies like Paypal or not since its operation will not be different from a centralized exchange and payment site? there are centralized services on this crypto and we accept them so why not on this one when you said that it wont differ on them . people are verry allergic to centralized systems but they do also use centralized exchange and others . paypal is not just a centralized platform but its one of the huge and the most reputable among others . like it or not , paypal wont change thier mind and theres always people that are going to support this because not all are centralized haters and not all are paypal haters . most of all this can help crypto grow bigTitle: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: BrewMaster on October 26, 2020, 02:46:53 PM The positive things that may come out of it is the reason why I think we need to give them a chance since the transaction will be operated through Paxos. Right, maybe I seem a bit too skeptical about centralized parties, but this sudden turn from being against BTC to supporting it all of a sudden by not only one or a few companies but so many in the past year seems just too sketchy for me.Unless the opposite proves to be true, to me it seems like it's just a plan of theirs. Could very well be that they simply gave up as Bitcoin is slowly gaining a lot of ground, the old "if you can't beat them, join them" idiom. But until then, I can't help but keep questioning this sudden wave of BTC support. i have a theory about this. right until very recently these centralized parties were thinking about creating their own centralized coin and use the hype to sell it to the masses and make a ton of profit while compete with bitcoin. the thing is, one of them did it sooner than others thinking they could take the market before others join in. the result was mostly a big failure. that new one was called "Libra". Facebook started the hype of this shitcoin in 2017 right when the market was overhyped with bitcoin setting new highs every week. after 3 years it has not yet been released and it is considered dead already. other companies seeing that big fail changed their direction and are coming towards bitcoin now. because they know creating their own shitcoin is not going to end well. if Libra succeeded then today we were in a very different situation. we would have seen PayPalCoin instead of this news! Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: Viscore on October 26, 2020, 02:48:48 PM I don't think that is necessary nor to decline such a thing because having them is a part of crypto development and that also it gives a positive impact on the crypto space. Besides those bad claims toward a centralized platform, some of them are seem to be good and helping for the growing market.
And I don't see any reason why we should not welcome them. In fact, a lot of trader and investors are using them which give them an option other than choosing decentralized platforms. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: DooMAD on October 26, 2020, 03:06:40 PM if Libra succeeded then today we were in a very different situation. we would have seen PayPalCoin instead of this news! Unless PayPal can demonstrate they're operating full reserve of the BTC they claim to be holding on behalf of their users, there's not much difference in practice between a theoretical "PayPalCoin" and this news. It still amounts to an IOU on their database that you may not be able to redeem. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: proTECH77 on October 26, 2020, 04:14:41 PM As we all know bitcoin is a decentralized currency which any one can use to start or grow a business. Even though other centralized body what to adopt bitcoin, bitcoin will still remain decentralized to others companies that are joining the body to make a good income
many companies has run other cryptocurrencies down just because of other fake body that was joining the company not knowing most of them are scam company looking for people to scam. I don't think bitcoin should welcome any centralized company because most of them are scam body that will later scatter the company with fake transaction. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: Ucy on October 26, 2020, 04:36:09 PM The question should be, why shouldn't companies like PayPal develop crypto platforms that are compatible with the Ideals of Cryptocurrency, like decentralization, transparency, immutablity, censorship resistant, privacy-friendly/anonymity-friendly, trustless/permissionless, self-custody, safe/secure, etc. Is it that they can't build such platforms or they just have different agenda that conflict with crypto ideals?
I would not recommend things I do not believe in or trust to people. Doing so will be hypocrisy. Well, people who prefer the centralized platforms shouldn't put in too much crypto in them, or they could preferably use the non-custodial ones. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: plast555 on October 26, 2020, 06:41:27 PM BUT when they come in and want to become something like a "bitcoin bank" by adopting bitcoin, then that is a big malicious move in my opinion. that is what PayPal seems to be trying to do. they want you to give up the freedom you gained by using bitcoin again and rely on them once more! I don't think PayPal has a malicious intention of taking away the freedom of Bitcoin users, if they did, they would have been active in Bitcoin field years ago. They simply want to make money just like what they do with fiat. This doesn't mean that their service is good or safe to use, I just don't think there's any malicious intent behind it. Paypal has Finally relized that Cryptocurrency is new and very important technology and whover adopt it as sooner it is as better for their future. Paypal's use was already reduced thanks to Bitcoin and Cryptocurrency. so paypal had no other choice but to accept Bitcoin and Cryptocurrency. Besides this they can't do anything else with Bitcoin. they cant control bitcoin or make it centralized. and BTW. we have so many crypto platforms which are 100% centralized. like all those CEX echanges. so we should see the positive side. and in this case the positive side is that bitcoin and cryptocurrency will get mass adoption with this paypal accepting bitcoin which is a good thing. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: 20kevin20 on October 26, 2020, 10:11:32 PM i have a theory about this. Surely is a viable theory, but I doubt that's the case especially as some centralized coins are now sitting among the top cryptos out there. Libra was a huge failure imo because of the missing legal framework that should've surrounded cryptos at the time it was presented. PayPal's news about adding Bitcoin is quite close to the time strong regulations the EU will see, so they could've just waited more before they could 100% legally add their PayPalCoin to the game. In fact, maybe that's exactly what they plan to do: accumulate as many crypto enthusiasts as possible, and then come up with your own coin.[..] Besides that, obviously, I agree with you - Libra was an utter shit straight from the start to the end of it .. and hopefully will not be revived in the future. What @DooMAD said a few replies above is exactly what I fear: centralized bodies may actually implement a virtual, non-existent Bitcoin and that could go further into an even worse scenario such as artificial Bitcoin inflation and strong price manipulation by corporations. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: hatshepsut93 on October 26, 2020, 11:45:26 PM Paypal's use was already reduced thanks to Bitcoin and Cryptocurrency. PayPal processes 5 million transactions every day, and nearly all of those transactions are consumer transactions or transfers between individuals. Bitcoin's half a million transactions per day is mostly just speculators and investors moving coins in, out and between exchanges, as evident by the spikes of transaction volume when there's rapid price action. And just from common observation, "PayPal accepted here" is hundreds times more common than "Bitcoin accepted here". I'm sure PayPal didn't adopt Bitcoin because they felt that it's already a threat to their business. Maybe they though it would be in some decades, or maybe they just though it would generate profit for them. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: claire_lovely on October 27, 2020, 02:36:12 AM While I prefer decentralized trading, I think that more and more centralized exchanges like Paypal entering the cryptocurrency market is a great thing as it will just drive adoption forward and allow for more methods to obtain Bitcoin. If it's easier to obtain from centralized exchanges, then there's also going to be more volume for decentralized trading.
Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: witcher_sense on October 27, 2020, 10:15:33 AM While I prefer decentralized trading, I think that more and more centralized exchanges like Paypal entering the cryptocurrency market is a great thing as it will just drive adoption forward and allow for more methods to obtain Bitcoin. If it's easier to obtain from centralized exchanges, then there's also going to be more volume for decentralized trading. You are speaking of easy methods to buy bitcoin and singing praises of PayPal, but it seems you have missed an important point. You can't buy bitcoin with PayPal, you can't sell it with PayPal, you can't even call your bitcoin yours when using PayPal, because PayPal is not interested in giving you control, they rather prefer to control you. For them, you are not trustworthy or not responsible enough to manage your money. They want to prevent you from making mistakes constraining your freedom, controlling your decisions, telling you what to do, and how to behave. Indeed, you should welcome centralized bodies if you are no longer in need of freedom to choose.Unfortunately, Bitcoin gradually going mainstream means limiting the freedoms of people using it. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: ampu on October 27, 2020, 02:36:47 PM The centralized institutions will be the places that indirectly help us bring Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies to the rest of the world. We need to understand that Bitcoin is too unpopular as it is new and has not been specified in any country yet. There is a lot of bitcoin speculation, we need some certainty for everyone to join bitcoin. The centralized agencies will be the best and most effective advertisers.
Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: hulla on October 27, 2020, 03:58:58 PM What I'm about say will hurt alot of crypto enthusiast but we need to be realistic cause if we by any means we wants Bitcoin and others good cryptocurrencies to succeed in becoming the mainstream we have to open our arms for some centralized bodies which I see Paypal as one of them since we also use centralized exchange site sometime but people are not to use them as wallet or exchange site but for payment. we need popular platforms to include btc or crypto within their payment system. that is, if we want btc or crypto to become mainstream. anyway, as mentioned, it is not that users can directly send their crypto to another entity. the receiver will still receive the amount in corresponding fiat (ex. USD) and not the crypto payment itself. so somehow, there is some control about the usage of crypto. With that been said, what I read is that Paypal won't handle the transaction but users not receiving crypto is what I'm not sure about and if paypal said their users will have the chance to buy, sell and hold crypto it means their users can receive crypto. Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: posi on October 27, 2020, 04:19:22 PM It understands that we all love the decentralization aspect of Bitcoin and others cryptocurrencies but we need to welcome centralized bodies for cryptocurrencies to be mainstream. However, this doesn't mean we should be ignorant to examine any shortcomings that may be create by the centralized bodies because we cant know their true purposes and the last time i checked people are advised to always keep the amount they can afford to loose on such platforms.
Title: Re: Why should we welcome centralized bodies for Bitcoin mainstream Post by: suzanne5223 on October 27, 2020, 06:49:58 PM The positive things that may come out of it is the reason why I think we need to give them a chance since the transaction will be operated through Paxos. Right, maybe I seem a bit too skeptical about centralized parties, but this sudden turn from being against BTC to supporting it all of a sudden by not only one or a few companies but so many in the past year seems just too sketchy for me.Unless the opposite proves to be true, to me it seems like it's just a plan of theirs. Could very well be that they simply gave up as Bitcoin is slowly gaining a lot of ground, the old "if you can't beat them, join them" idiom. But until then, I can't help but keep questioning this sudden wave of BTC support. The banks and institutions have understood that they cant beat Bitcoin and IMF boss advised them to join the crypto scheme which is the reason why choose to join now. |
