Bitcoin Forum

Let's assume that it's like this article says (https://www.coindesk.com/as-bitcoin-surges-google-searches-suggest-little-fomo-among-retail-investors) and this rally is institutionally-driven. What does it mean for Bitcoin? Will this bring us to some very high price levels, like hundreds of thousands, or are these experienced investors going to take the profits rather soon and crash the rally at barely establishing the new ATH, or in worst case, we won't even cross $20k. Can you say that institutional investors trade significantly differently from retail investors on a volatile and speculative market?

Every bubble has to have its own paradigm. No one, who already burned his fingers on last bubble will invest again without new story. 2017 bubble was backed by "bitcoin - new whole world money that will replace fiats". Old paradigm faced high fees/scalability issue and bitcoin bubble bursted. Then we had alt season - XRP, LTC and many more "faster coin with better scalability than bitcoins was being pumped (alt season paradigm - be better than BTC in terms of speed). Then money floated to all crypto market.

Now we see creation of new paradigm - Bitcoin as part of well diversified portfolio.


This paradigm is just in creation stage. The foundations for the next pump are being created in front of our eyes. This will not be dumped right after new ATH. It will be dumped on retail investors right after you will hear from your aunt/uncle during family diner that he is spending 10% of his income on bitcoin as pension fund for retirement. That's how bubbles work. But this time ... bitcoin will leave alts behind and even if we will see alt season too it will be much weaker than in 2018.

Indeed, there are pretty clear signals about institutional investors getting big into Bitcoin.
But I also somehow doubt that the institutional investors are playing with the markets during the week-end.  :)
So it's not only institutional investors there, that's clear.
Bitcoin went to 20k before and institutional investors were much fewer back then (I think).


As I said, 20k was reached with less institutional investors.
Now, with them present, a new ATH is a matter of time. I won't say how bit it'll be, but it may be really big.
Just keep something also in mind: institutional investor may also become very big speculators and may play (us) big with price ups and downs. But since this has also happened already without them I'd say I don't expect anything different on short-medium term.

The only difference I expect is on long term and that should be much higher level of price and much lower price volatility.

But this time retail investors aren't coming en masse, so there's a scenario where a new ATH won't come. I can totally imagine guys from Microstrategy selling all their coins at $18k, because getting 80% profit in a few months is already crazy good. Institutional investors, unlike many retail investors, who are often noobs, understand that this market is prone to bubbles, so it's important to take profit fast, before the bubble has popped.

Institutional-investors considerably influence the price of bitcoin to rise since they announced bitcoin purchases.
They can sell it at any point, whether at $18K or $20K but the cash flow into bitcoin market will always continue to increase over time.
However, Microstrategy adopt bitcoin as the primary treasury reserve asset, the CEO; Michael Saylor claimed that he didn't buy bitcoin to sell it. read more (https://www.coindesk.com/microstrategy-michael-saylor-never-sell-bitcoin)
Saylor also said that BTC is the best asset to be invested in, calling it “the only thing we can find with a positive real yield.” source (https://cryptonews.com/news/no-plans-to-sell-bitcoin-on-short-notice-microstrategy-ceo-c-7790.htm)

If the "institutional investor" swing is true, then they will be in it for the long haul and want to hold as much as possible while constantly buying more. There will be sporadic profit taking, usually as they need to cash out assets for particular clients, but in general they are not going to be "day trading" for profits like most retail investors will be doing. These sorts of institutions are what the mega rich use to hold and store their money, in some cases they are not even expecting a profit as we understand it - they'd just be happy not to have their money eroded by natural inflation each year. The people with that sort of cash around them are generally just accumulating more assets each year and if that money can now be allocated to bitcoin the price ceiling will be very high.

If more institutional investors buy Bitcoin that will mean that there will be more whales owning Bitcoin. Whales have chance to manipulate market. It will be a reason less to be a trader.

My speculation about the hype or surge is that a time will come when it will get less volatile. If the bull is as from institutional investors, they can be expecting that price will hit a new ATH before either taking out profit and cashing out. The ATH was last in 2017 and that was in 3 years ago, so maybe a record wants to be created again .

They will come. Retail "investors" coming "en masse" will happen when the FOMO sentiment will be more powerful. A little more continuous growth and that may happen (again).
Also you seem to have forgotten PayPal, which allows in US to "buy Bitcoin" and will do the same in a couple of months for the rest of the world. I know it's only IOUs actually, but it will bring Bitcoin to the masses.
I think that we are on the right track and all we need now is a little more patience.

The speculation that I have for this matter is that we will see it in due time but not in the upcoming years. I think if most of the institutions in the world have invested in bitcoin and that time will come which it's likely to have its lesser volatility.

But going to that point is that it's unlikely. Bitcoin is known to be a very volatile asset and these institutions would also do something before other cash out their profits. It's like a game who's going to be quicker in taking profits when we have a higher price or newer ath.

I think they are not going to trade much. They are buying just to have a reserve asset against inflation so in most cases they are going to just buy and hold. See MicroStrategy CEO, for example: Michael Saylor claims the company will hold Bitcoin for ‘100 years’  (https://cointelegraph.com/news/michael-saylor-claims-the-company-will-hold-bitcoin-for-100-years).

It surprises some people who strongly oppose Bitcoin for they see it as a scam but when they see that institutional investors come in, they are now looking into the technology.  I think the bubble of the crypto cause by the institutional investors will be much bigger and it's going to be difficult to identify the ATH because it might just stick for a very long time.

The bubble will pop when the government finally crackdown on taxes but the implication of institutional investors holding BTC I guess is that it legitimized Bitcoin to the media and public. 

I have already read a lot with that kind of stuff, bullish articles keep popping up when the market is bullish, so it's not really a big deal, jut believe what you believe and act on it. For me, this could still be a manipulation going on or let's say there's an institutional investors coming in, but would that result to crazy increases? I doubt so.

I believe as long as institutional investors continue to keep this up, they are going to actually get a lot better results because them coming in means a lot of increases and a lot of increases means they will come even more in bunches. So it is an endless cycle, more money coming into bitcoin makes bitcoin go up and bitcoin going up makes more money coming in, that is just how market works.

However the implications would be if one day they stop, that means this sudden influx of money will be gone and the price wouldn't be able to go up like it does right now which would make it harder for to stay up and if it starts to go down and if institutional money leaves because of it, it could trigger just the opposite and market could crash, so we need to be careful about it in any case.

why would retail investors be coming en masse? that doesn't happen until much later, during the bubble. remember 2017? the media was silent during the whole 2015-16 bull market, until bitcoin passed the 2013 ATH. then CNBC and forbes started hyping bitcoin every day of the week. then i started getting phone calls from family members asking about bitcoin.....

that's how markets usually work: institutions quietly buy in the beginning stages of bull markets while retail investors are sleeping, then they dump their bags on retail buyers at much higher prices after the bull market has already played out. this is a common exit strategy for institutional investors. retail investors tend to be emotional/greedy and they tend towards fomo buying without any exit strategy. that's why they usually begin entering the market en masse after exponential gains have already occurred. retail buyers = top buyers.


get a load of this: Michael Saylor claims the company will hold Bitcoin for ‘100 years’  (https://cointelegraph.com/news/michael-saylor-claims-the-company-will-hold-bitcoin-for-100-years)

I don't think whales have so important role, in fact I think that too much power is in theory given to them compared to real situation.
It's also just a theory, a hypothesis that this Bitcoin rally is driven by institutional investors. I don't like to speculate about such outcomes when there isn't any ground to support it.

Yes. They pop out when the market goes bullish and they're also bearish when the market is bearish. And that's what they have to do, they can't twist the actual market if the market is bullish or bearish. IIRC, a year ago there were speculations about institutional investors are getting in. I don't know if that happened for a reason or insider or they've just predicted it well and they already saw it coming.

People say investors but they would be involved in crypto operations and regular companies not just the rare commodity if they were serious investors and there are people like that but the vast majority of involvement is trading.    If volatility is a possibility and profits have to be booked for quarterly gains and taxes and pay outs and so on then sell offs are quite possible and the 'investment' will never be one way but a process that runs in cycles.
    I'm way more bullish on underlying growth of actual users and its ironic that the smallest involved users will typically keep a larger amount longer term in a wallet because of the hassle to sell, vs the hedge fund who can easily pull out millions whenever they want in order to capture the top dollar price.    The implication of big money involvement is trading practises becomes more common in crypto and we are altered by the strength of the dollar more so as most mainstream trade comes via cheap dollar flows.   The idea of cheap money is ultimately fake, I dont know how long it continues but its certain to encounter upsets and disorderly markets isnt a memory but the future also, imo with greater occurrence.

Institutional investors are whales, so it is unlikely they are thinking about this as a short term project, for them this is a long term manoeuvre, what we have been seeing during the last months is an accumulation period in which institutional investors have been buying a lot of bitcoin, but are they still buying bitcoin for a price above 15k? It does not seem to be the case.

It seems to me that what they are expecting is that retail investors begin to invest all what they have in bitcoin seeing how close it is to the previous ATH and then once a bubble forms after bitcoin surpasses the 20k level they will wait a little bit and then dump their coin on the market.

I disagree that this rally was driven by institutional investors. I agree that they bought over a billion dollars worth of bitcoin in span of few months, but before the rally started they already bought most of their investments, they were already there.

Grayscale and microstrategy and places like that already bought a ton of bitcoin when it was 10k, they didn't increased the price at that time, why should they increase it today?

I think they were a good news and we liked the idea that companies are buying into bitcoin right now, but the reality is that they weren't increasing the price themselves, neither their news did because when we first heard it the price was 10k and stayed that way for almost 2 months. I can't give you the real reason because I don't know, but institutional investors going into bitcoin at 10k and suddenly 2 months later price increasing can't be all that much connected to each other.

I don't think that being an institutional investor an a whale instantly means that they are for long term, in fact these people aren't buying Bitcoin because they believe in "HODL" or its technology, they simply care for profit. If their analysis will say that Bitcoin is going down, they will dump it without any second thoughts, they aren't emotionally attached to it, unlike many retail investors.

What are the indications that institutional investors are not buying anymore?

Think I remember Coindesk's headline last week shouting FOMO's back, but then follow up news suggested very little movement on retail side. So maybe, maybe, but I also believe the institutional narrative has lost its lustre ever since derivatives were hyped, arrived, and then practically died on arrival (we all remember the breaths we held for Bakkt, don't we?).

Have we considered that this rally could actually be... organic? Force of nature and all that?

If institutions are driving the rally, it would still be organic. It would still just be supply and demand playing out, whether demand is predominantly coming from retail or institutional investors.

Richard Wyckoff's market theories touch on this dynamic. In a bullish accumulation schematic, the big boys absorb all the supply at the bottom of a bear market. Then once that supply dries up, price gets marked up into a new trading range. This establishes a bull market, as all the sellers and shorters from the bear market become trapped at lower levels. They drive prices higher, which gets the attention of retail buyers. Price rises until the big boys start distributing all their supply to late buyers. Then the market enters a distribution schematic and price gets marked down.

Some might call this "manipulation" just because it means institutions move the market just by virtue of their size. I would call it organic supply and demand though.

As for Bakkt, I don't think it's been a disappointment. They had their ATH in volume in September, and looking at the moving average, volume has been growing. https://twitter.com/BakktBot/status/1326528928924770306

No one is saying that's it's a result of manipulation, institutional investment doesn't mean that it's some pump and dump scheme, it's just referring to the type of investors.  Every investor wants to buy low and sell high, so there nothing wrong with institutions buying Bitcoin to later sell it. I'm just curious what differences are there between them and retail investors, and how it could shape this rally, compared to the previous ones, that were mostly retail-driven.

I think it can be real, although when institutional money enters the market it always generates a lot of pump, and this rise in the price of Bitcoin has been maintained, investors may be putting more money into the market, and if it happens that way it means that it is very difficult to determine what type of money is coming in, if by Institutional or traditional Investors, speculators who want to move the market. There is no indicator or tool that specifies what kind of money is injected.

The most that can be studied is having a consolidated Volume, and the Exchanges do not have the consolidated volume, but the volume per specific Exchange. Some Strong Hands if they can have the consolidated volume, to have a better understanding of the market, but many theories have to be applied to determine them, one who was very expert in determining this type of behavior was Jesse Livermore.

Institutions have been investing with bitcoin all year long. I think its more that we get closer and closer to the ATH, that more and more people start to realise that, we might eventually break $20K and head to like $100K or higher. Basically went we broke $1K back in 2017, we did 20x, and people are pretty much expecting a similar move. Maybe not a 20x which would put us at $400,000 per coin but something like $50K or so.

So the stock market is getting kind of toppy with stocks like Zoom, or Tesla already starting to get extremely expensive and eventually will run out of retail buyers. Where will these people go next? Most likely Bitcoin. Now that Paypal accepts people to buy BTC, most people already got a Paypal account, they can easily buy some BTC without having to open a exchange account. Hence why every thousands that we get closer and closer to $20K, there will be more and more buying pressure.

Bitcoin was in a good position even before the existence of institutional investors and I think it will remain so, it is certain that they will try to take advantage of the existing situation in their favor and it is possible to reap their profits and run away but I doubt that Bitcoin will be affected greatly, as I told you I think that Bitcoin was and will remain Standing well with or without them and they are sure to play a huge role in raising Bitcoin to new levels of ATH.

Mainstream involvement on this scale means more reference to dollar I reckon, it always there but almost any company has a leverage element to its cashflow and asset management.  The theory with QE is their intention always to keep inflation at target of 2% or so, which means they try avoid any large pull back but I think hitches and volatility is unavoidable from a false market they deliberately are trying to create.    So long as the dollar never rises too much I'd guess BTC is ok but I keep an eye on that measure breaking out of its range (https://talkimg.com/images/2023/06/12/AcslT.png) sideways its had for a while, again recently it hit and rose from the bottom of that range as I see it.

Fair enough, and we won't care where this organic push comes from (or I won't anyway). I just have always had trouble believing that institutional forces were waiting for some moment to go all in, I think they've already been here since 2016 (which to me was rather what was behind the 2017 rally).

Nevertheless, I don't see it as manipulation either, not with a market like Bitcoin.

Bakkt -- disappointment because of the supposed impact it was meant to have had. Their ATH pales in comparison to market share. Yes, I know physically-settled derivatives, but still. Not the game-changer it was heralded as.

https://i.ibb.co/9GRHS4T/image.png (https://ibb.co/3ktmQFN)

Source: Skew

Honestly, I never had any thinking that bitcoin can't reach its all-time high anymore due to take profit that was planned by them.

I just think that all bitcoin's investors will have the same intention to see bitcoin price touch its all time high.

If you know the technical analyst, there is a strategy called cup and handle strategy where if the price coin touches its high before and the correction come then after that its price movement will pass the previous all-time high and I hope it can happen to bitcoin price when it touches $20.000.

And I think the institutional investor will have a good trader to run their money, it means they are a trader and they should let bitcoin price touch $20.000 again and don't decide as a decision to not sell/taking profit before $20.000 haven't reached.

Institutional investors are indeed better than normal investors. And they definitely do not see this rise as another bubble like what used to be in 2017. The bubble in 2017 was too big and created a huge FOMO covering all crypto investors. Everything was crazy back then and we could not predict what the market tends to. New peak after new peak, this had lured many many people to join the game. Suddenly, everything stopped. Crashing caused FUD. FUD created the next FUD. And then, as the results, crypto value kept decreasing months by months

Right now, the situation has changed. Investors have a solid behavior in the price of bitcoin and this has been recorded by many pieces of research. Amassing bitcoin is what they are doing right now but at a much slower speed. This forms a stable foundation which prevents the price of bitcoin from falling dramatically. Therefore, I personally believe we can surpass our all-time high during this time. And institutional investors are driving our bus on the right path

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Saving my money now in order to make some investment in cryptocurrencies. It is best to put my fund in Ethereum and XRP

This is looking like just a start. Because of these companies coming into bitcoin with hundreds of millions of dollars and them making 50%+ profit along the way because of it, there will be thousands of other companies all around the world with cash reserves looking at them like why are they still in cash and why are they not going into bitcoin with it just to keep it in bitcoin until they find something better.

The implications of these big companies making these type of unheard of income from bitcoin will show rest of the world that they could move to bitcoin too and make a profit there as well, not right away and not right now but they could get in and they could just wait for years before they could profit as well. It is certainly better than %10 they could get elsewhere from fiat income.

Back in 2016 it was just a handful of hedge funds and former Wall Street traders. I think more and more institutions have been dipping their toes in over the years. I don't see it as institutions waiting to go all in at once, not at all. In fact, going with my explanation about Wyckoff above, I see institutions as crucial to the accumulation schematic occurring from late 2018-present. They've been absorbing supply for years and are likely a big reason why price eventually got marked up above the ~$10.5K and ~$13.8K long term resistance levels.


Who says Rome was built in a day? :P

Like I was saying, a lot of institutions are dipping their toes in, as opposed to putting significant trading capital into a relatively illiquid market. It takes time for the kind of liquidity you're talking about to build up. I could see them being more relevant in another year or two.

I definitely think a lot more did it discreetly earlier through OTC brokers. The number and volumes of OTC desks in 2016 were already really large, and a lot of it off-chain too, especially when you had the same custodians just basically changing ownerships of wallets or maintaining off-chain accounts. So I still think a lot of that was and continues to be invisible.

But yes haha baby steps for Bakkt and the like. I'm not dissing the opinion, and agree this could very well be organic.

Big companies are now pushing themselves to adopt the future digitalization system where Bitcoin is a reasonable investment to take now. They'll be buying in volume and that hugely affects the price trend making it high.

If we could read this article (https://news.bitcoin.com/here-are-the-top-public-companies-that-have-adopted-bitcoin-as-a-reserve-asset/) they are preserving more Bitcoin for future used and more companies will come to follow then.
It was just a few companies who have already done this but it goes far already and has a huge impact on the market. As we expecting more and more establishments will accept bitcoin, the more we see such sentiment.

You are right being a whale and an institutional investor does not mean by itself that they are going to come to this market for the long term, however just a few days ago the CEO of MicroStrategy literally stated that the reason they entered the market of bitcoin was because they wanted to find a store of value, so there is no doubt in my mind that someone looking for that is looking for a way to store their money and their wealth in an investment for the long term.

And while not everyone is doing that and we cannot expect them to do that it is refreshing to know that investors with large amounts of capital are considering bitcoin to be the best option to store their wealth in this changing world.

Assuming if this is true then we all know what they can do as well and that is pull the market down, basically they have a big influence in the market if that is what the article is implying since the capital they have as well as the position they have is already big that can move the prices with their decisions. So assuming that the institutional investors will be more and more in the coming days then they will have more control in the market which is scary to think.

This is a double edged sword so it could mean great things or it could mean horrible things for us. Maybe microstrategy or grayscale didn't bought all of those coins just to make a profit and sell and get out right away, maybe they got involved because they want to hold it as long as they can and try to make a profit, however that doesn't change the fact that they "could" do it as well if they want to.

What stops grayscale from selling hundreds of millions of dollars (is it a billion already?) crypto tomorrow? Is there a mechanism that stops them? There is none whatsoever. So, what we are saying right now is "they could destroy the market by selling a billion dollar worth of crypto but it wouldn't be profitable so they won't do it" and not they can't do it. Which is a bit scary but still we can't do anything about it but to just accept it.

To hear Microstrategy's CEO tell it, they'll never sell, at least during his lifetime: https://cointelegraph.com/news/michael-saylor-claims-the-company-will-hold-bitcoin-for-100-years

Grayscale is different because they sell shares against their BTC to investors. The vast majority is not really theirs in that sense.

I am curious how much they personally hold because they've been pocketing a huge 2% management fee for years, and they take it in the form of BTC. Barry Silbert does seem awfully bullish on Bitcoin after all.


Grayscale can issue new GBTC shares, but clients can't redeem them for the underlying BTC. They can only sell GBTC on the open market.

There may come a time when Grayscale starts allowing share redemption, which could create new BTC supply on the spot market as GBTC shareholders move to arbitrage the gap between GBTC and spot. For now that is not the case, which is fundamentally bullish.

I somehow believe that the Btc price rally today was influenced by institutional investors. But, with a lot of bullish speculations about Btc reaching a 6 digit figure, I don't think these big investors are dropping their bags anytime soon. I mean we're close to $20,000 as of the moment. If you're holding a massive bag, I guess it would always be better to hold it for long term, and that doesn't mean to sell it once Btc gets ahead a few hundred bucks from the last ATH.

It depends and varies to someone because not all are holding for long term and some are really just aiming for gains on the shortest time as possible.

and for the reason of this rise then theres no doubt that institutional investors had already considered out on making such step on accumulating btc specially now that

it had been accepted by paypal and other big companies which might really be a go signal for those traditional investors that are still on doubts.

Implications? There would always be a sell-off and we should really be prepared for that.

I am not entirely sure if it is driven by them, but when you put billions of dollars into any market it would have some impact or another obviously. If you want to put this much money this quickly into some car rental sector, that would make that one go super high as well, it is not really shocking.

There are no implications and there are nothing that makes this more risky or better neither, it is just what it is and I think we just have to move on and continue. This doesn't mean to say that we don't need them, or they are irrelevant, it just means that it would have been like this anywhere else and they just picked crypto, that is it. This is why I believe it is quite important to say that these huge companies will probably keep coming here constantly and grow bigger and bigger, we just have to accept it.

True, but in what way is that any different than what we already have with exchanges, casinos or early adopters? The truth is the situation has not changed, all of those actors could dump their coins and crash the market if they wanted and yet they don't and that is because it is not on their best interests to do so, that is in fact one of the biggest disadvantages of being a whale, retail investors like us could lose a great deal of money if the market crashed but it is very easy for us to get out of it because our capital is small.

But for whales this is very difficult because even if they want to get out of the market because the price is going down or for whatever reason they need sell tens of thousands of coins to get out of their positions and that is not easy at all, this is just one more reason why I think that those two companies are in bitcoin for the long term.

Dunno about this particular rally but what we should be looking at is supply. Many of the coins bought by these types will never reach the open market again. They'll be held, privately traded or used as some sort of collateral.

Mining won't meet increasing demand so that means less floating around that's actually buyable. Every newcomer, be they a little man or institution, is going to build pressure on a shrinking pool of availability.

The really interesting bit, if institutions are balls deep by the time this bubble is ready to pop, is what happens on the way down. Will there be sustained scooping up in a way there wasn't before or will the dumpage be even more brutal? It's not as if any of them will have any emotional investment.

I believe the Bitcoin market will become more like stocks over time, in the sense of thicker liquidity and therefore lower volatility. Like stock market crashes, the downside will still be brutal (-36% in the S&P 500 this past February-March was no joke) but institutions will be, at least to some degree, unloading near market tops and absorbing retail pressure near market bottoms.

Their lack of emotional investment (and deep pockets) are why they can fleece retail investors out of their investments time and time again. Retail investors are emotional and not well capitalized. They can't sustain deep and prolonged losses the way institutions can. I fully expect institutions to be scooping up "cheap coins" in any deep shakeout, or in the later stages of the next bear market.

That is an interesting question, I really think that those institutional investors really gave a thought to the scenario that you are presenting, if they decided to dump their coins they know there is not going to be enough demand in the market to absorb such a huge amount of coins and the crash is going to be brutal as you put it.

So there are only two strategies that I can imagine they can implement, one is to hold their coins no matter what, think about the long term and take the losses, the other option that they have is that instead of waiting for the crash to happen they decide to manipulate the market and begin to sell their coins slowly so no one notices it, then sell a huge amount of coins so the market begins to crash and then buy at an even cheaper rate.

Available supply is low because there's lots of people hoping for new crazy high price, once something like that is achieved, the dumpening will start, and I don't think it matters whether institutions will be dumping or not, there will be enough selling pressure. Retail investors might be not active yet, but they are still easily the biggest group of holders, because who else was buying coins all these years? Many of us have witnessed the 2017 and 2013 bubbles, so we know it's better to sell and maybe rebuy later, instead of only hodling and regretting good opportunities with ATHs.

What concerns me more is not the price they can bring but the effect and how long?because if this is really happening then it means market is manipulated and we are just being driven into our own grave?i dont like the sound of this if true and it seems that  market is not really healthy but just being fed.

institutions buy Bitcoin not to trade, but to invest in it, you are wrong if institutions try to manipulate the market,
the market is only controlled by whales, there are indeed many Bitcoin holders in large numbers, this makes the market easier to manipulate,
but it cannot destroy Bitcoin, there will be people who buy, and circulation will be evenly distributed.

Implication that we are in safer hands right now. And I know that we have moved away from these same people to come to crypto and now we are working with them which is a sad fair of events. However that volatility caused by the decentralized liberal anarcho approach has caused bitcoin to be bought and sold very quickly almost all the time constantly.

When these companies get involved with something they buy it, and they hold it for years, maybe even decades, hell warren buffet has shares he owned to this day for the past 50 years. So, basically what this means is that, they are taking out bitcoin out of the market and they are putting it on their wallets which means there is even less bitcoin than it should be, which causes a new scarcity increasing the price.

I really think that people not really preferring to sell bitcoin is not new, I mean there are tons of people in crypto world who do not want to sell as well, plus we have like what.. a million bitcoins gone because of satoshi? And tons of people who send money to him and his addresses which can't be retrieved for now as well, so there is really ton of reasons why we know bitcoin is something we do not want to use or spend or sell, we just want to get into bitcoin and never get out.

It means these companies will do that too obviously, I am not against it nor I do not want to prevent them from growing bigger, but we shouldn't be shocked when they come out and say they will never sell, unless something major happens, no long term investor would want to sell neither.

According to the market reaction from Being pumped to $19,000 and drops to 16,000 yet not staying in 17,000 strongly .

My point is We still cannot make conclusion Until the value of Bitcoin and of course the altcoin Moves Either badly Down or Greatly UP,From those movement maybe we can finally answer if this really Driven by Institutional Investors or This is the effect of People entering crypto for Their own benefits,because we cannot deny that there are couple of reason why The Pump is literally Legit and not a Bubble.

There is no way we could know what their aim would be, I mean we can make some calculations and guesses and even predictions but none of them will be true.

Only because these companies do not know what they will do in the future themselves neither. They could say that they will never sell but something will happen that could make them sell and have no other option but to sell, or they could say they will sell when it is $30k, but when it is $30k they have enough money and support to continue.

So, I do not trust even them saying something themselves, hence we can never know what the implications will be neither, it is going to be totally random and will only really be something we just have to learn to live with. I doubt it would be that weird though, I mean total people who are not institutional but regular investors probably outweight the big companies when combined.

I'm not sure though, bitcoin marketcap is $300 billion now, but there are top holders of bitcoin like satoshi, Bulgaria, Bitfinex , FBI , The Winklevoss Twins

https://www.quora.com/Who-are-the-biggest-public-known-holders-of-Bitcoin-BTC

and probably more big institutions are holding, the thing is we cannot verify as everything is anonymous.

Eventually not just institutional investors will sell. Regular people who had bought a fraction of BTC and sees a profit will most definitely sell. The price will eventually saturate like being overbought and people dump but the price will likely be more than $20k probably even 3x than $20k. The only question I guess is if you are going to commit same mistake like you did in 2017 bullrun.