Bitcoin Forum

Yes, you heard it right now Bitcoin becomes the 20th in the biggest assets by marketcao vakue which crossed $300 Billion due to the recent bullish trend on the crypto market.And more importantly bitcoin's market cap value is over the PayPal's market cap value.This analysis was made by the site called Assetdash which keeps tracks the data of global assets.

But bitcoin yet to cross over the two biggest payment processing companies like Mastercar and Visa which are at 18th and 11th respectively. Next biggest crypto in the list is ethereum at the 199th place.

So what is your view on these guys? Do you believe that this increase can change the global economic structure and convince the traditional investors that Bitcoin is nit just a seasonal bubble?

Reference:  https://decrypt.co/47498/bitcoin-is-now-the-20th-biggest-asset-by-market-cap

About Bitcoin being compare with payment processors companies just like Visa and Mastercard, it's kinda  far from Bitcoin if we only talk about transactions, since Visa got around 65,000 transactions per seconds while Bitcoin got only around 4.5 transactions per seconds.
But I am not being negative on Bitcoin, there are just some part that these payment processors are really different with Bitcoin.

Bitcoin's market cap is very unstable. It rises as quickly as it falls. So while I don't agree in calling Bitcoin a seasonal bubble, its entering in the top 20 biggest assets by market cap is probably not as consistent as the other companies mentioned.

It is hard for Bitcoin to maintain a rank in this list which is predominantly composed of traditional markets. It's not like companies whose market caps basically reflect their overall performance. In Bitcoin's case, it all purely depends on the demand.

Market capacity does not give much information because it changes strongly according to price movement. Therefore, we cannot say that bitcoin will maintain this market capacity.
Part of this capacity is fake because many platforms fake trading volumes to look as if they contain more liquidity and attract more clients.
After some regulation occurs, we will see much less market capacity, but then demand and supply will increase further.

Bitcoin isn't perfect system but it has its own advantage which maybe preferred by the users when they realize the importance of it.But top 20th spot is something great for the crypto community to give more confidence for them while holding bitcoins.

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Its not about reaching the first rank or higher rank from 20th place but we can say that bitcoin is not something which can be eliminated from the global economy from now on. Well value of bitcoin is more accurate and transparent compared to other companies because the value got from demand and supply and easily accessible for everyone.

It was inevitable. We expect bitcoin to get into the top 10.

Not yet. The investors need to know more details about bitcoin so that they can invest in bitcoin. Bitcoin price is not unstable, and that is the big concern from the investors if they want to invest in bitcoin. The global economy still needs money to solve the problem, and it needs more time for all countries to use bitcoin. But we need to see what will happen after that because bitcoin's journey still has a long time.

As for changing the global economies which has plunged so much this year, Bitcoin can't change anything about that, mind you that the economy relies more on traditional institutions rather than bitcoin, which is dex and can't be controlled by any third party. Having said that, Bitcoin is obviously not a "seasonal bubble", anyone who thinks that way is prolly just being anti-bitcoin, or is ignorant of Bitcoins development since it was created.

Traditional investors choose their investments based on what suits them, Warren Buffet for example doesn't invest in Bitcoin, cause he doesn't consider it his kind of investment asset. The news is big for Bitcoin holders and firms that have adopted Bitcoin either as a reserve asset or an investment plan.

Some can hardly imagine how much it is actually $300 billion, but we need to know that every billion is actually 1000 millions. That’s a lot of money, but if we look in some other contexts than it really isn’t, because the often mentioned gold has a market cap of about $9 trillion - and 1 trillion is 1000 billions.

Let's say that Bitcoin will come on the radar of many people and institutions only when the news comes that it has reached that magical $1 trillion market cap. At the moment, we would need a price of around $50 000 for that, and as BTC has moved forward, let no one be surprised if that happens over the next year.


We are witnessing some long-time challengers of Bitcoin ideas changing their minds and there will surely be more of them as time goes on. Still, some will end up in the grave rather than change their minds, but that is still their problem.

https://i.imgur.com/yOoundl.jpg
Source (https://www.google.com/search?q=warren+buffet+bitcoin&client=firefox-b-d&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwji39K1oe7sAhVhk4sKHebyDPMQ_AUoAXoECBYQAw&biw=1280&bih=569#imgrc=5Vkag0WIpw0cXM)

Marketcap is one of the most useless metrics for Bitcoin, the fact that Bitcoin's supply multiplied by the market price does not affect us in any meaningful way. You can't tell people who aren't into Bitcoin that it's the 20th biggest asset and expect from them anything than a big yawn. Bitcoin's adoption, usability in the real world, new features, network security and resilience - that's what important. The price isn't a direct and objective reflection of those things, we have seen $4,000 and $16,000 this year, without any big fundamental changes - just pure speculation.

Is it the goal of bitcoin, to win over the trust of traditional market investors and change the global economic structure? I don't think so!

Bitcoin was never created to take over the traditional markets or even change the current economic structures. It is impossible for a single currency system to achieve such a huge task! It's indeed a great news that bitcoin is the 20th biggest asset by the market cap but that's not possible for bitcoin to change the economic structure of the world unless there is a nuclear war where majority of the human population is wiped. In a nutshell, the world order needs to fail before bitcoin can take over and that's highly unlikely to happen!

It's amazing to see how far bitcoin has come over these past few years.  I remember finding bitcoin back in 2014 at some point, and being instantly fascinated, but I wasn't sure if it could ever "blow up" like it has now.  I wasn't sure that an overall uneducated society would realize the benefits of cryptography and cryptocurrency.  I am glad I was wrong!

In the long run, it will. But if those die-hard traditional investors don't like to dive to bitcoin, it won't just happen even bitcoin goes to the top 5 biggest global assets.
We don't have to impress them and convince them though. But time will come that there will be several changes in their minds and bandwagoning.

First, this is a good announcement and it proves that the journey of Bitcoin mainstream has already started.

I know you're not being negative on Bitcoin because you actually mentioned the weakness of Bitcoin but I think it because you dont notice that despite the fact that Bitcoin process 4.6 transactions per seconds none of the project like ETH, Tron, XRP etc that process thousands of transactions per second were able to dethrone Bitcoin even the government when they are against.

That's because Bitcoin it special it not always about TPS but the potential and the bond it has.

Comparing assets with the numbers of users of a company product...
Ford is ranked below Ferrari, but they produce a hundred times more cars than them.
Why don't you compare bitcoin with something that matches its characteristics? Oh, wait, there is none, so can we stop with those already?


The whole thing you mentioned about volume driving price up is not real, we had volume records even while going down, the number 3 in terms of $ value is the drop from march this year, price fluctuations drive volume up not the other way around.
Anyhow, I'm really curious how will this supply and demand thingy will increase faster...

Even before the market turning bullish it even touched the top order in terms of market cap. By the time I think it reached the sixth place based on its marketcap. The position keeps moving as the market is highly fluctuating. Marketcap falling below 20th position isn't gonna contribute anything big to the market. If the trend change, parallel to that will be the marketcap.

Yes, Warren Buffet can be the best investor in that modern world but it doesn't mean he is going to be right with every opinion which doesn't fall under his category. Who knows maybe in the next couple of years he may recognize that bitcoin is something which he was wrong about his predictions.

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At least we are ready to accept it. :D Which will be helpful for us to get the benefits of bitcoin sooner than mass people finds it.

https://twitter.com/davthewave/status/1326795468593131520

this is a decent chart, gold market cap parity in 20 years

I'm sorry but traditional investors are quite silly if they see an insanely successful asset such as Bitcoin as a "seasonal bubble". To me, market cap isn't worth that much when it comes to asset comparisons. I value other characteristics way more than mcap.

I don't think market cap is directly proportional to the mainstream adoption. These two don't go that way.

A lot of people see him as if he's some kind of God. Same goes for a lot of other successful people. Success doesn't make you right/perfect. We're all humans and I personally see following others and letting yourself be influenced by them as a quite sad way of thinking. I'd rather think on my own and commit my own mistakes.

Many already said it's not a good basis as it moves differently anytime, however having listed can make others use bitcoin too especially if they are not believer and somehow always see bitcoin being listed along with known companies then they can do research on their own and see how the can benefit from having bitcoin as an asset.

Funny advert. I think this is the kind of news (BTC marketcap) that can get people of all kinds interested in BTC. Including people with decent amounts of money. They wouldn't want to completely miss out on the hype.

Let's say they already own some Tesla shares (incidentally also at a similar market cap), maybe they bought significantly cheaper than now, and feel smart about it. Well, if they look at BTC and don't own some, they'll feel dumb about that. It's still time to own a BTC or two just in case, and if they look long enough, they will notice that with BTC, there is no stock split, no emission of millions of new BTC, etc.

I think most will agree that his time is running out because he is about 90 years old, and he really has no reason to change his mind because he has so much money that he could not spend it to live another 90 years. Best of all, his predictions about BTC have shattered if we take into account what he said on the subject back in 2014. He is just a man who makes mistakes like everyone else, which includes completely wrong and failed investments.

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It's funny how some turned out to be funny, because if you could buy something for a few hundred dollars and you didn't do it - now you're paying an astronomical price just to be a part of it. I say that this is one of the rare occasions when the little ones may have outplayed the big ones, because we have known for a long time the real potential of Bitcoin, and they only found out about it recently.

Yes, you are right and I also thought about the same but I dont know how the article writer posted by the OP do their calculations because the total marketcap provided on cmc and coingecko says $296Billion which I believe the addition of some OTC trading capital could be the reason why they said the total Bitcoin cap is $300Billion.

Marketcap mertic isn't really worth to be considered when it works as a cryptos but in reality cryptocurrencies are in use for investment purposes more than the payment options.If you agree that then marketcap is something to be considered and I am just saying thag now traditional investors may get convinced that bitcoin is something to be considered which was never in their mind when creator said bitcoin is going to change things in this world by enthusiasts.

Market capitalization is important for a company, but Bitcoin isn't one. So I agree with those pointing out that if we compare it with Visa, we should have a look at the number of transactions per second, and I'd add the number of users to that. If we look at these characteristics, Bitcoin is way behind to seriously compete with them. Big marketcap means Bitcoin has high value per coin, but it doesn't signify what is it valued for. And apparently, it's value doesn't come from it being a decentralized payment medium, but instead comes from Bitcoin being a popular investment and something to trade. Not to mention that with BTC volatility, the marketcap can drop hard pretty easily, whereas other metrics give a more general idea.

I have already read this news in another blog and no way to deny that bitcoin is competing strongly with all other businesses worldwide. If we talk about its overall assets price then i will say that, Its just the beginning and brighter days are waiting for its users. Except bitcoin other businesses are running under the shadow of their owners and getting optimum support from their government but what bitcoin is doing all just by its community power.

After passing all obstacles, negativism, legality issues bitcoin is doing its best and if i am not wrong then entire world is admiring by seeing its stability in pandemic situation. Everyday new people are getting introduced with bitcoin and increasing the community. If it continues like this then we can expect much stronger position in the global market cap list.

It can increase in value even more and significantly, which I do not rule out. Then we can really go to a record height.
That would be nice for the stock market, and get an even stronger price / market share. First, move to the $ 20.000 and then the sky is the limit.

This pandemic condition provides an opportunity for beginners to get to know bitcoin more and learn about it. The strength of bitcoin during the pandemic even made people who received stimulus from the government as capital to invest in bitcoin, this is the right time to introduce bitcoin more and continue to promote it. getting a good position in global cap is good news for botcoin. Investors will continue to arrive and more and more adoptions will be made.

Comparing Bitcoin as asset to others in the world doesn't seem good to me becasue most of them aren't digital assets, so, why comparing these assets?. Days ago the Bitcoin market-cap was reading $300+B which was another leap for the community, hope to see more market-cap which will push Bitcoin to the top first before 2021.  Although, in term of transaction per se, other payment methods are more ahead of Bitcoin.

That’s really cool and I just hope that it keeps on maintaining that top position and keep on going up. I’m happy that the price has been going up lately and the market cap has also been increasing.

But, I have been noticing some technical analysis of some people saying that it will fall again, though I don’t want to believe that, because what I have had in mind from the beginning is that there is going to be a continuous growth till BTC reaches a new all time high price and market cap, something above the $20,000 mark before we start talking about whether it will go down or not.

Market Cap is the amount you get by multiplying the total number of BTCs mined so far by the current price, so with the current numbers we get $296,737,992,354 ($16,006.69 x 18,538,368 BTC). MC should not be confused with trading volume which is actually difficult to calculate because it depends on the accuracy of the data provided by crypto exchanges, and what is happening in the OTC market is a complete unknown.

According to some speculations, some have estimated that the OTC market is approximately equal to or even larger than the open market - in other words, background trading is very popular.

I am not in agreement with the current methodology which is used to calculate the market cap. IMO, lost coins should be completely excluded while calculating market capitalization. As per reliable estimates, there are close to 3 million lost coins (i.e those without private keys). Also, market cap should take in to account those coins which are not in free-float. Should we include coins which were mined in 2010, and not moved till now in the market cap calculation?

Yes, when you write this thread, bitcoin ranks 20th in the market capitalization based on assetDash. But now it’s down one rank to 21st. But this doesn’t matter because Bitcoin has an excellent performance as the most valuable digital currency with bitcoin’s rising market capitalization value, it could even beat a PayPal-class company is in 30th position.
This situation is very proud considering the price of bitcoin can rise as fast as it falls. And my perception is also that the market capitalization price of Bitcoin will go up and down, unlike other assets. But Bitcoin still boasts that Bitcoin is still precious compared to large companies such as PayPal, Netflix, Coca-Cola, and Adobe.

Lost coins still plays a role in the value of the bitcoin per unit so I don't find any reason why it should be excluded from the total marketcap.And these are lost coins based on assumptions but still it can be accessed when the user gets their private keys.

Right, which makes everything a little bit confusing for Bitcoin. In Bitcoin's part, not everything is well accounted for. Lost coins are playing a role in the value of Bitcoin because it means the supply is much lower than what is being indicated. Those lost coins have value but those lost coins have no more owner. The value is limited to the possibility that it will be recovered or retrieved. If not, the value of those coins will be zero.

How are you going to measure the lost amount. AFAIK it's all based on estimations. We don't know how many coins were lost. Even if you assume that coins that weren't moved for the last 8 years must be lost, the same can be said about coins moved last year. There are wallets being lost and recovered every month, so dormant addresses are not an indication of lost coins.
For me the situation with Bitcoin climbing up in the list of assets is completely normal. It's going to go much higher.

To be honest, Bitcoin does not need to be legalized, because cryptocurrencies are actually without regulations,
regulations only make crypto currencies more difficult to get the world's attention,
what must be regulated is about ICO, IEO and STO fundraising and of course about investing.

I don't agree, there are more unlined bitcoin that is still in there, out of the market, how come they can compute the market cap? I don't know maybe this is only for me or I am right, but bitcoin will always be bitcoin and will top for me in case of market cap. nothing can beat bitcoin in everywhere.

here is your problem, there is no such thing as "reliable estimates" there is only guesses that are very unreliable too. some of them are of course pretty good guesses but nothing more.
that means you can't use them as a means to compute the total bitcoin circulating supply.

i'm curious to know what you think about altcoin market caps which is the only metric that is used in ranking them these days? if you think it is bad in bitcoin wait to see how top altcoins have impossible to compute and even fake supplies...

No one had to expect this to happen, not even the creator of Bitcoin. It is likely we are seeing the outcomes of our continuous support since from the start. Now, it gonna be interesting these traditional investors are shifting to Bitcoin and let Warren Buffet realize that he was wrong. This it means that big companies are using Bitcoin now for the purpose to make a higher profit. This is also a way why PayPal is also willing to risk over Bitcoin.

But anyway, even Bitcoin doesn't get into the line and is one of the biggest assets, I'm still investing in Bitcoin and consider this as a valuable asset aside from traditional gold and silver.

I thought it was rank 6th biggest currency in the world. We know how much bitcoin had worth in the market. Anyway, 20th rank is not bad either knowing that there are many rich country around the world. USA or the US dollar is one of the strong currency with China, Russia and some western countries and I think in some parts too in asia. Yet, this is not something that can be seen by now because bitcoin keeps growing everyday.

Its not about the market cap of all the currency list,its about all the assets in this world which includes gold and the value of biggest companies.

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Even though the coinmarket is not really important its going to climb up in the upcoming years which is going to attract more people eventually, we can say that bitcoin is not created for the purpose of being one of the preferred investment asset but its still becoming one which has its pros and cons.

Exactly. A company earns money, Bitcoin doesn't. When you buy a company's shares, you expect to get a dividend, or the price to rise, or both, because the company will generate profits. Bitcoin doesn't generate profits. So a better comparison should be with gold or similar assets (works of arts, collectibles...).

The best guess is that around 190000 tonnes of gold have been mined, so at today's price of 61$/gram, that gives us 11590 billion "market cap" for all the gold in the world (not counting unmined gold, just like we're not counting unmined BTC). Still ways to go for Bitcoin !

It's just the beginning of a bigger thing to come.  As more and more bigger financial institutions lend support to bitcoin and make it easier for their customers to buy and use bitcoin. I expect bitcoin to move higher up in the financial table maybe 2 years from now. Don't sell your bitcoin, never fall for any bad analysis. 

Well, actually, although bitcoin was conceived as a peer-to-peer electronic cash system, it is actually being used more as a store of value. A creation can go beyond what its creator conceived.

All those institutional investors which are buying bitcoin, like MicroStrategy, are not buying it as a currency, they are buying it as a store of value that protects against inflation.

For the value behind the Bitcoin network and technology it's market cap is still extremely low in comparison with the potential.

It's still early, guys. $16000 will probably seem like $3000 in a year two.

Methodology that those coins who have not moved in a certain number of years are considered lost BTC (say 4), is something that someone can use to do their internal analysis, but as you say it's just a guess that has no solid facts behind it. As we have seen lately, coins from 2010 are often the subject of debate, and it is precisely such transactions that show that we cannot really know what has been lost and what has only been kept in the long run.

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This has been pretty clear to some for a long time, some others seem to have only recently discovered it, and some still stick to their old stories that Bitcoin will collapse one year in the future. If we refer only to the price, then I would agree that we are still very low considering how little BTC is in circulation at all, and what the total supply is. I remember a few years ago that someone wrote that there are about 36 million millionaires in the world, and only 21 million BTC - I'm sure there are even more (millionaires) today - in other words, I believe that there will come a time when it will not be so easy and simply to buy a BTC, no matter what price someone will be paying.

You are completely correct and the conditions of the OTC trading which is relatively unknown and also have the chance to surpass the open market explained the reason why the article writer stated Bitcoin capital to be $300B instead of the $296B.

I'm sure there are a lot of lost coins anyway, but yes pointing them out isn't easy. Most of the time the people who owned these coins either forgot about them, so they're unlikely to remember their BTC address, or they have died, with no plan to pass on the private key.

What do we expect after bitcoin reaching to 16K$ and that composes almost half of its market with other altcoins in the crypto market which also had a great and huge market just for altcoins itself for bitcoin. In this case we should be happy that bitcoin had been making a record for one of the biggest asset in the market and that we be confidence that because of these people will love and bitcoin and that wll ensure bull run.

Exactly, there's more to what we're currently witnessing, basing the judgement on the fact bitcoin is still barely making a stand in the industry and has already achieved all it has in the past few years, it's a positive signs there are greater things coming if only we'll be patience enough to let the technology be and not try to force our centralized ideology on it like the etf and government approval that has been in discussion over the last few years.

I'm pretty sure it'll top that list in next 5-10 years, the asset in the list aren't that mind blowing like bitcoin is. None has the advantage and unique features bitcoin has which is its decentralized nature.

Not bad for a 10 years old market.taking the 20th position is such a short time is an achievement for the whole crypto community.

But wait if Bitcoin makes it top 20 now what more back in 2017 when the price reached a 20,000 value and the Whole marketcap of crypto is almost a trillion ?
Actually not to mention the recent take over of Defi projects in which big amount from Bitcoin cap has been transferred for a while.

Bitcoin is the most violent coin in the crypto world.No body cannot know what's happing now bitcoin can up anyone time or down anytime.Bitcoin market cap now $328,326,494,260 and it will be 20000$ soon.If bitcoin gets negative feedback from other down anytime otherwise it will be cross the previous record.

In November, the upward trend in institutional investment in Bitcoin also intensified, which has been stable at a high level for several months in a row. In particular, large investors are showing an increased interest in buying Bitcoin. It is the large investors who show an increased interest in buying Bitcoin. In particular, billionaire Stanley Druckenmiller publicly talked about his investments in Bitcoin this week.

Open interest in Bitcoin futures on CME is close to $1 billion. In October alone, this figure rose by 169%. It is noteworthy that the number of large futures holders (contracts from 25 BTC) increased by 126% compared to 2019. According to Arcane Research, it is the new entrants who have entered the crypto market amid the current surge in Bitcoin and the growing fear of lost profits that fuel the open interest in Bitcoin.

bitcoin is not a seasonal bubble because bitcoin price depends on both sellers and buyers in the crypto market.  what is clear is that for now the price of bitcoin continues to rise, we do not know how long the price of bitcoin will continue to rise and there is nothing impossible that the price of bitcoin will go down again because this is a trading system.

You are right, in terms of technical analysis, we are likely to cross the 20,000 mark

after pandemic event and several year of "stable" value bitcoin isn't a seasonal bubble.
we have seen the value grow stepwise and it's becoming bigger!

most of altcoins unfortunately have this scenario of seasonal bubble just few of them are able to become widely accepted and are not just a pump and dump scheme.

As far as the market cap is concerned, yes it is on the rise and as of now, it has surpassed even major companies. However, changing the whole economic structure is totally another thing that doesn't seem possible for at least a decade or two. If we are the luckiest people on the planet then maybe three to four years.