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Title: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: Initial_D on November 15, 2020, 09:56:41 AM Hello there, I have a question that annoying me last days.
Can anyone explain me please, what happen if Some organization (corporation or country or maybe even some group of people) create Quantum Computer? How it could affect on Bitcoin if this (let say group of people) want to destroy the whole system. As I understand with the Power of such computer you could easily select private keys or create a 51% attack? And probably give advice what to do in that case, I mean it would be enough to store my Bitcoin on cold wallet(It would be safe?), or panic sell in physical gold)) Thank you in advance. Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: Tytanowy Janusz on November 15, 2020, 10:18:31 AM Quantum Computers are not just super fast computers. Computer made by this technology is specified to solve a specific problem. It needs months and huge money to calibrate it to do this. So if any day there will be quantum computer that will try to attack bitcoin - it will be made in purpose to do only this one thing. Will it be profitable? Probable not because simple fork will make this quantum computer useless.
And you also need to know that this is very far future. And only few companies works on that technology. So in next 10-50 years Google, IBM and someone else mine purpose of doing quantum computers most likely will not be destroying bitcoin - there are more fun, needed for society, profitable aspects that will be the purpose of quantum computers rather than shot to the knee from marketing point of view. Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: BlackHatCoiner on November 15, 2020, 10:20:58 AM First of all, take a look on this thread, it's a nice discussion: I don't believe Quantum Computing will ever threaten Bitcoin (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5157696.0).
As far as I know, if a quantum computer so strong as we imagine it gets created from some organization tomorrow, it will be a threat to bitcoin mainly for the public key part. There are already people that try to find a way to reverse a public key back to its private key and I can see that they've done some good work (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5244940.0) behind all these advanced maths that I don't understand. So, since someone makes a transaction and his public key is known, he may be in danger from such attack. Reversing a public key is "possible", but currently is infeasible (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5279569.msg55308914#msg55308914). I guess that that's the big problem that bitcoin will face from a quantum computer. It can be faced really easily, though. Once you make a transaction send the rest of the money to a non-used address you own. The other catastrophic theory is that a quantum computer can brute force a sha256 result. I don't know if that'll be true. I hope not. Otherwise, bitcoin is dead. As for the 51% attack, I wouldn't worry. Even if it happens, it will be something temporary. Sooner or later, the computer will spread to the rest of the world. Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: mardaed on November 15, 2020, 10:41:59 AM Quantum Computers are not just super fast computers. Computer made by this technology is specified to solve a specific problem. It needs months and huge money to calibrate it to do this. So if any day there will be quantum computer that will try to attack bitcoin - it will be made in purpose to do only this one thing. Will it be profitable? Probable not because simple fork will make this quantum computer useless. And you also need to know that this is very far future. And only few companies works on that technology. So in next 10-50 years Google, IBM and someone else mine purpose of doing quantum computers most likely will not be destroying bitcoin - there are more fun, needed for society, profitable aspects that will be the purpose of quantum computers rather than shot to the knee from marketing point of view. I was thinking that too If someone managed to have a quantum computer it might destroy the Bitcoin but as you said we can avoid this by making a fork but can you elaborate this one? Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: globalpain on November 15, 2020, 10:46:02 AM As far as I know, this is just a rumor, there is no proof that quantum computers will destroy cryptocurrencies.
Until now, cryptocurrencies are still very safe, hacker cases also often occur in centralized exchanges, and private wallets are still very safe, only cases of phishing attack so far. Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: btc_angela on November 15, 2020, 11:01:39 AM The other catastrophic theory is that a quantum computer can brute force a sha256 result. I don't know if that'll be true. I hope not. Otherwise, bitcoin is dead. As for the 51% attack, I wouldn't worry. Even if it happens, it will be something temporary. Sooner or later, the computer will spread to the rest of the world. What quantum computing can do in theory is derived your private key if your public key is exposed. So if your public key is not there then there's no way that even a super computer can hack a private key. And I'm sure that once bitcoin or blockchain is vulnerable, then we will have a consensus to go to the next level of cryptographic hash. Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: BlackHatCoiner on November 15, 2020, 11:10:42 AM What quantum computing can do in theory is derived your private key if your public key is exposed. So if your public key is not there then there's no way that even a super computer can hack a private key. I'm not sure, but quantum computers, I'm imagining, are known to have an enormous number of calculations per second. Maybe it intervenes the 2256/sec. Again, I'm not sure, I haven't made my search. I'm just saying some words a friend of mine told me. It may be totally BS.And I'm sure that once bitcoin or blockchain is vulnerable, then we will have a consensus to go to the next level of cryptographic hash. Yeah, about that. How exactly are we going to do this? Bitcoin developers can't just make many changes to the code. I will be considered as fork. Also, even if they can, the damages that will have been caused from quantum computers will already be huge.Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: romero121 on November 15, 2020, 12:58:10 PM For simple understanding, Quantum computers are developed in such a state to perform tasks that weren't possible with the normal computers. As of now the quantum computers can breach the bitcoin network if there isn't no further update. With the present quantum computer it isn't possible to make anything or steal the private key with its power.
Atleast it requires another five to ten years of time to develop a quantum computer that can get into the bitcoin network, by then the bitcoin network will be much updated. Possibly quantum computers will be used in mining in the future. Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: DapanasFruit on November 15, 2020, 01:29:54 PM Talking about possible threats to bitcoin, quantum computing is one of the top concerns though this is still of the future and nobody can be sure when this technology will be of use to anyone. So I am expecting that by the time quantum is operating and equipped to sow chaos against cryptocurrency, Bitcoin has already evolved a lot and its security is already tight and ready to withstand any kind of threats available. So maybe we should not worry much on this beast as it is still imaginary, to say the least. Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: hatshepsut93 on November 15, 2020, 02:33:20 PM Hello there, I have a question that annoying me last days. If this question is really bothering you, why didn't you use the search function? Quantum computer threads are created a few times each month, this topic is beaten to the death, nothing new is added each time it is discussed, because there's no breakthrough in quantum computers. Cryptographers around the world are already working on quantum-resistant standards, so when they are released, Bitcoin will adopt them too at some point. /thread Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: avikz on November 15, 2020, 02:50:04 PM Hello there, I have a question that annoying me last days. Can anyone explain me please, what happen if Some organization (corporation or country or maybe even some group of people) create Quantum Computer? How it could affect on Bitcoin if this (let say group of people) want to destroy the whole system. As I understand with the Power of such computer you could easily select private keys or create a 51% attack? And probably give advice what to do in that case, I mean it would be enough to store my Bitcoin on cold wallet(It would be safe?), or panic sell in physical gold)) Thank you in advance. Lol!! Quantum computers are still being built and has not yet became a reality. Probably we will be able to see a real quantum computer in next 3 - 5 years. But there's no need to panic because quantum computers will not be available in the market for anyone to buy. So no group will be able to use it for destroying bitcoin! Access to such computers will be highly restricted and the developers will be using them for pre-specified tasks! So I see no reason to worry here! Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: coolcoinz on November 15, 2020, 03:47:20 PM What will happen when they build a quantum computer? Nothing because a computer like that has already been built and performed some basic calculations. The problem with quantum technology is that it is yet incompatible with current binary systems. It requires some time consuming processes for the data to be prepared for a quantum machine and back, the results have to be translated back to binary and built into a normal code. It will be years before it threatens Bitcoin and when it does, banking will also be at risk. Encryption is used for more than just Bitcoin.
Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: Rodeo02 on November 15, 2020, 05:18:46 PM Try reading this to have idea what in quantum computer https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Quantum_computing_and_Bitcoin . And read why you should not be afraid about it, even we already have that or we don't I don't think there will be a big affect in crypto space unless someone can bought that computer cheaply which is most likely not.
Try to read his explaination here why they think it will not threatened Bitcoin I don't believe Quantum Computing will ever threaten Bitcoin (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5157696.0) Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: bL4nkcode on November 15, 2020, 05:33:02 PM Before you concern about bitcoin due to the risk of quantum computers, maybe you should ask and thought that the banking system and other financial systems are also at risk if this kind of computers is built.
While technology is evolving for future QC that can debunk the present encryption and cryptography capability then expect that blockchain/bitcoin/crypto and other financial technology will evolve too. Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: fiulpro on November 15, 2020, 06:29:33 PM Quantum computers won't destroy Bitcoins
Some reasons for my arguments: 1. Government websites and their softwares are far too vulnerable when it comes to **being destroyed by quantum computers** , so they won't allow these devices to be handled inappropriately but rather their distribution will be highly regulated. 2. They are going to be hella expensive so not like everyone around the corner is going to buy them. 3. Companies and people alike are researching on post Quantum cryptography which means in few years we might have foolproof plan against them. Therefore I do believe we might find some answers in the future and at the same time the government would for sure regulate it highly like they regulate everything :')) Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: Silberman on November 15, 2020, 08:42:30 PM Hello there, I have a question that annoying me last days. This has been discussed many times in the past and the answer is always the same, quantum computers are not going to appear from nowhere so there is going to be time for the developers to take measures against that risk, why don't we take those measures now? Because it is unnecessary, bitcoin has now the backing of a lot of powerful people and changing it just because is not going to sit well with them, so only when the threat of quantum computers becomes realistic that is when the change will be made in bitcoin to resist those attacks, so as you can see there is no need to panic at all.Can anyone explain me please, what happen if Some organization (corporation or country or maybe even some group of people) create Quantum Computer? How it could affect on Bitcoin if this (let say group of people) want to destroy the whole system. As I understand with the Power of such computer you could easily select private keys or create a 51% attack? And probably give advice what to do in that case, I mean it would be enough to store my Bitcoin on cold wallet(It would be safe?), or panic sell in physical gold)) Thank you in advance. Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: btc_angela on November 16, 2020, 06:00:25 AM And I'm sure that once bitcoin or blockchain is vulnerable, then we will have a consensus to go to the next level of cryptographic hash. Yeah, about that. How exactly are we going to do this? Bitcoin developers can't just make many changes to the code. I will be considered as fork. Also, even if they can, the damages that will have been caused from quantum computers will already be huge.That's where consensus or shared agreements comes to play: Quote This shared agreement (called consensus) allows people like you to only accept valid bitcoins, enforcing Bitcoin's rules against even the most powerful miners.In addition to improving Bitcoin's decentralization, Bitcoin Core users get: Better security for their bitcoins Privacy features not available in other wallets User interfaces and other powerful features https://bitcoin.org/en/bitcoin-core/ So it doesn't mean they will have to do fork, they could all agree and improve Bitcoin against the threat of quantum computers. Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: kentrolla on November 16, 2020, 06:13:35 AM Quantum computers have good recognization in the market, unfortunately they are not easy to grasp because they are completely governed different nodes.
People should understand it is not at all a thread to blockchain quantum technologies are expanding at a faster rate than previously expected, I believe their development team will come up with unique technology to avoid any scam. Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: Argoo on November 16, 2020, 07:11:47 AM Quantum computers are still not as close as you think, so don't think about it now. In theory and in practice, such a threat still exists. When it becomes reality, it will be too late for many to panic. They will simply be at a loss to consider their empty wallets. However, the first thing to be wary of is the big whales. In this case, they will be the first to be targeted by attackers. Let's hope that by that time they will find how to secure the cryptocurrency from this problem.Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: Leviathan.007 on November 16, 2020, 10:45:27 AM It's obvious that you don't know anything about quantum computers. These are not like the normal computers at to pay some money and by a quantum computers for yourself. Quantum computers requires a new technology and a lots of work to be created. In the other hand this will take a huge a mount of money. Considering the resources needs for a quantum computer, doesn't worth to create a quantum computer just for destroying bitcoin. Also, even if they create such thing whole baking system and encryption system will be on risk.
Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: Cnut237 on November 16, 2020, 03:57:41 PM Quantum Computer? How it could affect on Bitcoin OP, this (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5157696.40) thread has already been mentioned - it's well worth a read! But in case you don't want to go through the whole thing, here is my summary: Hi all :) I thought I’d try to summarise Bitcoin's vulnerabilities to Quantum Computers, as well as some potential defences, and get it all in one post. Apologies for the wall of text, but hopefully it is useful... Mining can potentially be much quicker with QCs. The current PoW difficulty system can be exploited by a Quantum Computer using Grover’s algorithm (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grover%27s_algorithm) to drastically reduce the number of computational steps required to solve the problem. The theorised advantage that a quantum computer (or parallelised QCs) have over classical computers is a couple of orders of magnitude, so ~x100 easier to mine. This isn’t necessarily a game-changer, as this QC speed advantage is likely to be some years away, by which time classical computers will surely have increased speed to reduce the QC advantage significantly. It is worth remembering that QCs aren’t going up against run-of-the-mill standard equipment here, but rather against the very fast ASICs that have been set up specifically for mining. Re-used BTC addresses are 100% vulnerable to QCs. Address Re-Use. Simply, any address that is re-used is 100% vulnerable because a QC can use Shor’s algorithm (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shor%27s_algorithm) to break public-key cryptography. This is a quantum algorithm designed specifically to solve for prime factors. As with Grover’s algorithm, the key is in dramatically reducing the number of computational steps required to solve the problem. The upshot is that for any known public key, a QC can use Shor’s approach to derive the private key. The vulnerability cannot be overstated here. Any re-used address is utterly insecure. Processed (accepted) transactions are theoretically somewhat vulnerable to QCs. Theoretically possible because the QC can derive private keys from used addresses. In practice however processed transactions are likely to be quite secure as QCs would need to out-hash the network to double spend. Unprocessed (pending) transactions are extremely vulnerable to QCs. As above, a QC can derive a private key from a public key. So for any unprocessed transaction, a QC attacker can obtain the private key and then create their own transaction whilst offering a much higher fee, so that the attacker’s transaction gets onto the blockchain first, ahead of the genuine transaction. So block interval and QC speed are both crucial here – it all depends on whether or not the a QC can hack the key more quickly than the block is processed. Possible defences... Defences using classical computers.
Defences using quantum computers. As I’ve said a few times, I’m more of a bumbling enthusiast than an expert, but exploiting quantum properties to defend against QC attack seems to me a very good idea. In theory properties such as entanglement (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_entanglement) and the uncertainty principle (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncertainty_principle) can offer an unbreakable defence. Again, people are busy researching this area. There are some quite astonishing ideas out there, such as this one (https://phys.org/news/2018-04-quantum-blockchain-blockchains-future.html). Title: Re: Quantum Computer Will Destroy Bitcoin Post by: Silberman on November 19, 2020, 05:40:50 PM Quantum computers are still not as close as you think, so don't think about it now. In theory and in practice, such a threat still exists. When it becomes reality, it will be too late for many to panic. They will simply be at a loss to consider their empty wallets. However, the first thing to be wary of is the big whales. In this case, they will be the first to be targeted by attackers. Let's hope that by that time they will find how to secure the cryptocurrency from this problem. |