Bitcoin Forum

After just about 3 years of patiently waiting, it's finally all time high season again. And as with every all time high season, there will be plenty talks of price targets with people planning on finally selling at $20k, $25k, $30k, $50k, or whatever.

Guess what. If you only hold bitcoin to reach a specific sell target, then YOU'RE COMPLETELY MISSING THE POINT.

The reason why cypherpunks, economists, and investors hold bitcoin is because bitcoin is the only asset that can give you true ownership of your money or wealth. And along with that, let's not forget that the federal reserve is printing the shit out of the US dollar. And knowing both of these facts alone, some of you already have exit plans, by planning on dumping your precious bitcoin at whatever price for filthy fiat money? smfh.

/end rant

People should also remember not to invest what they can't afford to risk/lose. That should atleast help them not to panic sell or be too attached to the price of bitcoin.
They can sell some part of their bitcoins anytime they what to... No pressure. Just relax and see what you can do to help keep Bitcoin decentralized and safe.

Targets are the reason for dumps at round numbers like 20 thousand or 10 thousand. People make it easy for themselves to remember and try to sell at these points.

I can understand them because some who plan to hold for more than a year need that push to make themselves take profit and buy something. Otherwise they'd be holding forever as it rises and never spend profits. If you're one of those people who never feel like the price is high enough maybe you need to set a target and stick with it or in you'll have a million dollars in Bitcoin and still live with your parents and drive a 20 year old car to work.

Everyone is neither holders nor rich enough to hold bitcoin for the entire life or a significant number of years. People like me are here to make profits/money out of it and reach predetermined goals. If I just hold "precious" bitcoin till it gets started using in our daily routine, I may not be able to spend it in this life span. Besides, I don't give a dime to the federal reserve is printing the shit out of the US dollar as long as I am building my very first own house from a BTC sell target (that I am gonna buy it at lower for sure).

Now tell me about the missing point!

Everybody wants to do the same as what you describe but people have different sentiments over these and being a trader its something you just can't overlook. If people are willing to sell and get the profit they've been waiting than regret not selling and watch it goes back to where they started is much painful. Profit is Profit. You have to see the market as what the majority is thinking not just yours.

I think it's you who are missing the point - complete ownership of money means people are free to do with them whatever they want, including selling it for fiat. Satoshi never said "don't you dare to use Bitcoin as a speculative investment vehicle", and even if he did, that wouldn't have mattered, because to the network it's irrelevant why are you sending transactions, and Bitcoin wouldn't be Bitcoin if it was different.

And from a more practical point of view, it's great if you can sell on top and buy back later, instead of missing out on some 1000% profits. When people discuss exiting Bitcoin, it doesn't mean that they will never own it again, it just means that they expect a crash.

In General, I absolutely agree with you, but for many traders and investors, buying and selling bitcoin is the main way to earn money. Ideally, you need to store bitcoin, but if we do not sell it and buy it, the market will simply die.

I agree with you
We dont have the right to judge traders desisions because everyone have his own trading strategy...even the one who sell with loses can maybe have reason in the end

Well, that's your point of view, but it doesn't means that you're completely right. You may say that they are missing the point, but you should realize not everyone bought Bitcoin for same reasons as you. It's nothing surprising and wrong that people bought Bitcoin to make profit. And it's normal thing that they have sell target because Bitcoin is just another form of investment.
I understand your point about being independent from fiat and etc. But what's point to hold Bitcoin if you're doing with it anything, you don't spend it or don't trade your crypto.

You have a point. But you just can't stop anyone to sell at any price point that they've set. It doesn't mean that they're not giving importance to bitcoin but all of the events that are happening like the US printing more dollars is just becoming favorable to bitcoin.
And the main point is to be secured in the future and we know that everyone wants to live financially free and that's through bitcoin. It will happen someday if the price points have been met. While waiting for those price points, it's best to have bitcoin stored for a long time that has been set, longer than your price point.

True, but that is only true for long term holders, for those that are interested more in the trade aspect then they need to set goals, that does not mean that they are going to get out completely out of the market that just means they will sell their bitcoin at that point expecting that a correction or a crash happens and then buy more bitcoin in the process and use some of their profits for some of their needs and wants, what you are saying is not wrong but not everyone is going to hold their coins for two or three decades straight so they need to have a plan on when to get out and then when to get in bitcoin again.

You have to understand that a lot of people who bought bitcoin was in it for the money and not for the vision that one day, bitcoin will be widely-used that they don't have to convert it to fiat. There's a slim chance that a lot of people will be saving it for the future and not give it up in the belief that it is all that they have to keep in order to survive, but that possibility is still overshadowed by the hopes of many to be fiat rich, and you can't really change much of that.

What should be done then if holding it and selling in accordance to one's own likeness if this concept is wrong? Gold for years and wait for the mass people to sag to you m that you should sell your investment in an instant? You're probably missing the point. Bitcoin is more often used as an investment due to the issues in its wide usage as a currency and that already broke its concept in the first place. What I mean is that we should allow those who invested or put their money in this technology should be allowed to do what they want with their holdings.

Selling and buying low can equally increase someone's BTC holding. I don't see any harm most especially if the person knows what he/she is doing and technically sound. BTC gave us financial freedom, and we can expand such by taking advantages of some movement.

Good point though, I think for long term holders this is their mindset, to get away from the government and have total control of their wealth and uses bitcoin as store of value. But with a new breed of investors who only cares about getting a profit from the market and then rinse and repeat process, there will be a point in time wherein they will have to sell at a certain price, be $20k or $40k.

And then repeat the cycle to invest again when we enter the bear market, slowly stacking sats and wait for the next bull run to sell and gain some profit. So it boils down to one's personal preference.

You are also missing the point that bitcoin is volatile and that the target profit will always gonna reach though it takes time.  Others also sell off at a particular target price because there is a choice of "holding" it even in a longest period of time. Btc doen to $18k again and itnhardly reach $20k at this point , it  bounce back.

The thing is bitcoin will always have a good value in the future. Certainly that more people and institutions are joining as btc enthusiast, too.

I'm missing the part where I said that no one is free to do whatever they want. Please quote me. The post was obviously for those people who looks at bitcoin solely as a short term make money quick thing, instead of seeing the monetary advantages Bitcoin has over fiat.

Yes, because people have been easily timing the tops and bottoms right?

Each investor has different reasons to invest in bitcoin and different max waiting time to close their investment.

They could spend their own money to invest in bitcoin or they could make a loan to invest and with loan there is expiration date. Even if they invest with their own money, they also have few reasons close their investment for personal financial reason. I don't recommend anyone to make any loan to invest in bitcoin as the votality of bitcoin and panic will be greater under pressure of loan and expiration date.

Obviously, if one investors invest with spare money (savings) and don't actually have financial reason to cash out, they should hold their bitcoin next 5 years (one year after the next halving)

This could be anyone who doesn't utilize the possibility of gaining through bitcoin. OP you should know that sometimes in life, you should roll with the punches. Can I buy ramen and 1 kilogram of pork with bitcoin in my country, spoiler alert: I can't. If only there are more business that are cryptocurrency integrated then your dumbass rant would be right, but no, you force people to your ideal that if they follow you, the world will be a better place. I agree with the quote above, what is the point of hodling when you can't reap the benefits.

If you think that just because you can't buy pork with your bitcoin right now that it automatically means that you won't be able to in the future, then fucking LoL. But I guess you're just a Bitvest campaign peasant so why would I even expect you to understand this shit.

"If you don't believe it or don't get it, I don't have the time to try to convince you, sorry."

But at least having a target amount to sell can save them from sudden fall because this happens all the time.
And besides Putting a specific amount means harvesting time because you plant seed to gain fruits in a certain time.
you will not allow your trees to just have fruit completely all the years without taking them to be beneficial.
We invest here because we wanted to earn money and not just because of the technology or anything ,let it be until the total adoption happen when we can use our Bitcoin in any merchant but for now?let us make some bucks for risking .

I'm curious, why did you ditch your main account to pursue building up this one? You're an alt account shitting on people for being "peasants"... why? Does it make you feel jolly on the inside, your dick feel bigger, or what? Just because you're in a higher paying campaign, you're not also a peasant? Get real.

Most people on planet earth can't afford to sit around and HODL, hoping that bitcoin will one day do what its supposed to do. And that's not their fault. Find some humility and courage to post under your main account and then I will reward you with half of a ballsack.

I didn't know posting on an account without a campaign is automatically equivalent to using an alt acount. So that's how Bitcointalk works!

Really though? I have nothing against signature campaign people. I wouldn't have went for his throat if he wasn't provocative with his words to start with.

Please, just stop. You're embarrassing yourself. In general I agree with your principles but its quite obvious you've resorted to posting under your alt for the sake of slinging shit. If you had something interesting or useful to say, you would have posted it from your main account.


I should hope not because you are in a signature campaign with your main account.

A few other posters have tried to tell you that you're missing the point, some more politely than others.

If people have bitcoin and no money, then blaming them for cashing bitcoin out for money is lame. Simply yelling at them for being poor or overinvested in bitcoin changes nothing.

Sure chum. Have it your way.


Yelling at them for being poor? Where? Clearly the message is not for literally everyone. Like I mentioned on one of my responses, it's for the people solely to make money while missing the grand scheme of things.

I think it depends largely on how Bitcoin gets adopted. People who have a sell target probably intend to sell not just because they want to have dollars/other fiat, but because they want to purchase something with this money (a flat/a car/tuition fees etc.). So it's easy to shift focus from BTC-USD to BTC's purchasing power, and essentially have the same idea, but in a fiat-free form: the idea of exchanging BTC one has been hodling for goods and services that can now be purchased due to the increase of value of Bitcoin. The problem is, we don't know if in a few years from now it would be no problem to purchase something serious with BTC, so the price/purchasing power might go up faster than direct spending of Bitcoin becomes available.
Dollar is not great, but it is something you can actually spend, whereas spending Bitcoin directly means having very limited options of what to buy and where. And taking this into account, I think that having an idea on when to spend Bitcoin on something is better than hodling indefinitely.

Well, due to the price volatility of bitcoin I cannot inculpate those people who have such plans of selling it now especially that we are in the midst of ^[ATH] because no one can guarantee that none of us would sell their bitcoin just to maintain the current price. However, --I perfectly understand that if someone sells their bitcoin then they will definitely miss the brighter future that bitcoin can offer to them in terms of their investments since if we can maintain the price for a period of time then rest assured the price will pump to the moon that would benefit us more. Perhaps this topic can inculcate the real thought behind bitcoin investment to all the holders' minds.

Sensible! This has always been Satoshi's goal. It is a currency and wasn't intended as an investment. Right now, people are buying and selling back because it's still affordable. When it becomes rare, difficult to own, that's when people will see its primary meaning.

Not bad on having this kind of thing in mind yet we do have our own beliefs and perceptions and to know the fact that majority of people who do jump into this
Bitcoin craze is just for its potential earning that they could possibly get not totally on the essence or do talk about its real purpose.

You cant blame out people not to sell off because we know that bitcoin isn't globally accepted yet and do still rely with fiat and if they do have that in mind that
they do need to make profits to earn more dollars then its their own money and its none of our business on how they do gonna handle it.

Just let them be and mind on your own.

Well if you dont then you'll simply miss the chance to sell at an all time high and you will find yourself holding those bitcoins for another 1/2 years to reach that price point again when you could've simply sold and reinvested, so no i completely dissagree with your point here...

That might be convincing OP but we  cannot force the investors to hold their bitcoin just because bitcoin is a good asset or reserve money especially for those people with huge bitcoin investments. They are seeing bitcoin like this and it can't help when you say that bitcoin is something that could be more valuable in the future as time goes by for an investor usually think about profit and that by selling their bitcoin anytime soon it can happen.

Whether they sell their Bitcoin at any price or not, it doesn’t change anything about Bitcoin being a technology that was created for peer to peer transaction.

Everyone has their own choice and I know why a lot of people wouldn’t Bitcoin is because the price is volatile, though we are aware that the price can still increase in future, some people are always using their money for steady transaction and that money can drop at the time they need it, that’s why they wouldn’t consider it as their main place for keeping their money. As for me I divide the money I put into Bitcoin into different addresses, there is a little part I just keep that I use for transaction just because I like bitcoin, then there is the one for investment, it’s just like that.

Actually, selling it in the target has been thought carefully, at least to secure the asset. ANd it is probably not for all in the sale.
We may ever think that we always want to get more and more profits. If it has reached the target, then we cancel it and continue to bigger profits again. And in fact, the market is not as our expectation, it decreases and you are panic selling.
In this case, I will prefer to set a target at least to manage the risks and also set the funds. And make the least for another bigger profits. I am really aware that I will never meet the eagerness and greediness that may make me lose.

You do have a point. But I think you should have a clear goal of selling it. Its true fiat doesn't hold up to the expectations of decentralization but it does have value and there isn't a stable system in place for crypto usage. That's why people still need to sell it at a clear point.

You are kind of contradicting yourself by calling bitcoin an "asset" since currencies aren't categorized as assets but you have a point.
I personally prefer a more balanced strategy, you buy bitcoin when its price is low and everyone is depressed about its price then you sell some of it when its price has gone up and everyone is overexcited with its price. Note that I said some of it not all. It is a good idea to enjoy some fiat profit while bitcoin has not yet reached mass adoption so that you can spend the fiat for now and keep the rest for the mass adoption phase and start spending bitcoin then without selling.

I guess what most people are missing is this.... Let's say you bought Bitcoin now at $20 000 and you hoard it for a few years... then in future when the price goes to $100 000 per bitcoin... you would effectively have higher valued Satoshi and you can buy more with those bitcoins.

So at a price of $20 000 ... you could have bought a car for say 1 bitcoin .....and at a price of $100 000 ...you can buy 5 cars for the same bitcoins. (Not having to convert back to US Dollar, because most merchants and services will be accepting it as a payment/currency then)

                                                                        It is a currency... not a commodity!

Just sell when you need it. Holding for a lifetime and not use it in real life is really worthless. I do not agree to stick with a targeted price. It would be a reason for the loss. For example, during the last bull run in 2017, I had a Bitcoin, I thought I will sell it when the price reaches $30K. But unfortunately, the price has dumped and I lost a lot. Because if I sold it on $19K, and when bitcoin dropped $3K later, then I would buy more than 6 BTC. So I don't like to stick with any specifically targeted price, we should take a real time decision when necessary.

I will disagree. Not all bitcoin users think like you do. The most common concept of others holding  bitcoin is to earn. This is why many are excited knowing about the ATH because they believe they can earn. Yes, they can earn so never blame why many people seeing bitcoin like this an asset and as an investment.

I don't agree with this, there are people who bought at $20k their main target is to at least sell and get back their initial capital after all. Even it means earning $1 interest waiting over the years. Trading bitcoin for interest is an individual rationale that should not be undermine. Some people hold bitcoin as a means of evading taxes by the government while other hold bitcoin as true value of asset.

Based on this, they say that there are traders and there are investors. If you invest as an investor, you must determine for yourself the time moment, the time allocated for investment, after which you would like to have a profit. And investments, as a rule, are designed for long-term storage. And yes, in any case, the profit from the hold is always greater, the probability of losing a coin is minuscule, in contrast to trading.
But I agree with everyone who unsubscribed in confirmation of the facts of the sale by the most common human factor. Anyone in trouble will sell bitcoins if needed due to a lack of other funds. Because one way or another, at some point everyone will find a reason to sell it

holding because you have plan on selling at a higher value makes you hold more your btc as when compare to if you dont have goals because you will end up selling randomly or too early . now tell which is better ? the one that those who hodl right ? however your also missing the point of btc if you will only hodl forever because btc isnt meant for that but btc is meant for active spending just like a regular currency .

for me it doesnt matter if i have a btc or a fiat but as long as i own it , im the owner of it .

So in essence according to @op rant or ideology we should consider holding btc for infinity or hold till btc becomes a globally accepted currency which is when you can actually have true freedom of your wealth,
in this case, btc is priceless, it shouldn't have a price tag, because if having price target means selling btc for cheap then no need to have a usdt value. so whoever is selling now is throwing a priceless gem away.  point taken... ;)

We all reserve the right to our individual opinion, @op opinion on how to hold btc is completely different i can understand, but to me fiat still rules and as such i will have a price target for selling my btc because of the simple fact that the future is very uncertain, what makes the op thinks btc will still hold any value in future! or it will be the digital currency that everyone will use!
i have a price target and am selling when it hit that target, and am not missing any point.