Bitcoin Forum

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Interesting development:


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Does anyone get the feeling JP Morgan is inaccurate here.

The natural scenario appears to be one where most flock to BTC and crypto in the near future. If inflation rises. Prices trend upwards. And concerns about lockdowns coupled with stimulus spending mount. Employees and the private sector will naturally embrace previous metals and BTC in an effort to insulate themselves from negative effects associated with fiat devaluation, inflation and stimulus spending.

I remember a time around 10 years ago when many europeans thought the EU would fail and euro would devalue due to concerns about greece. Many in europe bought big screen TVs and other items, to retain the value of their money, expecting the euro to crash.

I would be interested to know why JP Morgan says history would not repeat itself here.

Maybe they don't want it to? Maybe they thought they'd be able to buy more btc before the price goes up. Perhaps they have a loaded short on btc waiting to be fulfilled from the current price rise...

Analysts of cryptocurrency, tech stocks and further fields aren't going to be accurate either. There also might be a factoring in of the 80% drop that may come again some time potentially THIS year. If you got paid 0.01BTC for a month's work ($3000 eg) and then the value dropped over the weekend to $60k/coin leaving you with $600 you might be hugely out of pocket...

JP Morgan is a bank, isn't it?

I can't even expect them to support BTC unless they find a way to be in advantage themselves. Since MicroStrategy and Tesla have invested that much into BTC, I really expect a strong domino effect going through most of the large companies.

As time passes, Musk's and MicroStrategy's value will most likely rise at some point to an ATH specifically due to their recent actions of purchasing BTC. Other large companies will not be left alone in the course and all they have to do is just see the price evolution of 2009-2021 to realize that they're gonna be left behind if large corporations invest in BTC while they don't.

JP Morgan predicts bitcoin price could rise to $146k in the long term as institutional investors continue to increase their portfolios with the cryptocurrency at the expense of gold, stated in the news on January 5th, later in their next statement when bitcoin price fall to $30k; analysts at the financial JP Morgan Chase doubt that the electronic currency can be traded above $ 40,000 again. Seems their words and predictions contradict each other, not to mention their act to possibly buy bitcoin.
Grayscale, Microstrategy, and Tesla have been investing in bitcoin, how could it does not trigger others to follow their path? it just the early days of 2021, bitcoin still has a lot of room to grow this year upon inflation and depreciation of fiat currencies.

read more (https://www.entrepreneur.com/article/364066)

In a way, JP Morgan is right, if large firms were to follow now, the prices that they are going to pay is going to be big but I don't that it is enough excuse because they can see the potential of increase of bitcoin in the past year and I think that this will be discussed on the board meetings because the latecomers are going to be crying their hearts out because they will be buying at such a large price that they are not going to profit a lot. We just have to see what happens next because we can't trust bankers.

The fud now had to start from the big institutions too to balance Elon's move. ITs however not very convincing because JP morgan is also BTC investor.
If the large firms are not going to buy now, they are going to be at loss again because Elon might just pump it again for another $1.5B. It' will be very difficult to stop cryptocurrency when big names come out already.

These are nothing but their opinions, in 2017 they were calling bitcoin a fraud investment and a bubble and on the back side they started investing in it. The opinions and claims they make has nothing to do with the truth and hence they should be ignore as well.

JP Morgan cannot even say the truth about their investment and how can they predict what other companies will be investing in the future.

I went through the news yesterday when it first appeared in Coindesk. Here is what I find funny:


The last time Bitcoin had a volatility of 80% was in 2018, and with the institutions mopping up more and more coins, we are unlikely to see that sort of volatility anytime in the future. And even if there is an annual volatility of 80%, what is wrong with that? In terms of the total value of the portfolio, it means that the net worth will fluctuate between 99.2% and 100.8%. Is this such a big difference? Nikolaos Panigirtzoglou and other JP Morgan lapdogs need to stop their panic spreading strategy, because no one will take them serious anymore.

Is this the usual strategy of JP Morgan when a known institution have bought a lot and they're missing the time to purchase just as Tesla and Microstrategy did? and don't forget about Grayscale.

They think the game is still the same as before whenever they publish negative words towards the bitcoin community, here goes the panic sellers that will plunge the market to make the prices cheap for them. It could still be the same but impact isn't great as before.

JP Morgan's stance is not very surprising. Their officials have taken a stance against cryptocurrency for a long time. But the good thing is that cryptocurrency users never take them seriously and as a result we are in good profit right now. PayPal also used to be hostile to Bitcoins a few years back. But now look where are they right now. I am quite confident that the same will happen to JP Morgan as well.

JP Morgan said Bitcoin will reach $146,000, then they said it will never rise above $40,000 again, now they say this. There's a lot of analysts working at JP Morgan, so it's not that surprising that there's so many different opinions within this company.

Them being a bank doesn't mean they should be against Bitcoin, if Visa and PayPal and Mastercard are pro crypto, why banks shouldn't?

Once, I tried to follow the announcements given by JP Morgan, because it seemed to me that such a huge institution must have great knowledge and experience - after all, it would not have become so huge if it were not.
Over time, however, more and more often I started to see messages completely contrary to reality, which made me think that this huge institution had become so huge not thanks to knowledge and experience, but thanks to information manipulation.
Therefore, when I see their message now - such as this one, for example - I am more convinced that the truth is quite the opposite.

Isn't this the same JP Morgan that pays "Bitcoin is a fraud" and "I regret making that comment" Jamie Dimon?
They are far from understanding Bitcoin, hence it doesn't matter what they say, since it's probably incorrect.

Although it would have been super funny to see them turning from "Bitcoin is a fraud" to actually investing into Bitcoin, we can't actually expect that from such dinosaurs.

Coindesk article https://www.coindesk.com/teslas-bitcoin-buy-may-not-trigger-wave-of-corporate-demand-says-jpmorgan (I refuse to read articles from Cointelegraph after their erroneous bitcoin double spend article)

If you are in the same position of that JP Morgan analysts where you are also taking care of other people's investment, you'd also become cautious of the price volatility. Yes there are more institutional money coming in but that doesn't fix the volatility of BTC.

I think it's only natural for these big investors not to fall for FOMO after Elon's announcement. They would probably wait if there is a strong demand to support $40K level.

I guess I can't really refute what JP Morgan says because I do not have the power to see the future, maybe all the major companies will get in or maybe none of them will, I really do not know whats going to happen. However I also think, even with all those experts and analysts, they do not know who will get in or not neither, these are personal preferences (well company preferences) and they may not say it out loud but they might be thinking about it or talking about it or trying to find how to do it etc etc.

Moreover, I do not like to talk in absolutes, only siths deal in absolutes, I think this is going to be more like some majors go in and many don't and just spread it around, nothing major for us because we already have wall street on our side now, but still a few more will probably come while many many more will come at a later date.

JP Morgan tries to wishful thinking.  Why is he saying this? 

The main assumption is that he wants to lower the price of bitcoins and buy the first cryptocurrency as cheaply as possible.  In addition, many large corporations (especially banking structures) are wary of Bitcoin.  The main danger (in their opinion) is that Bitcoin will destroy the modern financial system.  And it is true. 

In my opinion, the modern financial system can no longer work as efficiently as before.

If you look at the current economic development controlled by the Central Bank, it is very possible that inflation will be very severe in the future. So much fiat money circulating in the world, so that the issuance of new money for stimulus can cause hyperinflation. This condition makes BTC a part of the best investment alternative today. The concept of Bitcoin that defies Central Authority becomes a tool to fight inflation. JP Morgan is currently only worried that if many big players own BTC, then there will be a possibility of short selling in the future and causing BTC prices to drop. They only dampen the hype in society.

I do not know where they get the idea "that the crypto community expects other companies to enter," it is a comment type "sensation" "conjecture" etc ...
As part of that cryptographic community, I think we are waiting for ordinary people to react and become part of it, the plurality of bitcoin is in the great diversity of investors and not in a few large investments ...

It is a pity that the "echo" of bitcoin is heard through entities against which bitcoin tries to untangle itself, but which undoubtedly seems to be a necessary evil.

People might flee from the stock market (and cash) to precious metals, but I'm not sure if bitcoin is really considered a safe-haven asset that investors go to when they're looking to preserve their purchasing power.  Sure, it might seem all rosy right now when bitcoin is hitting all-time highs weekly, but we all know how volatile it is--especially compared to metals. 

And yeah, JP Morgan can certainly be wrong here.  They've been wrong plenty of times in the past and will be wrong many more times in the future.  They don't have the market cornered on crystal balls.

The larger company just realize that in 2021 that's why they invested in the crypto market not to let the train go out of their hands. Now some larger companies saw that they have already missed their train so they are just creating fud to buy BTC cheap. We may see another correction this year but this time there won't be a scenario like 2018.

*so JP Morgan is currently an advisor to many large corporate companies lmao...
companies of course think about profits and gold currently does not provide big and fast profits like Bitcoin. if those big companies want to survive for the next few decades then they have to invest in Bitcoin. otherwise, they will just be left behind.

JP Morgan is a talented scammer, so I suggest you take all his claims and predictions with a grain of salt. One of the biggest critics of bitcoin known to man, he stops at nothing to shit on bitcoin.

Now on the case of his claim regarding corporations following Elon's move, I couldn't care less if they do or if they don't lmao. We got all the help we need, and frankly enough, it's going to be much more optimal to us small-time investors if there will be lesser whales in the market who can manipulate the price at will, so in retrospect this is actually a good thing if ever.

Big investors should be worried about the dilution of their cash reserves because of
central banks printing of cash. If they are not worried now they certainly will be medium to long term.

Moving wealth into Bitcoin is not primarily about generating profit its more
about preserving the value.

It might take a few more months but the longer this pandemic lasts the more
fiscal stimulus will be needed which means more cash printed which increases
inflation and the devaluing of FIAT.

Why would any savvy investor stand by and watch thus happen?

How many customers of JP Morgan will be asking them,
"are you investing any of my money in Bitcoin?'
and
'why not?'

I don't really care about what he says, what will happen matters the most!!!
More firms will follow Tesla's bitcoin move.

After every halving, price increases dramatically, more and more companies are turning into bitcoin related business. Exchanges make enormous profits (remember how much Binance paid for coinmarketcap), PayPal entered into the market, visa/mastercard is going to enter the market, there will be a huge fight between current crypto exchanges and giant, powerful payment service providers, Elon Musk's word has the huge influence on people's decision and he tested it multiple times, on every test, it was even more intense and powerful. Tesla moved money into Bitcoins, etc... And after that, what do you think, large firms won't follow those steps? It's even beneficial for them to follow it, this will cause a massive sensation and will have an enormously positive effect on bitcoin and on them too.

JP Morgan will say that they do not recommend X until they are the owner of 5% of the X in the world, and then they will say X is supercool. Why do we bother to listen to investment banker´s recommendations?

Because most people tend to be guided by someone's authoritative opinion and for someone the opinion of JP Morgan is exactly this authoritative opinion ;) In this crazy world in which one part of the people listens to the tweets of one representative of the car company, why not exist the followers of another company  ;D But seriously, the most important opinion should be your own opinion, because your wallet will be personally responsible for the consequences.

It is their decision not to follow Tesla. they know more in terms of money, financial, accounts and all related to money, maybe they are afraid because of the volatility of this market, of course why do they need to follow Tesla if they have their own mind and plans? banks has a 50-50 possibility to adapt crypto, some of them already want to buy bitcoin like that one in Miami some of them still don't want to be part of this revolution like JP Morgan, sooner or later they will realize that thing, bitcoin is good for their banks maybe they are just waiting for the perfect time to accumulate more.

JP Morgan is no different from the other banking cartels and they want everyone to remain under their control. Bitcoin allows the common people to transact and store wealth on their own, and this affects people like the JP Morgan executives negatively. JP Morgan had previously made a few predictions about Bitcoin. Back in 2017, Jamie Dimon (the Chief Executive Officer of JPMorgan Chase) claimed that cryptocurrency was a fraud, and it will be crushed by the global governments soon. And less than two years later, JPM came up with their own cryptocurrency, called JPM Coin (which obviously was a failure).

Yes, it is very clear their way of thinking with their ever-changing statements.  Whatever the statement will always want their own benefit.  Their track record is so long and has many cases to make me always sure, the mindset of a banker will always be "the mindset is only about profits".  They just don't want to feel disadvantaged by FOMO.  Because in recent days, BTC has reached its highest price in history.

100%.

Proprietary trading activity for bitcoin has ballooned over the past few years from an institutional perspective. Companies are using cheap funding to access BTC cash products and derivatives left right and centre.

This trend isn't going to stop now. Tesla jumping on with Musk is simply going to give reassurance to other companies on the edge, and not discourage them.

With this low interest rate environment and rounds of global central bank stimulus, JPMorgan will be proven erroneous in this evaluation imho.

JP Morgan Chase is a bank. Aren't we expecting statements like this coming from the banks like them who are against Bitcoin since the start of it.
I still remember Jamie Dimon saying that Bitcoin is a fraud last 2017. Now he is continuing to say negative things about it again this year.

Let him bark and let him say what he want to say in the end we are in a free to say anything. I don't really care about what he is saying and I don't expect this to happen too that large firms will not follow what Tesla did. It will create a domino effect for sure especially when they see Bitcoin's price go higher :).

JP Morgan.
They have a plan, but don’t expect to read it on the news:
News from Bloomberg:

JPMorgan’s Pinto Says Client Demand Isn’t There Yet on Bitcoin (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-02-12/jpmorgan-s-pinto-says-client-demand-isn-t-there-yet-on-bitcoin)


News from The Block:

 JPMorgan will offer bitcoin trading if there is client demand, says COO (https://www.theblockcrypto.com/linked/94750/jpmorgan-bitcoin-btc-trading-client-demand-coo-comments)


Clearly they have a plan, like every other major global bank out there. Provide their clients with basic services, in order to bootstrap a “crypto currencies banking ecosystem” where the bank can sick fees from clients into their pockets.

JP Morgan strikes again.

I remember them being pretty hostile towards bitcoin a few years back, calling it a fraud investment and all that kinds of stuff. But fast forward, 2020, their hearts kinda softened to bitcoin and started making good remarks about the cryptocurrency. Now, they're back with trying to warn other companies into not buying in to bitcoin due to the volatility it offers. I really believe that no one will ever believe into these 'chief strategists' because what they are proposing isn't really sound.

Their influence over the markets--especially in crypto--is no longer that recognized and all-powerful like it used to be. They could be 100% wrong in here and I wouldn't be surprised.

Of course they will but you have to accept that bitcoin is not in favor of banks neither, so why should banks like crypto when the whole purpose of it was to destroy banks? Would you like your murderer? Would you say "oh my murderer will kill me but he is a great person"?

Of course not, Bitcoin is here to destroy JP Morgan if it can, doubt that it would succeed but at least that is the aim, and considering we are moving away from banks and into crypto and instead of investing with banks we invest into bitcoin, it shows that we are hurting them for sure, and the whole world hates them too, we have seen what WSB showed the world, rightist, leftist, centrist, american, Canadian, European doesn't matter, rich people are very few whereas poor people are in billions so those banks are hated from all around the world hence why those banks hate bitcoin.

Strongly disagree with that.

Bitcoin is not here to destroy banks. It is here to destroy the FIAT banking system, i.e. central banks creating money out of the blue, at the only switch of a printer (a blip on their pc, actually).

Banks can thrive in a digital-gold standard, as the medieval banks in Genoa and Florence thrived during the first stages of the gold standard, during the Renaissance).

Those of you who follow Bitcoin for years now should see a pattern here. JP Morgan always bashes Bitcoin and tries to manipulate the market. I'd like to ask them why are they so interested in this? They're a fiat company so why the constant interest in Bitcoin? :D

I think otherwise. If after Musk's move companies like Uber started talking about bitcoin the machine is on the move and some Bank's opinions won't stop it.

Yeah JP Morgan is not the biggest name in the crypto world. Even though it's among the biggest banks in the world, in my opinion most people actively trading bitcoins probably go for other analyst recommendations. I think the target group of JP Morgan is more for institutional investors and bigger family offices, rather than the smaller crypto investors. While we like to invest a lot of money in cryptos for the institutional investors the part of the portfolio shifted into cryptos is farily small compared to stocks or bonds.

His thought maybe not false, moreover many big companies probably will not take the risk on something that is highly volatile, except the companies that really trust Bitcoin, have many free funds to invest in, and also set a specific target.
Sometimes, it seems impossible and may not happen. Like we also don't think that Tesla will also invest in BTC. We will also not know what happens next, if the uptrend of BTC will be good like this and many more good news spread, why not?
JP Morgan may only see from one side but sometimes one thing big comes from another side. ]Just wait for the progress whether e many more companies or not join in this BTC party.

He doesnt hold all of those minds behind of those institutions or companies even if JP is influencial but doesnt mean that they would really be having the power
to have those full rights on stopping on what they should gonna do.

They do really love to bash up Bitcoin after all these years but i wont be surprised that they've been secretly getting involved even though they do keep on telling
something negative to it. Who know right?

Not me.  Elon is a futurist - investing 1.5 billion is nothing to him.


They are saying history will repeat itself.    1929 all over again.  :/

Everything can be and such words can only be a masterfully constructed smoke screen that hides the true state of things  ;) However, this may be the opinion of individual representatives of JPMorgan, and other representatives may have a completely opposite opinion. What is the peculiarity of such forecasts is that they describe the likely scenarios and risks for investors and their opinion may change.

They are losing their potential profit by distancing themselves to Cryptocurrency, two big companies are now in and they are enjoying the profit, is this the unanimous decision of the whole board, they should go back to the drawing board they are missing something and they cannot go on being a hater of Cryptocurrency when obviously this is the future of investment.

Well, my opinion here is very simple, It's their money, They can do whatever they decide to do with it.  And  JP Morgan is in the industries of Bank that's against cryptocurrency features like bitcoin.

It is not necessary that these companies such as Tesla are trying to profit out of their investment in cryptocurrency. They may be just trying to protect the net worth of their reserves. With the multi-trillion USD stimulus measures being proposed by the current government, it is clear that the purchasing power of US Dollar will go down. And JP Morgan, in their statement hasn't mentioned this important factor even once.

JP Morgan has always been anti-crypto, and that's normal for an investment bank. Imagine how hard it will be for JP Morgan to slip the conventional fiat products and portfolios if many people start looking after crypto.

But sooner or later, all will have to accept that this is the future! Or at least to give the clients reasonable choices.

JP Morgan was actually when they said we shouldnt expect more large firms to emulate Tesla’s Bitcoin purchase because Tesla also make purchases due to Microguy CEO advise and I don't really see it happen this year until next bullish market because most of the large firm still scared of the volatility in nature of the market but I expect them to study the market and plan to invest during next bullish
About the currency devalue, they are totally wrong and I believe they know either but they are trying to create some hype so that people won't be panic and the only thing I believe will stop the devalue from happening is CBDC, if the government didn't create it the fiat devalue can't escape.

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Hydrogen, there's a typo in here "sector will naturally embrace previous metals"

Those financial institutions have been wrong about bitcoin forever so I will not trust a single word they say about it, because they are not expressing a real prediction about what it is more likely to happen but a wish, they are expressing what they wish it actually happens, they do not want more people to come to this market, they want people to remain with fiat currencies, but people despite the belief of many of those that think they are above everything are not dumb.

They can see that the rate money is being created by some of the most powerful countries around the world is simply unsustainable and despite their claims that they want to help the economy this is only going to help to make it worse and they are looking for alternatives, and one of those alternatives is bitcoin.

Whether they follow Elon's bitcoin rally or not, doesn't really matter much as bitcoin will benefit either way. If they decided to follow his path and buy bitcoin too, then that's cool as that would allow bitcoin to reach greater pricepoints and a faster road to $100k journey. If they decided not to, that's cool too! Since that's one less whale to deal with that can and will heavily manipulate the market in their hands.

I guess the fact that JPMorgan doesn't want to invest in Bitcoin and doesn't expect others to do so is associated with high price volatility. Elon Musk has made a bold move investing such amount of money in BTC, and good for him, however, it doesn't mean he will win in the end. Fiat devaluation if a possibility, however, Bitcoin's volatile price is a fact. It's unlikely that many companies will do the same and risk increasing portfolio volatility, not many can handle it and survive in a constantly changing market.

I think that for now, many companies are interested in such investment but they will stand aside and just watch how it goes with Tesla. If things won't get worse and this investment will prove its value - we may expect others to join the club. At least that's how I envision this situation.

Neither way then you are definitely right on what you had said.It doesn't matter if they wanted to get involved or consider Bitcoin out or not because
we aren't needing nor desperate to pump this market out with those whales or institutions.We do want global adoption and recognition and even if it would take time or years
then its just fine.They can do all the things they like but one things for sure is that we aren't really depending on what would be their own views even if it would
be the personal ones.

Hahahahaa, JP Morgan (Jaime Dimon) is so anti bitcoin from the beginning they have to continue down the road of denial.  What they say about crypto is completely meaningless, in fact what ever they say will happen id bet on the opposite happening.  They just pissy cause they are missing the boat.

When Jamie Dimon called Bitcoin a "fraud" in September 2017, the exchange rate was going at $3,500 per coin. Now the price is around 1,400% higher (eventually he realized his mistake and admitted that he regretted about his statement in 2018). JP Morgan in 2019 came up with their "JPM Coin" to replace Bitcoin, but it failed miserably. So obviously they are not feeling very happy right now with the continuing Bitcoin rally.

Crypto taught me to be flexible. The main thing is not to stand in front of the steam locomotive, in the form of insane institutions, who a couple of years ago shouted that this market was a complete deception and a bubble.

When the head of JP Morgan spoke of firing any employees who would be involved in cryptocurrency trading.

Hop, and so quickly the opinion of these clumsy guys changed?

Yes, they seem jealous of the current Bitcoin hype, it's only natural that the name is also a failed competitor.  They think their coins are attractive even though we don't think so.  Centralized coins are just like toy coins on the playground.  There is nothing interesting just like worthless numbers.  Their current statements are only the words of those who are heartbroken because it is not as successful as the price of Bitcoin which never dies.

JP Morgan is a company filled with idiots. I am not even joking if I was CEO or basically running it as a whole, I would do a much much better job, and I would definitely not need a board to tell me what I can do or can't do.

This isn't a way to say that I am a great investor, because I am not, I am just a "fine" one that makes not that bad amount of return yearly, and it is a small amount anyway, no, what I am trying to say here is that most of us here can do a better job than JP Morgan executives, whoever you are reading this right now, there is at least 50% chance you are better than them. Why? Because these idiots never have a problem, they take other people's money, invest with it, if they have a problem of going bankrupt they take "cash injections" or even bail outs from central bank and continue their way, there is no money they put themselves, and there is no way they could go bankrupt so they just do whatever they want and always fail but saved by the government.

Soon they might be the one left not using bitcoin, it's a matter who will be able to accumulate more while the price is still attainable and if they were too late it will be a sorry for them. There are more companies who will sure to foolow Elons move, it will just a matter of time before it will happen.

As for me, this statement is just manipulation. We all know very well that many companies pay attention to what giants like Tesla are doing. I will say more, I believe that JP Morgan himself invests in Bitcoin, and maybe also in other cryptocurrencies.
In the situation in which the financial market is now and when dollar is weakening, not to invest in cryptocurrencies is a mistake.

If everyone invest in cryptocurrency then JP Morgan and the other banking giants will lose their relevance and that is the reason why they are so opposed to the adoption of cryptocurrency by the corporates. But the corporations don't have much of a choice here. With the purchasing power of USD going down like a falling rock, it is foolish to keep all their reserves in fiat currency. If not Bitcoin, it has to be other assets that are protected against inflation such as gold and platinum.

If I'm in the position of JP Morgan, I will definitely act the same drama since his life has alway been about banks and benefits around him and wouldn't want people to move from banking system into cryptocurrency.
One thing is certain about the revolutionary 9f cryptocurrency, it wouldn't be force on anyone but when the time is due for people from traditional environment to come to crypto, they will definitely come here.

Would be divided since not all of them would really be going into the same path which it would be expected that there would be someone whom do consider crypto as a good option
rather than sticking into those traditional assets or currencies that they've known but this is really on unlikely side but its plausible and can really happen.We dont even know
that even they are saying negatives but actually behind they are getting involved with it just for them to protect out their reputation as a die hard traditional investor or
really goes with side on banking system which is totally opposing on crypto's existence.

Exactly! We don't know their true motive why they are saying such statement.
They may be secretly storing some crypto and they are just saying the opposite to the public.
I believe, I have had enough with JP Morgan. They can't dictate other big companies not to follow Tesla's move.
Later on, we will read from the news that JP Morgan has this much of crypto as their assets.

I have a 9 to 5 job and I wouldn't want to get paid in BTC or any kind of volatile asset, personally. My salary pays for my taxes, my bills, my living expenses, all of which are still paid in fiat. Then if I have money left, I'm a big boy and can buy BTC myself.

Of course if we're talking side job done under the radar, that's another story, but for an official job, where your employer will declare everything anyway, there is no point, at least at this stage.

It seems twitter is talking about this to surf the hype wave more than anything.

I see we all share similar opinion.
To what I wrote earlier - about the fact that in my opinion it is a manipulation: I will add that they write opposite because they still buy and want to do it at the lowest possible price. I think they know very well that a huge number of small and large companies will follow what Musk has done. Therefore, by providing such information, they want to extend this process in order to have time to buy at the lowest possible prices as much as is possible.

Come on! You really think it's real for someone to get 10% of Bitcoin total supply? After all 10% it is over 2 million BTC, even Satoshi does not have that much!
At the moment, the Bitcoin market cap is around a trillion, so JPMorgan would have to buy BTC for 200 billion! I'm afraid your imagination took you a bit too far...  ;)

The thing is... They should speak for themselves and not others. Yes JP Morgan might not be making the same move Tesla, but that doesn’t mean that other big firms won’t make that same move, there are so many of them that will likely be getting ready do that, and there have been so many of them doing it. Although the difference is going to be that they won’t invest as much as Tesla.

Tesla invested billions of dollars because it’s a very rich firm, so others that don’t have that kind of amount will stick to their level and invest what they can afford to risk. I don’t think any of them would like to miss out on an opportunity like this.

They are known to be vocal about other things even in the past, they were vocal and they always say something negative about bitcoin all the time and there were evidence that they used to invest in bitcoin as well in the past, so i would not trust any of their analysis as it does not makes any sense as they do not control other companies and they cannot control other investment and it is just their usual negative prediction and nothing else.

With these big companies and institution then its no surprise that they are really just pretending to be on the negative side but actually they are really accumulating bitcoin silently.

They are just trying to look themselves as die hard institutional investors but actually they are really tempted to get involved with bitcoin.Who doesn't really like to join up the trend?

Big companies and other billionaires had already considered bitcoin to be into their stashes.Then its no surprise that there would be some urge for you to get involved yet its
clear as day on how bitcoin will give out that opportunity for you to make profits not only into its actual usage.

I think it is worth bearing in mind that JP Morgan is a large organization with a large number of employees and the opinions of individual employees may differ radically and there may not necessarily be a single position. It is also worth bearing in mind that in such a large company, there may be a situation where one representative may express a negative opinion about bitcoin, and another department may completely independently deal with individual transactions with bitcoin.

You just nailed, while I will not go as far as say that I am better than them the reason people and businesses get better at anything is because of the consequences of failing, if I happen to make a bad investment I lose money and that is true for everyone else, but in the case of those companies that are too big to fail if they make a mistake then they are saved by governments all over the world and then they give themselves golden parachutes in the case they happen to be fired.

So there is no incentive for them to actually learn from their mistakes since they are not going to end up paying the price and instead it is the people that pay for it whether it is by increased taxes or inflation, so I can safely ignore whatever they say as it is not as if they move in the same world as the rest of us, what matters is that despite their predictions that have been very negative for bitcoin for a very long time bitcoin keeps growing and there does not seem to be any kind of limit to that growth as governments keep taking bad decisions about how to run the world economy.

The main thing is that Tesla set an example for large business structures that, for some reason, did not dare to invest in bitcoin. In any case, many corporations and companies will be interested in this opportunity and will consider it. Of course, in this case, one cannot speak for everyone whether or not they will buy bitcoins. I hope that a certain part of them, based on their own considerations, will nevertheless take part in such investments. In the future, it will be more difficult for states to take any restrictive measures on the circulation of decentralized cryptocurrency.

JP Morgan has been spreading a lot of FUD related to Bitcoin recently. Previously also they have done that, but they look really desperate nowadays. Do they feel threatened by the rise of Bitcoin?

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/02/17/jpmorgan-thinks-the-bitcoin-rally-is-unsustainable-and-doesnt-make-much-sense.html
https://www.coindesk.com/a-sudden-loss-of-faith-in-tether-would-pose-risk-to-bitcoin-jpmorgan-says
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-02-12/jpmorgan-s-pinto-says-client-demand-isn-t-there-yet-on-bitcoin
https://www.entrepreneur.com/article/364066
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-02-09/tesla-s-bitcoin-bet-won-t-be-followed-by-others-jpmorgan-says

^^^ These are just some of the articles dealing with FUD spread by JPM during the last few weeks.

Of course they feel threatened and with good reason, think about it if we were on their shoes and we were as powerful as they were we will be scared as hell by something like bitcoin, they are seeing that bitcoin does not stop growing despite all the FUD that is coming around the world, and why it keeps growing? Simply because it is the best form of money available at the moment.

If they had bought bitcoin when it was cheap they will not have this problem and they could begin to build their positions. but now they are seeing that other institutional investors got a head start over them and instead of accepting their mistake and decide to join them they are doubling down on their critic against bitcoin thinking that they still have the power the crash the market with a few articles full of FUD, but we know that is not going to be enough as too many people are realizing that bitcoin is here to stay and it is probably their only chance for a better future under the current circumstances.

JPM says a lot of things about bitcoin:

JPMorgan Says Investors Could Make Bitcoin 1% of Portfolios (http://)


Of course now they are ready to promote bitcoin related products to their clients, suddenly bitcoin is a legit asset to invest in.

You live in a universe of your own, and I live in a universe where bitcoin, after rampant growth, has fallen very well. Therefore, I fully agree with JP Morgan's opinion that a few powerful corporations cannot constantly direct any asset to the heavens by their actions. In times of unrestrained optimism, there should be skeptics who warn investors against being too optimistic.

I feel that they are just jealous of what bitcoin is achieving these days. Ever since, they are being pessimistic with bitcoin. And now, they still are. They don't wan't to grow the adoption of bitcoin, wishing that no one will follow the move of Tesla. But sorry to say, companies will not listen to them as many merchants and institutions are joining the crypto community. In time, this JP Morgan will join this community because they have no choice because everybody is already in here.

It is a double bluff, they try to have a smear campaign for the longest time knowing that no one will sue them because he is trying to talk against a decentralized market and they were in the headlines whenever bitcoin was mentioned and now they are providing service to their clients because even with all the smear campaign investors are readily investing and now they need to join the party to keep the business rolling  :D.

Lol, yeah I'm sure some internet rando has the macro economic knowledge to run JPM better than Dimon, who's considered one of the best investment bankers of this generation and grown JPM into the largest bank in the free world.  Further, JPM didn't need TARP money during the 2008 housing crisis, so your criticism about government bailouts isn't even applicable to JPM.

Remember this is the same company that declined to invest into "circle" app thingy when Goldman Sachs got in, they could have joined in that as well but they refused and kept their situation away from crypto and always said it is a bad deal. While Goldman Sachs made ton of money, like made the investment and then some back on top of it, JP Morgan failed to make a single cent out of crypto during that same period. They could get in right now, they could make a difference but that doesn't change the fact that crypto will always laugh at wall street whatever they do.

If they do not get in, they are idiots because only an idiot wouldn't get into bitcoin when they have so much money to spare, if I had some more money to spare I would get in even if it is just $10 as long as I can get in more, these guys have billion sitting around, and if they do end up getting in, they are idiots because they used bad stuff before and only just now understanding what bitcoin can become.

I'd note that Goldman Sachs begs to differ - https://www.coindesk.com/goldman-sachs-to-enter-crypto-market-soon-with-custody-play-source

Large financial institutions understand very well the idea of diversification of investments. They have no choice but to invest in crypto seeing as fiat currencies like USD are bound to be hyper inflated. Precious metals are the alternative most look to, but BTC is superior and more convenient (for obvious reasons).

For financial companies it's a no brainer. There is no downside in having say 1% of your portfolio in BTC. Well the downside is at most 1%. I think by now most investors would consider it prudent to take that risk, vs not taking it and missing the rise of BTC.

However Tesla isn't a financial company, so it's a bit of a different thing, I'm not even necessarily in favor of companies playing on the financial markets when it's not their business. Especially a company like Tesla that doesn't really earn money yet.

If it was Apple, it would make more sense, Apple has tons of fiat on bank accounts, it's a risk in itself.

Of course, the shares are different and individual percentages of some companies may seem like huge funds for others  ;) The situation with Tesla's financial capitalization in general is a unique situation and perfectly illustrates the current realities of the modern stock market and other traditional markets, when such phenomena appear due to the policy of quantitative easing, and I am not sure that such actions of Tesla's management will not potentially hit the financial well-being of the company later due to the high risk of investing in cryptocurrencies.

For me, it sounds surprising that these companies are not worried about the steep fall in purchasing power of the US Dollar, which can effect 99% of their savings. Instead, they are more concerned about the volatility of the remaining 1%. Volatility is not a bad thing, as long as the overall trend is positive. The corporations are not realizing the fact that they are losing huge amounts of money as a result of USD inflation. They should at least move a part of their reserves to bullion, if they are not in favor of BTC.

I don't think other companies really need to invest in BTC, instead if they can only allow and accept BTC that would be more than enough in my opinion.

I am not sure if the guy is mad or what but I was reading an article and JPMorgan suggested that investors might want to keep 1% of their portfolio in BTC which sounds like he is in favor of investing and holding BTC but earlier he made the statement that companies won't follow the same route as tesla.

I never even heard of this guy to be honest and I don't want to learn about him because it seems like he has a split personality or maybe suffering from some kid of bi-polar disorder. I don't mean to hurt anyone or their sentiments though, so accept my apology if you follow him and got hurt with my comments.

Not all of these large firms can be pleased enough with Bitcoin. Despite Elon Musk’s influence in buying Bitcoin worth $1.5 billion, you can’t expect that others may be following suit. Only a few handful ones like Microstrategy, Mastercard, etc., are just seeing the vision and know how Bitcoin could help them in the long run.

Before 2020 no one really believed that any of the big corporations are going to invest in Bitcoins. And look at what we got. In Q3 2020, PayPal announced that they are integrating Bitcoin to their platform followed by the investment from Tesla many months later. Now Mastercard and some other big names are going ahead with their integration plans. So I would say that the momentum is with Bitcoin. We will hear more big names later this year, or by 2022.

I agree they cannot ignore the market cap of Cryptocurrency which has grown too huge to ignore, they are going to lose a lot if they keep ignoring the Cryptocurrency market, if small traders and investors are making a lot why not big institutional companies, they get in now or they get it late.

Strictly speaking, it is impossible to say that Mastercard and Paypal invested in Bitcoin. Mastercard and PayPal simply allowed transactions with bitcoins to be made on their platforms, but using only their infrastructure. Therefore, strictly speaking, we can really say that only Tesla invested in bitcoin from the major players, which in itself looks a little unnatural and risky due to the small income from the business of Tesla itself.

Tesla's business itself is risky. And it is even more risky to invest in the Tesla stock, which is having a P/E ratio of more than 1,000. They took the risk and were rewarded. Bitcoin prices have risen by more than 60% ever since they purchased their coins and that translates to roughly $900 million in unrealized gains for Tesla. I guess this is more than their net income for the entire year from their main business.

I guess it's just how large firm behave, not gonna invest into something until they really sure and many people have already jumped in and I guess that happens to their idea of diversification too and risk calculation.
However, there's always an outlier why will try to make fortune when thing is still young and make many profit out of it, JP Morgan could say whatever he wants but I'm sure in the future there gonna be some large firms investing to crypto.

I agree, there are always some outliers. If all companies would do the same we wouldn't need any financial adivsors in the first place. Imagine all the banks having the same opinion on stocks and commodities. There are already quite a few mid size firms switching their cash into bitcoins. Eventually some of the larger firms will go into the crypto world as well. The risk of missing out on the new future is rising with the bitcoin price.

Actually, it's not about the Bitcoin price itself, but about its capitalization. Until now, large companies have been afraid of investing in Bitcoin due to its very high volatility and the possibility of price manipulation by whales. I think we are at the stage where, slowly, large companies are starting to believe that Bitcoin will soon reach a capitalization that will make manipulation impossible.
JP Morgan is probably just relying on the fact that this capitalization is too small for him, but that's just their opinion, nothing more. The free market will decide for itself.

Even at the current stage of bitcoin, we shouldn't underestimate the mind of human because it's dynamic for every second. I have this feeling and thought that most of this popular companies are into cryptocurrency but they are yet to go public perhaps the fear of SEC and its news effects on their share.
I still think this guys are heavily buying and selling of crypto in every pump and dump.

I am more into this thought. I believe a lot of companies are already buying their bitcoin, however, they are keeping silent because of the potential problem with SEC or their government. In time, some of them will disclose their crypto investments to the public. I don't think only MicroStrategy, or PayPal and other few are only buying. They are more of them already.

I don't think that any of the publicly listed companies are hiding their Bitcoin purchases. Private companies can do that, but it is illegal for publicly traded companies to do so. For now, most of them are taking a "wait and watch" stance. With Janet Yellen and others in the government warning against the usage of cryptocurrency, I don't expect a lot many companies to jump in to the bandwagon too soon.

Why is everyone saying that they aren't investing in bitcoin or other crypto currencies because they fear SEC? As far as I know, SEC or any financial regulatory body cannot stop a company from investing in crypto currencies or any assets. As long as they follow business laws and everything properly, they can do whatever they want.
If they do, they have to notify it publicly. They probably did, but aren't vocal about it. I am sure there are tons of small to mid companies that are holding bitcoins as assets.

I doubt they would be trading it. They are likely to hold it as a long term investment. Too risky and complicated if they join the pump and dump trend.

You really want to listen to one of Bitcoin's biggest target for disruption? Bitcoin was developed to disrupt corrupt Banking organizations like JP Morgan ..and they know it. Take a sniff at this ==> https://violationtracker.goodjobsfirst.org/parent/jpmorgan-chase

JP Morgan is one of the Banks with the worst track records for financial misconduct and their credibility is shattered in the financial world. Why would anyone want to listen to their advice?

They have been criticizing Bitcoin for years and everyone know what their agenda is. (They want to prevent disruption of their profits)  ;D ;D ;D

The problem is because of blockchain being such complex although excellent technology, there are not many who fully understand what it can provide and those who understand will never think twice before investing and adopting Bitcoins. Elon Musk being a technology lover has understood what Bitcoin does and what it can do to the economy and hence he adopted it, others might take time.

Someone 10 years ago if predicted that bitcoin will be $50k each Bitcoin, people might have laughed and cracked jokes about it but today after it reached that value, we now realize the potential.

Similarly, it will take time for people to understand and adopt Bitcoins but I can easily say that Bitcoin will be worldwide accepted in the coming 5 years, might sound like an exaggeration now but not after 5 years. As far as JP Morgan's statements are considered, he doesn't own the world.

For now, it is enough for at least a small part of companies to follow Tesla's example and start investing in cryptocurrency. This will already be a significant breakthrough. And such cases should be all the same. True, in order for legal entities to be able to invest in cryptocurrency, you need to have appropriate legal regulation.

I believe there is going to be something much better in the future but they are sort of right, following usually means one thing is done and another thing happens right afterwards and I believe that didn't happen, JP Morgan didn't mean it like "nobody will invest into crypto" that is not really wise to expect, that wouldn't be possible, at the end of the day we are going to end up with a situation like there will be some sort of investments over long period of time but I think people didn't followed Tesla all that much, at least not the big companies.

If there was another news like Apple bought 1 billion dollars of bitcoin in a week or 10 days, and after that Google invests another 1 billion dollars to bitcoin and after a while facebook buys half a billion dollars into bitcoin and so forth, if that happened all in a month or two we could actually say they were wrong but now I don't think we can say they are wrong.

It is completely inaccurate. As many investors are seen in these past few months, it has been greatly seen that large institutions are getting into cryptocurrencies.

i think its a strategy, we know that tesla invest large amount of money putting risk in bitcoin and tesla trusting digital currency. tesla corp knows that bitcoins will be soon to be very successful and that jp morgan for me is also investing in bitcoin, he said that for strategy purposes only, its my personal saying about this matter.

I see bond yields rising and this means there will be less liquidity. I doubt there will be inflation higher than 2% for this year and probably for the next one either. In fact I see this year a lot of businesses going down as QE has reached the maximum with the upcoming deals and after the coronavirus ends those companies that don't perform will go bankrupt without any more government aid, as there won't be any excuse left. JPMorgan is playing games with Bitcoin for months, and obviously the funds controlled by this bank have lately sold, while they had a large position back in the summer. It is like that for JPMorgan, they buy then shill, they want to buy lower they bring the bad news.

I'm also thinking that way they are one of the leading investment company, but they are thinking differently, they should go where the gold is, but they are not going, like what PayPal and Tesla, and other institutions are doing, maybe they are playing strategy and will just announce later, just like what PayPal did, we'll know that soon.  

It could be that these large firms are waiting for a much cheaper entry to Bitcoin since the current price is higher than previous years. They might avoid buying from the peak and go for a bit dip to jump in. History in crypto most especifically in Bitcoin might repeat but not the prices because it is hard to say we are going backwards like $3,000 again too long to wait for that, maybe $20k or $30k would be great but we don't know when.

I agree, JPMorgan's strategists could say negative things about Bitcoin in hopes that it might impact prices in the negative way. They just want to buy low. But in fact nobody knows what's "low" for BTC today. They might miss the train. :)

They have no idea what SEC is doing, that Is why, they do not even know what SEC stance is in bitcoin that Is the reason. Reality is that you can buy and sell and do whatever you want with crypto and nothing will happen, it Is not really something that you should be worried about and SEC will be helping everyone out, but for some reason people are unaware of this situation and that is why they are afraid.

I personally do not live in USA but if I lived there, all I would do is find an accountant that is good at this kind of stuff and would just simply pay him to help me with taxes and laws and I would do whatever he allows me to do, obviously there could be something not allowed but aside from that regular buying and selling is allowed and I would simply pay the taxes of my profits and move on. That Is what these huge companies do because they already have in house lawyers and such.

JPM is moving on various plan on Bitcoin.
There is a flurry of reports from them: the latest is a presentation deck for their private clients, UHNW Individuals with more than 10 Mios $ of financial asset allocation.

JPMorgan tells private wealth clients that bitcoin can be a portfolio diversifier 'if sized correctly' (https://www.theblockcrypto.com/post/97257/jp-morgan-bitcoin-deck-private-client)

I also follow the information around BTC and see how many companies want BTC and other cryptocurrencies, but the price is already biting. Based on this statement, JP Morgan looks somehow not convincing. The fact is that sooner or later the stock market will fall again and will no longer be able to rise, and then many companies will lose all their earned money. What should they do now? It's a good question and it is likely that one of the ways out of this situation will be BTC and other crypto assets. Perhaps some of the companies are already buying, but hiding it. No matter how it was, the situation on the markets is increasing and probably we will soon see interesting events and find out what exactly it was necessary to invest in.

From what I can see, the motive is to try and stamp his authority but he can't take decisions for others and if Tesla can accept bitcoins, there is every reason others might follow the same path. I was searching for JP Morgan net worth and it looks like $25 billion which is an astounding number but still way less than of Musk's and I think more people follow and admire Musk than Morgan.

I think the same and not sure why his statement are even being taken so seriously because every company has their own right to decide and I heard some companies are offering their employee salary in bitcoin so its a positive move.

Binance CEO Changpeng Zhao says his cryptocurrency exchange is seeing increased 'institutional adoption' (https://markets.businessinsider.com/currencies/news/institutional-adoption-bitcoin-cryptocurrencies-binance-ceo-changpeng-zhao-2021-3-1030151305)
JP Morgan is a bit contraditory. At same time his data indicates bitcoin is under a popular demand among institutional investors, he says large firms aren't going to follow through this way.
The facts are showing institutional adoption is happening, no one wants to miss the bitcoin train right now and I believe those who say the opposite are bluffing.

It was always good to see that JP Morgan itself would be interested with crypto, not just bitcoin neither, in all of crypto, it is also obvious that they are not going to come out and say "sorry, we were mistaken about bitcoin, it is awesome" and that is why it is obvious that they will offer it to their customers and not say anything in public that would promote bitcoin.

I have to say if they were smart enough to put 10% of their whole cash reserve into bitcoin, they would have been insanely richer, they would have provided so much money to their customers, and they would have made a lot more profit for themselves as well. It is a shame that some people in business world are stubborn, market doesn't care about your feelings, market doesn't care about your thoughts, market only cares about making money and it doesn't matter if you are JP Morgan or another company, they will not listen to you when they can make money on the opposite side.

 If they do what you say, that strategy is too cheesy.  JP Morgan classmates fry up the issue just to make the price collapse.  I'm not sure that will happen.  They do not fit the timing of the hype that spreads to many large companies.  Their way is like beginners but bodies like whales.