Bitcoin Forum

Some weeks ago i used metamask and pancake swap to sell some tokens, and they give the option to sell them for common altcoins like ETH, LTC, DOGE... But when you use this service to buy the altcoins what you are buying are the tokens of these coins and not the real coins, as an example I will leave the link to the LTC smart contract:

https://bscscan.com/token/0x4338665cbb7b2485a8855a139b75d5e34ab0db94

If you want to buy the real coins you need to swap for BNB then deposit that on binance.com and then trade for the real coins.

But here the issue is, they have created a token for each altcoin, and from my perspective, that's a nasty move because for sure there is a lot of people holding these tokens and thinking they are holding real altcoins.

I want to know what does the community thinks about this move from Binance.

It's not a nasty move. It's like BTC to EBTC on Ethereum Blockchain. Since there is a limitation on crosshain of other Blockchain when using DEX, Exchange just introduce a proxy token which the value is pegged to the original coin. The difference is just you can't use the proxy coin function as the original but its still the same for investment purposes. This is move is not only happening on Binance alone but on most blockchain like Waves, ETH and Eos

I think you are misunderstanding the situation of tokens that are backed by real coins. This token you see on other chain are most likely backed by Binance that's why if you observe closely, the general Binance. Con exchange has bsc deposits for BEP-20 tokens. So, there is no cause for alarm anytime you feel like withdrawing your funds or swaping it into other assets.

The Binance equivalent for BTC is Bitcoin BEP2 (BTCB), and not EBTC. Wrapped Bitcoin is another coin that can be considered as Bitcoin equivalent. But eBTC is some worthless shitcoin called eBitcoin, which is worth around $0.50 per coin (I had the misfortune of investing in this coin back in 2017, but got rid of it in 2018). Anyway, I like the idea of creating tokens. In terms of safety, it is no more riskier than keeping your coins in exchange wallets. But the plus point here is that you will be able to save a lot in terms of transaction fees.

as 3 countries have decided to block the Binance exchange for regulatory reasons, the impact on the coin itself is obvious, so when the price of Bitcoin, Cardano, and some other cryptocurrencies, BNB did not recover. so when the Bitcoin Crash continued it was clear that BNB coin became the crypto being the crypto with the lowest buying volume including Tokens under the BNB network.

That is a tactic of theirs so that people will buy on their BSC network and everything has to be traded first with their own token made for each altcoin.

It's just that CZ knows how to make a strategic move so that it can increase the demand for his tokens on his own network.

The pegged-tokens altcoin is a way to bring the altcoin to another network. So, its make people possible to trade them on the DeFi. Its not a nasty move since its backed with the real altcoin, you can actually swap it to the real coin by depositting it on Binance.

very strategic and i think it should have been done by other platforms too like the TRX and ADA. for ADA i believe they are on the way to be doing this while their smart contract is already up. they've already had deals with ERC projects actually. crosschains and tokenbridges will make it possible for all these platforms to have interoperability.

Yes it is, The use of pegged BTC and altcoins, on the ETH and BSC or in other networks aims to make it easy for everyone to own top tier assets on different networks. What's interesting is, we can buy BSC tokens and send them to support pegged-token, we can exchange them for real without any hassle. However, there is one thing to keep in mind, the exploitation problem that exists with BSC/ETH/MATIC smart contracts, when we choose the wrong developer, and their SC has a bug, this will be easier for hacker to pick up our assets or even dump, compared to having BTC and altcoins on their network.

CZ is a leading personality in crypto space without any doubt and done great job for crypto space.  Look at Binance exchange where it was 3 years ago and where it is today. He knows well how to create usability of his coin BNB and it is usability that adds value to any coin. This coin has grown more than 1000% during the past 3 years. Most of the new projects are now launched on Binance smart chart in stead of Ethereum because transaction fees  are extremely high and un affordable on Ethereum network.

https://i.imgur.com/2PFTHOV.jpg

https://www.tradingview.com/symbols/BNBUSD/

It's just wrapped token so you can interact with most of smart contract using these tokens but it really pegged to the real coin,
for example, if you want to swap BEP20 token to altcoin like litecoin, since it's not available in BSC you usually need to go to cex and exchange there and that's the only way you can get that, but with these wrapped tokens, you can use for example pancakeswap to get wrapped litecoin tokens that represents the real token.
nothing new and it's not even strategy, it's just a way to give more capability to trade other blockchain coins for dex or defi users in their blockchain.

Exchanges and projects try to create cross chain solutions with wrapped tokens through smart contracts. It give people more convenience to change their capital from Bitcoin, BNB, ETH to other altcoins through smart contracts and wrapped tokens.

Recent months, it is a trend that old and small altcoins have very good recoveries when their teams create wrapped tokens. It results in short term hypes for those projects and price has good reasons to move.

I don't think there's anything bad here. this is just a service for the function providers of DEX or CEX. provides many assets to make it easier where we can trade over the ownership of the assets we want.
there may be some conspiracy to further benefit the BNB coin or the use of a DEX that only supports binance. but binance really has been amazing at developing something that will interest a lot of people.

No, you don't need to swap for BNB. You can deposit these wrapped tokens like LTC to Binance but you have to select the correct network which is BSC. You can withdraw it using the native Litecoin blockchain later on.

But what about the risk factors? If Binance is holding the coins for us, then there is a chance that these assets can either be stolen or seized.  A few years back, Binance hotwallet was hacked and some coins were lost. And there is no guarantee that such a situation will not repeat in the future. And I am hearing rumors about the SEC launching legal action against Binance for sometime. It will always remain like the Damocles's sword. Then another risk factor is centralization. These tokens can be frozen by Binance, if they want to do so.

of course, binance can freeze every asset they create with the system they are running. in fact, it also affects BUSD and other assets whose authority is indeed held by binance.
I think in a case like this, there are bound to be people who like it because it uses what Binance has to offer. but some do not like it for reasons of risk as you mentioned.
we will not know for sure whether it will be legalized or not in the future. but for sure if that happens, I don't think an exchange as big as binance will take your money away if there is a freeze for some of the assets in question.

It's called wrapped tokens.
They use it a lot with their exchanges that also use a wallet. It's not an issue because you can still exchange it at their network.
But, if you want to keep the real altcoin or real Bitcoin you will need to exchange it for something without the "W".
I think they use this method to prevent failure of providing with that certain coin/token especially if there is a low total supply.

Lower fees and transaction time is fast because you are just using the Binance chain in this example.

I just mentioned the risk factors, although I know that chances of something like that happening is very remote. I made the post because a lot of people are talking about the lawsuit being prepared by the SEC against Binance. I just hope that Binance will be able to stay out of trouble, unlike what happened to BTC-e/Wex.nz back in 2017-18. For me, these things don't matter much. I use exchanges such as Binance only to swap my crypto (and that too only once in a while). But there are users who store coins in exchange wallets. They need to be cautious.

If you read carefully my statement, I never said that it was on BSC but rather on Ethereum Blockchain that's why I name it EBTC(Ethereum Bitcoin) for the purpose of discussion. I know Wrapped Bitcoin and you only emphasized without comprehending the whole content of my post. But yeah, There's a lot of shitty token on all blockchain that disguising in BTC. Try to go on waves platform and you will see millions of it that giving some airdrop.  ;D

A lot of rumor that Binance Smart Chain is centralized, not decentralized and if you take a closer look, it's almost copycat of Ethereum, but yet in some use cases, Binance Smart Chain got uses.
Binance Exchange and Binance Smart Chain are different, but yeah Binance Exchange is a big player for Binance Smart Chain (name tells,lol) Without Binance Exchange, Binance Smart Chain is probably not existing.

About the risk factors here since Binance Smart Chain is POS, and there are different validators (https://bscscan.com/validators) and each of them got voting power, if there is one entity or person got the most voting power that's maybe the risk.

Yes, it is very true, but for new users or beginners, at least understand it before buying tokens or coins, because if we don't understand how to buy tokens or coins, we will fall into a very deep abyss, as well as those with extensive experience, don't be tempted by golden opportunities in front of your eyes, why do I say that, because I've often watched market assets before, in seconds they can change, so be careful in studying this opportunity.

I am also a user of the BSC platform, for now I also often transact using BSC, as quoted above, it seems that only the platform is different but for the price everything is almost the same as other platforms, so we don't have to worry about holding the token, because it is only crosschain if we use it. If you want to sell, you have to exchange BNB, but so far the original tokens I hold in BSC are all safe and the price always follows the original.

there are a lot of other exchanges that do this. Wrapped token can bring a lot of value to the token by giving it more exposure. drawbacks is you are not trading real tokens by more of a void of a token that exists in bsc. Wrapped tokens have been around for a very long time and some people like trading them.

This is the some of the major flaws in crypto market, without proper understanding and knowledge on the token or coin newbies are buying it can lead to scam or worst losing his money.

Before, this type stories always pop's out on facebook how someone bought a token on pancake and cannot sell it back, Only to know that he bought a different token or a copy cat token.

Probably the real reason why they just use that technique is to assure every holder that own token from them will trade only on their exchange which is binance.com because if they didn't do that way, seems very unacceptable that knowing you use their service when swapping to different assets but you will trade it other exchanges.. So in my opinion perhaps that's the reason why they choose that way just to keep those who owned token from them.

If I remember correctly Binance exchange also supports deposit BSC network for those altcoins you mentioned earlier, what you need to do is just select the appropriate network when generating deposit address, then you can immediately withdraw it in its native blockchain or trade it with other coins.

The existence of pegged or wrapped tokens isn't new. Furthermore, lots of them already spread in the current market, I think it kinda wrong if we blaming Binance because of this. It's the fault of people who didn't understand what they are doing such as hold and thought its the real one

It is also real litecoin but it is in BSC Network. You can check on binance deposit option or withdraw option. You will get 3 type of Network for LTC. LTC Main Blockchain Network, BEP2 Network (BNB Main Network) And BEP-20 (BSC) Network.

The LTC that is available in BEP2 and BEP20 are not the real LTC coins, right? My understanding is that they will be the tokens issued by Binace against LTC. Although the value will be the same, it is slightly more riskier. I had bad experience with exchanges several times in the past. I know that Binacne is having an excellent reputation, but I would still be wary about trading and owning these tokens. But in case of Litecoin, I can understand. It is not easy to store LTC in some of the online wallets that are freely available.

I hope that other platforms won't create their own but just follow what CZ has done so that there's synchronization and there won't be that much wrapped tokens made by other platforms.

But maybe we'll see the other wrapped tokens made by other platforms and can easily be exchanged through those cross chains and bridges.

I am not happy with the way in which Binance is controlling the market, imagine them getting into trouble and all they do is file for bankruptcy and move on while billions will be lost to the end customer and we have seen many instances in the past and hopefully they are not a ticking time bomb in the cryptocurrency market space that is going to change everything, but i feel that they are going to mess up everything somewhere.

this is a really nice move. Because it is not limited to a single network. Also, I can't say whether it will happen or not, in case ETH disappears tomorrow, the same subbases will continue on the BSC network. Or it can continue on various bases. But be careful when sending to exchange platforms in this regard. They can cause problems if you cross-post to some exchange platforms.

It can be confusing because they don't call these tokens Wrapped LTC, they just call them LTC. All these wrapped tokens are centralized and managed by Binance but there is also other versions managed by other companies like tDoge and vBTC. For trading purposes people want to have exposure to the price of BTC and other popular coins so this is a good solution. The problem is that sometimes these coins can lose their peg, which is currently the case for tDoge and tBTC.

It's decentralized so there will be no stopping teams from creating synthetic assets. WETH and WBTC have been like doubling the supply count, WBTC for instance is like adding 21M more coins and then this vBTC as well. 

I'm not going to be surprised if there are scams out there that work as synthetic BTC and ETH which the team could just grab real BTC from the investors, wBTC and wETH are actually attracting when you are addicted to Defi.

Thanks for sharing your point of view guys, its nice to see how you see this topic and how for some users is totally normal.

The issue here is the market capitalization, Binance tokens of the altcoins have the same market cap as the altcoins, and for me, that's like making money from nowhere, that's why for me this is a nasty move. The tokens should create their own market cap, and not make a copy/paste from the other coins markets. I think this is the main issue.

It is true that many counties are blocking Binance exchange but we didn't notice any major negative impact of this news on BNB Price. Binance has done wonderful job during the past 4 years to create use case of its BNB coin. We like it or not but now it is alternative of Ethereum network becuase its fee is very low. Every other new project is being launched on Binance smart chain. Binance has become too big now so it won't die easily.

So far there is no negative impact to binance coin price due this fud. Binance as best crypto exchange in market have many cooperation with several local government and even binance advisor was former officer in America. i know there will bargaining with the countries who issued blocking binance operation. 

We’re using the BSC network and it’s good for them to take advantage of this to introduce more options that works for both parties and that’s how business works mate. You create a project, you create your own altcoins and then you introduce something in the market that will use the altcoin you created, this is how brilliant Binance team are and that makes them valuable.

They are actually holding them as the same amount of coin are frozen on smart contract. Unless there's so disastrous events with the contract or the resources, user can always redeem them with a bridge. It's not just BSC but every other utility platforms like Ethereum network, Polygon, etc have their own set of tokens for most of the coins.

The problem with tokenizing cryptocurrency is that there is always a chance that the issuer of the token can cheat the owners of the token and move the funds without their permission or knowledge. You can argue that Binance is a very trustworthy exchange and any chance of something like that happening is very low. But always remember the ultimate law in cryptocurrency market - not your keys, not your coins. The same is applicable for these tokens as well. If you want to use them, limit the usage just for trading and redeem them as soon as the purpose is done.

Well, Binance being prohibited to operate in some countries isn't a new story and we have heard it few times in the past. As you said this issue would not affect too much BNB values since there are lots of folks who still loyal to use both their services and  its currency.

as long as the original coin supports tokens in the bsc for me it doesn't cause a problem, even in my opinion this can make it easier for us to make transactions on the dex in the bsc according to the choice we want.

This actually make sense as I did this swapping and sending BEP 20 from Binance to other wallet ot vice versa. Then swapping it to other altcoins. Its a usual way of converting coins in binance if you wanted to  buy some altcoins.

And as for the market capitalization, they are not actually copying other altcoin's market cap. You see, they have their own exchange and the Binance token has been bought and hold by investors. Aside from that, they are doing some progress every now and then. They deserve what it stand right now -- the price, the market cap, and the decisions of planning some buying bnb before buying a particular altcoin.

I've observed more new token project that has come out nowadays that used binance chain network compatible wallet. Basically this brough up a good moves for bnb coin and the upcoming altcoins which is in line to their project. This will be the most awaited part, we will stay tuned for this project ongoing developments. I am positively motivated for this, since gas fee for bsc isn't that expensive compared with erc20, yet many investors appreciated that certain advantages.

I am not very happy with the current token system in cryptocurrency sector. It needs a complete revamp. Right now, the users have no means to find out that the token is backed up with the actual asset or not. We need to devise some mechanism, where the asset is directly incorporated in to the token (i.e the coin can't be spent by anyone else). If the coin is spent elsewhere, then the token should automatically become worthless. Is it possible to devise such a mechanism? Technology has advanced so much, and therefore I am hopeful of such an innovation occurring in the future.

There were already reports of scam projects in BSC chain so there is a reason to be watchful for whatever tokens you encounter in the network. Since anyone can create a token there, then this is the same with ERC20 which you will also have to check the smartcontract before making transactions.

Gas fees are really a big hurdle for ERC20 tokens this is why some of us had not even sold their tokens just worth $200 but the fee is a pain which could cost up to $60.

Of course this is a bad thing, because it would be a trash token. the easier it is to make tokens especially those BNB based, making every day there are thousands of new projects listed on coinmarketcap, as long as they have a little money they will pump and sell immediately.

I created similar thread on ID local board, and half of the polled participants prefer multi chain token (BEP2) for cheap transaction fees. Sure it carries significant risks, therefore I don't recommend people hodl this BEP2 token. If it's only for instant payment (paying goods and services), it may be okay since we will save significant tx fees for expensive tx coins (like BTC or ETH). But for already cheap tx coins, for example, LTC, XRP, BCH, I don't see the benefit of using BEP2 tokens.

Also, be aware that Binance can collapse anytime since it's only an exchange.

as long as it's for convenience and doesn't make it more difficult and expensive, it never hurts to try using it. hopefully it is an alternative that can be used at some point and we can't predict it.

obviously all need good support if you want what will be done can be successful in the future. because everything is needed adequate support in order to do well, because everyone wants convenience which is the main reason for other things.

all of that is true, when no traders use it then I guess such assets on binance will also disappear.
they still exist because some need them and do use them for their needs. all is not a problem even though there are people who think it is all politics from binance to keep getting adoption of BNB token trading.

Most of the pegged token usually audit their code before deployed it, unless nobody want to use it because no security guaranteed. The only thing that need to be hesitated is, is it really backed 1-1 by the real coin?

Thanks for the clear explanation. Previously I thought (wrapped) coin is a kind of hard fork coin. so wrapped is a kind of temporary alternative for some coins ? I think this is actually good because it makes it easier to turn BSC and ETH transactions to other coins with a minimum fee on BSC.

Yes, that's the right word "temporary". I was looking for that word when I was writing my reply but forgot about it.  :D
You don't want to be keeping this kind of coin for the long term. Its usage is just for the exchange to keep the profit flowing at a faster pace.
I think it's wise for Binance to make such a feature but it confuses a lot of traders at first. A thorough explanation should be written or a warning whenever a person purchases it.

There is no way to find it out, unless they conduct an independent third party audit of the reserves. But from what I have seen in the case of USDT and other stablecoins, it is always difficult to trust these exchanges. They will just take a large part of the reserve funds and use it for other purposes, and you may never know about it. Even if they provide the wallet address and other details, you don't know whether they will move them in the future. The risk is lower with reputed exchanges such as Binance, but still some amount of probability is there that the tokens may not be fully backed up.

to store tokens on bsc, I think it's safe to do, considering this system is from binance, where binance has a good reputation as our experience. Moreover, many new projects are currently based on BSC, with low fee facilities, I think BSC is worthy of being used as a personal wallet.

The audited code isn't worth much. I don't quite remember the name of the thread I came across on this forum, but someone is listing the hacks of DeFi projects. It goes into hundreds of millions I think? Not exactly sure. Those codes have been audited by "professional" auditing companies as far as I know. I have no idea how much these certificates are really worth. Whenever a new project shows up these days, it has some sort of certificate that says the code has been audited.

Yes, using the BSC wallet to store personal assets is not wrong because the BSC wallet also has a lot of support through Binance so that it is safe to use and is very feasible for anyone who wants to use it.

I is not about using the BSC wallet only, but about the good intentions that somebody can have sung the network. BSC is really efficient, there is no doubt abut that!