Bitcoin Forum

Pension funds typically provide investment options such as shares, property, cash and bonds.

1. Is Bitcoin likely to join the mix in the future?

2. Why is gold not usually available as an investment option for pension funds?

institutional pension portfolio managers dont want to dabble in bitcoin direct.
for their own regulated and insured treasuries they can only invest in other regulated and insured assets/companies

so that is where ETF trusts are to be created
whereby the ETF trust(company) holds bitcoin and values the ETFtrust(company) at the amount of bitcoin held.. and offers regulated and insured shares of the trust(company) where the share value a division of the value of the collateral(bitcoin value) held within

..
as for people personally 'saving for retirement' in their own lives.. outside of institutional portfolios
they are free to buy bitcoin and hoard it for a few decades

Pension funds are usually handled by private companies. So it's not actually Bitcoin who has to join, it's the companies who have to decide to make the step. And it's really up to them whether or when they do that.
Since Bitcoin is still seen as high risk, highly speculative and highly volatile asset, no wonder that most are afraid. But time works in our favor. Institutional investors "just" started coming in, we need a little more patience and probably the "labels" will become softer and more (including pension funds) will join these markets - directly or indirectly.

About gold I don't know, sorry.

Pension funds can be attracted to the possible returns with investing in Bitcoin, but they can be turned off with its extreme volatility. And since not a single person in a person fund can decide the investment strategy, they will have a hard time deciding to go or not to go, unlike with private companies where the decision-making can fall on a few heads. However, this is a great opportunity for a platform to provide Bitcoin investing services to pension plans with some good safety nets in place. Hope someone brilliant can come up a good idea along this line.

I think it will require reasonable amount moderation in price volatility and uncertainty for this to be accepted by most.
In regards to the question on gold , i suspect they do that to be able to control the price and keep it affordable for industrial purposes. That shouldn't be much of a problem with Bitcoin, because  it's used mostly as currency

Why don't pension portfolio managers want to dabble in Bitcoin direct?

There are already some pension funds buying bitcoin. Not directly, probably due to legal limitations, but they are able to buy Bitcoin ETF.

In Brazil we already have a bitcoin ETF and there are some pension funds buying  it.

Google translated:


I also found about this fund in New Zeland which is buying bitcoin:

1. If bitcoin continues to be as volatile as ever then probably we won't see it being added as aprt of pension funds unless they are traded in the market but I don't think that pension funds will want something risky being added to it.

2. Not everyone can afford it and I don't know if this is just in my country but gold can't be taken out when you buy it from a bank and you have to pay storage fee for them to safekeep the gold.

Maybe back then but right now gold not being considered a legal tender is already not true depending on which state or country you are because in Louisiana, Utah and Texas, they have a legislation that considers gold as a legal tender.

I don't think that's going to happen, bitcoin doesn't have a definite development team, everyone can use and develop them, and even if there is it's very difficult to determine its value, because the price is very unstable and will keep changing all the time. Bitcoin is much more suitable for investing only.

I heard that small percentage of pension funds in Norway already have Bitcoin and other investments that are not connected with fiat currencies.

I don't really trust any pension funds, I also don't trust governments especially after 2020 and 2021, and I believe that all funds will be destroyed in upcoming financial collapse or great reset attempt.
Pension funds are owned by various  investment firms that are investing in various things like equities, for example Ohio pension funds invested 5% of their assets in gold, and Chile pension funds have done something similar.
People should be responsible for their own money and they should invest in hard assets like gold, silver and in digital alternative as Bitcoin.

1. Most of those assets that you've mentioned can do the same as bitcoin. It can provide profit at the same it's your cash(medium of payment) and investment.
2. I don't know much about gold but I think there are people that treats it too as their retirement asset.

Bitcoin is not an ideal investment to prepare for retirement, because its value is very volatile and bitcoin will be more suitable as an investment instrument.
and pension funds are reserve funds that we can use to fill our old age when we are no longer working and because these funds can at least ward off currency inflation so that their value is maintained, while the price of bitcoin is very volatile where prices can change significantly from time to time.

pensions. have to have a high standard of fund security to reduce cost and minimise loss..
much higher standard than just plain 'investing'

so pension funds have portfolio in hi-grade secured/high standard regulated investment options

because they are protected by investing in other regulated companies. it pushes the risk/loss liability off them.
having direct holding of raw asset is a risk. costing them more on their insurance and liabilities, licenes, auditing etc

EG. just take the insurance part
imagine you had bitcoin hoard of $1m. to insure it under ur home insurance its a $1m liability. causing you a high premium.
but have shares in a bitcoin company collateral. where they have insurance. means if your 'shares' are lost. you can then claim on their insurance. meaning your own insurance for your share holdings wont be as high
because your more protected. and chances are you will get funds back from any losses via the third party insurance

EG just take the regulation
hoarding bitcoin would mean you have to KYC and taint analyse your incoming deposits. as you are liable for any AML.
however have shares in another company that hoards bitcoin where that company is regulated. means you dont have to KYC so heavily and dont have the licencing and auditing costs that come with it. because the other company is doing that before you

EG take the liabilities.
if you hoard bitcoin. and a thief/hacker stole them from your house.. all your customers would sue you. and your in bankruptcy. however have shares in a company that hoards coin. your not directly liable and its passed down to the other party, which falls onto their insurance. and their liquidity. protecting you

its all about several layers of protection, cost reduction of admin/insurance. and also if bitcoin goes up by 10% and the company trust share goes up by 10% .. why invest in bitcoin when you can invest in a more regulated share system with less management costs and still get the same market movement offers

Pension funds are for security, the fact that bitcoins are volatile would be hard for them to regulate their value
Problems can arise. It would be more convenient to hold them on our own to avoid any conflict.

after we invest we may have invested for the future with a long term, if one day we want to retire we can take our money back for something we want to use,that is an investment that we build from a young age and very it is useful to meet our needs in the future,that is what an investment with a long term is for.if we want to retire later we can take our funds back,only the amount is different

I share the same idea that some of you have. When investing in bitcoin in most cases we think of a long-term investment. In particular, I have decided to save in bitcoin to pay for the University of my nephew and niece who are now minors.

In addition, I am also thinking about my old age, saving is very important, I myself am experiencing it with my grandmother. In my country, pensioners receive very little money for a plan designed by the government, so I have had to help my mother with my grandmother's expenses.

Fortunately, she is very healthy and there are other relatives who help her to support her.
In view of this, I have also decided to save in bitcoin and crypto for when I get those golden years I know how to handle them and of course it would also be of help to my mother.

Bitcoin is the solution of the future. And the biggest investment in the world today is in Bitcoin, not in Gold. Although the current use of Bitcoin has not been dominated by all circles. Only for those who understand about networking and online investing.
We target that the use of Bitcoin in 2030 will reach all circles. And started by various companies in the world.

I believe that US pension funds have large savings and if the dollar continues to depreciate, then these funds will lose all their funds. I don’t think they don’t think about how to save their funds and probably they have been investing for a long time or some of them in different directions. The question is, are they investing in BTC or are they going to do it? But what if the price of BTC was deliberately lowered to attract the attention of pension funds and other funds? So what! First, they showed how the price of BTC is growing, then, as it were, they scammed the price to hint they say, come in while there is an opportunity. Thus, drawing more and more money into BTC.

bitcoin can not be an option for retirement funds , unless the company we work for already uses bitcoin to pay salaries .  but if the company has not used bitcoin payments I think it is difficult to have a pension fund in the form of bitcoin, because ordinary pension funds have been regulated by local government laws and managed by certain parties

Great idea but not likely to be anytime soon. My country is a country that provides crypto as an asset. They will not recognize as legal tender. So the government will definitely not use Bitcoin or other crypto as pension money. It's officially the government, but if you retire here unofficially, that's fine. Just like the advantages of Bitcoin, having a limited supply and holding on to inflation is very good as an unofficial pension fund. Because the value is believed to be going up even though the movement is very unstable.

bitcoin has grown for more than 10 years, the beginning of the emergence of bitcoin everyone hesitated and was afraid to hold bitcoin, let alone invest in bitcoin, even some big countries banned the use of bitcoin, but over time, bitcoin continues to be sought, and continues to be used as an asset and Big companies have started collecting bitcoins until now, I believe that maybe in the future private companies will take steps in bitcoin, and make bitcoin a pension fund, for bitcoin holders..

bitcoin and pension funds, according to the rapidly advancing development of bitcoin, it is not impossible that large companies will approach bitcoin, to collaborate, to be able to get the same benefit, even companies that provide pension funds will cooperate with bitcoin, Let's see what will happen in the future, hopefully what we hope for comes true..

Bitcoin can join the mix in the future, but it needs more time because bitcoin needs government approval. Once the government accepts, people will start to use bitcoin as their investment. But we do not have to wait for that because we already knew bitcoin for a long time and saved bitcoin.

People knew gold as an investment a long time ago, and they think that gold is the best investment for them. So if they know about bitcoin and realize the benefit of bitcoin, they will race to invest in bitcoin and save it for their future.

Related to pension funds, I think that will depend on what people choose, and if they like bitcoin, they will use bitcoin. Otherwise, they will still select gold as their investment.

Nothing had already anticipate on how far bitcoin could potentially go but for those who had risk on early days did really took the profit and it is really that worth the wait.

If we do talk about pensions and stuff then we cant really just easily rely into something or does have an assurance. When we do talk about bitcoin as part of it then

its up to someones risk taking thing because not all would really be having the mindset. Anything has risk even though it do show some good progress but we know that theres no such thing
about guaranteed safe or risk free.

Well, comparing both has a simple answer, and let us start from a basic one --bitcoin and gold are totally different, you can assume that bitcoin can be your pension plan because the price has a potential to increase and have strong volatility when it comes to price that could be somehow will up due to the limit of supply whereas gold has a limited supply and the price are almost stable that it will increase for a small percentage every year. At this people think that bitcoin is the best for keeping the value as an asset than using it as an alternative currency, that is why it is very suitable as an pension plan.

If you think that Bitcoin will be a stable currency without much fluctuation then people might consider investing their pension savings in the Bitcoin market, other than that none of the investors will advice anyone to invest their pension funds in a highly volatile market. Typical pension funds are invested in safe market that are not highly volatile.

Gold and precious metals are considered good investments during times of high inflation/recession.

In a normal economy, other assets on average will offer higher % returns than gold. Making them more attractive.

Pension funds are special in that they're expected to operate over a span of decades. If they were flexible in their investment strategy. They might buy stocks during a bull market and switch to holding bitcoin or gold in times of recession or inflation to preserve their reserves.

The performance of bitcoin could be evidence pensions might benefit from investing in algorithmically limited deflationary assets. That are publicly traded and useful for remittances. There are many interesting discussions which could had on this. If people were ever interested in discussing anything.

I think bitcoin itself is less suitable for pension funds because of its more active fluctuating price movements, but that doesn't mean bitcoin won't join in the future, I think bitcoin remains in its role and can become more popular from other sides such as investing, trading, certain transactions, and others related to a certain project.

Bitcoin is suitable for investment and it can be your gold so if you need money, you can sell your bitcoin and make money. Bitcoin should be the investment than to be the payment system because the price volatility is very sharp than the other commodity.

I consider selecting bitcoin and gold as an investment option for pension funds because both bitcoin and gold can give us the money we needed in the future. Even if the price has volatility, but in the future, bitcoin and gold prices can increase higher than today, but the increases of the gold price will not be like bitcoin price.

Related to question number 2, I think that is because gold is a personal option and not all people will invest in gold as an investment. We know that many other things can be the investment such as land, building, home, antique stuff, or else.

bitcoin and pension funds, maybe this is a very good idea, but if we look at the movement of bitcoin, we should still use bitcoin as an asset, because if we have made bitcoin into a pension fund, we make it a legal currency, etc., I think bitcoin in the future is no longer a challenge, and a new nuance,, we need to know bitcoin is coming to give us a new feel, which is not the same as fiat currency work...

Bitcoin is classified as an asset by the governments not as legal tender and also they implemented huge taxes on bitcoin so its more likely the users will be paying the money from their hands intead of making any returns if they add it to the long term investment, but it depends on where we are living.

Gold actual have the value neither of them in the list doesn't have that is why it is not available.

As many people know, at least here in the United States, Pension have been on their way out for a long time.  Very few private businesses offer pensions these days and mostly just governments.  Reason being? They are not sustainable.  There is a reason my state of Illinois is the most bankrupt, corrupt state in the U.S. and in large part it has to do with it's employees pension funds ( I actually work with governmental employees daily and speak about this all the time.  Pensions tend to only allow more stable investments, and when you get highly volatile investments in the mix, that puts peoples retirement checks at high risk.  So right now, it is not really a legitimate choice for fund managers.

Bitcoin is still much in doubt for the government for those who provide pension funds in the form of bitcoin because we know the price of bitcoin is very uncertain with many very significant changes, unless we change the pension fund to fiat and then invest if it is the main trust for some people are retired, but are they totally sure about bitcoin? there are still many doubts.

But it's a risk if bitcoin as an investment tool is profitable and risk-ready doesn't matter because it's old money where there can be no greater risk at such times so stocks and gold might be much better off.

All I know, pension funds is only based on fiat currency which is regulated by the local government. Bitcoin is not a legal tender and not yet acceptable as payment method in different business establishment. Also it is impossible for the government to use bitcoin as a pension fund because it is highly volatile.

I don't know much about the reason why gold isn't part of pension funds but I don't think that all pension funds don't have any gold in their portfolio. I think it's a good time to add bitcoin to pension fund because if you look at it, the prices overtime proved that bitcoin can go back up in prices even if a manor setback or dump happens.

It has been discussed with the other thread regarding bitcoin pension funds on this forum. Perhaps, if we are talking about the future, some companies will most likely reconsider that option. Though I do not think it is a good idea as the price wont be stable if they'll set particular basic amount in terms of bitcoin.

And as for the gold, it is too special that it wasnt that easy to mine gold and to make it as a pension fund? Nah, I dont think it will be great to consider that idea.

indeed, the consideration of giving a pension with bitcoin is certainly a good way because it follows developments that have continued to develop so far. but it looks like it's too risky to do it without thinking about what will happen in the future, because we know the bitcoin price is unstable. if the calculations are done in the end it is detrimental, of course it is not good for the future of the recipient. it's better if you have to use a stable coin like USDT etc.

In principle, don't force it if it ends up being detrimental to the beneficiaries, because in retirement they need funds that do not change from when they received them.