Bitcoin Forum

As Bitcoin is gradually becoming known to the public, this financial and economic feast brought by technology geeks.
Bitcoin is like honey, attracting countless butterflies (altcoins, air coins), countless new projects appearing, ICO.IDO.
It feels more like a comet hitting the earth, leaving big pits. It seems that there are countless treasures waiting to be mined.
The greed of human nature, the inducement of big brothers, the participation of whales, all kinds of good news are flying all over the sky, but the result is just a place of chicken feathers.
Perhaps the sharp drop of Bitcoin and endless washings can calm more people down.
How do you think about this issue?

I have never heard altcoins be called air coins. That's a good one. But to the point, price crashes or a prolonged sideway price movement usually makes it unattractive for scammers to operate because there simply aren't enough participants in the market to victimize with "air coins". So in a way flat markets are good for the reason of washing out scammers.

Probably because the altcoins are made out of thin air.

The sharp drop of BTC is inevitable though, the price just peaks and because of that, they take profit. It's still going to attract wealthy investors when they see the price dip. You can see Saylor still buying up more BTC. For now, the scammers are calming down but once the price is up again, they'd be back.

It's inevitable. Not Bitcoin or any pioneer of technology fault. People (business) will do this kind of thing since they smell the opportunity to make money. As long as we continue to educate new users, problems such as scams can go away, albeit slowly.

You means shitcoins, right?


Not at all. We had ICO craze, we had a huge drop in Bitcoin price (2018), crypto winter (2019) and then we got back where we started from, with Bitcoin hugely rising again and with NFT craze.
So it looks like a sharp drop calms people down only for a rather short period of time and they find another approach for worthless projects to lure people into.


I guess that people just don't want to learn from others' mistakes and they're keen to make their own. So it'll take a while... and Bitcoin sharp falls just make it take longer.

As long as there are no regulations limiting who is allowed to create their own crypto, we will continue to see thousands of new altcoins every day. Supposedly, the creation of altcoins is backed by established entities or companies that meet legal standards. In fact, nowadays altcoins can be created by amateurs with no skill base who just had an idea from their dream last night and then invite other random people on the internet to develop it.

Nothing new tbh. Bitcoin brought innovation, but it doesn't mean that people would accept it as the only one, hence they make more, most of them being suitable for their own purpose, some of them just riding the hype, while some of them taking advantage of the hype to scam others. And hey who knows, there may actually be a better product in the near future, no one can really tell. It's not like every pioneer was the best when they came out, some were easily overpassed by better developers. The start matters, yes, but the one to last till the end is still the winner, whether they start early or late.

No one can predict the future, let the future people think about what the future will look like. Altcoin is a virtual currency similar to Bitcoin, which is generated by referring to the ideas, principles, and source code of Bitcoin.
Since Bitcoin itself does not have an authoritative issuance agency or state power to maintain its authority and uniqueness, Bitcoin and its imitators can only get along with each other on an equal footing, and does not have an exclusive status.
I may be a pragmatist, a person who lives in the present, and does not think about things far in the future. Of course, I don’t believe in pie falling from the sky, so as long as you are rational and don’t believe in scams, You will not pay attention to altcoins instead of blindly following them. One scam a day, each scam is different

I think somebody should start a joke shit coin called "shitcoin"

ticker 'shtc'.

The propose of that shitcoin is to finance a campaign to bring awareness to the issue started at the historic 2010 discussion on potential “shitcoins”, scams, ponzis and how people will lose lots of money buying into them.  

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1647.msg20646#msg20646 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1647.msg20646#msg20646)

ps-> if you guys announce it at "Announcements (Altcoins)" please let me know I will send a msg to the Bitcoin maximalist
Max Keiser  ;D

I mean that's to be expected on almost anything, it's not like people are going to settle for only one product and if they were, then we won't be seeing any other model of cars besides Ford Motors. Also, it's a good thing that there are other cryptocurrencies out there besides bitcoin to make diversification in crypto bucket much easier.

Imitation is the most sincere form of flattery.
Bitcoin will adopt the best of the finance tech.

Alt and air coins push technology and innovation further. There are many more problems to solve than finance. Satoshi once suggested miners have a DNS service, f.x.

It's fine, except for the scams by air conns.

DNS is an important topic indeed .. to not mention namecoin and recently handshake

MIT Bitcoin Expo 2019 - Handshake: An Experimental, Peer-to-Peer Root DNS
https://youtu.be/h505L7A_Z8g (https://youtu.be/h505L7A_Z8g)

Bitcoin might be the inspiration but certainly not the reason why altcoins are appearing.

You already mentioned that humans are fueled by their greed to create money out of thin air, and they can do that by creating yet another cryptocurrency to get people buying. They just got the idea from bitcoin, but their reasons on creating that coin is not bitcoin per se so there's a difference in there.

No matter how many times people campaign against obvious scamcoins, if there would be enough gullible people around to buy the hype, nothing would change in the scene.

It is exactly what you said, just like a boy fell in love with a girl at first sight. Just by looking at his expression, he already knows where he will be buried in the future.
Many people go crazy speculating on coins, but they are annoyed by a fatal mistake, which is human nature. When a person thinks that he is already strong, it is often the most dangerous time.
This is like playing music. Every performer already has a different personality and personality background. Some people want to how to play in heart, but the actual control on hand is inconsistent.

Unfortunately, it has not and in fact I have seen so many new shitcoins and meme coins during the dip of Bitcoin. It happened before maybe around late 2017 when ICOs became so popular and most of them were then using the Ethereum network...right now we are witnessing the mushrooming of new projects under the BSC ecosystem induced mostly by its low and acceptable fees plus other features. Maybe the only way these new projects to stop sprouting if there will be the same cryptocurrency ban that is implemented in China to be done globally...but of course that is not what we really want. The thing is we can not stop these projects but we can choose either not to support them or be selective.

That's natural, people wants to imitate or take inspiration from the original because they know that there's money or somehing beneficial to it when they create their own coins. It's not a problem because as an investor, you just have to stick to the original and do your research on the other coins that imitated or was created after the original to see it's potential.

So was bitcoin, and it would be hard to argue otherwise (though all of the initial thought and innovation went into bitcoin's creation, whereas altcoins are mostly clones).  Satoshi basically just made it, and initially a relatively small group of people liked it and used it. 

I've never heard the term "aircoin" either, and I'm assuming OP just made that up or there's a bit of a language issue at play here.  Some shitcoins might as well be air, but not all of them are crap.  Whether you want to admit it or not, some coins have improved on bitcoin--whether it's faster confirmation times, lower fees, or the ability to create smart contracts.  Bitcoin most likely will remain the king of cryto, but there are never any guarantees of that.

No, it's not--at least not for all of them.  I'd say bitcoin fork coins are definitely due to the existence of bitcoin, but there are others (like ETH and some of the newer ones) that are different enough from bitcoin that they shouldn't be considered bitcoin ripoffs.

There will not be endless washings,,, one day the shitcoin market will not be able to grow and only Bitcoin and a few strong alts will be where people really use. Shitcoins will always be there along with whatever nonsense ICO stage but they will be like HYIP markets now. Ponzis that people stay away from and can only dupe people who deserve it.

Of course, bitcoin is the main driving force for the evolution of most altcoins but, it ain't the reason for its continuity and success. Many projects have tapped into the ideas and concepts surrounding it but then, not so many has been successful and so many still would always continue to fail out becuase, they don't solve any real problem. For a coin to be successful or a project, its got to solve a problem in the market and have some uniqueness about its futures. These are the things investors look out for to determine if a project is going to be successful or not. Most of what we have now are just baseless pump and dump coins.

This is what should be expected because anything on this world become a trend then expect that there would be something new that would be created correlated to it because they do know that it can possibly give them profits when they do get some market share.

We have seen on how the market is been flooded with lots of projects and it turns out that majority of it is just pure garbage or shit tokens in short.

Thing here is that you do know on how to to deal with your investment despite of the lots of coins in the market.When trend is hot then for sure there would be lots will be following.

People have seen the impact of btc in the market throughout these years and how they can get money out of it. So they start copying and imitating projects. The reason why there are a lot of fork of forks and copycats. Also, a lot found out that they can deceive investors without disclosing their identities. Which is actually one of the negative outcome of being anonymous. With the proliferation of these alts, the user should know how to differentiate a legit over fake/crap/scam project. Because no one can help you when you want to recover your funds from a failed investment.

The proliferation of countless altcoins which are mostly worthless and often outright scams was foreseen from the very beginning. I refer you to a very early thread about this very thing (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1647.msg20646#msg20646) from 2010. That link puts you at a very salient point but I suggest you go back to the opening posts (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1647.msg19737#msg19737) that set the stage for the discussions back then.

In fact, I am not completely rejecting altcoins and the air coins that the author said.
What is disgusting is the coins used to create scams. Many altcoins are completely plagiarized, without any value system, no sustainability, and no correspondence.
Application scenarios. Many of the altcoins I have encountered are all based on huge temptation to promote. The project propaganda method is simple and violent.
Sadly, many people participate. This is something I don’t want to see, because too many people are involved. Without cognition, what I want to say is that a person’s wealth comes from his cognition, rather than relying on fluke and speculation to obtain wealth.
Liars are hateful, but those who speculate and lose all their principal are not pitiful.

This case has become normal for every bull run we encountered.
Just like what happened last 2017 - 2018 bull run, a lot of money poured in shitcoins, ICO fever with Ethereum before started, most of ICOs before already lost above 80-90% after few months when we experienced huge dump from all-time-high $19,000+ and below $10,000 to $5,000.
It was an awful experience especially for those new people who just started cryptocurrency and lost very huge.

For sure a lot of people are going to calm down at this time that the market is down, they will take a break. When the market was rushing up a lot of people were rushing into it and the greed was too much.

A lot of them were not even taking calculated moves, they just had their mind on how they will make once they invest, there was a heavy FOMO. Well the market is in a bearish mode right now, so they are all going to calm down and will stop the rush. And as for the altcoins, well… there are some of them that are good, but as usual, in a space like this there is always going to be the bad eggs. It’s up to you to avoid them.

The outbreak of Bitcoin triggered the issuance of many air coins and altcoins, and also affected everyone's clarity and thinking ability. It seems that everyone feels that no matter how much money you buy, you can bring huge benefits. It is this influx of brainless fresh blood that has caused the recent turmoil in the currency circle. Countless air coins began to wield their sickles, harvesting the wealth of all users. This is accidental and inevitable. If there is no shock to clean up speculators, it will be detrimental to future development. It is precisely because of the shock that those who really persist can be screened out.

Worse than that I believe is that now people are making you think you are no longer pouring Bitcoin and ETH into these stupid IDOs,,, because of the wrapping and all those "layer 2 tokens". I bet you one of the big Layer 2s will fail and lose a lot of people's BTC and ETH especially, and then the domino effect will be unstoppable.

They try to follow the bitcoin but could never match it's technology and that's why people invest in it and countries and companies are accepting this.Most of the altcoins are shitcoins in the crypto market that have no future ahead,no advance technology and centralised which makes them completely out of the track when compared to bitcoin.They claim they can overtake bitcoin with pos or any other algorithm which makes system more centralised and you can't provide the same security btc is providing to you.Thats why when bitcoin crash it boost with high surge as it has been declared dead for hundred time but still rise but on the other side shitcoins who try to compete with it once crashed can never regain their position in market which happened in 2017 crash situation.

Indeed. I think there are far many people who are doing this, jumping into the waves once they see the market is rushing. And it can be deemed that people are calmer now, with the drop happening to the market. Whereas it is also sure that many are also attracted right now to invest with the price dip, with the opportunity in mind that profits will be gained in time. And maybe this practice is just what people will let to linger on for years. Although there are many good coins, shit coins also exist, nonetheless being wise is crucial here.

Its just because Bitcoin has some lacking characteristics that saw producers to create another coin probably new altcoin that can alter or can be chosen alternative to bitcoin. What problem I can see is that they make so much altcoins that are being left behind and doesnt even bought by investors because they have similar used of previous existing coins.

And thats the disadvantage of having mass production of altcoins, their value isnt worth enough and the competitions between those altcoins were tight.

that's how new project works nowadays and its called a technique just to get the attention of some investors. Wherein they copied what's the trend such features of the coin that can really convince buyer and etc. Its common now actually since those trusted crypto currency in the market keeps upgrading as well such bitcoin, ethereum and all top crypto,  even scam is too hard to determine because of that reason. So much better to focus in original to avoid it.

The bad effect if there are too many altcoins, namely the price can go down and investors must be very careful in investing in altcoins because at this time there are many scams.
on the other hand there are also advantages of altcoins because there will definitely be one of the many altcoins that has a good future so that the price continues to rise from year to year.

It wasn't always like this. The "Alternative Cryptocurrencies" were worthy of the name. They were projects that were exploring other possibilities and technologies that bitcoin couldn't or wouldn't try. This was 2011.
Then the developers slowly forgot what altcoins were for and started creating money grab projects where they could make a LOT of money in a short term for doing very little. Then they slowly decreased the amount of work they had to do by copying other projects, and finally by inventing the ICO scam where they don't have to do anything since there is no blockchain anymore and the tokens rely on the existing blockchain of a project made for scamming people!
This won't change as long as the devs and the investors care about making most amount of money in shortest amount of time.

If scammers aren't attracted to it then it's not actually worth what's been priced at, scammers only go for what they believe have potential and the cryptocurency industry is full of that potential. Bitcoin shouldn't be blame for all that's happening, I'm pretty sure it never intend for it to turn out this way like there's even more coins than investors.

Bitcoin was only interested in making us financially free, been able to spend your money without the interference of a third party like the banks, Satoshi knew the fiat system was failing and been corrupt so he introduced a much better way to carryout our finances but as usual humans, we always became greedy.

Th alternative industry has done some good as well bad to the community, assuming the industry wasn't exiting then we won't have had some of the amazing projects that are currently exiting and potentially been in developed to be released in future.

That is the fact that happen in cryptocurrency. When bitcoin began popular in 2013-2017, people who have knowledge about blockchain technology start to create many projects and invite the investor to join with them. We can see that those projects grew without stop and many more launch the other project from that year.

It attracts attention from people who see the opportunity to make money from crypto to join and make money. This opportunity sees by the scammer and follows their step by creating a new project.

It will happen like that and will still happen in the future so it needs more awareness from people to research deeper to find the right project if they want to join in the crypto world. But if they only have bitcoin, that will be okay for them since research for the other project will not be easy.

That's to be expected, I mean we won't have many brands of cars out there if only Ford was the one that made it right? That's the same for cryptocurrency, bitcoin won't be enough for a lot of people because some of them wants to put their own twist in something that's already existing, it's not something that we should be scared, it's just means that the popularity of cryptocurrency is still going rampant because new coins are being created although you have to do your own research first before anything else because not all these coins are profitable.

Bitcoin is the principle of money disruption, it has a purpose to demonstrate that we need decentralization especially in those nations that are oppressed by inequality and lack of opportunities.

Although we are still in the initial phase, the journey continues. The growth of other coins has been possible thanks to the invention of bitcoin which makes it possible to see that its mission has been maximized.

Bitcoin was meant to be productive with numerous offsprings just like a tree producing fruits that attract large consumption of traders and consumers. This is just the beginning of the mass adoption of Bitcoin and it's offsprings which are altcoins whether stable or meme coins of different varieties.

The acceptance of Bitcoin in the society as method of payment system and transactions had really increased the numbers of new coins in the market. In less than no time, by the time the price of Bitcoin skyrocket to like $100k per each, to there would have been millions of coins in the market, expanding the worth and participants of the entire cryptocurrency market.

More countries are still yet to officially adopt Bitcoin and it's activities which is going to expand and emanate more coins.

And am wondering how this decentralization can bridge the gap of inequality experience in small nations as you put it! To me it will all come back to  be the same old story, as it is, having btc or being part of the crypto space does not exactly change anything other than having control of whatever you own, it does not mean that money will be evenly distributed among the poor and the rich, right now in crypto,  we have fewer group in control of the market and have the power to pump or dump it at their own convenient, and what role has decentralization play in this aspect? Has it stop few whales to own a larger percentage of btc supply? Or have the whole space wrapped around their fingers! No right, at the end of the day, it is like a vicious circle, it will bring us back to same spot.

Many people see the potential of bitcoin way back before and even by now that's why many decide to create their own company and imitate how bitcoin circulate in  the ecosystem and we should glad that this one happen because the existence of  bitcoin creates opportunity to  us traders and business owner to gain profits from this technology. Also we need to be careful since the crypto ecosystem is full of scam that's why we need to be choosy on what coin we want to invest our money, many said that they are profitable but some of them create for illegal stuffs so we also need to  be careful from that.

Bitcoin was the first successful cryptocurrency so it would be the one who would be copied or at least gave them idea.
It has always been like it , It only needs one to start something and if it blooms surely others would try to compete with it.

Bitcoin is open-source, and it's fairly simple to create one's own coin. So of course, many go for it, especially since it's low-effort but potentially profitable. But I see it as a fair side effect of having Bitcoin in our world the way it is, and the side effect sometimes even leads to creation of pretty good coins and platforms, so it's not all bad. I don't think it's an issue we have to do anything about. Regulating who has the right to create altcoins and under which conditions would be against Bitcoin ideology. And it's not that hard to navigate the world of cryptos, as a simple sort by market capitalization is usually enough to see which coins have something in them and which are most likely rubbish.

And some still are,,, except not all of them call themselves altcoins.

In fact, the problem now is that the only ones who still call themselves alts are shitcoins. I think at some point we have to change the forum or at least change the guidance now and "educate" people to show them the world that was painted in 2011.

I suggest even coins that raise money or do ICO/IEO/IDO whatever it is you want to call them are in their own category as these usually have no real development unless there is money raised or tokens sold.

In every new discovery there will be hundreds of opportunities of all kinds, there will be people of all kinds as well, good and bad, and there will always be people trying to exploit and deceive others, for example when America was first discovered immigration began to a new land and people got thousands of opportunities It is good to invest and get rich but at the same time there were other people who were deceived that they would get the gold as soon as they got there but they ended up becoming slaves after they were deceived.
Bitcoin is the same because it is a new discovery. People have had thousands of opportunities and some of them have become rich as a result of investing in Bitcoin, but at the same time there are many people who have lost their money because they were deceived and their money was stolen by scammers and chitcoins.
The only solution is to spread crypto culture among the people and warn everyone about scams and alert people that no one can get rich just by getting some bitcoins or chitcoins.

I called altcoins-air coins, because they are invisible and intangible, because there is no application scenario, the number of the wallet gives us too little meaning, and it is easy to find the air where you invest. Many garbage coin projects are more like a blood-sucking mosquito. The only purpose is to get our money.

The goal is just to make a profit and then abandoned. Many rugpull projects I've known. They are just speculative coins that are constantly promoted so that they go up drastically and then when many buy them the developers will do a big sale so there is no luqudity left. Do not entrust your money in one basketball because it is very risky. Recognize and learn. Sell ​​when it is profitable than rugpull.

My point of view is actually very clear. Altcoins are not equal to rubbish coins. The key lies in everyone's mentality. I thought of a sentence, can I express my point of view: Many people do not go through the front door, but have to go through the back door, but they open the back door. Got into the arms of the liar. Because too many people look for projects to make money, but they don’t go back to look at project white papers, technical white papers, audit reports, mathematical models, etc. In the world of altcoins, a team of 100 people may deceive only one person.

You can call that, majority of the projects in the market are created expecting to make good returns by the developers and some started for fun just copying the source code of BTCitcoin and launching as their own and to my surprise everything is valued a few years from now and some of them are over $100 even the developers who created them for fun never anticipated, but the market is moving forward and new investment coming in for all the early coin and i am not a big fan of initial offers either because you need to have a trust to the developers to complete the project after collecting the money and the risk factor is really high.

Exactly, and with the variety of coins, it makes for a good competition meaning that we can get in the market early at an affordable price plus the potential of growth is really high given that there's only a few people that are still believing bitcoin. You are right about being be careful in the market since where there's prosperity, people that have malicious intent will try to take an advantage.

We all celebrate Satoshi not just because he is the creator of bitcoin, but because he was the first and boldest to take the first step towards the future. Bitcoin is the pioneer crypto currency and it is fair to say that all other creators of the early cryptocurrency that followed studied bitcoin first before their own creations having seen that the step was a step in the right direction towards the future of money.

So "yes", bitcoin caused the mass production of altcoins and other shitcoins. There are over a hundred altcoins out there and most were created by the creators for "pump and dump", a way to gather bitcoins and Ethereum for themselves.

I just think people need to trust bitcoin, that was the origin of everything we see around, and stop listening to crypto gurus who say altcoin X or Y is going to surpass bitcoin growment soon and become a top coin in the market. If investors stopped doing that, there could be infinite altcoins disponible that they wouldn't cause any negative impact in the market.
At the end of the day the issue aren't altcoins intensive development, people promoting them, manipulative whales or mainstream fud. The real issue is the investors' behavior which keeps falling for such empty promises and there isn't any solution besides investors changing their personal mindset.

It is usual thing for every direction that is connected with money, assets and so on. There are lots of projects outside the crypto world that create lots of hypes and some kind of ICO, IDO. Of course lots of people would like to create something huge, massive, powerful like Bitcoin, that is why they try to create altcoins and enormous projects to attract money. Of course Bitcoin is a fundamental thing and will be forever. It's like the automobile creation. There are and there will be lots of models of different colours, construction and engines, but the first auto created long-long ago will stay the fundament for all of them.

Is it bitcoin that cause it or blockchain? From my own point of view I think blockchain is the reason why we have so many alts in the crypto space since anyone can literally use blockchain to create their project since it is open source,  bitcoin only only contribute to it, many dev got inspired by btc that they decided to create their own project hoping it solve those problems bitcoin could not solve, before you know it there a thousands of altcoins all claiming to address one issue or another.

As long as the block chain and the data mining technologies grow, these cryptos will never cease to stop. Sure bitcoins have given a way to the production of various altcoins and aircoins and more people are paying their attention towards them. Have to wait to see how this goes.

I think this happens because the idea of being unearthed on bitcoin keeps coming up, so there are always coins with innovations and new concepts. make so many air coins, as well as other altcoins, although with the same concept, it's like not wearing copyright because here we are transparent and open source.

As long as there are no regulations that restrict anyone from being allowed to create their own crypto, but with this opportunity there are many fraudsters in the name of crypto, there are many who are taking advantage of the bitcoin situation that was up yesterday to make airdrops and some are valuable but mostly zonk.

I very much agree with your point of view. The greed of human nature and the fluke of getting rich overnight, especially some elderly people, are sometimes willing, which is very strange. "Investment" with high profits as bait has become the most current scam. When the stomach is not full, gold is not gold. Be more rational. Altcoins are not a pie in the sky.

Because a lot of money is made through Bitcoin, people are greedy and want to share a piece of cake to eat, and everyone can issue coins. So there are a lot of altcoins. If it is a new currency issuance, if you invest, you must understand clearly before investing. Now there are a lot of scammers. Don't be deceived.