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Title: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Hydrogen on November 26, 2021, 11:46:05 PM Quote Millions of truckers are balking at President Joe Biden’s workplace vaccine mandate, which would be catastrophic for the nation’s supply chain problem if it is enforced, an American Trucking Associations executive told House members this week. “We’ve tried to be very clear to the administration — I understand the logic behind it — but if you do this, these are the consequences,” said ATA President Chris Spear. “So if you’re trying to solve the supply chain problem, you’re actually compounding it and actually hurting the very problem you’re trying to fix.” ATA is the nation’s largest trucking trade group. Spear testified in front of the House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee on supply chain problems. America is currently short approximately 80,000 truckers compared to pre-pandemic levels. If Biden’s Jan. 4 vaccine deadline is enforced, the industry will lose 37% of its truckers, or 2.5 million people, according to an ATA survey. The survey “came back as 37% of drivers not only said 'no,' but 'hell no,'” Spear testified. “It’s not about being anti-vax — we’ve been moving the vaccine test kits.” Rep. Doug LaMalfa, a California Republican, told the Washington Examiner that the supply chain is a disaster because both Biden and Gov. Gavin Newsom are more focused on climate change and vaccinating children. The Los Angeles ports, the busiest in the Western Hemisphere, are backed up with 106 supply ships waiting to unload off the coast, according to the latest figures. “Newsom has been pretty inattentive on all this … and the Biden administration is not really helping either,” LaMalfa said. “Truckers are independent individuals. They are like the cowboys of the highways and don’t want to be pushed around.” Spear also testified that fining shippers for full containers that linger too long at ports is a bad idea because the cost just gets passed down to consumers. Los Angeles and Long Beach ports implemented such fines last month as a way to clear the backlog. “It’s just another layer we’re going to have to bear. I don’t think it’s a good solution,” Spear said. “It’s just one choke point of many.” He added that the problem is simply too many containers stacked up at the ports and not enough time to clear them. Republican Rep. Rick Crawford asked, “So assessing fines and fees associated with that is probably just going to be exacerbating the problem with inflation?” “I don’t think it does anything, congressman. I really don’t,” Spear responded. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/policy/2-5-million-truckers-say-theyll-quit-over-vaccine-mandate-industry-warns-biden .... Not certain what the implications of this would be. If there are implications. I suppose it hinges upon whether truckers in 2021 are considered skilled or unskilled labor. Would a 2.5 million chunk of the workforce quitting create a vacuum which could easily be filled. The term independent contractors used to describe the trucking industry. Is often used to describe employment conditions that do not fit the label. Mixed martial artists in the UFC and pro wrestlers in WWE are both considered independent contractors. With a great deal of controversy surrounding the terminology and whether it is apt. The only thing for certain is, Elon Musk is working somewhere to build trucks with no steering wheels that are robot driven. Perhaps 2.5 million departing truckers will give Elon the vacuum he needs to push his robot truck drivers. That could rank in the top 5 of the most predictable things happening atm. As crazy as it may sound. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Gyfts on November 27, 2021, 02:21:04 AM This sums up US Covid policy really well, in fact.
A trucker, sitting alone in his/her truck for the majority of the day, would need to be vaccinated to protect who from catching Covid, exactly? The truck? The argument for a vaccine mandate was that an unvaxxed person could transmit Covid to someone that is also not vaccinated, but this begs the question as to how a truck driver is going to infect someone when they're sitting by themselves in a truck for most of the day. Anyways, the implications of this are more supply chain issues and low economic growth. Shipping and logistics are the base of the manufacturing industries of any country, so removing transportation out of the equation ensures everything grinds to a halt. They say inflation was due to the supply chain issue, and not a high money supply. Well, what happens to inflation when you stop truckers from doing their jobs if the result is scarcity of goods? More inflation. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: adaseb on November 27, 2021, 04:24:20 AM Yeah in Canada I read that there was like 120,000 truckers and 20% are not vaccinated. And by the deadline most likely the percentage will be closer to 10-15% or so. And these are not the local truckers but the ones that go thru the USA and back. The supply shortages right now are already bad for certain products and if 15-20% of truckers can't cross borders then its going to make it even worse.
Like the above posters have said, they are usually alone in their truck, might have a partner with them who is always with them anyways. You already can't go to many events when you are unvaxxed and most truckers they sleep in their cabs. So perhaps maybe at some restaurant they might be in contact with some people but there are most likely already other unvaxxed people there also. So I don't really see the point of all this. Inflation will keep going up transitory due to supply shortages. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: cabron on November 27, 2021, 04:49:39 AM You would really see how the prices of products are going into the supermarket today and how much the turkey cost because of the supply chain disruption. This disruption was first noticed in cargo shipping which ships are just docked in the middle of the sea. But adding this vaccine mandate is really making the supply chain worse. Can't say this is part of Elon Elon Musk's driverless trucks transition but it will make millions out of jobs. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: The Sceptical Chymist on November 27, 2021, 05:09:38 AM Not certain what the implications of this would be. If there are implications. You better believe there would be serious implications if all those truckers suddenly walked off the job. Before this supply chain problem cropped up, I don't think many of us ever gave much thought to how important that supply chain really is--if any of us thought of it at all. Truckers are an extremely important component of that chain, and they wouldn't be able to be replaced immediately. Even if there was a week's delay in replacing all of them, I think we'd be in for some serious shit.Would a 2.5 million chunk of the workforce quitting create a vacuum which could easily be filled. Highly doubtful unless the government suddenly relaxed the regulations on what it takes to drive an 18-wheeler across the country. There are schools for truck drivers, did you know that? And there's a special license truck drivers have to get in order to do their job, and in addition to that if replacement truck drivers had never done that job before, that lack of experience is going to show up as a bunch of mistakes and delays being made, and probably a lot of road fatalities too.Even though I think the consequences of a walk-off would be dire, I admire those guys for standing up for themselves. It seems like there aren't enough people doing that these days with respect to all of these COVID mandates. And by the way, LET'S GO, BRANDON!!! Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Lucius on November 27, 2021, 04:30:37 PM I believe that there would be serious consequences if as many as 2.5 million drivers suddenly stopped doing their job in the US, no one should doubt that. Let’s just look at what happened in the UK with a shortage of drivers (https://www.bbc.com/news/57810729) when petrol stations ran out of fuel and store shelves were empty. These people are essential to the functioning of society, until one day they are replaced by robots that will work non-stop and be immune to SARS viruses.
This sums up US Covid policy really well, in fact. A trucker, sitting alone in his/her truck for the majority of the day, would need to be vaccinated to protect who from catching Covid, exactly? The truck? The argument for a vaccine mandate was that an unvaxxed person could transmit Covid to someone that is also not vaccinated, but this begs the question as to how a truck driver is going to infect someone when they're sitting by themselves in a truck for most of the day. It's not just US policy, most countries in the world introduce such measures, regardless of the workplace and environment, you have to get vaccinated to be safe for yourself and others, although examples of countries with more than 85% of vaccinated people show that the virus spreads almost so at the same rate in such a population. The example of the Netherlands (https://www.dutchnews.nl/news/2021/11/most-dutch-are-vaccinated-so-why-are-covid-19-cases-spiking/), where over 72% of the population has been fully vaccinated (84.7% over the age of 18), is a clear example of how the vaccine protects against virus transmission, as in just one day the number of positive cases was 23 680. Of course, they blamed the children for everything, because they are not mostly vaccinated and transmit the virus. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: fiulpro on November 27, 2021, 06:08:43 PM An interesting fact:
Them quitting their jobs would not only impact them as a whole but it would impact everyone else as well since most US based trucking loading/offloading companies do work overseas as well and they have their centers around all the parts of the world which does mean that if these truckers decided to quit their jobs then it would impact a huge diverse group of people as well. There would be sudden shortage of truckers and that would put many things at halt which can cause many problems for individual enterprises as well working with those truckers. I do think that the government should try and somehow enlist the rule for vaccination more gently to the public. It's important for sure!! But making people comfortable as well should be their priority so as to avoid sudden probelms like this. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Silberman on November 27, 2021, 06:47:46 PM An interesting fact: Correct, and we do not really need for 2.5 million truck drivers to quit to create huge issues, the US is having problems with a shortage of 80k drivers, that is only 3.2% of the drivers that are threatening to stop working if Biden forced them to be vaccinated, so while it is unrealistic to expect that 2.5 million truck drivers stop working at the same time, I think it is realistic for 3.2% to stop doing it, doubling the current problems of the supply chain.Them quitting their jobs would not only impact them as a whole but it would impact everyone else as well since most US based trucking loading/offloading companies do work overseas as well and they have their centers around all the parts of the world which does mean that if these truckers decided to quit their jobs then it would impact a huge diverse group of people as well. There would be sudden shortage of truckers and that would put many things at halt which can cause many problems for individual enterprises as well working with those truckers. I do think that the government should try and somehow enlist the rule for vaccination more gently to the public. It's important for sure!! But making people comfortable as well should be their priority so as to avoid sudden probelms like this. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Anonylz on November 27, 2021, 06:51:21 PM My question is why are the truckers refusing to get vaccinated! They will rather quit their job than get the vaccine, is it that there are any noticeable effects after taking the vaccine or what are their reasons! There must be a reason for the not to want it, between quiting their job will not necessarily solve any problem rather they will increase the number of unemployed people in the country,
It is better they state their reason(s) make it clear so that a solution can be made. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: so98nn on November 27, 2021, 07:21:48 PM Though Elons example was little slick here I think it’s serious that it will eat our jobs of 2.5 million workers. I think this is very very sad thing to happen because imagine 2.5 million families getting fed on that job, their dreams, their education and what not. This will cause series of chain reaction and making it difficult for the supply chain as well. We do not know the application of auto trucks yet and we always need human touch for any job to do it perfectly. Tuckers are the important part of logistic industry and they should never be replaced or vacated on any terms tbh. Dam, this is such bad news just because they are against the vaccines.
Yes I get it, vaccines are the needful in the current worst times but they need to be educated and then must be shown with right direction. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Sterbens on November 27, 2021, 08:11:35 PM So we're just going to see 2.5 million truck drivers turning their jobs over to unmanned transport cars? that way there will be a cost reduction that the factory does. But there will also be a lot of impact that they have given to drivers to no longer work because of the strike they think that Vaccines must comply with government regulations. Meanwhile, outside we have witnessed the non-stop government vaccine program which costs a lot of money but the economic growth is not really being realized. Moreover, the US is doing it all to reduce spending dollars.
2.5 million drivers is not a small number, so the government should at least think not to mention those who have got a driving license, just their factories with goods shelters that let drivers get a delivery permit without delaying the delivery time. Totally ineffective with robot trucker offers. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: TheGreatPython on November 27, 2021, 09:56:20 PM I don’t really get how some people likes to reason things at times; someone commenting that a truck driver can’t give any other person Covid-19 because they spend most of their day alone in their truck? You’re forgetting that sometimes that they will have to eat, which means at some point they will visit a restaurant or so, and they will also get home to their family and all that.
So, it’s very much possible that they can come in contact with a victim and also transfer it to others. But, anyways, I think the government should also try to do things in a way that it would be easy and not favor them, but the people as well, making sure that things are on the balance. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: STT on November 27, 2021, 10:58:39 PM Supply constriction leads to inflation, it can be as simple as a lack of truckers. They could try and fill the gap with army drivers for brief periods of time. Ironic effects or the law of unintended consequences is a classic sign of big government and how it can squash free trade in a country.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unintended_consequences Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Gyfts on November 27, 2021, 11:22:22 PM ... Definitely. Austria has introduced new lockdowns for the unvaccinated, which essentially states they are removed from society if they do not take the jab. No where in the requirements does it factor in natural immunity from previous infection, or does it factor low risk individuals that are less likely to catch and spread the disease. Australia has created "camps" for Covid infected people, and will arrest you if you have Covid and leave your dwelling. The US is characterized by hyper capitalism, so it seems uncanny for them to risk their economy for what is a mild flu for the vast majority of people. But when people are emotional, they're prepared to sacrifice their liberties in the name of safety. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: CaVO32 on November 27, 2021, 11:32:09 PM I don’t really get how some people likes to reason things at times; someone commenting that a truck driver can’t give any other person Covid-19 because they spend most of their day alone in their truck? You’re forgetting that sometimes that they will have to eat, which means at some point they will visit a restaurant or so, and they will also get home to their family and all that. So, it’s very much possible that they can come in contact with a victim and also transfer it to others. But, anyways, I think the government should also try to do things in a way that it would be easy and not favor them, but the people as well, making sure that things are on the balance. In this world of pandemic, we will experience soon that everywhere we go, they will ask for our vaccinated cards. Just like in Singapore, they are only allowing fully vaccinated individuals to dine in but there are still some restrictions. https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/dining-groups-five-vaccinated-same-household-restaurants-hawker-centres-2298466 So if you want to feel safe and not be discriminated, I believe, we need to follow the government mandate. But if you can stay at home forever, why not? But who can? This is why if you are a traveler, expect that everywhere you go, they will ask your covid vaccination card. We can't avoid this requirement as we move forward from this pandemic. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Wexnident on November 28, 2021, 01:38:00 AM I suppose it hinges upon whether truckers in 2021 are considered skilled or unskilled labor. Would a 2.5 million chunk of the workforce quitting create a vacuum which could easily be filled. The term independent contractors used to describe the trucking industry. Is often used to describe employment conditions that do not fit the label. Mixed martial artists in the UFC and pro wrestlers in WWE are both considered independent contractors. With a great deal of controversy surrounding the terminology and whether it is apt. I'm not sure what exactly would happen in the long term, since as you said, it's a matter of whether it's possible to quickly fill up that vacuum of the workforce. It does present a problem in the short term as stated in the article though since it would fill a gap towards that process that was already set in stone. Not to mention that the workforce to be filled is required to be vaccinated, and I don't suppose they're just going to get some random vaccinated dude that could drive as their worker. That is unless Elon releases his unmanned truckers. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Sithara007 on November 28, 2021, 02:27:58 AM Correct, and we do not really need for 2.5 million truck drivers to quit to create huge issues, the US is having problems with a shortage of 80k drivers, that is only 3.2% of the drivers that are threatening to stop working if Biden forced them to be vaccinated, so while it is unrealistic to expect that 2.5 million truck drivers stop working at the same time, I think it is realistic for 3.2% to stop doing it, doubling the current problems of the supply chain. And in the end, the real numbers will be much lower than this 3.2%. The prospect of job loss will force many of these truckers to get vaccinated. I really don't understand the hesitation from some circles. The vaccines are in use for more than a year, and till now there have been no reports of serious side effects on healthy people. On the other hand, in the US alone close to 800,000 deaths have resulted from COVID. I fully support the government's decision to make vaccination mandatory. We had enough deaths. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Lucius on November 28, 2021, 11:20:20 AM Definitely. Austria has introduced new lockdowns for the unvaccinated, which essentially states they are removed from society if they do not take the jab. ~snip~ But when people are emotional, they're prepared to sacrifice their liberties in the name of safety. Unfortunately, my country is copying all the measures taken by Austria, so I expect that this will happen soon in my country as well. My Prime Minister and the Minister of Health openly call unvaccinated people imbeciles, cowards, and even bio-terrorists - and have banned entry into all state and public institutions without a covid passport or a negative test. Meanwhile, people who have been vaccinated and lost their immunity a long time ago are walking everywhere and do not have to be tested - and the WHO and many others are expressing concern about this false security that has been created through covid passports. Here’s an example of how someone who doesn’t have a mask on public transportation in my country ends up - YT Link (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4skL6y9-ayY) or or how they treat a teacher who tried to enter her workplace without a covid passport - YT Link (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZozEKc9C-dM). They first try to convince people in a nice way, then threaten them that they will lose their jobs, and finally use the police as a repressive force. These truck drivers in the US may be brave, but the system they oppose is cruel and will have no mercy - but it is good to see that people do not agree to be forced into something they do not want. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: kryptqnick on November 28, 2021, 03:50:39 PM LaMalfa says that the Biden administration is not helping, but you know who else is not helping? It's precisely guys like LaMalfa that keep emphasizing that vaccination is a personal choice, that nobody can make people vaccinate if they don't want to, instead of actually sharing the science of how vaccines drastically change your odds of surviving covid and encouraging people to consider vaccinating. They're talking about trucks, but in my country the anti-vaccination moods are so high that while there are already some jobs with mandatory vaccinations, doctor is not one of them because apparently many small towns will be left without crucial doctors if it's made mandatory. Nothing is more unsettling than doctors who don't want to get vaccinated. As for the US, I'm sure they'll figure out what to do. They might take a risk and see if it becomes a supply chain problem. They can override the mandate if it becomes the case.
Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Obito on November 28, 2021, 04:11:35 PM Well, if they were to quit we will see a big reduction in supply and most of the malls will be on short supply because they're going to be relying on those truck drivers, the only problem is that these people are opposing the mandate even though there's no downside to it besides the fact that they think that vaccines are a bad thing.
Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: oHnK on November 28, 2021, 04:24:15 PM LaMalfa says that the Biden administration is not helping, but you know who else is not helping? It's precisely guys like LaMalfa that keep emphasizing that vaccination is a personal choice, that nobody can make people vaccinate if they don't want to, instead of actually sharing the science of how vaccines drastically change your odds of surviving covid and encouraging people to consider vaccinating. They're talking about trucks, but in my country the anti-vaccination moods are so high that while there are already some jobs with mandatory vaccinations, doctor is not one of them because apparently many small towns will be left without crucial doctors if it's made mandatory. Nothing is more unsettling than doctors who don't want to get vaccinated. As for the US, I'm sure they'll figure out what to do. They might take a risk and see if it becomes a supply chain problem. They can override the mandate if it becomes the case. A very interesting case for someone like me to read. I really appreciate how idealistic people in the US are, and how different it is for people in a developing country like us. Government regulations that force all workers to be vaccinated are not given the option of their own will. Even today, vaccines are not due to the need to increase antibodies against the covid virus but as an administrative requirement only. Flights must be vaccinated, work must be vaccinated, even to watch movies in cinemas must be vaccinated first. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: darewaller on November 28, 2021, 06:33:05 PM I would say let them go, I am sure there will be people with vaccination who would LOVE to get paid that much. These truckers think that they could feel untouchable just because they are solving a problem? What are we going to do if all doctors said they are not getting vaccinated? What happens if all police force decided not to get vaccinated, what happens if all fast food workers declined it? Are we going to have none of them? Of course not, we are going to find a solution with the people who are willing to get vaccinated.
I am not really kind to anti-vaxxers, they could just become unemployed all I care, just get out if you do not want to get paid for doing your job with requirements which includes vaccination. I am not going to suddenly say "oh man, if truckers quit then I am finished, let them be the only type of work that doesn't require vaccination and KILL people", sorry but I rather starve them then accept their blackmail. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: eaLiTy on November 28, 2021, 07:50:08 PM I suppose it hinges upon whether truckers in 2021 are considered skilled or unskilled labor. Would a 2.5 million chunk of the workforce quitting create a vacuum which could easily be filled. The term independent contractors used to describe the trucking industry. Is often used to describe employment conditions that do not fit the label. Mixed martial artists in the UFC and pro wrestlers in WWE are both considered independent contractors. With a great deal of controversy surrounding the terminology and whether it is apt. It is not just the truckers that are quitting over the vaccine mandate, government officials all over the US are quitting their job including police officers, army, fire fighters are so on and it will create a chaos that can be seen only in movies like purge. The idea behind independent contracts is that they are not getting a monthly or annual salary, WWE wrestlers are getting paid annually and hence they cannot be termed as independent contracts as they work over 250 to 300 days a year, but that is not the case with MMA fighters, they only get paid when they fight and if they decide to take a break for years, they can do so. Basically when you are paid during your working hours and not contracted to an annual salary you are an independent contractor. The only thing for certain is, Elon Musk is working somewhere to build trucks with no steering wheels that are robot driven. I doubt, AI trucks will be in the roads in the near future, but in the next few years it will be a reality as Elon and team are working on it.Perhaps 2.5 million departing truckers will give Elon the vacuum he needs to push his robot truck drivers. That could rank in the top 5 of the most predictable things happening atm. As crazy as it may sound. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: NeuroticFish on November 28, 2021, 08:29:04 PM It is not just the truckers that are quitting That's correct. Just the truckers quitting may halt the movement of many goods - see what has happened in UK - and they're quite powerful. But you're right, people from far too many fields are quitting. It doesn't look good at all. Will this trigger a real crisis? Maybe. And I don't see any other solution than opening the borders widely - then there will be a huge influx of people who will want to get those jobs and do whatever it's needed to get them. Of course, I can't realistically expect that to happen. Perhaps 2.5 million departing truckers will give Elon the vacuum he needs to push his robot truck drivers. That could rank in the top 5 of the most predictable things happening atm. As crazy as it may sound. I doubt, AI trucks will be in the roads in the near future, but in the next few years it will be a reality as Elon and team are working on it.The technology is not as good as advertised. Not yet. They can't do this so soon and at such a scale. Not yet. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: TheNineClub on November 28, 2021, 10:15:11 PM I know this is not fully related to the post, but what's the situation with selfdriving trucks? I mean, not to play devil's advocate, but truckers could in the near future loose their bargaining advantage. I mean, if they do quit now that could seriously impact the economic flow.
Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Darker45 on November 29, 2021, 12:50:12 AM I mean, if they do quit now that could seriously impact the economic flow. What's hurting the economic flow is this vaccine mandate. Everything would be smoothly transitioning into the new normal amidst the pandemic if only the governments not force people to take the vaccine. There's an uprising against this vaccine mandate or vaccine passport almost all over the world. If mothers are allowed to kill their own child inside their womb because they have the freedom over their own body, why are the governments now taking over the body of every single citizen and force to vaccinate it against a virus that does not really kill? Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Silberman on November 30, 2021, 05:46:41 PM My question is why are the truckers refusing to get vaccinated! They will rather quit their job than get the vaccine, is it that there are any noticeable effects after taking the vaccine or what are their reasons! There must be a reason for the not to want it, between quiting their job will not necessarily solve any problem rather they will increase the number of unemployed people in the country, Because it is their right, now do not take me wrong, I took the vaccine at the first opportunity that I got, but at the end of the day people by nature hate being forced to do anything and if you try to do it there is going to be a backlash, it is as simple as that, also you need to understand that while it is hard to generalize, a truck driver will spend a lot of time on their own which means they need a certain profile to take this, and that kind of person many times is doing that job because they do not want to take orders from anyone, which is precisely what Biden is doing here.It is better they state their reason(s) make it clear so that a solution can be made. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Fortify on November 30, 2021, 07:55:49 PM Quote Millions of truckers are balking at President Joe Biden’s workplace vaccine mandate, which would be catastrophic for the nation’s supply chain problem if it is enforced, an American Trucking Associations executive told House members this week. ....“We’ve tried to be very clear to the administration — I understand the logic behind it — but if you do this, these are the consequences,” said ATA President Chris Spear. “So if you’re trying to solve the supply chain problem, you’re actually compounding it and actually hurting the very problem you’re trying to fix.” ATA is the nation’s largest trucking trade group. Spear testified in front of the House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee on supply chain problems. Not certain what the implications of this would be. If there are implications. I suppose it hinges upon whether truckers in 2021 are considered skilled or unskilled labor. Would a 2.5 million chunk of the workforce quitting create a vacuum which could easily be filled. The term independent contractors used to describe the trucking industry. Is often used to describe employment conditions that do not fit the label. Mixed martial artists in the UFC and pro wrestlers in WWE are both considered independent contractors. With a great deal of controversy surrounding the terminology and whether it is apt. The only thing for certain is, Elon Musk is working somewhere to build trucks with no steering wheels that are robot driven. Perhaps 2.5 million departing truckers will give Elon the vacuum he needs to push his robot truck drivers. That could rank in the top 5 of the most predictable things happening atm. As crazy as it may sound. I think being vaccinated is a good thing, but there are certain proposed regulations like this which are too silly to impose and poorly thought out. I'd say trucking should be one of the last professions to be targeted with this sort of mandate as the often work alone in already tough conditions as it is. You are forcing people who are already isolated for 99% of the time they're doing a job - sure they travel long distances and should be sensible enough to wear a mask in crowded places, but beyond that they are some of the least likely people to be spreading it. Anyone in retail or hospitality has way more interactions that could spread a virus like this far easier. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Lucius on December 01, 2021, 02:23:37 PM I would say let them go, I am sure there will be people with vaccination who would LOVE to get paid that much. If you are not from the US, you certainly don't care what will happen there and whether all the trucks will stop, and you don't understand how much chaos that would cause not only there, but also globally. If you think it’s easy to replace millions of trained truck drivers with others overnight, then you’re grossly mistaken - it’s not a job that has a surplus of workers. ...sorry but I rather starve them then accept their blackmail. If you ever get into a situation where you’re hungry and you can’t buy food, remember your words. I'm not a truck driver, but I realize how important they are in the whole chain - if they stop, everything else stops. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: alpamar99 on December 01, 2021, 02:33:31 PM What is certain is that when that many people stop at the same time, it will immediately create chaos everywhere because indeed they are one of the frontlines in several vital shipments, one of which is staple food and other necessities.
This of course will be very influential because the supply that should be sent at the specified time will be hampered a lot because of the absence of a driver who does stop. The worst thing is that there is definitely a scarcity of a product and goods will happen everywhere. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: shogun47 on December 02, 2021, 03:29:02 PM This sums up US Covid policy really well, in fact. A trucker, sitting alone in his/her truck for the majority of the day, would need to be vaccinated to protect who from catching Covid, exactly? The truck? The argument for a vaccine mandate was that an unvaxxed person could transmit Covid to someone that is also not vaccinated, but this begs the question as to how a truck driver is going to infect someone when they're sitting by themselves in a truck for most of the day. Anyways, the implications of this are more supply chain issues and low economic growth. Shipping and logistics are the base of the manufacturing industries of any country, so removing transportation out of the equation ensures everything grinds to a halt. They say inflation was due to the supply chain issue, and not a high money supply. Well, what happens to inflation when you stop truckers from doing their jobs if the result is scarcity of goods? More inflation. The supply chain issues can become really intense. I would say that 2.5 million truck drivers is a number significant enough to cause some serious issues to the most relevant supply chains like food, energy and some other important stuff. Great Britain also collapsed for a while. I think it was around 100.000 truckers over there who stopped working and they had no gas at their gas stations and devastating conditions in the retail area. Now we are talking about 100.000 here. 2.5 million for the United States, oh oh... Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Rufsilf on December 02, 2021, 03:48:31 PM We'll see what will happen because either way there will be some implications. I just can't imagine what would be the reason for the truck drivers for rejecting the vaccines over the cost of their work, surely so much families will be affected. Imagine 2.5 Million truckers? There must be a reason to it why they won't like to get vaccinated.
But if eventually they will quit or just stop the job for even a week, the supply chain will surely be heavily disrupted, along the trucker's families and inflation will follow because of the shortage of products. Forget about Elon Musk for now, as if Elon can provide these much trucks or robots to replace this truckers immediately. He can't even get the Tesla model to perfection. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Ucy on December 02, 2021, 04:25:19 PM I expect the desire to serve should be greater than worries of what wearing mask(when necessary) to avoid vaccine can do. I think using the right mask rules should be alternative to taking vaccines. I'm more concerned about people unintentionally trying to quicken a full takeover. We should use the little time we have to properly prepare and save as many people as possible.
The one they call their leader should remain but the hand of the CREATOR is upon the Nation. So it's HIS Will that's currently being done not the other's will I think it's important I comment now so people can have some idea what is truely going on. They definitely know that strange things beyond their control is going on... Not talking about the natural disasters. *No issue will come out of my posting under "things" that currently cause issues. The Wall remains unshakable. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: shogun47 on December 02, 2021, 05:55:12 PM We'll see what will happen because either way there will be some implications. I just can't imagine what would be the reason for the truck drivers for rejecting the vaccines over the cost of their work, surely so much families will be affected. Imagine 2.5 Million truckers? There must be a reason to it why they won't like to get vaccinated. But if eventually they will quit or just stop the job for even a week, the supply chain will surely be heavily disrupted, along the trucker's families and inflation will follow because of the shortage of products. Forget about Elon Musk for now, as if Elon can provide these much trucks or robots to replace this truckers immediately. He can't even get the Tesla model to perfection. I know two people who had to spend several weeks in an intensive care unit with a ventilator. That was in April this year and one very fit guy, no smoking and no alcohol, in his mid-fifties isn't even close to half of a recovery. He ran a successful business and his son now overtook his role. He aged several years in his face within just weeks. Ever since I saw him not too long ago there was no doubt in my mind I would take the vaccine, especially because I also wanted to help protecting my parents. What I am asking myself how many of these truckers have really seen what can happen to you if you have a bad symptomatic infection? I am not judging anyone of them for their decision even though I think the data is good enough to justify the vaccination. Also how is it possible that really 2.5 million truckers agree so hard on rejecting a vaccine mandate? Are they all sufficiently well informed? Are they making their very own decision after listening to their doctor? There seems to be a lot of group dynamic at play. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: darewaller on December 02, 2021, 07:10:58 PM I would say let them go, I am sure there will be people with vaccination who would LOVE to get paid that much. If you are not from the US, you certainly don't care what will happen there and whether all the trucks will stop, and you don't understand how much chaos that would cause not only there, but also globally. If you think it’s easy to replace millions of trained truck drivers with others overnight, then you’re grossly mistaken - it’s not a job that has a surplus of workers. I am pretty sure the moment we have "okay we quit" situation going on with truckers, some of them will not give up, I suspect at least half of them will not be quitting their amazing job which allows them to earn way more than their qualifications suggests, and the other half will be replaced within 1 year at the very most if you ask me. Sure that means a bit of a problem at first, and to "train" them will take some time maybe, but in the end it will be a temporary solution. You know what the otherside is? You do not let them go, you do not mandate a vaccination for truckers because of their blackmail, and then tomorrow librarians will ask for the same, then fast food workers, then office workers, if you give up as soon as someone blackmails you, then there is no mandate anymore. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: DaveF on December 02, 2021, 07:24:19 PM The other question is how many of them are large over the road truckers and how many are the local ones.
If more of them are the long haul ones then it's a bigger issue then if it's the local ones. One of the people I do work for is involved in the food industry, I see a slightly different perspective. EVERY person who deals with the food, even if it IS just the guy in the truck driving it and never even has ACCESS to the locked and sealed trailer, has had just about every vaccine known, As in it's frozen vegetables, the chances of transmitting Hep A to them is *zero*. BUT you know what, the insurance brokers don't give a fuck. Vaccinate or you don't get insurance. But if you are hauling car parts, it's up to you. It's also up to the business shipping the parts and the business getting the parts if they want to let someone who is not vaccinated into their facility. -Dave Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: LUCKMCFLY on December 02, 2021, 11:05:17 PM The case of vaccination is a problem that for many represents the Non-Security of immunity, what seems very bad to me is that the truckers quit their job, if vaccination is mandatory, it is something else, but that each person Give him a possible compensation contract in case everything goes wrong, there are people who get vaccinated and die, Pfizer goes for the 4th dose, and the other vaccines such as Russia and China are still in development, I don't know what criteria the truckers take or who may be influencing them to make that decision, I know that Canada is closed even by air because there are more than 1000 deaths per day.
Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Mahanton on December 02, 2021, 11:28:42 PM Well, if they were to quit we will see a big reduction in supply and most of the malls will be on short supply because they're going to be relying on those truck drivers, the only problem is that these people are opposing the mandate even though there's no downside to it besides the fact that they think that vaccines are a bad thing. We do always have that kind of impression to those people who do really oppose the idea of vaccination due to some personal reason which is commonly that they've been thinking negatively about it which it isnt surprising that they would really be ending up with these kind of decisions even myself does really have that kind of views towards vaccine but i do still end up on getting some shot just because i cant enter malls and other establishments for those people who arent vaccinated which means you dont have any choice right? They are really good on making people do take the shot. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: stompix on December 03, 2021, 03:11:03 PM I am not really kind to anti-vaxxers, they could just become unemployed all I care, just get out if you do not want to get paid for doing your job with requirements which includes vaccination. I am not going to suddenly say "oh man, if truckers quit then I am finished, let them be the only type of work that doesn't require vaccination and KILL people", sorry but I rather starve them then accept their blackmail. You have the wrong idea thinking maybe (I assume) that truckers deliver only finished goods or food, they deliver a lot of things to a lot of business and even if you think you're not depending o them you might or your supplier will surely do in any manufacturing. Also, yeah right, you would prefer starving...have you ever gone a week without eating? Why? Why would you have hard time replacing millions of truckers? Explain to me the exact reason why would it be hard to find people who would be overpaid for a very simple job when there is no qualifications required whereas burger flippers get paid minimum wage which hasn't increased in decades? I don't know, have you sent your easy fix plan to Boris? The UK might need a bulletproof plan and pretty fast. Oh, maybe because the part I underlined is not true? Do they test your vision, health, urine, and pass a knowledge test before you're ok to flip burgers? ;D Perhaps 2.5 million departing truckers will give Elon the vacuum he needs to push his robot truck drivers. That could rank in the top 5 of the most predictable things happening atm. As crazy as it may sound. I doubt, AI trucks will be in the roads in the near future, but in the next few years it will be a reality as Elon and team are working on it.Rather than AI trucks they could invest more in railway transport, over long distances there is no way a truck would beat a train in speed and cost, and for short railway stations to deposit transports if everything is planned correctly you can have one truck serving an entire warehouse. Probably AI forklifts would be needed more as there is a lot of time lost on loading and unloading, I know from a friend who works at a logistic depot every time they tried to use two operators in pair for the same container it has never resulted in an increase in efficiency, a fleet of AI forklifts would be able to coordinate themselves better than humans could ever do with thousands of hours of training. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Silberman on December 03, 2021, 05:36:40 PM We'll see what will happen because either way there will be some implications. I just can't imagine what would be the reason for the truck drivers for rejecting the vaccines over the cost of their work, surely so much families will be affected. Imagine 2.5 Million truckers? There must be a reason to it why they won't like to get vaccinated. But if eventually they will quit or just stop the job for even a week, the supply chain will surely be heavily disrupted, along the trucker's families and inflation will follow because of the shortage of products. Forget about Elon Musk for now, as if Elon can provide these much trucks or robots to replace this truckers immediately. He can't even get the Tesla model to perfection. I know two people who had to spend several weeks in an intensive care unit with a ventilator. That was in April this year and one very fit guy, no smoking and no alcohol, in his mid-fifties isn't even close to half of a recovery. He ran a successful business and his son now overtook his role. He aged several years in his face within just weeks. Ever since I saw him not too long ago there was no doubt in my mind I would take the vaccine, especially because I also wanted to help protecting my parents. What I am asking myself how many of these truckers have really seen what can happen to you if you have a bad symptomatic infection? I am not judging anyone of them for their decision even though I think the data is good enough to justify the vaccination. Also how is it possible that really 2.5 million truckers agree so hard on rejecting a vaccine mandate? Are they all sufficiently well informed? Are they making their very own decision after listening to their doctor? There seems to be a lot of group dynamic at play. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: omone1 on December 04, 2021, 08:34:08 PM 2.5million workforce quitting would be catastrophic. This vaccine should be voluntary for Christ sake. The enforcement seems like a global end-time prophecy mandate causing some kind of resistance by well informed professions and even less informed folks. People should be allowed to have an option.
Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: mv1986 on December 05, 2021, 10:35:17 PM 2.5million workforce quitting would be catastrophic. This vaccine should be voluntary for Christ sake. The enforcement seems like a global end-time prophecy mandate causing some kind of resistance by well informed professions and even less informed folks. People should be allowed to have an option. But that comes with other problems. In Germany for example, the workforce in hospitals is shrinking because the work they have to do became so hard that they quit their jobs. This situation is damn complicated. Working in a suit with mask and all this clothes on your buddy for 10 hours straight with almost no breaks, for how long would anyone of us here do that? They are asking everyone to get the vaccine as it is proven to help prevent lots of people from getting such severe symptoms that they have to get hospitalized. There are so many interests involved. God knows where this virus will lead us. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: V-t.Ester on December 05, 2021, 10:37:25 PM This news sounds like it is about artificially creating of crisis in the country. If 2.5 million US truckers will be quitted because of limitations for non-vaccinated people that will lead country to collapse: people will not receive products (as a result - hunger) and medicines (more death), prices on scarce commodity will grow, these will lead to widespread lootings etc. Sorry, possibly I'm overstating a little bit, but do only I consider situation with vaccination strange?
Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: xSkylarx on December 06, 2021, 02:07:07 AM This news sounds like it is about artificially creating of crisis in the country. If 2.5 million US truckers will be quitted because of limitations for non-vaccinated people that will lead country to collapse: people will not receive products (as a result - hunger) and medicines (more death), prices on scarce commodity will grow, these will lead to widespread lootings etc. Sorry, possibly I'm overstating a little bit, but do only I consider situation with vaccination strange? I'm not sure but I believe you have a point regardless of whether it was genuine or not, as that would be a break issue. If this were true, we would face a food shortage because these truckers are actually performing their duties of delivering food, and the economy would collapse. However, I believe the government would not allow this to happen because it would be a major problem for which they are actively seeking a solution. Additionally, if this is a hoax, I believe we would be idle, so it is preferable to take it seriously. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: kapalmabur on December 06, 2021, 08:56:36 AM This news sounds like it is about artificially creating of crisis in the country. If 2.5 million US truckers will be quitted because of limitations for non-vaccinated people that will lead country to collapse: people will not receive products (as a result - hunger) and medicines (more death), prices on scarce commodity will grow, these will lead to widespread lootings etc. Sorry, possibly I'm overstating a little bit, but do only I consider situation with vaccination strange? I'm not sure but I believe you have a point regardless of whether it was genuine or not, as that would be a break issue. If this were true, we would face a food shortage because these truckers are actually performing their duties of delivering food, and the economy would collapse. However, I believe the government would not allow this to happen because it would be a major problem for which they are actively seeking a solution. Additionally, if this is a hoax, I believe we would be idle, so it is preferable to take it seriously. I hope this can be resolved soon just imagine if 2.5 million US truck drivers stopped of course it would cause serious problems, The most important thing is that we'll see what happens next Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: retreat on December 06, 2021, 04:11:29 PM This news sounds like it is about artificially creating of crisis in the country. If 2.5 million US truckers will be quitted because of limitations for non-vaccinated people that will lead country to collapse: people will not receive products (as a result - hunger) and medicines (more death), prices on scarce commodity will grow, these will lead to widespread lootings etc. Sorry, possibly I'm overstating a little bit, but do only I consider situation with vaccination strange? I'm not sure but I believe you have a point regardless of whether it was genuine or not, as that would be a break issue. If this were true, we would face a food shortage because these truckers are actually performing their duties of delivering food, and the economy would collapse. However, I believe the government would not allow this to happen because it would be a major problem for which they are actively seeking a solution. Additionally, if this is a hoax, I believe we would be idle, so it is preferable to take it seriously. I hope this can be resolved soon just imagine if 2.5 million US truck drivers stopped of course it would cause serious problems, The most important thing is that we'll see what happens next Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Silberman on December 06, 2021, 04:40:07 PM This news sounds like it is about artificially creating of crisis in the country. If 2.5 million US truckers will be quitted because of limitations for non-vaccinated people that will lead country to collapse: people will not receive products (as a result - hunger) and medicines (more death), prices on scarce commodity will grow, these will lead to widespread lootings etc. Sorry, possibly I'm overstating a little bit, but do only I consider situation with vaccination strange? I think they are not seeing the big picture, the supply chain is very affected which means that instead of restrictions what you want is to encourage people that left that job to comeback, train new people to take those jobs or bring people from other countries to fill the gap, right now the US cannot afford truck drivers to leave their positions, so even if the US government believes this is what is the right thing to do they should leave them alone until things get normalized, but they do not think like that and now we are seeing the consequences of trying to regulate this too soon.Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Sithara007 on December 11, 2021, 04:08:11 AM I think they are not seeing the big picture, the supply chain is very affected which means that instead of restrictions what you want is to encourage people that left that job to comeback, train new people to take those jobs or bring people from other countries to fill the gap, right now the US cannot afford truck drivers to leave their positions, so even if the US government believes this is what is the right thing to do they should leave them alone until things get normalized, but they do not think like that and now we are seeing the consequences of trying to regulate this too soon. Do you realize that this is a clickbait article? Out of the 2.5 million truckers, a few tens of thousands are threatening that they will quit over the vaccine mandate. In the end, this number may be as low as 1% or 2%. Even if that causes a shortage, the US businesses can easily hire truckers from across the border (either from the north, i.e Canada, or from the South, i.e Mexico). Unlike the situation in the European Union, there is no shortage as such. If the American truckers go ballistic over the vaccine mandate, then they'll lose their jobs. As simple as that. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: eaLiTy on December 11, 2021, 09:42:27 AM ~ The ground reality is different, there is a serious issue with trucking as goods are not moving to the destination for months and the ships are docked in the port without unloading and the stores are struggling because of this situation as the goods are there in the port but there is serious transportation issue.Do you realize that this is a clickbait article? Out of the 2.5 million truckers, a few tens of thousands are threatening that they will quit over the vaccine mandate. In the end, this number may be as low as 1% or 2%. Even if that causes a shortage, the US businesses can easily hire truckers from across the border (either from the north, i.e Canada, or from the South, i.e Mexico). Unlike the situation in the European Union, there is no shortage as such. If the American truckers go ballistic over the vaccine mandate, then they'll lose their jobs. As simple as that. When it comes to mandatory vaccine mandate, it is really against the freedom of an individual, it is not just the truckers that are opposing that, government officials including police officers, military personal and many are planning to resign if they are forced to take a vaccine to continue work. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: mv1986 on December 11, 2021, 11:55:23 AM ~ The ground reality is different, there is a serious issue with trucking as goods are not moving to the destination for months and the ships are docked in the port without unloading and the stores are struggling because of this situation as the goods are there in the port but there is serious transportation issue.Do you realize that this is a clickbait article? Out of the 2.5 million truckers, a few tens of thousands are threatening that they will quit over the vaccine mandate. In the end, this number may be as low as 1% or 2%. Even if that causes a shortage, the US businesses can easily hire truckers from across the border (either from the north, i.e Canada, or from the South, i.e Mexico). Unlike the situation in the European Union, there is no shortage as such. If the American truckers go ballistic over the vaccine mandate, then they'll lose their jobs. As simple as that. When it comes to mandatory vaccine mandate, it is really against the freedom of an individual, it is not just the truckers that are opposing that, government officials including police officers, military personal and many are planning to resign if they are forced to take a vaccine to continue work. I wonder why so many people around the world are surprised about vaccination mandates as they do already exist anyway for various illnesses and infections. Chickenpox, measles, and a variety of other infections are already coped with via a vaccination mandate. Nobody ever really considered protesting against that. Anyway, I hope this is soon getting under control. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Sithara007 on December 12, 2021, 03:06:38 AM I wonder why so many people around the world are surprised about vaccination mandates as they do already exist anyway for various illnesses and infections. Chickenpox, measles, and a variety of other infections are already coped with via a vaccination mandate. Nobody ever really considered protesting against that. Anyway, I hope this is soon getting under control. I completely agree with what you wrote, regarding the vaccine mandate. But the excuse being given is that the other vaccines (i.e the ones against diphtheria, measles.etc) have undergone stringent clinical trials over a period of many decades, while the COVID vaccines are relatively new and many of them are yet to complete the Phase III trials. And a section of the society believes that the side effects that result from the vaccination is more harmful when compared to the actual COVID virus infection itself. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: eaLiTy on December 12, 2021, 04:20:41 PM ~ When you cook up a vaccine within an year, which does not even completely protect against the virus, you cannot force people to comply with that. The other vaccines you mentioned are tested for years and then implemented and once you are vaccinated you will not get infected, but you are aware that the COVID vaccine is not giving you complete protection against the virus and there is no way even the scientific community will know about the side affects in the long term.I wonder why so many people around the world are surprised about vaccination mandates as they do already exist anyway for various illnesses and infections. Chickenpox, measles, and a variety of other infections are already coped with via a vaccination mandate. Nobody ever really considered protesting against that. Anyway, I hope this is soon getting under control. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: dezoel on December 12, 2021, 05:38:43 PM The ground reality is different, there is a serious issue with trucking as goods are not moving to the destination for months and the ships are docked in the port without unloading and the stores are struggling because of this situation as the goods are there in the port but there is serious transportation issue. There are two points there that I want to address. First of all, truckers are a job description, just like fast food worker, just like accountant, just like any other job, so you can just hire a new one and fire the old one, I really do not see this as a problem at all. Truckers do not hold the keys to freedom to do whatever they want just because they are doing a job that they imagine nobody else can do. It is literally carrying goods from one place to another via a vehicle, probably one of the simplest jobs in the entire world, I rather be a trucker than be a fast food cashier tbf.When it comes to mandatory vaccine mandate, it is really against the freedom of an individual, it is not just the truckers that are opposing that, government officials including police officers, military personal and many are planning to resign if they are forced to take a vaccine to continue work. Secondly "freedom of individual" is something regarding the individual, if you want to get a tattoo for example, it could say "f**k usa" and that's free, it could say "f**k trump" or "f**k biden" or whatever and it's allowed, there is no problem as long as you are doing something for yourself. However, without getting vaccination, you are risking others life, which means your "freedom" understanding is killing other people. This is like if you buy a gun then you have to kill someone with it, would that law be accepted? Of course not, if you do not want to get vaccinated and you lock yourself somewhere and never get out then it could be understood but obviously nobody will accept that. So you are saying "we should have the right to be able to kill others by not getting vaccination, if I want to risk others lives then I should be allowed to!!!" and that is EXACTLY what people who do not want to follow the mandate are doing, do not kid yourself with anything else, do not make up excuses, this is EXACTLY what they are doing. Title: Re: 2.5 million US truckers say they'll quit over vaccine mandate Post by: Tumanggor on December 13, 2021, 04:42:07 PM I wonder why so many people around the world are surprised about vaccination mandates as they do already exist anyway for various illnesses and infections. Chickenpox, measles, and a variety of other infections are already coped with via a vaccination mandate. Nobody ever really considered protesting against that. Anyway, I hope this is soon getting under control. I completely agree with what you wrote, regarding the vaccine mandate. But the excuse being given is that the other vaccines (i.e the ones against diphtheria, measles.etc) have undergone stringent clinical trials over a period of many decades, while the COVID vaccines are relatively new and many of them are yet to complete the Phase III trials. And a section of the society believes that the side effects that result from the vaccination is more harmful when compared to the actual COVID virus infection itself. just imagine how the vaccine was made in a short time, that means the test can't be confirmed to be successful I've received vaccine shots twice and it's like betting on fate lol |