Bitcoin Forum

Recently CBDCs is becoming a popular subject of discussion. Long story short, they are designed to be similar to cryptocurrencies but still with a lot of differences. They are totally centralized ad misleading to people.
As it's claimed, CBDCs are designed for safety and stability unlike bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies that are volatile and speculative.
But you know what?

Look at this! You work hard, work hard for years, save some money, and finally what? Their Safe and Stable currency fucks you You still have to work because this shit currency lost its value and it's not enough for your future and your dreams. Wanna buy a house? Then inflation + bank interest rate fucks you twice as hard. And then you know what? If you live in a country that has its national currency and people trade according to nat currency/USD rate, then if lucky, you are 4x fucked, if unlucky - higher than that.
https://i.imgur.com/RBJxjGE.png

Now, look at this! Is this the first image with a mirror effect? No, this is Bitcoin!
https://i.imgur.com/7p3r9D5.jpg

Media and the government tell you that it's a scam, a pyramid, terrorists and drug dealers favourite money, but no! This is a great escape. Just look at these two charts that clearly show the history of both currencies, the first one declines and the second one rises and after all of this, the government tells you that it's not safe and is dangerous!

We should learn from our mistakes!

Good for those of us who are already part of this revolution because that's what it is, a revolution even though the government are trying so hard to denial and prohibit it.
Majority of the crypto enthusiast already know where the cbdc stand and what it represent, an upgraded version of fiat can't be expected to do anything different from fiat, it is the same manner of control with unlimited supply (if am not mistaken).
BTC may be volatile but is far more better to hold than fiat with high rate of inflation.

I wouldn't call CBCD enemies though, perhaps government just wanted to offer alternatives that all.

But definitely, for us who are in crypto, then there's no way that we are going to shift to CBCD. Maybe in needed basis though, for example if your government requires you to transaction thru their agencies with CBCD as a payment method. I think this is the only way that I see CBCD might be of good use.

CBDC or whatever digital form of money is not an enemy to cryptocurrency or it is not the way that they are made by government. The need arose for a digital currency of course many aspect of life is gone to online since covid-19 so for better and easy way that marketing can go on via online and its affiliates because there different businesses that have gone online.

Correct. And you are not mistaken. The supply is unlimited and that is why it runs into inflation when they keep print more and more money. We already have above example and even saw last year how US kept printing the money when they ran out of it for health emergencies, stimulus packages etc. However, what they forgot is, they are loosing the liquidity at enormous rates and at the end inflation and peeps going crazy.

This is why one intelligent man pulled us out of this mess, Mr. Satoshi.  ;) No wonder now peeps will understand the meaning of decentralisation and also bitcoin ultimately. That graph surely keep surging no matter what.

In my opinion you and all those who have commented before me have left out the most important point: the absolute loss of privacy.

CBDCs emerge not only as an alternative to Bitcoin and crypto, but as an improved version of cash (supposedly). The problem is that with CBDCs governments and central banks are going to know exactly what you spend where your money, and the exact time to spend it.

Cash, as bad as it is in terms of its devaluation, gives you privacy. With some exceptions, like when you buy expensive things that have to be reported, like a second hand car for example. But if you go to the supermarket, the store, the pharmacy etc, and you pay in cash there is no record linking you to that purchase, whereas with CBDCs they are going to know everything.

Money can't be enemies. It's the government who can bring down  your finances are enemies. Fiat is a medium of exchange, same goes with CBDC as well. It's the data infrastructure that will be leveraged by the government agencies to run behind you, is going to be your enemies.

With CBDC, the human population will loose its right to keep their finances private. Everything will be visible to government. Today only, I have written a post about it. Read it once,

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5394515.msg59856353#msg59856353

Regarding fiat and CBDCs we can consider some factors upon comparing them with cryptocurrencies and bitcoin, the first and I think the most important thing is the centralization of the these even if the countries start creating their own CBDCs for their central banks and even in the best situation still these are depended to their governments while most of the cryptocurrencies are made to be decentralized, in the other hand since these are under control by the governments so cannot be safe from the inflation rate, unlike cryptocurrencies and bitcoin.

Some people don't have that option since the government cuts off all their supplies and forces them to use CBDC's - this would be a future statement definitely because we are seeing a trend where the government is trying to do the exact same thing.
People would go wherever they get the profits from which means that it can be CBDC's or just stable coins. But considering bitcoins and Altcoins they definately are the ones which would be able to provide you with economic stability and freedom as well since considering the situation right now it looks like the whole world is going to collapse and we are getting far too closer to WW2.
There is a long line of Government taking the privacy out of the cryptocurrencies as well since they are always trying to add the documents and connect it all with your bank accounts.

CBDC is an upgrade of fiat in terms of technology, it does not have any breakthrough like current crypto. CBDC is still a centralized currency controlled by the government and more importantly the government is still the one who decides how much CBDC supply they can generate as much as they want. Even using it will make us completely lose our privacy because they can control us anytime and anywhere.

Enemy in what way? Have you ever forgotten something before and jumped into Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies?

I'm not going to be a hypocrite and deny the benefits of fiat, albeit with some downsides. But the truth is we are still living with it. And no one should be emphasized as an enemy or anything. We just need to use it smartly as long as it doesn't harm our own finances. We live under the state constitution. Even El Salvador has never considered the fiat component or CBDC as an enemy. And you are so sure? just need to know how much bread where you live when you want to buy it? what's up with fiat?

Don't complicate things you can simplify.

It’s still the same Fiat and I am not expecting any breakthrough from it because even if we still adopt it, it is not going to change anything at all and will still continue to lose value.

Anyone who chooses to make use of central banks digital currencies (CBDC) is just wasting their time because they are not going to be gaining anything from it apart from the same headaches they are having with the use of the old Fiat, because you’re still using the same thing. And privacy is another thing you’re giving up on when you’re making use of CBDC, you wouldn’t be free to do what you want to do because you wouldn’t have the freedom to do so.

I wouldn't consider fiat to be bad, but well the way the government manages inflation inevitably makes it look bad to us anw.

But still fiat has it's own advantages (but disadvantages may overwhelm those depending on gow you look at things), so I reckon CBDCs are the same. Being centralized has its own advantages (mostly qol stuff imo), but still, inflation would still fuck us up, but hey, if you know how to manage your finance I think you can minimize the damage it could cause.

I am definitely agreeing with this for sure. I have been in crypto only because I hate fiat, everyone keeps talking about how crypto could become better and how if we could just adjust crypto the more like fiat, and so forth, regulations, legal tender, laws, many other things but for me none of that matters.

I was in love with bitcoin the moment I saw it, a truly decentralized digital money that can't be controlled by the government, the "price" could be controlled, but the coin itself can't be touched. That's all I care about and that's all I want to know. There is no CBDC, no fiat, no other thing that would make me want to use over crypto.

So with that said money is the enemy? this is certainly naive in my opinion why they are called enemies when we still need them.
The presence of CBDC is actually only used as an option for those who are still using fiat in a more modern way. there is no problem with it because regardless of accepting or rejecting it comes back to oneself and belief.
Crypto is a good thing now but that doesn't mean with crtypo we have to consider other things as enemies

Anyone who really knows what they are doing wouldn’t think that Fiat is better than Bitcoin.
Bitcoin is far much better than storing your money in Fiat because you’re just going to be the one who is losing.

And it is not just only about Fiat losing its value that irks me, there is also the issue of banks having to charge you a lot of fees, either it is daily, weekly or monthly. Seriously that shit is quite annoying, but with bitcoin you don’t have all those too much stress. And most of the fees that you would be charged by banks are just some totally unnecessary fees that are questionable.

Bitcoin and Crypto ain't the same thing, Hope you know this ?

On some aspect then it cant really be denied on what are the main benefits when we do deal up with Bitcoin which it wont really be that surprising that it did really get that much attention and support
in the community due for that reason but we cant really still avoid the fact or reality that we are still that dependent on fiat.We are aiming to accumulate bitcoin to have more fiat whenever it do
increase its value.Pretty much sure you would still come back to fiat form considering that bitcoin isnt adopted or accepted on any parts of the world.

There is nothing to blame the fiat and the CBDC's that are being developed to keep the finance under the government's control. Everything have evolved in a slow and steady manner according to the need of the people. As a result we had coins to currencies and from there we had everything digitised as internet banking, further we had card transactions. The lastest being the usage of applications and wallets to make transactions. However people who doesn't make use of bitcoin were also comfortable with it. So, it is upto the users and we should also know without fiat now we could've never got cryptocurrencies. So, everything is part of evolution.

"Fiat bad, Bitcoin good" is such a simplistic view, it ignores all the nuisance and practicality of Bitcoin use. Inflation is not a secret to anyone, but crypto can't magically fix it. Imagine you are a worker, you get your monthly salary and convert it into BTC - and it solves nothing in short term. Bitcoin is not growing 1:1 in response to inflation. The price of goods grows, your salary does not and Bitcoin moves randomly in short term. Bitcoin offers nothing to people who live on a tight budget, because they can't afford to make any savings and benefit from the long-term growth. And people who can save money can put it into a wide variety of assets, so it's not like Bitcoin is a game changer. Gold has recently acted as a much better counter-inflation and counter-risk asset.

The bottom line is, Bitcoin is still a high risk high reward investment and not a reliable financial tool for harsh times.

The money of states cannot be bad, and even more so, they should not be called enemies of ordinary people. Money is just a financial instrument in the hands of people for the exchange of goods. On the whole, they play a very positive role, there is no doubt about that. With the advent of blockchain technology, CBDCs are a more advanced system of cashless payments that are beginning to be implemented by states. All these types, including cryptocurrency, should work for the benefit of a person, complement each other, and not conflict with each other. All of them have their advantages and disadvantages, people themselves should choose what to use, based on convenience and the specific situation.

How could you not consider it bad. I mean there are so many reasons why fiat is a bad thing to hold. If you have debt that you invested into some profitable thing, that is even better.

It is so bad that I rather have fiat debt and crypto profit, that way I know that I could pay my fiat debt eventually due to inflation and how life will become more expensive and the debt will look smaller whereas I could be forcing myself on paying that a lot easier and that would allow me to make a good return. This is just an example, doesn't mean that you should do this, it just means that you should not be considering fiat as a good thing to hold at all, that is the worst.

A fun fact even the inflation rate of Fiat currency helped bitcoin to grow in terms of fiat but the sad thing is we still calculate the value of BTC in fiat like 1 BTC= $x. Anything that appreciate over time is good for us but how many people can differentiate investments and liabilities even in this 2022?

Have you ever thought that the Bitcoin value goes up because the fiat value goes down.
In that case,fiat is Bitcoin's best friend. ;D The Bitcoin value won't go up,if the fiat value doesn't decrease.
Who would even buy Bitcoins,if the fiat money preserved and increased their value?
With an "enemy" like fiat,we don't need friends. ;D
CBDC will be the same as fiat,the technology behind CBDCs doesn't matter.They will be as a centralized and as inflationary as fiat paper money.This means that another fake enemy(actual friend) for Bitcoin would join the party.
Unfortunately,the Bitcoin price is too volatile,which scares many people away from BTC and stops the mass adoption of BTC.

The government isn't looking to offer an alternative, they want to streamline fiscal control into a simple action of typing in numbers onto a keypad to alter the digital token supply of an entire economy. Fiat currencies lend themselves to overt governmental control but the distribution has a physical component. Most banking is online but there will still always be cash, and the government doesn't have any control over cash P2P transactions. The fact that CBDC's are being presented as even being remotely similar to crypto demonstrates their successful propaganda campaign. They aren't similar and I can guarantee you the long term goal will be to phase out fiat currencies for CBDC's and then use CBDC to replace crypto.

To determine the price of BTC, we need fiat which will also be replaced by the CBDC. I experience first hand how difficult it is to have no access to fiat, its not good.

Fiat digital currencies will still exist whether you see it as enemy. The government needs fiat currency. If they need go back to the gold back currency, they will do it just to have a control over the currency for  the country. There may be countries that will embrace BTC  but there are also countries that will hold on to fiat for they need it otherwise chaos will be there.

the media is a tool of government to lead opinion so it's only natural that they all say bitcoin is a tool for criminals such as terrorists, drug traffickers and arms dealers.  in fact, Bitcoin is a way out for many people to be free from the restraints of the government and also banks that have been locking up human financial freedom.  lucky us who know and believe in Bitcoin early.

I am quite passionate about this market but also have to look back at our current economy when other things are not the only problem but how to operate and manage high-ranking government apparatuses. interacted with each other. Perhaps crypto is gradually proving its superiority, so institutions that want to control it will always find all kinds of reasons to oppose the development of this field. I know many people are thinking the same thing as me when it comes to a financial space that is transparent and not governed by any one party. Perhaps one day we will look at money issues one by one. A simpler path is always preferable.

I don't consider them enemies as they had their usage. Cash is still a good use for privacy. You pay in cash then there's nothing link to you unless you provide the information yourself before you pay it with paper.
Bitcoin is still on the view as an asset. How could you even use it now without merchants accepting it for fear of volatility.
Both have usage for now and nothing should be erased. We are not in the era of Bitcoin as the main currency of all just yet. CBDC is a no for me, same with credit cards or whatever they offer in banks with your name on it.

That is pretty much the formula used by the rich, they have debts in fiat but then they buy assets which makes them money which can then be used to eventually pay their debts, so while it is necessary to have some savings in fiat in the case of an emergency the size of those savings needs to be limited and once they reach a certain size then it is time to think about in which asset we would like to invest them, with bitcoin being one of the best options we have available at the time.

Are you currently using fiat in your daily life transactions?

What's the point of hating fiat, when you get to know crypto then it's as easy as if the role of fiat has disappeared?

I don't deny the extraordinary role of bitcoin, but fiat can't be simply hated, if you yourself are still using it to pay for housing, food, drinks and gasoline for transportation.

You say you fall in love with Bitcoin, while the rules of the country where you live do not legalize Bitcoin. Are you going to switch places because there are only fiat options for transactions?

We just need to be smart in implementing it all and be in a safe position to be wiser in controlling the financial portion.

I totally agree with you. Fiat and CBDC are all enemies to crypto currencies, they are to destroy crypto Currencies and take over the E-Currencies system or space. They are not for the good of crypto currency but for the goods of crypto currencies. Crypto is to help the youths financially stable while the fiat is for the benefit for the elites. Crypto Currency reduce or close the gap between the wealth or rich and the poor Masses. The poor citizens are using Crypto Currencies to provide for their daily bread. The Governments had used many ways to destroy crypto by calling the currency Scam, and fake but when they discovered that the currency is gaining ground more than the fiat currencies, they started banning it. But it is too late to ban crypto in any country.

I am kinda in the “middle” when it comes to CBDCs. Although that it is a welcoming development, but CBDCs are centralized which means that the banks are still having the custody and control of these. But with crypto, as long we store them in non-custodial wallets, we are in full control and custody and no bank or government can do anything about it.

Charts is a fact and can't be manipulated, but you can't predict the future by looking at the past chart/history. Keep in mind I'm also a Bitcoin enthusiast, but I wouldn't disagree if someone say Bitcoin is speculative or high risk asset since it's really have high volatility. There's no guarantee the price will keep increase, it will depends on the people who want to use it. Fiat is stable even it keep losing it's value due to money printer, at least the price doesn't change 10% in a day. It's centralized and not save haven, but all merchants accept fiat, in the end you still need fiat.

The digital currencies of central banks are not cryptocurrencies at all, but only a digitized fiat that is being created to adapt finances to the digital age in which we live. Anyone who even thinks of putting Bitcoin in the same basket with any CBDC has no idea what they are talking about, least of all if they use terms like stability and security.


All the mainstream media is under the control of the same people who control the politicians, and all of them together defend their value systems, so I don’t even expect them to say positive things about Bitcoin. Although Bitcoin has indeed shown through its short history that it can be a good insurance against inflation and can be extremely profitable, the government's position is mostly to warn potential investors that not all cryptocurrencies are equal and that there are many scams in the crypto world.

We should always keep in mind that investing in Bitcoin has possible benefits, but also risks that (let's be honest) most people today are not able to deal with. If we extend this story to altcoins, then it becomes a real nightmare for investors, but also for government services that people complain about after losing their money. Lest anyone misunderstand me, I am no fan of governments and what they do, but if we put ourselves in their position then it is quite logical that they cannot be pro-Bitcoin, it is the complete opposite of what they represent.

The problem is that nowadays there are so many naive people who say that they hate fiat but on the other hand still use it in their daily life. I mean when we say hate indirectly we don't use it but a lot of people say hate and don't support it but on the other hand they are still consumptive users of fiat which makes this funny.
We know that Bitcoin is something that is very good to be an investment, especially if you look at the movement, volatility and capitalization they offer but on the other hand this does not mean we can replace Fiat there.
We live where we are still locked up with it, hate fiat just because we feel disadvantaged but on the other hand still use it for everyday life, it becomes a naive person

Hate on the sense that they could do something or anything because they are fully dependent on it since from the start and its true that people would neither be doing or hating something but still engaging or making

use of it because not all would really be having a good impression on how this current fiat or monetary system do works.Its better not to stress out yourself because even how Crypto would soar out but still
fiat would remain no matter how we do hate it and crypto would really be just remaining as an option or would be just an another choice.

I think they are only going with the flow. They can see that most people will say something bad about fiat, so they will do the same only to be on trend. I know this because im also doing it but that was before. I feel guilty inside so I stop it. There is no need to be afraid or ashamed of if you are still using fiat until now.

What can you do, you can't use cryptos directly. Fiat is still useful because on most countries they don't made cryptos as a legal tender yet, except only to the country of El Salvador. For now, crypto or bitcoin cant replace fiat, for the same reason like I said above but we don't know in the future, what if all countries convert like El Salvador?

Media has been gone for a long time, it has been gone decades ago but we just didn't realize it. With the increasing social media usage, we got to see both sides of a story and see what people really think. That way we managed to actually bring in some more idea on what we should think about.

Before that, we had tv channels most of which were owned by either same person or similar people with same interests, which resulted with the news being told in one way or another, it is either part A or party B and nothing more to it. With twitter and isntagram and facebook and so forth, we started to realize that maybe there could be other realities out there. Which helps crypto against CBDC for sure.

Too apathetic to consider Fiat an enemy. Does this come from a wise mouth? Isn't the price of cryptocurrency eventually disbursed into fiat and you can pay the rent?
But I agree if what you mean is referring to privacy then you might say the enemy in terms of freedom. CBDC is just an uptake from conventional fiat turning to technology. Where the goal remains the same to keep control of incoming financial flows from cryptocurrencies to fiat. The government just doesn't want to lose control of your money holdings, so the CBDC was born as a fiat counterweight.

Most of these words do really came from on someone who do really make themselves way too boosted on what crypto had made into them.Well, its not that surprising that there are people who do really get benefit out

with crypto market which they do think that crypto could replace fiat on some point which is really a bad idea to have or something talks about unrealistic thing since we know on how relevant fiat existence had.
Some might hate it but lets accept the fact that we are still dependent on fiat and any service that it is really attached to it.Therefore, having or saying these words are bit too confident or cant really be possible at all.

As a crypto user, I just need to be a balancer. Whether using fiat or crypto, both will still provide their respective benefits with state rules that make us unable to escape from fiat if our country does not adopt Bitcoin as El Salvador did. So to stay safe and not get high crypto tax deductions where I live then reacting wisely is the best option. Because fiat will still exist and will be maintained by the governments of each country.

You're right about that. A full-fledged digital economy patronized by the government will put an end to privacy for good. This will give more power to banks and the government over the mainstream economy. Luckily, crypto will be there to save the day. After all, crypto's decentralized and censorship-resistant design prevents any government from interfering against it. People can still enjoy privacy on crypto regardless of government's actions against it.

One thing for sure is that CBDCs are essentially an upgraded version of Fiat without the physical part. Paper money and plastic cards will become history as CBDCs prove to be superior. Which type of currency (CBDC or crypto) to use will depend on a person's needs. As long as decentralization wins, there should be nothing to fear. Just my thoughts ;D