Bitcoin Forum

Onchain gambling is gone, it was one of the first ways to gamble our bitcoins... The casinos used to be totally anonymous, to the point where you don't have to create an account on the casino to place a bet. And that was what I call freedom.

When I join to this crypto world in 2014, there use to be 2 casinos with this feature, their name was Lucky bit and Satoshi Bones. And their games have a unique address where you can send your coins and get back to the bet result to the address where the bet comes from. That was how they didn't ask for an account to place a bet.

Those engines were provably fair, and the max wins were up to 100BTC in lucky bit (in that time BTC was at $500 approx) but still huge.

The new casinos are crazy with their KYC rules and customer support. They hold users' money as if they were the owners of the money, and you can find all the same slots games bringing a lack of original and probably fair games.

Maybe regulation brings us to the current situation, but in the past was funnier, fair, and legit. And that's why I miss the old onchain gambling.

Do you remember those old casinos, and what are your thoughts about the current gaming sites compared with the old ones?

I have encountered that type of casino but I believe, that kind of gambling will not be a hit anymore in today's situation.
For one, because there are so many scammers, we don't know if the operator will be honest with their operations.
Also, if you are not creating your account, it is hard to prove that you are the owner if you happen not to screenshot your games or save your address/keys.
With centralized gambling sites, you have the chance to recover your account if you forgot your password as you can contact their support.
People nowadays prefer centralized as they have more confident that if something goes wrong, they can always contact the site or other people to help them out of the situation.

I used to use directbet.eu and it was the single best gambling experience of my life. It was a shame that it was taken down due to attacks against that style of taking bets as a result of high transaction fees allowing users to place bets that would never confirm both ways, and then double spending the losing bet while confirming the winning bet with higher fee transactions. It’s a shame that this method of gambling was attacked and abandoned before it could be developed further. This is exactly the sort of thing that I point to as an example of why Bitcoin has actually lost use cases over the years instead of gaining them. We’re ironically centralizing ourselves as a community as frequently as we can. I don’t blame casinos though, nobody wants to risk having you business bankrupted by the downfalls of the Bitcoin network.

At the old times,their was only few casino and now was used by the few people.The price of bitcoin was around 500$ and will be distributed among all the winner.The kyc procedures was easy for before.Now the procedure of kyc hard.And they taking huge time for the verification of our kyc.So it’s hard to hold our Privacy.

I did not reach this kind of game I was late here, and the format and the trend are what are we've seeing right now, it must be really good in the olden days because we all want anonymity in our playing session


If a player knows what will be the price of Bitcoin 8 years from then he would have played a lot just to get more Bitcoin


That's true there's one casino here that just opened and ask for a phone verification when you are signing up and it received a lot of bad feedback from the community, the KYC is now required when the casino thinks your account is suspicious


I wish e have something like that today so we new players can enjoy that game and appreciate it too but we all know casinos wants to protect their interest that is why they have a new system in place.

KYC has taken over most gambling sites at this recent time compared to years back where crypto gambling was not too known but was fair and legit. Majority of gambling platforms in this recent time do ask for simple KYC where other tend not to consider that as a requirement but the gambler will be limited to a certain on of fund that can be deposited or withdraw. This reason alone makes people to go in search of gambling platforms that are legit and has no KYC

Honestly in my heart I also always miss the old days, fair and legit casino don't need an account to gamble. That anonymous style makes me a free gambler to bet, you are right if a long time gambler in this crypto business will definitely not like KYC because in the past it was not in demand by most crypto gamblers. At this time there are indeed many casino that enforce that rule, in my opinion it doesn't matter if it is proven wise and proven safe but it is better to anonymously. By the way directbet is the best in my opinion personally.

Haven't experienced this type of gambling but I believe the reason why it was popular in the old days was because the restriction was not yet there as crypto gambling was still in the early days of the market. But as crypto gambling is getting interest from the community, the restrictions that come with it also changes. And for these casinos to comply with the license they are applying for, to make their business legit, they need to ask some information from their clients owed to this AML laws. Also, with fees getting expensive, I don't think the gambler will want to pay the fee every time he will bet. Because in the current situation, the gambler will only pay the fee upon withdrawal from the site. But during his games or bets, there's no corresponding fee to pay.

I was not yet involved in gambling when these systems or models are in existence, but they sure are interesting based on your observation, now we are in the regulation period it finally caught up with us, and these casinos need to protect themselves to be fully compliant to what their license issuer is demanding, and they want to assure their players that cheating will not be tolerated and they need to implement KYC to trace abuser to establish their reputation.

AFAIK there's an onchain Bitcoin casino on the previous year if I'm not mistaken, but there's no demand about the casino since they don't offer any promotions and still brand new without reputations. However Freebitco even though need to create an account, but they're wouldn't ask any KYC even you have doing something suspicious (you'll get terminated instead). Yeah I'd say currently 95% big casinos in this forum is a KYC casino, they only have different system/perspective to the trigger a red flag on your accounts.

Might be because the current system offered this way is much more comfortable in terms of experience given to the user. Yes, it's at the cost of KYC rules BUT you can't deny that with the order that those casinos give out, most of the experience users felt has been a lot more comfortable/better for the most part (emphasis on most). I reckon it wouldn't be that bad for a group/company to develop those types of casinos again, but I don't think it can be kept afloat since I don't think a lot of users would actually use it since the majority of the people would rather enjoy a comfortable (and a bit more secure than others) type of experience.

Congratulations! You've discovered that regulations are bad for business. There are still casinos without KYC but it seems to me that we are on an unstoppable trend to fully regulated crypto gambling with KYC. This also means more taxes to be paid by the houses and a lower return to the player or a higher HE, however you want to look at it.

It is not all bad, because it is assumed that with greater regulation there is greater security against scams and greater player protection, with mandatory gambling resposible features, for example, but the past that you long for is not coming back.

I remember satoshimines,where you didn't have to create an account,in order to bet.
Anyway,I don't think that these crypto gambling games were better than the current crypto casinos.
Registering an account isn't such a big deal.KYC is the big problem for many gamblers,but we have to abide by the rules.Nowadays,I would rather gamble on a legit regulated online casino,that has KYC verification,rather than having trust in a non-regulated gambling website,where you could just send your coins and lose them forever.I'm sure that such onchain gambling websites still exist,but who is gambling there?The amount of gamblers isn't very big,I guess.

Agree. Regulation is taking part of this transition.

There are still many of these casinos today but you will need to connect your wallet to the  platform. Its not using BTC anymore but the altcoins with smart contract functions like ETH and etc. Only few of us are using them also because the transaction few is just too  much. I hope someone will really create that kind of casino again using LN so for it to be cheaper.

Online gambling casinos were not really that much of an issue back then, when crypto was still fresh and new. You could easily use Bitcoin without having to worry about this regulation or that regulation.

Nowadays without decentralization of gambling via smart contracts I do not see much of a future for online crypto gambling, as regulations just keep getting tighter and tighter...

The best option is just to keep upgrading until we reach the point of balance again. I still believe in Bitcoin and I am sure it will overcome this annoying government-placed obstruction of freedom.

crypto is getting more and more famous so it is the aim of the regulators to make everything regulated so that crypto casinos experience it.
Honestly never played in such a casino, is this the same as decentralized casino?
It seems that you will no longer be able to find where players can play freely without worrying that they will be required to KYC in the future.


it's true they never ask for KYC but unfortunately the types of games are very few, they have a sister site but have never played is the rules the same that they will never ask for KYC

So what is the main idea of this discussion, is it about regulation/KYC related thing or about comparison between on chain and off chain gambling. As a gambler, I would prefer off chain games/casinos. Simply because it is easier to access and play, I do not need to make transaction for every bet. Off chain gambling gives me more different games to play at single time and single place. Onchain gambling was great but it was very limited, mostly people can play 1 single game only in a gambling site. When it comes to regulation or something related to KYC, yes OnChain based gambling is better than Offchain.

I don't think I've ever played in a casino like you mean because I haven't explored each casino very much in the past. Perhaps such casinos are still around for the time being to cater to the whims of gamblers who don't want to get involved with KYC. But I don't know either because nowadays, most casinos require registration to be able to play at their casinos. There may be some casinos that give gamblers the option of connecting their wallets directly to their casinos. But I remembered few names of those casinos, although I do not play on those casinos.

The main reason for this is due to the vulnerability of the sites.
Now the technology has become so advanced that, people using various methods to cheat the sites and winning ample amount of money.
This is the reason for which many gambling sites are asking for KYC when necessary to cross verify some certain facts.

Yes I also miss the on chain games that we were used to have before.
I too come across some sites and they were also complete anonymous.
But guess what  ? We need to bid them farewell, as those era and decades are now.
Now only the slots games and sports betting are famous.

Nevertheless, i enjoy being in both the time and thankfully able to make some good money from both.

True, the double-spend attack was the Nemesis of this king of games, and waiting for 1 confirmation to see our bets roll was cruel, and that's why the offchain casinos become the right way to do gambling with cryptos and without a risk for the house.

If a casino is vulnerable or can be abused then they should fix it, and not blame the users and lock all the accounts. The past week a see how a user get his account locked for abusing the promotion in one casino. So if you take all the promos now you are an abuser, and that's nonsense for me. If the casino feels the users are abusing the promos, then they should take out the promos.

This is the time also where binary trading on secondstrade was also famous in the forum. I have tried both directbet where all we need  is a wallet like electrum and they automatically send the winnings when we win. There is nothing like them today. But there are gambling dapps we use today on TRON and EOS not on Bitcoin chain.

Quite different when it started but government today are more focused on BTC and so they are asking data for its users. Regulation helps adoption but also not good to our privacy.

Even though i never has an experience in playing such before but i think there's a need foro restructuring of the casino and bring it back to live as many people have more pleasure derivation in playing such games, an onchain game is what gamblers can keep up with because they know quite alright that for them to make a claim for their winning their must be a prove to that claim and no body will want to make that aspect a joke, i expect games to be renderd in all forms regardless of mode of operation required in playing it as long as it is been acceptable for a play.

I remember something like DirectBet? IIRC. I know that it will already give you a unique address on this specific match/event when it comes to depositing etc. It's like the funds is on hold there then sent to you a new one on an address that you provided. Oh I remember the days. It was easy to play etc. I know that there are politics too there.

At least I tried to see and read about OnChain games and gambling, from the two topics below, I don't understand how to play OnChain gambling.

• Bitcoin Betting Website - Multiplayer Onchain Gambling on Block Hash Randomness. (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1483914.0)

• WarOfLife.com - Cellular Automata - Gambling - On Chain Parimutuel or Off Chain (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=714917.0)

Overall, some of the members who commented on the topic, they are not very interested in Onchain games.

I think if Onchain gambling is really good and fair, as you said, I believe Onchain gambling will last until now, the proof is not much information is obtained about Onchain, although there are several topics about them here.

I wasn't yet, into crypto in 2014, but I sure heard of Satoshi bone when I got in in 2016.
It did interest us all to know that the onechain method of gambling didn't not just die away like that, I personally think the bitcoin network very much contributed to the downfall of this method of gambling, If I could remember, there was a time when bitcoin transactions cost over a hundred dollars to get confirmation, and even at this, it took several hours before the transaction and push through, sometime even days, (I personally have made a bitcoin transaction that took over a week to get a confirmation).

So now imagine sending bitcoin to place a bet on a game, most especially sports games/betting that deals with time, if it is a time when the bitcoin network is congested, it probably will take hours to get a confirmation which by then, it might have become late to place a bet on that particular game, I think this and maybe other factors frustrated the onechain form of gambling into closure.

But you have to understand that crypto in the early years was very different as compared to the crypto right now, scams and illegal transactions are always something to worry about and at the end one must always remember that the usage have increased and there are a lot more people who are way more eager to follow up on online gambling as compared to the offline one due to the pandemic therefore I do think that all these additional methods are necessary one way or the other since they probably provide the additional security method that is needed. The anonymity had to go if it had to be widely accepted one way or the other.

It's easy because it's automatic, however, I think that would not be too attractive especially if the transaction fee is very expensive. It was  very popular gambling site back in the day but they just suddenly stopped their business, probably due to regulatory problem.

I agree we have evolved but the industry evolved towards centralization and regulation, but what can we do this is to protect the integrity of the casinos and to stop bad actors from cheating the casinos, even if we don't want, casinos are another exception on decentralization, and so far the industry is doing just fine and this model will stay on.
It's still a win-win situation for gamblers and the casinos.

I know, the fees are definitely a thing but with its anonymity, it's great. And the fees with BTC are not high anymore so I think it wouldn't be a problem now. I do remember DirectBet it being great but suddenly stopping their business. Maybe there could be something similar operating now?

It really is very gratifying that I was able to have that experience in 2014, I began to learn about the benefits of BTC E in 2017, and you are absolutely right, in fact now there are very few sites that do not require KYC, for everything it is a KYC, I believe that privacy and anonymity is undoubtedly a right that has been taken away from us little by little, and I believe that this is now a trend that is irreversible.

For now, the safest are those who can actually respond in terms of security. In some quite famous and good casinos they are beginning to accept the use of VPN, which in some were removing everything related to this type of freedom, if the casinos establish better freedoms in terms of anonymity, I think many will go there.

I have used both Satoshi Bones and Direct Bet. Both websites provided a new kind of gambling experience.
Another site that allowed you to bet directly on chain was SecondTrade with their binary options bets and other blockchain-based games.

I have to spent some words about DirectBet. This site is literally unforgettable, with its competitions and ease of placing bets.
Unfortunately, as OgNasty recalled, the whole mechanism was attacked and destroyed making the business no longer viable :(

I really understand your longing, we are the same. But in this case, it's hard to avoid anonymity where policies are getting stricter, we can't help but live in an age where Bitcoin is still being ignored. Therefore, more and more casinos now require us to KYC because Bitcoin has a very large adoption rate and very strict attention. Maybe all we can do is look for loopholes little by little to minimize but not be completely anonymous. At least pick and choose casinos that don't tighten KYC matters.

Online gambling has witnessed a tremendous growth since the emergence of the pandemic, so that central gambling sites began working on developing the infrastructure to avoid legal problems related to money laundering and financing terrorist groups. Unfortunately, I haven't had the experience of using decentralized casinos that don't require KYC, but at the moment if these casinos are back in business they will find it very difficult to gain clients.

I remember Onehash which you could make out some direct betting but as i have checked as of this moment its entirely been changed.So far i havent seen on which is similar to
Directbet which i couldnt deny that this kind of betting without the need of any account is surely something that interesting as long the fees would really be that cheap
then you would really see this to be interesting but if fees are on the roof then for sure you would really be avoiding on making transactions like this.

I never tried the old ways of how people get to gamble with crpyto because I entered this field in 2017 and it was the year of hype and new ATH for most coins. Your experience is great and somehow gives me a little bit of fear maybe because I never really have done it. That is way too simple and no hustles as you stated, I wonder how did it end up like these with so many regulations and restrictions. So much about control, Bitcoin was made to express our freedom and now, it ain't going there somehow in some parts.

Unfortunately, we can observe how the regulations are entering the world of cryptocurrencies from everywhere. Cryptocurrency companies (casinos as well) are getting bigger and want to operate legally, which is why they are forced to require KYC verification due to the law.
However, this is not the end of anonymous casinos. On some of them you can register with e-mail only. Such anonymous registration still exists on the 1xBit platform, for example.

Where you found the kyc easier before, base on the op I came to know they didn't require any kyc before. As there was no kyc that was the real freedom and now there is no freedom as they require KYC. And I think kyc is kyc there is no classification of hard kyc and easy kyc.

Anonymous gambling sites will get into legal trouble sooner or later. It is in general more beneficial for the customer than the operator to have the site run anonymous so that’s why there are less and less sites like this. Especially because the potential penalties for money laundering etc. are high.

What happens is that things have changed, on the early days of this market when the majority of those that were buying bitcoin believed in the technology and the ideology behind it, it made sense that casinos did their best to give to gamblers what they wanted, also governments still had not taken such a hard stance against the privacy of gamblers and traders, but since then the circunstnaces have changed and most of the people invested in bitcoin today do not really care too much about keeping their privacy and instead prefer to get bigger bonuses even if that means going through KYC policies.

It is definitely true that most casinos right now ask KYC to their gamblers even if you didn't do any suspicious things and it's also in their rules and regulations or terms and conditions that they have the right to hold your funds. What I think about the casinos right now is that I hate it when I wanted to gamble to a casino but to withdraw the funds then I must complete KYC first before it gets processed and the minimum withdrawal amount and transaction fee is not friendly for small time gamblers like me. I do understand why they must ask for KYC which is to prevent money laundering but I think there is a possibility that there's still people who might be able launder money or manage to do money laundering even though they have to go through KYC.

Those times were one of the best even though Directbet's odds are somewhat juiced it still provided a lot of conveniences as you can easily make a bet on the go.

A year or two ago there was a sportsbook that tried a similar approach like Directbet they're called Dbet.io but unfortunately, they didn't gain many players and eventually closed down.

I'd still think it's possible to bring back the old style of gambling but there might be a limitation as one of the services i'm using recently allows you to instantly process your transaction if you follow their rules like disabling RBF and putting a minimum fee (5+sat/b for example).

I think there are still some games that is like that but not sure which one is active, right now the gambling sites offers casinos from third party and sports betting to reach most of the gamblers here and those games requires license and if the gambling site has license then expect that there will be a KYC. Some gambling sites that doesn't ask for KYC or unregulated casinos most likely ended up scamming its players.

Gambling sites are one if the place where most cryptocurrencies are transacted so imagine what will happen if all of them are on chain transactions, the fee will be higher than bet amount and we actually can't have the faster betting experience, even though I respect the privacy factor still it is not possible for now because government recognized the potential of cryptocurrency gambling so they implemented lot of regulations and restrictions.

I think that was the old times, I like the way that we can play anonymous but right now I still prefer the web 3.0 as they can easily accessed in the gambling site. Although I like the OnChain games that is really fair rather than the casino sites that we are not sure if is fair or not and yes we still trust me.

This is actually true and gambling owners I think won't able to reach their niche so they are only limited to cryptocurrency gambling users and they have limited types of games unlike having a full gambling site with inhouse games, casinos and sports betting they managed to cover most of the likes of the gamblers and they have flexible payment system from fiat to cryptocurrency. So what I'm saying it is profitable to have full casino than the OnChain gambling sites.

Back then, crypto gambling has few competitors yet and at the same time, there are also few players. The gambling industry isn't much crowded and aren't abused by people, hence the KYC before is much easier compared today. Right now, there are many casinos and players already and these casinos and gambling websites are now abiding to the laws in which state they belong to. Regulation of gambling is now a thing because of increase rate of addiction and other repercussions as well as the tax revenue being generated in it.

If you don't really want to undergo KYC, there are still casinos and gambling website that don't really ask and mandate it. However, there's only a few left because most of them really ask for it for verification purposes the moment you will make a transaction such as withdrawal.

With web 3.0, I think it will make it easier for gamblers to directly use branded wallets that are linked to the casino so they can start playing right away.
But all of them have their positives and negatives and I think gamblers will be able to choose which one they think is more suitable for them.
Web 3.0 itself can be an option for gamblers who don't want to be bothered by registering on gambling sites and avoiding KYC which is often something that many gamblers don't want.

If I remember correctly.... those on-chain casinos got a lot of flack from the community back then... because people were saying that these on-chain games generated too much unnecessary transactions on the Blockchain. The Blockchain was very congested back then and sites like this, just made it worst.  ::)

When you spam micro transactions on-chain, it leads to congestion and higher fees...and that is why it was not working. I on the other hand, think that services like this must be there to reward the miners for their mining when the Block reward falls away. (Just find a way to batch groups of transactions together to cause less congestion)  ;)

Every bet placed has to be based on blockchain transaction speed so that in case of transaction congestion it will hinder the casino play, so only because of the KYC factor that maybe not all gamblers will accept the requirements of the online gambling platform. So there is no other choice to complete KYC and maybe some will use other people's identities because of the anonymous factor.

I also tried the same feature in old casinos before and it was fun but the problem is, we couldn't play the same way before. These days, we need assurance and security and in exchange for that, we're required to pass KYC. We could still enjoy different games nowadays securely and we could also get rid of scammers with the help of security features of the latest casino sites.

Actually there are no kyc's before, the one where you submit your own i.d and take a selfie. Dunno what is the kind of kyc you guys are talking about. Was it when you submit your email address? Or phone number? But that was easy to supply and easy to fake out. All sites before have a simple sign up form and some don't require a sign up at all like the one the op talks about.

It's interesting that casinos before only have a 1 btc pot and those who will win will divide it to their sign up addresses. It's automatic and no need to withdraw it manually. Pretty cool. Now almost all casinos will let you bet and win over 1 btc. We can see that they are serious now.

Whatever platform we are tending to make use then trust would really be the main talk thats why its not really bad to put up your time on making at least some research before making further step.

Did remember out those onchain betting which is really having that different experience compared to casual deposit on a particular casino before you could really make out bets.

Dont know on why casinos nowadays havent really able to adopt it but to presume it would be mostly talking or in issue with fees for some point.

Also, if they do want to get a gambling license, they need to have in their ToS that they will be getting some information from their players to abide the AML laws. So if they will have onchain, how can they require these docs from their players? This is why we can see that most of these gambling sites with gaming license has in their ToS about KYC requirements. For onchain, definitely they won't require KYC. However, people are trusting gambling sites with license these days.

I think I remember lucky bit.

There's no way to get back on it as most casinos are requiring now to pass onto their kyc verification as they're also being required by their locality.

The contribution that has been made by the old casinos not just to the market but also to the current situation of online gambling were huge. But change is constant.

The past must be said to be better than the present, when care is not taken the future will be worse than now. I could imagine the fun people had while staking bets through onchain, the stress free platforms, no Kyc, zero confirmation, safe from uploading important documents online. I guess alot of people were not interested in bitcoin in 2014 compared to today's crypto world where scam, fake projects and deceits surfaced the market like hungry men craving for quick wealth. The government is hitting the drum of regulating bitcoin so hard that everyone can hear the sound. This is what cryptocurrency related scam has caused!

And we know that gambling community does really mind off or always seek off about being a licensed company which it do really adds up credibility and trust on a certain company thats why they would rather prefer

on having that traditional way where everything is centralized since they do know that its one of the requirements rather than on on-chain but for those people who do really mind off about

their anonymity or identity then they would really be preferring on touching up these platforms but sadly we cant see something like this on present times.

Everything is evolving they have done their part and their purpose, and we are now in a better position, what we are right now we owe a lot of the changes and the flaw of the old model, the scams can easily be traced and cheaters are caught and that could have not been possible without the changes the new and existing casinos have implemented.
We need to also recognize their contribution, we cannot move on to the present without the flaw in the old model.

There is always a Bad and Good side of which happens from Old and New one and yes we must be thankful for what we had in the past because this thought us how to improve and deal with the bad elements in gambling.
But like OP i missed the Old Onchain and the old ways of gambling .
but we have to move forward because verything must come to change and gambling is one of the most to have this.

The old ways is very slow and limited game offered. I remember only dice, crashgames and sportsbet is what available during this kind of casino era. The only I miss about this old gambling type was everything is transparent since all bet is on chain compared to current casino that usually use game provider that use RNG which is impossible to verify although these classic games typically added on the in-house games. Aside from that, the no account feature is what they are good, Only wallet address is what you need then you are good to go.

But it's also regulation that at the very least helps in countering crypto-related scams. I still hold the opinion that KYC isn't exactly wrong, just that some people don't want it and that's fine, some people are fine with it and that's okay, I guess the only wrong thing here is the ratio of casinos that require KYC to those that don't. Well change to a centralized development isn't all that odd, despite all the issues with KYC that most users personally have, it's still something that benefits users in terms of, example, secure or licensed.

I see sometimes new gambling sites but they offer an onchain gambling from different network and doesn't accept Bitcoin and TRX that's why they are being removed from the board but is there any exisiting site that offer onchan gambling games?

Most crypto gamblers really don't want to do KYC just because it's to play gambling and crypto can give them that. With the increasing popularity of crypto in the community and they slowly find out what the benefits of crypto are for them, it will make people turn to crypto even though they still use fiat for their daily lives. But it seems that the existence of crypto today provides more benefits for the community so that they have their own choices to use crypto or fiat. With on-chain casino sites, gamblers can keep playing without having to register and enter their data and most importantly, they don't have to do KYC.

That's why the community should start asking, and start encouraging their favorite internet casinos/gambling sites to start implementing the Lightning Network. I believe that if implemented, some of them will start doing the natural evolution of offering games, or separate apps themselves where you interact directly with Lightning while playing the game. The same interaction with onchain gaming, but offchain. 8)

Well as far as I know EOSbet was the first on-chain gambling casino before that becomes popular.
I don't know what is the reason they are slowly fading in this gambling industry, the reason that comes up in my mind is that there is no provably fair on the onchain gambling casino or perhaps I am wrong with this conclusion. But still, they are good gambling casinos.

It's true that because of those changes, we've moved forward.

That's how it should go and the way that casinos have improved, we've seen the new ones and upgraded versions to make their service better. And, we're missing the old ones just as OP has said.

But, we can no longer be with the past and has to move forward for the betterment of this side of gambling.

I like the casino now more than the old ones, I read something like this years ago, but the new model attracts more players and the casinos can serve the gambling community better, the Cryptocurrency technology has gone a long way.

We are better and we are stronger the proofs are many fiat online casinos are now moving to Crypto casinos this is where money is and this is where the large community of gamblers are.

Now you mentioned, I remember there was a site that pays satoshi on click and view website they want to advertise. Yup, the kind of PTC that was popular back then but this one pays in satoshi and has some casino games so you can gamble on your earnings at there as well. I think they also did give out 1 unique address to users without any reg account, allowing users to deposit more money if they think they are on roll without any hassle.   

You simply send money to an address, and depending on the result of a block, you get returns or not. That's how satoshidice did it back in the day, you would send your money and then you will get it back if you won or if not then you would not get it.

Today that would be silly because even the fee's alone would eat it up, think about it each bet would have to be paid a fee for and now instead you get something like a cashback or rewards or whatever instead. On chain wasn't something to miss, the second just-dice and primedice created the off-chain betting everyone moved there and it was a no brainer, no reason to keep gambling there at that point.

Well, things do change and we need to embrace that and for some obvious reasons we are moving forward to what's the future would hold. I do like onchain gambling feature as I've read it, but if it isn't a trend anymore then there has some downside in it as well.

Go using "Chain-Bet"

They're on-chain betting using Litecoin, already in service since 2016 : https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1492457.400 feel free to read the thread here. To be honest, on-chain bettins is not quite popular at all.

Since is really lame, and not brig any fun at all.

Honestly, I don't think high fees and slow transactions confirmation are the only or the main reasons why those on-chain casinos shut down their services and ceased to exist. The lightning network, for example, solves the above issues. So, if there was really a demand for, or interest in, such games then someone would have already relaunched a similar casino and implemented the lightning network to receive and issue payments. Zero-confirmation transactions can also solve those issues but it's a bit more risky.

Completely agree.

Some on-chain casinos were goated, for instance Directbet - I remember you could literally drop tens/hundreds of BTC per bet and it's just such a smooth and classic experience.

But some others like Chain-bet just never took off despite being on chain, mostly because it was just really inconvenient to use their platform. And I certainly don't miss that.

We do have different impressions when it comes to onchain bets and we've seen on how popular Directbet in the past despite on having that feature.
Some do love and some doesnt like due to some inconvenience but i do really love to see that it would be offered again by some platform in near future.
Its a matter of preference on each user though.

^ It is like some old school but there are too many gamblers preferred to use this game of on-chain gambling that is purely based on luck, if you want to try your luck probably this is the best thing for you. The reason why they did not exist is that on-chain gambling has a higher house edge and as far as I know, it has a 6%-10% house edge which is the RTP to the gamblers is not quite good.

They have higher house edge which is something that most gamblers are really keen to get involved with but surprisingly Directbet did really able to get good number of player even with that kind of arrangement or feature.Whats the reason on why it hasn't been continued or other platforms never consider to create something similar of it?

I played once on EOS bet which is now Earnbet.io what I think the reason it fades is because the lack of uses of their coin I think you can earn BET coin when you play or wager and you can use it to stake to earn dividends and also I don't see any new games from them so I think that is also one reason why people lose interest on it.

I got curious with this OnChain gambling, what is the difference between this game and the provably fair games? In most casinos the games they have are originals and those games are provably fair wasn't that OnChain gambling? I get a little confused about this types of gambling.

I don't know the details of Onchain gambling but they want related anonymity of all gambler's identity, decentralized gambling can be used by connecting wallet and every bet from manual transaction but now it is not effective to use because of blockchain dense transaction.

But that's the point of DirectBet closing down their services though. They can't assure the same "smooth experience" as they did during 2012. It was before my time in Bitcoin, but I believe it was a time when the blocks were always empty, and the fees were always low. It's simply not feasible anymore, for the casino and the user.

I hope there are still left games like that but I think the sports betting and casinos are more in demand as they offer a variety of games that the player can choose from and even if some of the games came from third party service or we cannot verify their fairness a lot of people still play on those games with really a lot of money.

The old times were certainly great for gamblers. Anyone who wins a lot doesn't need to send KYC, but the platform just verifies that the game that was played was fair and went completely according to the rules of the said game. Lots of original concepts on games too, and most gamblers share tricks and tips on how to win against the casino and it's just overall enjoyable. Nowadays, it's just the same rehashed version of the same games over and over again that it's hard to find original content that is fun and enjoyable.

What were those original Bitcoin casino games/apps? I believe Binary Options based on the price of Bitcoin was one such game, although I'm not sure if it was a game everyone could play onchain. But what I read/heard about that could be played onchain was a simple dice game called SatoshiDice, which could be revived in Lightning. There was another early site I heard was called AnoniBet, for sportsbetting.

One of the advantages of on-chain gambling is the fact that bets that were placed on the Blockchain, cannot be "deleted" by the casino. We have seen some casinos "hiding" traces of bet manipulation by simply removing an entry (bet slip or bet ID from their internal database, which is almost impossible with on-chain betting.)

So every bet made are being placed on the Blockchain, which makes this a trust-less, immutable and unbreakable system.  ;)  (Well, some miners have found ways to reverse bets and that lead to the closure of some sites.)  :P

We all have our own different kinds of tastes. Some wants old stuffs because they feel nostalgic with it but there are some like you that likes new stuff because of the reasons you said above. There are still some old sites that are operational up until today and they can be able to magnet a lot of players, like for example bitvest, primedice and bitsler.

To serve better doesn't only exist in new sites but it's a must for any site if only they want their players to stay with them. No need for a fiat casino to move in cryptos but they can just add cryptos on their supported currencies, that's it, they are now ready to accept crypto players. In fact many crypto casinos are also doing the same thing.

those on the blockchain bets often had the same issues with hackers and abusers since they require to be service opensource games as well. Hence, not everyone would really dare to take that risk when the current gambling is already secured and entertaining enough. Onchain gaming can be an innovation, but when such innovation tends to be a risk, it is better to use the normal platforms and make it as entertaining and secured as it can. Transparency isn't always the winner in gambling.

Plus having the hassle on making transactions often whenever you do make out some bets which is something that not really that appealing for most gamblers.They do really love to deal with instantaneous type of betting

rather than on making always some deposit on every bet you do make and considering that fees is still and expense then this isnt something to be that interesting in all possible angles.

Thats why we are really seeing that there are more to those traditionally casinos that we do have the in market with the same features.

In general we humans tend to think that the past was better. In this case I think it also adds that when bitcoin and the crypto space were created there was less regulation and it was a bit more like the wild west. I also think that a large part of the gambling that operated under the table before 2010 switched to gambling with cryptocurrencies, as I mentioned recently in meta.

In any case, we are in the situation we are in, and although having a bit of nostalgia is very human, we have to adapt to the present situation.

directbet.eu was the best casino ever for me.

Everything was automated so by design, the player was never going to get scammed by the casino. Like you said, people abused their services and now there isn't any casino like this around anymore. (or maybe I don't know their existence) You didn't have to keep your coins in the casino wallet which was the most awesomest thing ever. I will forever remember this casino.

I get it now. But how about the provably fair games? can they be altered or deleted too? as they are not in the blockchain but only using a provably fair algorithm? It looks like the OnChain games are much better than the current ones we have but they only have limited games unlike table games and slots.

We have to adapt to the development of gambling platforms because they will renovate the interface according to the needs of the current users and offer the latest features for the new gambling games, so it doesn't matter if one wants to reminisce on the old version of the casino but actually it's not really interesting if played on advanced technology era.

Because casino game betting has traces of transactions it's hard to manipulate (possibly) but we can't be sure it's valid information. So because of the limitations of games at the OnChain casino, gamblers are also bored and want changes to other gambling games, so the current development of casinos is better than OnChain.

The world is changing and you have to change to, if don`t want to be the last. I join crypto world in 2016, but even for this time it was a huge quantity of changes in this world. New cryptocurrencies, new rules, masternodes, DeFi, NFT. There were just several places that need KYC. But everything changes and a businessman has to change his projects to match the current time. This gives us new opportunities, so i willn`t try to remember how it was 5-10 years ago.

Changes and innovation is something inevitable and for an industry like Gambling then it is really that understandable that they would really be needing out adjustments or making something new

which hadnt been existed on the market on where they would really be the first on giving out into the community or offering its service because once its been recognized then it would

really be in resulting for having that attention that they might able to pull it off which would really be good for the business.

I can align well with people who liked the online gambling. My personal view, and that is open for discussion, is that some of the games there were not strictly on the bitcoin chain, but rather on the Ethereum platform. I would not exactly class krytokitties as a gambling platform as such, but it does look like an speculation platform and made the network both consolidate and show as well the limits.

I still found such kind of game here, actually i found them often here now, although its not about bitcoin only but other crypto with faster confirmation. The issue on this kind of gambling is not the provably fair its the reputation of the website compare to those licensed one. I found them too suspicious and too risky actually.

There's a new thread - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5398548.0?
I do agree that with on-chain, it is the reputation itself of the site matters.
And how easy it would be to ask for assistance if you got any problem.
It says from the thread, you can contact them 24/7, but can they really assist their players?

In the first place, they will not go obsolete if they are not abused and there were no flaws in their system but there were flaws and the current model proves to be a better one, secure for both gamblers and the admins, the one thing that we don't like is the KYC, KYC should be based on the trustworthiness of the casino, if the casino is reputable I'm ok with KYC as long as it meant to verify abuse or double account.

We wont really be bothered if a certain gambling site would be asking some KYC and as long its known and reputable then we wont really be hesitating in doing so but we do see
that only a few casinos do really impose such thing and the rest arent still asking any verification or simply KYC because its been a number one kind of thing which the community
do really hate up the most and we do much prefer on playing as much as we could and thats why we do really have lots of options which we could choose on.

I played before on gambling site that is like that I think it was TRX network related gambling site, I am not sure but I think the game is rigged as I have played the dice game with 80% chance of winning but lose 8-9 streak consecutively. Although it is possible but I think something is not right on the site, or I am just unlucky. I forgot the name of the site.

I play some of the gambling casino before but i didn't catch up the oldest one well but still this is good because we can see the improvement of the platform recently they have a smoother platform and animations with their user and also the security added a new layer for the safety of their players too.  Recently now people would like to keep themselves anonymously but of course if there's an issue the platform required the user for this.

I also like the onchain games as it could be easily verifiable but since it proved that every network will get clogged up with transactions its not a good option, i think lucky.bit also faced this problem before and they have to halt the operation since most of the bets were not being processed and people were getting mad and blaming the website and they can't do anything about it since its in the btc chain.

You dont have any idea on what onchain game do you? What platform you do say that they become even more smoother and does have improvement.?

We couldnt see any onchain gambling sites as of today basing up with my awareness but if there are then i might have missed that.
Usually on chain betting platforms doesnt really get too much interest due to duration of each game that it would be doing.
Yes, its safe since its chain transactions but some been saying that it does have high edge which is something that we dont really like.

The benefit of on chain gambling game is about its fairness as it should be able to be verified easily.
You cant judge a game is rigged just because you have losing streak in the game, as it happen really often in provably fair games of reputable casinos.
When it comes to on chain gambling, site's names that comes to my mind is directbet with its sports betting and luckybit with its plinko game.
They were the best on chain gambling site years back but unfortunately they stopped the services.

I believe On Chain gambling is history now.

I still missed that sports betting site named directbet. That was the easiest and most trusted sports betting site i had ever seen. I wonder why after its departure, no one courage to make the betting site on a similar code.

I think they have another project that they want to focus on and they can make a similar code but the problem is most of the blockchain are experiencing high transactions and it will congest the network and people will be pissed about it if their bets doesnt get graded instantly.

Plus onchain betting/gambling/casinos wouldn't be very practical if they were still alive because the block are full which also causes higher onchain transaction fees.


It would be a trade-off in my opinion. If you want a high limit, non-KYC casino, with "no questions asked" withdrawals, then prepare to pay the price.

Sometimes it not only good for business, in some situations "My dear, here we must run as fast as we can, just to stay in place. And if you wish to go anywhere you must run twice as fast as that."(c) Lewis Carroll.
If you don`t want to lose gamblers you have to involve new decisions that will make gambling easier and more attractive for gamblers. In other ways they will just change casino.

And with the current situation in gambling, players are more comfortable in centralized casinos.
It seems that they are not attracted with the onchain gambling these days.
There are benefits with onchain but in this today's situation, I don't think they will patronize onchain.
There are features in centralized casinos that gamblers want, even if some of them are asking kyc.
Maybe, because they are trusting these casinos because most of them have licensed to operate.
At least, an organization is looking after them, even if we say, very rare occasion that you truly see a casino sued by a player.

It is possible that people new to the world of cryptocurrencies prefer to play in centralized casinos, due to their regulation through the possession of a license. However, let's not forget that anonymity was initially the main advantage of cryptocurrencies. In my opinion, still a very large proportion of cryptocurrency users prefer casinos without KYC verification. The fact that there is a choice gives more possibilities and everyone can choose what suits them better. Anyway for me, anonymity is still the most important argument, and risk is simply part of that.

It's because the current regulatory system is "easy" enough for the casinos to work with, and the requirements are moderate enough for users. For now. But an industry under the "indirect control" of a cabal through the "regulators" can be manipulated to tighten their requirements. If tight enough during the time of onchain casinos, I believe the trade-offs being offered might become more attractive for the users.

Changes in crypto universe are happening all the time and that is an undeniable fact, however people should be careful to not change too much in a point they are going to reach the same place they were trying to avoid and run far away from a long time ago... If crypto changes too much, it won't have a reason to exist anymore, because it will be the same or part of the traditional financial system which forbids people from freely transacting online, especially at the gambling scene. The fact is that the old good days of crypto universe are gone. They are just memories and nostalgia on the minds of few who were lucky or blessed to be in the right place at the right time.

I'm a new casino player, but judging from what you said it seems like onechain is the fairest gambling site and has nothing to do with today's gambling. Come to think of it, I think I would be very happy if I ever played there, unfortunately I was not active in the gambling community at that time. What you say about casinos now is true, some of them even cheat with the system, but what they highlight is also quite interesting with abundant prize events.

I think I like more the provably fair casinos because even though it is not on chain gambling it is still fair and you can verify the bets on your own and unlike onchain gambling provably fair games have different variants such as roulette, dice, slots and manymore games.

I don`t sure that it is so. The DeFi support by the common users grows up everyday. And the same situation in the gambling. The classic casinos will lose clients or they need to include some features that makes possible to choose what do you prefer - old style or modern.
I think that if we can compare percent of gamblers in classic casino now and a year later - it will grow down.

I guess it's still possible to gamble on the chain. There were many casinos running on the Tron network. It makes it possible to play fair game on smart contracts.
However, people find it more convenient to play in licensed and popular casinos.

I agree with you, and I would add they lock customer funds and scam them if they win too much(they don't bother when they lose their money at them). But it seems the freebitcoin and Dplay teams are trying a new fully decentralized and non custodial casino where all will be done onchain, thanks to xfun.

They truly run onchain without the requirement to make an account with the casino? Everything is sent and received to your wallet? That's good, but from a technical perspective, TRON has made trade-offs in the Blockchain Trilemma for more scalability, but the network becomes more centralized.

The Blockchain Trilemma, https://www.ledger.com/academy/what-is-the-blockchain-trilemma

Yeah, I think Tron people missed the point (well not just them, almost any altcoin really) that people wanted on-chain solutions like this because they trusted the network, or rather, it allowed trustless settlement of bets, purely objective, meet all the right conditions and it settles.

That's how Directbet and others mentioned worked, because it used the Bitcoin network.

Don't know just how badly centralised Tron/EOS and all those gambling dapp wannabes were, but I suspect pretty bad. Ethereum's probably the only dapp network I'd trust to gamble on with significant sums.

I believe developers can build a casino on top of the Lightning Network, with "No-KYC" as a "value proposition" for users.


Obviously worse, the faster the network can process transactions per second. If they're blockchain is used at scale, they will need a data center to archive all that data. Bitcoin is not actually used "at scale" yet, but look how harder/more expensive it is to boot-strap an archive node. Plus also the fact that TRON/EOS uses POS/DPOS, that makes it very worse.

Those casinos were great and easy to go with at that period which currently they would not fit in in today's situations as they may easily be prone to security breach from hackers and scammers. So It's like saying those kind of casinos were great while they lasted.
Cause with today's problems of high levels of hacking and other security breaches casinos needed to look into new solutions and as such the KYC among other new patterns introduced  by the current casinos now is of necessity despite the procedures involved cause it's worth.

Traditional gambling with bitcoin is dead basically. Now people just gamble with altcoins.

Scammers and abusers will only take advantage of that kind of casino though it's really interesting due to the freedom that we could have with it. Old gamblers could enjoy such casinos before because scammers haven't entered crypto gambling yet during that time. Casino sites these days require KYC for security purposes because scammers are now everywhere and both sites and gamblers are just being careful. Gone were the days when gamblers could play freely without being worried to get scammed.

Those were the days and I've seen one before that no registration is needed and you just send your bet to the given address per user/guest that visits them.

Well, we have to embrace the changes as before the authorities don't look at crypto gambling as a legit thing and it looks like a game to them. Now that money talks and the value and worth of the entire market is huge, they now have to make rules that they'll have to require the casinos for their customers to follow kyc.

Speaking with betting then nothing beats out directbet which the only site that I do really recognized in terms of on chain but excluding into those chain based lotteries and other stuffs that related to it which I don't really see any interesting stuff on it.Majority of platforms now are centralized and regulated which is something not surprising and as a gambler then we don't really have any choice whether we do like it or not.

I agree that most people prefer centralized casinos because they believe that there is more security with their money, however there are many more ways to be able to trust with KYC, I know that the KYC requirement is enough for some, especially for those who love privacy and anonymity, normally many take care not to leave their data on any platform, because their data can be vulnerable and easily shared in the face of any attack or hacking, but not everything is bad, the fact of doing a KYC allows to the casino to have its good license and apart from providing good protection to them. In any case, we cannot close the doors to the new, although for many it turns out to be: "what is known is safer than what is new to be known."

Well, they have gone too soon and I think they'll still at the top if the remain in the competition and doesn't have to close operations.

The changes that we've got now is due to the regulations that each country where the casinos are operating. They have now been strict than ever before.

Those days were just going to be missed but I don't think that we'll be back there. Maybe if a company tries to do that again, until they've noticed, they can remain to be the same as the older ones but players these days are looking for more validity and licenses.

If we should go by the year, bitcoin price would be less than $1k, winning 100btc wouldn't be a problem since it hasn't get the attention of the regulatory bodies and mass adoption. Many didn't see bitcoin as big thing then and free market money wasn't there too but since the emergence of AML schemes, they began Crack down of different payment medium that has to do with crypto payment making a mandatory kyc for all. Some Companies that weren't ready for that close down and new people comes in to the market and change the system.
Since we still some casinos who play without kyc, then there shouldn't be a problem at all.

I would guess that even with a casino, even with defi, even with a stablecoin, whatever tron does there aren't enough people who trust them to put their money in there. The only thing that made people use tron at least a bit, was the fact that it was the cheapest network to move USDT around, and many people used that, but nowadays there are other stablecoins people use on other networks and that is the way it goes for the time being.

I feel like on-chain is gone, satoshidice was the only one that worked, erikvoorhees made all the money he could and since primedice-justdice period there hasn't been any successful one that stands today, and won't be one.

I have a cool memory about DirectBet. It was so beautiful, so easy to play, and they had every type of game. Easy payment (in automatic) and you've only to choice your bet. I used to play to Hi Lo in that site, when they

closed I was so sad. Hope as you said that another platform like that will be opened some day. But I don't think, considering issue about regulation and law.

Those time had gone and onchain gambling is now limited and people don't play it again like them that it was a tog of town that we couldn't do without it a single week. The new era had come and we all are embrace the crypto era where we can play games anonymously with having to submit our identities to gambling platforms before we play or withdraw our money from these platforms.

Since it was completely Anionomas for playing games.  So it was a great site. Now it is very difficult to find such a site. All sites are making kyc requested for withdrawal and depositing. Which is a really annoying thing.  and it is also risky

Yes, during the old times bitcoin wasn't getting attention and even if you win thousands of it then others just have to convert that automatically based on the market value.

Everyone is now amazed on how much it is and despite that it came from the ATH and got this low, still its current price is still high which is taking attention still that it a huge drop came.

I think I already heard that site being talk about here. Is the full link called directbet.eu? Haven't tried it yet but can you tell what happened to that site? So many old sites are still alive up until now but maybe there are some changes that have been made like adding license on it and regulating it because we know, crypto and gambling are two of the popular things now and like what livingfree said there are now huge amount of money on these fields.

We need to embrace the change or else quit on it permanently. Chain or onchain but as long as the game is lottery, I also think that was not interesting as other casino games and the chance to win a prize on the lottery is also much harder.

Everything changes, as businesses and gambling casinos these days have been more regulated to be more safe and secured not only for the operators alone, but also for the players. The authorities have seen this coming, and for that KYC has been more established and strictly imposed. Although some still prefer the old and traditional way of gambling, but in most of the new generation these days, they have learn to love the new ways of gambling.

new online crypto gamblers are trusting casinos or bookies which have their gambling license. it was not a thing before because crypto casinos were just in the early days. but as the adoption of crypto market increases, regulation is needed to avoid the rampant scamming of people. hence, those casinos which acquire their legit gaming license will have to ask KYC from their players if needed, this is to follow the regulations set to them

You know that is not every country that knows cryptocurrency and it's not every country also that knows that cryptocurrency can be used for gambling if not the bitcointalk forum which many people or millions of people find yourself into it and the thing expand their knowledge of understanding cryptocurrency and its usefulness so many of us we don't have known that cryptocurrency is a possible way or the easiest way of gambling as a result of payment

....we all miss the old time and things and stuff - there are so many memories attached to them
But dont you think that the modern world has brought so much good change in the gambling world