Bitcoin Forum

At the beginning of this month (May 2022), a house was sold in Portugal, in which it was fully paid for with Bitcoin. This was made possible, thanks to a new decree of law that allows crypto exchanges for houses. The house cost 3BTC at the time and it was all done legally.

You can find out more in these news:
EN: https://finbold.com/house-in-portugal-sold-for-3-bitcoins-in-a-historic-first-ever-direct-sale/
PT: https://www.idealista.pt/news/imobiliario/habitacao/2022/05/06/52164-casa-em-braga-e-comprada-por-3-bitcoins-e-a-1a-transacao-100-cripto


But the highlight now goes to the platform created by the real estate company responsible for this sale, where it lists all the properties that can be acquired with Bitcoin.

Cryptohouses (https://cryptohouses.pt/)

In addition to presenting a series of properties available to buy with Bitcoin, the company still gives full legal support so that everything is done according to the law.


___
NOTE: I have no connection to this property, I'm just sharing the information. I'm from Portugal and I can give you a few more details.

I used to think that once the parties agree to buy or sell homes with bitcoin, the transaction can take place and you don't need to have a special law allowing that? In other words, if a buyer and I agree to pay in Bitcoin, do we need to check the law before registering the contract?

Overall, although it is a rare case, the growth in the use of Bitcoin is on the rise and soon we will hear more similar stories.
The funny side is that the user has sold Bitcoin before the last crash.

There may even be the possibility of making a specific contract for this.
But, making a deed regarding the purchase/sale of a house, you must follow the laws of each country for this type of property.
That is, although before you could make a specific contract for this type of situation, now in Portugal you can make this type of purchase according to the normal rules for buying a house.

It looks like Portugal is standing out in bitcoin adoption and usage as currency, congratulations. As I see, there is a decent number of offers disponible at the real estate website displaying properties for sale.

For me the prices looked a bit salty. I thought houses in Portugal were cheaper, or maybe is it more expensive on this site because they are dealing with bitcoin?

Does it mean besides the costs in bitcoin for the property, the buyer has to pay extra costs for the deed of sale and registering the property (taxes to the government), right?

I  never understood how bitcoin can be used in large scale buyings like these.the coin itself is not stable and highly volatile and although this may be fun and all in a bull market but in the bear case as we stand today that BTC you recieved can lose 1/2% of its value in a day.For 3btc + transactions this is alot of money and an unessecary risk taken by the sellr.

I don't think btc was supposed to be used like there,not unless it got severly regulated or backed more.

By looking the website few times I observed the values of the properties fluctuate a lot. I guess there is a fixed value in fiat for each offer and the site is configurated to follow bitcoin market's quotation in real time. The more expensive bitcoin gets, the less you pay for the house/land and the cheaper bitcoin gets, the more you pay. But even in this case, when the market is heavily volatile it can be annoying to close a deal...

One of the properties, for example, was pricing 130BTC, and after few minutes when I checked again it was 129.7BTC.

The price of houses in Portugal is very high, unfortunately. For example, a house in Lisbon (the capital) hardly sells below $400k.
And although the person buys the house in Bitcoin, he will have to pay the deed and the respective taxes in fiat.




This is very subjective. You say it's a risk for the seller, but the same goes for the buyer.
Now that the price is down, it was a risk for the seller. But when the price goes up again, it's already a risk for the buyer.

Then it all depends on how much Bitcoin you have. For those who have hundreds of Bitcoin saved, maybe it pays to make this type of purchase, rather than converting into fiat and paying capital gains (in Portugal you don't pay).




In turn, the price is fixed in the act of deed. That is, the exchange rate of the day is the amount paid for the house.

That's really annoying to see those changes because if there's a huge volume involve for sure every movement of the market hurts especially when your receive amount is still pending and the price of bitcoins keep falling so for sure the receiver of that amount will get disappointed  for what they encounter. But lets just see if there's something good deals with this since for sure the buyer or seller compensate and consider the volatility when making a deal.

But when the seller accepts to sell with Bitcoin, it makes no sense to be thinking about converting into fiat right away. It makes no sense.
And we come back to the same. The risk is for both sides, the price can go up or down, so it becomes risky again for the buyer/seller.

Depends, for example in the UK there's something called a stamp duty, which is basically a tax on a house purchase over a certain threshold, so if you did go above that threshold, then yeah you would need to pay the tax on that.

Other countries might have different things too, plus you're going to need solicitors to sign off all the paperwork to be above board. Anyway, it's always best to make sure you're ticking every box you can when it comes to big purchases. So, consulting with legal representatives is always recommended.

I do not see any problems purchasing with Bitcoin, however what  I see as a problem is getting Bitcoin as it is very expensive for regular people. I think if someone has Bitcoin he should hold it for at least 10 years.

You cannot forget who mines Bitcoin, or who entered the Bitcoin universe 10 years ago. Not to mention the miners.
Believe me, there are a lot of good people, who have a good ten (not to say hundreds) of Bitcoin saved.

bitcoin has now become a legal tender in several countries after EL-salvador because bitcoin is now one of the right choices to avoid taxes and other fees for buying land Houses and goods that are good for investment I'm sure later all countries will probably can accept Bitcoin presence

This is the reason why there are more countries has been undecided until now when it comes to Bitcoin legalization.  Because possible people can invade to pay tax which we know is the only way our government system way of surviving, it's through tax.

Back to the OP's topic.
If Bitcoin isn't completely illegal in your country you can use your Bitcoin to purchase houses, cars, or any assets that you want.
Not only in Portugal, but even in my place I saw there's a house and lot for sale in 4 Bitcoin.  But I think as a buyer, you should contact a lawyer and ask advice for on this matter first to know further if you aren't violating the law.

Common thing, the transaction of selling or buying a house is paid for with bitcoin, in singapore the same thing has happened as in portugal, actually more or less like this I mean a transaction if the first party and the second party agree to pay with Bitcoin, even though it's not legal from the government, I think it's fine, as long as both parties are ok.

However, if the house buying/selling system is legally implemented by the local government, it might be extraordinary, I'd be more than happy to see that 70% of properties can be paid for in Bitcoin.

The point is the same. In Portugal, the regulations for the purchase and sale of real estate contemplate the possibility of using Bitcoin directly, without conversion.

Property values can fluctuate more than bitcoin, depending on how interested buyers are in seeing them. Maybe you will get a very different offer price between 2 buyers at the same time.
Because real estate investing isn't just about value growth in the next few days, but months or years like bitcoin. So, price slippage should be tolerable.

You know, I like to read these kinds of stuff but seriously, it's not such a big deal.

I could sell a car here for Bitcoin if I wanted to, just need to convince someone, or even just get a Localbitcoin guy to act as escrow, it's no problem. That's probably what the agent in Portugal does anyway, have an escrow for the BTC and then probably ends up selling it for fiat anyway right?

I mean, it's just publicity, still, good to know.

Portugal has been Bitcoin friendly for a while now. For residents they dont collect
capital gains tax on Bitcoin transactions either.


Bitcoin amounts dont fluctuate, its the FIAT value which fluctuates. Everyone knows
Bitcoin is going one way but you have to look to the future.

If the buyer is happy to spend Bitcoin in a bear market the seller should be prepared to
HODL until the bull market.

Portugal is rich country - people are educated and streets are clean. So there are educated people, the one how sold the coin would have invested in them long ago.
What a great planner he is to have done saving - and purchased his house. Has the government legalised the bitcoin in the country.

Money transfers can be done in any way you want. In government institutions, when the sale is made officially, it is asked whether a money agreement has been made. If both parties agree to pay in bitcoin, it's okay. The transaction can be made at the current value of the current bitcoin. The seller of the house can instantly change the amount he wants to any currency he wants.

the biggest problem with this is undoubtedly the volatility of bitcoin. if a person takes 1 BTC = 50,000$ and buys a house that costs 50,000$, the buyer accepts to receive 1 BTC and months later the 1 BTC is worth 25,000$ then this home seller will be at a 50% loss, and the guy who bought a house will have made the best deal of his life, especially if he is a guy who bought bitcoin for the price of 10,000$, honestly this cryptocurrency market is for the smart ones, there will always be people who lost a lot of money if they accept bitcoin as a method of payment. payment in times when the price is too high

Bitcoin has now become a legal tender in several countries as Bitcoin is now a viable option to avoid taxes and other fees for buying land that is a good home for investment and things that are good for investment, I'm sure all countries will be able to accept Bitcoin' s  presence in the future  , But bitcoin is illegal in our Bangladesh, it is very sad for us

To buy house with Bitcoin is a nice development because almost everything in this world today is going digital and making things easier for us. I wish my country will legalize the use of Bitcoin to acquire house and other physical assets. This will really attract more investors to the Bitcoin ecosystem.

it's not a big problem in my opinion, he bought at today's price (at the exchange rate when he bought it, it doesn't matter) besides the price of the house will continue to rise, from the seller's side if he is a crypto player, they will know the bitcoin is resold or keep on hold. the problem is the government's provisions on tax and legality matters.

It sounds very cool, because it puts the bitcoin payment system to a whole other level. If further the cryptocurrency will be accepted as now, then the time will come when we will have no problem paying for groceries or if we do repairs, we buy for example glass doors (https://www.internaldoors.co.uk/internal-doors/glazed), just by paying with a bitcoin card. That's what my brother did recently, when he bought doors and windows for his house. Hopefully soon politicians will come to debates and make a decision to legalize cryptocurrency.

Although it is not an official means of payment, it is possible to use Bitcoin to buy products in some places. There aren't many, but there are some.

In this specific case, the purchase of the property was possible, because the exchange between houses and goods is allowed, and bitcoin is considered a good. But that did not relieve the buyer and seller of paying their respective taxes.

This is excellent news. I had already heard that Portugal is a bitcoin friendly nation but I didn't know that you can even purhase y a house with BTC.
This demonstrates that whoever governs Portugal has a modern vision of current society and all countries should follow their example : favoring additional means of payment for the circulation of goods and services can only benefit the economy of a society and the well-being of its citizens.

Yes, it is possible to buy, in the form of barter, that is, as if it were an exchange of goods. Now taxes still have to be paid with fiat.

However, from 2023 the laws have changed a bit, and Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies will start paying taxes on capital gains. But only those acquired less than a year ago. That is, it will become a great country for holders.  :P

I agree with the part that allows the contract to go through the law instead of just making a p2p contract even though Bitcoin's decentralized nature allows us to do that, but not with properties like a house that requires some legal paper work, such as a change of ownership document that will be issued by the government and possible change of names on the documents of the house.
Portugal is one of the Bitcoin friendly Africa countries with their recent law that allows access to the use of Bitcoin in some specific areas of the economy, allowing bitcoin holders to freely choose and control their privacy and providing regulatory frameworks to support Bitcoin transactions.

Portugal is not an African country! Portugal is a European country, which is part of the European Union.
https://goo.gl/maps/wVuXfLhcLXNGxMfU6

At this moment, there are already some laws favorable to Bitcoin, mainly for holders, since from 2023 only cryptocurrencies that are converted into fiat and that were acquired less than a year ago will pay taxes. There are some legal requirements for exchanges and other companies working in cryptocurrency.

This makes no difference to me especially when the prices of properties are fixed on fiat values. I can simply exchange my crypto to buy a house. And most importantly, taxes are still paid with fiat. I see this helps with exchanging but we still have to do exchanges to pay taxes and stuff.

I think the main focus should be on governments instead of free market.

This is true in a way.

But it also allows you not to have to make an immediate exchange of so much money at the same time.
It's easier to convert $1k or $2k to pay taxes instead of having to convert $200k to pay the house.

Yes, they`re enviable! This`s a reasonable decision, apparently the legislation decided to take advantage of crypto as another source of tax revenue than to completely ban it. The idea of moving abroad does not leave me, I had a problem with getting a loan, as my type of income isn`t quite official. I once read an article https://algarveprop.com/finding-cheap-properties-in-the-algarve-portugal/ when I got interested in buying an apartment abroad. I`m still contemplating this step, as I`m not sure yet if I want to live in another country on a permanent basis. With such updates the idea makes sense, at least to me.

Yes, it's much more convenient to not have to exchange crypto to fiat, so you avoid conversion and withdrawal fees. For someone who is actively working with crypto, dealing with bitcoin all the time it's great, especially if this person is coming from a foreigner country to Portugal, what must be the situation of many called digital nomads.

I imagine that to bring fiat from one country to another in order to settle yourself there as citizen is much more bureaucratic than bringing bitcoin.

Especially because converting large amounts of BTC at once can complicate the entry of money into fiat in traditional banking. Since they usually want to know the origin of the money, due to legislation against tax fraud and money laundering. It is not always easy to justify the BTC source money, especially if it is very large amounts or from the first holders.

Wow! This is good I wish my country will support the use of btc as a means of exchange. It will also help those of us that are still small traders to maintain the use and hold of cryptocurrency. Imagine using btc to buy goods worth as little as $100, I will be save from any inconveniences associated with the banks.

This is possible anywhere in the world as long as the merchant accepts BTC.
Hence everyone's work, we try to motivate merchants to adopt Bitcoin as a means of payment.

Involvement of Government in BTC transaction somewhat makes it non-acceptable as BTC is meant to be a P2P transaction coin.

Involvement of third man in here make me sad, but as it is a transaction where laws are involved, so it makes sense. Without this, you can't hand over one's property to someone. And if someone makes an accusation of fraud or hijacking their property, without proper documents you can't defend yourself.
Now it is what it is. If this is how BTC will spread all around the world, then I have no complaint about it. It is a good thing.
I am wondering when my country will allow us to use BTC.

Part of the reasons why most government opposes the use of bitcoin as means of exchange in their country is due to the tax free fees transactions associated with BTC unlike  the traditional banking process with fiat money. And almost all government in the world depends on taxes and internally generated revenues. Perhaps the reason they're against digital decentralized currency operations.

It is excellent to buy a house with bitcoins in Portugal since Portugal is a country that is friendly to cryptocurrencies, it treats bitcoin as any other currency, it is a form of payment, and it is an entirely tax-exempt asset, Portugal ranked first in the best places to live in a survey last year for one of the sites, and it is a suitable country for buying real estate and living in it, and Portugal is working to be one of the most innovative European countries in technology and economy, and it is worth noting that Portugal is not the only one that is friendly to Bitcoin, there are Germany, Malta, and Switzerland.

The future of Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies will, with time, shine, and all countries of the world will adopt this industry, and people will be able to use Crypto as a payment method in their real life in any of their financial dealings; it is only a matter of time before this dependence prevail.

Governments are afraid of bitcoin because they think that they can't track how much crypto everyone has and also they can't collect taxes on it. They are wrong because the bitcoin blockchain is like an open ledger and every transaction and wallet can be traced.


I hope this bitcoin adoption take place quickly so people like us can also buy houses, plot, and other things using crypto. Till that time, we only have one option to first convert bitcoin into fiat and then buy from that converted cash.

You know, the question on my mind right is;
Even should bitcoin be approved to be used in such large transactions, are people really getting down with it, using it to transact?

The idea at the moment, at least for most persons remains that you should hold. The more your able to hold as per volume and time, the more your likely to benefit from your holding as per multiples.

So, would we really ant to go down that lane at the moment?
Am not so sure I would but, when it comes to petty transactions, its a lot easier not to think the profit that would have come with it.

I think this has been the problem for greater adoption of Bitcoin for transactions. While you are always thinking that the amount spent today will be worth more or less tomorrow, you never come out at the same level.

You have to start not thinking about it all the time. We don't know the future, the purchase is today and that's what we have to think about.

Bitcoin is now being traded in all countries around the world. You can earn money working in Bitcoin even from your Bangladesh. You may have to work a little incognito. Although there is a little administrative fear. Still I think there is no such problem to earn money working in Bitcoin from Bangladesh. Even though there is no legal status in Bangladesh, you are simply working there without paying any government tax. Countries where bitcoins are legal have a 30 to 35% tax. But keep in mind that when bitcoin legalization will be officially launched in all countries around the world, I think bitcoin legalization will also be launched in your Bangladesh.

But it is very difficult to say whether Bitcoin will be legalized in Bangladesh. Bangladesh is technologically far behind compared to the unique countries of the world.  70-80% people of this country don't know about Bitcoin. So when Bitcoin transactions are launched in this country, people of this country will not understand about its valuation. If people don't know the proper use of Bitcoin, they will lose a lot of money by investing there.

Kudos to both the person selling the home and the person buying the home for making such a great decision. With this transaction I think Bitcoin moved forward a bit more.  Currently we see a lot of news related to Bitcoin where big transactions are organized through Bitcoin. I think Bitcoin will touch more new milestones as time goes on.

It is true that due to Bitcoin's peer-to-peer system, if any two persons agree to sell something, there is no obstacle. But the current condition of Bangladesh will never be advisable to do such a large transaction through Bitcoin.  Because cryptocurrency has been declared strictly illegal here and those who transact through it are currently being arrested.
And since all the people of Bangladesh are still not aware of crypto currency, I think no one in this country will take such big risks to sell their property.  So buying a house or property in Bangladesh without any hindrance by Bitcoin will still be very difficult in Bangladesh.

Undoubtedly, this news is very positive for Bitcoin. I would especially like to thank the buyer and seller of that house in Portugal for making such a good decision. Hopefully this news will spread worldwide soon and people's confidence and trust in Bitcoin will increase. And in the future people will use Bitcoin for larger transactions. This is how I think Bitcoin will slowly become one of the digital medium of transactions.

transacting with bitcoin will definitely be a massive choice for many people in the future because it is very efficient, fast and the fees are cheap. i started selling my old stuff and accept optional payment with bitcoin, even though the majority of the buyers who have bought old stuff i don't understand what bitcoin is but i'm sure in the future it will change. buying a house with bitcoin like in Portugal is brilliant.

yes positive for bitcoin volume transactions, this will not good if the buyer who owns the bitcoin seller has sold out his bitcoin to fiat. of course, this will the same as fiat payment, it will the same if the buyer pays with bitcoin and sold it asap. with this new we only hope he hold the btc or he changes his mind to change investment from property to gold.

This is the news I saw in the crypto industry that someone bought a house and land with 3 Bitcoins. Because before, I've seen a project come out here in cryptocurrency that the concept of the project was real estate, but it didn't succeed as far as I know, I can't even remember what year.

      But as far as I know, you can actually make a transaction like that where you pay in bitcoin, that depends on if the seller is open to this kind of payment options.

There have been a lot of such purchases and transactions in the mainstream world using Bitcoin as a mode of payment in the past. I don't deny the fact that such things contribute positively towards Bitcoin's adoption, but I also think that things will need to be on a higher level from this for the world to realize the real potential of Bitcoin.

Bitcoin is already pretty widespread around every corner of the world, and more than 50% of the world's population must already know what Bitcoin is, but the main thing is adoption and we definitely need more of that in the long run.

You are correct in what you said, bitcoin is known in all countries around the world today, although it is not included in the stock market, but when it comes to other things, bitcoin can be traded in various trading platforms and even in forex it is also there.

And hopefully, the time will come when no matter which country we are in, bitcoin can be a legal payment option for buying houses and land.

With the change of time, the prevalence of various transactions through Bitcoin is increasing day by day. There are many countries in Europe that use Bitcoin to buy their daily necessities. The use of paper money is decreasing day by day and now people are finding it more convenient to carry money online. While paper money can be lost or stolen, digital currency does not have this problem. So people now prefer to keep more amount of money in their digital wallets.  Hopefully Bitcoin will one day become one of the medium of transactions when people will buy all their necessities with Bitcoin.

Since the first deed for the purchase of a house with Bitcoin was made, a year ago, 13 houses have already been purchased using crypto as payment.

Even during this bear in the crypto market, people are still willing to buy houses with Bitcoin, according to recent news.

Here is the article in Portuguese on this subject:
https://24.sapo.pt/atualidade/artigos/ja-foram-feitas-13-escrituras-de-casas-em-portugal-com-moedas-digitais-a-primeira-em-maio-de-2022

If you want to know any details, you can tell.  ;)

Buying and selling a house through Bitcoin is a great news for us. I would like to thank the two gentlemen who have undertaken this noble initiative. I am very happy and motivated to read this news. 

When someone dreams about something, it feels really good when someone else realizes his dream. I also have some plans for Bitcoin. If I can implement that plan then I will be very happy. 

The two men behind the purchase and sale of the house in Portugal have a strong faith in Bitcoin, which is why they took such a big decision. Their decision is really commendable.

There have already been 13 purchases/sales of homes carried out with Bitcoin.
That is, there are more and more people trusting bitcoin and using it to buy high-value goods, such as a house (and houses in Portugal are at very inflated prices).

Buying house with btc as a payment is seems very interesting. I always dreamed to buy some big things(Bike, Car) and pay via Btc but unfortunately because of my country not allowing i am not yet able to fulfill my dream. Btc is most trusted crypto coin and its available in many Europe countries. whenever i see news of number of btc Atm placing in any country I also wish that this happens in our country.

I hope that one day everyone will be able to buy through Btc. journey of btc from 2009 to 2023 is very interesting and it is a sign of its success that many countries have accepted it as payment .

This proves that slowly people's trust and confidence in Bitcoin is increasing. According to your information about 13 houses have been bought and sold through Bitcoin transactions so far. Its number may increase. We know the news that is usually published.  Maybe there is a lot of news that we don't know. Some buyers or sellers may have bought and sold their homes with Bitcoin without telling anyone. But in any case, Bitcoin is making progress. 

We want people to not limit their Bitcoin transactions to just buying and selling houses. Let people use Bitcoin as a means of transaction in other areas as well.

All home purchases and sales must be carried out under contract, in front of a notary. And in that contract, it must be registered whether they were acquired by fiat or crypto.

According to the Order of Notaries of Portugal, to date, 13 purchases have been made using crypto. But, according to one of the main real estate companies carrying out this type of process, it indicates that there are forecasts for a few more crypto sales by the end of the year.

You can use your Bitcoin to buy any assets you desire, provided that Bitcoin isn't outright forbidden in your nation. To find out for sure if you aren't breaking the law, I believe that as a buyer, you should first speak with a lawyer and ask for guidance on this topic. I've always wanted to purchase some large items (a bike or a car) and pay with bitcoin, but sadly my nation does not yet permit it, therefore I am unable to realize this desire. The most reliable cryptocurrency is bitcoin, which is accessible in many European nations. Every time I read about the installation of bitcoin ATMs in other nations, I fervently hope that our nation would follow suit.

It's definitely good for Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies in general since it made it to the news and that will trigger more adoption or will at least spread more awareness among Bitcoin illiterate people of Portugal or any country in the world where the news is seen. Such events and trades are proof that Bitcoin can be used as a currency to buy things and isn't just an investment asset anymore.

The world around us mostly thinks that Bitcoin is nothing else than an investment opportunity while they lack the knowledge that Bitcoin wasn't created to be a store of wealth but was created to be a peer-to-peer money-transferring digital currency that is decentralized.

These are promising numbers considering the service is more or less a year old, plus one could say most crypto holders may be reluctant to spend their BTC's on high value goods but perhaps these buyers are just too loaded to care :D

Interesting data from wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_home_ownership_rate) says Portugal has 73.9% home-ownership rate which is pretty high. My guess is this probably played a part as home-ownership appears to be more on the norm side there indicating some locals may see it as an essential thereby making people more motivated to trigger the purchase button despite their inflated prices and bitcoin's long term potential.

Yes, in Portugal it is very common to buy a house instead of renting it, as the cost is practically the same. In many cases the monthly loan fee is lower than the monthly rental fee. That's why people in Portugal end up buying a house whenever they can.

Of course, at this time of interest rate hikes, things get more complicated. But also the rental prices are so inflated, it gets complicated in both cases.

Buying a house with Bitcoin, for those who have this ability, to get rid of monthly fees and save hundreds of euros every month.

A very good trend is that people have started accepting payment for real estate in Bitcoins. I am surprised by the fact that it is more profitable to buy an apartment than to rent, in my country the situation is completely different.

Just to give you an idea, in Lisbon, anyone who wants to rent a house pays twice as much as someone who has to pay a bank loan, even at this time of high interest rates.

So, if you have any possibility, which option to choose? If I had that option I would choose to buy instead of renting.

There's rent to own option on other country so much better to take that option if you can't afford to buy at the moment so that after years which agreed where the payment would last you can acquire that property unlike renting it without anything in return.

But much advisable with this option is to really buy a house since you cannot get any problem regarding on those monthly payment plus you can get this at much lesser rate compare to other options you are thinking of.

Accepting bitcoin as payment is really possible, it depends on the person you are talking to if they know the concept of bitcoin, which means that no matter what type of business type it is, bitcoin can really be used.

        Now, if bitcoin was used to buy a house in Portugal, it is because the seller himself may have had knowledge of bitcoin for a long time and besides that, it is also for sure that he is also a bitcoin holder in my opinion.

This is true to a certain extent. There are purchases that require legal records, and the law must authorize the purchase to be made using bitcoin.

This happens when buying a home. For everything to be legal, there has to be a deed according to the laws of the country. And at the time of the deed, it must be recorded how the house was paid for. If the law does not authorize the use of bitcoin, a direct purchase using bitcoin cannot be made.

In Portugal, at the moment, it is not necessary to convert bitcoin into fiat in order to be able to buy a house. But of course you have to pay taxes on that purchase in fiat.

This is a great move of Bitcoin adoption and usefulness in Crypto space.

With the look of things, bitcoins will have more use cases as it become accepted by the government, however there will definitely be some regulations in terms of some use cases.

It will be a really good experience to buy the house with Bitcoin. This news will really inspire Bitcoin users. Because this event is very rare, the use of Bitcoin is increasing and soon investors will invest more.We will hear more similar stories of properties available to buy with Bitcoin.Bitcoin usage gives complete legal support to the buyers so that everything is done according to the law. So those countries will increase bitcoin transactions and everyone will be more interested in bitcoin. We want to facilitate such legal opportunities in all countries.

When in a country you can buy and sell houses using bitcoin, means that you can buy/sell anything directly in Bitcoins and the government and financial institutions are no objection to these transactions. This is indeed great progress and i wished other country's governments also give such freedom to their citizens.
In my country, we can't think of buying a house with Bitcoin because every buy sell needs to be through the banking channel as governments do not support and recognize the use of cryptocurrencies.

Portugal is a great place to buy a house with bitcoins because it accepts cryptocurrencies well, treats bitcoin as a form of payment and as a fully tax-exempt asset, came in first place in a survey of the best places to live last year for one of the sites, is a good place to buy real estate and live in it, and is working to become one of the most technologically advanced European nations.

At the moment, taxes are already paid on capital gains in crypto, but with some advantages.

It is only taxed on the crypto you buy in the previous year. If you don't buy anything and sell it after two years, you no longer pay any tax.

It is truly fascinating to delve into the intersection of Portugal and Bitcoin as discussed in various online media outlets. In fact, rumor has it that a significant number of immigrants from countries such as Italy and France have flocked to Portugal to bask in the liberty of utilizing cryptocurrency without incurring any tax liabilities. Can it be surmised that Portugal lacks regulations that govern the taxation of cryptocurrency?

Additionally, I would be most intrigued to ascertain the degree to which Bitcoin has been adopted as a mainstream means of purchasing real estate. If you could provide me with an estimate, expressed in percentage terms, of the number of homes purchased in Portugal through Bitcoin, it would be greatly appreciated. What is the estimated percentage of real estate transactions in Portugal that utilize Bitcoin as a means of payment?

In one year at least 13-15 properties were purchased using cryptocurrencies.

Perhaps within a year or two, with changes in the rules of the European Union, changes in taxation may arise, but for now no changes are foreseen.

Nice catch for Portugal!
However one of the first country or probably the first country in the world that allow these kind of transaction is Italy since 2017 123 Apartments in Rome were available with crypto.
https://www.wired.it/economia/finanza/2017/04/05/prima-casa-bitcoin/
It's interesting there are these opportunities available, but I have not find any update about number of houses sold during these years.

It's pretty surprising how the authorities in Portugal are yet to impose any taxes or many regulations for the usage of cryptocurrencies, especially with real estate transactions increasing over time. We all know how serious authorities take the transactions and taxes when it comes to real estate, if people are able to easily make deals using cryptocurrencies, it's great.

But as you said, I doubt it will be the case for very long, and they will probably start imposing rules and regulations soon for any transactions or deals made using Bitcoin or any other cryptocurrency in general.

But even if you buy real estate using bitcoin, you have to pay all the taxes equivalent to a purchase made using fiat.
On the day of the deed, the exchange of the amounts involved is calculated, then the taxes on these amounts are calculated, which the buyer/seller will then have to pay in fiat.

We can not only use Bitcoin as an investment platform but we can also use Bitcoin for other purposes or transactions.  Two gentlemen from Portugal have proved that large transactions are possible with Bitcoin. Bitcoin is not the only digital currency now but Bitcoin has been announced as an alternative currency of a country. 

A few days ago, El Salvador added a new currency in addition to the currency of their country, the US dollar, that currency is Bitcoin. And they have the facility to transact directly through Bitcoin to purchase various things in their country. That is, if we consider all these things, we can understand how much the popularity of Bitcoin is increasing day by day.

I wonder does the tax breaks extend to only citizens of Portugal or can foreigners also benefit from the tax exemptions on the home purchases?

Most home buying is not tax free.

Either way, foreigners also benefit from the same conditions. In some cases, depending on the investment made, they may even have benefits.

I will do some research when I have some more time later today, as I would like to see how it would benefit me as a foreign to buy a home there using bitcoin. The home prices in Portugal are much more affordable than the home prices in New York.

Bitcoin was never meant to be an investment asset, it was created to be a currency that will be an alternative to traditional currencies and provide decentralization to its users unlike the fiat currencies which are centralized and are in total control of traditional financial institutions for centuries and nothing has ever changed.

Large transactions are of course possible using Bitcoin but it is only a matter of allowance and acceptance within the country where you and the seller live in. Portugal seems to be pretty friendly so far with cryptocurrency deals, and I hope that it continues to be that way.

I think all the benefits that you might get using Bitcoin to buy a property in Portugal being a foreigner is the difference in the prices of properties in your country and Portugal as you said. Properties in New York would obviously be much more expensive considering it is one of the busiest and in-demand cities of the world today.

You will still be paying taxes and everything even if you make the transaction using Bitcoins as described by OP in an earlier post. So your benefit will be that you will be saving a good chunk of money on the property based on its price.

Yes, but still no. The good chunk of money you'll be saving doesn't come from the price of the property being lower in Portugal (compared to NYC I agree, but compared to most countries in the world, Portugal is more expensive, it's not an underdeveloped country), but because the gains are not a taxable event there.

If you bought 10 BTC at 50 EUR each, hodled, and now you buy a house with these 10 BTC, you only have to pay the regular taxes anyone must pay (VAT, licenses, property registration fees...) but not for the gains anymore, whether you live there or not. This doesn't happen in most countries, where you should pay not only for the purchase of the house, but for the gains also:

10 BTC * 50€ = 500€ price @ you bought.
10 BTC* 27.000€ = 270.000€ price @ you sell.
270.000€ - 500€ = 265.500€ your capital gains.
265.500* 25%¹ = 66.375€ in taxes you should pay otherwise, but not in Portugal.

¹(25% is just an example and varies between countries)

As we are neighbours, this exemption is well known here in Spain, and some Spanish bitcoiners have already temporarily emigrated to the Portuguese country.

Interesting! I had no idea about this situation.

But have you been buying a house in Portugal or are you just renting?

Neither one nor the other: I'm living in Spain and have no plans to emigrate long-term, but among those who know Bitcoin relatively well in Spain it is known that, if you stay more than 6 months in Portugal, you pay your taxes there, and since gains from cryptos are not a taxable event there, you can withdraw/exchange for fiat for free.

I remember a couple of TV programmes explaining the situation, with interviews to not only Spaniards but people from other countries too, who were living in Portugal for a few months and/or buying houses there. There was even an agency with travel plans etc. so they managed everything and holders simply enjoyed their vacations.

I know that there are agencies that help in this process. But I had no idea that Spaniards linked to crypto were coming here. The fine is also usually discreet and therefore ends up being normal.

I also believe that most of these people don't come to more urban areas, like Lisbon. Prefer to stay in Alentejo and Algarve (warmer weather and better beaches).

Yes the popularity of Bitcoin is increasing day by day. At one time people did not know Bitcoin well. Now everyone is starting to bring Bitcoin to the forefront of transactions. Due to corruption in various bank ditches people are now starting to invest in Bitcoin. From here we can see how popular Bitcoin has become to people. Today we saw in a news that Bitcoin tower will be built in Dubai. If the Bitcoin tower is built in Dubai then surely we can say that the popularity of Bitcoin has reached its peak. If successful in building the Bitcoin Tower in Dubai, Bitcoin will be officially launched. So from here we can say that Bitcoin has gained a lot of popularity.

I guess that this is because, between Portugal and El Salvador, the former is much nearer from us and the language is not a big problem either :P.

As far as I know, yes, people tend to go more to coastal or touristic areas rather than the city. The plan normally is to go there and enjoy while others take care of their business and amusement for 6 months in some good paid holidays, much cheaper than simply staying at home in their homeland.

Linked to the title of this thread, some people do this and buy a house in Portugal directly, but others simply move there for 6 months to withdraw and buy the house in Spain. Here, as long as you paid your taxes, you can also buy the house with Bitcoin (a colleague from the Spanish board did it).

Yeah, they should more or less follow the same rules.
From there, you can do things with Bitcoin, what may change later is the taxes and the procedural form.

Dubai is one of the most modern cities. Most of the luxury people of the world usually visit this city. If a Bitcoin tower can be established in Dubai, then only through that one Bitcoin tower can a huge global campaign about Bitcoin be possible. Tourists who are going to travel to Dubai will be curious to know about Bitcoin. When they are interested to know about Bitcoin, different aspects of Bitcoin may appeal to them, which will make them interested in doing transactions through Bitcoin, and thus gradually the transaction system through Bitcoin. will be very popular worldwide.

Currently countries do not have protection for buying and selling with bitcoin. We can only agree to a 2-party transaction.
But we still have to follow the proof of purchase in this country
Pay taxes in the currency there.

I did not understand which country you are talking about. OP said here that two people in Portugal used Bitcoin as a means of transaction to buy and sell houses. That is, the amount that these two men charged for the purchase and sale of the house, they paid the amount through Bitcoin.

I am telling you about a country where you can do anything with Bitcoin. El Salvador is the first country to fully legalize Bitcoin in its own country, allowing you to make any Bitcoin transaction in that country. Not only transactions, but all the things you used to do with dollars or other currencies, you can do those things with Bitcoin in that country. That is, if you want to pay your coffee bill in Bitcoin, you can pay the coffee bill in Bitcoin. Or if your car runs out of gas, you can pay for gas in your car with bitcoins. That means you will get all the benefits of Bitcoin in El Salvador.

El Salvador is one of the developed countries that has officially legalized Bitcoin. Cryptocurrency is fully legal in this country and everything from buying and selling goods to asking for payment is paid in Bitcoin. The country has advanced their economy a lot by doing various transactions through Bitcoin and has become known as one of the most popular countries in the world today. El Salvador has a facility that has a free bitcoin payment system for various transactions. and has provided special facilities for tourists to transact with Bitcoin at various locations. So we can say that all the countries where Bitcoin transactions are completely legal, everything can be done using Bitcoin.

Bitcoin is a very popular name in today's world. The use of Bitcoin is now very high and now a lot of large transactions are being done through this Bitcoin. Transactions as big as buying land and houses are now being done through Bitcoin. That's because you don't have to pay tax if you buy and sell land through Bitcoin. Unfortunately, Bitcoin is illegal in Bangladesh, so even if we want to, we can't do such big transactions like buying land or house through Bitcoin. If bitcoin is legal in our country then we would get its benefits.

El Salvador is truly paving the way for a Bitcoin-dominated future! While it's exciting to see a country fully embracing cryptocurrency, I can't help but wonder about the potential downsides. How will they address the concerns of financial stability, price manipulation, and the impact on their citizens who might not be tech-savvy or have access to reliable internet? It's a brave new world, and El Salvador is at the forefront of it.

For now the potential downside we can see is the bitcoin price volatility since they can control the situation and if the price dump they will be affected since for sure the value or buying power of their owned bitcoins will decrease. Also we can add up the problem if transaction fees goes high since they will also get trouble to do transaction if there's network congestion will happen. But over all this is minimal problem and everything can be solve.

What is the cost of living like in El Salvador? How much would it cost to rent a one bedroom apartment in an upscale neighborhood there?

You may know wrong information about this country because over 90% of people in El Salvador are literate and this Central American country is a technology dependent country. Being a technology-dependent country, the president of this country is using this opportunity, they are accepting Bitcoin as an alternative currency of their country. The President of El Salvador is introducing Bitcoin to citizens and tourists as an alternative currency and medium of exchange.

Food costs or house prices may vary by region. You can collect information about this from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the country where you live.

I agree with what you said, but if you are a particular bitcoin lover and you are also a long-term holder it will not be easy for you to use it as payment for a house that you will buy of course. Instead of paying in Bitcoin, you'd rather pay in cash than use Bitcoin.

Because just think if the value of the House in money you will pay in bitcoin equal to the value of money today. You can even recover the value of the house in money if you hold bitcoin little by little as the day and time pass for sure.

I think the cost of living in El Salvador is much lower, for example when compared to the US. However, I'm pretty sure that it can vary from place to place within El Salvador. For more detailed information you can refer to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs in your country as Litzki1990 suggested.

I think you can also conduct your own research on Google where you are likely to find accurate information. This website (https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/country_result.jsp?country=El+Salvador#:~:text=A%20family%20of%20four%20estimated,lower%20than%20in%20United%20States.) provides a lot of data about the cost of living in El Salvador. You can check it out for more information.

It's not only about a technical difficulties that the El Salvador  citizens might face in order to use bitcoin in day to day life but it is more about how they will cope with the fluctuating bitcoin prices. At one time the bitcoin price was near 60000$+ US dollars and within a year it reach to 16000$ to 17000$ US dollars .
It is really a challenge for the people of El Salvador and bear this fluctuation in bitcoin prices.
You can think that if you buy a house with BTC when bitcoin was at all time high and then if you buy a house with bitcoin was near 20000$, how much difference it is in the value of the house.

A country that has grown to accept BTC as payment is one that may soon adopt it as a legal tender in some years time.
BTC has more than assisted in one way or another. El Salvador is one of the pace setters to say that BTC can work for a country.

I like Portugal, and the fact of their BTC acceptance for payments. One fact though is that the government is always going to find way to gain from BTC investments either as taxes or fees, where this don't happen, the government probably invested alot with their portfolio and wouldn't tell you.

From this year (2023), in Portugal, taxes on profits obtained from the sale of crypto in the last 365 days began to be paid. That is, if you buy BTC in January and sell it in December, you may have to pay taxes on that gain. But if you only sell in February of the following year, you no longer pay.

I think generally speaking, it's not a bad option. It's just a matter of the person managing their assets well.

The cost of living in El Salvador is supposed to be several times less than the cost of living in America. But the cost of staying there depends on how you stay. That is, if you want to be a citizen of that country, it may be a little easier for you to stay, but if you plan to collect a visa from your country's embassy and live in that country, the cost of living and eating may be higher for you. However, the Embassy of El Salvador or your Ministry of Foreign Affairs may be able to assist you with more information on this matter than we can.

I think it is very good news for all of us who are related with Bitcoin. If Bitcoin legal in Portugal there no problem but Bitcoin were illegal there are some problem. Because government or legal authorities will creat problem and that will creat negative impact on bitcoin and crypto currency market. Overall i think if bitcoin were not illegal in Portugal it will create positive impact on cryptocurrency market. And it will be milestone for Bitcoin. Because usability of bitcoin will increase and Bitcoin will more popular and credible. But i think every country will think positive for bitcoin considering it’s necessity.

So basically, if you are a long-term holder, you will have to pay taxes for holding a certain amount of Bitcoin if it is in profit since you've bought it after one year is completed. It means that Portugal is taxing long-term holders and short-term traders are exempted from this rule, It's obviously great for day traders as they won't need to pay taxes but we all know that the majority of people hold their Bitcoins for pretty long periods which will make them pay taxes if they are living in Portugal.

I forgot to ask, is the tax only payable if the person sells their assets and doesn't apply if they are just holding them? And what if someone sells their Bitcoins at a loss? Say they bought in January when the price was $29k, and they sold them in December when the price was $27k. So they won't pay taxes in this scenario?

I think you misunderstood joker_josue's example. If you are a long-term holder and you hodl for more than a year, then you are not subject to pay taxes in Portugal, from what I understand. Taking into account that historically nobody was forced to pay taxes on crypto profits in the country, this is bad news for many, but I still think that this is a very reasonable policy, the same as Germany's if I'm not wrong, and the one I would like to be applied in Spain.

On the other hand, losses can be used to get a discount in your present or future taxes.

If you are a long term holder of Bitcoin you do not pay tax!!!

I'll give an example:
Buy 1 BTC in 2020, sell in 2023 = pay no tax.
Buy 1 BTC in Jan/2023, sell in Dec/2023 = pay 28% tax on profit.
Buy 1 BTC in Jan/2023, sell in Dec/2024 = pay no tax.

That is, only the profits obtained from purchases and sales during that calendar year will be accounted for payment.
Another example:
Buy 1 BTC in 2020, and buy 1 BTC in Jan/2023. It sells in Dec/2023 2 BTC. You will only pay tax on the profit you made in 1BTC, the other was purchased more than a year ago, it will not be accounted for.

Did I explain the idea?

You have explained it perfectly well joker_josue: I think that the way you have presented the example with real figures there will be no room for doubt.

In summary, the regulation tries to charge the speculators, but leaves alone the long term investors/holders. Although I like the idea, it still poses some risks to newbies who start trading without a clear idea of what they are doing, who can get an unpleasant surprise if they don't manage their transactions properly.

As it seems, due to new regulations, this is going to stop being "just a game" soon.

Yes, you have to know how to manage well.
Buying at times when the person knows they won't sell. Or perhaps using platforms without KYC. And sell only when you know you haven't bought in the last year.

It requires greater management, but in general it was a good measure approved. We'll see how long it lasts.

Bitcoin in Portugal is legal which makes it possible to buy a house in Portugal with Bitcoin. No problem as Bitcoin is legal in Portugal and there is no tax on Bitcoin and Crypto in Portugal. That is why there will not be any problem on Bitcoin but it will create a positive impact on Bitcoin instead of negatively impacting it. And this is really a great milestone for me that will make Bitcoin more popular in the future. They make bitcoin usable because trust depends on it, and this bodes well for bitcoin and the future will gain more popularity.

The fact that Bitcoin is legal in Portugal is why these two gentlemen are able to sell and buy their house with Bitcoin, and the fact that Bitcoin is legal in Portugal has made this news so big. Bitcoin is legal in most of the countries in Europe, so it is very easy to transact with Bitcoin in those countries. If you want to transact through bitcoin then the government of that country will not stop you but you may be hindered by the security aspect of bitcoin. But those who are involved with Bitcoin should not worry about the security system of Bitcoin transaction system because the security system of Bitcoin transaction is good enough so that transactions can be done safely through Bitcoin.

Maybe they are worried about the security since they are dealing with huge amount so maybe that's the reason why they didn't choose to use bitcoin on that transaction. If I am also the seller or buyer I will directly use fist since I can't take to have stress dealing with huge amount and let it sleep on your wallet for 24 hours or more than that since we don't know when the hacking issue comes. Maybe in future if we know that platforms or bitcoins is 100% sure people will gain confidence to use bitcoin on huge transactions especially buying a real estate assets.

It's really nice to hear that houses are currently being bought and sold with Bitcoin. We look at this to understand how much Bitcoin has flourished today and how much it has tried to change the world. Today more and more people accept Bitcoin, and it is possible to buy different products with Bitcoin, since houses sold in Portugal accepted Bitcoin payments, so I think in the future more merchants will accept Bitcoin when selling different things. I believe that Bitcoin will rule the world one day and every country will have different purchases completed with Bitcoin. Since houses are bought in Portugal with bitcoins, I think maybe they will accept bitcoins for buying and selling land in the future.

You should really refrain up bumping threads which had been that no response or not active for 2 weeks but somewhat if the response is relevant then it wont really be that much of an issue.

---

Going back into the topic, any signs or things that correlates with Bitcoin adoption specially on its utility as a payment method then it would be always that giving that positive vibes.
The only thing that i dont like on buying things using up Bitcoin is that you do really miss out the opportunity on making profits on just simply holding it. Well, there are people who do really focuses
or really that giving out importance when it comes into its utility.

Lets show some example about the biggest or one of the expensive houses been bought using  Bitcoin.

In June 2021, when the cryptocurrency markets were soaring, the developers of the Arte condominium in Miami’s Surfside neighborhood announced that a buyer had purchased a penthouse there for $22.5 million in cryptocurrency.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/florida-penthouse-bought-with-crypto-sells-for-18-million-cash-11671732075

Just wow!

The two people in Portugal who bought and sold their house with Bitcoin I think had a plan in advance that they would do this transaction with Bitcoin. Where others do their transactions with Euros or Dollars, these two men may have wanted to do something different in the transaction, which is why they chose Bitcoin as the medium of transaction. Such incidents of theirs have been widely discussed in the world. People are now planning to make big transactions through Bitcoin.
Hopefully this large transaction through Bitcoin will not be limited to Portugal and there will be many more such transactions and all over the world. Such events show the level of popularity Bitcoin has reached and how much more Bitcoin's popularity can grow in the future.

It is, indeed, but if I'm not wrong some of the crypto benefits for foreigners who move there will end in 2024, so it seems that it is becoming little by little a not so friendly country, due to impositions from Europe.

Anyway, as long as I know, you'll be still able to buy a house in Portugal, after paying the corresponding taxes, of course.

The end of incentives for foreigners was not intended for cryptocurrencies, but for all people who came to live in Portugal or bought a house in Portugal.

Portugal continues to be a good destination for those who use crypto, as despite already paying taxes, it only pays tax on profits obtained from the sales of coins purchased in the last year. Anyone who is a holder is an excellent destination.

Thanks for the clarification joker_josue, I read the news a few weeks ago and mixed some concepts in my head. I wasn't totally wrong neither, because if I wanted to buy a house with Bitcoin in your country I'd benefit from double incentives, and as you confirmed, next year they will be less; although it is still much better than nothing, and it is great that long term hodlers are still rewarded the way you mention (not like here in Spain :'().

Two people have bought and sold a house through bitcoin with their own consent but if someone new wants to buy a house through bitcoin from a person is it possible. I mean if a person directly buys a house in Portugal and pays with bitcoins without bilateral negotiation whether the house owner will accept it.

This is amazing. Soon the coins will spread everywhere

I bought my house using bitcoins. The transaction was smooth but it lost value on the long run

In which country did you make this purchase?
Can you provide more details on what this process was like?

This is really surprisimh to me how you were able to buy your own house with Bitcoin and you are still complaining about it. You can always buy any amount of Bitcoin in the market so there is nothing to lose if you have followed the same full step.
It will be a good move when we purchase properties with Bitcoin which is going to be an eye opener to people that have the mindset that Bitcoin cannot be used as a legal tender or purchase goods. By the time Bitcoin is going to surpass the previous high.

You say you made a purchase with Bitcoin, may we know which country you live in and how long ago you made your transaction. You bought a house with Bitcoin so I'm dying to see your house. Can you share pictures of your home here? Most of the discussion in this topic is about a person in Portugal buying a house and a person selling a house and using Bitcoin as a transaction for this purchase and sale. On this subject but here you have shared your own house purchase so if you share different information we can know fully.

I wonder why are you dying to see the house purchased with Bitcoin The house either bought with Bitcoin or bought with fiat money will remain the same and there would be no extraordinary things with that house :D

Anyway, i would like to know how much bitcoins did he spent in order to buy the house as i know that houses are expensive worldwide and if he spent the bitcoin recently to buy the house, then it may not be a wise decision to sell bitcoin in the bear market   ???

What if , he would have bought the house after a year or so, maybe he could have bought two houses in the same amount of bitcoin he spends now. (as bitcoin price will be doubled or even more higher)

If we always think like this, bitcoin will never be used for anything. And I think bitcoin should also be used when needed.

Currently, given the price of the house market (in Portugal) and the price of bitcoin, you currently have to spend 4-5BTC ^minimum to buy a house (in Portugal). For anyone who has a dozen BTC available, I don't think it's a difficult amount to give.

Bitcoin transactions are allowed in Portugal due to which Bitcoin is being traded and traded there. There is no pressure from the government due to which it is very easy for a person to purchase his house through Bitcoin. If it happened in my country it would not be possible at all because Bitcoin is not accepted in my country. Bitcoin has been made illegal by the government of my country, due to which we cannot buy anything with Bitcoin even if we want to. If bitcoin is ever legalized in my country then maybe in my country like Portugal everything will be possible to buy with bitcoin.