Bitcoin Forum

The only way to get people to stop worrying and shying away from Bitcoin, is to banish the volatility aspet of it, naturally.

I put emphasis on the word "naturally" because you cannot force a monetary process to establish itself in a few short years. The price and users must gradually reach an inflection point on their own.

It is similar to implementing the Euro as the official European currency. By no means were the governments rushed to scrap their central bank currencies, they were give ample time (about a decade or two IIRC) to phase it in, in stages.

So Bitcoin, and anything that wants to follow it in market capitalization, must be introduced to the public in phases, which could take a very long time.

The rest of the altcoins that do not stabilize can disappear (e.g. Solana), I have no pity for them as they only serve to give larger cryptocurrencies (and crypto in general) a bad name in the news.

Agree with the fact but how it will be possible when 90% of BTC will be held by big institutes and few individuals in the future. This would be possible if BTC has been evenly distributed or held by people. Whales hold most of the BTC which makes it an ideal asset to manipulate the markets when most of retails investors failed to hold it for long because of their impatience nature.

I do not know. But what I do know is that USD and the currencies of oher big economies is concentrated in the hands of billionaires and billion-dolar companies (that's why we call them that), while the masses may have $100, $1000, $10K or perhaps $100K if they are lucky.

These economies are run on credit which is basically implying spending money that you do not have in the bank. It creates conditions equivalent to the concentration of money into the hands of few, similar to the economy of cryptocurrencies.

Banishing volatility is similar to killing any form of hypes and sentiments, maintaining a static demand and supply curve as well as ignoring any form of government regulation which is like taking the fun part of investment away from the market with the last factor been impossible. if we consider having this occur naturally then demand and supply curve has to be manipulative. As long as users and price keep maintaining infection point at interval prices will never stabilize. Bitcoin is already a big shock to the society as such it is almost too late to start a gradual introduction because many who were misinformed has the mindset that bitcoin is a get rich quick scheme. If altcoins that fails to stabilize disappears the chances of recording more suicidal case might be on the increase.

I don't quite understand the parallel between the Euro project and Bitcoin, as they are two completely different things. The Euro project was centralised, and although some countries had high inflation compared to others, the volatility is nowhere near as high as that of bitcoin.

Bitcoin, on the other hand, is decentralised, so I don't see how it can be:


I agree with the general idea. The price of bitcoin will stabilise, and it has probably started to do so this cycle compared to previous ones but in 2 or 3 more cycles I think volatility will naturally decrease quite a lot.

If you look at Bitcoin from a currency perspective, volatility is something that is a really big problem in the sense that sellers don't want to accept something so volatile as a payment method without using payment processors. On the other hand, most of those who are interested in Bitcoin for speculative reasons want as much volatility as possible because that is how they can make a profit.

There are opinions that this volatility will decrease in the future, but I believe that we can never completely eliminate it because there will always be those who can influence it. An open market will always allow someone to buy or sell large amounts of Bitcoins and thus affect the price.


That market will always be profitable for some (those who sell ideas about better cryptocurrencies) and for those few who know how to use it - but of course it will generally cause more harm than good, as you say. We cannot say how much the last scandal with stablecoins contributed to the current situation, but there is no doubt that it once again cast a negative light on Bitcoin.

The volatility of bitcoin is one of the reason why more and more people are into it as it is being taken as an investment by majority of people. Also, it'll be hard to control the stability of BTC price as it is decentralized and the market has been held by various holders that tons of bitcoins or whales. Another aspect that we will need look into is the limit of bitcoin as we still haven't reached the limit of bitcoin to be mined.

But yes, in case volatility will be erased or removed from Bitcoin, surely more people and association will incorporate bitcoin and crypto payment on their platform or company. By then, we can proudly say that bitcoin (without any doubt by other people) is a currency.

There is not any must whenever you are talking about the bitcoin market especially about the price because the price comes from the supply and demand and since these two are changing and are not stable the price won't be stable either. NI the other hand we can't forget about the age of the market, and since the market of bitcoin is much younger than other markets such as gold and real estate there will be less stability in the price on it, but even on the unstable price education if you have a proper money management plan and stick to it you won't have any problem with the stability of the price of bitcoin.

Only when it's more regulated and the adoption gets bigger will the market will be stabilized.

With lack of regulation, these whales will try to manipulate the market for them to gain from the ignorance of some investors, especially the newbies who easily get panic when the price dump, so as long as they will not learn from their mistake, these manipulators will continue to take advantage.

However, if the government will come into play, I think that's where the market will become less volatile until it will achieve stability.

if this is done, how is bitcoin going to make a difference from other forms of asset and currency both CBDC and in fiat, i think volatility is one of the standards to profitability as the demands and supply rate determines the shift of them both, while some are gaining some may not due to volatility, the market can't be on a fixed price even when the whole remaining blocks have been mined.


you're right, even without bitcoin been stabilized those other currencies are finding it hard to stay amidst dip volatility just as in the case of Luna, many will still emerge shitcoin which they truly are.

I agree that a more stable price is desirable in the long run. However, I have a couple of notes here. One is that fiat has an authority that can manage it, whereas Bitcoin is and will most likely remain under nobody's control. So how can we make the price more stable, or do you believe it will get there on its own? The second point is about introducing Bitcoin in stages. Again, something like a big company getting involved with Bitcoin happens, the media spread the news, people find out about Bitcoin and some get interested. It's not a process which is under control. Nevertheless, it seems to me that in practice Bitcoin is sort of being introduced at stages this way, but it does nothing to help stabilize the price.

Do you know why the number of new investors in the BTC market is increasing? It's because of its volatility. People who want to try their luck and have enough courage to take risk comes to the BTC market. Though 90% failed to gain from BTC markets but the massive gain of the remaining 10% people attract more investor to this market. People only see the success story.

If BTC wants to be the primary method of business transaction then it needs to be stabilized. Without stability, BTC will not be appropriate for mass adoption because it will be very risky and unsustainable for the economy. I really doubt that BTC will take the place of fiat though I believe fiat will be replaced in the future by some unknown assets. It could be something like BTC but not BTC itself.

I think that way because the world will never see a decentralized powered community and as long as there is some sort of central authority they will try to control the economy by showing people how decentralization could lead us to a lawless society.

Agree, though completely removing volatility may be impossible though. There might also be cases where big companies that hold big amounts of Bitcoin could temporarily fluctuate the market and if that happens, even if Bitcoin was volatile for a certain period, it wouldn't really appeal as a properly stabilized currency

On the other hand, Stabilization would seem to include it being regulated (not banned) which may not appeal to some of its enthusiasts.

Decentralization. Volatility isn't even a main feature when it comes to Bitcoin, it's just a natural event due to supply and demand.

I do consider the volatility as an asset therefore I do not understand the concept of stabilization for Bitcoins and other cryptocurrencies as well, I do think that most of the investors are in this market because of the volatility that exists, I do think that companies with big amount have huge power over bitcoins they are the whales in the market as well which also means that they would eventually try and exert this control if the market moves close to stabilization therefore what do you think would happen? They would eventually lead the whole market into oblivion. I think volatility is indeed an asset that needs to be preserved.

Exactly! You know, bitcoin have got a pot of work to do on itself and that I partly what the volatility part is helping it to archive at this day stage. It's It's a decade already and would seem like a long time but given the years ahead, it's only normal to think of it to have just begun.

Waht we ought to realise is that, bitcoin was supposed to serve as a currency of the web and this purpose would be surely archived universally when the time is due. Its stability would be a very good place to start bit before that comes, it's got volatility to ensure users jump on the train and gets to understand I a lot more.

I once came across a meme about the fiat dollar that carried the caption, where we've been and where we are now. From what was understood, $1 had it's equivalent value in gold stored away but now, the $ has become the world reserve currency and needs no gold backings. That's the point bitcoin would get to the the future. Lest just enjoy the carriage as it goes.

Like any other product, its price will go to stability with the expansion of its spread among users and not be in the hands of a single authority capable of manipulating it. Just like with all traditional currencies that we consider stable.
The biggest problem, in my view, that will face this stability resulting from a wide distribution of a very limited amount of bitcoin in its total number, is that it does not accept splitting into more than eight decimals. So imagine if one satoshi equal to 10$ (likely possible t happen sooner than expected) then how becomes possible for the community to share the held while we intend bitcoin to replace Fiat money.

I think that the concentration of a large number of bitcoins in one hand will continue for a very long time. The whales understand that now they can control the rate and mood of bitcoin, they will not lose faith in it. I don’t know how much time must pass for them to stop believing in him, perhaps some events must occur.

Eventually it will, because the price depends on demand and supply so if more people buying it then the manipulating its price will decrease so over time when everyone have some bitcoin in their wallet then it is supposed to be spread over not in the few hands so it eilk be really used for its actual intention but even now we are too far from attaining that state.

Volatility will remain but I get the point that someday that it won't be as volatile as it is right now and also for the past years.

When the consolidation is done, there will be more people that shall run over bitcoin and will choose it rather than diversifying their assets for different altcoins.

They'll see more risk there than owning bitcoin so they're going to choose that someday. Yeah, it's going to take a long time before we see it stabilize somehow and I think this was discussed before.

Some of this volatility is external is how I see it.   The world is full of it as part of easy monetary policy and debt financing.   The EURO isnt achieving some perfect statehood, they will end like YEN is now with great doubts for the giant amount of debt taken on that is not serviceable.    Get used to excessive inflation for years into decades of instability.
   BTC stability will happen with the largest amount of potential buyers possibly, part of why price drops must occur and are healthy is that it widens the base of support from potential users more able at that lower price.    Probably applies to commodity use of any asset but naturally BTC will continue to increase its population and so we should see more certainty in pricing from wider bid offer order books and general usage in exchange for good worldwide.

Take gold for example - on a scale of 5-10 years it is far from stable, and this is gold - an asset with thousands of years of history, with very little uncertainty about its current and future role. Bitcoin has way smaller volume and market depth than gold, and huge uncertainty, as people still debate whether it is useless or the next big thing. Bitcoin is going to be volatile for decades, if not hundreds of years.

adoptin be the key bitcoin volatility in future, if we mass adopted and blockchain technology applied in many tech system it would not be same with gold which is only as an assets not as technology. alot people look bitcoin like gold as assets but they dont see the technology behind it. soon it will usefull in any system information that will replace old technology.

BTC is a virtual asset in the world of cryptocurrency that attracts people day by day. When Bitcoin is integrated, its market value will increase further.After a few years, people will rely on Bitcoin because people are increasingly relying on cryptocurrencies.All the other coins are altcoins From time to time people will lose confidence.
So Bitcoin will be considered as the coin of all time because people have started relying on it.

Volatility is the only reason we haven't seen mass adoption IMO, which is unfortunate because generally the only way to fix volatility is for mass adoption.

Price should stabilize in the long term with more users. It'll take decades, though. It's why I find it so bizarre for people to panic when there are sudden shifts or corrections in the price. If you're someone that's holding, expect to be holding for a while. Your patience will be rewarded.

So, is this, in effect, arguing against the claim of a number of prominent Bitcoin supporters that Bitcoin's overall price increase could be nonstop?

I myself believe that at a certain point, when its use would become highly widespread, the price would somehow stabilize. When every single country already uses Bitcoin, the increase in demand would surely slow down. It wouldn't be like today when people are grabbing the opportunity as early adopters, racing against time and supply. Neither would there be heavy dump as Bitcoin is already in active use as a currency. So a certain level of stability would be reached.

Which means, it is indeed more urgent to stack now while the upward trajectory is still there. There might come a time when Bitcoin's price reaches a more or less permanent boring movement. When that time comes, the treatment of Bitcoin as an investment will be gone.

It will for sute have to stabilize if it really want's to get over this step and have more adoption (good or bad, whatever it may be). But the process might not be so natural, or rather it will be hard to tell if it's natural or sligtly pushed by the need for regulation and centralasation. That remains to be seen.

Getting rid of volatility Yes, this is, but how does this happen with the presence of whales and large institutions that own the largest amounts of Bitcoin and control the market, it is true that the euro and the dollar, as you mentioned, are concentrated in the hands of a small group, and despite that they are stable and not volatile, but there is a central authority that controls the dollar or The euro and trying to make it stable constantly, this thing is not available in Bitcoin because it is completely decentralized, whales will continue to manipulate the market constantly, but I agree with you that it is possible that betting on the time factor is the only solution to get the required stability naturally.

I think if we are talking about it to happen naturally it definitely will after some point in time when there are a lot of users which are able to put pressure from both sides just as it happens in various other mature markets it will definitely stabilise at some time but it will take a lot of time maybe more than a decade before this might happen. Not only because this a very new market but also because market participants have entered in this market to enjoy the volatility only and also the concentration of total supply is pretty skewed in hands of big guns.

there is probably no volatility term for Bitcoin holders in the long term. i agree we should eliminate volatility naturally in our investment aspect. maybe various negative arguments arise when we can provide positive things in the progress of the investments we make. This comparison may be difficult for some people because when the market is volatile suddenly they will be a little worried about the decline in the condition of their assets against Fiat. well like the extreme market that happened recently almost some people lose control when making decisions, so can we prevent those ridiculous decisions if we can maybe we will become millionaires in the next era and isn't volatility a very influential aspect in extreme market conditions.

If we look at the currencies of the poor countries, we will find that they are highly volatile against the dollar and therefore Bitcoin will remain volatile as long as it is decentralized, but the intensity of these volatility will decrease because it is difficult to liquidate about 3 trillion from the market within two or three days (therefore, it is almost impossible to get a 20% correction within A day if we reach twice the capacity of the gold market)

The model has changed dramatically during the last years from the first years.

It will in the long run but the thing is, believe it or not, we are still very much in the early stages, not at the beginning but nowhere near the peak either.  The long run timeframe may mean it's quite possible we aren't around to see it.  However, regulation may speed up stabilization, but the fear is this may somewhat bastardize things if overdone, which some central governments have the tendency to do.

No one seriously doubts the Bitcoin protocol and its ability to deliver on what it claims - being a p2p global censorship-resistant network. It's irrelevant if "blockchain technology" is applied in other spheres or not, I personally have been viewing it as a failure for quite some time - the hype started 6 years ago, and still zero results. If there was some merit to it, there would already be some promising results, but there are none such. According to your idea that Bitcoin depends on public perception of blockchain technology, Bitcoin would have already crashed to the ground.

i also believe that we are still in the early stage of this market to aim for stabilisation. even after a decade of existence, btc is still very much volatile which attracts a lot of attention of enthusiasts. government intervention may indeed aid in this stabilisation factor. but it is still a long way to go. what we have right now is a good playing ground for traders as well as investors.

Even if bitcoin was somehow evenly distributed from the beginning and everyone knew how important it would be eventually a disparity in the amount of bitcoin held will appear, so even in that hypothetical scenario it would be impossible to reduce the volatility of bitcoin, I understand that most people are very conservative and as such the volatility scares them, but the volatility will never disappear, bitcoin and its limited supply by nature increase the volatility in the system, since when there is an increase in the demand it is impossible to increase the supply except with the process of mining bitcoin, so this creates an environment in which the price of bitcoin will always be more volatile than fiat or precious metals.

I agree that it can't happen instantly, but "a very long time" sounds scary to me. After all, it didn't take a very long time for EURO, right? If you mean, we need a couple more years for general public to finally realize that Bitcoin is here to stay because it's a convenient and secure money to use in the future, then I absolutely agree with you, because, indeed, we are not there yet. It's easy to smear something new and unknown to the average Joe and Jane, and that's what some "financial experts" are doing regarding Bitcoin, and many people believe them. But luckily today we have many other financial experts

https://i.imgur.com/JJnpdei.png

and certainly we'll have more of them in the future because truth overcomes lies and deceit.

And when btc finally stabilizes people will then wishes it to fluctuate because how can they be able to buy cheap and how can they be able to earn massively? That's always their mentality so better if we will just ignore them.

We don't need them here and even if most of them are gone, there's still a lot of btc supporters out there and there will always be new people that will enter on this space. Solana and other top alts aren't the one that gave btc a bad name but it was those scam coins. It's also the fault of those who invest on them. Once those people get scammed, this will then create a headline and those who don't have a knowledge in crypto will think that all here are scam including the btc.

True, but we can't avoid situations like that. Scammers, they will always be there, associated with a project no matter how good the project itself is. But, of course, scamming people is a bad thing, while trading is not. There's nothing wrong with buying low and selling high. So, I personally don't mind volatility much. Our world is volatile, and Bitcoin is a part of it.

Scamming is such an "easy" way of making money for some people. All you have to do is work hard to convince people to believe in you, and you can make a bulk amount of money together. Just think of companies that scam you. Think of an exchange, normally they make money from the trading fee, and if they just decide to take all the money in their accounts and leave? That would be gigantic compared to what trading fee profits would bring you.

This is why I believe that the best thing to do right now is not get scammed, but also understand why scammers do it. If you realize what the angle someone talks to you, then you will see if they are scammers or not.

I would say will agree with this one but i don't think this is possible you can take a look at the gold, Gold can fight against inflation and you can see the price of gold is driven up and this happen to bitcoin that i would say fight against inflation as well but crypto is volatile in short term like bitcoin did

This is very common, people want to make bitcoin to have different characteristics than the ones it currently has and that are given to it by its code, and this is not possible, and the ones that want this more than anyone else are politicians, it is very common to see how they wish for bitcoin to work differently than the way it does, and most of the time we see that they want bitcoin to just become another form of fiat they can control, and that is never going to happen as bitcoin was specifically created to work differently than their fiat currencies and this drives them crazy.

I don't think it's easy, tbh. Actually, far from it. We have a lot of scammers around because the world is big, and with the invention of the Internet it has become bigger, thousands times bigger than before. And not only because the world population is growing, but mainly because now you can be sitting at your home in Belgium and be scammed by someone from Nigeria, and vice versa. Very few people are capable of convicing others in something. Sadly, many of them use their gift for evil.

But I was saying to @barbara44 here that there's nothing wrong with buying low and selling high. It's not scamming, and it's not a bad thing at all. It's called trading. And traders are not enemies of the Bitcoin community. They are part of it.

How the hell would someone be treating that buying and selling or simply trading do really be ending up to be scamming? Dont know on where they do get that idea on mind.

Its just pure common sense and doesnt need to be technical or do make in depth research about definition about scamming and trading. :D
Back on the topic about bitcoin price must stabilize? Havent we realize on why bitcoin do get attention that much? Because one of its volatility or moving prices.
People could make out money or profits out of its price volatility even though not all and the other side losses but we do see its potential.
Not only for money making opportunity but also with the utility and usage that we could really able to attain.

As I see Bitcoin as time goes on, its price in the market is going up, and we have all seen that since 2009 which started with less than 1 $ each Bitcoin is now priced at 20k $ more than one. Although it has fallen from a high price of more than 69k $ and it can be said if it really stabilizes, especially now that many believe that bitcoin in the future will possibly be 100k $ each or more so many are buying now and they are holding it's a few years from now.

Bitcoin price is volatile because there are too many coins held in few hands. If there were less whales, bitcoin would become more stable. That is how market manipulation loses strength and impact, since bullish and bearish tendencies would be smoother, so investors in general don't feel forced to sell their portfolios due to possible crashes and consequently there isn't panic selling waves.
Thankfully, it's already happening, although in short steps and small dosages. But I really think potential and small investors should pay more attetion to this reality and help bitcoin to become really decentralized, that is, splitted among most hands as possible.

But in fact the volatility of bitcoin is what attracts people even though they eventually give up themselves because the volatility is not as good as expected and creates the bad news.
If bitcoin is to become stable, I estimate bitcoin will lose more than half of its users as the majority are only concerned with profits rather than advantages. It wouldn't make any difference to the fiat they use on a daily basis, in fact I doubt that 70% of current bitcoin holders ever use it onchain.

Regulation comes stablization but is price would be more 'controlled' in a way that it defeats volatility. I mean, the aspect of volatility is what most investors purchase BTC in the process. In the event that this happens, then what would be the difference of investing in BTC compared to investing in other instruments as well? But this kind of argument falls short when you look it purely on an investment perspective as BTC is more than just an investment.

Though this may be the case, but I think this is the only remedy if we truly want to see BTC being adopted globally and being accepted as an alternative currency. Even if China has recently ban its utilization, we may see a revival if this where to happen.

And because, unlike many volatile things that go to nothing within a year or two, Bitcoin has proved to be a good thing to invest in for those aiming for a long-term investment.

Skillful traders can make money with the worst assets, as long as they are volatile, but it's a risky business, not for everyone. If you don't know when to quit - you lose everything. But people who bought BTC at $19.5k in December 2017, just before the long bear markets lasting for more than 2 years, still could make nice profits afterwards.

Yes that's right.  The main question is at what price will the price of bitcoin stabilize? 

$100,000?

$500,000? 

$2,000,000? 

The answer to this question, in my opinion, depends on what Bitcoin really is.  Some experts believe that Bitcoin is digital gold.  In this case, its capitalization should be equal to the capitalization of gold, and the price of 1 bitcoin should reach approximately $500,000. 

Other experts believe that Bitcoin is the future world reserve currency.  In this case, we will see Bitcoin at a price of $2,000,000 and above.

I like your numbers. :) Indeed, do we need BTC to stabilize around $10k? Some people here would say, it's irrelevant, "One Bitcoin equals one Bitcoin", but I personally strongly disagree with such approach. Bitcoin is money, and there is an exchange rate for every pair of currencies, crypto or not. You don't say "One Venezuelan Bolivar equals one Venezuelan Bolivar", right? It's ridiculous.

I think so, if Bitcoin can be more stable it will make anyone not worried to make Bitcoin as an investment, I hope what happens with gold fluctuations can occur in Bitcoin, now is the time to wait at least 3 years and hope that the marketcap can reach at least 10x from now .

Bitcoin price can't be stable even it's already 10-50 years later since it's decentralized and no one limiting the trading activity on an exchanges. If Bitcoin price will become stable like stable coin, I would sell my coins before it's happen since it's not a Bitcoin anymore. Make Bitcoin as a stable coin is obviously the protocol are different, it's a Bitcoin fork to be honest.

I don't think if Bitcoin price already hit $500,000 , $1,000,000 or higher, we would see the price will be stable.

If bitcoin price stabilizes, how will this fit into a deflationary pattern? Inflation will always exist. If you fix the price of bitcoin, then the purchasing power of itwill fall. The more the more time passes.

Gold or reserve currencies don't have a stabilized price either. Their rate against other currencies and each other also fluctuates. And with inflation, their purchasing power is also changing, so the prices of gold and reserve currencies are definitely not stable. So why should the price at bitcoin stabilize at any one level? It seems to me that this will never happen.

Well, most of the early coiners and hardcore Bitcoiners wants Bitcoin to be adopted as a currency, but the high volatility has made it more attractive to speculators and they are giving fuel to the volatility in the price. People in the community should actively go out there and demand that retailers and shops start to accept Bitcoin as a payment option.

The same people should also use their votes to vote for a government that will accept Bitcoin as a currency and not just as a Commodity. Once this are accomplished... mass adoption will take place and volatility will stabilize.  ;)

Its decentralized and there's no such thing about monopolizing into its overall supply and we know on how it well circulated into the entire community even though partitions might not really be on equal which isnt surprising because billionaire/institutions/organizations would really be always have the edge on acquiring more compared into those average joes.
Stability of price cant really be possible because its been common traded and the price is always moving every second thats why its cant really be possible for it to be stabilized.
If ever it does happen or possible then we wont able to see bitcoins popularity on what we are seeing today which it wont really be the same.
People love to play moving prices because this is where we do make out profits neither in short term or long term.

If we banish the volatility, people will stop investing in Bitcoin.
There is no difference between stable coins and Bitcoin if it has no volatility aspect. Almost all people are interested to hold/have Bitcoin because it has big volatility. Big volatility means a chance to gain huge profits. Without volatility, I suspect people won't be interested anymore in Bitcoin.

Don't forget that only a few people use Bitcoin as a currency, most people use it for investment purposes. Banishing the volatility kills investors' interest, which means killing the future of Bitcoin.

What I see is that people welcome Bitcoin, not in a form of currency that can be used daily but they welcomed it most as an investment that they think it helps them to become rich. Because if only they know that they can't make a trade and make money for this, Bitcoin won't be known and famous to the people. The idea has come to the point that Bitcoin become a long-term investment, they sometimes used it as a currency (options) but naturally, in their mind is to make use of this for investment purposes.

No, please don't do that. You will only turn them against Bitcoin with such actions. We should not demand anything from anyone, imo, except maybe from media. If we know someone with a large audience, if we are like friends, I mean, then we can demand from them to tell people the truth, to educate people regarding BTC and its potential. Retailers will make their own conclusions. We can't force them with our demanding to accept BTC.

It's time for bitcoin to be more stable and less volatile as it is today, I hope that the price rises and falls no more than 5% per day, this can happen if the bitcoin marketcap can reach at least 1000x of the current marketcap.

Bitcoin's volatility is the reason why most investors gain profit from it. We will not able to take advantage of its volatility if it will be stabilized. Those who are complaining about its volatility are those who have weak hands. They aren't smart enough to the changes in the price of Bitcoin. I wonder why others are having a hard time dealing with it wherein fact, that's an opportunity for us to buy at a low price and sell at a high and profitable value.

Everything is simple here and the point of view on the question depends on what purposes a person wants to use bitcoin for. If a person is doing this for quick enrichment and speculation, then it is naturally in his interests that the asset is sufficiently volatile and such a player is already prepared in advance for the consequences that follow from the strong volatility of the asset. It is quite another matter when a person invests in bitcoin in order to save his savings from inflation, then naturally a strong volatility is not necessary for such a person and, on the contrary, he would like more predictability of the exchange rate and for him it is a great test when an asset instead of a stable rise on the contrary loses in price. From its very appearance and at this point in time, bitcoin is a very volatile asset and the fact that bitcoin is not secured by anything clearly suggests this, so if the investor is not ready for this, it is better to find other more reliable areas for investment that are more adapted for this. However, I still think that in the long term bitcoin will still grow in value and long-term investments will still justify themselves, just do not panic and be patient in such turbulent times of asset value decline.

Yes, the time is very near for people to experience stable pumping of Bitcoin because their teams are seriously working to make people to experience bullish season before the end of this year 2022. I don't think, this bearish season will continue next month before bullish market will start for long term traders to smile again in the market, because  the price has increased to $23,000 few days ago.  Showed that other coins are preparing to increase higher for their investors to believe that bearish season is about to over in the market.

Firstly, price fluctuations of around 5% per day are considered pretty big in stock market and are expected to happen only during about 1-2 days each year. So, with such fluctuations you can't actually say that the price has stabilized.

Secondly, I'm wondering where's that 1,000x number coming from? Current Apple's market cap is 2.55T and Bitcoin's market cap is 453.1B. So, if BTC rises just 6 times from today's price its market cap will be higher than that of Apple.  You think it wouldn't be high enough still?

I am not sure why the question of volatility is so much in the air when the yearly volatility remains between 10-15%. The concept that Bitcoin is too volatile for mainstream use is a vague exaggeration of a simple thing.

The reason why today bitcoin and crypto is on everyone mouths is the speculation around its price and hence the hype around many altcoins.

Abolishing speculation is absurd to think of and that will drastically reduce the popularity that Bitcoin has gained. I think we are doing well in this regard for now.

It's clear that 23k was a good increase, we reached 21k and around before but 23k hasn't been reached that much until a few days ago, which is a proof that we need about the fact that we could go on about our business and increase the price again.

What people are not realizing is that price of bitcoin will go up eventually either they are in it or not, bitcoin won't wait for you, and when it does go up, some people will be too much behind to realize it. Maybe it wasn't this time, but it could be next time and unless they are there, they will be upset with the result and there isn't a thing they can do about it when it is too late. So either get in now, or just don't get in at all.

A stable bitcoin price would be good for people who are using bitcoins on a daily basis for their business. Paying bills with bitcoins, or receiving bitcoins as a form of payment becomes easier when the price is stable. On other side are investors who are using bitcoins for long term investments, I think they would be less happy about stable prices. Less volatility in the bitcoin market also means lower rising prices. The question is also at which price should bitcoins stop rising or falling, 20k, 60k, 100k USD? All the initial investors probably ask for the highest price possible whereas the investors would want the lowest possible price. As long as there is such a large discrepancy between the valuation of different investor will I not expect a stable price. Most other assets like stocks or commodities tend to fluctuate heavily, it's part of the game

Eliminate volatility - while bitcoin is providing freedom, diversity in most uses/payments/investments… can't eliminate the need for that freedom.  The volatility of Bitcoin is exciting and opens the way for people to escape the oppression and trampling of fiat.  Simply put, you can consider it as an asset, a means of payment, a savings, etc. that is the freedom that bitcoin brings.  So the best bitcoin doesn't need stability

As long as Bitcoin exist, the price will keep moving up & down which will be a sign of "Life". .. It becomes dead when it stop moving. The goal should be to moderate the volatility while making sure there is continuous increase in demands caused mostly by good developments in Bitcoin space. Besides, the demand factor plus its relatively low supply helps in making it anti-inflationary upholding its principle as a Deflationary Currency. Without this it won't be a good Store of Value as users savings will keep depreciating in value like you see in Fiat currencies.

The goal now is to help it cross $50,000 which it actually deserves, then things will slow down abit unless there are good developments that can increase demand and keep the price going up strongly from there.


* So, Bitcoin stabilizing in the long run should not equal Bitcoin not moving anymore.

The only way volatility would "disappear" is if people began using Bitcoin regardless of its value in Fiat terms. That would mean ditching the "Fiat Standard" in favor of the "Bitcoin Standard". But this is very unlikely to happen since governments and central banks still have the leading edge over the global economy. As long as Fiat exists, Bitcoin won't be able to fulfill its purpose as a currency for cross-border payments. It's only useful as a store of value.

If you really want stability, then stablecoins or cash are your only options. I hope someday Bitcoin becomes the global unit of account in order to truly decentralize the world. Just my thoughts ;D

Really? How so? We can love and admire Bitcoin but we shouldn't be blinded to its faults too. I'm sure, if Bitcoin weren't the first it wouldn't even be having half the goodwill it's having as an edge on others. After all, it's not the only payment crypto. Come to think of it, Bitcoin doesn't even have a smart contract; does it?

Isn't it the same way Bitcoin is? Those who hodl thousands of Bitcoin are in the minority compared to those who hodl a few sats here and there.

I think that volatility would even become more active if people are actively using bitcoin but volatility is also the reason on why many people won't use their coin actively, i.e for payment purposes. Volatility is also the reason on why many people are here (traders and investors) because they figured out that they can buy low and sell high. It's only about willingness anyway and not about governments or there are still a fiat around.

I am into btc but I have worries if what will the world will be if it's fully decentralized or like you said, the global unit of account will only be btc. I couldn't ask for more but btc having a volatile nature is already fine for me and we still have a stable coins anyway if we want some stability.

Having stable coins is not stability, imo. Their value is pegged to the value of a fiat currency and, especially in times like these, one can't certainly expect a sustainable purchasing power of fiat currencies. And, in fact, unlike Bitcoin, stable coins can only lose their real value with time. So, if by "stability" we mean constant losing of real value, then stable coins are stable in that sense. But who wants that stability?

Bitcoin does not need any promotion, it get promoted on its own. :D

The popularity of one coin does not lead to a bad outcome even when its price fluctuates, like I said the yearly volatility remains within controlled limits.

Though altcoins also see pump and dump they too remain close to this when seen on a long term scale like a year or a half. Specific altcoins might be doing better on their creators promotions, still bitcoin remains the big one.

Price remains stable in the long run, if you know how to take advantage of it. Besides without the price changes we would not have any trading happening.

When you do step your foot into crypto market then you should be aware on market price conditions.

1. Bear
2. Bull
3. Ranging/Sideways

We know that #3 would be the most hardest part on making up a decision whether you do buy or sell specially if this condition or situation had lasted
for a couple of months which it is really hard to determine on what step you would really be doing in order to maximize possible profitability.
It doesnt really need to  stabilize and it doesnt really need to be promoted because everything would come normally just like on what you said which is definitely true.

back to the reality of bitcoin now those who hold it because the real reason is its volatility which gives them hope to get rich and we are not hypocrites for this. and naturally also bitcoin can not grow into something that might be said to be stable
Of course this takes time and market capitalization is of course unavoidable from volatility and inflation so worry about value and supply will always be there.

Topic is important enough to not let it go entirely to the dumpster :)

I mostly agree, but the Bitcoin community can of course help to achieve this goal. A possible way to do that is increase liquidity massively.

How to do that? Well, you can't of course force more people to put more orders on exchanges. But there is another way: If Bitcoin is used more as a currency, then liquidity comes automatically.

An example: If 10% of all Bitcoin users (according to crypto.com, 176 million (https://assets.ctfassets.net/hfgyig42jimx/5i8TeN1QYJDjn82pSuZB5S/85c7c9393f3ee67e456ec780f9bf11e3/Cryptodotcom_Crypto_Market_Sizing_Jan2022.pdf), I think it's relatively safe to say that there are at least 50 million, so I'll take 100 million as a guess) buy one thing per week worth $50, then we have around 500 million USD worth of Bitcoin "sales" per week. Each trade (Bitcoin to a good/service) can be seen as a buy/sell order. In some cases, if the merchant uses a payment processor, this means directly a buy/sell order on an exchange.

In the cases Bitcoin is accepted directly, it's a bit more complicated, but actually each offer on a merchant shop or website expressed in Bitcoins, even if it's only valid 10 minutes, can be seen as an additional (limit) buy order, only that not the USD, but the good/service is exchanged against BTC.

The 500 million USD may not look much if we take into account that the trade volume per day is of several billions, but these are real orders expressing real interest, and not orders of traders. This would also leverage the volume added by traders.

The more liquidity/order volume there is close to the reference price, the more difficult it becomes also for whales to move the price and create FOMO or panic to profit from it.


This "Bitcoin standard" is exactly the effect I'm hoping for. If Bitcoin is more used as a currency, even with floating prices, you'll get at least for short timeframes when Bitcoin is rather stable, a "feeling" what a certain Bitcoin fraction is worth (i.e. if Bitcoin is between $20K and $25K, then you can say "1 BTC is worth as much as a small car"). If this effect becomes more common, it could slowly make pricing in Bitcoin more popular (what is currently a very small niche, but is occasionally used, e.g. in the forum marketplace and signature campaigns).

I think once merchants start significantly to give price guarantees for goods and services (this is easier for digital goods with low marginal cost, see this thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1926913.0)), then the way to the "Bitcoin standard" is paved. They can start with a fixed price for some hours, then 24 hours, then 48 and then even longer timeframes once they feel secure.

This volatility factor is indeed the driving force for most crypto users to continue to hold bitcoin. This is why stability is not really the aim of most. People are banking on the possibility that the btc price will increase a lot someday, hence, holding their satoshis as long as they can. But in the long run, we are aiming for stability so we can use this for everyday, and we have no qualms of using it as payment method. But unfortunately, we are not yet in this stage.

Even though now Bitcoin no longer requires promotion, but at the beginning of its appearance, they used it to make bitcoin like now. It is true what you say, that votality and popularity are the result of their own performance, but to control it, bitcoin requires a balance between demand and sales, and I think depending on how people use market conditions

When we come and start trying to enter the market, so that that must be connected are bear, bull, and rangeways/sideways, althouls three points can not do done simultaneously, but as far as we believe and based on research, there is no harm, there is no harm In trying, especially those related to bitcoin, the most important characteristics and developments must be known, so we know when to get out of the market

People who do not know what else to do, pick stablecoins because they believe that they could end up making a bit of profit with it. First of all, even if you are from the USA, you could use stuff like USDT to make sure you are in liquidity providing, interests, staking and whatever else you want to find and that's how you make a big profit.

However, if you are not from the US, then you could be doing even better because not only you will profit that way, but you will profit because USD would go up against your own nation currency as well. I have been doing it, and I know the returns are little, but it is certainly a way to make profit and I am quite happy about it.

For the "Bitcoin Standard" to become a reality, all of the world needs to adopt Bitcoin as legal tender. This would mean "ditching" Fiat in favor of Bitcoin. I don't see Fiat collapsing unless inflation grows to a point where it's uncontrollable by world countries. Once "hyperinflation" kicks in, then we'll be forced to look for other alternatives. We were used to the "Gold Standard" in the past, and it worked out pretty well. But Bitcoin is even better than Gold, so it's likely the world will switch to the "Bitcoin Standard" with decaying Fiat currencies. Nothing is set in stone, so we can only hope for the best. Just my thoughts ;D

If Bitcoin is stable, of course it will not make people want to buy bitcoin, the biggest hope of investment bitcoin is the price opportunity that rises, and in my opinion that has happened for around 12 years which is very volatile is a better thing and makes anyone hope to get profit.

That's crypto because without fluctuations it wouldn't be profitable,
for now we are indeed waiting for the Bitcoin price to rise again and it takes time,
Bitcoin investment will always be profitable but it takes patience

I congratulate you on making profits with investing in USDT, but how it's different from simply investing in USD then?


It may be hard to understand for most people in the world at the moment, but these days Bitcoin indeed is better than gold. There's nothing wrong with gold itself, it will always be worth something, but today it's overpriced big time, same as it was 10 years ago. Bitcoin, on the other hand, is now fluctuating around its new bottom.

For profitability reason yes we can say that bitcoin is better than gold but before we can earn with it we must have been more experience dealing with volatility since if we are newbie and been hype up with results shown on internet then maybe we will not like bitcoin at first try. This is why we need to think more and learn more before we enter because bitcoin is volatile and that add the risk upon trying to select this as investment.

Yes, the price of Bitcoin has moved from $19 to $23 in the market which any moment from next month people will begin to experience massive pumping in the market. The crypto price situation is coming to an end soon, because many coins in the market are showing green light to make people mind feel good for the bull season they are about to enter which is the best season for long term investors to earn well from the market.

I think if bitcoin can be more stable, i.e. price fluctuations will not be more than 3% then this will make a lot of investors optimistic and don't hesitate to store bitcoins in cold wallets, the thing that makes us always worried is bitcoin price fluctuations that can reach more than 10 % per day and often make me panic.

I believe it is not necessary for Fiat to collapse util we get some sort of Bitcoin standard. Both the USD standard and the Bitcoin standard could happily coexist. Currently we have a strong USD standard*, and (a bit weaker) Euro and Renminbi (yuan) "standards" which act as anchors for prices in international trade, each one more important in certain regions and less in others. Something similar could occur with Bitcoin.

Once the Bitcoin price stabilizes a bit more (like I described in my previous post) it could be attractive in some countries with high Bitcoin adoption and a weak or non-existing (like in El Salvador) local currency to price at least some services in Bitcoin. Perhaps El Salvador could do this with services like the "Chivo Pets" veterinary hospital which already are heavily subsidized (the cost is USD 0,25; "real cost" of the service - salaries etc. - should be much higher, so maybe this could be an ideal "playground" for experiments with bitcoin-based pricing). In other countries it could be advantageous for private companies to price services in Bitcoin, particularly in slight bear markets when this would be perceived as a "discount" (remember we're talking here speculatively about a future situation with much less sharp BTC price movements, so this could apply to times when Bitcoin loses ~1% per week or so in a "harsh bear market").

*I use "standard" here as a sort of "value anchor", but not something as static as the gold standard was.

Uh...bruh are you so sure about that, in my opinion investors will not like stability, they want fluctuations in price so they could buy low, and then sell high and make profits, fluctuations do not make investors panic, it makes them happy, gives them opportunities to accumulate, though they are going to have to hold it for long. If any investor will panic about fluctuations then it'll be those who are in for the short term. It goes without saying that people who spend bitcoins, and take it as a currency that it is are the ones that are more passionate about stability.

If Bitcoin is going to be a solid and reliable currency that is used for into the future it needs to act like the biggest existing currencies which have reasonably low volatility like you say. Speculators are bad for the future of Bitcoin, because they are people who have the most fear and are the most erratic in their dealings with the currency. Volatility can also breed a lot of misunderstandings, put off newcomers who might only have sparse knowledge of how it works and create warning bells for politicians who will be more inclined to regulate against them. Stability will breed confidence and it'll actually be good once all the possible Bitcoin are mined, even though the newly minted stuff is in much lower supply than it used to be.

We dont really need that if we do speak about stability because if we do mind on this way then there's no difference on dealing with those fiat stable currency.Im not saying
that bitcoin cant be used as a currency but you shouldnt really believe about on being the main one because it cant just be possible and lets just move on because
thats not how BItcoin should be ending up.Stability is impossible and this would be always volatile and this is what people do love about it because we do make
money out of those movements thats why its really not that possible for it to happen.

Because, it's not available in my nation to buy any amount you want, and sell any amount you want. There are regulations and people who do not have a license to trade, could do so with a limited amount of money, well I am already under that limit, so it wouldn't have mattered to me to be fair, but many people prefer USDT in my nation because of this, many also moved from USDT to BUSD instead, because Binance is bigger and better.

Long story short, USDT is still better because it's still crypto, we could also go into crypto from there easier as well. I have to say, the regulations mean nothing when you are in crypto and you know what you are doing.

That is true for me as well. Plus, even if it was available to buy as much as we want, being in and out of crypto with USD on the side is a great deal when you are doing it together. If the option was given to be USD then I would do that.

But, I use Binance and they have busd and not usd, that means that if I want to be in crypto, then I can buy crypto on Binance, and if I want to get out of crypto but not completely, just enough to trade, then I would have to turn them into BUSD. The idea to be in crypto and in fiat back and forth constantly makes me feel like it would cost a ton of money and I rather not do that at all, I would prefer if I could stay in BUSD and not in my own fiat, or even USD unless Binance offers that.

It took a long time to achieve bitcoin price stability. I agree it can be achieved in the long run if adoption is widespread in different countries. As a means of payment, bitcoin is expected to have better price stability so its volatility will not affect future adopters much. But I think this must be difficult to achieve and will probably take a lot of time considering traders and investors may never want stability.

Little by little people's mindset about bitcoin can change, but because bitcoin is traded and not controlled, its price stability will only be determined by supply and demand.

Learning and getting experience is never a bad idea, so I'm not going to argue with that. But don't you think that with Bitcoin it doesn't take a lot of learning to see that your investment is going to be profitable in the long run?

What you describe is very important for day traders. Indeed, you can earn a lot with exploiting the volatility of BTC, and you can lose a lot too. But for the long term investors volatility is irrelevant.

Its just common sense and if we do talk about stability then its better to deal with fiat or stable coins but we know the cons of it which it would be less for you to make money or profits.
One of the things on why people do love to invest on something which does have potential on making profits via those movements and this is where people do get interested.
We dont want stability and we dont want for the price on moving less because we cant really make out some money with that and this is what most people do love the most
which its moving price and since it does have the potential then there's no doubt on making profits in the future.

It depends on who are the "we". Daily traders don't want stability for sure, but just holders ... idk. The lack of stability is what scares off many people from using Bitcoin, and we want more of them, right?

Yes, we don't want stability around $20k, but around $100k, I wouldn't mind. :)

In trading perspective for sure traders would not like to see bitcoin go stabilize because if this happen for sure many traders lose a lot of profit because they cannot trade it according to what position they like to enter.

But if we also see it on adoption especially to be added on local merchant maybe this is good because for sure many institutions will look at it as valid grounds for acceptance and they will not worry about volatility and they can take advantage on its huge user base.

No, that's not how economies work. You are implying that there is some kind of difference in Bitcoin (and possibly other cryptos) that handicaps their purpose as a method of payment.


Here is a hard fact: If you're only here to make money, then walk the plank and convert all your holdings to Ethereum (with their 2.0 launch mania you will make a hansome profit in the next 1-2 months).

If everyone just stays here to make money, then we are only proving the naysayers right when they said "Bitcoin is just a speculative bubble". You are suppoesd to buy, and then you HODL the majority of it. There is a certain stage in the network's growth where increased prices become destructive due to lack of increasing difficulty [new antminers having only small speed boost] - and the priority should be to save the network above making money.

Even if we have to turn off halvings to keep the hashrate in balance, we should do it. IDGAF if the price never moons again at that point. The point is to maintain an inflation-resistant currency, not an investment scheme.

I refer you to this mailing list entry by Jaroslaw: https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2022-August/020854.html

One of the finest pieces I read about the subject of blockchain economics.

Tὰ πάντα ῥεῖ.

The price will never stabilize in the long run; it'll just be less fluctuating than it is now, assuming there will be more institutions and countries in play. And that's because there's nothing stable in the nature to begin with. State intervention might have boiled things down with market regulations so far, but bitcoin is another thing. There is no freer market than the bitcoin one. And a so free market comes with destabilization, as third parties can't intervene to disrupt it.

Authorities can't confiscate it. They can't control who's gonna move what, let alone the demand & supply. They can't criminalize/stop/regulate its use effectively. Gold bugs cannot rival what we've built here. Gold Standard is an innocent fool in comparison with the Bitcoin Standard. Ultimately, we're talking about the yet best, individual's-rights-preserving money.

---

Hard fact? You mean bareless speculation?

You should post this here (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5405755.0) if it concerns you.

The stuff that follwed was more of a hard fact than this part.

The point being, vultures that are only here for the profits ought to go elsewhere.

(I do not particularly like Ethereum, but Blockchain.info made such a fool of themselves splashing it on their front page that I fent compelled to post it here.)

Yes, I agree with you on the bases that you can not force a monetization process to be stablized over night. But removing volatility side of bitcoin is something that might have issue because even my country's currency as it is now, it is unpredictable. And that is already stable currency talking of bitcoin which is not stable at the moment and I doubt if bitcoin even be stable because bitcoin is not controlled by Central Bank of a country whereby it tells the sub bank to obey their policies. Yes if the volatility can be vanished naturally then bitcoin at that point becomes stable but at what point do you what bitcoin to be stable? Because people predict that they want 1 bitcoin to be $100+k and others even predict more so with this I think the volatility side of bitcoin is undiscussed as for now. Even the rising and falling aspect of it is a benefit to some people. Some people make profit when it is in the bear Market and others make profit when it is in the bull market. That is why it is only those who understand bitcoin can make Investment. Anyone that scared to invest in bitcoin is not conversant user of bitcoin. Bitcoin is meant for everyone as it is in fiat currency but everyone is not meant for bitcoin.

Why do we need to compare Bitcoin exchange rates with those of fiat currencies and commodities? And I don't think that Bitcoin is more volatile than most of the national currencies and commodities. For example, the Turkish Lira has gone down against the USD by more than 50% during the last 12 months (1 USD = 8.5 TRL to 1 USD = 18.1 TRL). Even the Euro has gone down by ~20% against the USD. Now take the case of commodities. Dutch TTF natural gas prices are up by almost 2500% during the last two years. Crude oil is up by 150%.

No it isn't. We're in a bear market and "investing" in altcoins can make your capital shrink. It's as hard fact as it isn't.

I don't agree. Foolish vultures that can't even pleasure themselves with hands so weak go elsewhere. The smart ones hold bitcoin and enjoy thrilling appreciations over the long term.

I also think that for the masses and the government to acknowledge Bitcoin, it needs to get rid of  its high volatility.  I know it will be gone one day but I think it will take long years of waiting for the price of Bitcoin to stablize.  I guess it will happen when the last coin is mined or when majority of the population are using Bitcoin.

This is very unlikely in my opinion, we cannot deny that it is the volatility of bitcoin that attracts people to bitcoin and the market and not the technology behind it, it has but very few people care about technology. What everyone wants here is profit.

Once bitcoin becomes as stable as gold it is today it is very likely that countries will gradually adopt it but we will also lose a large number of bitcoin users as it is no longer profitable for them.

I don’t think that a decentralized cryptocurrency will ever be able to get rid of its high price volatility. Some argue that this will happen when people start using bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies en masse, and thus, since the buying and selling actions of many people will almost always already be balanced, the price of the cryptocurrency will be more stable. It is unlikely that this will happen. The price of a cryptocurrency, as in the stock market, will always depend on bad or good news, and this, in turn, will influence the mass decision of cryptocurrency holders to buy or sell it, and then high volatility will continue.

The only way Bitcoin will become stable is if and only if people decide to use it as a currency, a method of payment. Unlike today, people are buying bitcoin and expecting to be able to sell it at a higher price to make a profit from it. As a result of this thinking, bitcoin will never be stable, as everyone tends to buy low when the price is low and will sell high when the price is high. The volatility of Bitcoin will depend on our behavior.

Of course, I am not expecting perfect stability in the price. I know that there will be continuous deviations in terms of hundreds and maybe even thousands of dollars (if the price of Bitcoin reaches an extremely high value). But price swigns such as 0.5x, 3x, 0.75x are unacceptable for most people who want to do commerce [not trading] in bitcoin. This has already been explained by many other people in different threads.

So suppose we have the current price of BTC: $20,000. Assume the price is supposed to stay like that (in reality it will not stay at this price because BTC has much more market potential).

I don't mind price swings of $100, $200, $500 or even $1000.

But a price fluctuation of $2000, $5000 etc. becomes destructive, because people will wait for the prices to rise to profitable levels so they can spend less BTC. So there will be fewer economic transactions during a bear season.

No it won't lose bitcoin users, what it will lose are speculators and traders who intend to take advantage of Bitcoin high volatility.  Why would a user abandon Bitcoin when Bitcoin got adopted by masses or government?  As far as I know, bitcoin users are those who use Bitcoin regardless of profit.  They are the one who use it as a currency and often buy things using Bitcoin. 

Yes, I mean investors in bitcoin, not people who are using bitcoin for their daily payments. Most people who own bitcoin are investors, speculators, not too many people are willing to use bitcoin as a currency, a means of payment for life. Even for large companies holding bitcoins, they consider bitcoin an investment. El Salvador is a country that accepts bitcoin as legal tender, they have bought and stored bitcoin as an asset and not a currency, even though it is legal currency in their country.

Exactly. We don't need to measure Bitcoin's value in terms of Fiat, especially when it was designed to be an alternative to the current banking system. If only people used BTC directly for goods and/or services regardless of how much it's worth in Fiat, things would've been different. Only then, Bitcoin would've been considered as a currency by many instead of an investment tool.

Unfortunately, greed has changed people's perception of Bitcoin, as they rely on it as a store of value just like Gold. Now Bitcoin needs to have a high price in terms of Fiat, or mainstream adoption would decrease at a very fast pace. There's nothing we can do about it, since that's the way the market works. How you'd use Bitcoin (either as a currency or as a store of value) is up to you. As long as Bitcoin stays true to its roots, it won't be going anywhere soon. Just my opinion :)

But if you think of it, why stick to Bitcoin if you are a daily trader? Aren't there enough other volatile assets, crypto currencies included? Just make money on their exchange rate fluctuations, right?


Exactly. We want wide adoption of BTC, the wider the better. And we know that with wide adoption its price can't be below $100k, which is also a good thing. :)

Because the basic concept of bitcoin is decentralization and the price is very much determined by the market so I think there is no point if it is stable, the thing that makes bitcoin a strong global community is because of the fluctuating price, this is a good opportunity to be used as daily trading.

I believe it all depends on "alt" we are talking about. The problem with the word altcoin is that it consists of everything from ethereum and bnb to all the smaller ones that are not even in the top 1000 of CMC right now and even ones that are not even listed there. So, that means when we are talking about alts, we are talking about a vast one and I agree that majority of them would shrink it, but the ones like ETH would probably not cause that.

This is why I personally try to make sure that we do not invest into silly stuff that could be a scam, but we would definitely invest into high level top 5 ones that could go on to be major players like bitcoin in our future.

All of them. They're all spread as investments, but they're all highly more vulnerable to manipulation, because far less institutions own most of them. The majority of altcoin developers focus on marketing tricks --and even more into their pockets-- not on the actual thing. This justifies on why they're working outside bitcoin.

Not just altcoins. NFTs, ICOs --worthless tokens generally-- are dumped in bear markets, because bear markets expose part of the truth: Utility.

If Bitcoin price stabilizes at some point in the future,  as many of us in this thread expect, then those coins in the top 5(I think it's pretty safe to say "in the top 10" even) will become more attractive to day traders. And unlike those coins you've mentioned that are not even in the top 1,000 on CMC,  coins from the top 10 have low chances of being a scam.

It’s hard for bitcoin to get stabilized, as its volatility will always be present no matter what. That is why using it as a currency or a legal tender might create more confusion on part of the people, the reason why the government is still hesitant to adopt it as a currency. However, in terms of market stabilization, I know in the long run bitcoin will bound to recover and will reach new all time highs once again. For now, let’s just grab the opportunity of buying it at a discounted price.

I absolutely think bitcoin's price will stabilize in time just be patient. Right now there are many factors contributing to BTC volatility. First, we are probably entering a recession due to massive government overspending and general mishandling of the pandemic.
Furthermore, the war in Ukraine has shaken the world economy up and it will take time for things to blow over. BTC price will be in a completely different place when the market conditions change. I just try and remain patient. I’m holding long anyway so I don’t even look at my wallet these days.

I think the government is still reviewing Bitcoin as a legal tender,
it is with this volatility that the government still has not legalized Bitcoin as legal tender,
we'll see what the future will be like because this is an interesting discussion

It will take longer to make the Bitcoin price stabilize.  We might probably have our grandchildren or great-grandchildren and yet the Bitcoin stabilization process is still ongoing.  One reason for this is the organic process really takes too long.  My hint would be after the mining block reward effect is negligible to the circulation of Bitcoin supply.

If Bitcoin were to be stable it would make things seem strange. so Bitcoin will continue like that to see if the price will get higher or lower in the next 10 years.

I agree with you. In times when everything around is very unstable, we can't expect something as volatile as BTC becoming stable all of a sudden. In times like these, people are selling their assets to cover their food needs and stuff, and Bitcoin is not an exception. But no pandemic and no war can last forever. Better times will come.

Stability will only be achieved when adoption is at a global level. Now adoption is no longer surprising as it is increasing day by day, but this adoption is still on a relatively small scale in the micro-industry.

Not many macro industries are willing to adopt bitcoin as a payment system, but some are already well-known. Macro adoption growth can help stability as bitcoin will be used more as a currency than for anything else. Of course adoption still has the potential to grow, but it will take us decades from now to use it on a larger/global scale.

Bitcoin will lose a big chunk of its volatility as its market cap increases, so the more pricier each Bitcoin, the lesser the volatility, and that will happen naturally.

You can see the opposite of that in low cap altcoins which due to small small market cap move +/-5% with a single large buy/sell.

But other than that there are also other factors that will have some influence over volatility, such as trust and reputation, obviously a new digital asset won't have the same trust and therefore lower volatility as a reputable coin like Bitcoin which has been around more than a decade, so as more time passes Bitcoin price could get less and less volatile and sensitive to short-term negative/positive news or be affected by what other markets are doing(like now that Bitcoin price is following US stocks), so in a way crypto market will mature itself as it ages.

https://i.imgur.com/YLB2Gjh.png
 source  (https://twitter.com/BitcoinMagEDU/status/1564183892864688129?t=W_cnLjrk-BV3XzBkDOhDQQ&s=19)

This is what i mean when i say bitcoin isn't loosing value but USD may be with time, inflation is the number one evidence to proof it, bitcoin cannot be a fixed value because all theories about volatility will come to an end and turn lies, after the whole blocks had been mined, quite alright miners will depend on incentives from transaction fees to earn profits but bitcoin will be independently controlled the more and everyone will tend to sell at his convenient prize, the network will still remain volatile and the price will continue to rise and fall just as it has always been, i believe volatility is one of the distinct difference bitcoin has over fiat as well.

We know that fiat not only dollar lose value punishing the savers, also bitcoin loses value and punish savers too. The only difference is bitcoin can decide to rise and give savers joy but fiat doesn't do so.
Bitcoin price will tend to stablize in the future when there is mass adoption and again when all the bitcoin has been mined. But before then we will continue with what we have. The volatility of bitcoin is one reason people are avoiding it.

Bitcoin has always been a victim of volatility ever since it was first listed on a crypto exchange. This problem doesn't have anything to do with the economic recession caused by the COVID-19 pandemic or the Russia-Ukraine war. The real issue is that the whole world still goes around Fiat. As long as people don't abandon the Fiat standard, Bitcoin's volatility won't disappear anytime soon. I've always wished people would use BTC regardless of its value in Fiat terms. 1 Bitcoin = 1 Bitcoin, right? If people did this, then Bitcoin wouldn't be viewed as a store of value but rather as digital cash.

Some countries already adopted Bitcoin as legal tender (eg: El Salvador and the Central African Republic) but there's a long road ahead before we could say BTC will become the standard unit of account. At least, we know Bitcoin won't be going anywhere. As long as decentralization prevails, nothing else matters. Just my thoughts ;D

They say there are more than 180 million users of Bitcoin worldwide. So, we are moving forward step by step. And I agree with you, the more users the more stable BTC will be. How many users we need for stability in your opinion? I personally think around half billion would be enough.