Bitcoin Forum

The user ChipMixer  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1003345) also do Signature campaigns here. Always pay for memebrs.
He seems to be more active than online casinos.

I think this guy is the richest on Bitcointalk.



I just read article that TORNADO CASH mixer was closed. TORNADO CASH was smaller site and less known than ChipMixer  and yet he had volume of 7 billions dollar (assuming owner made 2% is around 140 millon dollars.


This user ChipMixer  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1003345)had make ten of millions if not hundreds of millions from his site what you think?

You're linking to "chipmixer", not "cheapmixer". Why would you care how much money they make? They run a business, they're providing a service, kudos for them if they make some money from their business setup...

Sure i'm in their sigcampaign, which doesn't make me completely impartial... But still, i can honestly say i'd give the exact same response if i wasn't affiliated with them in any way.

This is an official account of Chipmixer, not a guy.

Chipmixer is a bitcoin mixer, no fee required but donation. Yes they are making money. They have one of the highest paying campaigns on this forum which could be an indication that people using their service are donating for them for good work done.

Not donating don't be fool. They made money from hundrends  of millions of dollars laundered money from black activities such as sellngs guns, drugs, terrorism etc.
This why the can be the highest payng campangns.
 

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You misunderstand the goal of this thread is to run discussion how profitable these chipmixer are not to mock the owners that he made hundends of millions.

[moderator's note: consecutive posts merged]

I think he's trying to troll and maybe try and stir some shit in the reputations board, why would anyone change the name from chipmixer to "cheapmixer" if it's not trolling.

Do you know that you made the thread look like a troll or is it just a bash topic because of the "CheapMixer" that you included on your first post? Before you edited it? That's why a lot of the members treat you that way and are not serious about the topic.

I edit it.  so stick to the topic. and don't spam . Both of 2 recent comments are completely out of topic.

And how do you know this? As far as I'm aware they still don't take a fee when somebody mixes on their website, so, is there a hidden site that I'm unaware of?

Other businesses made million of dollars too that greater than what chipmixer profit such as Binance and other huge exchange. Why this company earnings is so important to you? They earned it because they are the number Bitcoin mixer due to there strong marketing until now so who cares on there earnings if the owner risk his money for his business?

I knew that you mention that the goal of this thread is to determine how rich is the owner. Remember that owner promotes privacy on his business which means he wants privacy including his assets and profit. It’s nonsense to discuss this topic if we are just speculating on someone net worth.

So what are you proposing? That the government shuts down ChipMixer as well just because criminals are able to use it(Assuming they could)? Totally ignoring the day-to-day people that just want privacy?

the day-to-day people you talk about that want pricacy are all criminal. not that I have issue with them.
But stick to the fact.  Why else would you want a bitcoin mixer? Only for tax evasion, money laundering and other illegal activities.

Yea sure anyone that doesn't want their bitcoin holdings to be traced/viewed is automatically a criminal. That in itself is a really dumb take, regardless of what your opinion on ChipMixer(or privacy tools in general) is.

I use chipmixer because i think it's nobody's business to know how much funds i hold and where i hold them. This protects my family from a $5 wrench attack.
You called me a criminal, please provide proof that i did anything illegal in my current jurisdiction.

I will give you an analogy:
Why are you closing and even locking your door? It means (by your logic) that you must be doing something illegal there.
(also by extending that logic) If you would have nothing to hide, you would have no curtains, the door open and even advertising your address and what goods you keep at home.


Show some proof and maybe you can have some basis for a discussion. Else I could argue (for the fun of it) that you have made billions for selling meth.

Is this 2018 again? the only similarities that I can see is that both are bear market years and then we have trolls in the community attacking not just Chipmixer but any other bitcoin mixers and accusing them of working with criminals and should be taken down by the authorities. I've used a lot of mixers in the past and I would say that it protects and breaks my identity online.

What a bunch of bullshit nonsense crap  ::)
If you want to accuse someone for selling guns and weapons and stealing money with taxation extortion you should first look at your own government and army industrial complex.
People who are making guns and printing money are ones who are selling them, and that is certainly not Chipmixer.

It gets pretty boring addressing this same old nonsense over and over, especially when it is on a forum which was founded on the principle of financial sovereignty and not allowing third parties to hold complete power and jurisdiction over your finances.

The "Nothing to hide" argument has been so utterly debunked so many times (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5214200.msg53499357#msg53499357) that I am of the opinion that anyone who still repeats it is either a moron or is actively malicious and has an ulterior motive they are trying to push. Further, the evidence shows (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5220554.msg53785945#msg53785945) that only ~8% of mixer use is tied to illegal activities, and that by far the largest input to mixers is coins coming directly from centralized exchanges, i.e. average citizens who are doing nothing illegal and simply trying to reclaim some privacy against the global surveillance programs we are all subjected to.

Yes they charged me 17% (of donation) without me agreeing to it. lmao.

seems like is more prosperous business that i thought.

I test their tool:

proof

https://prnt.sc/yHifI0teand_

Haven't you heard that privacy is a fundamental human right that people barely achieve because of how big companies are trying to invade your personal shits and sell them for good?

If it's true that they made millions of dollars, then kudos to them as they made a privacy tool for bitcoiners to protect themselves from day-to-day pursuit of surveillance.

all the broke people who get few cents from from their signature feel need to protect chipmixer now?


By the way I sent $50 deposit and was charged 10$ fees. 

There it is. The ulterior motive I was talking about above. This user didn't read the instructions on the Step 1 page which quite clearly states the following:


He deposited 0.002427 BTC, which resulted in him being credited with a 0.002 BTC chip exactly as expected, and then opened a thread to say that everyone who wants privacy must be a criminal. ::)

I'll protect any privacy service from idiotic statements which claim that only criminals care about privacy.

Their funding and donation structure is clearly spelled out on their website. You could have deposited $50 and paid nothing had you bothered to read it.

You  broke and chipmixer pay you are bills i understand your need to be loyal to them. I don't need signature campaigns to get money so I say what I think.

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You think that they really make money from donations that you are a fool. I will not be surprised if they all the money from people who deposit 10 btc +
Do you think that a terrorist organization that  kill people and deposits 200 BTC each time will bother giving him a donation?


I am sure that he programmed his app that if someone sends for example 1000 btc it will charge him at least 10%.

Only people who send really large amounts will know the truth about the mechanism of this site.

But you  will never see them complain to interpol if they get scammed.

About my deposit of $50 he does not make it clear enough that I will pay $10.

Right. I'm certain that there are thousands of users who have lost thousands of BTC or more on ChipMixer and said nothing, but you donating 40,000 sats because you didn't read the instructions is what exposes them. ::)

It is made abundantly clear with the text I quoted above appearing immediately below the deposit address. It's also spelled out clearly in their FAQ. Something isn't a scam because you failed to read the instructions.

Mate, you seem to be getting a bit too riled up (for someone that didn't read crap about how the mixer works, hence lost 17% lmao). Here, I got some valuable advice for you..

The guy pays 20k weekly for signature campaigns. Do you think is from donations. don't be naive.


https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1935179.4640

Sure? It really isn't that impossible. You even got the numbers wrong. Last week, they paid $8200.

And let's not forget the revenue from people like you who don't read, despite the way chip sizes work being clearly explained in the mixing process. It's not like the information was hidden or something.

the information is not clear at all that he charges 17% he should put some warning or put a table of fees

like 50 -500$ - 15% FEES

200$ - 1000$ - 5% FEES

and so on.


On faq is also vague on the fees he wrote :

We use Pay what you want as pricing strategy. It mean you set how much value our service is to you.

he didn't mentioned that he will charge me 17% there.


the Bitcoin fees network is so small why he charge me 17% for small transactions? and for big transation he charges low?

something is sketchy here. Many red flags.

You only protect them because you get 300$ weekly from them on few posts. easy money why not defend them. i am none bias here.

If they'd print such a table, they'd be lying.
Since you keep on giving dollar values, i'll break it down in dollar values. Be advised that the chipsizes in BTC are not equal to the chipsizes in FIAT, so a $5 bill does not match an actual chipsize.

This is a service that has $5, $10, $50 and $100 bills. They do not deal in metal change coins. If you mix $6, they'll give you a $5 bill and you have donated $1 (since they don't have one dollar bills). If you would have send $15, you would have gotten a $5 and a $10 bill back, and you would have payed no fee.

This is clearly explained on multiple spots on chipmixer's site.

What i see is that you have accused every user of every mixer to be a criminal, but you failed to provide proof.
You have also accused chipmixer of scamming users that mix huge amounts without providing proof.

Now go ahead and make this all about chipmixer campaign users that are protecting chipmixer without providing any evidence for your accusations.

It's already clear, if you're don't understand what is chip size and increments on their rules, why you're not make a thread and ask about it first? You're seems like a mad guy who're not read the whole TOS and start blame the sites when there's a rules that you can't accept. Similar like casino with mandatory KYC, you're mad when they demand you KYC.

They're not charging 17% fixed fees, it's because you're mix small amount money and the amount exceed is considered as a donation. If you're deposit 0.001 BTC or 0.002 BTC, they wouldn't charge any fees from you.

You literally just got corrected by o_e_l_e_o 2 hours ago, with you even having a response to him, but yet you didn't even spend 2 minutes in checking how the fees/donations thing actually works. Instead, you came up with your own numbers. Bravo.

I won't agree here. Using a mixer doesn't mean we must need to do illegal activities. Any users can use it to hide their identify from the public. Because we know each transaction on the Blockchain is visible to anyone. I don't like that someone will follow my footprint. So I might use a Bitcoin mixer.

Calling people criminals themselves because they promote something that gives Bitcoin users a certain amount of privacy is completely pointless, because in that case any use of Bitcoin is a criminal activity, at least in some countries.

Furthermore, it is quite clear that a misunderstanding of how CM works, led to a 17% fee that the OP obviously cannot bear - so if it helps, I will gladly compensate him for that loss from my own pocket - with funds that have nothing to do with CM in any way.


Then why am I, as you say, loyal to CM? Since I've been in the sig campaign (3+ years) I haven't spent even 1 satoshi of everything I've earned? Maybe everything in your life revolves around money, maybe you think that whoever is behind CM earns millions and that only criminals use coin mixers - but for someone who doesn't know how to read a simple FAQ, you assume a lot that you can't prove in any way.

I don't know the essence of your thread, is it to discover how much Chipmixer is worth or how they run their business? Whatever is your purpose, I have this to say;

Chipmixer is a business and no one remains in business for so many years even when they are not making money.  I read that there was when Chipmixer was paying something higher than $300 per week and they have been consistent over the years, so it isn't a surprise that they may worth millions or billions. You wana start a coin mixing company? The opportunity is open for everyone and it is lucrative, you may want to try out your luck.

For the legality or nature of the business Chipmixer does, everything has it's two edges. If bitcoin can be accused of promoting illegality in the society, it won't be a surprise if everything relating to bitcoin has a share of it, and Chipmixer inclusive.

They didn't charge you anything. You voluntarily donated that amount.


Proof that you can't read or aren't intelligent enough to use a simple online tool:

https://i.imgur.com/xzxBihn.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/9RD3bZi.jpg

I would not call anyone using CM a criminal, but I would say that using any mixing service is going to involve the risk that the "added" privacy is just an illusion. I have no evidence to support this, but there is always the potential that CM is being run by a government in order to track the flow of coin. Even if this is not the case, there is always the potential that the government will take over CM (by using force), and will not make this public, at least at first.

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To answer the OP's question, I think it is very likely that CM is profitable on an operating basis. Their required operating expenses are likely to be low in relation to the volume they are mixing, and they can trivially change their "discretionary" operating expenses, such as promotions and advertising. Further, there is little incentive to keep coin on their platform for an extended period of time -- even if you "withdraw" a chip via a private key, but do not spend the coin on the private key, CM cannot reasonably use that coin because the customer who withdrew the chip would know their coin was randomly transferred.

Alex Jones, is that you with news conspiracy theories?  :P

To be fair, it could happen to CM like it could be the case with any other mixer. But CM is operating for many years now, if an agency was behind, they would have already finished doing what they wanted to do. Or they are very bad to track the flow of bitcoins.
We would also have seen news such as ABCD was arrested, we managed to track the funds that flowed here and there.
Also, with the various attacks that CM has undergone since,...

Taking over a mixer could also be possible. It happened with Bestmixer with the servers infected for many months. After "spying" enough, they decided to close the domain under seizure. If CM was in a case similar, the service would be closed since

Unless the agency wants to play the very long term but I can't imagine them running a mixer for years.
I could be naive this said.

@PrimeNumber7: true... But in my particular usecase, i would care less that the government knows how much funds i hold (i'm not saying i wouldn't care at all, it's just not my primary objective to hide my funds from the government). My biggest concern is criminals (and beggars). I'm not doing anything illegal, best case scenario the mixer is run by an honest company and nobody knows how much funds i hold, if it's run by a 3 letter agency i would be dissapointed, but i'm pretty sure a 3 letter agency will not come to my front door with a shotgun or a crowbar to threaten my family and steal my funds.

But once again, that's my usecase... It doesn't have to map with the usecase of other users.

CM could have made billions and we wouldn't even know, and we shouldn't even care. They are running a business, and it's normal for them to get some profits for their service. If they are managing to pay 50+ members with an average of $80 each every week, for a few years, this should already give you a clue that they are still doing pretty well, although the exact number of course is not known. A lot of people trusts the service, and they're actually delivering a good service, so whatever they are receiving is deserved.

You make a fair point in that if CM was in fact operated by a law enforcement agency, it would likely be discovered by now, as it is likely that some of the coin they mix is associated with criminal activity. I might counter this argument by saying that law enforcement could know that Alice is engaging in something illegal after tracing money flows through CM, and would then look at Alice specifically to try to find other evidence linking her to crimes. It is also possible that CM is being run by an intelligence agency that doesn't care about most crimes, and is trying to track money flows to/from enemy states, such as North Korea, Iran, Russia, etc.

On net, after considering your point, I think it is unlikely that CM was created by a law enforcement agency. Although there is always the potential that CM was taken over by a law enforcement agency "yesterday".

I am willing to speculate that most people who value their privacy are in a similar situation as what you describe and use CM (and other mixers/mixing technology) accordingly. In fact, some people may not even have substantial amounts of money to hide from criminals/beggars, but do not want to tip off said criminals if they were to become more successful and start using mixing technology.