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Alternate cryptocurrencies => Altcoin Discussion => Topic started by: gunhell16 on November 19, 2022, 06:49:40 AM



Title: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: gunhell16 on November 19, 2022, 06:49:40 AM
In this topic we will study a blockchain project that is greatly affected by the fall of FTX which is none other than Solana(SOL), So now let's find out the connection of Solana with Sam Bankman Fried in Ftx ventures, how big their holdings in Solana tokens. Most people here probably know that FTX is one of the early investors of this Solana project. So many are afraid that Solana may fall in value like the FTT token.

Do you think there is a high chance that Solana will be like what happened in FTX or is there any hope to recover?

But before all that, let others know what Solana is. It is one of the well-known layer1 smart contract blockchains in the market, which is one of what they say is an Ethereum killer. There is a large decentralized ecosystem that is now facing a major problem due to the collapse of FTX. The Solana Foundation released an article on how much exposure they have to FTX, and this is the fund they got stuck in FTX.

- 3.24m shares of ftx trading LTD common stocks
- 3.43m Ftt tokens
- 134.54m SRM tokens

So, 3 days ago if I'm not mistaken, the SRM token was pumped worth 40M$ and the FTT token was at 5M$ apart from the shares of ftx trading ltd, in short, they have 45M$ stuck.

Now if we look at the transaction of FTX Alameda in Solana foundation since 2020 after the mainnet beta launched there is ftx available with a total of 58,086,686 SOL in Alameda. Because some are unlocked on a linear monthly basis and others will be unlocked in 2025 and 2028.

And because of the chapter 11 bankruptcy file of ftx in Alameda, we don't know yet what will be done with these assets, whether they will be returned to investors or customers or whether they will be included in the market after dump before unlocking and it has no impact on the market today.
Referrence : https://solana.com/news/solana-facts-ftx-bankruptcy
Referrence : https://cryptoslate.com/solana-foundation-reveals-minimal-exposure-to-ftx/

And to make the story long short, the Solana community and Serum developers decided to fork Serum which is what is happening now, proving that Ftx has no connection with Serum. Because the potential of the project is a waste if it is only pulled by the collapse of FTX.

In addition to that, there are many projects under Solana that have exposure to FTX, but not all of them. So if any of you here are users of Solana, try to double-check the dex you are using here for the exposure in Ftx.

Referrence: About Serum - https://www.projectserum.com/
Referrence: https://portal.projectserum.com/
Referrence: https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/11/12/ftx-hack-spooks-solana-defi-community-igniting-revolution-at-alameda-controlled-serum-dex/
Referrence: https://coinculture.com/au/tech/solana-liquidity-hub-serum-to-be-forked-after-ftx-hack/


Final Thoughts

Now let's look at the reasons why Solana will live, but is there a chance for Solana to recover? The answer is yes first,

1. Its Ecosystem with one of the largest smart contract base applications in the market. There are many dapps and not all of them are connected to Ftx. even the Serum made by SBF can live without him because Solana's community and developers can handle it.
2. They no longer have a connection with SBF so it can no longer be called a BC chain. Then there is their Founder. But in the world of crypto, as long as the community and developers are there, Solana is still complete and they were only really affected by FTX because their name was attached to SBF.

We should also note that FTX is a centralized exchange. Solana is not, but a layer1 decentralized Ethereum blockchain. So, when it comes to this case they are very different. FTT tokens have no demand outside of the FTX platform. Solana is used in decentralized applications, NFT, and Defi.

So as long as someone believes in the blockchain, as long as there is a community and developers and there is demand, it is certain that the project can develop especially if its fundamentals are good. Besides, Solana didn't do anything bad to people, it seems its just felt sorry for Ftx. That's why I don't believe that the price will go down to zero, yes it can go down or fall but that doesn't mean it won't recover. As long as the team is there and making a progress on their projects it will thrive for sure. This is just my only opinion and not a piece of financial advice.

God bless you all and Hopefully, we learn a little bit of something about this topic anyway...


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: GreatArkansas on November 19, 2022, 08:01:16 AM
For me, it was normal that Solana experienced a huge dump because yeah FTX exchange is a big backer of Solana, and Solana for FTX exchange is like a BNB of Binance or CRO of Crypto.com
So for me, now that FTX exchange already filed bankruptcy and Alameda too. Solana is still here because it's not the same on what happened on Luna Ecosystem which it is direct issue with the project, Solana is different.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Dave1 on November 19, 2022, 09:11:38 AM
For me, it was normal that Solana experienced a huge dump because yeah FTX exchange is a big backer of Solana, and Solana for FTX exchange is like a BNB of Binance or CRO of Crypto.com
So for me, now that FTX exchange already filed bankruptcy and Alameda too. Solana is still here because it's not the same on what happened on Luna Ecosystem which it is direct issue with the project, Solana is different.

Yes, it could be very different scenario for Solana, but still though, they have been drag in this issues that it might take sometime for them to recovery (that is if they can bounce back).

So for me personally, this is not a financial advise, but I will stir clear of Solana for the meantime, until everything settles down a bit as the market is clearly very crazy because of this FTX collapse and everyone is very edgy on it's feet.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: cryptoaddictchie on November 19, 2022, 12:31:24 PM
With affiliation to FTX pretty sure there will be panic selling on traders and some of the big investors of their private sale shares. See the price of sol, almost near with avalanche. Only the difference is the volume which I think will change in positioning when solana continue to fall. Many are still uses solana due to effectivity on nfts. But with the impqct of FTX, no one will be spare on massive dumps that anything connected to FTX.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: DeathAngel on November 19, 2022, 12:58:11 PM
Solana can & probably will recover & reach new highs in a few years. I know it’s had a few outages but at one stage it was touted as an ETH killer, a real competitor & maybe successor to Vitalik’s beast. If you hold Solana then I advise you to stay strong & don’t listen to the FUD, maybe even add to your position if you’re able to.

We are in a widespread macro economic recession bear market. Everything is down except inflation :D
Stay strong, keep your conviction because Solana & crypto in general will moon.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: rhomelmabini on November 19, 2022, 01:05:11 PM
Imagine if it goes to the $3 buyzone of SBF, it could hit harder in the defi space and other space for Solana and it may instill fear onto the market. Moreover, they still has huge treasury and I think failing isn't on the mind of Solana founders, has huge community as well as developers developing in it, can handle huge TPS as an L1 and many more, maybe NFT community too.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: tbct_mt2 on November 19, 2022, 01:13:27 PM
Imagine if it goes to the $3 buyzone of SBF, it could hit harder in the defi space and other space for Solana and it may instill fear onto the market. Moreover, they still has huge treasury and I think failing isn't on the mind of Solana founders, has huge community as well as developers developing in it, can handle huge TPS as an L1 and many more, maybe NFT community too.
We can take the buy zone of SBF to consider a bottom for $SOL but Solana is not FTX and FTT token that are more connected to SBF and Alameda.

Solana is a different project and if their developers can resolve its technical drawbacks and if it can survive in this bear market which might last one more year, Solana will be able to rise again in a new bull run.

When a new bull run begins? It will be warmed up in late 2023 and will take off in 2024, maybe in Q2 2024. One more year to know about future of Solana and please keep it away from SBF and FTX.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: ultrloa on November 19, 2022, 01:14:37 PM
For me, it was normal that Solana experienced a huge dump because yeah FTX exchange is a big backer of Solana, and Solana for FTX exchange is like a BNB of Binance or CRO of Crypto.com
So for me, now that FTX exchange already filed bankruptcy and Alameda too. Solana is still here because it's not the same on what happened on Luna Ecosystem which it is direct issue with the project, Solana is different.

Yes, it could be very different scenario for Solana, but still though, they have been drag in this issues that it might take sometime for them to recovery (that is if they can bounce back).

So for me personally, this is not a financial advise, but I will stir clear of Solana for the meantime, until everything settles down a bit as the market is clearly very crazy because of this FTX collapse and everyone is very edgy on it's feet.

Maybe their relation creates some panic to their investors but since SOL is still alive and kicking for sure it still have possibilities that it will rise up. This one is still place in top alts so for sure FTX controversy will be nothing once great recovery will happen(bull run) since for sure many people will forget about those issues.

For now maybe the holders of SOL decrease but once it is slowly recovering for sure those past holders will comeback to get some profits for holding or investing back again.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Sayeds56 on November 19, 2022, 01:26:54 PM
Yes! It is possible in the long term but not in the mid to short term, the current circumstances of market and lack of any competitive advantage doesn't favor its quick price recovery. The slump we see in SOLANA is mainly spillover effect of FTX because of its close affiliation. The wounds market got from FTX collapse will continue bleeding for sometime until some macro level good news starts healing it.

 


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: rhomelmabini on November 19, 2022, 05:20:57 PM
Imagine if it goes to the $3 buyzone of SBF, it could hit harder in the defi space and other space for Solana and it may instill fear onto the market. Moreover, they still has huge treasury and I think failing isn't on the mind of Solana founders, has huge community as well as developers developing in it, can handle huge TPS as an L1 and many more, maybe NFT community too.
We can take the buy zone of SBF to consider a bottom for $SOL but Solana is not FTX and FTT token that are more connected to SBF and Alameda.

Solana is a different project and if their developers can resolve its technical drawbacks and if it can survive in this bear market which might last one more year, Solana will be able to rise again in a new bull run.

When a new bull run begins? It will be warmed up in late 2023 and will take off in 2024, maybe in Q2 2024. One more year to know about future of Solana and please keep it away from SBF and FTX.
Yes, I totally understand that, it's just for an instance in the worst-case scenario and everything is possible when the market is fearful. We don't really know when will the market recover but as I've said, Solana will surely live. SBF and FTX are surely out of the picture here but with the drama they created, it will surely have a bad imprint in the space.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: BIT-BENDER on November 19, 2022, 08:14:40 PM
I think Solana still have hope. Infact some Crypto-currency enthusiast I respect so much are seeing this as an opportunity, well don't get your guard down make sure you do your own research. I think Solana what greatly involved in FTX exchange and what is experiencing right now is a mixture of the already poor market and the events unfolding on FTX exchange.

I think Solana has a large community and since it's not an official coin of the FTX exchange it can definitely bounce back, generally coins in the crypto space now aren't having the best of times.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Jating on November 19, 2022, 08:47:00 PM
I think Solana still have hope. Infact some Crypto-currency enthusiast I respect so much are seeing this as an opportunity, well don't get your guard down make sure you do your own research. I think Solana what greatly involved in FTX exchange and what is experiencing right now is a mixture of the already poor market and the events unfolding on FTX exchange.

Well that's what everyone is saying, or at least the people behind involved in a project that goes down. The thing with Solana is that there have been a lot of negative news, like Hacks and then the whole FTX in which their name is being drag.

I think Solana has a large community and since it's not an official coin of the FTX exchange it can definitely bounce back, generally coins in the crypto space now aren't having the best of times.

And that big community as well will tilt the balance in the other side if they see that Solana is a big risk to put their money right now.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: crzy on November 19, 2022, 08:53:42 PM
Yes! It is possible in the long term but not in the mid to short term, the current circumstances of market and lack of any competitive advantage doesn't favor its quick price recovery. The slump we see in SOLANA is mainly spillover effect of FTX because of its close affiliation. The wounds market got from FTX collapse will continue bleeding for sometime until some macro level good news starts healing it.
They need to make a good improvements and prove that they will not ended up with the same faith of FTX.
SOL can still rise but for now they have to suffer since the market are still down and there’s still a lot of FUD because of the FTX issues. If SOL will focus more on the security and good updates, many investors will trust them again and that’s a good sign of recovery, this will take time.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: serjent05 on November 19, 2022, 10:20:50 PM
Solana needs to tackle and solve the problem of its security.  Leaving it as that will only lose the confidence of the crypto investors.  About FTX, it is really regretful to have one of the supporting company to get bankrupt, though I do not think that the SOL held by FTX will be in circulation soon because as far as I know, their funds are somehow frozen, there is no immediate dump for FTX of its  Solana holdings.

They need to make a good improvements and prove that they will not ended up with the same faith of FTX.
SOL can still rise but for now they have to suffer since the market are still down and there’s still a lot of FUD because of the FTX issues. If SOL will focus more on the security and good updates, many investors will trust them again and that’s a good sign of recovery, this will take time.

I agree, Solana needs to deliver and fix their security issue.  I think it is the major one that is holding Solana back.  Solana had already a huge community, the Dev just need good news and update in order for Solana market to recover.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: o48o on November 19, 2022, 11:15:38 PM
I honestly think that their exposure to ftx was a minor issue that's affecting only to price and not Solana fundamentals (Unless something new gets revealed about their illegal price manipulation tactics or something).

But unfortunately fundamentals alone are enough for keeping it down. Vulnerabilities in a multi-billion marketcap project on which the whole essence should be about security is just fatal blow for getting any serious reputation. In fact that turns down so many institutional and serious players i can't see a way out for sol. It doesn't matter if SOL fanboys still see a change if everything is fixed when the reputation is tainted.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Tony116 on November 19, 2022, 11:20:20 PM
Not only Solana is facing a lot of difficulties when their biggest investor, FTX, has collapsed, besides, Solana's blockchain also has too many potential risks, if I remember correctly it has had outages 9 times this year and sadly they have not been able to fix this problem. This is unacceptable for a blockchain that is rated as the top in the market.

Solana won't die for FTX, although FTX is a major sponsor and contributor to Sol's success, FTX is not the only investor in Sol. Sol will really come back or not is up to them, as long as their blockchain gets better and better then other big investors will notice. One more thing, Sol's ICO price of 0.1$ means they are still very overvalued in the market, I predict it will continue to decrease in the near term.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Sayeds56 on November 20, 2022, 01:04:05 AM
Not only Solana is facing a lot of difficulties when their biggest investor, FTX, has collapsed, besides, Solana's blockchain also has too many potential risks, if I remember correctly it has had outages 9 times this year and sadly they have not been able to fix this problem. This is unacceptable for a blockchain that is rated as the top in the market.

Solana won't die for FTX, although FTX is a major sponsor and contributor to Sol's success, FTX is not the only investor in Sol. Sol will really come back or not is up to them, as long as their blockchain gets better and better then other big investors will notice. One more thing, Sol's ICO price of 0.1$ means they are still very overvalued in the market, I predict it will continue to decrease in the near term.

The recovery of SOLANA depends on its team who need to work hard to find new partnerships and improve their block chain which had been shut down many times due to technical issues. This outage was the beginning of SOLANA decline & collapse of FTX added fuel to the fire otherwise SOLANA had made huge progress to build strong use case of their coin during the past 2 years. SOLANA is still one of the top 10 block chain with highest transaction speed which is its strength and gives it competitive edge.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: merekamo on November 20, 2022, 05:25:22 AM
Overall, not only SOLANA was affected, almost all altcoins fell due to the FTX problem. Because indeed all investors are waiting for the time to invest again in crypto.

If we look at recent crypto projects, in phase Q4 there are actually many projects that will be launching. But because of the FTX case, now the crypto project is waiting for the market situation to return to normal.
 
I don't know the relationship between Sam Bankman Fried and Solana. Last I read, the Solana team hadn't mentioned anything about the financial problems SOL was facing due to FTX.

Although the original price of SOL was low, but they still had a good ICO to recover quickly and this will help with the economic situation, but right now many people doubt that Solana can fix it economically. We hope everything returns to normal soon.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Yatsan on November 20, 2022, 10:35:46 AM
If it is chance in its broadest sense, yes it has a tendency to recover simply because it has a community of users already. And what happened recently just pulled its market price down, and that is really unexpected. My friends are traders for years and they expected a pump before the incident. Other traders as well predicted the opposite of what happened. Solana is here in this industry for years and previous pumps, it was often carried away so yes, it may still rise once bull run enter this market. The problem is assurance that it would. But if it is just chances, higher chance that it would. Solana chain is being used on different utilities, in the first place. So for those who are holding, keep going and wait if you can endure the situation of this moment.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: zasad@ on November 20, 2022, 06:14:02 PM
Unfortunately, it is very difficult to make investment decisions after reading these articles. Solana is a buy because the price of this coin could rise to $100-$200 in the next bull market. But if you believe that aptos will kill solana, then you should not invest in it. If the price of the coin drops to $8, I will probably take the risk and buy the coin in the long term.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Rana590 on November 20, 2022, 06:44:26 PM
Unfortunately, it is very difficult to make investment decisions after reading these articles. Solana is a buy because the price of this coin could rise to $100-$200 in the next bull market. But if you believe that aptos will kill solana, then you should not invest in it. If the price of the coin drops to $8, I will probably take the risk and buy the coin in the long term.
It is very much possible to reach $100 for Solana within next 1 year. I think Solana will be able to recover its price very soon. It is a golden time for us to buy Solana at a lower price. I don't think price will fall more than current price. I'm still buying Solana and obviously I'll buy more if it drops under $10.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: lalabotax on November 20, 2022, 09:49:18 PM
In my opinion, if there are no other projects similarly that will be hyped in the bullish era, Solana may have a bigger chance to rise up again. But, if there are some or any, well, this may be difficult. Because many people like more the new ones that is in hype to make some short-term investment. Do you remember that many good projects in the bullish era of 2017 failed to rise up again in the bullish era previously? Because they were likely replaced by the new ones with better technology and startegy. The goal is only to earn profits, but not for long-term investment. However, the Solana project is actually interesting and good enough. But, they also still have some problems to be fixed so that any more people will put their trust in Solana.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: TastyChillySauce00 on November 20, 2022, 11:48:00 PM
FTX's token has been experiencing steady decline since the collapse from the exchange site. FTT is always going down along with solana. I can even imagine what's gonna happen with solana when the price will be reaching zero value. FTX has still owned bunch of solana which has not yet got liquidity. Im sure that liquidators will be liquidating all of remaining assets owned by sol despite the hacked that happened with it. I would prefer to call that as insider hack rather than a hack conducted by a real hacker.

The price will be dipping even deeper than before. The dead of solana is ahead of us. I just avoid to buy any tokens that strongly affiliate with FTX at this moment. It's very risky investment pretty much the same like doing future.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: kurniawan05 on November 21, 2022, 12:06:18 AM
So much FUD for Solana these past few weeks, some even predict solana price will drop at $5, I think as long as Team Solana and their community are solid, their technology is good and they are able to overcome this crisis, by then I think solana price will recover.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Paul Pogba on November 21, 2022, 09:23:09 AM
So much FUD for Solana these past few weeks, some even predict solana price will drop at $5, I think as long as Team Solana and their community are solid, their technology is good and they are able to overcome this crisis, by then I think solana price will recover.

Many panicked and if we look at the trend of Solana being almost the same as FTX a few days ago so that Solana dropped significantly, I hope Solana can recover and strengthen again, now attacking each other the founders of cryptocurrencies and exchanges is so massive that it hurts the market.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Maidak on November 21, 2022, 09:32:17 AM
FTX's token has been experiencing steady decline since the collapse from the exchange site. FTT is always going down along with solana. I can even imagine what's gonna happen with solana when the price will be reaching zero value. FTX has still owned bunch of solana which has not yet got liquidity. Im sure that liquidators will be liquidating all of remaining assets owned by sol despite the hacked that happened with it. I would prefer to call that as insider hack rather than a hack conducted by a real hacker.

The price will be dipping even deeper than before. The dead of solana is ahead of us. I just avoid to buy any tokens that strongly affiliate with FTX at this moment. It's very risky investment pretty much the same like doing future.

As far as I know FTX invests and will get about 58 million Sol tokens and it will be allocated until 2025 which means they also won't be able to get a chance to dump Sol in one go. FTX is Sol's biggest investor, not the blockchain operator solana. So whether Sol will continue to develop or stop is the decision of their team, not the decision of FTX. I don't like Sol because it's too centralized, but judging by it I still believe it can get through this tough period.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: stadus on November 21, 2022, 09:38:05 AM
So much FUD for Solana these past few weeks, some even predict solana price will drop at $5, I think as long as Team Solana and their community are solid, their technology is good and they are able to overcome this crisis, by then I think solana price will recover.

Many panicked and if we look at the trend of Solana being almost the same as FTX a few days ago so that Solana dropped significantly, I hope Solana can recover and strengthen again, now attacking each other the founders of cryptocurrencies and exchanges is so massive that it hurts the market.
No, compared them wrongly. Because what happened to FTX is a different issue, unlike Solana which is all about the development of the project and people aren't looking at it valuable anymore. I thought before that Solan becomes one of the promising coins in the future. In fact, I have the plan to invest more but too lucky enough that it this project shows the real situation and withdraw my plan.
Though I wasn't hopeless yet to seeing Solana will recover but the chances are very slim. We know investors are really hard to please if they already had suffer losses from a particular project.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Orange89 on November 21, 2022, 04:29:08 PM
Everything is depend upon the early investor of the Solana All though i am still positive about the sol Ecosystem just I personally got Around 34 Sol Airdrop/token 2$ when it's Launched the Fishy thing about all that Binance is paushing some Sol pair trading in the exchange again and again you can buy in the Parts if you wanted to invest right now


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: tygeade on November 21, 2022, 06:13:20 PM
Many panicked and if we look at the trend of Solana being almost the same as FTX a few days ago so that Solana dropped significantly, I hope Solana can recover and strengthen again, now attacking each other the founders of cryptocurrencies and exchanges is so massive that it hurts the market.
No, compared them wrongly. Because what happened to FTX is a different issue, unlike Solana which is all about the development of the project and people aren't looking at it valuable anymore. I thought before that Solan becomes one of the promising coins in the future. In fact, I have the plan to invest more but too lucky enough that it this project shows the real situation and withdraw my plan.
Though I wasn't hopeless yet to seeing Solana will recover but the chances are very slim. We know investors are really hard to please if they already had suffer losses from a particular project.
The difference between "one of them stole, the other failed" is not as big as you think it is. Solana offered 65k TPS and got frozen even at 15k which means that they are not what they claim they are and that's going to cause a ton of problem for the investors.

Solana is something that failed, at least to me it is something that failed, they are not scammers they are not shady they are not stealing your money but they just failed to succeed which means that it is not really that much different from getting hacked or something. This is why it has been over a year since I owned any solana, I have sold all my solana and got out because to me it's just a purely failed project.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Roman_Picisan on November 21, 2022, 11:32:45 PM
Many panicked and if we look at the trend of Solana being almost the same as FTX a few days ago so that Solana dropped significantly, I hope Solana can recover and strengthen again, now attacking each other the founders of cryptocurrencies and exchanges is so massive that it hurts the market.
No, compared them wrongly. Because what happened to FTX is a different issue, unlike Solana which is all about the development of the project and people aren't looking at it valuable anymore. I thought before that Solan becomes one of the promising coins in the future. In fact, I have the plan to invest more but too lucky enough that it this project shows the real situation and withdraw my plan.
Though I wasn't hopeless yet to seeing Solana will recover but the chances are very slim. We know investors are really hard to please if they already had suffer losses from a particular project.
The difference between "one of them stole, the other failed" is not as big as you think it is. Solana offered 65k TPS and got frozen even at 15k which means that they are not what they claim they are and that's going to cause a ton of problem for the investors.

Solana is something that failed, at least to me it is something that failed, they are not scammers they are not shady they are not stealing your money but they just failed to succeed which means that it is not really that much different from getting hacked or something. This is why it has been over a year since I owned any solana, I have sold all my solana and got out because to me it's just a purely failed project.
A downturn like this risks a lack of investor confidence in my Solana, which has decreased by half in price (50%) as a result of this case. Their failure could be very bad this year for them, especially going forward with the issue of a severe recession in 2023.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: asriloni on November 22, 2022, 11:38:20 PM
Everything is depend upon the early investor of the Solana All though i am still positive about the sol Ecosystem just I personally got Around 34 Sol Airdrop/token 2$ when it's Launched the Fishy thing about all that Binance is paushing some Sol pair trading in the exchange again and again you can buy in the Parts if you wanted to invest right now
Investing in solana just like buying a knife that can hurt you anytime. You have bunch of legit tokens available in the market other than solana and why do you need to buy solana? that doesn't even make sense. I think that binance has been taking the right decision to pause some trading pair for solana. Solana has a very strong relationship with SBF. SBF itself was making self support for solana and that's why solana can become big caused by it has been helped by SBF.
Solana was nothing rather than a garbage blockchain that frequently being paused due to the network problem. Investing in this coin must become the worst choice that can be taken by people.
I hope that people will understand to never invest in this piece of shit again. The price may go drop even further as FTX was also going drop so hard.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: yazher on November 23, 2022, 10:28:11 AM
As long as they sincerely develop their project to give their users and investors promising development, they will stay alive throughout this roller-coaster event in the crypto industry because they are willing to sacrifice some money to improve their service. However, when they only all talk and keep delaying their promise. In that case, they will see their investors migrating to another promising project in the market, leaving them with fewer and fewer investors every month, which will become the exact reason for their fall. This is what happened to some failed projects out there and they all cannot bounce back since they lose the trust of their investors.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Questat on November 23, 2022, 11:40:44 AM
**

Do you think there is a high chance that Solana will be like what happened in FTX or is there any hope to recover?
....

I wasn't really skeptical about the situation but since Solana is still there, I would this project still have the chance either.
Now, it was from the team or the developers to find a way to make people bring back their trust and appreciate their services. It was really tough for them in this current situation but this will never say that the future of Solana is dark, lights can be seen if they will take action and find a long-term solution.
Most importantly, the team will never give up but rather push themselves to work hard.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: roslinpl on November 23, 2022, 11:42:31 AM
Now the market is very green, So their is huge chance of some rise in Solana too. If you had some Solana for the longer period, just hold it to gain some good value from it. The transaction of many coins was made using Solana, So this made some demand for the coin. People with good potential for the investment should keep their investment in the Solana. Some tweets was made with the tag of Solana as the next BSC. So early adoption helps to gain good money.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: drwhobox on November 23, 2022, 01:05:25 PM
It's possible in the long run, but not in the medium or short term. The way the market is right now and the fact that it doesn't have a competitive advantage don't help its price recover quickly. Because SOLANA and FTX are so related, FTX is mostly to blame for the drop in SOLANA. The market's wounds from the fall of FTX will keep bleeding for a while until some big-picture good news starts to recover them.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: asyakashi on November 23, 2022, 01:43:11 PM
Selena's potential like FTX remains a possibility but that's still a long way off. They are merely investors and projects. But there is no tied to the team of any of them. This is just how Solana brings her project forward. Whether they can be used as guidelines like Ethereum or even collapse like FTX. It was the provision of Solana itself.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: zasad@ on November 23, 2022, 02:54:25 PM
OOPS.. it looks really bad.
https://defillama.com/chain/Solana
Solana has a problem not with the price, but with decentralization. Exchanges banned stablecoin deposits in the Solana ecosystem for a reason. And until the situation with the FTX exchange is over, the growth of the TVL ecosystem is not expected.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: BigBos on November 25, 2022, 03:50:24 AM
Solana is one of the most innovative innovations, designed to facilitate decentralized applications (Dapps) that aim to facilitate the scalability of proof-of-stake combined with proof-of-history.
they provide it with Proof of History (PoH) to help know when a transaction was made, developed by Anatoly Yakovenko.
The hybrid protocol built into the Solana network provides significantly reduced validation times for lightning-fast smart contract transactions and execution.
 
The association with FTX makes investors both small and large fear that Solana will suffer the same fate as FTX. I think from a fundamental standpoint, Solana will improve even if it takes a while.

because it's basically Solana.
1. Its Ecosystem with one of the largest smart contract base applications in the market. There are many dapps and not all of them are connected to Ftx. even the Serum made by SBF can live without him because Solana's community and developers can handle it.
2. They no longer have a connection with SBF so it can no longer be called a BC chain. Then there is their Founder. But in the world of crypto, as long as the community and developers are there, Solana is still complete and they were only really affected by FTX because their name was attached to SBF.

We should also note that FTX is a centralized exchange. Solana is not, but a layer1 decentralized Ethereum blockchain. So, when it comes to this case they are very different. FTT tokens have no demand outside of the FTX platform. Solana is used in decentralized applications, NFT, and Defi.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: rozak on November 25, 2022, 06:52:05 AM
I'm worried that Solana will have the same fate as FTT. Solana network problems have been around for a long time, it could get worse for Solana network users if there is an attack from negative news. this will create a negative sentiment toward the adoption and trading of Sol. if there was a continuous decline, it would end badly. Sol was temporarily suspended for trading on several exchanges. but in the end, they got on with it.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Natalim on November 25, 2022, 09:17:25 AM
As long as they sincerely develop their project to give their users and investors promising development, they will stay alive throughout this roller-coaster event in the crypto industry because they are willing to sacrifice some money to improve their service. However, when they only all talk and keep delaying their promise. In that case, they will see their investors migrating to another promising project in the market, leaving them with fewer and fewer investors every month, which will become the exact reason for their fall. This is what happened to some failed projects out there and they all cannot bounce back since they lose the trust of their investors.
Solana won't die easily but slowly, that is my take.
I'd seen the fast growth of Solana last year, in fact, many had thought that it was next big in the market but unfortunately, not all who have a good start will succeed in the end. And what happened to Solana will tell us that there is something wrong with them and with this project. Good thing is that I already sell my Solana already at a time when the price to moving high and never reinvested again. My instinct is right but I'm worried about those who still buy them even though they have issues already.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: inanilujimi on November 25, 2022, 12:33:12 PM
Solana was one of the best blockchain candidates before frequent outages on its network. but even so, solana survives even though it continues to be attacked with so much fud, there is no doubt that the community and developers are very strong, I believe that solana can rise while still getting support from the community.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Bitcoin1216 on November 25, 2022, 01:08:03 PM
Solana certainly has a great potential for Rise Again, the market conditions are still red like now making all assets drop, this does not only happen with Solana but other top coins such as ETH or BNB also drop, now is a good time to buy Solana.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Ziskinberg on November 25, 2022, 02:03:59 PM
Solana certainly has a great potential for Rise Again, the market conditions are still red like now making all assets drop, this does not only happen with Solana but other top coins such as ETH or BNB also drop, now is a good time to buy Solana.
But I don't think so. Solana lost its market demand due to some issue that deliberately made its value drop more even without the bear season, it can still be possible seeing that situation. That is why don't expect too much from this project, better put your money and hope into the projects that are worthy of our trust and investment. We have to accept that Solana didn't make a successful attempt. Might we will still see it in the CMC, I can imagine the low value of this coin.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: justdimin on November 26, 2022, 10:33:24 AM
I'm worried that Solana will have the same fate as FTT. Solana network problems have been around for a long time, it could get worse for Solana network users if there is an attack from negative news. this will create a negative sentiment toward the adoption and trading of Sol. if there was a continuous decline, it would end badly. Sol was temporarily suspended for trading on several exchanges. but in the end, they got on with it.
Unfortunately, that looks like a quite big possibility. I am not saying that it is 100% guaranteed, but the looks of it that Solana constantly have some technical issues, and if those technical issues become a lot more frequent then it would definitely cause it to crash. So, what is the path? To make sure that they fix all of that before the bull run comes, but without testing it, it would be very difficult to be certain they are fixed.

Simply, I would have to say it’s a difficult situation to be in for sure, there is no guarantee of anything and you are risking your money if you buy solana at this moment. It may survive, or it may crash very hard.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: albon on November 26, 2022, 04:47:54 PM
Most of what I have seen is that there are a lot of people talking negatively about Solana, after the collapse of the FTX platform and its bankruptcy, as Solana lost millions of dollars and Solana was unable to recover its balances, and I see that Solana coin has become a victim of this storm, as it lost more than half of its value in less than a month, frankly There will be a great risk in Solana coin investment, so everyone should not enter with big money. For me, I will invest a small amount in it, perhaps we will find something positive in its price in the short term that reflects all expectations.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: fzkto on November 26, 2022, 06:07:21 PM
Most of what I have seen is that there are a lot of people talking negatively about Solana, after the collapse of the FTX platform and its bankruptcy, as Solana lost millions of dollars and Solana was unable to recover its balances, and I see that Solana coin has become a victim of this storm, as it lost more than half of its value in less than a month, frankly There will be a great risk in Solana coin investment, so everyone should not enter with big money. For me, I will invest a small amount in it, perhaps we will find something positive in its price in the short term that reflects all expectations.
Many people are just as negative about solana after this unfinished project experienced difficulties with their blockchain or because of scam applications that stole record amounts of money. So it's not surprising that even more people started to hate solana after FTX collapsed. I also think it's a dead project in the future and will quickly have a replacement.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: molsewid on November 26, 2022, 08:16:16 PM
Most of what I have seen is that there are a lot of people talking negatively about Solana, after the collapse of the FTX platform and its bankruptcy, as Solana lost millions of dollars and Solana was unable to recover its balances, and I see that Solana coin has become a victim of this storm, as it lost more than half of its value in less than a month, frankly There will be a great risk in Solana coin investment, so everyone should not enter with big money. For me, I will invest a small amount in it, perhaps we will find something positive in its price in the short term that reflects all expectations.
Many people are just as negative about solana after this unfinished project experienced difficulties with their blockchain or because of scam applications that stole record amounts of money. So it's not surprising that even more people started to hate solana after FTX collapsed. I also think it's a dead project in the future and will quickly have a replacement.
That's what I am thinking as well, correct me if I'm wrong even though Solana is different project to FTX still everyone knows in the world that the major reason they are in that place is because of they are being backed by FTX which is already filed for bankruptcy and last time it is announced being hacked. Solana will take years before it can recover and they need to have other partner venture to continue the plan, it will be seems so impossible to happen but it is still possible just a proper execution and they need to learn from the past.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: OgNasty on November 26, 2022, 10:33:54 PM
There is a lot of bad accusations surrounding Solana right now. I imagine that the price is headed lower in the near term. Having Google as a supporter was a great announcement for them, but the FTX drama and now Bitboy saying that it’s just the tip of the iceberg, I would be hesitant about investing anything in Solana right now. Sure, it could bounce back up, but it could also go to zero. I’d definitely wait until the hype train gets rolling again before considering touching Solana.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Mr. Magkaisa on November 27, 2022, 04:41:08 AM
 - Sometimes FUD is done differently on different platforms to create information that can destroy an altcoins in this era.

But even so, I know and I believe that they can survive or overcome whatever they are going through in the market. Yes, its value will be affected right now because of what happened with Ftx, but I just don't think that will be a big reason for its price to continue to fall in the market in my own opinion, especially since it's good the development that is happening now in Solana.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Lambe Ndumble on November 27, 2022, 06:28:23 AM
I was surprised when I saw the ranking of Solana at this time was ranked 14 which usually always entered the top 6 ranking, but the good thing was this week the price had gone up more than 9%, I was sure when the market began to improve then Solana would immediately skyrocket and enter the top 5 ranking .


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Cling18 on November 27, 2022, 06:45:30 AM
The FTX issue has affected Solana real bad but I'm sure that things will still get better for it especially when the market goes into its recovery phase. Solana has built a good foundation already so it wouldn't crash continuously that easily. There will be investors who will doubt and would feel hesitant but I'm sure that it still has a huge potential to rise again. We only have to wait until the market recovers.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: erk on November 28, 2022, 01:47:04 AM
The FTX issue has affected Solana real bad but I'm sure that things will still get better for it especially when the market goes into its recovery phase. Solana has built a good foundation already so it wouldn't crash continuously that easily. There will be investors who will doubt and would feel hesitant but I'm sure that it still has a huge potential to rise again. We only have to wait until the market recovers.

FTX dumped a lot of SOL which helped drag the price down.
That dump should be finished by now, and margin calls should have stabilized.

I don't believe there is anything fundamentally wrong with SOL and it's network, therefore it should crawl back up once this "dump everything flight to USD" cycle is finally over.



Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: TastyChillySauce00 on November 28, 2022, 10:54:04 PM
This Solana price prediction (https://coincodex.com/crypto/solana/price-prediction/) is quite optimistic :D If we get hit by another bull wave in the next year I think it's not that far-fetched.

That's nice chart for 1 year prediction but i didn't even think the chart will be like that. It may needs at least a few years or until bitcoin will have done another halving again to decrease the block reward and inflation rate caused by miners. Solana needs bitcoin to be pumped so hard like what you have mentioned in the chart. Another bullwave is not likely to come in the next year. It may probably takes a few years to recover from the bottom yet we didn't know what's gonna happen for sure caused by it can be even shorter or longer due to the various factors that were affecting the price in the crypto. As long as the condition from another country will be steadily recovering from the recessions and im sure that if solana can rise again but touching new ath will not happen until bitcoin will do that first.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: alexandr1115 on December 02, 2022, 12:34:49 PM
Most of what I have seen is that there are a lot of people talking negatively about Solana, after the collapse of the FTX platform and its bankruptcy, as Solana lost millions of dollars and Solana was unable to recover its balances, and I see that Solana coin has become a victim of this storm, as it lost more than half of its value in less than a month, frankly There will be a great risk in Solana coin investment, so everyone should not enter with big money. For me, I will invest a small amount in it, perhaps we will find something positive in its price in the short term that reflects all expectations.

that's right! The drop is also due to the fact that the Binance exchange has stopped accepting USDC and USDT deposits on the Solana blockchain without any explanation!! Also, the acceptance of USDC и USDT deposits in the Solana network was discontinued by exchanges under the names: OKX, Bybit, BitMEX, KuCoin, MXC и Crypto.com.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: posi on December 02, 2022, 12:52:37 PM
Most of what I have seen is that there are a lot of people talking negatively about Solana, after the collapse of the FTX platform and its bankruptcy, as Solana lost millions of dollars and Solana was unable to recover its balances, and I see that Solana coin has become a victim of this storm, as it lost more than half of its value in less than a month, frankly There will be a great risk in Solana coin investment, so everyone should not enter with big money. For me, I will invest a small amount in it, perhaps we will find something positive in its price in the short term that reflects all expectations.

that's right! The drop is also due to the fact that the Binance exchange has stopped accepting USDC and USDT deposits on the Solana blockchain without any explanation!! Also, the acceptance of USDC и USDT deposits in the Solana network was discontinued by exchanges under the names: OKX, Bybit, BitMEX, KuCoin, MXC и Crypto.com.

That is not the main reason for the recent slump of solana. Solana is considered the project most affected by the collapse of FTX because they are the largest investor and Sol's success has a significant contribution from FTX but I think Sol won't be able to die from the collapse of FTX because FTX is not the only investor in it. I do not appreciate Sol because their blockchain simply has too many inadequacies and they have not been able to fix it. Currently, according to statistics, Solana has the largest development team after ETH, showing that they are still working hard to develop themselves.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Kelvinid on December 02, 2022, 02:20:56 PM
- Sometimes FUD is done differently on different platforms to create information that can destroy an altcoins in this era.

But even so, I know and I believe that they can survive or overcome whatever they are going through in the market. Yes, its value will be affected right now because of what happened with Ftx, but I just don't think that will be a big reason for its price to continue to fall in the market in my own opinion, especially since it's good the development that is happening now in Solana.
If you believe the FUDs, then you are also destroying your trust in crypto. But I see it is not the only thing we get from spreading it because it also retests our capability to decide what is right and what is wrong.

Whether Solan rises again or not, we can't blame the FUDs. It was just time to see and realized that Solana doesn't have the full market potential. Not to wonder why its price dropped because investors ignore and rejected this project. The demand is decreasing together with the market and the bear season helping it to drop more. This project will just rise if the developers will improve it.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Ani1985 on December 02, 2022, 03:00:19 PM
Solana is a large project that enters the top ranking even ranked 4th, unfortunately the market conditions make the big correction of Solana, some problems such as slow networks make users impatient, but I'm sure Solana immediately rose and recovered again.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: evichi on December 02, 2022, 11:57:08 PM
IMO, yes, it can, but it might a long time. Solana is built to have numerous use cases ranging from decentralized applications (dApps), decentralized finance (DeFi), NFTs as well as tradable in numerous exchanges. Though FTX exchange was a big supporter of Solana, Solana will experience fall in price but will pick up due to its numerous use cases that cuts across outside FTX space. People that hold Solana may sell due to panic, however, over time, with sensitization and good project promotion, Solana will recover in no distant time.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: OgNasty on December 03, 2022, 12:05:11 AM
It's possible that Solana can rise from the ashes again.  However, it hasn't fully burst into flames yet.  FTX is still sitting on a ton of them and I'm sure they'll all be liquidated to try and recover something in their bankruptcy proceedings.  Last I heard it was close to 15% of the entire outstanding amount of SOL that FTX will be dumping on the market.  I can only imagine that will have an extremely negative effect on the price, perhaps dropping it below a dollar even.  There's no reason to be holding SOL right now in my opinion.  Wait until the final shoe drops.  The risk just doesn't justify the potential reward.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Silberman on December 03, 2022, 02:52:33 AM
IMO, yes, it can, but it might a long time. Solana is built to have numerous use cases ranging from decentralized applications (dApps), decentralized finance (DeFi), NFTs as well as tradable in numerous exchanges. Though FTX exchange was a big supporter of Solana, Solana will experience fall in price but will pick up due to its numerous use cases that cuts across outside FTX space. People that hold Solana may sell due to panic, however, over time, with sensitization and good project promotion, Solana will recover in no distant time.

Solana can definitely rise again but this is not really the moment to try to outsmart the market and try such a risky move, this is the moment to play everything in a manner that is as safe as possible, so you either invest in bitcoin or keep your money in fiat waiting for the right opportunity to get back in the market, so investors which are interested in solana should give it time and let it reach its bottom, and once it does then they can finally begin to invest in solana once again if they want.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: worle1bm on December 03, 2022, 06:31:21 AM
FTX crash was big push to Solana but the development team behind is really working hard for its growth as they are not directly linked with FTX so in the long run it would not have much impact on it.There are some investors who are at the moment investing huge amounts in it as they believe it's best time to make money if they hold it for next 2-3 years and hopes are same but can't say with surety.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: len01 on December 03, 2022, 07:36:24 AM
FTX crash was big push to Solana but the development team behind is really working hard for its growth as they are not directly linked with FTX so in the long run it would not have much impact on it.There are some investors who are at the moment investing huge amounts in it as they believe it's best time to make money if they hold it for next 2-3 years and hopes are same but can't say with surety.
Solana's price has dropped dramatically due to 2 factors. bearish that hit the market and coupled with the crash that happened at FTX. no wonder Solana's price has dropped so much right now, but this is actually one of the opportunities for Solana fans to buy for less and I also believe that behind Solana there is a really good team of devs working hard to fix these issues. and I also agree with you that Solana is not fully involved in FTX so Solana still has a chance to rise again when the bullish season arrives


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: jaberwock on December 03, 2022, 09:15:54 AM
Solana can definitely rise again but this is not really the moment to try to outsmart the market and try such a risky move, this is the moment to play everything in a manner that is as safe as possible, so you either invest in bitcoin or keep your money in fiat waiting for the right opportunity to get back in the market, so investors which are interested in solana should give it time and let it reach its bottom, and once it does then they can finally begin to invest in solana once again if they want.
Yes, because we are still in a bear market and it would be weird if solana increase now while the rest of the coins are still in the same position. Some people won't be happy with that but it would be better if all the coins fairly increase together. At the moment, we can continue investing. Just good coins only and not those who have no utility because we can't get anything in return with them once this market returns to normal.

It is not wrong to have some money in fiat or in stable coins. We can use this to DCA further in case there are more dumps that will happen within this year. I don't advise waiting for the bottom without buying anything.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: fuguebtc on December 03, 2022, 09:40:10 AM
IMO, yes, it can, but it might a long time. Solana is built to have numerous use cases ranging from decentralized applications (dApps), decentralized finance (DeFi), NFTs as well as tradable in numerous exchanges. Though FTX exchange was a big supporter of Solana, Solana will experience fall in price but will pick up due to its numerous use cases that cuts across outside FTX space. People that hold Solana may sell due to panic, however, over time, with sensitization and good project promotion, Solana will recover in no distant time.

Solana can definitely rise again but this is not really the moment to try to outsmart the market and try such a risky move, this is the moment to play everything in a manner that is as safe as possible, so you either invest in bitcoin or keep your money in fiat waiting for the right opportunity to get back in the market, so investors which are interested in solana should give it time and let it reach its bottom, and once it does then they can finally begin to invest in solana once again if they want.

I'm not sure if Solana will be able to rise again but I can say with certainty that FTX crash didn't cause Solana to crash, FTX has a big effect on sol but they are still 2 separate individuals. Solana will continue to survive or will die is for them to decide, the bigger problem I see with solana is that their blockchain is really unstable and secure, the constant outages have caused many investors to lose faith in them.

I agree with you that this is not a good time to invest in sol or any altcoin, if you want to invest then just focus on bitcoin. The market is very risky at this time, we should stand outside and observe, not rush to invest.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: darewaller on December 03, 2022, 07:23:04 PM
- Sometimes FUD is done differently on different platforms to create information that can destroy an altcoins in this era.

But even so, I know and I believe that they can survive or overcome whatever they are going through in the market. Yes, its value will be affected right now because of what happened with Ftx, but I just don't think that will be a big reason for its price to continue to fall in the market in my own opinion, especially since it's good the development that is happening now in Solana.
If you believe the FUDs, then you are also destroying your trust in crypto. But I see it is not the only thing we get from spreading it because it also retests our capability to decide what is right and what is wrong.

Whether Solan rises again or not, we can't blame the FUDs. It was just time to see and realized that Solana doesn't have the full market potential. Not to wonder why its price dropped because investors ignore and rejected this project. The demand is decreasing together with the market and the bear season helping it to drop more. This project will just rise if the developers will improve it.
That full market potential is the cause of SOL not being as high as it could be. Even in the bear market you get to see which coins do best, because while one could be down 50% other could be down 70% and right now SOL is down more than many others, which shows that its not just the bear market that dropped it, all coins drops but this one did more.

So, I guess that we will end up with something major in the long run that will cause it a trouble, its not out in the open yet and not obvious but it will get there. I imagine we will be seeing a lot more on the bull run, when that comes and SOL doesn't go up as much as others, that will make it more obvious.


Title: Re: Can Solana rise again?
Post by: Jackl87 on December 04, 2022, 04:24:50 PM
Do you think there is a high chance that Solana will be like what happened in FTX or is there any hope to recover?

I don't really think that Solana will completely collapse. I mean of course FTX was one of the biggest investors if not the biggest investor at all and therefore also obviously pushing and supporting Solana very much, but i think that Solana was to big already to complete go out of business just because one big investor and supporter is no more.
That being said, i am not so sure, if Solana is able to recover it's place among the most important cryptocurrencies again. It was an top 10 coin for a few years now and it's ATH was at more than 250$ per coin. I doubt that we will see such high prices again for 1 SOL even iin the next bull run, but we will see.