Bitcoin Forum

Today I stumbled in a Twitter thread that was quite astonishingly bullish:

HOW MUCH #BITCOIN to get rich and fund your lifestyle?

https://i.ibb.co/t2pqdr8/61655325.png (https://twitter.com/luke_broyles/status/1618252730954567680?s=61&t=h_VMFagL1E3butTKdh02KQ)

An old thread here in bitcointalk resonated wit h this one: 

source (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=12156.msg169751#msg169751)

According to his computation ( I am going check on those on a later effort) just 0.6 BTC should be enough to live a decent lifestyle:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FnUs7vTX0AEpaNq.png


Read the whole thread on Twitter or here (https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1618252730954567680.html)

Oh, I didn't know it was a very long entry.

He made mention of 0.008BTC being enough to have a lifestyle "far more luxurious than an upper-middle class lifestyle today." He even claimed that 75,000 Sats could become a literal life-changing amount in the future. Notwithstanding his math, which carries a bit of exaggeration, these are all pure speculations. Regardless, however, the point has always been to stack as much Sats as possible.

This man's prediction may or may not come true but, as Satoshi advised, "It might make sense just to get some in case it catches on." And every single day that Bitcoin remains alive is a day that Bitcoin grows stronger and inches toward the prophecy. So, the possibility of Bitcoin becoming bigger in the future grows every day.

Therefore, it is probably not enough to ask how much Bitcoin is enough. After all, there's no stopping now. I simply can't go like, "I already have 0.008BTC or 0.00075BTC or "0.12%" or 1% of my entire worth in Bitcoin, I could stop stacking Sats now."

As many think “crypto will make me rich” it’s definitely not going to be Bitcoin. Even if it hits a new ATH and you buy here at $24K, you will maybe make 3x. Unless you buy millions you won’t get rich this way.

Bitcoin and ETH would of made you rich back in 2015 or so. You could of invested $10K in both and would of made great sums of money as long as you held. Gone are those days.

Having a 200% yield in any other financial assets it going to be spectacular, only for bitcoin 3x is considered "meh".
The point is you are thinking on a too short time horizon. We are talking about intergenerational wealth here.

"get rich and fund your lifestyle"? Come on, you can do better than that.

Just having a lot of assets with zero cash flow (the bitcoin price increases are NOT cash flow) will not be enough to save you if you are hit with a series of large and unexpected bills during a bear market.

In my own personal opinion, Bitcoin has made those who invested in it early rich already, right now, buying an average $100 to $1000 worth of bitcoin will never make the individual buying it rich, even if the price of bitcoin hit $100,000, except the individual is ready to wait till the year the price of 1Bitcoin hit $5,000,000 or more, which to me, is unlikely to happen in the lifetime of that individual, even in the next 100 years, its still unlikely to me.

And on the other hand, investing hundreds of thousands of dollars or even millions of dollars means the individual doing that is already rich, he or she is just looking for some, its like buying an item and reselling it for a higher price for some profit, so it is with the already rich people buying bitcoin, they are not buying it because they want to become rich, but buying to resell for profit.

Yeah.

People buying a few $1000 of BTC now and expecting it to return several million dollars of their investment in 20-30 years are in for the reality that it's just not going to happen at this point, as BTC becomes less and less volatile (plus you have the greed factor where the person trying to get rich loses all their money in an industrial sinkhole such the NFT marketplace, or in scams, during that process).

Until recently, I felt rich for myself and my wife. Make a prosperous life and be able to meet daily needs without the need to make loans to other people or banks. So in general to others it might not be considered rich but with the freedom and ownership of Bitcoin I feel I will definitely be rich in the future. With the principle of continuing to believe and always accumulate every week or month in Bitcoin. Personally, I enjoy it and find a rich path to a better life.

Uh, yeah.  This is nothing but extremely optimistic, borderline nutty speculation.  This very much reminds me of the big bull run in gold and silver leading up to 2011 when I was a member of a coin collecting forum.  People would be in fantasy land, making outrageous price predictions if everyone in the world bought just one ounce of silver.

And by the way, does anyone think they would have seen a tweet like this one about two weeks ago?  You only see crap like this when bitcoin is taking off like a rocket, because the euphoria clouds people's judgement.  But hey, 0.6BTC might eventually make someone wealthy.  Who knows?

I also believe that even if you own not one bitcoin, but only a fractional part of a bitcoin, you will become a very rich person (in the future). 

Bitcoin is a deflationary asset that constantly increases in value over time.  In addition, Bitcoin is a decentralized asset, independent of politics, which allows it to be used by a wide variety of market entities. 

At the same time, I cannot answer the question - when will the price of Bitcoin exceed 1,000,000 US dollars?  The last Bitcoin will be mined only in 2140.

Yes, the price of Bitcoin will exceed $1,000,000, but it is not known exactly when this will happen.  You and I may have to wait a very long time for this event.

Becoming rich is not that difficult, in the big scheme of things. One good idea, a bit of luck, or an incredible skill (think of Leo Messi) can lead you to become very rich.
The difficult part is staying rich. Securing such a luck to your heritage.
This is what Bitcoin si for.

If measured by the current price of Bitcoin, I only need ten units of Bitcoin to become rich and make my life more luxurious. Because with ten units of Bitcoin I can already buy a new house, a new car and also new fields and fields for farming. But it looks like it will be difficult for me to make it happen in the near future because remembering the difficulty of getting profits and competition in making money is always in life.

For a decent lifestyle, 0.6 BTC will be more than enough, but that much Bitcoin will still be lacking if someone spends on luxury items that can be used for their lives. Although for me the amount of 0.6 BTC is quite a lot now.

I also support Fivestar4ever's opinion that Bitcoin made those who invested early extremely rich in a period of a few years. However, I don't believe that's the case now. I read the complete article and find it extremely exaggerated. It's claiming that as little as 0.001 BTC can make you in the top 50%, while any amount over 0.1 BTC will make you in the top 1%. I find it completely doubtful that such an amount of BTC could be changed live. It can certainly assist your financial situation, but it won't change your life completely. If that's the case, I'll be in the top 1% in just a few years, probably not.

Well, doing a x3 per cycle, and decreasing surely each cycle, if you invest $50 is not going to change your life radically, if that's what we're talking about here.

Then you have to think about something else: the person who invests $1k in Bitcoin, who normally does it because he cannot invest $10k or $100k, how long can he hold on without selling when it goes up? It is normal that if it makes a x5 or x10 at most 99% of people sell. You have to have a lot of patience and know about personal finance as well as good management to see it go down from the peak without having sold and endure 4 years of bear market.


Without becoming very rich, everyone can become rich without having a special talent, simply by spending less than their earn and investing their savings. Month by month, year by year, investing and reinvesting.

This is reflected in the book The Millionaire Next Door, which was criticized at the time as having a small sample size of less than 1,000 people. Years later the book Everyday Millionaires: How Ordinary People Built Extraordinary Wealth--And How You Can Too with a sample of 10,000 people had very similar results.

Regarding the Twitter thread, it's not the first time I've seen a thread like that, and just now after how disappointing this cycle has been in terms of returns, I'm not getting my hopes up too high. Besides for me Bitcoin is just a part of my wealth building plan, which I have been following for a long time, copying what those two books reflect and which is a safe but monotonous way to get rich.

Since I became interested in personal finance many things have changed in my life. At the beginning everything seemed very difficult and I started with what everyone does: saving, then I controlled expenses, then I started investing, and to top it all off I came up with ways to get paid more for my main job and to obtain other sources of income. At the end there comes a time when everything becomes easier because you control income, reduce expenses and make more money month after month, year after year. What happens to a person who does that? They become rich. And this taking into account that I donate regularly, I take it as an expense like paying the electricity, yes I donate, I give money, every month, and every time I get richer.

There is some truth in that, although only a small percentage of people manage to find the perfect combination that consists of a top idea, a way to finance that idea and an element of luck without which it is difficult for it to succeed. Admittedly, some people are just lucky and become rich because they won the lottery or a rich relative left them a large fortune that they didn't even know existed.

Staying rich is really a problem for some, because I remember an example when an elderly man in my country won the main lottery prize (about a million euros) and after a few years appeared in the newspaper with a story about how he was left with nothing.

---

It is hard for me to say at this moment how much BTC I would need to feel rich, although I am not one of those who would like to have some kind of status symbols that determine how rich you are, such as yachts, luxury villas or expensive cars. For most of us who live in the EU or the US, having one BTC is not a fortune considering the prices we pay, maybe if the price of BTC would go up at least x20, but for someone who lives in a country with a low standard, 1 BTC is already a real fortune today which can enable you to buy a house, a solid car and more.

I somehow doubt that 0.6 BTC would be enough for a slightly better lifestyle in countries with high standards, at least not in the near future. However, maybe one day that amount will really be enough, but only if the demand is so great that it pushes the price to heights that few people talk about in a serious tone today.

That's the problem for most get-rich-quick types:


Source (https://www.essentiallysports.com/nba-basketball-news-despite-65-percent-of-nba-players-going-broke-within-5-years-of-retirement-shaquille-oneals-mother-helped-him-buy-175-restaurants-and-amass-450-million-net-worth/)

Also:

Here’s why lottery winners go broke (https://www.cnbc.com/2017/08/25/heres-why-lottery-winners-go-broke.html)

Those who get rich the slow way I have explained above do not have that happen to them.

While it's a nice big pat on the back to agree with some of those numbers (the 75k sat one really sticks out to me), that would require me to assume the majority of people on this forum are then able to live more luxuriously than upper middle class today. And I know for sure that's not true!

I get that lifestyle is vastly different in expanse and cost, depending on where you are, how old, and your education and opportunities, but we've got to be realistic. As someone pointed out above, even if you buy today and we get an ATH of 3x the last, that's barely 9 times your wealth multiplied.

And who here even has the money to go out and buy 1 BTC? At 9x, that couldn't even support my entire family living on a bare lifestyle in a small country for... a decade. That's without even owning the house or land we'll live on.

You can never have enough since your lifestyle will constantly change whenever you have money to support your wants in life. Sooner when you find out you have a ton of BTC, you may decide to fly to Hawaii and then Monaco to find out how good it is to eat the most expensive cheese in the world.

Learning that you have 1000BTC, your will eventually, you will pamper yourself. Unless you really can control and still live the way you do today.

In Indonesia, you are already a rich man if you have 1 BTC at the current price. And if the price of BTC returns to $69k, that means you're a richer person than before. But since human nature is greedy, we want to collect more BTC.

With 0.6 BTC equal to $13,789, it means enough to live on for maybe a year or more if he can save money. You can buy many luxurious things for your lifestyle.

These were also the words that were uttered back in 2018 when bitcoin already broke the $20k mark.

"We won't see anything past $20k"
"It's literally impossible to make money on bitcoin after the ATH has been reached"

Blah blah.

Yet we managed to cross $60k which is more or less triple the amount of the ATH that everyone was hyped about. Short-term, I think we won't be able to make that much money off of bitcoin like the way we could have during 2015 - 2017, but it's never really wrong to keep some bitcoins on your stash just in case. After all, at this point most people who understand the dynamics of bitcoin use it to keep value and not necessarily to make money, unless you're an active day trader who fiddles with these coins for profit.

Many people have missed out on the opportunity in the times when purchasing a tangible bitcoin can make you rich which was back then when the bitcoin price was very low but at this current price of bitcoin it will only make a little different added to the capital you used in buying and that too is under probability as we can only experienced this when bitcoin reaches another ATH. Today it just feels like its only the rich folks that can have the capital to purchase bitcoin that will give them a good profit when the price goes up because the lower class like myself can only  buy bitcoin according to the money my hands can get and you don't expect me who is not rich to purchase  and have up to 1btc for a good profit when the price goes up. So i just bought the little i can and pray that bitcoin can beat its ATH soon because with the price value of bitcoin to my country currency i can atleast live a comfortable life when its reaches another ATH.

I beg to differ. Yes, being in the right place at the right time, have the right idea, luck, skill... these are not things that come easy.
Just think if Leo Messi would have been having an accident and lose a leg. Great skill gone down the drain. And many are in similar situation, had some of the ingredients, but didn't get them all or didn't mix them well.
Imho it is difficult to get rich.

Staying rich is imho the easier part. Having the money you can hire the right people who - for the right salary and fees - will grow that money in ways you could not even imagine.


Bitcoin can be both.
Imho it still can be the tool to get wealthy without having the right skill, knowledge, idea or connections, just now one obviously needs significantly bigger starting funds than he needed 5-7-10 years ago.
And clearly it can the tool for securing one's wealth. Buying at least 10-20 BTC is already something significant for us, but for wealthy people it's not; and even more, they don't care that much of the price fluctuations, not on short term. But, if somebody rich has hired the right people, he already have bitcoins in his portfolio, maybe even without knowing it.

In the meantime, here you have a customisable version of the spreadsheet he used for his thread:

https://i.ibb.co/YD3TfDB/61659742.jpg (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1uSw_AKAECP3_VMf0w6j9HYq3SmUUhMJgWIYb4x8flr4/edit?usp=sharing)

I am going to add some interesting feature soon.

Bitcoiners do love modeling how rich they will be when Bitcoin replaces fiat money, but they always skip the part that describes how exactly would it happen. Just because they believe that Bitcoin is better than fiat, doesn't mean that the rest of the world will do it too. This reminds me of how communists predict that capitalism will inevitably collapse soon, and in 170 years their prediction still haven't materialized.

A good skill with high pay can start a Bitcoin investment that will eventually turn into an amount that can guarantee a comfortable life style in the future. People who believe Bitcoin cannot make them rich again only depend on signature earned coin. If as an investor with a high demand skill that pays well. It will be much easier to take from your earning to buy as much Bitcoin as possible by gradually accumulating them until it becomes enough to afford what ever life style that anyone can picture.

I so believe it is never too late to get rich through Bitcoin it all depends on planning and capital. Gradual accumulation of Sats can eventually turn into piles of coins. Been intentional with the investment plan differentiates those who make it big through Bitcoin and those who earn based on their portfolio

And then there's the question when this magical time is in the future. Is is somthing my childrens are going to enjoy when i am dead?
Even if it's always fun to read insaly bullish predictions, i am going to take Luke's "mind blowing math" with a grain of salt.

And as Luke is quoting sources like Wicked throwing away phrases like "when fiat dies" in the chart
(which could mean anything to losin purchasing power to destruction of capitalism):

https://i.imgur.com/YQupCF5.png

Then i remember that some of these people making peredictions are maybe relying too much on the libertarian dream where governments don't have stabilization plans. Where nations fall but bitcoins stays.
I have more trust on the keynesian economics then any anarco capitalism taking over but maybe i am naive.

Of course to be richer must be from the rich. Because to make more money with just money. Very few people have the luck to become rich without sufficient capital.
Imagine if we only have $100 capital and invest in Bitcoin. As fast as lightning the bull runs, with a capital of $ 100 the highest profit we can make is $ 300, of course this has increased 200%. lol.
But if they have a lot of money, and invest in Bitcoin. I think it only took 1 year to get the billionaire title. Because they can invest tens to hundreds of Bitcoins. So, if we don't have capital, maybe getting rich is only a dream, unless we have other skills, like a world-class soccer player as you say.
Not pessimistic, but generally so. Maybe we can see this from the lives of the people around us. Only the rich get richer, while the poor keep their title, poor.
But the most important thing is the passion to work, because that's part of the main capital to get rich.
Look for happiness in life, because it can't be bought even though we are already rich.

 But why this hypothesis that Bitcoin alone can achieve the required luxury for anyone in any society in our current era?  Bitcoin can achieve financial stability if it was invested in it earlier and achieve profits at the present time.
In addition, Bitcoin can contribute to the financial stability of an individual if it is used in business to save payment and transfer costs.

Yeah, three generations from now, 0.6BTC might indeed be a huge amount, enough to make somebody wealthy. As a matter of fact, if we consider the cheaper cost of living in some developing countries, we don't have to wait for 2 or 3 generations to pass. We only have to wait for that $100,000 to finally arrive for that 0.6BTC to be able to give a family a nice house and a nice car.

But Luke is basically looking at the farther future, past our lifetimes or even our children's lifetimes, so, yeah, 0.6BTC could indeed be a huge wealth at that point.

It's only a matter of time, even you and them can live life with only 0.6 Btc. The rich are only looking to make a profit in bitcoin investments, whatever the price is if it is profitable they will sell it. But not here is the essence of living a luxurious life having only 0.6 Btc, I believe it is not about the price but more about the value because Btc is not only seen by the price, but rather a more important role to fulfill 0.6 is value in the future.

It is this relevance that makes people believe more in collecting bitcoins and we also understand more and more that 0% risk even though bitcoin is trending towards 0 price. If you don't take part today, then in the next few years it will be even more difficult to collect bitcoins.

The interesting part from the spreadsheet is millionaire/companies class only hold average of 0.06 BTC which is only $1,400 at the current rate, actually it's really low amount since millionaire at least have $1,000,000. I believe most users in this forum already own 0.06 BTC, you might not yet a millionaire in terms of fiat, but you're already have a same Bitcoin investment like a millionaire.

If we talking how much Bitcoin we need to get rich and fund our lifestyle, the answer will be varies between each user. But I think if you own at least 1 Bitcoin you will be rich in any third world country. I don't really care with lifestyle, sometime branded clothes and new products are trick to make people become poor, not to mention there's a chance you can buy a fake product.

Yeah, for me it's not so much: you're going to have x Bitcoin? You will be rich. But more: you will have x Bitcoin+ x of other assets + 7 sources of income? Then you will be rich.

I put 7 because they are the average sources of income that a millionaire has, although normally one is the one that accounts for 80% of income or more.

What happens is that in this forum it is normal that everything is seen from the prism of Bitcoin. There are people who have 100% of their net worth in Bitcoin, said in this forum. For me that is too risky, but if you do well you will certainly become richer than someone who diversifies more. 

This is the thing, you underestimate bitcoin, pretty much like people who in 2010 and 2011 were hoping for a milestone of $100 and in their wildest dreams thought of 1k high.
Bitcoin went wild in the next few years, hitting $300 in early 2013 and then people started thinking a step forward, about 10k, but the next big thing was 20k. 10k was never a big top.
The majority of people always look a step forward and only exceptional visionaries manage to see beyond that.

Say you'd spent $100k in bitcoin last year at 15k and your end game happened to be 250k, which by all means is achievable in the next 10 years. Would you say that it didn't make you rich? That would be 1.6 million. Enough to live happily ever after in most parts of the world, assuming that you're not completely broke and in debt before bitcoin hits that level.

I have to say I seem to be on the upper scale of upper middle class, just below where really wealthy people start, and yet I am so bad at finance that I barely live. Like buying the brand new macbook m2 max laptop would be unachievable dream for me, hell I am having trouble with buying a new monitor for my PC these days, not impossible of course I can get it but it is really not worth the extra stress on my finances.

It means that the calculation is either wrong, or majority of people are living in literal poverty. Like just food+clothes+shelter+bills, that's it, nothing else is left, that is the bare minimum to survive, that must be 95% of the population with this calculation. I agree there are a lot of people in poverty but not this much, that must be wrong.

As someone living in Turkey, about 1000 dollars per month is more than enough to live a decent life, it wouldn't be like kings or anything but it would be quite easy. I have been making around that much for a year now, between my work and also the signature campaigns here, and I can say that it has been quite good enough. I see plenty of people living much worse lives than me and I can only be thankful. However, you could also "survive" for 500 dollars as well, wouldn't be a good life, just basically staying alive but that's about it. This is why I believe that we shouldn't be putting all these numbers into same column, it changes from nation to nation.

I'm afraid you're operating with incorrect numbers. $24k x3 = $72k that will be the previous cycle's ATH (roughly). Don't forget we're in a new cycle and ATH of this cycle can easily reach $240k which is x10. But I won't be surprised if we'll reach $400-500k this cycle. And that's a whopping x20 profit! So, even today (and especially today with these low BTC prices) we can get rich by investing in King Daddy. Shitcoins promise you crazy gains, but most probably will leave you penniless.  8)

For me, as long as you still hold bitcoin, you can get rich and all costs can be funded with bitcoin, as long as we still have it when the price is high.
Currently I still have .36 BTC as long as the results invested until now but to become rich is impossible because the price is still low while for rich potential it is clear that we can as long as we can wait to reach ATH again so a piece of bitcoin is more valuable and even become a billionaire.
But with .36 BTC to fund this lifestyle it is more than enough to last 1 year, but I always put off the fun for now and continue to earn as much bitcoin as possible, I want to be rich so I will multiply bitcoin.

1BTC = 1 Billionaire? I believe it :D

.1BTC is already enough to live for at least 5 months in my country, and it will always depend on your lifestyle and on where you live. Being rich means being able to buy all your wants so there is no certain amount for this as many still aim for more and don’t want to be contented of what they have. Bitcoin is not a rich quick scheme though, there are things that you need to sacrifice in order to achieve your target Bitcoin.

Nation to nation indeed because not all is really that recieving on the same numbers if we do speak about getting some paycheck from our day job which is something differs on every place in the world plus having

that monetary value on how much you are earning basing up on local fiat.In some places it might that be much but when you are on a place where wages are really that standard then living situation and conditions
will really reflect into that.This is why we cant really tell on which one is big and which one is small or not enough. $1000 indeed here on my place is something a salary that would make you live but on a standard
condition and not that lavish.$500 would do but this is already that struggling or in the most thin margine for you not to be able to eat well.  :D

At least 5 BTC is enough to be call a Rich man in you locality. Though all depends on the exchange rate of the country but any how 5btc unit is big enough. We should also remember that BTC price is not stable so when the price comes down the unit of BTC should also increase to have the equation or equilibrium of the riches.

That would depend on your lifestyle. If you would hve multiple Bitcoins but your lifestyle would also adjust to a more luxurious, you'd end up with nothing for sure. Keep in mind that the market peice is not continuously increasing on a consistent manner. But if you will have somewhat of an 'average lifestyle' I guess 10 BTC would be good to go to give you a decent life as well as to your family especially if you will 'run' that asset to be more profitable such as with investment diverification. But if it is assurance you are looking for, engage to stock or property investments. This industry has a huge potential but has its own kind of risk, so you decide.

I think it's a hard question to those who wants more after experiencing a luxurious lifestyle or maybe it depends on someone on what kind of lifestyle they want but my only answer would be, no matter how rich you are if you can't think of something to do with your money it will one day be gone and you will find yourself looking back to what you wasted. Thus, you will need a continuous passive income and not just a steady wealth that doesn't grow then you might retire one day and spend your wealth while funding your lifestyle choices.

Although, with all of that computation I think it's too much but who would wait till their BTC hit that high when we are getting older. ???

Not sure about other cryptocurrencies and how they may work and how they can make people rich because there are many other cryptocurrencies that may have pump dump and after that, some people can get rich if they invest enough in it and they have the knowledge of the cryptocurrencies. But speaking of bitcoin, I don't think investing just a few dollars on bitcoin can make anyone rich even in long term, to be more realistic bitcoin has grown up and reached many high prices but you cannot expect to see investing a few dollars on bitcoin make anyone rich in this time.