Bitcoin Forum

Hey everyone,

I wanted to announce that coinbits.com (http://coinbits.com) is sponsoring a FREE giveaway of bitcoins on Bruce Wagners show.  There is no catch, just watch the show at http://onlyonetv.com/ I believe it starts airing at 5pm eastern just follow the instructions 15 minutes or so into the show.

Thanks!
Andrew

You are paying to be on the tiny show of an ostracized pedophile and convicted fraudster? 

Welcome to the big league.

We're just all waiting to be on your show. If you have a crime to report, call the police or risk being accused of accessory after the fact.

Oh stop trolling already and grow up.


Nice!!! I'll definitely watch it  :D

I look forward to it also, although I've thrown more than my fair shares of jabs in regards to BW. Here's hopin' you accomplish your objectives.

~Bruno~

looking forward to it!  ;D

He's not a pedophile, he's an ephebophile. Learn the difference.

http://uscerock.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/TheMoreYouKnow.jpg

Because if I was more mature, I wouldn't be concerned that Bitcoin's poster-boy is an ephebophile (thx rassah  ;)) who has been convicted of mortgage fraud?

Every day he remains a spokesperson for Bitcoin hurts our reputation.  I understand that it feels exciting to "be on TV", but you shouldn't be taking attention from a creep and a crook as such a compliment.  Every person who adds to his page-views lets him stay in the limelight for a little bit longer.  

He wanted to have a Bitcoin conference in Pattaya, the underage sex capital of the world!  You can read posts he made giving tips on buying young virgin boy prostitutes. Is that the person we want representing the rest of us who use Bitcoin?  If you believe his story that it was an innocent mistake, you are incredibly naive.  

Was he connected to MyBitcoin.com 51% theft?  Wouldn't be the first time he took a bunch of people's money and never returned it.

Furthermore, he has been convicted of defrauding people of their money!  I don't care how many excuses or apologies you give, you are still a sketchy guy who no rational person should trust.

Unless you want Bitcoin to be known as the currency for underage prostitutes and hiding money stolen through fraud, stop supporting Bruce Wagner.

I don't know what your social circle is like Yankee, but most of the world doesn't want to associate with people who pay for sex with children.  Why are you defending him?

Bitcoin stands on it's own merit. It doesn't matter if its "poster boy" was a baby eating atheist vampire named Adolph Manson Gacy (no relation to any living person). It's only money. Money only needs value and liquidity. Bitcoin is decentralized, even if the commie pinko socialists or nazi fascist zombies use it, Bitcoin doesn't care.

Look, I see your points and I know the arguments. Don't forget, I was one of the people who brought alot of the evidence against him to light!

At the end of the day, we need to move past this bickering from one member to another.
The fact still remains, that Bruce's show gets alot of attention in the Bitcoin community and Andrew has every right to utilize that for the better of his business.

Don't worry my friend, Bruce's day will come....

Satoshi Polanski.

http://www.youtube.com/user/vlogwrap/videos not sure if anyone checks the Bitcoin Show statistics or the value of preaching to the choir when you all view that as the only media outlet that will report on Bitcoin related things.

That's pretty cool that you helped open the closet full of skeletons.  I would still strongly encourage you to boycott his show. 

You can wait for things to change, or you can be the change.  I choose the latter: I am going to be vocal against him every time someone positively mentions his show in this forum. If you go on his show to promote his business, I will remind everyone within earshot you are associating with a con man and a creep.   

I wouldn't call this "bickering," I would say there's a huge smelly turd in the middle of the room, and I see a lot of people breathing it in or just waiting, hoping it will go away by itself.

Grab some bleach, lets get this shit out of our house.

If you haven't heard about it:
http://buttcoin.org/has-bruce-wagner-pulled-off-the-financial-biggest-scam-on-the-bitcoin-community

Andrew,

Why did you choose the show of a pedophile convicted of fraud to promote your brand?  Does coinbits.com support fraud and pedophilia? Interesting choice of branding.

What is coinbits.com's position on underage prostitution?
What about fraud?

Sincerely,
-Ragged

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

See, I really appreciate your response here. I thought it was very mature and you sound like a rational guy!

However, after reading your next response....


C'mon really?
"Does coinbits.com support fraud and pedophilia"
"What is coinbits.com's position on underage prostitution"

I hope you really don't believe that and are just trying to stir a conversation.

If a site I used was going to be advertising on The Bitcoin Show, I have the same feelings RaggedMonk does, and will definitely always keep in mind Coinbits using The Bitcoin Show as a platform for acceptable advertising.   I don't use Coinbits regular enough to have a strong opinion on that, but I think you should be happy if anyone would care enough about your site to bring up such concerns.

Everyone groans when a big business pulls out of some kind of advertising campaign based on personal politics, but that groan is so short compared to true business lost and the view of your company if you do work with someone that would have such a questionable record.

Is your indifference towards Bruce's past indiscretions, viewing going on his show a "means to an ends," indicative of your business values as a whole?
Do you believe self-promotion, and the resulting money, is worth more than your dignity and your business's reputation?
If not, why are you using his show to promote your brand?

Hey! As a baby eating atheist vampire I resent being compared to bad people!
Well... I eat animal babies, am an atheist, and am a count... But that's close enough!

Guilt by association. Always a sign that the goon squad is not far behind. Fortunately for Bruce, he does not yet live in a Banana Republic. OTOH, our former Chief Executive Administrations were full of indicted appointees. The exception is the 43rd POTUS with a teflon clean record that the entire world admires. But I digress... Business these days cares not about morals, mores or ethics when profit is involved, present company excepted of course. Those minor details are left to the legal department.

I am sick of the Bruce bashing going on, the accusations have already been addressed satisfactorily, any reptition is pure malice.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=40404.msg492483#msg492483
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=40258.msg491039#msg491039


There is no evidence Bruce was related to mybitcoin, except he encouraged newbies to get accounts there and lost a lot himself.
There is no proof mybitcoin was a scam, they failed to implement proper bitcoin security (only waiting for 0-1 confirmations) and got exploited.
https://www.mybitcoin.com/

The lies were created by trolls from Something Awful to help crash bitcoin and for lulz.  There's no need to help them.

For your information, Bruce Wagner is a criminal and fraudster. 'Interesting' to see that your company wants to be associated with this person.



That's a bold statement. To the day that I die, I will walk the way of justice. People in a weak position, being exploited by someone else, I feel with these people. And any scammer and fraudster, no matter the level of their crimes deserves not to be spoken highly of. To my knowledge, there's no clear evidence of Bruce being involved in the mybitcoin scandal, merely indicies. However my main grip with him is his convictions in the court
system.

I can reccomend to read: this article  (http://mortgagefraudblog.com/perp-walk/item/10674-illinois_foreclosure_rescue_company_fined_and_shut_down), with excerpt:
All scams are low, but scamming people so they potentially becomes homeless, that's a new low in the scam division. No matter what people would think of me for what I say, I would never stop trying to make the world a better place, and for that to happen, people like Bruce Wagner needs to feel the consequences of their actions. Chosing to associate your own business with anything run by him, would make me not want to be your customer anymore.

If you attribute being a good and honest individual to malice, so be it. My blood boils when I see injustice, and there's nothing I hate more than a dishonest individual telling lies attempting to fullfill his egoistical selfish needs.

Great idea! Looking forward to watching it and +1 to you for supporting the best Bitcoin show out there!

Let's get real here.  While theres no proof that he was associated with mybitcoin or that he is a ephebophile, but he is a convicted con man and took money from people on the verge of losing their homes with promises to help.  I doubt trolls made up court documents.  

Translation - People are weak and stupid. I know better than them. It is my job to protect weak stupid people from themselves and from those who may exploit them.

If you're smart, experienced and intelligent, chances of getting conned are less, but it could still happen. I would be unwilling to share your level of arrogance.

I'm tending to side with Tril on this one . Bruce has been thoroughly vetted and has been found not have anything to do with mybitcoin if he has then lets present the evidence or no and go after him?  As for his mortgage fraud thing  I believe everyone deserves a 2nd chance? I mean we've all  had a bad things happen to us does that dis-qualify us from enjoying bitcoin or at the very least not allow us to promote our business's?  And as Trill said Something Awful got the lulz in this and repeated this non-sense over and over here to where it seems some of our members are believing it.  I've had my past battles with SA  just look at my old threads :)

Side note: At one point I was accused of being Bruce :o

Sure, he'd be welcome to paint my house next summer, but not handling my company finances. *g*

+1

I won't be watching any of those "The Bitcoin Show" episodes. And I will avoid doing business with anyone associating themselves with Bruce Wagner.

cbeast:

I am a business man and I care about morals and ethics etc. more than profits, and if I only cared about profits I would care what my customers
and, potential customers, thought about my business practices and who I associate and advertise with etc.

While you think most businesses these days care only about profits, more and more customers are getting pissed-off with the way things have
traditionally gone in the business world and good businesses would take note, even if they only have their own best interests in mind and
cared nothing about others in this world.

This is a good thread to find additions to my ignore list.

+1 lol    oh come on we're all grown up's aren't we ?   assuming you can even see this  :P

lol yes, ok, will nobody is asking you to do your "company finances" with him ? he runs a internet T.V show on bitcoins ?  how does this have to do with your "company finances"?

Maybe, he can come paint my house also!  :P

Bruce is in good company with other successful convicted felons like talkshow hosts G. Gordon Liddy and Rush Limbaugh.

Rush Limbaugh was convicted of popping pills how did that effect you ?  I forget what Liddy was jailed for  either way your saying since Rush Limbaugh pop'd pills he shouldn't be allowed to use bitcoins? interesting logic  you have there ...

I think I just found 38,000 more talk show hosts that... https://www.google.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=%22talk+show+host+convicted%22

I'm going to remain neutral on this issue. Interesting arguments for both sides, nonetheless.

~Bruno~

lol wow   yes seems like its 50/50 on Bruce  - maybe we should just "hang him" or something!



Thanks Cage that is brutally ugly what I had up there!  :P btw: your catching up to Bitcoin Porn on the # of posts in the top 10  - get to it! I see bitcoin porn on today he must have heard hahaha

Jeez bbit, are you a sociopath?  Nobody said anything about killing or hanging anyone.   
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

I didn't mean literally we already doing a cyber hanging already!

It would be ridiculous to think that Bruce should be prevented from using bitcoin.  I have no problem with that.  I have a problem with him promoting and recommending bitcoin services.   He has already recommended one that has stolen hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of bitcoin.

About mybitcoin:
There is no way we will find a conclusive answer, but from what I have seen this looks like a possibility. This is not fact, it is conjecture:
-He sets up MyBitcoin (using the same obscure host as OnlyOneTV- a big coincidence)
-Promotes it on many of his shows
-Astroturf-promotes it with the name T** Williams  (which he had previously used to astroturf for Bold Funding)
-He decides he wants to cash out, so he takes the site down.
-He cries and moans about how he just lost an amount of money approximately equal to the total deposits people have put into MyBitcoin
-He says he is in contact with the FBI to make people feel like the theft has already been reported (someone said they called the FBI and they have no record of Wagner)
-He puts the site back up, allowing people to redeem 49% of their deposits
-He keeps the rest, claiming it was his part of the 49% being returned
There you have it.  A free pile of money that no one can prove you stole.

If he is still recommending sites on his show, why should anyone think those businesses are legit?  The guy has a horrible track record.

Read more than just what he wrote.  The rest of the threads tear his arguments apart.  So, are you personally friends/scam partners with him, or just naive?

In "three pronged attack" he argues that his words of the post were inside of a quote block, and what was outside of the quote block was someone else's. Nobody does that, not even him when he posted on here.   It sounds like Bold-faced lie to me. There are a lot of coincidences around mybitcoin that appear to point to him, but it is unlikely there will ever be enough evidence for anyone to press charges.

While you I guess I am just feeding the troll....

A lot of bad people use cash.  A lot of bad people use Visa.  I do not think we can sanitize cash, credit cards or Bitcoin.  People you will not like, who have done things you don't like, or even have done illegal things will use Bitcoin.  That is the way it is. 

Stick to the mortgage fraud, there is a paper trail and conviction.   The stuff above just makes you look stupid. 

In light of the other stuff uncovered about Bruce I think it's possible he was at least partly behind the mybitcoin incident.

Even if he wasn't at all, I don't think there is enough bashing available in the world for that boy banging, grandma's last dollar to save her house stealing, scammer.

I cringe every time someone even hints at any sort of defense for that guy after his past actions came out.  Mortgage refinance fraud is low, really low.  He should be ostracized completely in my opinion.

Sure he can use bitcoin, I don't think there should be any effort to ever stop anyone from using it, however any business or person that associates with him should be pointed out loudly and often as a service to all the rational people out there that wouldn't want to promote or be involved with scum.

Personally I think people that pay for a forums to type gossip shit about other people to feel better about themselves are fairly sad, however this is one that SA got right.

The main problem is that no one really gives a shit, one way or another.

I don't have anything to do with Bruce.   I just believe people can change their behavior.  That's why I consider ad hominem attacks irrational - speak out against actions, not persons.  It makes me sad that when Bruce promotes bitcoin you see it as an affront to Bitcoin and try to boycott the guest of the show, instead of considering he's trying to do something good.  If promoting bitcoin is good, leave coinbits alone.

I don't think anyone here is prohibiting Bruce from using Bitcoin.  That is impossible and unreasonable.  I just think we shouldn't support him in the role which lets him recommend places to keep your money.

Exactly, no need to factor in things like past history when dealing with investments in new currencies and screw taking a second and allowing yourself to rightfully judge a business based on it's advertising choices.

Sorry, I do not believe in guilt by association. 

Ad hominem attack?  No one is trying to win an argument by trying to attack one who voices the other side of said argument. The whole
point is Bruce Wagner's sociopathology. And he is being criticized exactly for his actions, not his views on Bitcoin or his sexual preferences etc.

Sure it is possible the leopard may change his spots but there is a lot of evidence that he should not be trusted to represent Bitcoin in any way.  
Even before trying to get a paid vacation to "play" with boys in Pattaya; even before the mortgage scams; there was a lot of evidence of him
pulling scams in his escort business and other dishonest behavior.  You can even see it in his posts here when he was asked to reconsider
a conference in Pattaya, he attacked those members and called them trolls and children and showed a very unprofessional attitude as if there
was nothing at all he should have to reconsider, or explain in regard to his past behavior and choices.  An arrogance and lack of foresight typical
of sociopaths. He kinda shot himself in the foot with that whole business. If he just backed away from the choice of Pattaya then a lot of his
past criminal actions might not have come to light.  

If you want to support Bruce, and any businesses who want to associate themselves with a well known repeat scammer, go ahead. I, like many
others here it seems ( sorry Rassah but there are some of us who 'do' care about this, even if you don't give a shit ), just feel it is responsible
to speak out against this scammer every time we see him trying to further associate himself with Bitcoin and use it to boost his own ego and
enhance his finances, to the detriment of Bitcoin and the community...  Do we have to wait for his next scam before more people speak out
against him. No doubt even then there will be those who will want to give him a second... oh wait, it must be up to at least a fifth or sixth
chance by now....  

How many is a reasonable number of chances to give a sociopathic personality type which rather than changing their behavior instead,
time and again, takes advantage of others willingness to forgive and forget?  You can even see it in a few of his senior citizen mortgage scam
victims. "Ah well he is isn't really bad. He just got in over his head. His heart is in the right place."     And because of that heart of his he of
course doesn't even attempt to repay anyone he ripped-off and instead flees the state and gets his lawyers to play through the usual legal
loop-holes so he can start again on his next big scheme somewhere else...  

    

I absolutely agree with RaggedMonk and Portnoy.

Strawmen, ad-homs, and other logical fallacies are fallacies, but they're also extremely effective.  And, given how often they are used mistakenly, you can imagine how much influence they have on a person's psychology.

From what I have read about Bruce, I don't even want him USING Bitcoin.  He HAS committed fraud, he HAS discussed the prostitution of underage boys, so at this point I don't even care about whether my reasoning is fallacious or not.  My INTUITION tells me this guy is absolutely no good.

Haha OK Rassah.  In a real sense I'll never give a shit about anything that happens over an internet forums and I imagine most people are the same.  I click on the next tab in my internet browser and everyone here disappears.  However confined in the purview of this small forum community I think you and I care about as much as anyone else.

After this post I'll go eat some food and not give a shit what Bruce did to who since I can't be bothered carrying around concern for almost any action that doesn't directly touch me.  So in that sense you're absolutely right.