Bitcoin Forum

The question is in the subject  :-* I’m genuinely just curious if people are still interested in this because I believe it’s a good way to “HODL” your bitcoin.

I don't know if I got the question right but I think you are asking to invest your balance in some casino which offer to give you something in return.Unfortunately very few casinos offer such a service now and this must be because of people not being that much interested anymore in such option.

If you want to increase your bankroll there are wallets who offer you staking to your coins and there is no time amount in some of such wallets.

Do you mean investing in a casino bankroll? I've never done it before and I think it requires a large amount of capital to invest in a casino bankroll and like any investment, there are risks involved, such as losses or even having the money taken away by the casino. But I don't understand why you think investing in a casino bankroll is another way to hold bitcoin? if we hold bitcoin then we only need to keep our bitcoin, there is no risk in it as long as we can store it safely, the risk is only if there is a decline in the price of bitcoin but the amount we hold will remain the same

Investing assets, especially Bitcoin, which is very valuable crypto asset, into casino bankroll is not recommended, especially in large amounts, the risk is much more likely to occur.
The first risk is the risk of hacking which endangers all the Bitcoin assets we own, this will make us feel huge loss if it actually happens.
The second risk is the desire to use or spend the Bitcoin we have to bet or play and in the end we spend number of these assets just to gamble, clearly this is a failure in investing.
The final risk is that there are restrictions or difficulties if Bitcoin has high price and when you want to withdraw it, there are difficulties given by the casino such as KYC requirements or so on. But if the one used is large casino, perhaps you will be able to avoid problems like this.
Moreover, there are many personal wallets that we can use to store number of assets for the purpose of investing, this will be much safer and more reliable.

     -   What kind of bankroll investment are you talking about, mate? Is it from your bitcoin balance that you will deposit in a gambling account, and you will hide or hold it there? Because if yes, I don't think it's a good plan that you're thinking of.

You are the one who said that it is better to hold Bitcoin with the opportunities that are happening in the market right now. Maybe that gambling platform will cause you to think badly when you make a transaction from gambling to an exchange to your fiat currency that you will transfer to your bank account when the time comes.

What's the difference with staking in centralized exchange? I don't see any difference since you're still risking your money.

If most people willing to submit their KYC to CEX, but not willing to submit their KYC to casino, it means they trust CEX more than casino. So I doubt a casino that offer bankroll investment will successful since not many people interested with that.

Not really sure on how large is in your perspective, but the minimum to invest in crypto.games is 0.01 BTC (https://cryptogamesadventure.wordpress.com/investment), not really that big.

Maybe there are still some investors who will want to invest on crypto based casinos. If I'm not mistaken, this the craze around 2018-2019. And there are some members who posted their investment bankroll.

This might be old though, but it can refresh our memory during that time: [Overview of all bitcoin casinos] Latest update: 14-03-19 VISIT NEW WEBSITE (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2097255.0).

Maybe things have changed, and obviously the hype have died down already. But who knows, if we are looking to make money then crypto casino might still be effective at this time. Perhaps there are few tweaks, but the end goal is still the same, give those investors some percentage of the winnings.

We know that many reputable casinos have built trust over the years. But it will not be wise to keep Bitcoin in casinos with the aim of hodling it for the future. Casinos are not traditionally designed to offer such services. I think it will be better to only bankroll funds that have been budgeted for betting.

The Bitcoin ecosystem has recommended means of hodling funds and anything outside these means will increase the risk of losing funds. I am not also comfortable with OP's position because it could fuel over-gambling and loss of funds not embarked for betting. Why would I opt to keep my money on a platform where I might go through some cumbersome process before withdrawing meanwhile there are far better options.

I believe you should differentiate long-term investment and speculation. What is your standard of "good way"? If the security of your money is in it, then speculating by moving your funds to fund some projects definitely should not be on the list. Holding your Bitcoin by nature can only be done in one way, keep it on your offline storage and store the seed carefully. If you move around your money regularly, that's just doing speculation as usual.

I’m a bit comfused – I’ve never done this before so I find it strange that Op used “hodl bitcoin” yet others are comparing it to staking in centralized exchanges.

Can you stake your bitcoin? I know of increasing your stash of altcoin by staking for a period of time after which you’ll be reward with a percentage that was initially agreed on, but I don’t know anything about staking and bitcoin.

I’d appreciate if any of you can throw some light to it, if I’m currently misinterpreting what they Op is about.

Maybe what @OP meant was to keep "HODLing" our bitcoin and not use it for gambling. If that is the intention, we can use altcoins or stablecoins for gambling and don't need to use bitcoin. Usually, altcoins or stablecoins are also used by many gamblers so that they can still gamble as usual, and they can also "HODL" their bitcoins. They can profit from "HODLing" their bitcoins while they can gamble. That was the advantage they could gain if they could do both. But that doesn't guarantee they can win if they gamble. At times like this, it is better for us to "HODL" bitcoin rather than use it for gambling or other things that will reduce the amount of our bitcoin. But it will depend on each gambler because there are still gamblers who use bitcoin to gamble.

Bankroll investment of what? Casino or players? If casino then it depends on the wager volume on the particular casino since it’s just a waste of time to invest on casino bankroll if there’s no player on it. Also there’s a high chance for casino run with investors bankroll so this kind of offer is not popular anymore unless your casino has a decent volume.

Holding Bitcoin on a non custodial wallet is still the best way to hold Bitcoin despite no passive earning as long as the holdings is 100% safe. It’s useless to have a small passive profit while there’s a risk that you will lose it all when the casino runaway.

This actually deserved to be asked, because from my side, I think it's been a very long time since Ive heard or read someone talking about investing in a casinos bankroll for profit sharing and so on, and personally, I think this used to be one the best ways to make guaranteed money from casinos, because if one invests in their bank roll, as long as that casino is in profit, the gambler will also be in profit.

But on the other hand though, I do not think that casinos are still interested in gamblers investing in their bankroll, since no casino I can remember talks or advertises this anymore, so, I think the proper question should be, if casinos are still interested in allowing gamblers to invest in their bankroll? For I believe that, if casinos are interested and advertise this to gamblers, then there did be so many gamblers who will be interested, as long as the casino is a reputable and well trusted one.

Well bankroll investment is like pooling money with others to ride the ups and downs of Bitcoin. It can be a way to hodl and potentially make gains. Just be careful, check out the platform thoroughly and watch out for scams in the crypto world.Its basic

Well, I think (one), you are misinterpreting what the op is saying, and (two) you can still stake your bitcoin if you are doing it in a centralized manner, for example, you can stake your bitcoin on any centralized exchanges or casinos that offer staking feature and ability to their users, the only way you can't stake your bitcoin is in a decentralized matter, since staking smart contracts are not live on bitcoin's L1 blockchain.

To understand why some users are comparing staking to bankroll investment on online gambling casinos, you have to first understand what bankroll investment is, and to try to explain it here, it simply means the ability for a player to invest some money into the casinos funds with which they settle players who won in their platform.
Gambling can be considered a game between the casino and the player, when the player wins, the casino loses, and when the player loses, the casino wins, so you as a bankroll investor, if you invested in the casinos bankroll, you kind lose money in your investment anytime the casinos loses, and you also make profit in your investment any time the casinos make profit.

This is the simplest way I can explain it so that it's clear enough for you to understand it, and I hope you do understand now.

Perhaps others see this as a long-term approach to capitalize on potential growth. But here in the popular and reputable casinos in this forum, it seems that there is no one offering this kind of bankroll investment feature, maybe because there is not much interest in it anymore. It's also difficult to trust new casinos that offer bankroll investment, especially when the platform is not well-established. Some other casinos, utilize a staking feature using their coins or tokens. This may have replaced the traditional bankroll investment using Bitcoin.

https://www.mintdice.com/faq/investing#how-does-casino-investing-work

I've got to check online for us to understand this casino bankroll investment and above quote is the explanation, it looks profitable but there's also risk involved since the casino has a house edge over all their players you have a chance to profit, and we have to understand it's still gambling you could win and you could lose, be sure to fully understand how it works and be sure that if you're going to invest in a casino bankroll, invest in a casino that is transparent with a good reputation, it involves trust between you and the casino you're investing with.

I'm not sure what you're trying to convey in your question, but I think you may have focused on the investment aspect of a casino platform. If this is the case then I think we should get out of this kind of thinking. Because if you invest big in a casino platform, if that site is not reliable then you can lose money there. I think no casino site should make such an investment. However, it is a different story for the famous casinos platform. I never keen on such risky investments. I will only trust my own wallet to hold bitcoins. I can never expect anything good from keeping money from others wallet.

If you have your bitcoins in a casino, they don't belong to you... Remember, not your keys not your coins.

I mean, is a nice way of investment, but is not the right way to hold... If the casino decides to close tomorrow and you don't notice it, then your coins will be gone forever. So, the right way to Hold is bi having your coins in your own address and save the private keys on a secure place.

It's exactly that, and we had some casinos that had done that in the past. One of the lists from many years ago:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1389266.msg14114671#msg14114671 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1389266.msg14114671#msg14114671)

In the end, it all comes down to how trustworthy a casino is. I wouldn't like to deposit and stake my coins in some new casino without some guarantees. It's one of the reasons I like dividend-based casinos, I play (or we can buy casino tokens) and earn tokens and stake them for some passive income, I don't need to risk by leaving my Bitcoin in a casino.

There's always a person will interested in bankroll investment, the proof if many people still leave their coins in centralized exchanges, it means they don't care with "not your keys, not your coins". But you need to make sure if your casino is trusted and big in the first place, how you can convince other people to invest in your casino when your site looks not capable to grow or sustain.

If it is trustworthy casinos and if the casino is having progress and more customers, then it is not bad. In casinos, as people are gambling, they are more likely to lose than win. That is just the fact. From the losses of people, the casino will pay you interests and you will make money from it. If someone can know a new gambling site, it would be good because it will likely be more profitable. But new gambling site are highly risky and it might even end up as scam. It would be good to make enough research before doing something like this.

Most of the popular casino nowadays usually have their own private investors that fund their bankroll. Only those small casino relies on public investment model for their bankroll. The thing is big casino nowadays dominates the casino industry that’s why there’s not much room for profit on investing with small casino bankroll.

Blackjack.fun is the only medium size casino that I knew that offers bankroll investment with fixed interest rate but the rest that I know offer profit sharing which is not appetizing on investors eye so I doubt many is still interested on this offer while there’s a lot of DeFi offer a much better profit opportunity with much better transparency and safety.

A lot of people were confused by your question, but well I understand a little bit now after seeing some of what they said.

So maybe invest the bankroll offered by the casino is it? If yes then I will not be interested in this kind of investment because there is no confidence where the casino will give rewards especially this casino is relatively new because people may doubt it a lot, so for me to invest with my own control not in a centralized especially offered by the casino.

If I'm not mistaken, the bankroll investment that I know is like Bustadice casino, right?

Bitcoin bankrolls are still popular. Any secure investment that gives a good interest on coin of choice are always being looked for by investors. There's no investment safe enough that gives more than 5% for bitcoin and if any reputable casino does provide a stable 10%+ profit on bitcoin, people would be interested.
That can't be said true for some other altcoins as there are different rates different exchange and defi are providing for staking.
Among good bankroll site's I knew and used bustabit and bustadice but the owner had further increased the commission on bankroll profit which might have put the effective yearly earning below 10% according to some bankroll investors.

Basing up into my understanding on what he had said is that he's really that tending to open some bankroll investment on which means that he would be the ones who would be holding up those funds,profit sharing would really be basing up on the time that he would really be making those winning bets or gambling session then this is where profit would be divided up. Just like on what most people been saying on here.
How would someone would really be able to get that assurance that OP wont really be running away those accumulated funds? I do highly agree on what most people been saying on here that
i would rather be playing on my own funds rather than on transferring into other people just because they do believe that they could entrust up their funds and letting others do the play?

Well, if OP could provide out some real time stats then he might really be able convince some people but i do highly doubt that there would really be lots of people or gamblers
would really be trusting up this kind of set up. Just like on what i have said earlier that i would really be preferring on playing on my own funds rather than
on investing into some bankroll.

I'm waiting for you to drop a post here and post this, or lead us to the thread you created three years ago, so since you posted on what you think on the subject I prefer to drop your thread here that you created three years ago I think the list is not updated but yes some casinos offer bankroll investment and these are some of the casinos that offer this, some are out of business some are still there but you will have an idea from now on how they perform in the industry, based on their reputation.

Do you mean holding ones asset through the bankroll in gambling or the earnings you make should be reserved on your bankroll, if you think you can be gambling and be earning through such means then know that this could not be perpetual enough for you to have a steady income flow in gambling, how then can one be able to make use of his bankroll as an investment even when all you could manage do is to use the remaining bankroll to gamble anytime you feels being financial stranded.

Yeah, it's very rare to see such a feature nowadays and unlike the old ones, they give good numbers to those who invest their cryptocurrencies in online casinos and other gambling sites. Yolodice had that feature before and I found myself investing with them too because of the thread made by one member here who shared how much profit he is making by just investing in them.

Now, because of the growth of different cryptocurrencies, I bet the online gambling sites who offers this service was scared off. I mean, they will be giving away money for that, but if they can handle it all they don't need to so no freebies for anyone.
And, it's not like reputation is that difficult to get. A lot of gambling sites today especially in this forum are reputable ones so trust won't be an issue for them so they don't really need to add that feature anymore just to prove it.

But, I do hope they could come up with this again especially from the popular online gambling sites because there are people who really want to invest in this type rather than gamble their money. It's the best way to accumulate more Bitcoin rather than sticking for the same amount waiting for the pump to come.

In my opinion, it is much better for a person to keep their bitcoins in their wallet and hold them than to invest in a casino where the profit is very low and the risk of the casino disappearing with your bitcoin is very high. for example, imagine that you invest 1 bitcoin in casino Z and that casino will give you a profit of 3% per year, a year has 12 months, even if your bitcoin is not converted into fiat and the price of bitcoin increases a lot, the The risk of waiting a long time trusting your bitcoin in the casino is a risk that is not worth it, because you are putting 1 bitcoin = $42000 to simply get a 3% profit, think about it, is it worth putting 1 bitcoin in a casino just to win profit as low as 3%? I don't think it's worth taking all that risk

imagine that the casino disappears with all your bitcoin, what would you do? I believe that you will not do anything against the casino and the people behind it, because it is an anonymous casino, with anonymous owners. then your 1 bitcoin will be used by them and you will no longer be able to recover it. That's why it's always important to keep your coins in the wallet where you have control over them. It is much better to be patient and make a profit by doing long-term hodl than taking unnecessary high risks with these investments that give little profit and can disappear at any moment. Nowadays, few casinos still offer this type of investment, to be honest, I haven't seen casinos here on the forum doing this type of thing.

AFAIK, there were forum members that have made their own threads tracking their bankroll investments not just for one casino but for several of it. I just can't find them all but I think that if they see this thread, they'll come by and drop their threads. IMHO, there's a little interest now with bankroll investments. But take a look at it like 5+ years ago, there were bunch of us that have shown interest on it and for that reason, many thought that it's one of the best investments. I can't argue with that but as everyone becomes more aware on how to keep their bitcoins safe.

It's just better to keep your bitcoins on your own wallet than put it on a bankroll investment even if you're highly trusting the casino that offers it. Because just as what we're saying with these exchanges, these casinos are not also giving the private keys whenever we deposit bitcoins on them. So, there's no difference at all about keeping it there as a bankroll and the same goes with the exchanges.

Bankroll investing is a strategy commonly used in the world of gambling and betting, especially in the areas of sports and casino games. This concept can also be applied to financial investments in general. And this refers to the amount of money owned or invested in gambling or betting activities. This may include funds set aside specifically for such purposes. Bankroll management involves managing money wisely to avoid the risk of major losses. This includes setting daily, weekly, or monthly limits, and sticking to them.

A common strategy in bankroll management is to only risk a small portion of the total bankroll on each bet or game. This percentage can vary but is generally recommended not to exceed 1-5% of the bankroll. And patience is key in bankroll investing. Not all bets or games will result in profits, and long-term success requires patience and tolerance for loss.

However, it is important to remember that bankroll investment in a gambling context carries risks, and no strategy guarantees profits. While the concept of bankroll management can help protect against major risks, remain responsible and play wisely.

Some casinos have done this kind of thing in the past, I remember seeing a list of them from a while back. But really, are there still casino platforms that offer this form of investment? I mean the old school type of investing directly in their bankroll and earning a commission based on their turnover?

Since when has the bankroll investment become a good way to HODL bitcoin?

I think only a few now are interested in bankroll investment since when that was quite popular before, it did not become a big thing as a whole. We can assume that it's not profitable even in the long run even if the house always wins. Most gambling sites nowadays are well capable of running the site operation without offering a bankroll investment,

Not unless the new gambling site offers a bankroll investment, the hype might be built, and maybe others will try to test the waters.

Now you can invest in liquidity pool like Defi, it's safer than custodial centralized casinos bakroll, because they can't do exit scam and leaving with all the coins borrowed to the investors, or addind suddenly new requirements or restrictions for withdrawing your funds to prevent users claiming their funds. In addition they allow more transparency on the use and evolution of the bankroll by the casinos using the protocol and the liquidity pool.

After several years lurking in the forum's gambling section, I have never seen a user stating that they have a successful run in bankroll investment. If does, maybe I just missed it but I'm sure there's none. I also remember someone created a thread here to monitor his profit at bankroll investment and the site was popular and famous. It seems that the progress didn't go well.

Maybe the interest is not there anymore, even long before.

I think I would be indeed I tested in investing in a casino, to provide to their bankroll. Though, since we are talking about Bitcoin and cryptocurrency casinos, I would feel very worried about the destiny of my money in the long term, to be honest.
It is one thing to invest money in a physical business or keeping money in bank, both if those cases we are talking about examples of entities which are accordingly registered in their jurisdiction and also have headquarters in their country, in the case of banks and investment institutions, they are even secured by some insurance, investing in casinos in the internet is a completely different thing, and I would doubt of any high yield offer I would see. It is just not worth it. It could be a ponzi scheme running in the long term.
Though, If I could find relatively acceptable yields and with a registered casino with a proven track record of years, then I would not mind to give some money to try it for some months.
I have seen one or two casinos before who offered those investing options, but I never considered them to be reputable enough for me to deposit in them, to invest.

I don't think casinos still offer this kind of perk to their users and even if they do, it's massively minimal and not something that the users could mistake for being a good way to refill their bankrolls. Sites like betfury in the past where you could go as far as to even stake your money in their site for extra benefits and moolah died down because this system doesn't work for the casino setting, where people are more on the "earn now worry about the risks later" mindset rather than the passive earning disposition. With that being said I think there are upcoming casinos on the market that would offer the same thing but at the same time I wouldn't really count on these sites booming or becoming famous as it's not the flavor of the month anymore. Casinos are places to achieve instant gratification and passively earning your keep not only undermines the operation of the casino, but massively sets a precedent where people could earn from casinos, a massive mistake.

I still think there's a place for this kind of thing outside the casino world though, and honestly I'd argue that you explore that instead of looking for ways to earn money inside the casino cause whatever they give you, they'll be able to take back one way or another.

Most sites that offer a bankroll investment feature don't use BITCOIN as a primary token. Usually, it's an altcoin or native token of the platform.

Generally, you will purchase the site's token and that will be used as an investment.

The site's reputation is a big factor here. Always remember one of the famous lines in crypto, NOT YOUR KEYS, NOT YOUR COINS.

Yes, but there were times that Bitcoin is the only crypto or at least ETH as well as the primary for casino investments. But the landscape has change in the last 5 years or so. Many casinos have their own native token now, some went on a ICO process, died down and accused of being a scam. However, there could still be casinos still managing and accepting investors with their native token and maybe it can still attract investors. Nevertheless, we are getting matured already, it's better for us know to just not take that risk and hold on our crypto, as you have said, the old and still very effective adage of "not your keys, not your coins" remain.

It was very profitable years ago when Crypto Games and Yolodice offered this feature on their platforms. There was an investor who made 50% BTC profit in a year time period by investing at Crypto Games' bankroll many years ago. It was a specific lucky year for investors and the casino, but even though the next years weren't so profitable like that, they were still consistent for investors.

However, after those two casinos ceased the feature, bankroll investment kind of disappeared, although there are other casinos offering it. The point is that they don't have enough traffic and don't make enough income to make it a profitable investment for investors, so people don't talk about it anymore too often.

For those who are still interested in a similar concept of investment, they can try freebitco.in. They don't offer the classical bankroll investment feature, but they pay daily interest over your BTC balance (4,08% APY) and run a casino on the website, so you are funding their casino anyway, just like you would do at other casino bankroll investments. There are always risks involved, but the platform has conquered reputation along of more than 10 years operating in crypto market already.

Everyone and every community has a different level of interest in bankroll investment, which is when people put their gaming money into investments. There are still people who might be interested in it as a way to possibly grow their Bitcoin holdings while gambling. Because of the risks involved, it's important to be very careful when making these kinds of purchases. When choosing to invest in a bankroll, you should carefully think about things like how volatile cryptocurrencies are and how unpredictable the results of gambling are. Do a lot of study before making any investment, and only put in money that you can afford to lose.

Yes, freebitco.in still offers investment features for bitcoin owned by gamblers and investors. They can check it on the site and send some bitcoins to earn daily interest on their bitcoin balance. It is an investment that is still ongoing today so that investors can try it. Yes, we know how the site's reputation has been, so this site is included in the recommended sites for gambling. Besides investing in bitcoin, freebitco.in also offers investment in FUN tokens so that there are additional benefits that they can get apart from investing in bitcoin.

Some casinos offer bankroll investment but not because you're investing in a casino you're investment is safe, there are risks associated with it, and one of these is the trustworthiness and transparency of the casino you're investing in.
So you should be guided and fully understand if you're investing in casinos on their bankroll

One of the casinos that offer bankroll investing is Bitvest and they fully explain how their bankroll investment, they did mention that they are transparent its up to you to take the words of the casino you're going to invest your money.



https://bitvest.io/investing

Why people are talking about bankroll investment?

OP is indeed that talking about pooling up funds to be acting as a bankroll for him to make use on, it isnt really that something that you would be talking about investing
into the house itself. Two things are totally different on which i dont know on why people been trying to discuss about two different things?

Just like on what most people been saying here that this one would really be having mainly that trust issues. No one would really be that confident on sending out
their funds into someone on just trying out to believe that the one whom they send those funds into does have that good winning chance
on which there's no fun with that if you are really that playing gambling just that for fun.

This is an old model of bankroll investment since most of the casino especially on DeFi was they are already using Staking feature using their own utility token. It’s not directly called as bankroll investment but all the casino token investments money are going to the casino funds for their bankroll and other expenses while they are rewarding token holders through profit sharing by buy backs and other form to boost the token price aside from staking.

The Bitvest model is old and risky since you are storing your money on their centralized wallet while you can hold your casino utility token on your decentralized wallet and wait for the casino to distribute profit through buy back then you can sell your token on exchange.

Thank you. You helped me understood the question better. Didn't know that casinos had something like this. Would have loved to know the casinos that did this in the past and what would have caused them to stopped it. Were they not in profit? On the side of the gamblers who do this, do they see gambling as a business? Because only those who see it as a business would give up the fun that gambling offers and decide to do bankroll management.

Maybe because they think this is one of the right ways to invest because when they save crypto assets, especially Bitcoin, in casino bankroll, when Bitcoin experiences an increase in price, the amount stored in the bankroll will also increase in value.
And maybe they are looking for additional capital to gamble for free by investing or saving assets in bankroll.
We will never know what the real reason will be because everyone mindset will be different.

But here why OP says to keep the funds for his use?
Obviously the OP was just asking if anyone still uses or is interested in investing in bankroll, he also mentioned HOLD and that means the goal is to save, invest to make some profit.
I actually don't really understand what you mean.

Is it like giving money to someone with the aim of investing but that someone uses the money given to them to gamble?
I don't understand, but what is clear is that doing this is very risky and if really want to gamble then just gamble privately without involving other people and if the aim is to invest then just send and store all assets in private wallet which will clearly guarante security.