Bitcoin Forum

Just a thought...

If you consider how much the dollar is and will be losing value through inflation, because of impending euro-crisis and quantitative easing. And add to that the uncertainty of the safety of our dollars in financial institutions... witness the loss of client funds with the bankruptcy of MF Global (8th largest bankrupty ever).

It would seem to me that if BTC found a stable price point, it presents itself as a decent place to store wealth anonymously and in a very liquid manner.

Thoughts anyone?

too many ifs, imho.
gold and silver are the way to store wealth.
and that is not a shameless plug, it's the truth.
maybe but 5% of your wealth in btc, max.

IMHO, the only "if" to surmount would be a stable price for BTC.

BTW, totally agree that Silver/Gold is a great way to go for long term investment.

Holding physical silver long here.

USD cash has serious liquidity problems due to the various anti-money laundering laws, and unfortunately this liquidity issue is plaguing bitcoins as well. Personally I'm hesitant to hold more bitcoins than my daily mtgox limit.

That' a good point.

the dynamicness of btc means even though its not a good candidate yet for storage long term its stull great to know your btc is safer than buried gold in other respects - accessible and usable in a different way. I mean, gold is a better store but what good is gold if you can't convert it or even get to It?
.
probably worth having a few btc stored just in case if you can risk it.

I would prefer to store fuel or cigarettes: p

gox limits is a good point - this needs to be fixed

gold has had its 15 years of up trend... Going Extremely high a few months ago. but whats stopping gold from dropping. isn't this a highly speculative market as well?

the safest place to store your wealth is in your own life, enjoy your money!

buy a house! buy some beer, buy a super hot computer, wtv you want.
buy some bitcoins and spend them! support something you believe in.

money / things are not wealth

invest in your life!

singled out the one thing better than silver/gold

buy a wife? ???

Nail on the head. 
Bitcoin as an investment in a diversified portfolio to preserve wealth -Risky but practical
OMG DUMP LIFE SAVIGNS INTO BITCIONS! - Horrible idea

If you gain or lose 10% of your wealth almost every day (~current volatility), you will get no sleep and get nothing done but watch the price.  Save yourself the stress and only put in what you can lose without regret.
*This is not financial advice, do whatever you want, I am just some guy on the internet.

Clap Clap BRAVO- +1
From the womb to the tomb, what we do in between defines us.

i know someone who had one imported from china.... he's lost alot of money in the process =/ this is not recommended

Bitcoin is, and will be a very risky investment. If you have an appetite for risk, then invest to it. If you want to avoid risk, invest to something else. Bitcoin could still be useful to you as a money transfer tool.

I think it's practical, i am going to invest $10k into btc.

Besides, you can't sleep in Google stock.

I'm currently fleeing most of the EUR holdings I have and also EUR-denominated insurances. It isn't much, volume-wise, but it's a large part of my small little wealth.

I'm doing it over a period of time and roughly like this:

• 60% -> gold
• 30% -> silver
• 10% -> bitcoin

I might adjust this in favor of silver and bitcoin in the future.

avoiding risk, aye? I can only think of a house or some land here, both of which sorta carry a minimum amount you have to put in which I don't have.

Any other suggestions?

BitCoins actually seem to have an interesting correlation to gold, silver and equities which help smooth out the overall volatility in a portfolio. They are also, in some ways, safer and more secure than gold which can be confiscated or taxed. Gold and silver are good for transporting wealth over time but I think bitcoins are superior for transporting wealth over distance. Bitcoins are the ultimate offshore bank account.

I think people should have at least 0.1% of their net worth in bitcoins. I think 1-3% is not an unreasonable amount and actually would make a great current asset in the cash portion of the balance sheet. For liquidity I think having some American Express Prepaid Cards in place, not tied to one's own identity, and some individuals who will fund them with Moneypaks when needed. With 20 prepaid cards you could withdraw $4,000 cash from ATMs per week which would make it a fairly liquid form of wealth.

Agreed.  Money is only as good as what you buy with it.  Money, by itself, is no better than kindling.  My father-in-law spent his life living conservatively (his dad went through the Great depression).  Late in life he started spending on things.. not a lot, just more than what he usually did... so bought a year-old pickup instead of an 8 year-old pickup (he still wouldn't buy off-the-lot), he bought a nice golf-cart instead of renting, etc.    I noticed that once he started doing this, and enjoying life, he got a lot happier.
 
I'm not saying go spend every time you have the moment you have it, but enjoy yourself... you're allowed!

by the way, when someone invests in gold/silver, is it just a paper trail, or do you get a physical gold bar?
 
I'm just wondering 'cause if shit hit the fan and the economy collapses, anarchy, etc, etc, I'd be leery of just holding a piece of paper.
 


"It says here that I own a gold bar!  I'm here to collect."
 
(person holding the gold bar)  *cocks gun*  "That piece of paper don't mean shit son; possession is 9/10ths of the law, now get off my property.  Leave your woman, tho."

You can do both. Generally there's a higher fee associated with purchasing the physical item.

But a piece of paper is never the real definite thing you can trust.

It depends on how you purchase it. Sometimes traders prefer to have digital holdings that they can move around a lot easier. That's when they get that little slip of paper.

There are a couple benefits from only having a slip of paper. Mainly that your gold is being secured in a vault complete with a couple of big guys with guns.

However, you can also buy gold or coins straight from dealers (like Coinabul!). If you buy with us, you pay a bit over spot price to pay for minting the gold, shipping the gold, all those other costs that allow us to sell gold to you!

The best advice I've heard is to keep a majority of your gold in those secure vaults and just a couple of pieces at your home, in case things go sour.

And since 9 or 10 people other people also "own" that exact same gold bar, the EFT/COMEX is always very careful to keep it well guarded.

Exactly, don't trade paper without considering "open interest"

I have made the following investments:

10% Irreplaceable solid assets. (I own a really expensive violin with a phenomenal, explosive tone)
29.99% U.S. dollars. (high interest savings account and CDs)
0.01% bitcoin (bought a handful of coins at $13.00 per coin)
60% Equities. (about 40% financials bought @ market bottom in March 09, 25% tech, 20% industrials, 15% consumer staples - about 50% large cap and 50% mid or small cap companies)

I don't think bitcoin is worth investing more than 0.01% of your net worth in, but it's definitely worth investing more than 0.0001% of your net worth in.  Sort of like buying a single lottery ticket to learn about how the lottery works over the course of your lifetime.

I think Bitcoin is worth putting a significant percentage of your wealth, if you can take a bit of risk.
I'm putting 100% of savings in it. Albeit I don't have much, but if Bitcoin goes mainstream I will be rich!

this raises a good point: "how much do I have?"

if you have 500 USD, buy some bitcoins, misewell.
if you have 25k+ USD, buy some bitcoins, buy shares, buy gold
if you have 500k+ USD, buy some property, buy gold, buy silver, buy bitcoins.
if you have 1m+ USD, have your wife sign a prenup.

It's not that simple in real life when shit hits the fan. You come to that same guy with a chunk of gold instead of the piece of paper, to get some goods or to arrange for border crossing.  Guess what happens next...

Unless your situation is really (rarely?) special and unique, a bar of gold will often help you about as much as a brick. Unlike brick, though, it will attract bad kind of attention. Gold is good when things are good. If you're a tough guy, or at least an asshole, shit hitting the fan may be a good time to acquire gold cheaply from poor souls who saved it for when shit hits the fan.

Invest your money, time, and passion in friends, health, and all sorts of education. That might help you when times get rough.

BTC is at this point a noticeable, though not huge, percentage of my wealth.  The reasons you mention are big factors in my decisions in these matters.  I have, however, never considered Bitcoin as anything but a very long-shot gamble albeit one with the possibility for a large payout, and that remains my mindset.

Bitcoin is the one possession of mine which I have realistic access to if I alighted in a foreign land with nothing but the shirt on my back.  That was one of the biggest 'selling points' to me since it is by far the most tenable way to achieve this goal.  Buying a condo in Montevideo is much easier fantasized about than done, and Uruguay may or may not be the land which I could find myself.

You cannot be speaking from experience, this is purely your opinion. If we look back historically, gold has always been valuable, even in the very worst situations. Hence the saying "as good as gold". Only a global disaster of epic proportions could effect gold's fungibility, IMO.

Why do you assume that gold will only be traded in bars? There are American eagles, Canadian Maples, and other official coins that are not only valued for their gold content, but also have numismatic value and are backed by the authority of various governments.

I'd like to know how people with gold got on during WWII

Much better than people without gold. I've heard numerous stories about people buying tickets for the ship to US with gold, people bribing other people to get out of the country and even people bribing soldiers to let them live. Do you think they would accept some pieces of paper of the country they are occupying?

Silly.

While having a big gold-brick would be sweet, I was considering buying a bunch of pure-gold coins (or small bars) that could be easily hidden, yet pulled out in an emergency.

Coinabul, are your coins/bars pure gold, or a mixture (or plated)?

I think in addition to the above suggestions (property, gold, silver, stocks, bonds, cash) maybe somebody should start investing in ammunition.

You could have a digital currency hardbacked by commodity bullets. You vault them and then hand out the redeemable certificates (scrip).

A digital bitcoin-like currency backed by ammunition and/or weapons. You have to protect your investments (whatever is in your possession) somehow right?

Your suggestion is so ubiquitous that I planning to trade a few quarters (real ones) for a couple of ammo cans if we ever get to a situation where I need them.  If we don't...the hopeful scenario...I'll use said quarters for something else and let others burn up their barrels in target practice.  Fondling and firing guns amuses me for all of 5 minutes or so.

My calculus is that in a gun fight one has about a 50% chance of needing further ammo after the event, and probably much less if you go up against a gunship.  Thus, owning a basement full of the stuff is overkill unless you plan to enter the market as seller...where you will have much company and almost certainly on the wrong side of whatever laws might exist.

All that said I am totally in favor of as many private individuals as possible stocking up to the gills while it is relatively easy to do.  In a truly unpleasant scenario an ammo cache could very well provide value which survives it's original owner.  So please carry on!

on the ammo thing: http://falkvinge.net/2011/12/16/do-we-really-have-to-prepare-for-the-fourth-box/

also: probably need to stock up on ciggies and sugar, too.

Salt and pepper.

Wasa crackers are good.