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I am opening this thread as opposed to all the publicity you have received about day trading. It is a very falsely marketed activity, on a par with MLM businesses, with the difference that the latter tend to advertise in smaller niches.

So let's see why if you're thinking of day trading you'd better not do it because you're likely to lose your money, everything and more. The longer you trade the more likely you are to lose, and if you use leverage you will lose it quickly.

The following article is from a reliable source and refers in general to traders, not specifically day traders:

Why 90% of Stock Market Traders are in Loss? (https://www.researchgate.net/publication/380733162_Why_90_of_Stock_Market_Traders_are_in_Loss)

But I would like to highlight one paragraph that reinforces the idea that frequent trading is counterproductive:


Here we have two ideas:

1. Transaction costs. Every time you make a trade you pay a fee, which works against your profitability. There are brokers that claim to charge no or very small fees, but then they tend to have a wider spread.

2. The psychological aspect, which is more difficult to master the higher the frequency of trades.

Let's see more reasons:

3. Time and Experience. Although advertisements and trading houses sell you the idea that with a little training you will be able to start earning money comfortably from home, the truth is that being a successful trader requires a lot of time, study and practice.

4. Mathematical impossibility if you start with a small capital. The idea that you are going to start with $100 and be able to reinvest it until you make it a large capital or that you are going to be able to get a monthly income from it clashes with the mathematics. The smaller the capital and the bigger your aspirations, the more likely you are to lose it all and the faster. Just ask someone who knows real finance, not someone trying to sell you a course or shitposting on bitcointalk.

5. There is no guarantee of success, even with training and practice time. Those who sell you trading courses earn more by selling courses than by trading themselves.

6. Survival bias distorts perception. Success stories are often seen because those who fail simply disappear and do not tell about their experience.

In another thread I commented that Warren Buffet, who is known as the world's greatest living trader, has earned an average annual return of just over 20%, over a sample of decades. He says that if he worked with small capital he could make a return of 50% per year. That's something like 0.136% daily return, but also ask yourself: why is no one as famous as Buffett a day trader? The answer is very simple.

This is not new on this trading discussion. We all the time warn people to trade with the amount of money that they can afford to lose. I have posted many times before on the trading discussion on this forum about how 85% or more of traders that are losing. There is nothing new about this.

Hope your money is not going to gambling also because I think you lost huge amount of money while trading recently.


https://talkimg.com/images/2025/02/05/e3hiz.png


This image also shows that you were never an active poster on trading discussion board on this forum. I noticed that I did not noticed anything relevant about trading about you before on trading discussion. I know the good trading discussion posters and they are not many.

...90% of Stock Market Traders are in Loss...

How much sustainable, repeated profits are available for the 10 to 20% of traders who are successful? Savvy, winning traders are rare but they do exist, and - unlike gambling - you have a real chance to win long-term since you are competing against other traders.

Don't day trade, you're going to lose your money = Good advice for you and many others, but a horrible thing to say to a young person with potential to enjoy a great career as a successful trader and investor.

That I can really agree with because in gambling, it is all based on luck if you happen to play casino classics. But in trading, you have better chance especially if you know the coin you are dealing with. The more information you know about the project, the better your chance of earning profit. Just discard such piece of advice because once you are well-equipped in this market, you can work around with your trading activities. Definitely, start with small funds as you need to get good grasp of how crypto trading works. Everyone started here from somewhere, just like in forex.

honestly day trade is so random in term of profitability, nobody can guarantee whether you gonna lose your money or make profit, it is at the end of the day comes down to statistic and as of now 90% of trader are losing money, doesn't mean all losing money, if you got the edge you might become the remaining 10% who is profitable.

basically it depends on you and your trading ability, like any other activity, even arbitrage has chance of losing, doesn't mean everybody is losing though.

Short-term trading, for the average Joe, is a game with a negative EV (trading fees). If you try to trade news, you will always be behind the news creators ;D and if you take a trade based on TA, it is just random noise, nothing else. The only way is to locate your servers close enough to exchanges in order to gain some edge in terms of execution and become high frequency trader, which I guess if you have access to then you would not have been the average Joe ;D

I agree with your sir, day trade is risky, it's completely uncertain way especially in day trading, but long term trading is profitable if will show patient, trading ability is everything in trading, who are experienced in trading, possible to make profits in day trading, but no guarantee about consistency even experienced traders.

the most profitable day trade activity is MEV bot ;D because you actually exploit a loophole and those big MEV bot runner are racking profit big time.
but as far as I know day trader make technical analysis and usually detached from the news, if it happens that news appear, they mostly close their position to avoid market volatility and see next opportunity.
as from my experience, we can make money from day trade, even consistent, as long as you only use small amount of your capital as margin, like 1% probably, so if you lose you can compensate.
it's unlike those depiction where people are making hundred grand every day from trading, its tedious and tiring job, overtrade will easily blow up your entire month profit.

Should we take this as a financial advice? In all conclusiveness, so no day trader is profitable? You're in for long term hodl? Is that what your submission is all about?

Even though you left your last sentence with an assumption that we should know, I still don't know what the simple answer is. Nonetheless, I like to let you know that every businessman or investor won't have the same temperament and shrewdness of Warren Buffett. We all aren't built the same way, and it doesn't mean that Warren Buffet's way is the only right way to do it.

Every trader has a particular type of trading time that best suit their strategy. It doesn't matter if you are a day trader, a scalper or a swing trader, so long you are profitable. I don't actually see those fees collected by brokers as much. Most times it depends on your positions and lot sizes for crypto( leverage). They take little fees when your trades sleeps over to the next day called swap fee. A traders experience in the market is what matters not much about the brokers fees...

It's not just about day trading, there are different types of trading, (scalping, day trading, swing trading, etc), but generally, trading is a very risky activity. On countless occasions, different topics and comments on this board have warned against the risk in trading and anyone that have the zeal to trade must always have it at the back of their mind that losses are usually inevitable no matter the strategy you are using.

Most of the times, people are usually referred to holding, rather than trading. So, you have not said what has not been discussed before now, but not bad to still remind some newbies with the idea of getting rich quickly through trading.

Of course I wasn't, because trading is a more a way of losing money, not making it. I am a long-term investor.

What are you trying to do, discredit me? You'd better worry instead about demonstrating that it is easy to get the returns you say it is easy to get.


Please don't talk rubbish.


It depends. Skill games are similar to trading.


Exactly, plus you play against high frequency trading algorithms, and nowadays also AI.

Trading is can rally look good and a huge source of income to many people that thinks in such perspective but the reality is absolutely different. Just like the stick market, there are also many traders that are in huge losses but would not come out publicly to let people know. I keep seeing people posting their success in trading not their misfortunes. We are in the era where every trader is claiming to be successful when their portfolio are bleeding.

The really traders don't come out to voice their success. It actually appears like a smoke covered with a basket with bigger holes. Whether you are a day trader or swing trader, I believe that everyone has a strategy that is working for them. If you have a profitable strategy that is earning you profits from day trading, that's fine and if you are scalper with a  profitable strategy, that's fine too. The aim is to make profits from the market.

There are people that actually do day trading It's working for them, even if majority have to rely on luck because you cannot exactly be able to to get it right always and when you talk about the trading to me, there is not much difference with gambling Just start in gambling You can't reduce a lot of things that put every risk on the measure, but dumpling does not have those features.

No matter how good you are in quite selection you still have to hope for luck because even people with knowledge are losing money but they just have to depend on and the same way that people want to make money but futures comes with a lot of responsibility they have to know how to read charts and be able to interpret exactly what is actually the truth you will just have to have the mind of handling your loses.

They can be professional traders with trading is their main jobs, but even professional traders don't force themselves to trade every day. There are days, they will stay outside the market and do nothing, it's how professional they are in trading.

Amateur traders who do daily trading, not because they are professional or good at trading, but it's because they are trading addictive and they don't see risk of over trading that can affect their trading capital negatively and possibly cause big loss.

With traders, amateur or professional, manage risk and defend their initial trading capital is everything that is important they must do. If they can not defend their initial capital, their trading career will end after they lose all that capital. It's most vital skill they need to prepare before trading and master through their trading experience.

You can day trade only if you have good skill in trading so you can analyze the market and find the coin to trade. Day trade is risky but if we can learn more about trading, we will reduce the risk and make a profit. They must learn more about trading so they can understand how to analyze the market. If they can learn and take their time to trade, they will know when to enter the market and pick the coin and take their profit. They will not greed to chase more profit if the situation is not good..

In my country the situation got much worse due to the wrong taxation policies from government. Every trade has to pay 1% as tax from the trade amount which is irrespective of whether we made profits or lose during the particular trade made the day trading as impossible to be a sustainable model to make any profit at all.

If someone wants to make real money with not much of complicated strategies and analysis all they need is to HODL the accumulated BTC.

I disagree to the comparison of trading to MLM.

You have day trading and you have long term trading - I discourage the former but do support the latter because in my experience it can be profitable if done properly.

Day trading is also profitable but I find it more stressful and difficult to handle for those who have a big life outside their computers.

But trading mindset is also important and most people dont have that.

If you don't have the experience of day trading, don't involve in day trading, because you are going to lose huge funds and it will make you feel that it is possible for people to achieve income from day trading, because you don't have the experience. If you have the experience of day trading, it will be difficult for you to lose so much from your day trading, because you have to rely on your strategies and experience whenever you are embarking on a day trading, to make sure you continue achieving income either huge or small. I have tried day trading many times, it didn't give me what I want from the trading which is the reason I have change my mind to use small amount of funds to do day trading, because the pressure of the day trading is too high.

If you are going with long term trading, it contains risk, and does not like zero risk.

I don't know what you do with your long term trading, but a longer time you leave your coin on centralized exchange, the more risk. Additionally, the longer time you let your trading position opens, the more risk especially if it's leverage or futures trading position.

Day trading or long term trading, use Stop loss order.
One of the best weapons in trading. (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5173189.0)

If it is long term trading, I would like to do it as my investment. Withdraw my coin off exchange and only deposit it to exchange for taking profit.
Reminder: do not keep your money in online accounts (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5421039.0)

I agree with what you are saying, op, where for every closed position we make, there is a fee that is deducted from us, whether it is spot or futures. And I have also tested that if you do not place a stop loss, it can really cause us to liquidate often.

That is why this is very important and a good habit because we will have control over our loses when we carry out trading activity whether short or long-term.

I would not advice anybody that is starting to trade newly to go into day trading but for someone would had gotten the experience from their years of trading, they can put that knowledge to good use by day trading and they will make profits. There are some people that are day trading and making profit therefore if someone can do it so can you. I am not saying day trading is easy but I am saying, you can decide to be a trader that does it daily and still be making profit but before you do it, you have to be very skillful in trading already. Some people that try to say trade are going to lose money but with the right guidance from experience mentors and discipline, you can make a profit from both day trading and trading in general.

Let me unpack some of them:

1: True, but those are actually quite small in crypto trades.
2. I disagree. It's hard, but not harder then high frequency trading. There are studies in psychology on how to beat your fears and be more in control, and these techniques are actually working. They aren't based on luck, but just psychology and growth. They are also in many ways beneficial in your life, other than trading. There however isn't any working method on how to be a good trader.
3. Sure, but even time and experience can't guarantee you winnings. In fact sometimes you make more money with beginners instincts and luck.
4. This just isn't true. If it would be mathematical impossibility, there wouldn't be any millionaires that started trading with that amount. And i know at least one for sure.
5. This is true.
6. I fail to see what survival bias has anything to do with success stories. Warren Buffett doesn't believe in day trading or technical analysis, and i sort of agree to a point. There are just so many ways to do technical analysis that i really can't just blindly believe all of it.

I think that you could express a best opinion in your comment. So I am also agree with your prefer comment. We also know that short term trading is very risky for any person. If we will be a new traders it will be very risky, because we can not understand suddenly what do we should in cryptocurrency trading. But if we follow in long term trading, it will be very helpful for us. Because when we start long term trading, then we can decide what should need in this time. So I think that we should trying to understand in cryptocurrency trading and need to acquire knowledge in cryptocurrency world, then we can earn best profit from cryptocurrency market.

Expert traders would like to short term trading, they are mostly comfortable to day trading i know some people, long term trading boring for them, they want to make profits in daily, but even expert traders can not make profits in consistently it's impossible, because they don't know what happen in the next after bought a token.

Two basic problems cause losses in trading when a person is day trading. The first one is to do futures trading with high leverage and less knowledge. We often see newbies getting into futures trading when they hear or see some other traders getting good profits from it, but they don't realize that there is more risk than reward in this, and they jump in. Soon after that, they got their account blasted because they couldn't handle the risks involved.

The second problem is overtrading, as you mentioned it. When you get into trading, you are not supposed to make a lot of trades with the mindset that your profits will be higher this way because it is a wrong mindset. More trades mean more fees and, of course, higher risk exposure.

Hence, if someone can gain enough knowledge beforehand and doesn't do these things, the chances are they are going to become profitable in the long run.

These people aim to be in profit by having more good positions than the bad ones. The difference is in PNL, of course.
Trader is not the one who is getting profits all the time, it is the one who is getting them by the end of his sessions.

The main mistake of a beginner is that he starts with futures, and for a beginner it would be worth starting with spot, where his deposit would be much safer. A large shoulder is a pursuit of quick money, and it is good if a beginner starts with a small deposit, because he will lose it in any case, it will be a lesson and in the end it is good if he switches to spot and he will have something to trade. A beginner will initially have a lot of desire and will make many deals, because he will be very passionate about trading, and in order to understand how everything works, he will need time.

A good trader will enable himself to avoid loss, that is he does not turn to profit, because of which he does not covet.  If our goal from the beginning is to make profit, then we will not be successful because any work, business or any other has both profit and loss in it so we should take a step with patience and good understanding from which we can also make profit and if we go into loss then the loss should not be so much that we can worry about it which will be added to the calculation of our profit.

Your perception is wrong and the advice is not smart, day-trading is part of trading styles that have "blessed but also ruined" people's finances just like any other style of trading you can talk about, holygrail doesn't exist in trading. Still, if you know your day-trading strategy very well, manage/plan your trade rightly and are disciplined, then you will have good results. However, trading is risky, it is either you risk it or leave it.

Nevertheless, I agree with you on those brokers/exchanges making more money through day-trading. This is why I open a maximum of 1-2 trades daily. Although the practice is in line with a good day-trade practice and the gainable amount is not too big for the service they render.

No, it is not wrong, because with the thread what I wanted to put is a contrast to all those ads and influencers who sell you that learning a little trading you can make money easily. The statistics are there, however much the trading houses that live on fees and influencers who charge for promoting trading do not show them or underestimate them. For someone who has never traded before and is considering starting now, they are likely to lose their capital.

Playing dice is also a kind of trading but with negative edge (core argument). You can argue the same for any casino game with negative EV that some will win and some will lose, but the real question is can you make sustainable income from day trading, answer is NO, the math is not on your side.
Yes, there will be occasional winners with longer winning streak, just like in casino, but overall population will make a perfect bell curve as per the odds (which are not in your favor.)

Totally disagree!

When it comes to trying out to make comparison or trying out to say in between gambling and trading then its really that totally different. Yes, when it comes to risks then there's risks and trading would become that gambling at the moment or time that you will be not applying any analysis then this is where you can say that it is gambling. Day trading is risky but i do see that futures will really be that even more riskier. Trading loses is inevitable because market is really that unpredictable and there's no way that we can be able to predict on where price will be going. There are still those who do make day trades on which we know that there are different trading styles on which it could be that daytrading,scalping,swing trades and long term trades.

If you dont like on losing money then better not to trade, as much more on doing gambling. There will those times or moments that you are really that becoming that too optimistic but ending up on having some disappointment. On the time or moment that you deal up with trading then expect you can have those loses. The important thing on here is that you do really lessen up the risks as you do go forward. It is really just that too impossible that you wont be able to learn things along the way.

You are not getting it right if you are comparing gambling with trading. They are completely different but their risks can be the same for people that do not know how to trade. Some people could have been trading since many months but do not know how to trade. Some people will even would have been trading for years and still be losing. But if you ask an experienced trader and gambler if trading is the same as gambling, the trader who is also gambling will tell you no. There is more probability for traders to make money but which is not true for gamblers.

No problem at all, now let's look at your arguments which propelled you to disagree.

I should sue you for murdering my brain cells.  ;D.
How can you write so much repetitive crap without saying anything substantial? I think your conclusive line (bolded out part) is supporting my claim. ;D

Really!,
long-term trading is one of the types of day-trading? ;D. For your kind information there are various type of Dice strategies also. How does this lead you to disagree with my stance?

OK, thanks for your sound financial advice. I thought we were talking about day-trading not trading itself.

RIP, my brain cells.  ;D

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How ?

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If anybody want to have a serious attempt at this, I will ask you to first read my thread: A Death Knell to Short-term/Intra-day Traders.  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5523670) This will give you an overview of my position so that we can have a better discussion.
And please have some mercy on brain cells ;D.

This is true, OP is right about the easiness of it. Everyone thinks it's sooooo easy to trade, and while there are some humans in the world (very rare) that easily understands how to do it and get richer, in most cases we are not going to see this be that easy for anyone at all. Obviously we need to make sure that things aren't that simple, and we could always make it change with time as well.

So all in all, if you really want to make a lot of money, then you need to spend a lot of time and get a lot of experience to be a good trader. I would say veterans won't really care about what OP says anyways, they are veterans, so the best way to move forward is to assume that OP means the newbies or the likes when he says don't day trade.

I think it doesn't depend on the level of the traders. Even if they are experts, they may be interested in long term as well. I think traders choose whether for short or long term trading, depending on the market condition, too. So, the experts are possible to do both short and long term together. How the chance for the success? Since they are called as experts, surely the chance will be high (both for short and long term).

I understand the school of thought you are driving at but you shouldn't have used trading as a kind of gambling, they are two different things even though they look similar. Again, you asked a question and also answered it yourself, that's funny of you to speak for everybody. If you can't sustain a good result for day-trading, does that mean other people can't? Day-trading may be very risky but it's not the reason why it should be totally condemned.

I see the ambition of ignoring spot players or futures players who want quick profits and not a year's accumulation that can get 3% profit from capital is considered sufficient. This market is like playing a bet, the more profit is obtained, the more obsessed you are to place a bigger bet so that the concept of folding sees the profit running. Buffett has many points and doesn't think too much about small things like that, he only says the concept for psychology, he certainly won't guarantee that everyone will be able to follow as he does.

"A man who is a master of patience is master of everything else". George Savile

Day trading or traders in general are set of impatient people who are eager to take advantage of the market in a short possible time. I'm quite sure that every experience trader is fully aware of everything you highlighted in Op but unfortunately they have chosen the path to lose more money than being patience to hold their coins for a long period.

You could simply put it, don't trade because you'll likely lose your money in the long run. Not specifically for day trade.

Talking about point number five , there's no guarantee of success in any type of trade be it swing trade or day trade, there are people who become successful from day trading while others achieve financial stability through swing trade. It all depends on you as a trader, first of all you must be very decisive of what you want. If you want to be a day trader then look for ways to master your skill set and you can do that by always running back test, strategy development and perhaps participating in a mentorship class. The only thing required of you is discipline and consistency.

Yea you are actually right and I also share the same sentiment as you, the real guys making money from the market are not posting it on social media or telling people how they are making millions daily from it, it is mostly traders that are making most of their money  as influencers that mostly post only their winnings online, because who the hell in his right senses would want to learn trading from someone that always post his failings? None, so that's what it is.

Then as for the topic of discussion, honestly I don't see anything bad in day trading or any other trading system like scalping , swing trading, trend trading and so on, all are risky, but the key thing here is how skilled are you in the craft?
That's where the winning and losing are, because if you truly knows what you are actually doing, it doesn't really matter which strategy you are using to trade, you can always be profitable because you knows all it entails to be successful while navigating your way in the market.

If that is not enough for you to not take day trading as a career then go ahead.

Yes, there are traders who have an edge over others because of insider information, unethical practices, servers located near exchanges, high-frequency trading, etc. But to an average Joe there is no sustainable money.

Why do you think so? Please explain why it is sound advice for an experienced trader but not so good for a new trader. It does not make sense.

While trading can make you money but it is only the investment that will make the life changing money. There is no comparison of trading with investing and one should focus on investing too while having the trading fun all long.

Trading can be further  classified as swing trading, day reading or scalping etc. I think the most profitable is the swing trading while the most difficult is the scalping which is made only for the advance traders or who has lot of time to spend in front of the screen.

What the person wants to do let them do what ever they want and they will work on their self by reading and the forum have made everything easy for everyone because in this forum you will find everything that you want to do in this forum and knowledge matters a lot when it comes to what you want to do and about day trading because you,and through the knowledge you will be able to make a quick decision in your selection and the strategy that you will develop and there is more things to learn than to look at the profit because this is why may everyone is always looking at and we need to make adjustments about our understanding because that is what understanding will give you, what you don't expect.

I know so many people that are making real money from trading and what they do sometimes is to use a large part of their profits to invest in other sectors as a hedge. Some buy invest in real estate, some buy cryptocurrency while some also do several other types of businesses. This does not mean that the money will stop coming from trading, they just have to diversify so that whatever happens, they will always have funds to run their lives. You see, trading is not all that bad as most of you think, it still come down to the level of knowledge and discipline you have.

In any case, it will depend on whether the trader adheres to the risk management rule or not. It must be remembered that the main task of a trader is to save his deposit, and if he learns this, he will be able to earn money in the future thanks to his knowledge and experience.

Yes, we need to diversify in our investment, i would not like to invest in only cryptocurrencies, because this will not always give good profits, beside trading we should focus on as like house rent or realstate investment and to build different business then it's out come will be great.

It cannot be denied that day trading is really high risk, and it is also not a guarantee that every time we do it we will have a profit at the end of the day.
The majority of individual traders are really losers in the end. Meaning, at some point the op is right.

So if I were asked, it would be better if we only conduct trading activity 2 or 3 times in this field of the crypto space in the trading industry.

Trading is only simple and I think everyone on their normal/right minds can understand it but what is hard is knowing the fundamentals around it. Trading has variations too like we can choose our risk, same as gambling, so both can be the same I guess? It is just that gambling is more on the entertainment side because they are games and sports while trading is more on the business side because we can only see boring charts here.

This would be the same to what I'm saying above/earlier but many months seem long enough already for them to not know the fundamentals of trading. It might be better for them to just quit already than lose a lot of things for nothing.

Day trading is overhyped and risky. Most people lose money due to fees, emotions, and false expectations. Even top investors avoid it for a reason i am currently a swing trader it is much safer with less losses .

I agree with your opinion that everyone has the right to make their own choices and also many things they can learn in this forum and with the various knowledge gained here certainly becomes a provision for them in deciding things that are appropriate and when we enter trafficking many things that are We cannot predict but we must be able to adjust the strategy so that we can survive or release the assets that we hold because if we cannot face the situation we may continue to maintain assets that could have made even greater losses.

I invested part of the money (most of it) in long-term transactions and left part for trading, and in all cases investing (or long-term transactions) was more profitable. At the same time, I spent much less time on them than on trading and I could avoid all the losing trades that happened in trading and took my time, money and my nerves. Now I trade less and less and tend to focus my attention on long-term trade.

Long-term is where patience lies and evolves.
You are keen to make fewer mistakes in that way, and you just hodl till you think it's enough and it's time to get PNL to be realized at last.

I think that is certain, when a trader makes daily profits of course he will not waste the profits he gets that day and he will definitely save his profits in long-term investments to maintain the growth in the value of their assets. The opportunity for success in trading, both short term and long term, depends greatly on the trader's knowledge or experience and discipline. Traders who continually learn and adapt to market conditions have a clear trading plan tend to have a higher chance of achieving their goals.

Maybe some of us have tried short-term trading and I have also tried it with various methods that I learned through videos of someone who succeeded in short-term trading. It turns out it's not as easy as I thought, the method has no effect every time I try it. That's why I stopped being a trader, I better switch to regular investment with a long-term method, which is much better.

Don't be frighten, day trading have its advantages and disadvantages, but if it's clear and understandable, everyone have equal right and mindset to explore their chances of grabbing losses and profits. If you're not keen on day trading, don't discouraged others that find interest in day trading. Day trading are mainly for scalpers, they selects a shorter time frame and execute their trades, they lack the patience of waiting for days and weeks before actually triggering their trades. They need the result instantly and I choose this path, atleast one knows his or her fate. Not everyone have a bad luck running day trading, it's important and basic necessity for those category that mapped the good set piece.

Of course day trading is indeed very risky. Market prices fluctuate very rapidly especially in the short term due to this volatility day traders often suffer losses emotions also play a big role in day trading. Traders often make wrong decisions due to greed fear and excitement it is necessary to have good knowledge and experience about the market without sufficient knowledge, the risk of loss also increases greatly. There are some traders who succeed in day trading by using the right knowledge strategies and experience. But before day trading you need to consider your own financial situation if you are not willing to take risks it is better not to day trade.

Holding sounds simple but at the time or moment that you've been seeing the market drops down or pumps up that much or new ATH's then you will be itching out whether you will be selling out or buying even more. We do know that not all people will really be having that same mentality about having that long term hold and thats why they would really be that preferring on dealing up with the market on active manner even if it means on trading up actively. Neither holding or trading actively on which you would really be still be able to face up risks, although it will be that differ when it comes to level of risks on which its obvious on which one is really that more riskier. Day trading or scalping is indeed risky specially if you dont know on what you are doing. This is why there are those who do have decided to hold their Bitcoins rather than on making up some active trade on which this isnt really that actually a bad choice. There are really those people who do play safe and there are those individuals who are really risks takers or who do really wants to see up earlier profits even though it means on dealing with volatility.

You say that because you don't have a holder's mentality. As a proper holder, if I see the market going down, at most I think about buying more, not selling.


That sounds quite generic to me. You have written a lot of words, but saying that is pretty much the same as saying nothing.

Indeed, long-term traders do not mean that they are only focused on this, of course that is not the case, because they also carry out day trading activities, and vice-versa, short-term traders also have other assets that they hold for long-term holdings while they do short-term trading.

Then as a trader, it is normal for us to expect to lose here, because this is where we learn where we already know the strategies that we should not do in the actual trade that
we do on any exchange platforms.

You're right, day trading is not for everyone. You need to know what you're doing and have a good strategy before jumping into it.

Especially now, looking at the fear index, it's a bloodbath currently.

Im a day trader and its easier to make analyze the market with the higher time frame because there's a confirmation that depends at the same time with the availability of the trader, I guess its riskier to trade with a lower time frame because the market is so volatile just simple market changes gives a huge impact on the price and of course you cannot skip just a blink of an eye to make trade on this. Instead in a higher time frame, you can easily make another execution where to entry and exit strategy.

Im an intraday trader/scalper in forex on which i have tried out to apply it on crypto as well. I can say that lower TF trading is indeed that very risky i should say on which you would really be needing up to have that bias on higher timeframe on which i would say that it is really that a bit hassle because you would be needing to be active on trying out to check those biases on higher timeframe. I have been able to experience that higher time frame kind of trading on which you can really be able to take up some application with technical analysis. It is really that somewhat not that much effective if we do speak about on crypto market because if we do tend to compare it out into those traditional market like forex and stocks then it is really that totally different.

On the time or moment that you have decided on taking up such career then make it sure that you should really be that having that kind of consideration on  trying to look on whats the best for you in speaking about trading methods or ways on which that would be getting in line with your capability or capacity because each trader does have its own preference when it comes into this one.

  Yes i agree with that statement luck well there are some that are quite not good in day trading and some are really good and aslo it all depends on the mindset of the investor, well from me i really don't like day trading well because it alway needs time commitment and it unpredictable well to most people's it really worth Nothing because to them they feel this are some right strategies in helping them to control there risks mentalities.

So does it mean 90% of day trading ends up in losses? Because I'm trying to understand all of this now but I'm aware the results of being profitable in day trading is slim and you'll tend loose more but what I want to understand is that does it always end up in losses cause with the way alot of people tend to go into it, I had to make a conclusion that it varies and we can't just give up that it's not profitable.

There are still people that are making money from day trading and we should just think that because some may be making losses from dat trading, then it's not a good way to trade and make money. Every traders does not have the same portfolio that can sustain one to hold trade for a very long time that's why it's good for us to trade based on what we hold and our understanding about the market. We still have scalpers that do trade under 5 minutes timeframe which are in the market to cash some profits within few minutes.
Everyone need to trade based on their knowledge and what they can sustain because not every traders have huge portfolio to sustain a long trade.

it varies indeed, it's just that 10% takes 90% of the money because they're well equipped with sophisticated tools and smarter than the 90%, if you see someone profit in trading consistently then they are the small minority that profits.

if you however can do really well in trading then go ahead, be that 10% remaining people and make profit out of it, if you're not however, I think investment is the way.

day trading isn't for everyone, only for people who really understand the game in my opinion.

They are exceptional, and they are just a few. So we don't get surprised if we lose from day trading because not all are meant for that position.

Perhaps it is very important to position ourselves into something that we are capable of. If day trading does not suit us, we can choose spot trading or just be plain investors. Besides, all of these things are ways to earn money. Why choose day trading if we know we can't make money from it? Otherwise, that is stupidity.

The percentage might be even higher, lets just say that most day traders dont make money.

But mate, you have been on this forum since 2017 and you still have not figured trading out?? Were you completely away from the trading scene since start?

Day trading is similar to gambling, these altcoins that people buy, have no basis of putting money in, they jump into the ones doing good and then exit. But this ends up being a huge rat race overnight. That is why it tolls on the brain and the body of the trader and the money goes down in total.

All matters on how you would be able to sustain because at the time or moment that you do deal up with trading and we do know that there are different types of trader on which you would really be neither to have that daytrader or would be a scalper or would be that a long term ones. If you are planning to become a day trader then make it sure that you've been that good when it comes to spot trades on swing then you would definitely at least have the idea on what you've been dealing on specially when dealing up with volatile prices in short time candle time frame on which i would be saying that it would really be that much needed and wont really be putting yourself into some issues at the time that you've decided to go with another path or way on how to trade up with the amrket. Losing money is really just that normal because you cant really be that perfect when it comes on trading up with this volatile space. No matter how old and veteran you are but still you would really be able to experience loses on which this is really that something inevitable. If you dont like on losing money then trading isnt for you or any other similar investments or even on gambling. Dont day trade if you arent that good when it comes to swing trades or higher timeframe on which you would be able to have such difference.

It is impossible to reduce risk to zero in trading because any given action that one is taken or decision made always entails profit making or loss. We can have different plans for the short and long term goals but if we do not have an understanding of the market, all these would not be effective. This, however, is never a disadvantage in the general sense, as such high speed and changes of prices are a challenge in their own right for the ones who plan on getting the most profits within a relatively short time. It shows that no matter the time that one is alive in this world, loses are still part of life. The most important thing is the fact that we are attempting to exercise as much caution as possible from the time of making any decision in order to persevere in the face of new market conditions.

I believe that everyone has different abilities in the same job. So this also applies in the crypto world, especially trading. Some are better at day trading, some are better at spot trading and so on. So we just need to find where our abilities are more prominent and we can find it by learning all the time. Don't push yourself too hard to do something that we don't really master. I mean maybe we can understand everything, but don't rush and it's better to learn first than to force yourself because it's riskier and can make us lose money faster.

Day trading is something like gambling. and every day Traders always get panic because there intentions of holding investment for some hour's or a day. must of the time day Traders face loss. all day Traders think thereself smart and they think there prediction is right and after bought any token they predicted, price of that coin will increase or decrease but it will follow there entry. must of the day Traders choice future trading for quick profit. but they loss and loss and also face liquidation many time. but they not stop trading. day Traders is like gambling addicted

Not entirely true, it is not day trading that makes trading like gambling but how we trade, for example trading without knowledge or just based on feeling.
Day trading is still trading but thinking that it will produce profit every day is wrong because there are times when traders will lose, the problem is which is more frequent, loss or profit, and losses will usually damage the trader's mentality so that can make the wrong decision, being a long-term holder is much better.

Some investors can easily accept trading. They may have more skills, but there are many investors who do not have sufficient knowledge about trading but they like to trade. For those investors, trading is not very effective. It is definitely important to gain knowledge about trading. Although it is easy for those who trade regularly but for those who are new to the trading world, doing any kind of trading can be dangerous. Trading should never be associated with emotions. It is definitely not easy to make money from trading.

I will not discourage those who want to trade, but if someone does not have proper knowledge, it is better not to day trade. We know that cryptocurrency is risky, but day trading is more risky. But those who understand the risk and gain sufficient knowledge trade can be very easy for them.

Day trading is usually good for scalping. We test our strategy and principles in the market because we open day trading. There are people that understand how these day trading works effectively. They're scarce in numbers because they know what exactly what they're doing and not some random Traders that transformed day trading into gambling. They've no backup plan and open trade as if they've zero opportunities on opening a trading tomorrow. Day trading is optional based on your strategy, we choose if we want to trade daily or specified these charts for months.

Day trading isn't for everyone only few could be successful on day trading specially in bear market it is hard to make profit when most of thw cryptos are dropping down.
It is hard to choose which one could go up in a short spam of time to make a quick profit and you should also consider the fee that would be cut to your trades.

Trading is not for everyone, and even if you try, you will most likely lose money. Trading requires time, focus, and patience before you can achieve your goals. Anything that brings a lot of money will undoubtedly be difficult, but if you can pass all of the challenges and are willing to learn, you will become perfect and profit from it. Experienced traders are the ones who do day trading because you need to have the knowledge and experience to deal with the market. If you can't accept risks, you should stay away from trading. It's best to focus on regular investments because trading requires you to understand that you can lose your money at any time. You can claim that if you stake, you're guaranteed to win, which I think is lucky because you can forecast the market. However, if you want to be one of the lucky victors in the trading team, you must first gain knowledge and expertise before you can be among the lucky winners in the trading team.

If I base my answer only on the title, a trader cannot be called a trader if he is afraid of losing funds in trading. That's why there is BUY and SELL, where when selling that means there are only two reasons 1st is you take profit and 2nd is that they sold because the price of the coins they hold dropped even though they are losing.

That's why entering trading is like a job where you really should know the basics and what you should know in trading, particularly in the strategies that will be used as guidelines
in the analysis that we will do here if we enter being traders.

I generally tend to agree with this.  Crypto is still way too volitile and all the TA in the world wont help you with such short timelines.  Sometimes there is no rhyme or reason why it goes up or down.  Best to just buy hold and enjoy the ride.  Easier on stress levels as well.  Watching crypto charts all day gets exhausting

As somebody who's currently doing an experiment on what will be my result if I day trade for around 30 days, I would say that it really is stressful and very exhausting at the same time. I have a solution for that though and that is, limit the tokens you're trading to only 2-3 tokens. That lessens the stress of watching all of the tokens' movement.

As for the volatile part, that's why there are many traders that are making money off of trading. It's the volatility that's the reason why many are making money, but at the same time losing money as well. What I would say is that if you're afraid to lose your money, don't trade. If you can't afford to lose that money that you want to trade, don't trade. Day trading really is very risky compared to being a swing trader or a position trader, but in terms of profit, day trading has the highest so I would say high risk, high reward as well.

Trading is for everyone but then only those who devoted their time could have that winning part of the trading, and yes there have been series of discussions and warning about people trading with the amount they could afford to lose than going that extent with the amount they can't accept losing, and yes we know that it's also very tempting and when risk management aren't applied it's that easier for people to keep losing their hand earned money into trading.

Its not a job because it does not depend upon your level of skills but only your luck and the market. It does need risk to execute which is higher in case of day trading and lesser in case of long term trading.

Strategies dont exist here because again it does not depend how skilled you are or how much knowledge you have similar to gambling comparing with any sort of actual job like cooking which needs the skills and experience.

A simpler way to putting strategy is buy low sell high which also needs a number of clauses after that to make sure it profits.

It is really very tiring, even though we do not work physically and we may even be in an air-conditioned room, but still watching the market movement is very tiring because our minds are working, and in my opinion it is more tiring to work using the mind than working using the body.

Maybe we can see how someone who works physically after bedtime, they will quickly fall asleep. While people who work with their minds will find it very difficult to sleep, I have experienced this myself.

TA will not guarantee that price movements will always be as we predict, because as said this is so complicated and we know that market conditions are also very volatile.

The crypto market is different from the forex, stock and commodity markets because there are still many coins that do not have good fundamentals and also large liquidity, besides that there are also many crypto assets that are just pump and dump schemes, usually meme coins are often like this but when choosing bitcoin trading the story is different, it's just that doing daily trading with bitcoin is not so comfortable, bitcoin is more suitable to be held (just a personal opinion)

I agree with you because most traders are losers in this market and as losers, they depend too much on luckiness for their trading positions. Professional traders are different but they belong to minority in this market and are not counted here.

With newbie traders, they don't have any strategy and simply have their greediness to force them opening many trading positions with bad and risky entries without enough safe capital management and no idea of how to proactively close their trading positions for avoiding liquidations. They perhaps don't have any idea of Stop loss order and don't want to use this order for protecting their trading capital.

One of the best weapons in trading. (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5173189.0)

It is only possible and easy with investment or spot trading.

Day trading may seem working on few traders, but majority are certainly losing on it. So I won’t suggest either to risk with day trading where losing is highly possible. Even experienced traders are doing it with high caution, yet some still lose in the end. That only proves that day trading will likely to cause you great losses than making possible gains. Better to focus on buying and long term hodling instead.

Frankly, most traders are losing money, even the so-called professionals. But despite that fact, many people still rush into trading because controlling greed is not easy.
Except for some newbies who have no knowledge, I believe everyone knows that long term holding is the best way to make profit in this volatile market, but not many people have enough patience to hold for long term. Most people want to make money and get rich quick, so many people continue to trade even though they have lost a lot before and are even aware that they are more likely to lose than win. The temptation is too great and very difficult to resist.

Losing is inevitable and this is something that should really be putted up on someones mind because on the moment that you would really be that being optimistic about being that becoming that a perfect trader then this could really be only happening on dreams but in reality then there's no such thing about this. What matters on where is about on how you would really be able to sustain on which this will really be the main thing that you should really be that thinking when you do touch up trading. Doesnt matter whether you would really becoming a day trader, intraday,scalper, swing and long term traders on which this will really be that sharing up with the same goal or target on which its recommended that you do really know at least on what you should gonna do.

Losing money is normal, whats important is that you do able to make profits that would really be able to cover up those loses on which simply talks about sustainability. It will really be just that too bad that you will really be that expecting too much without even trying out to realize on how the reality reacts.

My understanding about Bitcoin is that it has it's own timing of going up and down, we can't predict when it will go up or go down. TA/FA didn't work well in case of Bitcoin. The best way to get benefit from bitcoin is to buy it and then HODL for long term. If you have better understanding of Bitcoin then try to buy when price is down compared to high price. For instance, it's more appropriate to buy Bitcoin at current price of 81k  rather then buying when price was around 100k. The long term strategy also frees us from the hassle of looking at Bitcoin price on daily basis, just invest once and HODL for few years. 

4 or so years - and any Bitcoin investment comes full circle and brings results.

The issue is only to get an understanding of the process, why it happens, and why BTC only becomes more valuable as time goes on.

If 90% of traders lose their money, then 10% still manage to make a profit from trading. So this statistic is not so frightening, as everyone has a chance, having gained knowledge and experience, to become a profitable trader and become one of the most successful 10%.

I don't know this information is true like 90/10 but there is a Pareto Principle (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareto_principle) that if you apply for trading profit and loss probability in a trader community, you will have like 80% loss, 20% profit. It's not too far from 90% loss and 10% profit and the fact can be somewhere around 80% to90% loss, in the middle or lower than 80% or higher than 20% loss, but this fact about risk of trading is very strong warning on newbie traders.

If they think trading is easy, this information is strong enough to wake newbie traders up from their unrealistic dream.

This is the very reason why day trading is not safe for beginner or inexperienced traders because they will only suffer from committing mistakes and losses in the long run. Even professionals cannot guarantee profiting in day trading so it’s best to just buy and hold and enjoy bitcoin investment. Lesser losses, lesser stress anyway.

That is a fact that even professional traders can still make mistake when they do this. If they, the good ones are not able to guarantee profit then how much more are the newbies can do. This is why they have to look at those people that cannot guarantee profit as their model, it doesn't mean that they are newbies won't also make a profit but it means that the market doesn't choose anybody to guarantee some money. And with this, it can also make them aware that if some gurus are telling them after the class or the course, they'll be the best trader in the world, it's a scam. So, a lot of birds will be hit with one stone as a warning.

Thats quite haed to be part of the 10% before I tried to become a good trader, and I can tell its not really easy. Comparing the wins and loss, Id say the exchange gain more with fees than me. Its not I dont understand it but its really unpredictable. So thumbs up to those who are good into making profits on their trade.

It's not easy, and it's not meant for everyone. You need to have a lot of patience and grit just to sit on the sidelines and let the knowledge and indicators dictate what you will do. It's always like that and most of the time that's how you could make it and profit. The consistency and being strict with yourself and not treat it like gambling.

Tools are also good for this and that would be on your trading style as well.

Remember, these statistics are usually gathered over a small period and small typicals.

In a period of 1 year? 5 years? I doubt anybody tried going back in 5 years to ask the same people if they managed to make profit.

I can almost guarantee in the longer period of tie the 10% in profit will become 1%.

Day trading puts you even more at risk.

Be frightened :)

Honestly, time and experience are big factors that can help us as traders, of course if we don't allocate time for trading we won't know the things we are studying
whether there is something right or wrong in the implementation that we will do or do in the actual trade.

So, for me, even here we can become skilled later without realizing it because we pursue ourselves to really learn, unlike others who only study but don't really want to learn
when it comes to the actual because they become impatient, you know what I mean.

Even without day trading, not many traders can make money, and even those who make money statistically will lose in profitability to Bitcoin hold, so you can draw conclusions and save your time. Although every trader will want to test their strength in trading, for me it was an exciting activity, I liked trading, but when I compared it with my hold portfolio and realized that my trending was losing to it, I had no doubts left to give preference to Bitcoin hold.

You apparently haven't realised that this statistic is generally for traders, not day traders. The more often you trade, the more likely you are to lose money.


Do you want to put your money where your mouth is (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5529140.0)?


It's just like that.


Yes, it's clear to me that what you mean has more to do with writing whatever it takes to make up your weekly quota than with sharing knowledge you have on the subject.