Bitcoin Forum

What happened:: The have deleted the card but before deleting the card they have never informed me and there is no terms and conditions for the deletion. And they are telling me to create a new card by 30$ which is a scam

Scammers Profile Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=3609392

Reference Link: https://prnt.sc/2DKLlOOaL4Bv
Amount Scammed: 30$
Additional Notes: I have contacted with them via telegram chat but they are not able to provide any valid response about the deletion. And on that card there is still top up option according to them it happened for their frontend developers.
https://img001.prntscr.com/file/img001/2MWJozAFRcywT2b2rHLfGw.png
Flag: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;flag=3387

Edit:
They Offered users full refunds for deleting negative reviews:

---

They deleted the card instead of blocking the card which is mentioned on their terms. They are stealing the funds of users by deleting the card as the card should be blocked after 5 declines and there is no chance of more decline nut they have neither deleted the card nor blocked the card they just shown deleted card from their website that's why after creating this topic there happened more decline this behavior should be no one but scammers.

The suspended account of other people and ask them to provide evidence
Update:
They have suspended my account:
https://img001.prntscr.com/file/img001/hRuWHGCdRh2NZMLWcyhNeA.png

We have certain rules established by the bank, which are clearly stated in this thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5484771.msg63647081#msg63647081), on our terms and conditions page, and through periodic notifications on our website. These notifications serve as a reminder that multiple declines due to insufficient funds may result in your card being deleted. Your card received a significant number of declines for insufficient funds and was therefore deleted by the bank’s risk control system.

UPDATE: we discovered that this user received the card for FREE from the very beginning as part of our trial program—he never spent a single cent on it. And now he’s calling us scammers? Ridiculous.

On your terms and conditions page, you have not mentioned the deletion of a card you have mentioned blocking a card. And it is for 5 declined but you have charged me 6 times for the decline. Why you have charged 6 times instead of blocking after the 5 declined and why there is no notification about the charge as well as about the deletion of the card?

From your ANN thread:

There is a difference between blocking a card and deleting a card. If there is a payment decline for insufficient balance, there is a need for the card to be blocked. It's understandable for security reasons, and the card should later be reopened if the customer contacts you and rectifies the issue with you, but why delete a card when you know it costs money to request a new one, and that's a totally different thing from what you stated on your ANN thread?

I believe you have these details?

Now is your time to prove yourselves right. Post the evidence here (of course you can blur/cover off any sensitive information in the screenshots). We (or the members in this forum just want to be sure who is right or wrong.)

Shasan didn't deny the allegation, in fact he corroborated it:


Anyway, the terms are indeed clearly laid out in the accused's service thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5484771.msg63647081#msg63647081), and Shasan admitted to reaching the number of declined transactions listed in the thread.

To be honest, I don't care either way.  Certainly not enough to oppose or support the flag.  Selling non KYC virtual debit cards is shady as fuck, and anyone buying them should assume there's risk involved.

Sure, we have all the evidence, and if a moderator requests it, we will provide it. However, at this moment, there is no need to do so since "Shasan" does not deny this fact. Additionally, we respect our users’ privacy.

but your own terms say nothing about cards being deleted after getting blocked?
it clearly say the card would be blocked by you and not the bank, and the user can unblock it by contacting you.

https://www.talkimg.com/images/2025/03/18/0gUh9.png

first, mods don't moderate scam accusations.
second, if @Shasan is okay with it, i don't see why not post the info, as long as you redact all personal details.

The decision to unblock a card lies solely with www.paywithus.net, and our final decision was to delete this card. This action was taken because many users exploit cards to obtain free trials without intending to pay for subscriptions. Such abuse negatively impacts the system and may affect other users.

To prevent misuse and ensure security for all users, the bank’s risk control feature is essential. We do not impose excessive requirements—simply cancel any subscriptions you do not intend to pay for or maintain a sufficient balance to cover them.

i get why you deleted the card, but you are missing my point.
your terms (neither on the website or the forum) say anything about deleting a card after blocking it.

if you are going to delete cards for whatever reason, you should clearly say it in the terms.

In this dispute I am more for what shasan says, because as others have pointed out the ToS talk about blocking, not deleting.

However, no one else is struck by the fact that someone who is in the business of lending money acknowledges that he has tried to pay 5 times without sufficient funds?

Despite the terms and conditions, and message in our thread ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5484771.msg63647081#msg63647081 - "The card will be blocked and will not be refunded after having 5 declines (no coverage) in 48 hours.
")  there is also a mandatory notification https://ibb.co/BHQk8snZ that you cannot bypass until you click ‘Notified.’ These are our rules, and whether you like them or not, if you choose to use our service, you are required to follow them.

I don't think this is strange. People mostly use these cards to pay for online subscriptions, such as buying game credits or subscribing to Netflix. Some services automatically try to spend the funds from your card when the package expires. If the funds are insufficient, the service keeps trying to renew your subscription until it succeeds. I assume he subscribed to something and turned on the auto-renewal, which triggered multiple attempts to spend the funds from the card. I am sure people do not keep large funds on such cards.


Whatever, you are right. But you are missing a simple point. You never mentioned anywhere that the card would be deleted. Did you? Of course, you can do whatever you want with your business, but you have to follow your own rules. If you do something, mention it in your terms and conditions. You are not providing a personal service; you are running a business. So, you have to be professional.

That is bullshit. They are not ready to do business therefore they have to stop online cards issuing because people will be frustrated with their obnoxious Terms and Conditions. It would have better you guys making things fair foe people to use online. I have been using master card for years, and I have not gotten any issue in offline. And I thought that would have been the case here but this blocking and deleting method of cards is not the best way.
If this service was good many people here would used it and you would have gotten your service fee regular.

https://ibb.co/BHQk8snZ

I have some questions. In the screenshot it shows a balance of $4.87. This amount belongs to shasan therefore will you return it to him if does not want to pay $30 to obtain the card or will you confiscate the balance?

Regarding the card that was deleted, did shasan pay $30 for it and was given a $10 balance (or another amount minus the $20 fee) or did he receive it on a promotional offer/free trial courtesy of PayWithUs?  

You are correct, @God Of Thunder, and it's not just something that happens with Netflix; almost all subscriptions which we use our card for do try that. Unless you go back and cancel your membership with them or use the payment option and disable the card once it's the due date for your subscription renewal, they will keep on trying to make the payment themselves through the card you have added there even without your permission, and I have been debited for my Netflix subscription renewal even when I no longer use the account again, which is why I have to cancel my membership with them.

You keep reuploading this image to answer the question about card deleting, which you don't have included in your ToS, both on the forum and on your website. What if the customer doesn't log into his or her account over this period? Do you just assume they got the notification and chose to ignore it? And aside from the pop-up and the display each time the customer logs in, do you try reaching them with the warning via the email attached to the account?

I warned everyone about this shady service from the first days they showed up in forum.
If I remember correctly there is another member who previously accused them from stealing money from him.
Now, speaking from experience of testing other virtual crypto cards, I can say they are very unstable and I had cards canceled/deleted as well for different reasons.

So according to this you are now accusing shasan that he tried to exploit something from your service, all because you think he won't pay for subscription ::)
Sounds like a silly excuse to me.

Our service is fully automated, and as soon as the bank’s risk control is triggered, the card will be frozen and then deleted. Since our launch, we have had more than 5,000 users, all of whom know that we always strive to help and resolve issues, including offering full refunds or card replacements when the issue is on our side. However, in this case, the user subscribed to a service, then abandoned their card, resulting in more than 10 consecutive declines. This triggered the bank’s risk control, leading to the card’s deletion. Now, they are trying to blame us as scammers, despite the situation being entirely due to their own actions.

If you are talking about offering full refunds, then why didn’t you refund the $50 for the card this user purchased, which didn’t work with German accounts? This is proof that you do not adhere to your stated refund policy. And if the card doesn’t work with German accounts, shouldn’t you have mentioned this beforehand?

------------------
Coming back to this issue, your ANN topic was posted here in the forum on February 11, 2024 (https://ninjastic.space/post/63647081), which is the same time Shasan received your card. This was before you edited your announcement topic on February 19, 2024, and added the refund policy and important notes.

Assuming he didn't notice these important notes in your topic, he should have at least received email notifications about this. Also, you didn't mention deleting the card but rather just saying that it will get blocked, as @Zwei has mentioned. So, to avoid prolonging the discussion here, you should either restore Shasan’s deleted card or issue him a new one as compensation for what happened, as the mistake is on your side. Even if he had abandoned his card and it was blocked, he would have had the option to recover it through your support. Now, he is forced to buy a new one, which is unfair in this case.

Would you like to tell me if you block after 5 declines then why does it charge me for 6 declines and if you block then why will there be no room for unblock? If there is a block option then there must have unblock option. And for the unblock option you might have some criteria. But for my case, you have directly deleted my card instead of blocking it, and you have denied any option for re-opening/unblocking my card why? Isn't it for stealing card fees?

All necessary information has been provided multiple times. You violated the rules, and as a result, your card was deleted—it’s that simple. You chose to use our service, which means you must follow our rules. Otherwise, feel free to use another service. Further debate on this matter is a waste of our time.

Netflix subscriptions? Well, if you subscribe to a service and you don't cancel it, of course they will try to charge the monthly fee.


Come on! What you are doing is breaching a contract. If you don't want them to try to charge you for the next monthly payment what you have to do is log into the platform and cancel, which may cost you a minute or two.

I don't know how you see it as normal to contract something, not cancel the contract and stop paying.

Yeah, that's what I did. I guess you missed that part on my statement. If I don't want my subscription to be renewed, I go back to the platform head, direct to account settings, and cancel my membership, which they won't try to debit me again from my card without my permission, unless when I'm ready to use their service, I will have to use the same option and renew my membership either with the same card or with a new one.

No, I haven't missed it. We are not talking about you here. We are talking about why shasan, who is a lender on the forum, had at least 5 declines on the service in question for insufficient funds. I am not going to defend the service here, but it is clear that he has done something wrong, so in this case I will refrain from acting.

I mentioned Netflix as an example. None of us knows if Shasan actually subscribed to Netflix or other online services. Let's say you subscribed for weekly game credits, which cost $5 per week, and you had $50 on your card. You used the same card to subscribe to another service, but you forgot to top up your card; now, the game company keeps trying to renew your weekly subscription once it expires, and you have no clue until you log in. Actually, I think these things happen sometimes, regardless of who uses them. It does not mean much if someone is a lender who has a good amount of crypto in their wallet. Not keeping a hefty amount in an anonymous card is a wise decision. I would blame him if he kept more than a thousand dollars.

Look, if your rules say you have to arrest a criminal, you have to arrest him. But you cannot kill him.
In this case, there would be no problem in blocking the card since your rules say you have the rights. But you just deleted the card. Why do you keep ignoring this point? I will tag you within the next 24 hours if you keep ignoring this repeatedly. I asked the same question before, but you ignoed it.

Read our terms and conditions carefully: "...The decision to unblock a card lies solely with www.paywithus.net and may depend on the Cardholder’s compliance with these terms and conditions...." Since the decision to unblock is at our discretion, we may choose not to unblock the card—and in such cases, we may cancel it at our discretion.

It’s very simple. You can tag us as many times as you want, but it will not change anything. If you need a card that will not be canceled due to declines caused by insufficient funds, simply visit a bank with your ID and order one there.

Ok. Yes, you do reserve the right to block the card and may not unblock it if you want. But you never explicitly mentioned that you have the right to delete the card. If you want to delete it, you have to explicitly mention on your website that you have the right to delete the card if it gets blocked. If you do not mention it and delete the cards, it means you are scamming people and making them order a new card.

So indirectly, you just said, "Fuck off, do whatever you want", right? That is too unprofessional.

What difference does it make to you—never unblocking the card until it expires or canceling it? Does it really change anything in how you accuse us of ‘scamming people’?

So, if a card remains frozen but is not deleted, it’s not a scam, but if it’s canceled, it is?

Perhaps for such ‘professionals,’ we should explicitly add the term ‘card canceled’ in the terms and conditions.

This is not true, because you said it yourself that you have the power to unblock and not delete card, that is clearly MANUAL action.

I don't know about that, but I know for sure about two forum members that made serious accusations against you, and you choose to ignore it.
You also spent a bunch of time acting like a kid with member incrediable, and you turned your ANN topic into circus show.
Very unprofessional and childish behavior.

Ok, we have another ‘expert’ here. Let me break it down for you—it’s a highly complex automated system that considers multiple factors, such as MCC, the ratio of successful transactions to declines, the reasons for declines, and many other parameters. Initially, the system freezes the card, and at this stage, we can manually unfreeze it. However, if the card continues to receive declines, it gets permanently deleted. In this case, the user had more than 10 declines against just one successful transaction (he can check his transaction history as he still has access to it).

Moreover, we discovered that this user received the card for FREE from the very beginning as part of our trial program—he never spent a single cent on it. And now he’s calling us scammers? Ridiculous.

Where have you mentioned the deletion of the card if you have mentioned anything about the deletion of the card then show it in an archive (I have asked for the archive as you can blur it). For decline, you can block my card but you can't delete my card as delete has not been mentioned. Note: I have got the card for free as a trial that doesn't mean you can delete my card. And I will soon publish howto  treat on your customer service on telegram. Also, I have to write a few more information about your service as well as customer service.

You received a free card with an additional $30 added to its balance. You spent all the money, broke our rules, and triggered our bank’s risk control measures. And now you claim that we are scammers? The only scammer here is you!

You have given those but you have charged 0.15$ multiple times for using a small amount but you have never mentioned it on your terms as well as you have never mentioned it on the charge/fee. Also, earlier I said seen my card has been inactive, and then you have given a new card as stated your bin had been stopped. Are you stealing a card and giving those to your users that you bin stopped but you have not informed your users?

Yes, we replaced your FREE card when we lost one BIN. It’s normal practice. But again, you didn’t spend a single cent. How can you accuse us of being scammers?

You are a scammer because you have deleted the card though you have never mentioned that you can delete any card and you have never mentioned you will charge your user 6 times while after 5 declined card should be blocked and another important thing is that if the card has been really deleted than how the card decline another time.
https://img001.prntscr.com/file/img001/b0X_2rIuTSC0QzFB9TXe2A.png
Who knows if all the decline has happened after the deletion of the card or not? There is no proof of when the card has been deleted and I wasn't aware before I logged in.

If you don’t understand how the entire banking system works, that doesn’t mean we are scammers. Despite canceling the card, we continue to receive notifications of attempted withdrawals.

And the fact that you, after receiving a free card and money and breaking our rules, are trying to accuse us of fraud is just too low.

putting the issue with the terms and the card being deleted aside.

i have to agree that you can't accuse them of scamming you if you got the card for free and never used any of your own money on the service.

Exactly—do you understand how absurd it is? It’s like getting a 7-day trial from Google Cloud, not spending a single cent, breaking their rules, and then accusing them of deception.

You can give me a gift and then you can take that gift from my room when I am away from the room?? When you have given me anything all the rights reserved upon me no one else even you have no right of that gift what to do with that gift and what to not. If you can do that then that will be nothing but an eye-wash or passing something to scam more. And if that is the case then they are trying to scam money by it.

He received this card for free. We also gave him a replacement when we lost the previous BIN, and provided him with an additional $30. He didn’t spend a single cent of his own money.

no, but you have never owned the card or the balance on it in the first place to call it a gift.

i assume the card you got was some kind of promotion. and stuff like this get taken back all the time, if a service give you something for free and they take it back later for whatever reason, you can't call it a scam, because they owe you nothing as you paid nothing. you leave a bad review and you move on.

you may not agree with what i'm saying, but i'm trying to be fair here.
for you to say they scammed you, you need to have lost your own money.

We were not going to take his trial card back, but as we mentioned before, he broke our rules and triggered our automated risk control; that is why his card has been deleted. Then he opened this thread to accuse us of being scammers, even though he didn’t spend a single cent. It’s really ridiculous.

I don't care what service it is, and as you said Netflix had caught my attention because I recently cancelled it and I haven't had any problems with them trying to charge me. The point here is that if you sign up for a subscription service, whatever it is, and you don't cancel it, they are going to try to charge you, because that's what you agreed to.


Now, this is getting interesting.


I see it more like they gave you a gift and told you that if you left the room they would take it away (or put it in a safe), and now that they have taken it away you are complaining.

So far I've supported you in all the threads you've opened but I don't see the point of this one.

If we are speaking in allegory, imagine a traveler who was given a golden ticket for a free trial ride on a luxurious train. Along with the ticket, he received a small bag of tokens absolutely free to enjoy the journey. The train company provided everything for a smooth experience, but the traveler decided to ignore the rules—using the tokens recklessly and causing disturbances on board. As a result, the company had to cancel his ride. Yet, instead of accepting the consequence, he went on to complain that the company was unfair and deceitful.

Well, this changed my mind and I have deleted my feedback from your profile. If the card was free, and no real money was spent by Shasan, then I am not sure if I can call it a scam. However, I still suggest you explicitly mention in your terms that the company reserves the right to delete a card.

I got you and I have to agree with that. Once I subscribe to a service, it's my responsibility to cancel the auto-renewal if I do not want to. But I guess you missed my point. Let's say you wanted auto-renewal, but for some reason, you forgot to top-up your card. Wherever you subscribed, they have been trying to spend money from your card and you did not notice it till you login back. If you are busy in real life, this can happen. I am just talking about the possibility, not sure if something similar happened.

There’s no practical difference. Arguing over semantics to find a loophole in the terms and conditions is a common tactic on this forum when people do something that is against the rules and they get penalized in some form.

I’ve used non-KYC cards from other providers before and these risk control measures, as annoying as they may be, are very common. Sometimes you can get a refund or a replacement, even if the card is canceled/deleted, but it is up to the provider and it can be a hassle dealing with customer support in these situations.

Ok so now let's go back to the main point of the thread. If that happens to you, it's not that unusual for the card provider or service to take some action. Most banks charge fees for returned payments.

What I can't do is this: the bank opens a free account for me, I set up a direct debit, and when I repeatedly forget to have enough money in that account to cover the payment, they charge me $40 and then I accuse them of being scammers.


I agree.


And automated, according to the service provider.

Keep digging deeper hole with this kind of infantile replies ::)

Wow, I see now what was is problem here, maybe he forced and blackmailed you to give him this card...
You gave away few free cards but than you think that you have the right to brag about it, and complain if they don't purchase another card :P

Here we go... counter accusation, and now shasan is a ''scammer''  :D

I have to disagree with this.
If someone gives you card, money, coins, bread, banana or anything else, than this item becomes yours.
If I send you 1 Bitcoin than this Bitcoin becomes yours, I don't have to justify and call you out for life how once that coin was mine.
He didn't steal or forced anyone to give him card for testing, and he didn't agree to be shamed for not spending more money.

It doesn’t matter whether you agree or disagree. You could also disagree that the Earth is round, but that wouldn’t change reality. This is simply your personal opinion. There are common sense and obvious facts—this user received the card for free. We also provided a replacement when the previous BIN was lost and even added an additional $30. He never spent a single cent of his own money. It was a trial program!

I won't comment anything on this stupid example... as if you have been in spaceship to confirm actual shape of anything.

No, it's just facts, not my opinion.
Let me repeat again, YOU GAVE HIM A CARD LOADED WITH MONEY, after that point card with all the money inside was his.
End of story, and I won't continue talking more about this subject.

The facts remain unchanged—this user used our funds to test our cards and is now blaming us. It’s like offering someone a free meal, only for them to turn around and accuse us of being scammers once they’ve finished eating.

that's not always the case, for something to becomes yours you need to have 100% control over it once it's in your hands, bitcoin, cash, cake, an orange etc... are item that can't be taken back unless you give it back or is taken from you by force.

bitcoin is really not the best example here, because unlike bitcoin, the "virtual card" and the "money" on it was legally speaking never actually his.
it's funny money, just like a game currency, it's there on your account, but it's the service that owns it, he was given access to it, not ownership.

if i gave you a free VPS to use for 1 year, does it become yours?
and let's say i shut it down after a few weeks, would that be a scam?

i agree, but he should have expected that tbh, he didn't spend any money yet accused them of scamming him, so obv they are going to point that out.

If you want to look it like that than you don't own anything at all, and your bank account with all the money is not yours, but you would still accuse bank if they first send you virtual money and than they delete it from your account (owned by them).
You also don't own your bitcointalk account, but you would still complain if someone hacks and take it over, even if that was theymos.
Or maybe you are so liberal that you would just ignore it and say it was never yours to begin with.
Anyway, good luck supporting this lowlifes, I am exiting this topic.

is your money really yours if the government can freeze and seize it? and with a bank, you have a legal contract, laws, and regulations that protect your ownership of your money, there is none of that with a random shady no kyc card provider on the internet that you pay for with crypto.

a hack is different from theymos banning/deleting your account, and he doesn't need to hack anything, he already has access to everything since he accualy is the owner and i only have access to post under this username/account. it's same for everyone on the forum.

come on man, saying things as how i see them doesn't mean i support them.

maybe i wasn't clear on that, so let me be clear, i don't think they scammed him because he didn't use his own money.
but i also do not recommend anyone to use their service for the fact that you can get your own card that you paid for with your own money deleted in the same way, which will be a scam since they mention this no where other than the popup after you get a card, but this kind of info need to be knows before hand not after.

this will be my last comment, as i feel i have made my opinion on the matter clear.

This information is explicitly stated. You cannot proceed with purchasing a card until you click the ‘Notified’ button, where this rule is clearly mentioned –https://ibb.co/BHQk8snZ

When they give it to use mine they can't get it back as it is my own. By the by if they would take it back by saying their promotion not working or something like that and they need to take it back then I would not mind. The important factor to me is that:
They would block after 5 decline but they have charged me 6 times for the decline. Even after the the deletion (after the thread was created they declined the payment) if the card has been deleted then how they can decline they would not show it anymore. Now how I can know how many times declines happened before the deletion? And there is no terms regarding the deletion. At the same time, they have not sent me any email about the deletion of the card.

An important factor to consider is that you requested a trial card, and we provided it to you for free. When the BIN became unavailable, you asked for a replacement, and we issued a new one. Additionally, we gave you $30 for free to spend as you wished . You haven’t spent a single cent of your own money. On what grounds are you accusing us of being scammers?

You have offered the card to check to check how your card is so that we can check and if it is good then we can use it. You have not been told it is a trial and you will delete the card. And you have mentioned the card has been deleted due to a decline. How you can charge 6 times for the decline while the card should be blocked after the 5 declines? And how you can decline while the card is deleted? So, you deleted the card before any decline?

After five declines, your card remained frozen but was not deleted. This is why each subsequent decline was still processed. However, after additional declines, the system triggered the card cancellation process. BTW your card remained active for an entire year.

Regarding the cancellation of your card:  you violated our rules, and as a result, your card has been deleted. It’s that simple  - how is this not understood?

Regarding your accusation of us being scammers: you requested a trial card, and we provided it to you for free. When the BIN became unavailable, you asked for a replacement, and we issued a new one. Additionally, we gave you $30 for free to spend as you wished. You haven’t spent a single cent of your own money. On what grounds are you accusing us of being scammers?

We believe this discussion has reached its conclusion and further communication would not be productive.

You have asked me https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5484771.msg63650406#msg63650406 I have not requested from you. Do you block/delete cards manually if not then how does it take too long? If it takes too long and there is something wrong then how users on your site can be safe? I am still on the same point and I think you are scamming your users in various ways and deletion of the card is one of them. If the card is active for a year then whyare you told the card can't be reactivated even if I refill it?
https://img001.prntscr.com/file/img001/xZWwGJ4rQOiMUXjbGha_kg.png

We have provided a clear and thorough response. The only dishonest action here is taking money from us and then falsely accusing us. We will not waste any more time on this matter.

I went through a similar thing. My card was first blocked (2+ months ago) and then deleted from my account a few days ago. Also, I had a negative balance on it, because fees were charged from the bank for some unexecuted transactions.

Honestly, I didn't see a problem with deleting a blocked card, which had a minus balance. A very small, but still negative balance. Now I can't remember how many notifications there were that it would be deleted, but I remember one for sure. Maybe in the future, you can implement some email notifications about such events. If the user was informed in advance about the scheduled deletion of the card, he might make a deposit and cover the required amount.

Still, you are not telling me  about your mistake of charging 6 times instead of 5 times (as in 5 times you have to block the card) if you blocked on 5 decline then there would have no chance to be more decline and there was no chance to be deleted. Actually you have deleted the card before the decline as there are decline happened after the thread creation (after In noticed the card deletion).
Did you think all the people would delete negative feedback and provide positive feedback? It is your wrong idea. It should be considered as buying positive/removing negative feedback.
What a word!
Absolutely right.

From my experience, blocked cards aren't easy for them to "unblock" in most cases, especially if the bank is one freezing the card and not them.

So blocking is basically equivalent to card deletion but at least you get your balance refunded to your account credit.

I use my card for a lot of things (Google cloud, mailgun, Mongo, fly.io - gcloud in particular froze my account until I typed a confirmation code sent to my card as a transaction) and as long as you keep it refilled then you won't have any problems with it.

[I was not paid by them to post this btw]

if you really show this before someone can order a card, then i take my words back.

but still, a popup is not enough imo, you should add this info in clear words to the terms since that's what users agree to by using your cards, and there is no mention of card being deleted there.

It’s very clear that PayWithUs never mentioned anything about card deletion for that reason (5 declined transactions). I see that you block the card after five declines, and I find this rule ridiculous in the first place. Although, it’s your service and your rules but you should make your terms clearer. 

You accused Shasan of breaking your terms and rules, so does that mean getting five declines due to insufficient balance is actually forbidden? What if a subscription service like Netflix attempts to charge the card five times in a row within 24 hours? How would that be the user's fault if he doesn’t have enough balance inside, and why should their card be deleted in such a case? 

I remember once attaching a virtual card to my Google account, but accidentally deleted it. Few weeks later, Google Payments requested a copy or at least a screenshot of the card, and since I couldn’t provide it, my Google Payments profile remains locked to this day. Luckily, it wasn’t that important to me, but this is just one example of how a card can sometimes be imported.

I understand that you are only providing a service and may not have full control over these cards, as dealing with them especially with crypto deposits, the bank may face issues or won’t survive long. However, denying your mistake of deleting a card instead of simply blocking it, just because it was offered for free, without mentioning that in your ToS doesn’t seem right.

If these rules don’t work for you, you are free to choose another service that better suits your needs. We do not force anyone to use our platform. If you require a more stable card, we recommend visiting your local bank, completing KYC, and obtaining a physical card.

They are not ready to accept their mistake of not mentioning the terms about the deletion of the card (or it might be their technique of scamming as all the people are not aware of the bitcointalk) another person posted about their scam on their announcement thread. And they offered the users a refund if they did not accept that.

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I posted about their scam activity on Trustpilot and after posting that the admin of the scam site (paywithus) suspended my account. Before posting on there my account was active.

Hey shasan, just so I can understand the situation a little better, did you click on “Notified” or not?

Curious to know what he has to say, although if that was a while ago, a year ago if I remember correctly from what I've read, he might not even remember. Don't you sometimes get a popup and close it without looking? The way things are going, I think it's difficult to reconcile this issue.

I have never received any notification before the card was deleted. I had just opened the site and got the notification, and saw that my card had been deleted. If they update and notify users, then they could send a notification email, but they have not sent me any email, even though they have not sent any email after deleting the card, and also they reject payment on their site after deletion of the card. And finally, have they blocked my account so that I can't provide any more information?

After your case, they became much more up-to-date regarding notifications. Almost every time I log in, I get some new information. They also updated their ToS so that the card can be removed if it has a negative balance for a long time.

https://talkimg.com/images/2025/05/18/UaA2Rz.png

Good to hear that they have learned from their mistake and updated their terms and conditions, as well as giving notifications with each update. It will be helpful for the user who will use their service, and the site will be considered as an authentic service, but earlier it was foggy, and many people lost their cards, which will not happen now as they will receive a notification before going to be deleted.