Bitcoin Forum

Don't want to start a loong post here but after the BC hack @cryptorush and the AsiaCoin non sense stupidity @mintpal and the rest of the exchanges that took the coin out of trade without warning or showing any respect for us the traders or our money:

WE NEED AN EXCHANGE THAT WILL OFFER US SECURITY.
AN EXCHANGE THAT WILL HAVE PROTECTION TO THE TRADERS.

I AM SICK OF ANY EXCHANGE OUT THERE THAT IS FILLING THEIR POCKETS WITH OUR MONEY AND WILL NOT GIVE A FUCK IF SOMETHING GOES WRONG.

HERE IS WHAT MINTPAL HAD TO SAY ABOUT THE AC BULLSHIT:

Unfortunately, as with the stock market, you should never invest more than you can afford to loose. It's extremely unfortunate that AC turned out to be a SCAM however at the end of the day, you made the decision to invest in the coin. Whilst we do our own due diligence into every coin we are not code auditors and do not validate every line of code in each coins wallet. You yourself would not go and buy a house simply because it is listed at a local estate agent, you would do your own due diligence and checks, the same can be said for a cryptocurrency.

Thanks
--------------
Kind Regards,
MintPal Jason

Which i find to be the most ridiculous and stupid answer ever, i am not at the corner betting shop here, if i miss a pump i am on a long run and won't loose shit.

SO NOW THE NEW SHIT IS TO GET SCAM COINS OUT THERE AND THE EXCHANGES WILL JUST FUCK US RIGHT UP LIKE THAT?

Is time to do something about it before is too late, because we are going nowhere like that.

The exchanges aren't filling their pockets with your money, you idiot. They're filling the pockets of the people who sold you your scamcoins, because you're literally paying the exchange to make that transfer happen. It was your choice to buy the coins, so you have to deal with the consequences. It's not the exchange's fault you made a stupid investment decision.

You sound like you don't know how to read you fucking moron.

Let me see if I've got this right: you bought scamcoins; your scamcoins are now worthless; you're now blaming the exchange for this even though they had no way of knowing the coins would become worthless, no way of preventing that even if they did know, and the decision to buy the coins was entirely your own. Is that pretty much how it went? Quit blaming others and take responsibility for your own actions. You'll get absolutely no sympathy from anyone here until you do.

I completely agree with you.

@ ninjask

Don't blame the exchange or the maker of scamcoins if YOU made a horrible investment, you should do research first before you invest in any sort of coin.

Mintpal & Cryptsy are fair exchanges and not trying to scam anyone, the poll you have created is quite unnecessary.

Not much experience with Mintpal yet but Cryptsy is not the worst. Cryptsy has problems and it can take a while to fix but so far they always get resolved.

Many scams with cryptocurrency. Do some research and prepared to lose.

Everyone always hates on Cryptsy, I honestly don't get it.

Altcoin exchanges are essentially gambling, I don't know what everyone doesn't get about that.

I always have a couple hundred bucks in cryptsy with a bot running.  And I've lost money plenty of times, but guess what? I've made plenty of money too.

Everyone just needs to be aware that most altcoins are pump 'n dump schemes similar to the plot of this movie:

https://i.imgur.com/0eNW7Xz.png

Ok, so don't invest in scam coins, problem solved.  I have no idea why people "invest" in all these new coins.  Any new coin is a risk, there are like hundreds of coins coming out now, why don't you stick with some more established coins like BTC and LTC?  I almost want to say you all deserve it.

Your post is so impressive! But we will never have an exchange with security and guarantee of no loss...

There's always risk. Even with B&M banks there's risk over a certain amount.

He is right about almost everything in life has a risk whether you are willing to take it and how you can possibly minimize it to almost zero

Without any gov regulation you have no recourse to get your money back, and the exchange has no reason to try. I know many here want zero government involvement. I would be cool with that, but it means that creating a fake exchange is far more cost effective than a legitimate exchange. Without regulation or repercussion,crime does pay.

As far as a guarantee of no loss.??? If you find such a contract please let me know! In my 20+ years of investing I have never heard of such a thing. Well, except for the unholy bank bailout of 2008. Are you suggesting the taxpayers cover your bad bets?

There is always risk when you make an investment
The exchanges have no reason to hold your hands the responsiblity and burden remains on the users
The obligation that an exchange has is to not shut down and run away with your coins (mtgox)
Or freeze assets if their coins are stolen due to bad security practices (vircurrex)

All digital currencies should be listed as "buyer beware".

I'm with MintPal on this one. They bring buyers and sellers together. What is bought and sold is not really their concern.

ugh, people who buy scamcoins and think it's their right to be ensured money are just plain ignorant. they are the kind of people who put in the least amount of work and expect the most returns.


well, the problem is that people like the OP don't look at this as an investment. they look at it as a get-rich-quick scheme.

i think insured deposits are good but if you can't expect someone to save you from your own stupidity. People like you are why we have bloated governments. Take responsibility for your outcomes.

Exchanges have a vested interest in security, but it would be impossible for it to be 100% guaranteed that they will be safe. That is like asking for a fee lunch

In order for an exchange to be as secure that you are asking then you would be paying up the wazoo in TX fees. This would also fill up the block chain with unnecessary transactions.

A much better solution would be to simply only keep money on an exchange when you need to exchange it into fiat

I cannot afford to lose any money that I invest.

I invest money to try and increase the amounts of money that I have, in order to get gains from my investments.



To be honest with you, anyone who says: 'only invest what you can afford to lose', well people should not
invest at their exchange at all, because that is a copout, showing that they are resisting any accountability
for any losses of the investors.

off-scouring all the risks involved in investing in cryptocoins at the exchange onto the investor, and not
accepting any accountability for themselves at all, though they are perhaps the biggest money earners of
all. Exchange owners want their cake and eat it too sort of thing.

As investors, we likely need to use an exchange that allows more accountability from themselves, to try and
help and protect investors money, and to try and get back monies that are somehow wrongly lost by investors.

its not possible to have an exchange that guarantees no losses to investors though.
When investing, investors might gain or lose, its just that way.


Accountability is the issue here I think though

investors prefer if the exchange was more accountable
whereas, the exchange may prefer that each investor is accounable for their own actions completely

personally, I believe there is shared accountability involved. Its not just one or the other, but both.

Therefore, the exchange must be partially held accountable for investors losses at least some of the time,
and it cannot be that the investor is solely to blame or accountable completely for their own actions all of the time


If any of you ever go to a christian church and listen to the preachers, you will hear them tell you about
accountability.


Here is an example I want to show you, why its important to give or help others with charity.
Although most investors may be sound and more in control, I am aware that there may
be situations, occurrences or events in peoples lives which make it hard for them to control their
money, and such persons at such times might invest wantonly, losing alot of money, and wind
up going looking for charity afterwards.
Now if you have a conscience, you can see that there are times when it is wrong to take such persons
monies from them like that, but nonetheless, in the daily activities of doing business that is what
happens, and perhaps it takes all of their money from them.
In order to try somewhat to correct this imbalance requires giving to charity, and also helping the individual
persons who might ask for help in and around you in your life.
Something to consider, but do it cheerfully, and not because of necessity, but many sins will be forgiven people who give.
The Lord Loves A Cheerful Giver! Wow, to be loved by God, that is something, isn't it.

But the exchange may have an agreement people have to agree to, prior to trading on the exchange, and if the exchange insists that you must exhonorate them fully, then that agreement might be regarded as legally binding upon the investors. If that is the case, then if the exchange owners do allow accountability at all, then it is their charity towards the investors but its not binding upon them according to the agreement, but its a friendly gesture or charity I think

Hi @cryptolaw666,

I am certainly for more accountability at exchanges, but that will not protect you from losses. There are losers and winners in any free market. That is why rule #1 in any investing is to not invest any more than you can afford to totally lose. That should be especially heeded in the case of an extremely risky vehicle like bitcoin.

There is no way to totally mitigate the risk of loss. It is not something that the exchange can help you with either. If the price dropped, for example, how could they cover the losses? They don't have the money. Most exchanges get a cut for facilitating the exchange or withdrawal. If the price were to fall and I lost value, then the value is gone and no one can replace it.
Investing IS gambling. That's really all it is, and your 401K is just a bet about the future health of the stock market. You would not gamble with your rent money, right? That is why you should not "invest" in bitcoin with needed money either. Of course you could just use bitcoin as a currency, like it was designed. In that case you don't have to worry about all this.