Bitcoin Forum

The Chinese have their own online ecosystem that is mostly separate from the rest of the world. Google, Twitter, YouTube, and Facebook aren't very popular in China and the Chinese people seem to prefer their own homegrown alternatives like Baidu instead of Google or Weibo instead of Twitter, etc. So how did Bitcoin buck this trend to become popular in China? I'm guessing it must be very popular there because China seems to be very important for Bitcoin. After all, why else would prices drop whenever news come out about their government regulating Bitcoin?

Bitcoin does not need China. The Chinese can develop some shitty copycat altcoin, the same way they have developed copycat sites such as Baidu and Weibo. Enough of Chinese hypocrisy.  >:(

Watch your mouth!
We like to use Google, Youtube or Twitter etc but we could not.
It is Chinese Gov's decision instead of our choose!

yeah, maybe that was a bit rude.

because of the masses, china is important for alot of stuff in the world. bitcoin will find a way to live in china  :)

China is not important at all. In many ways China banning bitcoin can be considered good simply because the US would hate to ban bitcoin and being compared to China.

So your govt decides what u'll use ? Are Google, Twitter banned in China ? If not, then why dont u use them ?

OP, you have it kinda wrong. They do not prefere those sites, they are more or less forced to use them. Google, FB etc are heavly filtered in China. As far as BTC goes, they can not filter BTC so that's why China has such impact on BTC (purely by mass of people buying in our out of BTC).

They have massive amount of miners as well

Why?
Because, 1/4 of world is China.

All big countries are important, India, Brazil, Russia, USA, Japan. IF BitCoin ignore them all, will not grow as fast as it will without that.

Google, Twitter, Youtube and Facebook are all banned in China.
You can not access those websites unless you use proxy server or VPN. But it is illegal in China.
It is why we have to use Baidu, Weibo, Youku etc.

Man.....I thought it was common knowledge that the Chinese government censors everything. Their government wants the people to have as little news about the world as possible. It's easier to control this by making people use websites you can control.

Been to China.  Old favourite websites are just not there.  Sites that are critical of the Chinese government is blocked by the great (fire)wall of China.  This seems to include google and others that do not bow to Chinese goverment demands in terms of access to user data etc.

Yeah, those were my thoughts also. Sad.

As an informed American, I stand in solidarity with the Chinese people, and against the tyrannical Chinese government (and all governments). Don't worry, not all Americans are so ignorant. Some of us know there is a Chinese spirit of liberty crying out to be unchained.

It's not about Chinese vs. American. It's about billionaires vs. the rest of us (http://nypost.com/2014/06/18/chinese-billionaire-plans-to-sing-for-1000-poor-new-yorkers-buy-them-lunch/).

Its about the 99% ;)

In terms of innovation, ecosystem and infrastructure investment, China hasn't contributed much, or anything, to the Bitcoin world. I'm sure they would've given the chance but it's not going to be allowed to happen. The volumes on the exchanges that so obsess people are largely fake or the result of zero fee trades.

In the grand scheme of things China will be a major laggard in the BTC space and might never be able go places with it because of their government.

china really isn't that important for bitcoin to survive. Does China help the growth? Sure. But so does any other country where it resides.

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Because we are in China as in Korea, we need Bitcoin and Google to deliver us.  ;D

Thanks for your stance.
I noticed this news few days ago.
Actually that Billionair "Mr. Chen Guangbiao" is a "Performance Artist" in China or even in the world.
He did many crazy activities by spreading money.
Chinese traditional culture teach people to be humble and keep low profile. But Chen Guangbiao is a maverick!

The truth - and this will become apparent in time - is that China needs Bitcoin, not the other way around.

Have you guys been on fiatleak. Most trading occurs in China, not USA. I should of said China dominates bitcoin trading by 4 to 1

I couldn't agree more! And they will realise it soon!

Yes, Bitcoin does not need China. It's more or less other way aournd. Those 99% of poor Chinese need BTC as tool to own and manipulate their own assets.
So if it is like that, how can China affect BTC so much as we saw it not so long ago?
Well...it's all about numbers. World BTC exchanges are shallow waters. Once milions start buying even small amounts, price starts rising sharp, and if it lasts long enough, momentum will bring us to what we saw in December of 2013. Than again, once those milions start selling their BTC, they affect price as, i say again, BTC exchanges are really shallow and you dont need much to affect price.

China is somewhat important due to it's size and bitcoins popularity amongst the people there.  It's natural that when something goes on in China it can have an affect on bitcoins exchange rate.

With that said,  Bitcoin (or something like it)  will survive and grow with or without China in the long run.  Just like companies like facebook and google do just fine without China.

It is long discussed that FiatLeak is inaccurate

Zero fee exchanges do that. It's the same coin being sold back and forth thousands of times an hour. If they had fees like everywhere else we'd see the true volume.

If Lesotho had a zero fee exchange then everyone would pile in there and we'd be fretting about them. It's a mirage.

This will happen in due time. Not yet, not in 2014 but it will. We just have to be patient. The price will slowly recover to China levels without China.

"The financial market turmoil may feel bitcoin as a large amount of money that is being pumped by the Chinese and the rest of the world", "Maybe bitcoin will reach $ 10,000, or maybe it will be destroyed and people will start looking for a more reliable alternative."

cyber money is not as safe as before. Cyber ​​gangs are developing malware to steal individual bitcoin wallet online. This value will be higher. Thirty days have changed the price from about $ 200 to over $ 1,000. Bitcoin is a triple-levered ETFs on steroids. And security issues has grown, from virtual users, including investors, perhaps it guarantees to something else.

Foreign sites are banned in China, and therefore can't earn any revenue there. On the other hand, the Chinese sites are not banned anywhere and they receive revenues from every nook and corner of the world. That's why I called it hypocrisy.

Bitcoin is a global internet currency, and it is going to succeed with or without Chinese involvement. I do agree that the Chinese has accelerated the growth of Bitcoin in the past, and will continue to do so in a much lesser degree despite Chinese government's ban, but in no way Bitcoin actually needs China.

Chinese do not need Bitcoin either but it is useful to them. They have many successful electronic payment systems in operation and Bitcoin is not to replace them as a medium of exchange. It is mainly used to store value and transfer value out of the country. Bitcoin is not the only way to transfer money out of China undetected by the Chinese government, but it is the cheapest way.

Bitcoin doesn't need China, and China doesn't need Bitcoin. What Bitcoin needs are just users anywhere around the world.

Fuck you boy watch your lip before saying sht you can't back up.

Lippy chnk.

Haha.

Last time i checked, india has same if not possibly more population than china, and china certainly is not a quarter of the world seeing as ther are over 7 billion closing in on 8 billion people, and chinese are under 1/6th of that. Big difference, but squinty chinese eyes make it 1/4. 8)

Fuck off.

Not sure you're going on about but it's common knowledge the China Govt blocks those sites. Hence the "great firewall" of China.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_population

Chinese are 1/5 of the world and that's just in China. Again not sure what you're going with these racist remarks. Are you indian hence the reference?

Bitcoin will thrive with or without China. I am glad they no longer dominate our daily discussions.  :)

Why i saw title of this topic i had to read it :D . I was so anxious to see why is China so important .

Good that i did not find the answer :D LOL. Coz it rly isn't , China is not important for btc AT ALL .
Yes they maybe can cause some price ups and downs but that is nothing, and bitcoin doesn't need any country to succeed , it only needs US , people that use it, and mine it, and nobody else . That is the beauty of bitcoin.

what's with this "we don't need China!" attitude? just hope it takes off there -- it will add so much value to the network.

i think western speculators are confused and nervous about the legal/potential legal issues surrounding bitcoin in China. it's a cloud hanging over our heads. so we continue to follow the Chinese exchanges.

For China, BTC played a comparatively large role since it has been used in order to get past their restrictions of the monetary system. So, any regulation attempts there could be expected to create some movement.

Hehe, coz its true , bitcoin doesn't need any county it needs only people that live in it.

That is whole point of it, it doesnt need any county, government, bank or whatsoever , it only need US .

i dont think bitcoin NEEDS china, but that china's adoption of it could provide a big boon, as it has in the past. chinese people have a lot of money and their options of where to put it are limited.. compound that with its hyperbubble real estate market, and you'd see why. plus there's a reason why they hold on to so much gold. bitcoin could potentially be a blessing to china, but i guess they don't want to have anything to do with it. maybe that's why they are so wishy washy.

China have yuan !

Read the recent findings of Willy report.

The so-called china push is a myth that cost many chinese and others alike their money which poured into that hands of few manipulators behind the scenes.

If nothing else, chinese panic destroyed many chances to rise higher than 1112.

Buy a lot alone is NOT a push. There's more to it than that.

Bit coin was only spurred on briefly by the 'news' of china, which was largely negated by their panic sells.

Also, you need to account for other people's undocumented population when determining the final number of world population. You also need to determine the so called overseas chinese being counted as citizens in china despite their lack of physical presence due to census.

Check it right, get it right.

Using fiatleak for any serious analysis of bitcoin trading is like using farmville to research productivity of crops.

AHAHAHHA:... I CANT STOP LAUGHING :D ROFL :D .
U made my day with that post , its so good analogy that its brutal :D

Fiatleak is based on ... Um is it based on something ? Or just pure bs ?

Considering so many feel that China is going to save the world economy it is not surprising that so many feel it is detrimental to Bitcoin's success.

There are many reasons for this but some of the biggest are 1) Huge population 2) Restrictive government so lots of people are looking for places to stash money and 3) The Chinese people are known to love a good speculation  :)

It takes data the exchanges publish.
So if i do a transaction in yen it will show like somebody in Japan is buying which is totally false.

Also , I don't really want to open again the subject on huobi okcoin and their already proven fake volume and fake trades that are actually never executed.
There are plenty of articles on this already.

LOL

they love to gamble and lose their shirt. Casinos and gambling places everywhere are fraught with uppity chinese who thought they were smarter than the house.

No one is easier to manipulate and dominate than someone who thinks themselves clever, and everyone likes to feel clever.

Especially the stupid ones.

wait, who actually thinks china is going to save the world economy?

i personally just think that china believes it is at the center of the world, that it is supposed to be the #1 superpower of the world. they have the hunger of a honey badger, which is why it would help bitcoin along so much if the government DID accept it.

any country with many people is important for bitcoin
adoption matters, it will make Bitcoin more usefull so more valuable

i can't wait to buy food/drinks with bitcoin everyday

to be fair, the chinese and vietnamese are both really good gamblers overall.

Communists in China.  Not only is there the money restrictions, as other users have pointed out, but there's a small statistical likelihood that some Maoist could get into power and decree anyone with more than $10K in the bank will be shot.  

Rich Chinese for decades have been stashing their fortunes abroad.  

Ask people in casinos if they are really 'good gamblers' or just putting up air. They will tell you very frankly they suck ass.

If you need to ask this question then that tell me you did not pay attention in school.

Quesion is not good. Coz its made like that so it sounds like China is important for bitcoin but , in reality its not. So it should been like this.
Is China important to bitcoin. And simple answer would be . NO 1

yeah it's interesting to see how that all folds out.. they are artificially building towns. who in their right mind would want to invest in the real estate market there?

I tend to disagree. When all the western exchanges stop following Huobi and Okcoin like lap dogs, I'll entertain the idea. At least to speculators, China is very important, clearly. And for the network -- don't you think a country of 1.351 billion could be of significant value?

Personally I think it's more a matter of the peoples mindset.  The Chinese seem to have the concept of savings down to an art form.  I wouldn't be at all surprised if the government of China itself had a fairly large stash of coin's tucked away somewhere.

*Though I don't think Chinese adoption is critical to bitcoin I know it would certainly speed things along considerably.

Cmon now guys. Who is stupid enough to say that 1.3b people are not important?!! Are you plan and simple crazy? On crack?!
Of course China is important. But not in "it will kill BTC" way. China adopting BTC would speed up (by huge amount of time) adoption of BTC and price ofc, but they can not kill it, just slow it down. BTC can survive easy w/o 1 single Chineese touching it, but it can flourish if for example whole china accepts it.

China is important for Bitcoin.

However, Bitcoin is more important to China. Simply because it's an easy way to get money out of China with their strict laws. They buy art, property, etc to get money out of the country so Bitcoin is easier additional avenue for them.

because they're most populated country on earth

Yes, this is true. China will come back to BTC and lift the ban.

The levels will continue to rise. Then when China jumps back on, the price will skyrocket like before.

China will adopt BTC in one way or another. In one year or another.

Actually ，Bitcoin does not need Chinese gov's approval & so does US gov
But Bitcoin needs Chinese players & We also need Bitcoin . 8)

true, but at least more open to bitcoin china.
because china refusing to other online payment

Whys is China important? Because a lot of ASIC mining components end up getting fabricated in China, even if designed elsewhere.

As far as banning Bitcoin in China I couldn't care less.

I see many of you use China's total population to estimate its influence on bitcoin. I do not think that is wrong, it is just inaccurate. Internet coverage in China is poor, computers are scare in the rural areas. Smartphones and mobile internet is unimaginably expensive for rural income. I believe bitcoin capable devices (computers and mobile phones with internet connectivity) is low, probably less than 30% of population, and out of those 30% only a small minority have the technical literacy to use bitcoin.

The total population can be viewed as a potential influence, but I cannot imagine a high percentage of China's population can learn to use bitcoin in the near future without a major change in China's bitcoin scene. It is arguable that those who are bitcoin literate, have extremely high demand for bitcoin to compensate.

China's population is a factor, it is just inappropriate to gauge influence from the total population statistic.
(You can also read my previous comment #30 on page 2)

"I believe bitcoin capable devices (computers and mobile phones with internet connectivity) is low, probably less than 30% of population"??!!!

China is not India! the penetration rate of smart phone and computer are much much higher than your imagination!
Even in the poorest area, peoples are easy to obtain computer or smart phone. Because of there are many Chinese vendor provide very cheaper smart phone and computer.
Entire China are fully covered by Internet and Cell phone signal at least 10 years ago.

The biggest obstacle for majority of Chinese to accept and use bitcoin is not capable device coverage instead, most of Chinese lack of independent thinking and scientific literacy.
They are not willing to accpet intangible assets (like BTC) which is not recognized by Govt.
I tried to convince many of my friends to buy BTC but they do not believe in it even they have master degree.

Btw, your comments reminding me a funny story:
2 years ago, a manager from Sillicon Valley just arrived at Beijing airport and, I picked him up and sent him to Beijing downtown.
One the way, he was impressed by the clear and well built express way. So he asked me if this express way was built for 2008 Beijing Olympic Games?
I said: no, the express way was built 20 years ago! and you can find same express way in each city of China.

Many of Chinese knows US very well, but only few American knows China.
China do has a lot of problems, but it is not like what you think.
Money and Infrastructure are not a concern in China today, the problem is it would be hard to change people's mind in short term!

Whats so important ?

Its Money , They have the most population and the most money in the whole world just imagine a split from each chinese can sub away japan  ;D

From your writing, I guess you are a Chinese living in the cities? Probably quite well off too. I believe you are applying what you see in the cities to rural areas. You are correct in saying computers and smartphone penetration is around 60% in China and I have no doubt mobile internet covers most parts of China too. However, mobile internet is expensive for rural Chinese relative to their annual income.

I did not plug the 30% figure out of thin air. It is not my imagination. Mobile internet subscription is around 800 million early 2014, total population is around 1.3 billion. You have to take expats, one person owning multiple mobile numbers, and rural businesses into account. Actual Chinese individuals, having mobile internet bitcoin ready devices, out of total population should be less than your estimate. My 30% could not be far off.

China and its people deem themselves higher than all races across the Globe. They use their own sites because they do not want to see the truth the world will say about them, if they would darepost the stuff they spout on their own sites in google, facebook or twitter, you can bet they would hear a lot of what they dont want to hear. They like to pump their people up, and lead them to believe China are the smartest people and strongest country in the world, and they dont want to hear anything against what they have to say. They are in territorial disputes with about 15 different nations Japan being one of the biggest disputes, recently they tried hacking the US defense system and got caught, and now they have just made a direct attack on British people and their intelligence, china feels they are untouchable, and they keep pushing buttons on a lot of countries, this will soon backfire on them, and shows how utterly stupid the chinese people are. they have absolutely no leadership qualities of a growing empire and show this in their ignorance on a daily basis, when you catch them doing something illegal, they spin the story and blame you for the exact same act. They are cowards, and idiots, who think their crap dont stink.

They are not needed in the bitcoin industry and i can bet they spend hours upon hours trying to hack it, the first thing they do not like about the currency is it was founded by Japanese name. And they hate, and despise anything Japanese. You could bet if the name on the founding code was Xiu Chan Wan the acceptance of bitcoin in china would be very different.

1. I have been to many regions in China. From poorest village to richest cities, I see what's happening in China instead of imagining what China looks like.
    Besides, I have been travelled to US and many other countries many times. I have my own comparison between China and other countries, especially for US.

2. According to China Mobile 2010 financial report, mobile subscriber amount of China Mobile has reached 0.98 billion in 2010. Plus China Telecom and China Unicom, total amount of mobile subscriber has already exceed 1.1 billion in 2010. Moreover, mobile internet feature are default enabled at all mobile phone. and even poor Chinese people are able to use internet mobile service since mobile operators provide many sort of package. Take the famous mobile app "Wechat" as an example, there are more than 500 million subscribers in China.
   Besides, mobile internet is NOT mandatory required by BTC transaction, fixed line internet is enough to support BTC.
   Again, the biggest obstable to promoting BTC in China is to change Chinese people's mind, rather than the infrastructure and annual income.

3. If you have spare time, I suggest you come to China and feel it. People usually has prejudice on many things and easy to be misleaded by press and TV, traveling is the best way to understand the world.

If you replace the word "Chinese people" with "Govt" in your comments, I couldn't agree more.
Otherwise, you are talking like an racialist!!

BTC doesn't need China, but let's face reality, the Chinese economy is huge. If BTC is adopted and accepted in China, this will have a huge impact on BTC.

The actual question should be: Why is Bitcoin so important to China?

Your estimate of 1.1 billion in 2010 is on mobile phones, NOT mobile internet. Do not mislead by showing figures form 2010 and let us believe it should be higher in 2014. My estimate of 800 million is correct.

Please use relevant and update statistics:
http://www.chinainternetwatch.com/7363/chinese-mobile-internet-users-reached-838-million-january-2014/

Besides, my initial point is about the inaccuracy of using total population as an estimate of bitcoin influence. It still stands.

It's not China is important for Bitcoin. It's Bitcoin is important for China!

Well the amount of ASIC technology that has been and is currently being developed in China can't be overlooked.

Maybe they're not contributing to a lot of open source projects. But I don't think we can completely dismiss their contribution.

It is not just the Chinese economy, it is the fact that there are so many people in China.

Fixed that for you.

I think, it could be bitcoin is a good tool for kite with chinese dama..

Are Chinese merchants allowed to use a processor like BitPay instead of receiving BTC for goods/services directly?

I don't think bitpay has a restriction on Chinese merchant

https://bitpay.com/bitcoin-enterprise-solutions