Title: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: ebliever on June 19, 2014, 07:55:52 PM http://www.coindesk.com/bolivias-central-bank-bans-bitcoin-digital-currencies/
From the article: “It is illegal to use any kind of currency that is not issued and controlled by a government or an authorized entity.” I suppose we should be shaking in our boots that an economic powerhouse like Bolivia is banning bitcoin... or something. But I see a few problems with their plan. For one, a number of other nations have declared that bitcoin is _not_ currency. But it is considered _property_. So Bolivia's central bank might have to defend the notion that bitcoin is currency against an international climate that has not reached such a concensus and may be rejecting it. And if bitcoin is just property, how can you ban trading it? Seems to me you'd have a difficult time banning bitcoin trades without banning all property-property transactions (such as trading a hammer to your neighbor in exchange for baseball tickets). Thoughts on how this pans out? Personally I suspect it just shows the weakness of their fiat currency and they are trying to shore it up. On a side note, I wouldn't be surprised if Argentina announces similar moves. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if bitcoin had another run to the moon based on news today that Argentina expects to default on their next debt payment. A few weeks ago there was news that bitcoin traders were beginning to establish boots-on-the-ground in Argentina, that could enable them to provide desperate Argentines with an alternative to their oft-collapsing currency. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: ebliever on June 19, 2014, 07:59:54 PM Here's a cross-link to discussion of the Argentine crisis, since I brought it up:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=656019.0 Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: BitCoinDream on June 19, 2014, 08:00:38 PM I was just about to post it too... This is sad their immigrant workers wont be able to take the advantage of bitcoin, but it is not going to impact Bitcoin as such.
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: justusranvier on June 19, 2014, 08:03:03 PM South Americans, in general, are much more acutely aware of the precarious nature of government-issued money than North Americans and Europeans.
If a central bank is actively denouncing Bitcoin, then many of them will automatically start taking it more seriously. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: franky1 on June 19, 2014, 08:14:23 PM can we for once ignore coindesks interpretation of the news which thy sourced from panampost.
can we ignore panamposts interpretation of the news.. and can someone translate the actual banks source info.. so that we can see the actual wording the bank has used. coindesk has exaggerated far too often with russia, china, etc before. so can we read source material before spreading rumours http://www.scribd.com/doc/230438003/Resolucion-del-Banco-Central-de-Bolivia using google translate.. what i take from it is that bolivian central bank BCB are telling financial institutions that in article 124 they can move money digitally through mobile apps as long as they meet tight security restrictions and ensure data stays private. and that these institutions can only deal with FIAT.. it then says that BCB has Quote currency has been detected in some countries the use of virtual currencies like Bitcoin, Namecoin, Tonal Bitcoin, IxCoin, Devcoin, Freicoin, 10coin, Liquidcoin, Peercoin, Quark, Primecoin, Feathercoin and others that do not belong to ningian state, country or economic area, emission and therefore use is not regulated and may cause a loss to their holders which to me is the standard "investment risk" warning EVERY country has published, and that the BCB RECOMMENDS the ban of financial instittions USING bitcoin. again like all countries banks have contracts to supply only FIAT. banks tdo not store or hand out cars, tins of beans.. only FIAT. though im still reading it and will edit this line later. i do not see anywhere that stops INDIVIDUALS from purchasing bitcoins privately. and i do not see PRIVATE businesses cannot handle bitcoins. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: allthingsluxury on June 19, 2014, 08:15:32 PM Bad news for them.
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: acoindr on June 19, 2014, 08:19:18 PM Here's a cross-link to discussion of the Argentine crisis, since I brought it up: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=656019.0 Thanks! Not sure how I missed this. Quote Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg worried that this could expose even its embassies and military ships to seizure if the government doesn't pay. :o Now we're getting somewhere! Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: ArticMine on June 19, 2014, 08:47:01 PM Here is the original Spanish:
Quote POR TANTO, EL DIRECTORIO DEL BANCO CENTRAL DE BOLIVIA RESUELVE: Articulo 1.- A partir de la fecha queda prohibido el uso de monedas no emitidas o reguladas por estados, 'Daises o zonas economicas y de ordenes de pago electronicas en monedas y denominaciones monetarias no autorizadas por el BCB en el ambito del sistema de pagos nacional. Articulo 2.- La Presidencia y la Gerencia General, quedan encargadas de la ejecucion y cumplimiento de la presente Resolucion. La Paz, 6 de mayo de 2014 From http://es.panampost.com/belen-marty/2014/06/19/bolivia-el-primer-pais-americano-en-prohibir-bitcoin/ (http://es.panampost.com/belen-marty/2014/06/19/bolivia-el-primer-pais-americano-en-prohibir-bitcoin/) Google Translation: Quote THEREFORE, DIRECTORY OF CENTRAL BANK OF BOLIVIA RESOLVED: Article 1 -. Starting date using coins not issued or prohibited regulated by states' economic and Daises or payment orders zones electronic currency and monetary denominations unauthorized by the BCB in scope of the national payment system. Article 2 -. The Presidency and the General Manager, are responsible for the execution and implementation of this Resolution. La Paz, May 6, 2014 My Translation: Quote THEREFORE, THE DIRECTORATE OF THE CENTRAL BANK OF BOLIVIA RESOLVES: Article 1 -. Starting with the date below, the use of money not issued or regulated by states, countries or economic zones, or the use of electronic payment orders, electronic currency and monetary denominations unauthorized by the BCB in scope of the national payment system, is prohibited. Article 2 -. The Presidency and the General Administration, are responsible for the execution and implementation of this Resolution. La Paz, May 6, 2014 There is little doubt in my mind that this is an attempt to ban Bticoin and other crypto-currencies; however the ban is contingent on no other country in the world regulating Bitcoin. The key word here is "reguladas" translated as "regulated". Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: C64_4EVA on June 19, 2014, 08:57:30 PM Wow, that makes them the first country to ban Bitcoin entirely.
I knew it would be one of those Banana Republic South American countries. Their monetary systems are rapidly falling apart and they are desperate to control capital. If I was a betting man, I would be betting on them failing miserably. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Elwar on June 19, 2014, 08:58:36 PM Bank bans bitcoin!
Alert the media! And what is Bolivia's stance on Bitcoin? Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: beetcoin on June 19, 2014, 08:59:59 PM man central and south america are not places i would like to be.. so much turmoil in that region, possibly 2nd behind the middle east. it could be similar/equivalent to africa.
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Elwar on June 19, 2014, 09:05:14 PM Wow, that makes them the first country to ban Bitcoin entirely. I knew it would be one of those Banana Republic South American countries. Their monetary systems are rapidly falling apart and they are desperate to control capital. If I was a betting man, I would be betting on them failing miserably. No country has banned Bitcoin (title should be changed). Have banks gained such a foothold as to make people believe they have the power of guns, kidnapping and cages like governments? Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: TheButterZone on June 19, 2014, 09:08:07 PM This just in: exhaling CO2 (greenhouse gas) is now "banned". Extinction-level genocide to begin in 3...2...
::) Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: ArticMine on June 19, 2014, 09:09:17 PM Wow, that makes them the first country to ban Bitcoin entirely. I knew it would be one of those Banana Republic South American countries. Their monetary systems are rapidly falling apart and they are desperate to control capital. If I was a betting man, I would be betting on them failing miserably. More correctly tries to ban Bitcoin. http://www.fincen.gov/news_room/nr/pdf/20140130.pdf (http://www.fincen.gov/news_room/nr/pdf/20140130.pdf) Sounds like regulations to me. Edit: IANAL The reality here is that all it takes is one government somewhere in the world issuing regulations related to Bitcoin to kill the ban. Any Bolivian lawyers care to comment? Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: franky1 on June 19, 2014, 09:11:17 PM still missing the proof that the banks are banning PEOPLE from holding trading bitcoin. as all im reading is that BANKS wont hold / trade bitcoins.
EG banks dont trade baked beans.. people do.. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: jjc326 on June 19, 2014, 09:19:09 PM http://www.coindesk.com/bolivias-central-bank-bans-bitcoin-digital-currencies/ From the article: “It is illegal to use any kind of currency that is not issued and controlled by a government or an authorized entity.” I suppose we should be shaking in our boots that an economic powerhouse like Bolivia is banning bitcoin... or something. But I see a few problems with their plan. For one, a number of other nations have declared that bitcoin is _not_ currency. But it is considered _property_. So Bolivia's central bank might have to defend the notion that bitcoin is currency against an international climate that has not reached such a concensus and may be rejecting it. And if bitcoin is just property, how can you ban trading it? Seems to me you'd have a difficult time banning bitcoin trades without banning all property-property transactions (such as trading a hammer to your neighbor in exchange for baseball tickets). Thoughts on how this pans out? Personally I suspect it just shows the weakness of their fiat currency and they are trying to shore it up. On a side note, I wouldn't be surprised if Argentina announces similar moves. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if bitcoin had another run to the moon based on news today that Argentina expects to default on their next debt payment. A few weeks ago there was news that bitcoin traders were beginning to establish boots-on-the-ground in Argentina, that could enable them to provide desperate Argentines with an alternative to their oft-collapsing currency. Like when Cyrus began taking peoples' money, BTC took off to the moon. Could happen again when the next crap goes down. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Elwar on June 19, 2014, 09:23:22 PM Visa and Mastercard have also banned sending bitcoins over their networks.
McDonalds has banned all Whopper sales! Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Meuh6879 on June 19, 2014, 09:34:13 PM Wow, that makes them the first country to ban Bitcoin entirely. other country don't ban ... but bank blacklist client that it transfer to exchange. what the difference ? Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: phelix on June 19, 2014, 09:39:30 PM The media has been eagerly waiting for the next Bitcoin story. This spells rally.
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Blinken on June 19, 2014, 09:47:01 PM From the same Bolivian legislators who have also wisely made it illegal to have sex with a woman and her daughter at the same time.
Ah, Bolivia, the home of the llama, the dumbest of all pack animals. The country still hoping to build a tunnel to the Pacific Ocean. The country where driving a car is tantamount to suicide. Unfortunately, that has not resulted in the extermination of the Bolivians, because there are very few (functional) cars there, the reason being that whenever a car has a mechanical problem it becomes permanently inoperable due to the absence of anyone intelligent enough to be able to fix a car. To their credit, they were eventually able to kill Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, although it did take over 1,000 of them to do it. Ah, Bolivia, the only country in which McDonalds is unable to operate, because the concept of a restaurant is too complex for their bird-like brains. Where airplanes are illegal, because, you know, it's impossible to fly. That's logical right: it's impossible to fly therefore airplanes should be illegal. Very logical. Based on that logical insight they were invited to submit a team to the world math olympiad, but that proved impossible because they were unable to find any Bolivians who knew what math was. So, instead they had a tortilla eating olympiad in La Paz. La Paz, interestingly enough has a few buildings which are over 1 story in height, presumably built by foreigners. The Bolivian architects specialize in constructing soccer fields, because nothing is more important than soccer, and they are safe. Safe in the sense that noone has been killed by a collapsing soccer field, the soccer fields, being, well, flat. Some goalies have been injured, however, by falling goal crossbars, so that is their current focus: improving crossbar joining technology to avoid goalie head injuries. This is very important because the soccer field is the most important part of every Bolivian city. It's the law there must at least one soccer field every 5 blocks. The Bolivians like soccer because it is simple to understand: kick ball. At one point some Americans tried to teach them baseball, but that didn't work, since it involves using the hands and legs at the same time and other complexities like requiring the use of tools. The Americans tried tying a glove on a llama to demonstrate that animals, and by extension people, could indeed use tools, but the indios remained convinced tool use in sports was impossible so they made baseball and any other sport utilizing tools illegal, because they are impossible. Bolivia used to be a much larger country. In fact, at one time all almost all of South America was "Bolivia", but the Bolivians kept starting wars and losing them. Every time they lost, they would lose more territory. Other times they just gave away territory. For example, around 1900 it was discovered that a Bolivian region called Acre had a lot of rubber trees in it, so Brazil told the president of Bolivia, who, like all Bolivians was an idiot, that they would like to buy Acre. The president said, "How much?" The Brazilians knowing how stupid the Bolivians are, said, "How about 1 horse?" The Bolivian president said, "Hah, what do you think I am? An idiot? I have lots of horses." Then the Brazilians said, "O, but this horse is perfectly white." The Bolivian president not having any white horses readily agreed to that deal. Here's another story about the same guy, Presidente Mariano Melgarejo. Melgarejo means "stupid" in Indian language. In 1870, Germany invaded France. Melgarejo was infuriated because he had heard how beautiful and elegant Paris was. So, he ordered his top general to send the army to France and defend Paris. The general complained that the army would have to swim across the Atlantic Ocean. Melgarejo angrily replied "Don't be stupid! We will go around the ocean and take a short cut through the brush!" Anyway, its a good thing they have banned bitcoins because you know crypto currency is impossible. It involves math. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: zimmah on June 19, 2014, 09:52:49 PM I was just about to post it too... This is sad their immigrant workers wont be able to take the advantage of bitcoin, but it is not going to impact Bitcoin as such. Exactly my view too, minor countries banning bitcoin will only hurt their citizens, and will cause no harm to bitcoin. In fact in the long to medium run it could even benefit bitcoin because people may try to get rid of these currencies being afraid of a collapse. As such measures are a sign of a weak currency being scared of bitcoin. Also it might once again stir up some discussion about bitcoin being a currency or not. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Cicero2.0 on June 19, 2014, 10:17:25 PM I though bitcoin banned Bolivia. ;D
This needs some clarification obviously but isn't a major issue either way. Bolivians will find a way to get bitcoin if they want it. This makes it more valuable there. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: justusranvier on June 19, 2014, 11:47:09 PM By any chance, are you Peruvian? It's fun to ask Peruvians about pisco, especially what they think of Chilean pisco.Peruvians view Bolivians the way *most* Americans view Mexicans. That is, not in the highest esteem. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: jc01480 on June 20, 2014, 12:13:46 AM Crap. There go coffee prices!
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: smashingpumpkin on June 20, 2014, 07:44:19 AM From the same Bolivian legislators who have also wisely made it illegal to have sex with a woman and her daughter at the same time. Ah, Bolivia, the home of the llama, the dumbest of all pack animals. The country still hoping to build a tunnel to the Pacific Ocean. The country where driving a car is tantamount to suicide. Unfortunately, that has not resulted in the extermination of the Bolivians, because there are very few (functional) cars there, the reason being that whenever a car has a mechanical problem it becomes permanently inoperable due to the absence of anyone intelligent enough to be able to fix a car. To their credit, they were eventually able to kill Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, although it did take over 1,000 of them to do it. Ah, Bolivia, the only country in which McDonalds is unable to operate, because the concept of a restaurant is too complex for their bird-like brains. Where airplanes are illegal, because, you know, it's impossible to fly. That's logical right: it's impossible to fly therefore airplanes should be illegal. Very logical. Based on that logical insight they were invited to submit a team to the world math olympiad, but that proved impossible because they were unable to find any Bolivians who knew what math was. So, instead they had a tortilla eating olympiad in La Paz. La Paz, interestingly enough has a few buildings which are over 1 story in height, presumably built by foreigners. The Bolivian architects specialize in constructing soccer fields, because nothing is more important than soccer, and they are safe. Safe in the sense that noone has been killed by a collapsing soccer field, the soccer fields, being, well, flat. Some goalies have been injured, however, by falling goal crossbars, so that is their current focus: improving crossbar joining technology to avoid goalie head injuries. This is very important because the soccer field is the most important part of every Bolivian city. It's the law there must at least one soccer field every 5 blocks. The Bolivians like soccer because it is simple to understand: kick ball. At one point some Americans tried to teach them baseball, but that didn't work, since it involves using the hands and legs at the same time and other complexities like requiring the use of tools. The Americans tried tying a glove on a llama to demonstrate that animals, and by extension people, could indeed use tools, but the indios remained convinced tool use in sports was impossible so they made baseball and any other sport utilizing tools illegal, because they are impossible. Bolivia used to be a much larger country. In fact, at one time all almost all of South America was "Bolivia", but the Bolivians kept starting wars and losing them. Every time they lost, they would lose more territory. Other times they just gave away territory. For example, around 1900 it was discovered that a Bolivian region called Acre had a lot of rubber trees in it, so Brazil told the president of Bolivia, who, like all Bolivians was an idiot, that they would like to buy Acre. The president said, "How much?" The Brazilians knowing how stupid the Bolivians are, said, "How about 1 horse?" The Bolivian president said, "Hah, what do you think I am? An idiot? I have lots of horses." Then the Brazilians said, "O, but this horse is perfectly white." The Bolivian president not having any white horses readily agreed to that deal. Here's another story about the same guy, Presidente Mariano Melgarejo. Melgarejo means "stupid" in Indian language. In 1870, Germany invaded France. Melgarejo was infuriated because he had heard how beautiful and elegant Paris was. So, he ordered his top general to send the army to France and defend Paris. The general complained that the army would have to swim across the Atlantic Ocean. Melgarejo angrily replied "Don't be stupid! We will go around the ocean and take a short cut through the brush!" Anyway, its a good thing they have banned bitcoins because you know crypto currency is impossible. It involves math. By any chance, are you Peruvian? Peruvians view Bolivians the way *most* Americans view Mexicans. That is, not in the highest esteem. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: sj2199 on June 20, 2014, 07:48:15 AM How many countries have banned bitcoins?
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: amitrwt on June 20, 2014, 08:19:29 AM How many countries have banned bitcoins? Look into the link below . If that helps.bitlegal.io (http://bitlegal.io/) Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: amitrwt on June 20, 2014, 08:27:36 AM I like the title of the Post shared on Panampost which says " Bolivia Not Revolutionary Enough to Tolerate Bitcoin " this is exactly what i think , If i'm not wrong there GDP was 27.04 billion USD in year 2012 and bitcoin's market capitalization will surpass that in upcoming years .
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Honeypot on June 20, 2014, 08:38:49 AM From the same Bolivian legislators who have also wisely made it illegal to have sex with a woman and her daughter at the same time. Ah, Bolivia, the home of the llama, the dumbest of all pack animals. The country still hoping to build a tunnel to the Pacific Ocean. The country where driving a car is tantamount to suicide. Unfortunately, that has not resulted in the extermination of the Bolivians, because there are very few (functional) cars there, the reason being that whenever a car has a mechanical problem it becomes permanently inoperable due to the absence of anyone intelligent enough to be able to fix a car. To their credit, they were eventually able to kill Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, although it did take over 1,000 of them to do it. Ah, Bolivia, the only country in which McDonalds is unable to operate, because the concept of a restaurant is too complex for their bird-like brains. Where airplanes are illegal, because, you know, it's impossible to fly. That's logical right: it's impossible to fly therefore airplanes should be illegal. Very logical. Based on that logical insight they were invited to submit a team to the world math olympiad, but that proved impossible because they were unable to find any Bolivians who knew what math was. So, instead they had a tortilla eating olympiad in La Paz. La Paz, interestingly enough has a few buildings which are over 1 story in height, presumably built by foreigners. The Bolivian architects specialize in constructing soccer fields, because nothing is more important than soccer, and they are safe. Safe in the sense that noone has been killed by a collapsing soccer field, the soccer fields, being, well, flat. Some goalies have been injured, however, by falling goal crossbars, so that is their current focus: improving crossbar joining technology to avoid goalie head injuries. This is very important because the soccer field is the most important part of every Bolivian city. It's the law there must at least one soccer field every 5 blocks. The Bolivians like soccer because it is simple to understand: kick ball. At one point some Americans tried to teach them baseball, but that didn't work, since it involves using the hands and legs at the same time and other complexities like requiring the use of tools. The Americans tried tying a glove on a llama to demonstrate that animals, and by extension people, could indeed use tools, but the indios remained convinced tool use in sports was impossible so they made baseball and any other sport utilizing tools illegal, because they are impossible. Bolivia used to be a much larger country. In fact, at one time all almost all of South America was "Bolivia", but the Bolivians kept starting wars and losing them. Every time they lost, they would lose more territory. Other times they just gave away territory. For example, around 1900 it was discovered that a Bolivian region called Acre had a lot of rubber trees in it, so Brazil told the president of Bolivia, who, like all Bolivians was an idiot, that they would like to buy Acre. The president said, "How much?" The Brazilians knowing how stupid the Bolivians are, said, "How about 1 horse?" The Bolivian president said, "Hah, what do you think I am? An idiot? I have lots of horses." Then the Brazilians said, "O, but this horse is perfectly white." The Bolivian president not having any white horses readily agreed to that deal. Here's another story about the same guy, Presidente Mariano Melgarejo. Melgarejo means "stupid" in Indian language. In 1870, Germany invaded France. Melgarejo was infuriated because he had heard how beautiful and elegant Paris was. So, he ordered his top general to send the army to France and defend Paris. The general complained that the army would have to swim across the Atlantic Ocean. Melgarejo angrily replied "Don't be stupid! We will go around the ocean and take a short cut through the brush!" Anyway, its a good thing they have banned bitcoins because you know crypto currency is impossible. It involves math. I lol'd. Hard. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: VeroPossumus on June 20, 2014, 08:51:10 AM How do they control if people stil use it or not?
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: amitrwt on June 20, 2014, 09:03:38 AM How do they control if people stil use it or not? the truth is they can't..! but if they get to know about it then they might do something..! Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Icardi09 on June 20, 2014, 09:10:03 AM nobody cares
i never meet bolivians here in bitcointalk i thought only few people use Bitcoin there but usually after gov banned bitcoin, many people will know about it and interesting about bitcoin Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Blinken on June 20, 2014, 10:40:02 AM Are there any Bolivians on this forum? For a Bolivian to be here, they would have to know how to use a computer. Also, they would have to leave Bolivia in order to find a network port to plug into. What are you? A science fiction author or something? Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: jc01480 on June 20, 2014, 11:41:58 AM Are there any Bolivians on this forum? For a Bolivian to be here, they would have to know how to use a computer. Also, they would have to leave Bolivia in order to find a network port to plug into. What are you? A science fiction author or something? They have like, three IP addresses, right? Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Elwar on June 20, 2014, 12:19:13 PM People keep talking about this like Bolivia banned bitcoins.
http://geek-news.mtv.com//wp-content/uploads/geek/2012/11/picard-facepalm2.jpg Misleading title is misleading. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: virtualmaster on June 20, 2014, 12:21:27 PM They were a lot of stories that a Central-bank from one country or another banned Bitcoin.
What does it mean concretely after my interpretation ? (I am not a lawyer but I have studies in economy and trading.) The Central-bank is nowhere a legal or executive organ. That would be the parliament or at least the finance minister. I could also say also that the USD is illegal or banned but it doesn't have any compulsory consequence for anybody. So if anybody is trading or accepting Bitcoin in a country where the Central-bank banned it, he doesn't make any illegal action just because the Central-bank says so. However to avoid problems: - Why should somebody exchange in fiat if he has his prices in BTC ? He can keep in BTC and spend in BTC then the Central-bank is not competent for that use. - If somebody needs fiat then should show the fiat prices and those who are buying with BTC can use something like Bitpay. Then there is again no problem. I am not sure if it exists something like Bitpay for specific local currencies. What can happen in worst case that the Bank will not make the clearing for a trading to exchange in fiat or will suspend the involved account. This decision is made based on the interpretation that the involved person made an unlicensed financial transactioin what is not necessary a valid interpretation of the local law and could be fought in a court. As Bitcoin is not considered money accepting Bitcoin is just like barter trading which is not illegal. It is like you would exchange your horse for a cattle. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: LiteCoinGuy on June 20, 2014, 01:22:58 PM ...and nobody cares.
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: IIOII on June 20, 2014, 01:35:26 PM Even if this news does mean that Bolivia really banned BTC - question is, to what extent this ban could be enforced. A lot of the economy in countries like Bolivia goes on in the gray/black area. Without the gray/black economy most people there simply can not survive. The government in Bolivia certainly has a lot less effective influence on everyday life than in western countries.
Of course it would be better if they realized the positive potential of Bitcoin to grow their economy. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: franky1 on June 20, 2014, 01:51:21 PM lock this thread, sheeple are starting to think bolivia banned bitcoins from human use.
bolivia only banned the banks themselves from handing out bitcoins.. just like baked beans and gravy.. move on with your lives Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Este Nuno on June 20, 2014, 02:57:52 PM Wow, that makes them the first country to ban Bitcoin entirely. I knew it would be one of those Banana Republic South American countries. Their monetary systems are rapidly falling apart and they are desperate to control capital. If I was a betting man, I would be betting on them failing miserably. Vietnam did didn't they? I thought I remembered hearing something like that, no? Says here on wiki too. This this incorrect? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_Bitcoins_by_country (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_Bitcoins_by_country) Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: ebliever on June 20, 2014, 03:45:52 PM From the article: “It is illegal to use any kind of currency that is not issued and controlled by a government or an authorized entity.” I know there is some controversy here over whether it can be fairly said that Bolivia has banned bitcoin. In my defense: 1. The quote from the article above sure makes it sound that way. 2. The article goes on to say "The decision to fully ban bitcoin puts Bolivia in unique standing in the international community..." 3. The title was just too rhythmic to resist. It just rolls off the tonque. ;) I do agree that edicts like this one will have little effect on the gray/black market use of BTC and will probably just wind up an embarassment to the government. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: ArticMine on June 20, 2014, 04:24:05 PM From the article: “It is illegal to use any kind of currency that is not issued and controlled by a government or an authorized entity.” I know there is some controversy here over whether it can be fairly said that Bolivia has banned bitcoin. In my defense: 1. The quote from the article above sure makes it sound that way. 2. The article goes on to say "The decision to fully ban bitcoin puts Bolivia in unique standing in the international community..." 3. The title was just too rhythmic to resist. It just rolls off the tonque. ;) I do agree that edicts like this one will have little effect on the gray/black market use of BTC and will probably just wind up an embarassment to the government. The article is wrong. They translate "regular" in Spanish as "to control" rather than the correct translation "to regulate". The intent here was to ban Bitcoin; however the resolution was very badly worded. The wanted to exempt fiat currencies so they said "issued or regulated by a state, country or economic zone" in order to not ban fiat currencies issued by "independent" central banks. The trouble with this wording is that it also exempts what the want to ban in the first place namely Bitcoin since many countries are regulating Bitcoin. This is why I posted the FinCEN regulations example from the United States. I am not one who will brand an entire country as inept dumb idiots; however after reading this resolution I can see why others have, at least when it comes to those who drafted this resolution. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Velkro on June 20, 2014, 07:09:54 PM Noone care about Bolivia, after many countries will adopt Bitcoin it will have more pressure to adopt it also. But after all this, strange countries are all over the world, for example north korea, cuba etc. they will never adopt Bitcoin, and noone care either ::)
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: franky1 on June 20, 2014, 07:57:19 PM From the article: “It is illegal to use any kind of currency that is not issued and controlled by a government or an authorized entity.” Quote subject to its regulatory jurisdiction, all entities of intermediation financial and financial services authorized by the Superintendency of Banks and Financial currently Authority Financial System Supervision ASFI in short.. if your a regulated bank in the jurisdiction of bolivia banks cant hold bitcoin .. people are not regulated!! Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: keithers on June 21, 2014, 07:47:52 AM I wish we could see some data showing how much btc id used in a particular country before a ban, and then after a ban. That would be interesting to see
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Elwar on June 21, 2014, 09:32:58 AM I wish we could see some data showing how much btc id used in a particular country before a ban, and then after a ban. That would be interesting to see The data would be empty because there are no countries that have banned Bitcoin. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: cyberpinoy on June 21, 2014, 10:28:02 AM Well my first thoughts were, what exactly do they think they are doing, if you think about it, it says they can not use the crypto currencies, Ok so what is to stop the people from mining them, exchanging them into any currency that is regulated by a government or authority and then using those funds. Nothing like making a law that is useless right. Not all peopole trade the currencies, some people just mine them and exchange them for local currency, there are many portals of use for these coins, it is clear the central bank did not use any research when theyb made that law.
Besides that please tell me who wants to buy anything with their bitcoins that is made in Boliva or resides in Boliva? Buying property in Boliva was not on my wish list how about you guys? Or wait what about the new manufactured vehicles Boliva is producing, Oh wait they dont produce vehicles. So what exactly do the Bolivians produce that the world needs or even wants? Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: NewLiberty on June 21, 2014, 11:13:26 AM I wish we could see some data showing how much btc id used in a particular country before a ban, and then after a ban. That would be interesting to see The data would be empty because there are no countries that have banned Bitcoin. This. And... https://i.imgur.com/rqcPUEf.jpg?1 Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Stery on June 21, 2014, 11:16:27 AM Quote There are no countries that have banned Bitcoin China did :D Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Malin Keshar on June 21, 2014, 12:28:03 PM As far I can see, USA and other countries classifies BTC as an asset for monetary purposes only, they don't say bitcoin IS an asset and there are no other regulations out of the tax and financial aspects;
As long as I can see, Bolivia adopted a position similar to China and Russia, that is, no one can use BTC to buy things, but sell and buy BTC is not forbidden. Think the smae would apply to buy things using gold, salt, stock assets or anything similar, things that are not banned. Anyway, all laws can be changed, or have no effect. I think cocaine and drug traffic is prohibited in Bolivia too, and they are one of the biggest world's drug producers. Quote There are no countries that have banned Bitcoin China did :D They baned the use of BTC as currency and also put pressure against exchanges and bitcoin-related business, but no real ban, this was just FUD to grab cheap coins I wish we could see some data showing how much btc id used in a particular country before a ban, and then after a ban. That would be interesting to see The data would be empty because there are no countries that have banned Bitcoin. This. And... https://i.imgur.com/rqcPUEf.jpg?1 You put anual PIB vs total market CAP in same table, they are not comparable. Would be more far use capital cap growing by year, but still misleading Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Stery on June 21, 2014, 12:31:51 PM Thats really odd :(
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: 0nlin3r on June 21, 2014, 01:40:16 PM Hello,
I live in Bolivia and can confirm our government is very ignorant, I don't even know how they heard about Bitcoin, they only know how to steal money and spend our money in non useful things. I don't care of their ban to Bitcoin and will continue using it. As in the document says: "National use of digital currencies" I won't use it nationally, because as web developer/programmer, Bitcoin is a very useful "Tool" for me. The thing is when I withdraw my Bitcoins, I will have to lie because every bank has KYC policy and they ask even for small transaction the source of funds and what are you going to do with the funds. Anyone can suggest a smart way to deal with banks with this stupid policy? http://cdn.acidcow.com/pics/20101115/animals_showing_19.jpg This is for you Mr President. Evo Morales Llayma.. or was it Ayma. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Nerazzura on June 21, 2014, 03:33:39 PM http://www.coindesk.com/bolivias-central-bank-bans-bitcoin-digital-currencies/ Hmm, let's try to compare with some other countries I have ever read in the online medium, but I forgot to take down the site. correction if I am wrong.From the article: “It is illegal to use any kind of currency that is not issued and controlled by a government or an authorized entity.” I suppose we should be shaking in our boots that an economic powerhouse like Bolivia is banning bitcoin... or something. But I see a few problems with their plan. For one, a number of other nations have declared that bitcoin is _not_ currency. But it is considered _property_. So Bolivia's central bank might have to defend the notion that bitcoin is currency against an international climate that has not reached such a concensus and may be rejecting it. And if bitcoin is just property, how can you ban trading it? Seems to me you'd have a difficult time banning bitcoin trades without banning all property-property transactions (such as trading a hammer to your neighbor in exchange for baseball tickets). Thoughts on how this pans out? Personally I suspect it just shows the weakness of their fiat currency and they are trying to shore it up. On a side note, I wouldn't be surprised if Argentina announces similar moves. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if bitcoin had another run to the moon based on news today that Argentina expects to default on their next debt payment. A few weeks ago there was news that bitcoin traders were beginning to establish boots-on-the-ground in Argentina, that could enable them to provide desperate Argentines with an alternative to their oft-collapsing currency. Many countries responded with permissive bitcoin transaction, which is marked with green legal status. In the United States, bitcoin be circulated as electronic transactions. As in Singapore, the central bank decided not to intervene on the transaction with bitcoin, but would impose a tax because bitcoin is considered a commodity. In the neighboring country of Malaysia, the central bank allows the transaction with bitcoin. However, people are suggested to be careful in transacting and investing with the virtual currency. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: NewLiberty on June 21, 2014, 05:10:07 PM As far I can see, USA and other countries classifies BTC as an asset for monetary purposes only, they don't say bitcoin IS an asset and there are no other regulations out of the tax and financial aspects; Diverse US agencies treat it differently. There isn't a "US policy" in toto.As long as I can see, Bolivia adopted a position similar to China and Russia, that is, no one can use BTC to buy things, but sell and buy BTC is not forbidden. Think the same would apply to buy things using gold, salt, stock assets or anything similar, things that are not banned. Pretty much just the BCB bans it. So banks won't accept it.For what its worth, I can deposit Rubles into my US Bank account and get dollar credit, can't do that with bitcoin, so its more or less the same in the USA too. Except in Bolivia, you may be more likely to lose a banking relationship if you try. You put anual PIB vs total market CAP in same table, they are not comparable. Would be more far use capital cap growing by year, but still misleading I just took and provided the picture. Its a comparison of M1. The data is here: http://www.coinometrics.com/bitcoin/bmix Click full data. Zeroblock also puts it on their app. I don't claim originality here, just caught the joke when Bolivia's central Bank made their funny 044/2014 "ban". Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: RepublicSpace on June 21, 2014, 05:57:38 PM To me, the most interesting part of this is their justification for it: Specifically, to protect their own national currency.
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Elwar on June 21, 2014, 05:58:29 PM I don't care of their ban to Bitcoin and will continue using it. Fortunately for you the Bolivian government did not ban Bitcoin. A bank's legal department made a recommendation that the banks only use government currencies for their bank accounts. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: RepublicSpace on June 21, 2014, 05:59:39 PM Not because they think it will facilitate otherwise illicit activity. Not because they think it poses a security risk, or puts citizens' own finances at risk. Their openly stated justification for banning bitcoin is "if we don't ban it, people will use it instead of our money."
Or, in other words, "we can't compete." Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: ArticMine on June 22, 2014, 07:54:44 PM Hello, I live in Bolivia and can confirm our government is very ignorant, I don't even know how they heard about Bitcoin, they only know how to steal money and spend our money in non useful things. I don't care of their ban to Bitcoin and will continue using it. As in the document says: "National use of digital currencies" I won't use it nationally, because as web developer/programmer, Bitcoin is a very useful "Tool" for me. The thing is when I withdraw my Bitcoins, I will have to lie because every bank has KYC policy and they ask even for small transaction the source of funds and what are you going to do with the funds. Anyone can suggest a smart way to deal with banks with this stupid policy? http://cdn.acidcow.com/pics/20101115/animals_showing_19.jpg This is for you Mr President. Evo Morales Llayma.. or was it Ayma. Can you get independent legal advice in Bolivia on the actual resolution? My read of it is that they tried to ban Bitcoin but failed because the ban is contingent on no other country passing regulations regarding Bitcoin. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: NewLiberty on June 24, 2014, 03:49:18 PM Not because they think it will facilitate otherwise illicit activity. Not because they think it poses a security risk, or puts citizens' own finances at risk. Their openly stated justification for banning bitcoin is "if we don't ban it, people will use it instead of our money." Or, in other words, "we can't compete." They may not have heard the saying that starts "If you can't beat them...."? I don't think it ends with "ban them". Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: percocet on June 24, 2014, 04:18:19 PM I suspect there will be more "backlash" coming against Bitcoin, but fortunately, it will make no difference as we are beyond the point of no return!
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: stompix on June 24, 2014, 04:21:03 PM So this is another episode from the China Thailand Russia have banned bitcoin?
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Elwar on June 24, 2014, 05:11:43 PM So this is another episode from the China Thailand Russia have banned bitcoin? Yes, same episode where none of them banned Bitcoin. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: pummle on June 24, 2014, 05:15:23 PM Bitcoin doesn't care, bitcoin will go on without them. They are only hurting themself by stepping out of the world economy.
People will still use bitcoins, the more governments fight against bitcoin the more irrelevant they become. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: gbooz on June 24, 2014, 06:10:52 PM Bitcoin doesn't care, bitcoin will go on without them. They are only hurting themself by stepping out of the world economy. People will still use bitcoins, the more governments fight against bitcoin the more irrelevant they become. I think, that authorities are realistic - there is no fight against the bitcoin. There is a wish to control it and to charge taxes. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Ashbite on June 24, 2014, 06:24:18 PM Bitcoin doesn't care, bitcoin will go on without them. They are only hurting themself by stepping out of the world economy.
People will still use bitcoins, the more governments fight against bitcoin the more irrelevant they become. yep. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: pummle on June 24, 2014, 08:24:55 PM Bitcoin doesn't care, bitcoin will go on without them. They are only hurting themself by stepping out of the world economy. People will still use bitcoins, the more governments fight against bitcoin the more irrelevant they become. yep. Please use the "quote" feature when quoting blocks of text. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: gbooz on June 25, 2014, 07:21:54 PM Bitcoin doesn't care, bitcoin will go on without them. They are only hurting themself by stepping out of the world economy. I would not be overoptimistic/overenthusiastic. Bitcoin is part of the interconnected economy, so it "care" about the trends in its ecosystem. And the exchange price deviations are the sign of it.People will still use bitcoins, the more governments fight against bitcoin the more irrelevant they become. yep. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Elwar on June 26, 2014, 03:07:19 AM Bitcoin doesn't care, bitcoin will go on without them. They are only hurting themself by stepping out of the world economy. I would not be overoptimistic/overenthusiastic. Bitcoin is part of the interconnected economy, so it "care" about the trends in its ecosystem. And the exchange price deviations are the sign of it.People will still use bitcoins, the more governments fight against bitcoin the more irrelevant they become. yep. Then it is only perception since BOLIVIA DID NOT BAN BITCOIN Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: smashingpumpkin on June 26, 2014, 11:13:36 AM Then it is only perception since BOLIVIA DID NOT BAN BITCOIN Finally :) Big letters definately help to get the point. Bitcoin the unbannable!!! Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: KonstantinosM on June 26, 2014, 12:04:47 PM The only way to ban BTC is to ban:
Computer networks Devices capable of creating such networks USB storage devices paperwallets and the human brain It's extremely imipractical to ban bitcoin... Taxing it on the other hand! Taxing could be very beneficial to governments they tax, they hold, they get a stake in the matter. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: CrackedLogic on June 26, 2014, 12:10:53 PM banks are not governments, they can't ban shit.
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Nerazzura on June 27, 2014, 09:41:27 AM Bank bans bitcoin! Virtual Currency bitcoin world spotlight due to controversial existence. Unfinished issues related validity as the official medium of exchange, now according to a study hasi titled 'Financial cyber threats in 2013' released computational security company Kaspersky Lab revealed that Bitcoin has a big hand in enhancing malware attacks.Alert the media! And what is Bolivia's stance on Bitcoin? The results of the study also mentions the number of large financial cyber crimes happening in Afghanistan, Bolivia, Cameroon, Mongolia, Myanmar, Peru, Turkey and Ethiopia. - what do you think Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Nerazzura on June 27, 2014, 10:06:08 AM I though bitcoin banned Bolivia. ;D true, but Bolivia also need strong parties or institutions to support them in the achievement of bitcoin. if bolivia fend for themselves for it is not impossible but it is difficult and takes a lot of timeThis needs some clarification obviously but isn't a major issue either way. Bolivians will find a way to get bitcoin if they want it. This makes it more valuable there. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: BADecker on June 27, 2014, 10:06:26 AM http://www.coindesk.com/bolivias-central-bank-bans-bitcoin-digital-currencies/ From the article: “It is illegal to use any kind of currency that is not issued and controlled by a government or an authorized entity.” I suppose we should be shaking in our boots that an economic powerhouse like Bolivia is banning bitcoin... or something. But I see a few problems with their plan. For one, a number of other nations have declared that bitcoin is _not_ currency. But it is considered _property_. So Bolivia's central bank might have to defend the notion that bitcoin is currency against an international climate that has not reached such a concensus and may be rejecting it. And if bitcoin is just property, how can you ban trading it? Seems to me you'd have a difficult time banning bitcoin trades without banning all property-property transactions (such as trading a hammer to your neighbor in exchange for baseball tickets). Thoughts on how this pans out? Personally I suspect it just shows the weakness of their fiat currency and they are trying to shore it up. On a side note, I wouldn't be surprised if Argentina announces similar moves. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if bitcoin had another run to the moon based on news today that Argentina expects to default on their next debt payment. A few weeks ago there was news that bitcoin traders were beginning to establish boots-on-the-ground in Argentina, that could enable them to provide desperate Argentines with an alternative to their oft-collapsing currency. "Illegal" comes from a position of power. There are a lot of things in my life that I consider illegal. Yet, even though I don't do them, lots of other people do. I don't attempt to stop them because (besides that it wouldn't do any good) I allow freedom, as long as it doesn't harm me or damage my property... but even then a little, once in awhile. If Bolivia has the strength to stop or control Bitcoin within her borders, great. Personally, I don't think she has that kind of power. If she is a true republic, then she doesn't really even have the authority to try. Same said with the United States. :) EDIT: Remember your Pledge of Allegiance. "... and to the REPUBLIC for which it stands ..." The United States is a republic, not a democracy. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: franky1 on June 27, 2014, 11:12:45 AM if banks had the desire to prohibit individuals and businesses from using bitcoins.
if banks had the had powers to make laws to prohibit individuals and businesses from using bitcoins. if banks had the an easy way to get government to make laws to prohibit individuals and businesses from using bitcoins. then banks would not be announcing that they wont touch bitcoins, baked beans or whoppers, only FIAT... instead they would have made the laws that you tin foil hat wearing, government hating conspiracy theorists are fantasizing about. but they have not.. so move on with your lives, there is nothing to see here. bolivia has not banned bitcoins!.. end of Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: unpure on June 27, 2014, 05:19:13 PM Is there any country out there that actually support bitcoin?
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Bit_Happy on June 27, 2014, 05:25:34 PM Visa and Mastercard have also banned sending bitcoins over their networks. McDonalds has banned all Whopper sales! What? A Whopper with McDonalds fries sounds almost good right now. :) <"Bolivia Bans Bitcoins!"> @OP are you going to change the title to be more accurate? Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Dr. Sekxy on June 27, 2014, 07:51:29 PM TIL there's a country called Bolivia
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: ebliever on June 27, 2014, 07:58:51 PM <"Bolivia Bans Bitcoins!"> @OP are you going to change the title to be more accurate? If it was unambiguously wrong I'd do so. However: 1. The notion that Bolivia did so is clearly expressed in the Coindesk article. 2. It's unclear what relationship the Central Bank of Bolivia has with the government - as others have noted, their pronouncements may extend no further than their own operations. Or they may be backed up by the full force of the civil government with all that implies. I just don't know either way at this point. My reason for posting the OP was not to have people blindly swallow it (I wouldn't expect the crowd around here to do so anyways), but to chew it up, toss it around and gain a better collective understanding or at least clarify the uncertainties. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: ajareselde on June 27, 2014, 08:22:57 PM <"Bolivia Bans Bitcoins!"> @OP are you going to change the title to be more accurate? If it was unambiguously wrong I'd do so. However: 1. The notion that Bolivia did so is clearly expressed in the Coindesk article. 2. It's unclear what relationship the Central Bank of Bolivia has with the government - as others have noted, their pronouncements may extend no further than their own operations. Or they may be backed up by the full force of the civil government with all that implies. I just don't know either way at this point. My reason for posting the OP was not to have people blindly swallow it (I wouldn't expect the crowd around here to do so anyways), but to chew it up, toss it around and gain a better collective understanding or at least clarify the uncertainties. in the end, noone even cares about Bolivia. north korea threats with nuclear strike, noone cares coz its funny, same thing with bolivia baning btc. we just dont care about any of that. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Aricoin_Mike on June 27, 2014, 09:25:10 PM I will also ban bitcoin ;) does that mean something?
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Bit_Happy on June 28, 2014, 12:03:09 AM I will also ban bitcoin ;) does that mean something? Your DOGE will be happy. :D Other than that, you might not have much of an impact. The BTC adventure continues... Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Aricoin_Mike on June 28, 2014, 06:17:24 AM I will also ban bitcoin ;) does that mean something? Your DOGE will be happy. :D Other than that, you might not have much of an impact. The BTC adventure continues... Hehe, I think that with Bolivia is "almoast" the same. ;) Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: rext on June 28, 2014, 06:18:54 AM I will also ban bitcoin ;) does that mean something? lollllTitle: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Elwar on June 29, 2014, 10:52:26 AM <"Bolivia Bans Bitcoins!"> @OP are you going to change the title to be more accurate? If it was unambiguously wrong I'd do so. However: 1. The notion that Bolivia did so is clearly expressed in the Coindesk article. 2. It's unclear what relationship the Central Bank of Bolivia has with the government - as others have noted, their pronouncements may extend no further than their own operations. Or they may be backed up by the full force of the civil government with all that implies. I just don't know either way at this point. My reason for posting the OP was not to have people blindly swallow it (I wouldn't expect the crowd around here to do so anyways), but to chew it up, toss it around and gain a better collective understanding or at least clarify the uncertainties. A partir de la fecha queda prohibido el uso de monedas no emitidas o reguladas por estados, paises o zonas economicas y de ordenes de pago electronicas en monedas y denominaciones monetarias no autorizadas por el BCB en el ambito del sistema de pagos nacional. translation: Starting date using coins not issued or regulated by states, countries or economic orders and electronic payment in coins and currency denominations not authorized by the BCB in the field of national payment system areas is prohibited. Bolivia Central Bank bans bitcoins on their payment system ie. No sending bitcoins from bank to bank, over wire transfers, etc. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Elwar on June 29, 2014, 10:53:33 AM Full text:
RESOLUCION DE DIRECTORIO N 044/2014 ASUNTO: GERENCIA DE ENTIDADES FINANCIERAS — PROHIBICION DEL USO DE MONEDAS Y DENOMINACIONES MONETARIAS NO REGULADAS EN EL AMBITO DEL SISTEMA DE PAGOS NACIONAL.VISTOS: La Constitucion Politica del Estado.La Ley N° 1670 de 31 de octubre de 1995 del Banco Central de Bolivia BCB).La Ley N° 393 de 21 de agosto de 2013, de Servicios Financieros. El Estatuto del BCB aprobado mediante Resolucion de Directorio N° 128/2005 de 21 de octubre de 2005 y posteriores modificaciones. El Reglamento del Sistema de Pagos de Alto Valor, aprobado mediante Resolucion de Directorio N° 131/2009 de 27 de octubre de 2009. El Reglamento de Servicios de Pago aprobado mediante ResoluciOn de Directorio N° 121/2011 de 27 de septiembre de 2011 modificado mediante Resoluciones de Directorio N° 59/2012 de 22 de mayo de 2012 y N° 100/2013 de 30 de julio de 2013. El Reglamento de Instrumentos Electronicos de Pago aprobado mediante Resolucion de Directorio N° 126/2011 de 4 de octubre de 2011 y modificado mediante Resoluciones de Directorio N° 25/2012, 60/2012 y 22/2013 de 23 de febrero de 2012, 22 de mayo de 2012 y5 de marzo de 2013, respectivamente. El Reglamento para la Transferencia de Remesas Internacionales aprobado medianteResolucion de Directorio N° 071/2012 de 19 de junio de 2012 y modificado mediante Resolucion de Directorio N°154/2012 de 28 de agosto de 2012. El Informe de la Gerencia de Entidades Financieras BCB-GEF-SSPSF-DVSP-INF-2014- 35 de 30 de abril de 2014. El Informe de la Gerencia de Asuntos Legales BCB-GAL-SANO-INF-2014-149 de 6 de mayo de 2014. CONSIDERANDO: Que la Constitucion Politica del Estado establece en su Articulo 328 que es atribuciOn del BCB, en coordinaciOn con la politica economica determinada por el Organo Ejecutivo, ademasde las serialadas por Ley, regular el sistema de pagos. Que conforme al Articulo 331 de la Constitucion Politica del Estado, las actividades de intermediacion financiera, la prestacion de servicios financieros y cualquier otra actividadrelacionada con el manejo, aprovechamiento e inversion del ahorro, son de interes public° y solo pueden ser ejercidas previa autorizacion del Estado, conforme con la Ley. Que la Ley N° 1670 dispone en sus Articulos 2, 3 y 30 que el BCB tiene por objeto procurar la estabilidad del poder adquisitivo interno de la moneda nacional, para cuyo cumplimientoformula las politicas de aplicaciOn general en materia monetaria y del sistema de pagos, estando sometidas a su competencia normativa, todas las entidades de intermediacion financiera y servicios financieros autorizadas por la Superintendencia de Bancos y Entidades Financieras, actualmente Autoridad de Supervision del Sistema Financiero ASFI).Que la Ley N° 393 en su Articulo 124, establece que las operaciones efectuadas en el marco de los servicios que prestan las entidades financieras, podran realizarse a traves de medios electronicos, los que necesariamente deben cumplir las medidas de seguridad que garanticen la integridad, confidencialidad, autentificacion y no repudio. Asimismo en numeral IV de este articulo seriala que la Autoridad de Supervision del Sistema Financiero y el BCB de acuerdo a sus competencias, emitiran regulacion que establezca el procedimiento y normativa deseguridad para las operaciones, asi como los requisitos minimos que deben cumplir las entidades para realizar actividades de banca electronica, banca por telefono y mediante dispositivos mOviles. Que el Reglamento del Sistema de Pagos de Alto Valor define en su Articulo 32 que las ordenes de pago seran registradas en las siguientes denominaciones monetarias: a) Moneda nacional (MN), b) Moneda extranjera (ME) sOlo Mares de los Estados Unidos de Norteamerica, c) Moneda nacional con mantenimiento de valor con relacion a la Unidad de Fomento de Vivienda (MNUFV), y d) Moneda nacional con mantenimiento de valor con relacion al Mar de los Estados Unidos de Norteamerica MVDOL). Que el Reglamento de Instrumentos Electronicos de Pago seliala en su Articulo 5, inciso a) que los fondos constituidos en las cuentas que sustenta los pagos con billetera movil (cuentas de pago) estaran denominadas exclusivamente en moneda nacional.Que se ha detectado en algunos paises el uso de monedas virtuales como el Bitcoin, Namecoin, Tonal Bitcoin, IxCoin, Devcoin, Freicoin, 10coin, Liquidcoin, Peercoin, Quark, Primecoin, Feathercoin y otras que no pertenecen a ningian estado, pals o zona economica, en consecuencia su uso y emision no esta regulado, pudiendo ocasionar perdidas a sus tenedores. Que la Gerencia de Entidades Financieras mediante Informe BCB-GEF-SSPSF-DVSP-INF-2014-35 evalua la normativa vigente que regula el sistema de pagos nacional y el uso de otrasmonedas o denominaciones monetarias no autorizadas por el BCB, y recomienda prohibir el uso de monedas no emitidas o reguladas por estados, paises o zonas economicas, y denominaciones monetarias no autorizadas por el BCB en el amito del sistema de pagos nacional Que la Gerencia de Asuntos Legales mediante Informe BCB-GAL-SANO-INF-2014-149 manifiesta que es pertinente que el BCB, en su calidad de unica autoridad monetaria y cambiaria del pais, con facultades suficientes para emitir normativas especializadas de aplicacion general, prohiba el uso de monedas y denominaciones monetarias gue no se encuentren reguladas en el ambito del sistema de pagos nacional concluyendo que la prohibicion es legalmente procedente, siendo competencia del Directorio del BCB considerar su aprobacion. Que, el Directorio del BCB en su calidad de maxima autoridad de la institucion es responsable de definir politicas, normativas especializadas de aplicacion general y normas internas, estando facultado para dictar las normas y adoptar las decisiones generales que fueran necesarias para el cumplimiento de las funciones, competencias y facultades asignadas por Ley al Ente Emisor. Articulo 1. A partir de la fecha queda prohibido el uso de monedas no emitidas o reguladas por estados, paises o zonas economicas y de ordenes de pago electronicas en monedas y denominaciones monetarias no autorizadas por el BCB en el ambito del sistema de pagos nacional. Articulo 2. La presidencia y la Gerencia General, quedan encargadas de la ejecucion y cumplimiento do la presente Resolucion. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Elwar on June 29, 2014, 10:55:02 AM translation:
BOARD RESOLUTION No. 044/2014 SUBJECT: MANAGEMENT FINANCIAL INSTITUTIONS - BAN USE OF COINS AND CURRENCY NO NAMES REGULATED IN THE FIELD OF PAYMENT SYSTEM NACIONAL.VISTOS: The Political Constitution of Estado.La Law No. 1670 of October 1995, the Central Bank of Bolivia BCB 31.) Law No. 393 of August 21, 2013, Financial Services. The Statute of BCB approved by Resolution of Board No. 128/2005 of 21 October 2005 and subsequent amendments. The Payment System Regulation High Value, approved by Resolution of Directory N ° 131/2009 of 27 October 2009. The Payment Services Regulations approved by Board Resolution No. 121/2011 of 27 September 2011 as amended by Resolution of Directors N ° 59/2012 of 22 May 2012 and No. 100/2013 of 30 July 2013. Regulation of Electronic Payment Instruments approved by Resolution of Directory N ° 126/2011 of 4 October 2011 and amended by Resolutions Directory N ° 25/2012, 60/2012 and 22/2013 of 23 February 2012, May 22, 2012 y5 March 2013, respectively. Regulation for International Remittance Transfer approved medianteResolucion Directory N ° 071/2012 of 19 June 2012 and amended by Directory Resolution N ° 154/2012 of 28 August 2012. The Report of the Management of Financial Institutions-GEF-BCB-DVSP SSPSF-INF-2014- 35 of April 30, 2014. The report of the Legal Affairs Management BCB-GAL-HEALTHY-INF-2014-149 of 6 May 2014. WHEREAS: That the State Constitution provides in Article 328 that is vested with the BCB, in coordination with economic policy determined by the Executive, the serialadas ademásde by law, regulate the payments system. That pursuant to Article 331 of the Political Constitution of the State, the activities of financial intermediation, the provision of financial services and any other actividadrelacionada with the management, use of savings and investment are of public interest ° can only be exercised prior authorization of the State in accordance with the law The Law No. 1670 provides in Articles 2, 3 and 30 BCB aims to ensure the stability of the domestic purchasing power of the national currency, for which cumplimientoformula policies generally applicable monetary and payments system, to be subject to its regulatory jurisdiction, all entities of intermediation financial and financial services authorized by the Superintendency of Banks and Financial currently Authority Financial System Supervision ASFI.) That the Act No. 393 in its Article 124, provides that transactions under the services provided by financial institutions can be made through media electronics, which must necessarily enforce security measures to ensure the integrity, confidentiality, authentication and non-repudiation. Also in section IV of this seriala article the Supervision Authority and the Financial System according to BCB its powers, ISSUED regulation establishing the procedure and rules deseguridad for operations, as well as the minimum requirements for the entities to engage in electronic banking, phone banking and through mobile devices. Regulation System of Large Value Payment defined in its Article 32 that payment orders will be recorded in the following currency denominations: a) Currency national (MN), b) Foreign Currency (ME) only Mares of the United States of North America, c) Domestic currency with value maintenance in relation to the Unit Housing Development (MNUFV), and d) national currency with value maintenance relationship to the Sea of the United States of North America MVDOL). Regulation of Electronic Instruments seliala Payment in Article 5, paragraph a) funds established in the accounts based mobile wallet payments (accounts payment) will be called only nacional.Que currency has been detected in some countries the use of virtual currencies like Bitcoin, Namecoin, Tonal Bitcoin, IxCoin, Devcoin, Freicoin, 10coin, Liquidcoin, Peercoin, Quark, Primecoin, Feathercoin and others that do not belong to ningian state, country or economic area, emission and therefore use is not regulated and may cause a loss to their holders. The Management of Financial Institutions by BCB-GEF-SSPSF-DVSP-INF-2014-35 Report evaluates the current regulations governing the national payment system and the use of monetary denominations otrasmonedas or not authorized by the BCB, and recommends ban use coins not issued or regulated by states, countries or economic areas and monetary denominations not authorized by the BCB in the amice the national payment system That the Legal Department by BCB-GAL-HEALTHY-INF-2014-149 states that relevant BCB Report, in its capacity as monetary and exchange only authority in the country, with enough power to issue general regulations specialized application, prohibit the use of coins and currency denominations gue are not found in the field of regulated national payment system concluding that the ban is legally applicable, remain the responsibility of the Board of BCB consider approval. That the Board of BCB in his capacity as the highest authority of the institution is responsible for defining policies, specialized regulations and internal rules generally applicable, being empowered to promulgate rules and adopt the broad decisions that were necessary to fulfill the functions , powers and responsibilities assigned by law to the Issuing Entity. Article 1. Starting date using coins not issued or regulated by states, countries or economic orders and electronic payment in coins and currency denominations not authorized by the BCB in the field of national payment system areas is prohibited. Article 2. The President and the General Manager, are responsible for the execution and enforcement do this Resolution. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: chaosPT on June 29, 2014, 12:45:51 PM So after china banning so many times Bolivia started to continue to the train of rumors?
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: tidda on June 29, 2014, 06:54:43 PM Not because they think it will facilitate otherwise illicit activity. Not because they think it poses a security risk, or puts citizens' own finances at risk. Their openly stated justification for banning bitcoin is "if we don't ban it, people will use it instead of our money." Or, in other words, "we can't compete." I get excited seeing these central bankers squirm Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Elwar on June 30, 2014, 03:25:27 AM Bolivia has only banned using bitcoins on its banks national payment system.
Like Visa banning using bitcoins over its credit card network or banks banning the use of bitcoins for wire transfers. Essentially. Bolivia has not banned bitcoins! Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: stompix on July 02, 2014, 01:38:16 PM So after china banning so many times Bolivia started to continue to the train of rumors? Fortunately nobody uses bitcoins in Bolivia and there was no gold rush for bitcoins either. No exchanges with fake volumes so this new wave of FUD won't affect anything. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: chaosPT on July 02, 2014, 02:08:09 PM Or may be you can use other coin like Dogecoin and litecoin still even they ban bitcoin :)
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: stompix on July 02, 2014, 02:17:07 PM Or may be you can use other coin like Dogecoin and litecoin still even they ban bitcoin :) They "banned" because they haven't actually BANNED cryptocoins not specifically bitcoin. So it doesn't matter you would be using litecoin or dogecoin. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: NewLiberty on July 04, 2014, 09:37:52 AM Bolivia has only banned using bitcoins on its banks national payment system. Like Visa banning using bitcoins over its credit card network or banks banning the use of bitcoins for wire transfers. Essentially. Bolivia has not banned bitcoins! Would it make the news if the Sahara Desert bans snow? Its not like the central banking network ever had any bitcoin on it, or ever would. We are getting to the point where: Too big to fail becomes To slow to matter. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: StatusSeeking on July 07, 2014, 08:38:15 AM oh shit they better ban WoW and Diablo gold Title: Re: Bolivia banks won't use Bitcoins for their transactions! Post by: Elwar on July 07, 2014, 08:43:32 AM oh shit they better ban WoW and Diablo gold Bolivia did not ban WoW and Diablo gold. However, the banks have said they will not use WoW and Diablo gold for their financial transactions. And by saying "they will not use WoW and Diablo gold", they said they will only use government currencies in their bank transactions. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: logger on July 07, 2014, 09:38:36 AM That is like banning Email to protect the post office, how retarded they look.
Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: cccarnation on July 07, 2014, 10:20:43 AM That is like banning Email to protect the post office, how retarded they look. and the irony of the situation is just imagine how many Bolivians are reading this article and saying, "what is bitcoin?" Often times trying to ban something actually has the reverse effect. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Elwar on July 07, 2014, 10:36:40 AM That is like banning Email to protect the post office, how retarded they look. and the irony of the situation is just imagine how many Bolivians are reading this article and saying, "what is bitcoin?" Often times trying to ban something actually has the reverse effect. Except Bolivia didn't ban Bitcoin. OP is trolling. Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: coinits on July 07, 2014, 10:45:03 AM From the same Bolivian legislators who have also wisely made it illegal to have sex with a woman and her daughter at the same time. Ah, Bolivia, the home of the llama, the dumbest of all pack animals. The country still hoping to build a tunnel to the Pacific Ocean. The country where driving a car is tantamount to suicide. Unfortunately, that has not resulted in the extermination of the Bolivians, because there are very few (functional) cars there, the reason being that whenever a car has a mechanical problem it becomes permanently inoperable due to the absence of anyone intelligent enough to be able to fix a car. To their credit, they were eventually able to kill Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, although it did take over 1,000 of them to do it. Ah, Bolivia, the only country in which McDonalds is unable to operate, because the concept of a restaurant is too complex for their bird-like brains. Where airplanes are illegal, because, you know, it's impossible to fly. That's logical right: it's impossible to fly therefore airplanes should be illegal. Very logical. Based on that logical insight they were invited to submit a team to the world math olympiad, but that proved impossible because they were unable to find any Bolivians who knew what math was. So, instead they had a tortilla eating olympiad in La Paz. La Paz, interestingly enough has a few buildings which are over 1 story in height, presumably built by foreigners. The Bolivian architects specialize in constructing soccer fields, because nothing is more important than soccer, and they are safe. Safe in the sense that noone has been killed by a collapsing soccer field, the soccer fields, being, well, flat. Some goalies have been injured, however, by falling goal crossbars, so that is their current focus: improving crossbar joining technology to avoid goalie head injuries. This is very important because the soccer field is the most important part of every Bolivian city. It's the law there must at least one soccer field every 5 blocks. The Bolivians like soccer because it is simple to understand: kick ball. At one point some Americans tried to teach them baseball, but that didn't work, since it involves using the hands and legs at the same time and other complexities like requiring the use of tools. The Americans tried tying a glove on a llama to demonstrate that animals, and by extension people, could indeed use tools, but the indios remained convinced tool use in sports was impossible so they made baseball and any other sport utilizing tools illegal, because they are impossible. Bolivia used to be a much larger country. In fact, at one time all almost all of South America was "Bolivia", but the Bolivians kept starting wars and losing them. Every time they lost, they would lose more territory. Other times they just gave away territory. For example, around 1900 it was discovered that a Bolivian region called Acre had a lot of rubber trees in it, so Brazil told the president of Bolivia, who, like all Bolivians was an idiot, that they would like to buy Acre. The president said, "How much?" The Brazilians knowing how stupid the Bolivians are, said, "How about 1 horse?" The Bolivian president said, "Hah, what do you think I am? An idiot? I have lots of horses." Then the Brazilians said, "O, but this horse is perfectly white." The Bolivian president not having any white horses readily agreed to that deal. Here's another story about the same guy, Presidente Mariano Melgarejo. Melgarejo means "stupid" in Indian language. In 1870, Germany invaded France. Melgarejo was infuriated because he had heard how beautiful and elegant Paris was. So, he ordered his top general to send the army to France and defend Paris. The general complained that the army would have to swim across the Atlantic Ocean. Melgarejo angrily replied "Don't be stupid! We will go around the ocean and take a short cut through the brush!" Anyway, its a good thing they have banned bitcoins because you know crypto currency is impossible. It involves math. +1 for the lulz Title: Re: Bolivia Bans Bitcoins! Post by: Aricoin_Mike on July 07, 2014, 11:27:30 AM From the same Bolivian legislators who have also wisely made it illegal to have sex with a woman and her daughter at the same time. Ah, Bolivia, the home of the llama, the dumbest of all pack animals. The country still hoping to build a tunnel to the Pacific Ocean. The country where driving a car is tantamount to suicide. Unfortunately, that has not resulted in the extermination of the Bolivians, because there are very few (functional) cars there, the reason being that whenever a car has a mechanical problem it becomes permanently inoperable due to the absence of anyone intelligent enough to be able to fix a car. To their credit, they were eventually able to kill Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, although it did take over 1,000 of them to do it. Ah, Bolivia, the only country in which McDonalds is unable to operate, because the concept of a restaurant is too complex for their bird-like brains. Where airplanes are illegal, because, you know, it's impossible to fly. That's logical right: it's impossible to fly therefore airplanes should be illegal. Very logical. Based on that logical insight they were invited to submit a team to the world math olympiad, but that proved impossible because they were unable to find any Bolivians who knew what math was. So, instead they had a tortilla eating olympiad in La Paz. La Paz, interestingly enough has a few buildings which are over 1 story in height, presumably built by foreigners. The Bolivian architects specialize in constructing soccer fields, because nothing is more important than soccer, and they are safe. Safe in the sense that noone has been killed by a collapsing soccer field, the soccer fields, being, well, flat. Some goalies have been injured, however, by falling goal crossbars, so that is their current focus: improving crossbar joining technology to avoid goalie head injuries. This is very important because the soccer field is the most important part of every Bolivian city. It's the law there must at least one soccer field every 5 blocks. The Bolivians like soccer because it is simple to understand: kick ball. At one point some Americans tried to teach them baseball, but that didn't work, since it involves using the hands and legs at the same time and other complexities like requiring the use of tools. The Americans tried tying a glove on a llama to demonstrate that animals, and by extension people, could indeed use tools, but the indios remained convinced tool use in sports was impossible so they made baseball and any other sport utilizing tools illegal, because they are impossible. Bolivia used to be a much larger country. In fact, at one time all almost all of South America was "Bolivia", but the Bolivians kept starting wars and losing them. Every time they lost, they would lose more territory. Other times they just gave away territory. For example, around 1900 it was discovered that a Bolivian region called Acre had a lot of rubber trees in it, so Brazil told the president of Bolivia, who, like all Bolivians was an idiot, that they would like to buy Acre. The president said, "How much?" The Brazilians knowing how stupid the Bolivians are, said, "How about 1 horse?" The Bolivian president said, "Hah, what do you think I am? An idiot? I have lots of horses." Then the Brazilians said, "O, but this horse is perfectly white." The Bolivian president not having any white horses readily agreed to that deal. Here's another story about the same guy, Presidente Mariano Melgarejo. Melgarejo means "stupid" in Indian language. In 1870, Germany invaded France. Melgarejo was infuriated because he had heard how beautiful and elegant Paris was. So, he ordered his top general to send the army to France and defend Paris. The general complained that the army would have to swim across the Atlantic Ocean. Melgarejo angrily replied "Don't be stupid! We will go around the ocean and take a short cut through the brush!" Anyway, its a good thing they have banned bitcoins because you know crypto currency is impossible. It involves math. +1 for the lulz I realy like to read about Bolivia ;) |