Bitcoin Forum

I canceled this auction for reasons described in the thread

Why US only?

I'm Xenophobic :)

It's all about shipping costs. They are lower if I keep it to the US.

Really, there's nothing stopping any of you from doing the same thing, so if you want to sell internationally, please do!

Is there any requirement you actually have to ship something on ebay, or can you just email the code?

I think he means "shipping costs"  ;)

Awesome idea, electronic  "Gift Certificates", redeemable in BTC at your favourite supplier.

Could be electronic images, pdf documents of value, whatever ...

Actually there are no air quotes. I am literally going to ship a piece of paper, tracking number and all.

If I don't, I'm not eligible for seller protection in case of fraud.

Why is the certificate not signed by your PGP key?

Ah, okay. But sending a Gift Certificate outside US in an envelope costs aren't great or?

I just assumed it was because doing business like this across international borders would be fraught.

I like the idea though because you leverage Ebay's payment system (PayPal), seller rating (trust) and existing infrastructure

That would be because, like most people, I don't have one!

Anyway, even if I did make one, it would be new/untrusted, and it would just confuse 99.9% of people on Ebay who saw the auction.

I'm going offline for the evening - you guys all bid so I can be happy tomorrow morning, k?

If the auction ended right now, some lucky person would get their bitcoins for just over $1 each :)

Hopefully I'll have some snipers when it ends.

It's US$0.98 to mail a simple letter.

A priority mail envelope is $10-$15 but also offers international tracking (using the tracking # on the customs form).

Great idea :D, I hope this works and you don´t get trouble with ebay.

For future auctions, I'm thinking about using this gift certificate template:

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/8881/certificate50.png (http://img10.imageshack.us/i/certificate50.png/)

I created a "web store" that this gift certificate goes with: https://sites.google.com/site/onedollarbitcoinsandcarrots/ (https://sites.google.com/site/onedollarbitcoinsandcarrots/)

What do you guys think?

I decided this idea wasn't going to work very well.

Would it a lot of extra trouble to sell smaller lots?

Not a lot of extra trouble, but the fixed cost for shipping might make it not worth it. I'm guessing my next auction will be for a $25 gift certificate, but it will be good for 25 bitcoins as described above, so it will actually be a BIGGER lot than the $50 certificate I'm selling now. Edit: Next auction is linked in the top post, and is for 25BTC with a face value of $100.

I want some carrots.

Just posted what my next certificate will look like at the top of the thread, assuming this auction goes smoothly.

A 7-day auction feels way too long. Next auction will probably be 3 days with a buy-it-now option.

Bidding is at $53 with one hour left. There may be a frenzy of sniping at the end (I hope), but if not, these bitcoins will be sold at $3.71 each! (MtGox is currently at $3.88 each)

Once Ebay takes their 9% and PayPal takes their 3%, that means I would get $3.26 each for my bitcoins (even less than that, depending on how much shipping costs). Even if I sell at a loss, I will still do at least one more auction. I'd like to establish whether this is a viable way to sell coins, even if I have to lose some money doing it.

If I make a substantial profit, I will definitely do more auctions, and I'm sure some of you will too.

Buyer got their bitcoins below market value, which means I get quite a bit less than market value.

Buyer paid by e-check, which means I have to wait for it to clear before shipping.

New auction selling 25BTC is posted, this time with a buy-it-now option: http://cgi.ebay.com/300555905164

Great idea and I hope it works well; Sorry to hear about the high fees.
Please, tell me if the seller protection costs you extra, or is it "free" since you are shipping the gift cert.

Seller protection is "free" if you follow their rules and ship to the Ebay/PayPal confirmed address using a tracking number or USPS delivery confirmation. I've heard that if you ship USPS, you have to write "DO NOT FORWARD" on the package, otherwise the buyer can have USPS forward the package to another address, then claim the package never arrived, and Ebay/PayPal makes the seller eat the loss.

I discovered that I am vulnerable to price speculation selling these gift certificates on Ebay, so I had to cancel my $100 auction early.

Assuming the e-check clears, I will still pay the 14.29 bitcoins to the winner of my earlier auction.

The problem is that the winning bidder can pay by e-check, which takes a week to clear. The winning bidder can cancel that e-check at any time. If the price of bitcoins doubles, they let the e-check clear, and I send them the gift certificate that they bought at a much lower price than it is currently worth. If they don't like the price in one week, they cancel the e-check before it clears, and I have to re-list the gift certificate. Ebay rules won't let me exclude e-checks.

I've learned an important lesson, and I'm changing my strategy. From now on, I will be selling gift certificates good for MtGox USD on ebay instead of bitcoins. Since the price for them doesn't vary wildly, there isn't a vulnerability to price speculation.

Can't you just take paypal only, or is the e-check done through paypal?  I'm a little confused, could you state "paypal only" in your auction and if they pay with an e-check just refund the money and tell them you don't accept payment via e-check?  I thought the idea was pretty solid, so much so, that before finding this thread this evening, I had even come up with my own certificate and was pretty much going to copy you!

Yeah, the e-check is through PayPal. If I accept PayPal, I have to accept their e-checks.

So do you think if you made it a "term of service" it would suffice?  Borrowing heavily from you, I went ahead and started an auction.  Let me know if you see anything glaringly obvious that I may have left out.  I really like the idea behind this as it ties into ebay's current feedback system with ebay protections built in.  Anyways, your comments would be appreciated.

His auction is here: http://cgi.ebay.com/280675399419

I can't find the official policy, but everyone seems to think if you accept PayPal, you have to accept e-checks. For instance: http://answercenter.ebay.com/question/Paypal/Echeck/900247346

The real hang-up is that a new PayPal user won't know that they are paying by e-check until after they send Payment. This actually happened to me the first time I tried to pay somebody with my new PayPal account. I hit "send payment", and then when I looked at my transaction history, it said an e-check would be sent in a few days. I had to cancel the e-check and jump through some hoops before I could send the instant payment I had meant to send.

Just for the fun of it, I put in a low bid on your auction :)

P.S. If your auction sells for more than $250, you need to ship with signature confirmation in order to be eligible for seller protection.

Nice, thank you!

I guess a link would have been helpful.  :)

I'll see how this one goes...if nothing else, it may be a good learning experience.

Post #1 in the thread has been updated to reflect that I am now selling $100 in MtGox USD on Ebay. Ebay listing is here:
http://cgi.ebay.com/300556550490

Buy-it-now price is $115, which I think should cover ebay fees, paypal fees, and shipping costs.

This is  a good reason for bitbills! It gives you a physical item to ship to customers.

Hey guys, I just want to let you know Paypal decided not to allow people to sell bitcoin with their service (this also includes Mt Gox USD). You may be able to sell for a while, but be prepared for Paypal to freeze your account.

I know this from experience. :(

I'm aware of the bad experiences you and mndrix had. I'm hoping that selling "gift certificates" rather than currency will avoid that problem.

The ebay listing has been ended.

I'm kind of a dummy - I hadn't messed around with Dwolla at all, and didn't realize how easy it is to fund MtGox that way. Nobody in the U.S. is going to be interested in a marked-up gift certificate when they can just use Dwolla.

I could always sell a certificate to international folk who can't use Dwolla, but then I'd have to deal with scummy Nigerians in internet cafes. (No offense if that is you)

OK, I take that back. Go ahead and be offended you dirty 419ers.

Why not just lower your buy it now price?

Overhead costs described earlier in this thread (ebay, paypal, shipping)