Bitcoin Forum

  USBcoin is the latest scam being pulled on Bittrex users.   Yesterday, a coin by the Name, USBcoin was added to Bittrex exchange, like any other IPO, there will be some volume people buying and selling, it was a 200 btc volume and very high volatility. Then all of a sudden supposedly "2 accounts coming from TOR nodes", with millions of USBcoins dumped on everyone. USBcoin was supposed to have 6m coins from POW, and 2% yearly Piece of shit (POS). Apparently the dev, had a hidden code that allowed him to inject extra 40 million coins and dump on everyone.

Now, me and countless of Bittrex users, are the real victim here.. What did we do wrong ? We are at an altcoin exchange, which serves one need only : "to buy  and sell cryptos" , USBcoin was the most traded coin  and the normal market reaction is to get on the ride. Who on earth would expect someone to scam an IPO on the first few hours ?


  so  your "it's a jungle and survival of the fittest argument" is not valid here, your "go read the code yourself is also not valid", your " they did not make you buy it" argument is not valid .. The situation is as follows :  Our trust in Bittrex was used by its staff in order to get few bitcoins and add a new 2 day old coin. AKA putting everyone in danger just to gain few bitcoin as "listing fee".

So basically Bittrex feels comfortable using us as sheep to barter for higher rate in order to add a new coin, regardless if they are giving an honest man, or a criminal access to us and our coins. I will give this analogy .. Imagine a government allowing someone in the country, and the day he's in the country he commits a major crime .. who is to blame ? the criminal or the government that let him in without proper investigation and criminal history and so on ....


Now we reach la crème de la crème : What was the response from Bittrex? "Oh well, we're sorry we got payed to add a malicious coin, we will remove asap, concerning your loss you are to blame."

they removed the market, and reopened the malicious wallet for "withdrawals only".

So what should happen now?
first of all, the amount scammed is around 100 thousand USD, so it's not a game.

two, we need a fully detailed response from bittrex  as to what exactly happened? who contacted them ? how much did they get payed to add the coin ? did they validate the identity of the Dev to add the coin ? the addresses that withdrew the bitcoins etc.

Three, User repayment plan, fees can generate enough to cover the loses in a week or so i don't think it's a major problem. 


Now, this is crucial, everything i wrote above, didn't contain any hint or remark that would suggest Bittrex is complicit with the scam, but the recent events, (that's the 4th scam pulled on us in a relatively short period) are starting to look fishy .. either Bittrex is completely unreliable and cannot run a Tier 1 exchange, or Bittrex just cares about the extra few bitcoins it gets in order to add coins, which i think it is, or Bittrex is on the scam too. What ever the reasons are, users cannot be blamed for actions allowed to happen by the third party acting on his own, and adding coins to his monetary gain using its trustful users as  barter.


Failure to repay the users, shall be met with widespread organized boycott.

that's right. this guys all blame the victim and claim bittrex has no responsibilty to protect users.

therefore the only way to protect yourself is to stay the fuck off that exchange especially when it comes to new coins.

say no to new coins on bittrex. they are all scams anyway.

I only use poloniex these days  :-[

Stay away from any exchange which adds coins right after launch. Let's go back to trading the good old coins, they have a lot more to offer the market.

Just relying on adding new coins is continuing to hurt the market, and the reduced volume all around shows that. Bittrex will continue to lose volume because of this.

"But its not how life works"

the exchange is responsible for launching a fraudulent ipo .. you don't put a shoe company that opened yesterday on your penny stock, unless it has some documentation and actual existence and working business model .. if it was a scam and everyone who bought the shares were holding fraudulent pieces of paper, the stock exchange would be responsible  for the losses... let alone the fact that they were getting payed to list the ipo


the problem for me is the  way they dealt with it .. just delete the market, nothing happened, go back to trading.

No it is not. That is a horribly insensitive, untactful, and insulting comparison to make. One involves personal freedoms and the ability to go where ever one pleases to go. This incident on Bittrex is people going of their own volition for a profit scheme motive.

People have the right to go to most places with the expectation to be safe and secure. People do not have the right to gamble and expect a return. One is a right and the other is a privilege. Huge difference.

I agree that example was not really useful, but I think the full blame doesn't lie on the end user. Yes, they should be careful, do their own research, don't risk more than you can afford, whatever, but there also needs to be some professional responsibility from the exchanges, which I would say has not been shown up to now.

No. However, the cryptocurrency scene is relatively new and unproven. And accordingly you will get results that will match.

Secondly, casinos are part of a regulated scene and function within that type of purview. These exchanges do not fall remotely within the same scope or oversight as a casino. The gambling is more akin to a gamble between unverfied/untrusted parties. It comes with the territory of dealing with unregulated trading in a "free" market.

i guarantee their staff are making these scam coins !
other wise they would be stopping them.

don't be gullible guys and don't let these exchanges play dumb with you.

they are ripping you off and playing stupid .

edit:
i already have posted numerous times about a LOT of suspicious shit with these guys (they make coins related crap)
and i don't want to retype out a wall of text all over again lol

a casino yes. but one thats not fun at all!  ;D

ITT, butthurt daytraders.

Actually, it is like quoting a stockbroker after a bubble has collapsed. Exactly like quoting a regulated, overseen stockbroker after the client's favourite stock has collapsed.

And it's also a lot like what a judge would say as he throws a lawsuit out from an angry client who got bullheaded enough to sue after his favourite stock collapsed.

Welcome to the world of high-risk speculation.

Why is that trope so continually thrown around? Why not a rich bloke with $1000 in his wallet who gets mugged after wandering into the inner city?

I don't understand why men would compare themselves to damsels in distress. It's like some feller putting on a dress in order to get out of being conscripted.

the analogy applies.

'she was raped because she wore provocative clothing and was in the wrong place at the wrong time.' == victim blaming
'he lost his money because he didn't do the research.' == victim blaming.

the rapist, the scammer, and the exchange deserve their share of the blame.

Its only similarity is in the shared idea of victim blaming, other than that, the analogy is completely off-base. It's fundamental tenets are vastly different and the prior argument requires implicit information in order to be taken at full-value. There are both formal and informal fallacies with the analogy. And the comparison is simply offensive.

Here's another difference: the expectation of outcome.

The woman does not directly have any expectation of a physical encounter (she could just be returning home from a day out with friends).
The investor does have an expectation of trading (and in particular for a profit).

There are so many better analogies that exist, so don't bring that weak sauce in here.

Regarding scams though, although I feel for those who lose, cryptocurrency is a place where free market ideals are taken to a significant extreme. People assume that they can make easy money here, but they also need to face the fact that they can lose that money just as easily. It comes with the territory. If you're looking for a safer way to make money off an investment, you're looking at the wrong place. Go find a place with regulation or insurance as protection.

you don't 'feel' for anyone.

you r just adding insult to the injuries.

5 scams in a few weeks shows a significantly poor job of quality control by bittrex as well as poor self control by traders.

cryptocurrency is already being regulated and it will continue to be so. its another profit center that will be controlled by big corporations and government agencies.

free market has nothing to do with the fact that bittrex takes $1500 to list these scamcoins. they don't do it for the good of the community or out of the kindness of their hearts. they do it for the cash.

since they are not protecting their customers its important that the clients protect themselves and dont buy these risky new altcoins.

"Bittrex just cares about the extra few bitcoins "
exactly the same as you were "just trying to get e few extra bitcoins"!

Dont you get it? Everyone in this show is trying to make easy money. Bitrex, you, scamers,... The only reason the scammers succed in their doing is because yourself and people like you think you can make easy money! The more people get scamed, less fools will "invest" in shitcoins, less oportunity for scammers to succeed in their scams. You and others like yourself are the ONLY reason this scam was such a succes! REWARD=RISK! The market Will balance itself out. suckers Will lose their money. Shitcoins wont get as much attention, scammers Will find new ways to rob people,... We dont need regulation.

That's what I believe too.
I believe that an exchange can make a mistake once in a while and add a loosy ipo scam but adding continuously ipo scam every 2 or 3 days... since a couple of week... ? well nobody is that stupid intentionally...
So yes I am pretty sure they are behind.

But at the current rate of scam, I would expect that Bittrex will soon be ready to make their grand finale, the infamous  "we got hacked" scam   ;D

Now, may-be the profit generated by bittrex isn't large enough and it might be tempting to them to either generate their own crappy coin or just accept bribes to list coins which doesn't fall in their "selection procedure" (ie innovative etc...)

So for me, they are the scammer no the scammed... (obviously there are also people who keep buying in every IPO...  ;D so scammed or scammer (or sock puppet ?)

It makes sense. I better withdraw before their grand finale.

that really is the final act.

the old 'we got hacked' with no details about what happened and then off to the exits.

like this guy said: one scam maybe a mistake. two maybe a mistake. three, okay, now....

four...wtf? five....come on!   ;D

"But at the current rate of scam, I would expect that Bittrex will soon be ready to make their grand finale, the infamous  "we got hacked" scam   ;D"

I've been worried about this for awhile since exchange revenues went down. Needless to say, I've left nothing of value on Bittrex and a couple of others. We just got lucky with Mintpal and their recent hacking.
Everyone would be well advised to move assets to safety.

How are these scam coins added so quickly to exchanges while other coins are not?

word on the street: $1500 listing fee in btc behind closed doors.

actually that's cheap  ;D I would ask for 10% of the IPO revenue

Imagine the MT Gox screaming regulators and government agencies that would all come screaming in because a Bittrex is an American Company? I bet Bittrex is already being monitored by the US government so I doubt they would try anything.

I've been altcoin mining and trading since early this year. Everyone involved in crypto for that long has some shrapnel in them.

That said, best wishes with your attempts to gain satisfaction. I do think the first exchange to publish strict guidelines on how it adds coins and the steps it takes to verify them will gain marketshare and trust. Of course scammers will work to find ways around any safeguards, but the absence of any real safeguards doesn't help the situation any.

Perhaps some sort of volunteer-managed "Altcoin clearinghouse" could even be developed, with each coin listed and a status on verification activities posted. It would be a quick reference for traders to see whether each coin has been vetted, to what degree, any issues that have come up, and so on. It could be ad-supported and if it is anything like I expect it would receive a ton of visits daily as a standard reference tool for altcoin traders.

sorry but you cant go back to a time in which the girl wasn't raped. its terrible it happened but it can not be undone. same as now except as devils advocate i proclaim that getting raped is worse than neckbeards losing 100k.  you think anyone who got into facebook ipo at $38 was able to call up their broker and undo it when the price was $18 3 months later? Meanwhile it didnt go above the ipo price for another year...  as the trader in ALTCOINS you people should know firsthand that for no apparent reason your coin could turn out to be a scam, broken, hacked, attacked, left behind, or any other scenario that is pounding the 5-15 coins released daily into the dirt.  some of the biggest and "respected?" names in new coins have fallen apart in the last month ue to Dev leaving, Hacks, Hidden premines.  if this is your first month please get used to it. if its not your first month then im sure your used to it by now.
as always do your own research, dont invest more than you can lose, dont trust anybody, and dont expect the price to be the same when you wake up in the morning.

SUGGESTION WOW  :o :o :o
it could be reasonable for the exchanges to only allow the posting of up to 1% of the total coins per 24 hours per account. if a dev who controlled a 5% premine wanted to drop the bomb it could take 5 days for them to do a drop as 1% was posted to their account each day.  We could get more extreme by only allowing 1% of currently emitted coins if the exchanges wanted to read a block explorer/moneysupply.  im not an expert but im sure this could be done.  its like depositing a check in an atm, you get 100 bucks right now and the rest when the bank verifies it.

Did poloniex have some deposit limit that stopped a qora scammer? It seems like a good idea.

Just to let you know, setting up a clearing house means doing some legwork for a future regulatory agency. That's exactly the chain of progress that led to the SEC being placed over what are sometimes called "Self-Regulatory Organizations" (dealer associations, exchanges, and of course clearing houses.)

As long as you're cool with it, fine and dandy; I'm more-or-less reconciled to something like that happening. I'm making my point so that you and anyone who likes your idea can go ahead with eyes opened.

If you're interested, try tracking down a full-length book on the full history of the New York Stock Exchange or of Wall Street in general.

To be quite blunt, there's a damn good reason for doing so even if the endgame isn't a grab and run. By doing so, you send a signal - the only signal that matters; declining volume and lower trading revenue - to Bittex managers that it's high time they cleaned up their act and got choosy about new listings.

I can't join you right now, as Bittrex is the only major exchange that lists Quebecoin which I'm trying to pick up right now (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=708702.msg8106986#msg8106986), but I can say this flatly:

As the head dev of NFD, I have now lost all interest in getting NFD listed on Bittrex. In fact, a teeny part of me would prefer that they don't list NFD.

Their listing policy has gotten so bad, I'm a little bit worried about NFD being tarred by the same brush! 

Feel free to quote me on this. >:(

The trouble with it is: even though it's weak sauce logically, it's one of the biggest hot buttons in the psyche of a normal male. The earlier poster comes across as something like a half-crazed Vietnam-vet type belting out: "Okay! You come home and someone is raping your sister..."

If you wave around the red herring, don't be surprised if someone like me smells something fishy...

I'd rather have a voluntary website that people can use or ignore as they wish, then wind up having the government set up some onerous set of regulations. The idea I floated above would just be a tool people could use or ignore as they wish. Over time if it was successful, exchanges might come to rely on it (more or less), giving it some weight/authority. But as I envision it, it would all be free-market and voluntary in nature - no one would force an exchange to pay attention to the information on it, and people could pay attention to it or ignore it at their peril.

I can see what you mean about such an idea leading by degrees to a more formal, controlling body. But I think you'll wind up at that conclusion faster if you don't do anything and people continue to fall victim to scams leading to an outcry to government to "help." At least with this approach people would be able to fight the encroachments as they started coming up. (I'd certainly be inclined to do so, as they crossed the line from voluntary to coercive/punitive attempts at regulation.)

its not like 'regulation' is going to be up to us.

when the powers that be want their cut it will happen.

I disagree with a fatalistic attitude. We can fight and at least try to win. We can fend off stifling controls by showing external regulation is unnecessary by having the crypto community develop its own tools to police itself. But if we don't, when people are scammed and they see little interest or resources within the community to make things right or prevent it from happening again, then they naturally run to government and demand government "do something."

Control freaks in government may "do something" sooner or later anyway, but we'll have a better shot at fighting them if we don't have a portion of the crypto community allying with them and egging them on in the first place.

I'm not a coder and have little/no competence in website development, but I wouldn't think the informational website I described would be very difficult. Just a list of coins, with a page for each, with a set of criteria for each coin. Some of the info could be the standard info found elsewhere (name, symbol, launch date, current and projected coin supply, POS/POW, algorithm, etc.)  But the real value would be answering questions (with links/citations wherever possible) like:
1. Open source?
2. Vetted? By whom?
3. Development team/contact info. (W. notes on other coins they have been or are involved with.)
4. Premine.
5. Rich list.
6. History of blockchain issues.
7. History of thefts of the coin.
8. History of scams involving the coin.
9. History of Changes to Dev. Team. Why?
10. History of Changes in Coin Characteristics (POW to POS, changes in coin supply, interest rate, etc.)
11. Exchanges carrying it, when listed (or de-listed).
Etc.

Even partial information on a partial list of coins would be helpful to get things started. And additional criteria could be added as we learn from scams and issues that come up, going forward.

I might just pick a few coins and start researching them to do kind of a demo of this idea, though I don't really have the time/expertise to fully flesh it out. But since the site could be ad-supported and should be quite useful/popular, this could be a good opportunity for someone to tackle.

I honestly would prefer an all-voluntary approach. But I'm enough of an amateur historian of these things to offer a different opinion.

Bureaucrats are organized people, detail-oriented, who admire thoroughness. I actually respect them, as people, for that. They're also known for not showing initiative. In a democracy, that's how it should be. The democratic-regulatory State we live under was designed to leave the initiative-taking to elected politicians, at least theoretically elected by the people. Bureaucrats are expected to stay within the bounds of their authorizing mandate. That isn't always the case, as I'm sure you've come across, but there's still an expectation that this sequestration of initiative is the way things should be. Changing the rules, instead of passively enforcing them, should be confined to elected officials that are - at least theoretically - accountable to the electorate via elections.

I know that your approach is common-sensical, and even jibes with the mantra of our times: "The government is in place to do for the people what the people can't do for themselves." But consider the issue from the point of view of a bureaucrat.

Since bureaucrats are organized and orderly people, they would prefer a largely orderly market to maintain and guide, which includes landing on crooks (however defined by their enabling legislation.) So the typical bureaucrat will take a look at this here place and conclude, "Gawd, this is like Somalia. The only way we can secure an orderly market is if we send in a gunboat. And since we don't have a gunboat handy, we shouldn't try at all."

And then they'll say to the people who are crying for help, "Sorry, but we lack the authority to do that. All we can do is issue official warnings saying in plain language that this marketplace is high-risk, very volatile, and interlaced with crime. It's something like the inner city of marketplaces, and is about as anarchic. Other than that, we can only offer sympathy and good time-tested advice."

But on the other hand...if they see a cleaned-up marketplace, one with clearing houses etc., they'll say: "Yep, we can regulate this. We'll do it in the same way that the Securities and Exchange Commission regulates the investment markets. It'll take some doing to craft out appropriate enabling legislation, by elected officials of course, but we already have a working template in the SEC. The time has really come for alternate cryptocurrencies to grow up."

I do see your point, but in a different way. If the cries for help reach elected politicians and sway them, they will swing into action. But any action, given the 'Somalia-esque' nature of the altcoin scene, will more likely be outright illegalization...using the now-potent hot buttons of "terrorism" and "money-laundering" as an enabling mantra.   

So, as I just noted, you do have a valid point. I'm not trying to deter you at all from pursuing your plan: if anything, I'd like to encourage you. You might well own/operate the altcoin's answer to the all-private Consumer Reports. If you can make a living providing that service, that'd be great!

I'm just giving you a history-based heads-up, that's all. Proceed as you will!

You guys realize, that there was NO successful launch hosted on bittrex. MIL was the best example for this.

Bittrex will host EVERY shit if they get a cut. Sad but truth!

Not if it bring them into disrepute enough to take a piece out of their trading volume and commissions. At some point - and I'm sure that point is approaching - the easy BTC will cost more than it's worth.

Remember Mintpal!

That is the problem. Most exchanges are very shortsighted. Because if they collapes they can just get "hacked" and start over as a new exchange...

Mil was polo by the way

Thanks for your thoughtful comments. I think I'm at fault for using the wrong word, leading to a misperception on your part. When I commented about an "altcoin clearinghouse" all I meant was an informational website, nothing more. As I envision it, information would be collected either wikipedia-style or with a staff of some sort (with some method of vetting the information, and the integrity of the leadership would be key) on each coin. The goal of the site would be to share information on the characteristics of the coin, details on scams/thefts/fraud related to the coin, technical issues/major bugs, missed milestones/broken promises from devs, and so forth. Links/citations would be provided for all the information. The idea would be to provide a sort of overall risk assessment related to investing in the coin, so far as non-market factors are concerned.

People could do what they want with the information, the site would simply be for reference and hopefully make it a little harder for scammers to operate successfully and save some people from them. Optionally the site could also have a section devoted to exchanges, how they operate, thefts and scams on each one, and so forth. That would help encourage them to clean up their act, be more transparent, stop shady practices that burn customers while profiting the exchange and so forth.

It's hard for me to see how such a website could lead directly to government control, instead I would hope it could be used to head things off. "See, we don't need increased regulation because scams have fallen 40% since the Crypto Clearinghouse started operation, and they have more projects on the way to get the word out on the latest scams so we expect that trend to continue..."

I've started drafting my ideas for this project; I'm about to head out on vacation but when I get back I may start a thread on it and try to get the ball rolling, if people see the value in it.

Ahh damn I confused MIL with Digital commerce coin DCM

Regardless of how a coin gets into an exchange, it is up to the trader to do his/her own due diligence on whether a new coin is legit. There's been plenty of scams. That's nothing new. You aren't children who need to be told the same thing every time. Yes, Bittrex should have been alert and paying attention -- that's their responsibility, and the fault for that lies on them. However, buying the coins is on the buyers themselves.

Most altcoins are useless, which means that some people will make a profit and some will end up as bagholders. People who complain about losing money only do so because they couldn't make a profit at the expense of someone else losing money. Let's put it this way: if the people who lost money on this recent scam made huge profits instead, then they would be bragging about their trading prowess and saying "you should have sold sooner" to those who lost money instead.

Yes, atm, but that short-sightedness has a definite sell-by date. It's only a matter of time before the bigger exchange owners figure out that "pay to list" is like buying the hottest stocks on the NASDAQ: wonderful in the short term but a sucker bet in the long term.

Remember Mintpal! ;D

Okay, no worries. I did misunderstand you because my experience with the stock market has 'gifted' me with the expertitis that leads to using technical jargon as if it were defined in the pocket dictionary. :-\

This is what I thought you meant, courtesy of La Wik:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clearing_house_(finance)


The more I hear about it, the more I like it! It's a great idea, and one that at the very least will make you a real pillar of our hardscrabble society. :)

But I still stand on my hope that you can make an honest living with it...

Oh yes...but the trouble's that, in the B&M world, we expect quick action when we buy a defective or not-significantly-as-advertised product. That accustomed-to B&M habit does carry over into these parts.

Believe it or not, your sound-sense advice is strikingly old-fashioned in a way. "What Was Old Is New Again."

Their last one...

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=737636.0

https://ip.bitcointalk.org/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FSlXzDnc.png&t=543&c=3yxqpp_bKOwrTg
https://ip.bitcointalk.org/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FLmU7T9a.png&t=543&c=Q4oc5b6nBcWq6g

When Bittrex got scammed, how is the customer affected?

Did they pass the loss to the customer by having all customer taking a haircut?

People are too much believers way too soon. They should be more conservative and wait for confirmations from the community not just jump any boat that's leaving the dock while no one checked if there is any holes in the bottom. The launch of so many cryptocoins enforces people to do more research which is actually a good thing.

funny is that "hosting every shit" back then was a good thing, i remember lol

There is no doubt that Bittrex is a shady exchange. In addition to being a coin graveyard, they are more than happy to accept complete scam coins like this case with USBcoin and Veilcoin a while back (where they had a "ninja" launch and then lo and behold the coin magically appears on Bittrex the same evening).

Of course you can't blame them if you buy a scamcoin, but on the other hand it sure seems they are complicit when it comes to some of these scams.