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http://www.nst.com.my/node/20925
US analysts conclude MH17 downed by aircraft

It would be news only for those who belive US politicians lies and didn't know the nazi undemocratic ukrain government that kill its people shot down the plane; the US want Russia and Europe not to be allies because they would be afraid of losing power

That is news from Malaysia.

Even if it gets published in the Western MSM, the image of "Putin's missile" is already too deeply entranced in the mind of an average Joe watching the zombobox (TV). The damage is already done, the truth can now be printed in small print on page 68...

I would really not consider the OP's source to be credible. This is also not being reported by the MSM which it almost certainly would if they received even a semi-credible tip to this effect.

There is also a lot of other evidence that points to the Russian separatists.  being responsible for the downing of the plaine. 

Oh c'mon... There is no evidence, except for some "photos" which were made in paint. :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CahOF3asOlQ#t=734

Sources for the air-to-air shootdown analysis:
https://hat4uk.wordpress.com/2014/07/28/new-mh17-sensation-german-experts-point-finger-at-ukrainian-air-force-jets/
http://www.globalresearch.ca/german-pilot-speaks-out-shocking-analysis-of-the-shooting-down-of-malaysian-mh17/5394111

In German:
http://www.anderweltonline.com/wissenschaft-und-technik/luftfahrt-2014/schockierende-analyse-zum-abschuss-der-malaysian-mh-017/
http://www.presseportal.de/pm/59019/2791311/neues-deutschland-nva-raketenspezialist-mh17-nicht-von-boden-luft-rakete-abgeschossen

Interview with the OSCE observer, conducted by CBCNews:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hiXjXmZ3NYg

Article:
http://consortiumnews.com/2014/08/03/flight-17-shoot-down-scenario-shifts/

What about the fact that the rebels in the Ukraine were claiming to have shot down a military crash in the same location at the same time MH 17 was shot down?

Which should make everyone question the accuracy of the information.

With what?

This should not be hard to check. How many weapon supplier is in the region?

Russian anti-air weapons

http://web.archive.org/web/20140717152222/http://vk.com/strelkov_info

"B paйoнe Topeзa тoлькo чтo cбили caмoлeт Aн-26, вaляeтcя гдe-тo зa шaxтoй "Пpoгpecc".
Пpeдyпpeждaли жe - нe лeтaть в "нaшeм нeбe".
A вoт и видeo-пoдтвepждeниe oчepeднoгo "птичкoпaдa".
Птичкa yпaлa зa тeppикoн, жилoй ceктop нe зaцeпилa. Mиpныe люди нe пocтpaдaли.

A тaкжe eщe ecть инфopмaция o втopoм cбитoм caмoлeтe, вpoдe бы Cy."

they thought they shot down this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonov_An-26

So it's really not any kind of conspiracy, it's just complete retardation, and I'll put my money on people being stupid every time

The evidence really does not support this. It is very much accepted that it was shot down with a SAM. Even Russia acknowledges this.

I have long suspected this. Also, the media has suddenly gone silent over the MH17 incident. Earlier also, there were indications such as these:

1. No missile plumes
2. Bullet holes on the wreckage
3. US not releasing the satellite data.

Strelkov (Girkin) mentioned he does not have accounts in social networks. This account is an obvious fake.

Who acknowledge it? Sofa expert with no data?

Check about old PZRK "Igla" - Max altitude is about 3000 meter.

That VK public account is ruled by activist, and he put there any thing, that he found on youtube or on forums.
If someone see a burning aircraft over civil war zone, that think about "successful anti-aircraft operation". But for real responsibility wee need proofs.

Dnepropetrovsk flight control crew is kidnapped, foreign experts are not more on place of impact. That is all about that - case is resolved.

That site is questioning the official Malaysian line. It seems that the Malaysian government has been bought off.

Hishammuddin pushes the US line:
http://www.nst.com.my/node/21682

The BUK missile is pretty large - the size of a small airplane. Where are remains of it, remains of its engine? Where are the debris from the missile?

And in this article:
Malaysia wants the ‘missing’ Ukrainian ATC tapes
http://www.nst.com.my/node/21260

You can see another interesting "official" statement:


Which is not the case at all.

Russia acknowledge that the plane was shot down with a surface to air missile. They claim that it was the Ukraine that had shot it down and not the Russians (who want the Ukraine to be part of Russia).

It's not his own account, but that account DOES post statements made by him. That's why it's in quotes. It's also within 20 minutes of the plane actually being downed if you look at the time. It's not some random guy in the US making this up, this is someone definitely in the area.

Let me guess? Now evidences about hidden separatists air force will start to appear?

the article doesn't provide any proofs, but this goes in accordance to Russian radar images and the plane they detected in their radar.

For me there are only too possible scenarios for this crash that are logical from a geopolitical standpoint (and I know this is repeating what coming out on the media)

a- The plane was targeted by separatist by mistake (as nor Russia or Pro-Russia separatist has anything to gain from
downing such a civilian plane) on the other hand I don't know how can the separatists can operate such equipment as it requires a minimum knowledge I guess

b- The plane was targeted to blame Russia and Separatists and weaken their case which is if it's true sounds horrible, but this is not the first time such thing happened, examples would be Vietnam and Iraqi war

With what? Buk-M1 make too much radio signals with the radar, is easy to locate. No one located Buk-M1 inside Donetsk/Lugansk.

The rebels don't have enough technical expertise to operate the Buk SAMs. And if they had someone with that knowledge, then none of the Ukrainian air force jets would have made it to Donetsk or Lugansk. Every day the Ukrainian jets make dozens of bombing raids over the rebel territory. The rebels can't target them, as they are too high for their Igla missiles.

I don't know really but this article shows a an SA-11/BUK M1 being transported by separatist, but so far and like I said before no definitive proof for either case scenarios was presented that's why I believe that both of them are possible

Just for those interested; I know for a fact that the pro-russians didn't shot down the plane

That is so obvious, even BUK-M1 could not tear down this big plane only could that S-300

Now it is known to everyone. Had the rebels actually shot down the MH17, then the Malaysian authorities would have already released the flight recorder data. But that is not the case. They are simply refusing to make it public. So there is only one conclusion. There is something in the flight recorder data, and the Malaysians don't want to reveal it. I don't want to go wild with conspiracy theories, but make your own guess.

I don't think the Malaysians even have access to the black box. So I don't see how they would release data they don't even have access to. Even if they did have access to the data, it would be of little use to the public as the public has little/no way of interpreting the data. The data would also not give any indication as to how the place was brought down.

The US and Ukraine will never officially admit it and we will never know the truth.

I think the saddest part of this whole thing is it wasn't an accident. Accidents I can handle. Out right cruelty and murder I can't. May the loved ones of all the people murdered during this crime find some peace

The last time I heard about them, the flight data recorders of MH17 Boeing were being transferred to the Malaysians. That was almost one month ago. But after that, there has been no announcement from the Malaysians. They are refusing to say what was in the flight data recorders, and are not yet ready to release the information public.

Actually, they would have no idea what hit them and even the smallest hole in the fuselage would have led to rapid decompression... meaning VERY quick unconsciousness, due to very low oxygen at that altitude. Small mercies, really, but it's very unlikely they suffered

Statistics of MH17 at the time of crash. Source is FlightRadar24's FB page
https://i.imgur.com/9fKGhFw.png

There are rumors that the MH17 changed its course over Donetsk, after the Kiev control asked it to do so. Another rumor is that an Ukrainian fighter jet was flying extremely close to the MH17. If these are true, then it will be evident in data from the flight data recorders. May be this is also one of the reasons why the Malaysians don't want to release the data.

fun to see a desperation, as ruSSians  trying to deny their crimes :D

I may have missed that announcement. Regardless of if they have it or not, what information do you expect to get from the black box that could potentially be useful to the public? Black boxes do not record the kind of information that would show how the plane was shot down. It is my understanding it only collects information about the performance of the plane (speed, altitude, fuel levels, engine performance, how the flaps are positioned, ect.).

Why would changing course make them not wanting to release the flight data?

They probably have something to hide to evade responsibility and feared of being sued.

Also, a question, if it is impossible for a normal person to mistake it for military aircraft,
wouldn't that suggest that perhaps it was intentional and perhaps thought
to be Putin's jet?

usa is the biggest agresor ever alive

There is a lot of useful data in the black boxes. There are two of them - one is the Cockpit Voice Recorder that records the following on separate tracks: pilot and co-pilot mics, ambient cockpit mic, the speech from both VHF radio trancievers. Then there is the Flight Data Recorder that records what you mentioned above, plus the cabin pressure and information about the radio transceiver engagement, and more. All that information is supplemented with a timestamp track, so the exact time of each event, as well as cross-referencing of the two boxes is possible down to millisecond.

If the plane was hit by a heat-seeking missile, you would first notice an engine failure (engines emit most heat and will get hit first), followed by loss of performance, but the cabin would probably remain intact. It would be interesting then to hear what the pilots had to say during those critical moments. Did they have time to transmit Mayday, mayday, mayday or Pan, pan, pan on 121.5. The tower would have picked that up (the withheld ATC tapes).

If the plane was hit by a BUK, you'd have loss of air pressure in the cabin, but the engines would probably still run for some time.

Finally if the cockpit was shot with 30mm armour-peirceing gunfire from a Mig, then the pilots would be dead within seconds, but the avionics would be intact. You'd also hear telling sound on the cabin ambient sound mic channel.

There is a lot of information that can help you reconstruct the events down to a millisecond, and the sequence and characteristics of events will determine what the cause was.

Images Show the Buk that Downed Flight MH17 Inside Russia, Controlled by Russian Troops

New evidence has been found that shows the Buk missile system that was used to shoot down MH17 on the 17th of July came from Russia, and was most likely operated by Russian soldiers. Using videos posted by locals in Russia’s Belgorod region back in June it has been possible to identify the Buk missile launcher seen in Ukraine on July 17th as part of a convoy of Buk missile launchers. It has also been possible to identify the Russian brigade the Buk is likely to have belonged to, and who may have operated the Buk missile launcher when it was in Ukraine.

The Buk launcher can be identified because of a number of features, including white markings on the left side side of its chassis, and what looks like the traces of a number that has been painted over. Here is a comparison of the Buk seen in previously unpublicised video taken in Russia on the 23rd of June with a well known image from Paris Match, which shows a Buk in Donetsk at 9am on July the 17th.

Numerous earlier studies of vehicles inside Ukraine has shown it has been standard practice for Russian forces to paint over the numbers on their vehicles before sending them into the Ukraine. In the Paris Match image, much of the remaining number has now been painted over. However, it is still possible to see the top curve of what was a “2” and the other two white marks. It’s important to note that these markings are in exactly the same positions on the Buk in both images.

Please find out more at:
https://bellingcat.com/news/uk-and-europe/2014/09/08/images-show-the-buk-that-downed-flight-mh17-inside-russia-controlled-by-russian-troops/

Why they shot not other targets?

Flight MH17 with a Boeing 777-200 operated by Malaysia Airlines broke up in the air probably as the result of structural damage caused by a large number of high-energy objects that penetrated the aircraft from outside.  This is mentioned  in the preliminary report on the investigation into the crash of MH17 that has been published today by the Dutch Safety Board. There are no indications that the MH17 crash was caused by a technical fault or by actions of the crew.

http://www.onderzoeksraad.nl/en/onderzoek/2049/investigation-crash-mh17-17-july-2014/preliminary-report/1562/preliminary-report-points-towards-external-cause-of-mh17-crash#fasen

My first assumption that Flight MH17 was shot down from a 30 mm gun fired by a Ukrainian plane gets confirmed...

Yes, that was my thought as well, when I read the report: "large number of high-energy objects".
Also: "penetrated the aircraft from outside". Which side? Both sides, as the imagery of entry/exit holes located on both sides of the cockpit seem to indicate?

The report manages to say a lot while revealing nothing specific.

Bullets form a 30 mm aircraft autocannon would pierce through the hull of a civilian airliner like a hot knife through butter. In fact, this report is hiding the truth, since it is very simple to tell holes made by a bullet from holes made by shrapnel (by the traces left on the piercings)...

Full report: http://cdnimg.rg.ru/pril/article/101/76/57/b3923acad0ceprem-rapport-mh-17-en-interactief.pdf

Can confirmed it was shot air to air

If the plane was shot by an air-to-air missile, there would be no "large number of high-energy objects that penetrated the aircraft from outside", since these missiles are self-guided and would target a plane's engines. And in this case the plane wouldn't break up in the air instantaneously, meaning that the crew would be alive for some time (in fact, it could even land successfully). The fact that the crew died almost instantly leaves only two possibilities, the first being that the plane was hit next to the cockpit by a SAM, the second that the cockpit itself was pierced by an attacking plane autocanon...

I don't think it's somehow related to China

Wrong.  :) There would be a "large number of high-energy objects that penetrated the aircraft from outside", since these missiles are using Continuous-rod warhead (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continuous-rod_warhead).

P.S. I'm talking about R-27, R-60, R-73, AIM-7C/E/F, AIM-9D/G/H air-to-air missiles.

Wrong is you, and for pretty obvious reasons. These missiles are too weak (unlike SAMs) to finish off a plane as big as a Boeing-777 in an instant (as the case appears to be). The only way when this would be possible is if they hit directly the cockpit which is next to impossible, since, as I said, they are self-guided at working engines...

Maybe, but these damages are similar to caused by the continuous-rod warhead..

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-d_eWfyF6ikM/U8k0a82ZoLI/AAAAAAACPgY/XHAmG-yoB8I/w506-h750/IMG_3178.JPG

In addition, there could be several attempts using the different weapons.

In any case the crew wouldn't die in half a jiffy, and there would be some information on the voice recorder about the causes of the crash. But since we are told that there is no trace of danger on the voice recorder, we have only the option that the crew died instantaneously (provided we are not lied to, in the first place)...

dutch should make ukrainian pay.
cause this make sense

This photo of the cockpit remains has been posted many times already

http://s28.postimg.org/fr66f69q5/1adc94a3bcfeb61c5a0f6a70670006b9.jpg

Here (http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/ap_webfeeds/1adc94a3bcfeb61c5a0f6a70670006b9.jpg) is a full resolution image. By the shape of the inlet holes it is clearly visible that the cockpit was pierced by the objects round in the cross section, which correspond in size to a 30 mm plane canon bullets (shells)...

Here's the official link:
http://www.onderzoeksraad.nl/uploads/phase-docs/701/b3923acad0ceprem-rapport-mh-17-en-interactief.pdf

Based on the pictures I have seen there were two dead pilots, rapid de-pressurization or not. They are designed to shred the aircraft; taking out hydraulics, electronics, comprising the structural integrity of the aircraft, etc

according to my source, MH370 was also shot down, and staged as crashed/disappeared.

It is far stretched to think it is an coincidence that 2 B777 from the same companies disappear for "non technical one of a kind" reasons in a matter of months

Isnt it funny that aircraft felt in UKRAINA, was MALAYSIAN, and supposedly downed by RUSSIA. And blackboxes end up in England. Which is today like american colony.

And isnt it funny, that USA is funding Ukraina with money and military to fight russians, but media act like it is conflict between Ukraina and Russia. :D
They never mention America, proshenko is on pohone with Obama daily, american politicians are in Kiev every week they are telling them what to do, they demand sanctions...they are 80% of what is going on, but media act like it is only between Ukraina and Russia.

I heard from a guy who knows a guy in an air controller room, saying he was right there at the moment watching radars and monitors. He noticed the disappearance / reappearance and looks very much like a pattern of military operation.

Russia denies any active involvement and claims that the conflict is between Russian-speakers and Ukraine. To that extent, both sides are hiding behind a facade.

If the USA didn't intervene, the conflict would probably be over and at least there will not be the bad consequences on the EU economy and Russian Economy; the USA didn't want to see Russia and Europe forming a block against them

Last info that came out is that a passenger had a mask of Oxygen on which means he had time to put it which may validate the (true) theory that the B777 was hit by bullets before it was hit by an air to air missile

The now former head of Ukrainian SBU had a slip of the tongue during a press conference the other day. He said that Kiev needs to implement the plan, developed in Holland, to visit the crash site ("experts" still haven't been there) and to find some fragments of Buk-M1 to pin the blame on Russia. The model is significant M1 stands for "modernised". This modernisation was done in Unraine on Buk systems inherited after Soviet Union. All 70 M1s are in service in Ukraine. Russia had some regular Buks, but these are not in active service.
Poroshenko also had a slip when visting anti-air academy. He was shown Buk-M1s and remarked "are these the ones like that which was used to shoot down MH17"? During a speach he then spent 15 minutes thanking the alumni of the academy for their contribution in the conflict, however AA was officially never used as resistance has no planes, so what contribution?

of course we are all concerned over the incident, the incident made ​​the eyes of the world were stunned, because it turns a commercial airplane carrying civilians became victims of the shooting of the country there is a conflict, it is proved that a war can cause a lot of casualties, especially from civil side, the authorities may be able to immediately find the shooter, hopefully this war quickly ended ...  8)

That was obvious from the very brginning, that it was shot down by ukrainian plane.

If the US had not intervened then the Ukraine would be part of Russia right now. The short term consequences of the conflict may be eliminated however it would put a very unstable country that is not exactly friendly with the western world at a big economic, trade and military advantage over the US and Europe. The long term consequences of this would be great.

I don't see how an O2 mask would validate that the plane was shot down by an air to air missile? If the plane was shot down by a SAM it would not have fallen straight out of the sky. The plane was several miles in the air and it would take gravity several minutes to get it down to the ground.  

1) If Russia will want so, Ukraine will become a new federal subject in less than 1 week despite of US wishes and interventions. US will impose another ridiculous set of sanctions but won't be able to do anything with that.
2) This won't happen even if Ukraine will pay a big bribe. Nobody needs any sovereignty on such kind of region. And reason is very simple, Ukraine itself is nothing but combination of enormously crazy debt and very poor people with destroyed infrastructure. Even if Ukrainian government will decide to sell all lands and other property, that won't be enough to cover payments for these debts, development of infrastructure and social obligations.

Russian TV Published Propaganda About MH17 That Actually Disproved The Kremlin's Main Theory


Anyone who has been following the debate over the downing of MH17 will know one point of contention is which weapon was used to down MH17. On one side you have people who say it was mostly likely a missile launched by a Buk missile launcher, and on the other people claiming it was cannon fire from a jet. Generally the former claim is used to link the separatists to the downing of MH17, while the latter is used to claim the Ukrainian government was responsible.

Russian television will today broadcast a special report, previewed on Dmitry Kiselyov‘s Becти нeдeли (News of the Week) programme on October 5th. Dmitry Kiselyov is very well known in Russia, and was last year appointed by Vladimir Putin as head of the new official Russian government owned international news agency Rossiya Segodnya.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=6HDR32KEAns

Presented by Arkady Mamontov, a Russian journalist who last year linked the Chelyabinsk Meteorite incident to gay activism, it promises to explore the downing of MH17 in depth, and in the preview they demonstrate the lengths they’ve gone to in their investigation by arranging to have a live fire exercise to test out cannon fire on aircraft.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=gzw363q1N3o

Anyone who has been following the debate over the downing of MH17 will know one point of contention is which weapon was used to down MH17. On one side you have people who say it was mostly likely a missile launched by a Buk missile launcher, and on the other people claiming it was cannon fire from a jet. Generally the former claim is used to link the separatists to the downing of MH17, while the latter is used to claim the Ukrainian government was responsible.

Russian television will today broadcast a special report, previewed on Dmitry Kiselyov‘s Becти нeдeли (News of the Week) programme on October 5th. Dmitry Kiselyov is very well known in Russia, and was last year appointed by Vladimir Putin as head of the new official Russian government owned international news agency Rossiya Segodnya.

Presented by Arkady Mamontov, a Russian journalist who last year linked the Chelyabinsk Meteorite incident to gay activism, it promises to explore the downing of MH17 in depth, and in the preview they demonstrate the lengths they’ve gone to in their investigation by arranging to have a live fire exercise to test out cannon fire on aircraft.

First we’re shown the entry holes created by the cannon fire, several holes of a consistent size and shape.

http://static3.businessinsider.com/image/543bb13a6da8110d3c2582cc-1897-987/russiat1.jpg

Next, the other side of the aircraft, where along with the larger exit holes we also have much smaller holes of various shapes and sizes

http://static4.businessinsider.com/image/543bb13a6bb3f70439a743f1-1909-989/russia2-8.jpg

http://static3.businessinsider.com/image/543bb13aeab8ea3d56bc821c-1911-974/russia3-4.jpg

So here we have a pattern of damage established, consistently shaped and sized entry holes and the same shaped exit holes surrounded by smaller exit holes of various shapes and sizes. There’s even a comparison shot of the MH17 wreckage to demonstrate how closely the damage matches.

http://static1.businessinsider.com/image/543bb13ceab8ea4f5abc8218-1912-978/russia4-4.jpg

However, there’s been many photographs of the wreckage of MH17 posted online, and some of these show clear examples of the initial damage done to MH17 when it was first hit. This panel, from above and behind the flight deck windows (discussed here at length), shows clear examples of entry holes coming from outside the aircraft.

http://static1.businessinsider.com/image/543bb13aecad04c72da743ec-766-600/russia5-4.jpg

It’s clear that unlike the entry holes in the Russian video, these holes are a wide variety of shapes and sizes. This image shows the full panel with many more points of penetration.

http://static5.businessinsider.com/image/543bb13a69bedd3f6487a9a4-1050-788/russia6-3.jpg

It’s also worth noting that many of the 30mm cannon scenarios involve the attacking aircraft coming from below, generally from behind, yet the above images clearly show the impacts coming from above the flight deck.

Another example of MH17 entry holes comes from ANNA News, a Russian language news channel embedded with separatists in Ukraine. In this video they are given a tour of the wreckage by separatists, where they are shown part of the aircraft it is claimed was hit by cannon fire. Here’s a image from the video showing the entry holes.

http://static4.businessinsider.com/image/543bb13a6bb3f7fd38a743ef-1776-862/russia7-3.jpg

We get a sense of the size of these holes in this image.

http://static5.businessinsider.com/image/543bb13a69bedd325f87a9b6-1185-790/russia8-3.jpg

This is what’s claimed to be entry holes from cannon fire, but as we can see, compared to the Russian TV piece on the damage done to MH17 there’s a significant size difference.

http://static6.businessinsider.com/image/543bb13a6da811ef3b2582ce-946-444/russia9-2.jpg

It’s been possible to ascertain that the panel in the ANNA News video was positioned above the flight desk windows, on the starboard side of the aircraft (details here), so, as with the earlier example, this shows cannon fire from below and/or behind the aircraft could not have caused this damage.

Thanks to the Russian channel’s work we now have a rare chance to compare the damage from cannon fire on aircraft to the damage done to MH17. Based on the Russian channel’s own tests it seems clear that the entry holes visible in the above examples do not match what’s shown in the Russian channel’s own tests. It seems that rather than prove MH17 was shot down by cannon fire as they claim, they’ve inadvertently provided evidence that it wasn’t.

http://www.businessinsider.com/russian-tv-inadvertently-published-propaganda-about-mh17-that-disproved-the-kremlins-main-theory-2014-10

Thanks for the info, pal. Now its obvious that its ukrainians shot down MH17

Even if it would have been the East Ukrainians shooting the plane (which it wasn't), it would have been Ukrainians shooting the plane but it is obviously a plane that shoot up MH17 then it wasn't the East Ukrainians fighters

http://player.rutv.ru/iframe/video/id/947083/start_zoom/true/showZoomBtn/false/sid/vesti?time_play=0&isPlay=true&showPopUpBtn=false&showZoomBtn=true

Aussie PM owes Putin an apology over MH17 blame game – senior MP
http://rt.com/politics/197528-russian-duma-mh17-german/


Germany’s intel agency says MH17 downed by Ukraine militia – report
http://rt.com/news/197316-germany-blames-militia-crash/

What has Australian Prime Minister been sniffing?
http://finance.rambler.ru/news/economics/153538713.html?utm_source=news&utm_content=finance&utm_medium=midcol&utm_campaign=cross_promo
He suggested to Putin that Russia should apologise and pay compensation to the relative of the victims of MH-17 shot down over Ukraine (most probably by NATO-backed Kiev airforce)

Well it was almost certainly russian backed troops that had shot down the plane, primarly evidenced by the fact that russian backed groups had boasted about shooting down a ukraine plane around the time that MH17 was shot down, plus the location of where the plane was flying at the time it was shot down

The aircraft should not pass through the conflict area where the warring parties mutually deny shooting the plane, the plane that passes through the area of conflict has had to bear the risk of stray rocket fired by both warring parties, hopefully this be a lesson for the next time flight commercial areas of conflict despite not passing on any height ...  ::)

Origin of the Separatists’ Buk: A Bellingcat Investigation

https://wp4553-flywheel.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/21.jpg

Summary

This report analyses evidence from open sources, in particular social media, relating to the Buk missile launcher filmed and photographed in eastern Ukraine on July 17th that many have linked to the downing of Malaysia Airlines Flight 17.

While other open source information is available on other aspects of the downing of MH17, the Bellingcat MH17 investigation team believes that this particular investigation provides solid information about the origin and movements of the Buk filmed and photographed on July 17th. The Bellingcat MH17 investigation team also believes that many of the unresolved questions about the downing of MH17 will be answered by the official investigation, and our investigation was made possible by the examination of open source material overlooked by other organisations.

The report is split into three sections. The first examines the open source evidence relating to the movements of the Buk in eastern Ukraine on July 17th, the second presents evidence that the Buk filmed and photographed on July 17th originated in Russia and was part of a convoy headed towards the Ukrainian border in late June, and the third looks at the activity of vehicles seen in the same convoy after July 17th.

It is the opinion of the Bellingcat MH17 investigation team that there is undeniable evidence that separatists in Ukraine were in control of a Buk missile launcher on July 17th and transported it from Donetsk to Snizhne on a transporter. The Buk missile launcher was unloaded in Snizhne approximately three hours before the downing of MH17 and was later filmed minus one missile driving through separatist-controlled Luhansk.

The Bellingcat MH17 investigation team also believes the same Buk was part of a convoy travelling from the 53rd Anti-Aircraft Missile Brigade in Kursk to near the Ukrainian border as part of a training exercise between June 22nd and July 25th, with elements of the convoy separating from the main convoy at some point during that period, including the Buk missile launcher filmed in Ukraine on July 17th. There is strong evidence indicating that the Russian military provided separatists in eastern Ukraine with the Buk missile launcher filmed and photographed in eastern Ukraine on July 17th.

A PDF version of this report is available: -  Origin of the Separatists’ Buk A Bellingcat Investigation.-

https://www.bellingcat.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/Origin-of-the-Separatists-Buk-A-Bellingcat-Investigation1.pdf

The report is now available in German here:

https://www.bellingcat.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/bellingcat_-_bericht.pdf

Explore a map showing the separatists’ Buk and June and July convoys in Russia here:

https://www.mapbox.com/labs/bellingcat/index.html

The shame is the international experts didn't have the guts or the political latitude to tell the truth and say the plane was shot by an air-to-air missile.

Oh, and of course the bullet holes from the high-explosive rounds used by fighter jets. And the total absence of Buk shrapnel balls in the bodies of the passengers (when Ukraine shot down a Russian passenger plane several years ago, using Buk, the bodies of the passengers were filled with such shrapnel, allowing the experts to determine the origins of the rocket).

In other words, the freedom fighters have nothing to do with this - been discussed before.

But I can say what The Aussie PM has been sniffing: the CIA script that probably got sent to some key figures prior to this false flag shoot-down, telling them what to say and how to react. As the plane was supposed to fall on Russian territory, all the anti-Russian lines uttered suddenly start making sense.

Looks like someone had no idea how big the plane should be in this picture.

http://en.cyplive.com/ru/news/malaziyskiy-boing-reys-mh17-byl-sbit-ukrainskim-samoletom.html?selcat=4
http://obkon.ucoz.com/_fr/14/0162309.jpg

https://www.metabunk.org/attachments/screen-shot-2014-11-14-at-17-10-31-png.10172/

Mythical Su-25 downing MH17 transforms into Mig-29 in Su-27 image

http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/zyalt/10761149/559255/559255_1000.jpg

Clouds from 2012 google earth

https://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xaf1/t31.0-8/1961888_673728156077446_6689090590846386357_o.jpg

 ;D Looks like in this new MH17 satellite "evidence" the position of the Malaysia airlines logo is in the wrong place

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B2atEu3IEAABqMH.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B2atFWvIUAE1qZT.jpg


 ;D  ;D shooting direction

http://s1.postimg.org/cnxxg43tr/B2a0_QQ4_IYAATjjw.jpg

http://s27.postimg.org/v5qu7am77/B2a2v_Ag_CMAAqg_UR_jpg_large.jpg


 ;D  ;D  ;D Here it comes.

http://oi62.tinypic.com/2iiz5lf.jpg

more http://zyalt.livejournal.com/1203282.html

https://www.facebook.com/adagamov/posts/673730582743870

https://navalny.com/p/3946/

http://avmalgin.livejournal.com/5031487.html

https://meduza.io/.../pervyy-kanal-pokazal-arhivnyy...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwgjN22fUc4

There's so much wrong with those Russia "satellite images" of the MH17 incident. No shame. I guess this is next

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B2bBUPkCMAA3q3p.jpg:large

Russian propaganda is great at tricking Russians. The rest of the world just laughs at it.

Is that why Dutch journalist working in Donesk republic wonders why Dutch investigators still have not fully investigated the crash site, while the German pilots talk about air-to-air shoot-down?

Ok, found the location seen there.
https://goo.gl/maps/6koWq
Now, look at the scale.
I don't think the plane is more than 2km long.

Looks like somebody got trolled :)

 ::) Russian satellites recorded the face of the pilot, who shot down the Malaysian Boeing

http://mtdata.ru/u4/photoCA3C/20480936137-0/original.jpg#20480936137

Poccийcкий вoeнный cпyтник зaфикcиpoвaл лицo yкpaинcкoгo лeтчикa, cбившeгo мaлaзийcкий Бoинг. Haпoмним, чтo yкpaинcкими вoeнными 17 июля был cбит caмoлeт aвиaкoмпaнии Malaysia Airlines, лeтeвший из Aмcтepдaмa в Кyaлa-Лyмпyp. Teпepь нe ocтaeтcя ни мaлeйшиx пoдoзpeний, чтo Бoинг cбилa yкpaинcкaя cтopoнa.


Hecмoтpя нa плoxoe кaчecтвo cнимкa, нa нeм oтчeтливo виднo дoвoльнoe лицo кapaтeля, пoкaзывaющeгo в кaмepy cпyтникa нeпpиличный жecт. Пo дaнным poccийcкиx кpиминaлиcтoв, пaccaжиpcкий лaйнep cнaчaлa был oбcтpeлян из пyлeмeтa c paccтoяния 50 килoмeтpoв, a зaтeм пo кaбинe пилoтoв былa выпyщeнa paкeтa «вoздyx-вoздyx». Пepвoнaчaльнaя вepcия o тoм, чтo вoeнный лeтчик пpocтo xoтeл cбить фypaжкy c кaпитaнa лaйнepa и тaким oбpaзoм пoшyтить, нe пoлyчилa пoдтвepждeния. Oчeвиднo, чтo yкpaинcкий кapaтeль нaмepeннo xoтeл cбить caмoлeт мaлaзийcкиx aвиaлиний, чтoбы oтoмcтить зa импopт poccийcкoй нeфти, кoтopyю Maлaйзия нa 60% зaкyпaeт y Poccии.

B нacтoящee вpeмя в Poccии пo фaктy вoздyшнoгo тeppopизмa и гeнoцидa pyccкoгo языкa вoзбyждeнo yгoлoвнoe дeлo, в xoдe кoтopoгo cпyтникoвaя фoтoгpaфия yкpaинcкoгo лeтчикa бyдeт oтпpaвлeнa в Интepпoл.

http://supermnenie.mirtesen.ru/blog/43582762818/Rossiyskiy-sputnik-zafiksiroval-litso-letchika,-sbivshego-malazi?utm_campaign=transit&utm_source=main&utm_medium=page_0&domain=mirtesen.ru&pad=1

Haha, can't handle the truth can you, pagan?

It is obvious to anyone who is not a completely brainwashed fool that MH17 was a false flag... and one of the most poorly executed in history.

The mainstream news in the US hardly even brings it up anymore.

http://www.picshare.ru/uploads/141114/iRCvZ49vUK.jpg

http://www.picshare.ru/uploads/141114/iRCvZ49vUK.jpg

That is a great joke, to put some fake image on random forum, and later to give explain in 5 minutes with deep work on old google maps.
LOL

We still waiting on ufficial release with proofs.

Oh yes, and also deep work on russian yandex maps  too ;D

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B2bQLyjCIAASWnj.png:large

Who control google maps history from 15 october 2014?

Let's not forget this video here, uploaded on  June 18th a whole MONTH before MH17 was shot down:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKKoKmUtQXE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKKoKmUtQXE)

In this video Elena clearly describes an eyewitness report of the Ukies using passenger jets as cover for bombing runs. And there is no way the US doesn't know that they were using this tactic. The Ukies were doing this shit MONTHS before Mh17 was shot down. They are clearly fully to blame for this tragedy.

You are desperately trying to play the isolation card. you have been fully called. you can raise or fold. both ways it's a pleasure to continue the training... sorry it can be any more serious so far away... my only recommendation would be to start to evacuate all civilians once the Empire's contractors enter the arena... we operate under safety first... everyone can cloak. And after the sands, snow is the exact training we may need. Russians freelancers may meet an unexpected resistances... Just please evacuate the civilians as retreat or capture is unacceptable from our contractual world. Sure to be able to play against contractors? there is no pride, just a job... and to phrase it simply to kill as much as possible with the lowest possible risk the most Russian&true Ukrainians patriots... and if drones are needed, they may come. remember our objectives are down south, but to clear the herd up north will do no harm. Ballet is safer. I am sorry, but this Syrian nightmare has to stop, even if it include the final stage of the disintegration of Russia. You are testing us, unrightfully on us, right now. Please (as a rhetorical wording) change. I am not sure that the Russian leadership nor the people of Russia have an idea against who they chose willingly to fight in Syria, and how nothing is unrelated. But you seems to persist in playing Russia Roulette, let's roll! Welcome to LVS, you will not be disappointed. And remember here we can bet on bets. On one hand you will be so proud to have seen America, on the other the dream will be the last thing you saw. I hope you enjoy the nightmare, the night is going to be long for Russia. I hope that a new more conciliatory morning will soon rise over an appeased Federation. BBQ or BF we are all ready. never forget sweet bear.

COLLATERAL DAMAGE OR CRIMES OF WAR?

Remember NATO Collateral damage (http://www.dw.de/collateral-damage-nato-airstrikes-remembered-in-varvarin/a-17516618)

Both Russia and the United States are having aerial footage from spy satellites. Russia has released its data. Why the United States is refusing to release the data which it possesses?

Just made some calculations:

http://s020.radikal.ru/i703/1411/b2/ccb57acbac43.jpg

The only possibility to make a real photo like this is to place camera 172 meters above the plane.

I was waiting for someone to make these calculations  ;D

---

Donetsk republic, Dutch experts and OCSE agreed on the procedure to transport wreckage parts (bigger parts will be cut into portions) to Holland for inspection and reconstruction. Donetsk Republic will be providing trucks and cranes. Let's just hope that Ukraine will not be providing artillery fire such as their customary want.

The picture with bullets holes, the non public Dutch investigation report that implies it's an air to air missile that hit the plane, the google cloud ect. are facts

The Ukrainian government is killing its citizens in East Ukraine while the East Ukrainians want to be independant

Gotcha! :D

I have to remind that such calculations would be correct only for naked eye. And incorrect if long-focus lenses are used, for example. So this literally doesn't prove anything.

Russia again calls for USA to release their satellite imagery from that day, and for Kiev to release the seized ATC communication recordings. The very fact that Kiev holds those recordings secret speaks volumes, and is the most damning evidence of Kiev's and/or Washington's involvement. If the records didn't hold any compromising information or compromised Russia, they would have not been touched as is the normal procedure in the crash investigations.

In the meantime, the retrieval of the Boeing pieces continues well.


Yes, long-focus lens would "compress" the distance between the plane and the ground, making the ground to appear closer to the plane.

Actually, to make the plane appear bigger compared to the ground, you have to get close.
There's no way around this. Basic optics.

http://s.pikabu.ru/post_img/2013/07/22/6/1374479023_953964726.jpg

However, it's obvious that original picture was compiled from the various sources... Some kind of trolling.

Well, look at that picture.
With the tele lens you can see less of the background.
For the picture with the plane it would mean that the camera has to be close, and not in space.

Corrected. Didn't read your message carefully. :)

Russian aviation authorities prepare a new packet of documents to be sent to the Dutch, pertaining the Boeing crash. In return, Russian (and more importantly, Malaysia!) do not get any information about the investigation as everything is concealed under the shroud of complete secrecy.

Meanwhile, the evidence continues to be cut into pieces in Donetsk by the Dutch experts (read: partially destroyed) and the whole plane will not be reconstructed according to the same experts, so the picture of the disaster will remain partial and secret, just as needed for a false flag to be able to frame Russia.

Also, a new article: http://www.globalresearch.ca/malaysian-airlines-mh17-downed-by-ukrainian-military-aircraft-kiev-regime-false-flag/5414173


And incidentally: http://futuristrendcast.wordpress.com/2014/10/26/pranks-to-die-for-us-general-admits-help-for-ukraine-and-oligarch-kolomoysky-mh17-downing/

It is one more hint that US/Ukraine government want to blame the East Ukrainians/Russia but do you have any knowledge of the optics involved in a satellite? Maybe it is a bit different than what you are used to.

it's such a shame, if I had a death loved one, I would be enraged, but what to expect from the west... It tells you everything you need to know about today's world.

Kremlin hybrid war

A Tweetbot Caught the Russian Gov't Editing Flight MH17 Wikipedia Info

Remember @CongressEdits, the tweetbot that alerts whenever a Wikipedia article is edited from a government IP address? There's a Russian version now, and it just uncovered some pretty drastic edits to a Wikipedia article that mentions Flight MH17, originating from a Russian government IP address.

As The Telegraph reports, @RuGovEdits tweeted that a computer user from within the All-Russia State Television and Radio Broadcasting Company (VHTRK) edited the Russian-language version of the Wikipedia entry about the Malaysian Airlines passenger jet shot down over Ukraine yesterday.

The original version of the Wikipedia article listing civil aviation accidents stated that MH17 had been shot down "by terrorists of the self-proclaimed Donetsk People's Republic with Buk system missiles, which the terrorists received from the Russian Federation." Emphasis added.

The edits originating from the government-owned computer changed the article to read "the plane [flight MH17] was shot down by Ukrainian soldiers". Again, emphasis added.

@RuGovEdits alerted the public with a tweet that says (translated): "Wikipedia article List of aircraft accidents in civil aviation has been edited by RTR [another name for VGTRK]".

http://ru.wikipedia.org/w/inde...88991&oldid=64288044 (http://ru.wikipedia.org/w/index.php…)

If @RuGovEdits is to be trusted (and considering the Wiki-twitterbot code is widely available on Github, it probably can be), it certainly seems like someone within the Russian government is working to hide the widely-held theory that Russian weapons were used to bring down MH17. But while Wikipedia might be malleable, it's also transparent. [The Telegraph via Amanda Zamora]

http://gizmodo.com/a-tweetbot-...ight-mh17-1607483459 (http://gizmodo.com/a-tweetbot-caught-the-russian-govt-editi…)

https://ru.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=64288991&oldid=64288044

Dutch government withheld information about the secret agreement to keep the results of the investigation from public, according to World Socialist Web Site:
http://russian.rt.com/article/60896?id

My simplistic theory, the Ukrainians used civilian plans to hide, the sol-air missile was fired by the "separatist". Who's at fault? lawyer rhetoric, it's war. the loser of course. first casualty of war is truth outside of the Empire. No fear.

German Beuro of economic investigations, Wifka, on behalf of an anonymous requester, raised the bounty on providing any information about the guilty in MH-17 shoot-down. The bounty is as follows:
30 million dollars for information proving guilt of those who are behind the shoot-down.
Additional 17 million dollars for information on how some countries hide the results of the investigations and/or impede it.

http://ria.ru/mh17/20141125/1034940913.html

Malaysia has been excluded from investigation process of the crash due to the country's neutral and calm position.
http://russian.rt.com/article/61249

Just think about it! Malaysia, whose plane was shot down, did not get included into the international investigation group!  :o

It is interesting to observe the inertia of this failed anti-Russian false flag and how it carries on despite the perpetrators having failed to shoot the plane down so that it would fall on Russian territory.

Relatives of Australian victims prepare a lawsuit against Malaysia, Malaysian Airlines, Ukraine and... Russia. According to their lawyer, it is not correct to limit the lawsuit against Ukraine only, and "everyone knows who shot the plane anyway". He should be reminded that Russia can at best be a witness for the prosecution, and has already transferred all available information to the investigation. At worst, Russia is a victim of slander and defamation. USA on the other hand have not, Kiev still keeps the ATC records secret, and Australia, Holland, Ukraine and Britain still have the non-disclosure agreement in place, covering in secrecy the eventual results of the investigation, if one of the parties objects to publishing.

The only good thing with this lawsuit is that it keeps the case at the top of the news stack and that the lawyer intends to get information from Dutch experts.

Also, it should be reminded that the bodies of the victims were not stuffed with steel shrapnel balls from BUK (as was the case when Ukraine earlier shot down a Russian airliner).

German relatives, who seem not to be brainwashed, are in the meantime suing Ukraine.

http://ria.ru/mh17/20141204/1036528146.html

---

German media discovered that intermediate report from the investigation commission dropped the statement that Ukraine should have closed the airspace over the war zone. This passage was present in the draft, but was removed from the released version.

http://ria.ru/mh17/20141203/1036447724.html

It seems nobody can find MH17 yet
it is so tragic  :'(

Malaysia has finally (!) been allowed to participate in investigation of the shoot-down of its own plane. Only half-a-year later. Once all the evidence has been taken care of...

Hard at work on Saturday morning? You love your country far too much. It's not healthy, Nemo  ;D

Looks like another false flag was being set-up, and again in the air:

Allegedly, Russian military plane with disabled transponders came too close to a Danish commercial liner, endangering it. Russia denies having a plane near the area, let alone with its transponders off.
http://tass.ru/politika/1645247

Swedish SAS released a statement that the military plane was not close enough to be of any danger:
http://www.gazeta.ru/social/news/2014/12/14/n_6742321.shtml

Yet, Russian ambassadors were called on the carpet to Danish and Swedish Foreign ministries:
http://www.bfm.ru/news/281538

The end goal of this whole incident was to warm up hysteria in Europe and force EU back on the path of sanctions, as EU had been slacking up lately...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTaCbmX4ffQ

Interview with retired officer who was responsible for vehicle #312 (https://humanrightsinvestigations.files.wordpress.com/2014/07/0_10dbee_b2c60b07_orig.jpg). No translation is available yet, maybe somebody will make a quick review later.

Major statements seen from few minutes of video:

It was ukrainian SA;
Ukrainian officers had a control on this machine during the time of incident and no shots were made. He said something like "we didn't shoot this boeing".

P.S. More information about vehicle #312 is available in article published here:

http://humanrightsinvestigations.org/2014/07/21/the-mh17-investigation-and-buk-312/

First, something about the other MH flight:
MH370 was 'shot down by US military', claims former French airline boss
http://rt.com/news/216675-mh370-shot-down-us/

---

And now, about MH-17.

Komsomol'skaja Pravda published the following revealing materials:
http://www.kp.ru/daily/26323.5/3204312/

This is an interview with man who saw return of the pilot, who might be the one who shot down MH-17. The family name of the fighter pilot is Voloshin. The shoot-down seems to be an accident.

Three fighter planes went on a mission from an airport near Dniepropetrovsk, one of the plane had air-air missiles. Of this flight group only one returned (the other two were shot down) - the one that started with air-air missiles, but it returned empty. According to the witness the pilot was unnerved. The first thing he said ofther climing of the cockpit was "Wrong plane". Later when asked "what happened to the plane", he allegedly replied: "the plane was at the wrong place at the wrong time."

There is more about Ukraine changing the dates of these missions, so as it would seem they didn't happen on the same date. There is a discussion around what type of rockets were used (there is a 2-stage rocket with srapnel, and the main part detonating at an interval).

They also discuss what kind of air-ground munitions were used during missions (one forbidden type).

More in Russian:
http://lenta.ru/news/2014/12/23/kpboeing/

More in English:
http://itar-tass.com/en/world/768593

http://s1.stc.all.kpcdn.net/f/4/image/75/94/889475.jpg

Ukrainian pilot suspected to shot civilian aircraft with air-air misile.
http://www.kp.ru/daily/26323.5/3204312/

Russian Investigation Committee came in touch with the Ukrainian citizen, who gave the above interview to KP, and will question him as a witness to determine if there is any truth to his statements:
http://ria.ru/mh17/20141223/1039791588.html

Russian Investigative Committee has conducted questioning of the Ukrainian witness, who gave interview to KP, using lie detector, and the results indicate that the man is speaking the truth. He is now under Russian witness protection program. the evidence he provided strengthens other evidence, that the Investigative Committee collected before.

From previous news items:
http://itar-tass.com/en/world/769050
http://itar-tass.com/en/world/769035

Interestingly, the Dutch investigators did not express any evidence in the witness, while the Western MSM treated it with complete silence. In any case, all norms of ICAO are broken in this "investigation"

Meanwhile, a Dutch journalist published a book, collecting all the open evidence and indicating that the plane was shot down from air. However, in the true spirit of European freedom of speech, this journalist is now a persona-non-grata, barred from appearing on national television in Holland.

http://ilaelamam.com/2014/10/29/mh17-the-cover-up-deal-dutch-journalist-publishes-revealing-book/

I really hope this isn't another Malaysia flight 370 situation again.
AirAsia Flight QZ 8501 Goes Missing - Newsweek
www.newsweek.com/airasia-flight-goes-missing-295

Sigh.. I wonder how many of these we're going to have.

2014 was a bad year if we look only at commercial airline accidents  :(

Ukraine’s Snowden: Whistleblower confirms MH17 was shot down by Ukraine
https://futuristrendcast.wordpress.com/2014/12/29/ukraines-snowden-whistleblower-confirms-mh17-was-shot-down-by-ukraine/


The above is a more detailed analysis of the events of the past days, that got completely ignored by the Western MSM.

Incidentally, Russian Investigative Committee offers to question Pilot Voloshin on lie detector, which should, if he is innocent, remove any suspicions off him. Kiev denies. Initially, Kiev also denied that Voloshin even existed, but had to revise their stance, when it was pointed out that Poroshenko gave him Medal For Courage “for heroism in defending Ukraine” two days after the shoot-down.

I personally would not consider him to be credible (nor would I consider that "media" outlet to be credible). Anyone can claim they witnessed something and it is not difficult to beat a lie detector. The witness has not provided any actual evidence to backup his claims (unlike Snowden) nor did he give anything up to make such claims (also unlike Snowden)

But he has. If you actually read/listened to what Russian Investigative Committee was saying, his information strengthened the evidence that IC already collected from before. To beat a lie detector, you need to have special training, and even then the bluff may be called.

PS: A perspective on events. In the light of constant anti-Russian propaganda and baseless/factless accusations, Russia has to be very careful when presenting its evidence. If presented evidence does not hold, you can just imagine the amount of howling in the West that will ensue. By this virtue, you can actually be pretty sure that is IC presents something to the public as verified evidence, it is, in fact, verified from various sources and is correct. The reaction of Kiev is also indicative of this. Why else would Kiev outright deny Voloshin's existence? If you sat that lie detector can be easily fooled, why would Kiev deny Voloshin be questioned on lie detector - he would, by your logic - be able to prove his innocence and ridicule Russia in no time. Or would he? Also, the European reaction. If you are serious about an investigation, you would pursue any leads that may shed light on the events. By indicating that this lead is not interesting to the European investigators, they thus show that they are after pursuing only one line of enquiry - the one that would achieve the preset goal of vilifying Russia.

Flight MH17 - Searching for the truth

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-gOUvatJWUS8/VJiPrq5S3gI/AAAAAAAAYik/eQuF4dVy844/s1600/Buk%2Btrail%2B3.JPG

    On July 17th Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17 was shot down over Eastern Ukraine. All 298 passengers died. Back in the middle of June, the Nato showed pictures of Russian tanks in the city of Snizhne in Eastern Ukraine. The German Bundeswehr and Nato know that Russian tanks do not move through enemy territory without the protection of BUK missile systems. Therefore, the flight altitude of ordinary planes was essentially a war zone since the middle of June. According to the CORRECT!V investigation, the German government and all other Nato countries would have had to warn the airlines not to fly across Eastern Ukraine. The Dutch government already confirmed our investigation. The German government still rejects it.
    CORRECT!V talked to witnesses of the downing of Flight MH17 in Eastern Ukraine. In a complex investigation in Vienna, the Netherlands, Ukraine, and Russia, we talked to military experts, warlords of the separatists, former BUK engineers and former soldiers of the 53rd Air Defense Brigade. All of them confirm: The separatists were not able to use such a complex missile system. Therefore, only Russian officers could have given the order to down Flight MH17.
    On July 17th a lot of pictures and videos were taken of the BUK missile system in the part of Eastern Ukraine that was controlled by separatists. The international investigative team Bellingcat identified the BUK as part of the Russian 53rd Air Defense Brigade. CORRECT!V checked the locations of the pictures and followed the path the Russian BUK took.
    CORRECT!V is publishing this investigation in cooperation with the German weekly magazine Der Spiegel and the Dutch daily newspaper Algemeen Dagblad.

Full article:

https://mh17.correctiv.org/english/

West has forgotten MH17 Ukraine crash probe – Lavrov
http://rt.com/news/221759-lavrov-ukraine-plane-crash/

boy and I remember a time when people thought proxy wars were over.

Sneaky anti-Russian EU-Parliament resolution:

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides/getDoc.do?pubRef=-//EP//TEXT+TA+P8-TA-2015-0011+0+DOC+XML+V0//EN&language=EN


Oh, yeah? Right, we know who was creating obstacles (Kiev, Washington, Amsterdam), and who was providing all the information and assistance (Donetsk, Moscow)

There was an interesting event a Holland, described by a Western author of a MH-17 book as a PR-stunt.
Journalists were allowed to see the remains of the Boeing. They were led into 2 hangars, and shown the debris. Three discrepancies hit the eye:

1. The debris were stored haphazardly about the hangar. If there was an ongoing investigation, there would have been an  outline of the Boeing drawn on the floor, and the fragments would have been placed according to their origin so as to reconstruct the plane.
2. Journalists were told that they see ALL the fragments of the plane. Meanwhile, another group of Russian TV journalists were at the crash site at the very same time and showed that many large fragments and personal belongings were left behind under the open sky.
3. Journalists were told that some of the fragments were off-limits and must not be filmed under any circumstance.

Let's also remember that the only country that release all the information that it had about the situation in the Ukrainian airspace is still Russia. USA and Ukraine itself are keeping mum, not releasing the information. And the fighter pilot Voloshin still hasn't been questioned by the investigators.

It just a big whitewash by the US. Of course Ukraine shot-down the plane, everyone knows but the media will never tell the truth.

Democracy defined: Lie, blame others, start wars, strong-arm other countries, rewrite laws to suit your own needs, while crying manifest destiny!

All true. The point is that nobody cares. Very sad.

A Dutch journalist from RTL tried to make a front-line by postulating that he managed to get hold of a fragment of the plane and that "according to experts" it show that it  was shot down by BUK.
In response to this rubbish, the Dutch security council issued an official denial, saying that the investigation is ongoing.
http://ria.ru/mh17/20150319/1053506462.html

It makes me sick to my stomach to see this issue abandoned. Is this how we treat terrorism, with total absence of repercussions???
I don't care who did it, both Ukraine and Russia should be punished, until it is clear who was responsible.

By the way, what happened to Crimea? So it's Russia now? No one is talking about it anymore...

Um, no. The investigation should not be hampered, and one of the prime suspects should not have a veto right to whether to publish the results, in complete breech of all ICAO aircrash investigation procedures.
It may still turn out that one would need to punish USA...

I keep a thread on Crimea.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=494128.960
It was Russia, is Russia and will be Russia.

And people are talking about it, if you know where to look:
http://www.globalresearch.ca/obamas-double-standard-on-russia-he-attacks-russia-then-condemns-putin-for-defending-russia-from-his-attack

Link:
http://www.rtlnieuws.nl/nieuws/buitenland/evidence-proving-flight-mh-17-was-taken-down-buk-missile (http://www.rtlnieuws.nl/nieuws/buitenland/evidence-proving-flight-mh-17-was-taken-down-buk-missile)

Thanks. I also see that a lot of Ukrainian sites have jumped onto this article as hungry wolves, and present it as if it's the final conlcusion.

Funnily, the article actually contradicts itself:


And he found only a few nondescript metal bits, and none were wound in the bodies of the pilots and the passengers, who should have been peppered with them.



Hmm... And they are still not interested in questioning of pilot Voloshin or in finding the classified ACT tapes that went missing hours after the shoot-down from Dniepropetrovsk. Apparently not every source can be considered as "every source".

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-03-30/did-reuters-falsify-testimony-mh-17-crash-witness

It seems witnesses can't make up their mind where the missile was fired from.  I personally will just ignore what this guy says now, it was the Ukrainians, no the rebels, no the Ukrainians.. He seems to be saying whatever the reporter asking at the time wants to hear.

Not enough people have questioned the very poor quality images and videos that were force fed to the world at the beginning of this saga.

Debunk those images such as the Paris Match "photos" and there is no case against Russia or separatists but what is even more worrying is that if those images and videos are proved fake then due to the rapid timeframe of them appearing that begs the question of were they prepared in advance of a premeditated attack on a civilian airliner?

For instance Paris Match announced their journalists were on hand to capture the photograph of the BUK on it's way from Donetsk.

In my opinion the Paris Match photos are video grabs from a dash cam , probably of the Volvo pulling a digger or some other machine and then the BUK was badly photoshopped on hence the weird angle of the BUK, it appears to be perched up on it's front wheels whilst the tractor unit is flat to the road.
https://i.imgur.com/bmojw2f.jpg

The video that grab was taken from appears to be the same size and aspect ratio that would fit with Paris Match photos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zHj4nltPf5U

Well, every video/image that was so far released by Ukraine and picked up by the Western MSM, were proven to be fake, or were at least raising quite big questions. Remember that before, there was an image of supposedly "Russian" BUK moving to Ukraine, which, using it's side-number, turned out to be a part of a Ukrainian division from Driepropetrovsk.

In other news, a Dutch forensic scientist, who mentioned some of the information pertaining the inquiry to his students, was fired:

Dutch expert fired after showing MH17 victim photos in public lecture
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/apr/24/dutch-expert-fired-after-showing-mh17-victim-photos-in-public-lecture

This belongs here, for the record:

---

Psaki Mk.II - Harf - said that USA will not be providing any additional information regarding downing of MH-17, despite Russia urging them to do so.
http://lenta.ru/news/2015/06/04/harf/

Well, USA is once more reaffirming their guilt as a accessory to murder by their damning silence.

About the above investigation:

BUK Manufacturer Almaz-Antey Investigation: MH17 was shot down by Ukraine BUK Missile


A commenter to the article nails it:


Read more + a video in English: https://futuristrendcast.wordpress.com/2015/06/03/buk-manufacturer-almaz-antey-investigation-mh17-was-shot-down-by-ukraine-buk-missile/

US can solve all the trouble with the data release. Or maybe hiding it because what happened would land everybody in a bugger trouble.

It would not land everyone in trouble. But it will definitely create issues for the United States. The MH17 was shot down by an air-to-air missile, which was probably given to the junta forces by the Americans or their allies. The Americans will be forced to give compensation to the victims, if the truth comes out. So for them, it will be better if they hide the data.

Just in. At the press conference in St.Petersburg Putin answered a question about MH-17 investigation. He said that we should wait for the official report from the Dutch investigation committee. He also referred to an unofficial report, which he got presented and which concludes that the airliner may have been shot by a rocket, launched from the direction of Ukraine-controlled territory. According to that report, the trajectory of the rocket went through the tail part of the plane.

http://tass.ru/proisshestviya/2059874

Also, and undisclosed informant seems to have turned up, laying claim to the £30 million bounty, placed by Germany for information on the shoot-down:
http://russian.rt.com/article/98528

The world's starting to sound the a movie

Independent British journalist Graham Philips, despite the intimidations from his government, continues to report from Donbass.

His latest reports are from the MH-17 crash site and interviews with locals, who witnessed jet fighters before the explosion.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-O0LdA2uJ8

According to one report, there were two fighters, one flying from the direction of Saur Mogila (a strategic hight and a memorial from WWII, which Ukro Nazis completely bombed out), while the other climbing just before the airliner exploded:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBIOAKpgT0c

Not surprise me that soon began another stupid war...

Russian Prosecutor General's office published a report, which says that MH-17 was shot down by and air-to-air missile of a non-Russian make. They also say that they know the make of that rocket:
http://tass.ru/politika/2122685

While CNN published a partial "official" report, which it obtained through its channels (read: was given to publish by the CIA), where the plane was shot down from the ground from the resistance-controlled territory:
http://lenta.ru/news/2015/07/15/boeing1/

By that theory of CNN's falls apart already, as DNR say they didn't have control over Grabovo back then, when the the rocket was allegedly launched from there:
http://www.gazeta.ru/social/news/2015/07/15/n_7379761.shtml

A year ago today Malaysia flight MH17 was shot down in a false flag operation to blame Russia and the Pro-Russian separatists. RIP to the victims.

Today marks 1 year since MH-17 shoot down. The West continues to play dumb, trying mightily to stall investigation and erase the event from people's memory.

Prosecutor General's Office of DNR marked the day by publishing documents, related to the investigation. Most of the documents comprise protocols/transcripts of witness questioning:
http://www.gazeta.ru/social/news/2015/07/17/n_7386105.shtml
One citizen reported about sounds, similar to shots shortly before the disaster. Another mentions sound of a jet engine right after the liner fell. Almost all witness testimonials coincide, indicating presence of another airplane in the vicinity.

MH17: A Year Without the Truth

Dutch Security council watched with great interest the Russian documentary "MH17: A Year Without the Truth" and contacted RT asking to help them get details on and assist with transfer of the cockpit cabin fragments, shown in the film:
http://russian.rt.com/article/106937

The film itself can be watched here:
Russian: http://doc.rt.com/filmy/mh17-god-molchaniya/
English: http://rtd.rt.com/films/mh17-a-year-without-the-truth/#part-1

Russian experts requested access to materials pertaining investigation of the shoot-down of Boeing in Ukraine, but were denied it. Ukrainian military flight controller records are also being kept classified.

http://www.gazeta.ru/social/news/2015/09/03/n_7548707.shtml

Well, actually, it's the Dutch, who did the denying.

As for Ukraine, they are still to release the ATC communication - both civilian and military. The civilian ones were seized by SBU right after the shoot-down and are kept classified too.

Why would they do it? For that you need to understand one simple thing - Ukraine is an occupied state, controlled from across the ocean. Ukraine stopped doing what is good for Ukraine a long time ago. That shoot-down was not mistake - it was a premeditated false flag to sick the world onto Russia and to discredit the freedom fighters of Novorossia. But this false flag didn't go entirely as planned, so tracks need to be covered by the perpetrators.

Almost one and a half years have passed since the shooting down of the MH17. And till now, it is not clear who was behind this incident. The Russians will blame the Ukrainians, and the Ukrainians will blame the Russians. This is going to go on for ever. Feels bad for the victims. But a few questions remains to be answered:

1. Why was permission given to the MH17 to use the airspace over Donbass, when it was clear that the rebels were shooting down Ukrainian Air Force jets using modern surface-to-air systems?

2. Why the Americans are not releasing the satellite data?

3. If the Buk system was transported from Russia (as claimed by Ukraine), then why the evidence is not being given to support this? Buk systems are very heavy, and it is almost impossible to hide them.

My guess is that it was thought to be a military aircraft, and was shot down by mistake. Another case of the "Fog of War". Russia and the Russian separatists had absolutely nothing to gain by shooting down an airliner full of foreign nationals.

somebody can give me the picture? i really want to know the truth.

MH17 Lies and Inconsistencies Exposed – Excellent Analysis by a French Citizen
https://futuristrendcast.wordpress.com/2015/09/16/mh17-lies-and-inconsistencies-exposed-excellent-analysis/


Thierry Andre Laurent-Pellet analyses a pre-report, and asks some very important questions that don't get answered in the report, in the following video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hhmi-f-UbE

Also this:
https://futuristrendcast.wordpress.com/2014/12/29/ukraines-snowden-whistleblower-confirms-mh17-was-shot-down-by-ukraine/

I think that it was thought to be a military aircraft, and was shot down by mistake. Another case of the "Fog of War". Russia and the Russian separatists had absolutely nothing to gain by shooting down an airliner full of foreign nationals.

Hahahahahaha

https://futuristrendcast.wordpress.com

This website has none valuable information ... just stupid propagande for nobrain people ... UFO , conspiracy ... all this shit to sell book to weak brain...

http://www.apell.fr/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/boule-de-cristal.jpg


Really you looke video LoL ... this guy come from nowhere ... claim blablabla ... i can do this same shit video ... no proof ... and claim ... UFO was there ... in Crimea ... we called little green men ... i sent them ! LoL

I don't think so, if the plane was shot by an air-to-air missile, there would be no large number of high-energy objects that penetrated the aircraft from outside, since these missiles are self-guided and would target a plane's engines. And in this case the plane wouldn't break up in the air instantaneously, meaning that the crew would be alive for some time.

Holland presented a report on MH-17 shoot-down. As expected, it did everything to present the party that has the most to lose from this false flag as the guilty one, and did not address such trivialities as observable facts. For example: if the plane was hit by BUK, all it's passengers would have been instantly killed by shrapnel. How come many had time to pull oxygen masks over their faces? Why were only pilots' bodies riddled with holes? The plane would not have been airworthy after a BUK impact. How come it could fly (glide?) for so long after it lost air contact inside the Ukraine-controlled territory.

https://www.rt.com/news/318457-mh17-report-plane-crash/

https://www.rt.com/news/318536-mh17-investigation-dutch-report/

Dutch experts say the rocket must have been shot from the DNR-controlled village Snezhnoje (btw, it means "Snowy" in Russian). But Almaz-Antey, the weapons maker, conducted several simulations, which show that the rocket could only have been launched from Ukrainian territory...
http://regnum.ru/news/accidents/1989971.html

https://cdn.rt.com/files/2015.10/original/561cdef9c46188fe538b45f9.jpg

MH17 downed by outdated BUK missile fired from Kiev-controlled area – Defense system manufacturer
https://www.rt.com/news/318531-mh17-experiment-almaz-antey/


See the video here:

BUK producer detonates missiles next to pilot’s cockpit in real-life MH17 experiment (VIDEO)
https://www.rt.com/news/318505-almaz-antey-video-simulation/

I thought it was an air-to-air missile? Don't change propaganda mid stream, it looks even less believable.

Who are these local investigators and who is paying them? this can be the beginning of a new plot with serious implications...

No one is changing the "propaganda". I still think the plane was hit with cannon fire and an AA rocket. Russian authorities may be conceding to the Western view of BUK in trying to find a compromise, acceptable to the West. That way the Western BUK-propaganda would not be looking as foolish. Russia has done it in the past - went along with a partial lie to save the faces of the Western "partners".

See, for example, independent and exhaustive investigation by Michel Brun of the KAL-007 shoot-down. He found enough hard evidence to pinpoint the location to the west coast of Japan, yet USSR took the blame for it, as if the shoot-down occurred over Sakhalin... All in the name of avoiding WWIII

EDIT: Besides, it's of the secondary importance what destroyed that plane, as long as those who ordered the execution of this atrocity are found and brought to justice.

‘It remains our belief’: US insists rebels downed MH17 with BUK missile, ignores Dutch report
https://www.rt.com/news/318613-usa-rebels-mh17-buk/


Also, Russia aviation authorities say that the rocket could have only been launched from Zaroshenskoej, which was controlled by Kiev:
https://russian.rt.com/article/123551

And further accuses Netherlands of substituting the evidence - the strike elements of the rocket:
http://www.mk.ru/politics/2015/10/14/rosaviaciya-razgromila-gollandskiy-doklad-po-boingu-mh17.html?

In this article it is pointed out that the fuselage lacks butterfly-shaped holes, characteristic for BUK shrapnel damage, something the Dutch report does not address. So the BUK theory is still, in a way, rejected by the Russian side.

In conclusion, what Russia does here is not propaganda, but science. The West puts forth a hypothesis: "it's BUK's". (USA says it's an axiom ::) ). Russia says, fine, let's do some experiments, like detonating a warhead near an airliner fuselage or calculating where a hypothetical rocket was launched from to match the observed radio (silence) data, and see if experiments strengthen or weaken the hypothesis.

Read more: http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2015/10/13/the-mh-17-report-paul-craig-roberts/

RosAviation named 6 facts pointing to falsehood in the Dutch final report regarding MH-17 shoot-down (http://нoвocти-poccии.ru-an.info/%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B8/%D1%80%D0%BE%D1%81%D0%B0%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B0%D1%86%D0%B8%D1%8F-%D0%BD%D0%B0%D0%B7%D0%B2%D0%B0%D0%BB%D0%B0-6-%D1%84%D0%B0%D0%BA%D1%82%D0%BE%D0%B2-%D0%BD%D0%B5%D0%B4%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%82%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%BD%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B8-%D0%BE%D1%82%D1%87%D1%91%D1%82%D0%B0-%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%BB%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B4%D0%BE%D0%B2-%D0%BE-%D0%B1%D0%BE%D0%B8%D0%BD%D0%B3%D0%B5-%D0%BC%D0%BD17/)

Russia's official position is expressed in a letter to the head of the Dutch Security Commission

Unnoticed sensation!

A Dutch parliamentary told the press that during a closed Dutch Parliamentary hearing of the 22nd of January, it was stated that only Ukraine was capable of shooting down MH-17:

http://regnum.ru/news/polit/2076897.html

http://regnum.ru/uploads/pictures/news/2016/02/11/regnum_picture_1455216926116288_big.jpg

and finally the truth is that Ukraine shot down the aircraft, and why are they not paying the dues

yes...the probe was going on and now it is proved that it was an act of terrorism....many innocent people were killed in the flight...!!

Five Australian families are suing... Russia for... "lack of cooperation" (!) over the MH-17 that got shot down over Ukraine by the Ukrainian forces. They want to get $10 million for each perished relative out of Russia. It is not known if the European Court for Human Rights will accepts the case.

https://russian.rt.com/article/303802-rodstvenniki-zhertv-katastrofy-mh17-podali-isk-v

Anyone who followed the case from the beginning remembers that is was Russia alone that was forthcoming with all the information, which got dutifully ignored by the West, and, moreover, Netherlands, US and Ukraine struck a non-disclosure agreement on any MH-17 findings...

Another act of terrorism.  What are these people thinking of?  Don't they have families?  What benefits they will have just by shooting a plane?  Different beliefs, different ideology, whatever it is, it is not right.  Innocent people were the victims.  I can't understand what is on their minds, such full of hatred or just a plain craziness. 

As I said 2 years ago, this is one of those cases, which Russia will not let lei, nor will it let it be forgotten. Russia will continue to bring this case up to the public attention until the perpetrators are identified.

And so it happens. A few days ago Russian Defence declassified radar data, showing that no object approached MH-17 from the position, designated by the Dutch committee as the BUK launch site. Russia also pointed out that Ukraine sits on the similar radar data. What was not said out loud is that USA had a military surveillance satellite over Ukraine at the time of the shoot-down, and is too still keeping the data from it classified.

The latest from the newsfront:

Russian radar data shows no missile attack on MH17 from rebel side, indicates Ukraine involvement
https://www.rt.com/news/360634-mh17-ukraine-radar-data/


The passage above is also indicative that the plane may have been shot down by an AA missile...

My hunch is that the data was neither "misplaced" nor does it come from civilian radar. More likely, it was not made public back then in the hopes that hinting at the existence of such data across proper channels would make the perpetrators think twice about pursuing the lie, and because publishing such data back then could have been damaging to the Russian military security. You never show your hand in one go...

As I said above the following is the real reason for publishing this data:

Almaz Antey hands over radar data on MH17 inquiry, Moscow calls for other countries to follow suit
https://www.rt.com/news/360319-almaz-russia-mh17-crash/


Russian radar would’ve spotted missiles east of MH17 crash site — Aerospace Force
http://tass.com/world/902254


Buk missile producer: JIT probe lacks tech proof, experiments showed MH17 downed from Kiev-held area
https://www.rt.com/news/360950-buk-producer-mh17-jit/

Russian defense ministry doubts objectivity of MH17 crash investigators' report
http://tass.com/politics/902838

Int’l investigators allowed Ukraine to fabricate MH17 evidence – Russia
https://www.rt.com/news/360946-mh17-ukraine-fabricate-evidence/

MH17 shot down by rebels using Buk system brought from Russia – int’l investigators
https://www.rt.com/news/360925-mh17-crash-jit-report/

Now I know that 247crypto is a Russian Troll. Evidence that was released today recognizes the entire world. Ukraine immediately talked about this. Journalists said, but the official investigation lasted a long time to gather accurate facts.Putin is afraid to be in the Hague that is lying. Impresses politicians. Contains a Department Troll.

No news from the Kremlin. Today was published the first report of the independent Commission. Boeing was shot down Russian. But to get them will be difficult, as they don't go there. Say about 100 people involved.

So the mystery was solved.  Another act of terrorism that cannot be inclined to ISIS right?  Since they said it was on Russia.  How come they shot down a passenger plane that easily?  Do not they know that innocent people were riding that plane?  Something to investigate about by both the country, Malaysia and Russia.

http://s00.yaplakal.com/pics/pics_preview/7/7/4/7141477.jpg

The proof of Who used the Missile.
Only the "Ukrainian" side have the operative BUK in the Zone of Missile launch.

It is very clear, unless you are having a sub-60 IQ. The Ukrainians allowed the passenger jet to fly over Donbass, despite the ongoing civil war. They were just hoping that the rebels will shoot down one of these jets. That didn't happened, and therefore the Ukrainians used a Buk to bring down MH17.

You're lying! Portable anti-aircraft missiles that Russia has supplied to the Donbass not able to shoot down planes at an altitude of 10km. Why close the sky? Soviets wanted to stage a provocation to bring down the Russian plane but missed and hit the Malaysian. Know it all!