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As the trial of alleged Silk Road drug market creator Ross Ulbricht approaches, the defense has highlighted the mystery of how law enforcement first located the main Silk Road server in an Icelandic data center, despite the computer being hidden by the formidable anonymity software Tor. Was the FBI tipped off to the server’s location by the NSA, who used a secret and possibly illegal Tor-cracking technique?

Even the anonymity software Tor is not really anonymous，which can be cracked down by NSA.

A better article on this here:
http://krebsonsecurity.com/2014/09/dread-pirate-sunk-by-leaky-captcha/


Did you even read the link? the SR was taken down by an extremely dumb mistake when implementing an anti-spam captcha. Nothing to do with Bitcoin whatsoever.

http://ia700603.us.archive.org/21/items/gov.uscourts.nysd.422824/gov.uscourts.nysd.422824.57.0.pdf

Insightful information. A dumb mistake indeed. On the other hand, it's easy to overlook potential security loopholes when you're working on a bigger project.

As a general rule: Be always wary of implementing external services, especially when they employ Javascript.

ya.ya.yo!

Thanks for the better link to the pdf. Interesting to see that nothing 'spooky' (like NSA) was involved in the trace, just a clever agent finding DPR's mistake with the CAPTCHA install.

tor doesn't belong to the government? if it is so then the thing is explained, tor was never secure, it was expected

LOL at Zerocoin, Monero in any case. ALso BItcoin had nothing to do with this. Re-read.

i like when people defend this guy. go defend someone who runs a drug dealing business in real life too then. i dont get why anyone talks about dread pirate moron at all. he was dumb, he is dumb, he did illegal things that were totally illegal to start with, and the majority of people agreed it is illegal except some "bitcoin wackjobs"... th emore and more people who talk about this guy like he is something to be respected, the more and more the media is goign to say bad things about bitcoin.

get it? got it? good.

granger, for the ones who get it done.

If this was truly the way that they found the server, then why haven't they found silkroad number 2 or whatever number they are on? I believe its an exact copy. there is almost no way someone could have written fresh code in less than a month. If what the govt is saying is true, most of the darknet sites are being followed or being copied. if SR had an issue, then im sure there are many sites that use tor that would have the same.. im not buying their excuse.... I believe that there is either a back door to tor or NSA was involved. Or there is another way that they found it, but want to keep it secret as iim sure every dark web site is figuring out the hole and going to try and plug it..

But, i dont know if any of the other sites are using capthca's... Its very apparent that DPR was not very smart when it came to security. He didn't know what he was doing.. Im just taking the governments excuse with a grain of salt. IF the NSA was involved, do you expect them to say so?

Its not a question of the guy being an idiot or doing something illegal. The point is the U.S government is over-reaching like they have a long history of doing. Look what they did to
online gaming. They arrested guys who had a business in another country where it is legal. WTF!?

BTW drug dealers are not the problem. Drug users are. Solve the root cause of drug abuse and there will be no need for dealers.

Just because something is illegal doesn't necessarily mean it's wrong and just because something is legal doesn't mean it's right.  A lot of people struggle with making the distinction between legality and morality.  Personally, morality is a bigger concern to me than legality.  Hopefully he gets someone on his jury that believes in jury nullification (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jury_nullification) if all he is accused of is facilitating transactions between buyers and sellers of drugs.

Neither drug users nor dealers are a problem. They do nothing wrong. They only ones doing something wrong is the state for bringing violence in to the equation.
Also. There is no "problem" to be solved. It's perfectly fine to use drugs.

Oh boo hoo, some people will say bad things about bitcoin. Cry me a river.

DPR did the world a favor by offering a place to conduct business in a safer manner than had previously been possible.

Also, you might want to learn how to spell before accusing others of being dumb.

If it was not for drug dealers then drug users would never be able to get ahold of drugs, nor would they have ever gotten into using illegal drugs. Also drug dealers will often take advantage of a person's addiction and do things like extend credit and give a discount to a person who is unable to pay to prevent them from potentially breaking their habit.

Wrong. Drug lusers can get addicted to any substance, and do whatever it takes to manufacture it for personal use.

drug dealers offer more choices (= more freedom)

government pigs deprive us of choices (= less freedom)

it is not a question whether drugs are good or bad. FREEDOM is always good, that is the point. People should have the freedom to harm themselves if they want as long as they don't harm others. Police should focus on those that "harm others" rather than those that "violate laws".

They could have potentially configured the site correctly. The FBI affidavit says that the service was configured improperly, not that there was something wrong with the code. I would also speculate that the code is somewhat different (I believe the UI is the same, but I would bet that the backend is different). If the new operators of SR2 were to properly configure all of the services running then their real IP address would not be leaked.

I do believe that the FBI agents were likely doing more then just "playing around" with the capha as is implied in the affidavit, I think what they were doing is much more advanced. I would also speculate that this was not the first way they attempted to break into the site.   

Something about this capha story doesn't make sense, but I can't put my finger on it. To me, it reads like a red herring.

Tittle could be: FBI finally invented a plausible denial about how they localized the SR servers.

Since the Snowden leaks we know the NSA was working a way to de-anonimaze Tor

I agree. If seems like something is missing. I think it would be wise for the defense to depose the FBI agent before the trial to get more details about what exactly it was that he did. I would find it hard to believe that the FBI got the IP address from the headers of the return data after just a few attempts of random letters being input.

As if people that support the war on drugs really give a shit about drug addicts.

Drug addiction isn't the problem, it's just a symptom.  That's why trying to take away the supply won't eliminate the demand.  Only counseling and treatment can do that.

Furthermore, not all drug users are drug addicts.  Many are recreational users with no danger of becoming addicted.

Interesting, but nothing special i expected something more.

If drugs are not available in the first place then people would never get addicted.

You are correct to say that not all users are addicts, but the majority of the drugs consumed are done so by addicts. This and many "hard" drugs more or less guarantee that people will get addicted and many people get addicted after using it just one time.

This is true. You can get addicted to cocaine after using it just one time. Same with many other drugs. They ruin people's lives.

The war on drugs has ruined more lives than the drugs themselves.

Drug availability isn't the cause of drug addiction.  Drug addiction is just a symptom of other psychological issues.  Regardless of how good one's intentions may be, drug availability can't be eliminated by politicians declaring war on drugs.  The road to hell is paved with good intentions.


You've been exposed to far too much propaganda.

This! Also the money spend on the war on drugs could've helped many in need! Let's not even get started on the private rights of the people. People should be allowed to do whatever they wish in their homes at least. As long as they don't interfere in a bad way with others then there shouldn't be a problem. Why not allow all the addicts to have their fun in their homes? If they don't go out on the streets to hurt/steal/damage/etc where is the problem? Oh wait, but the alcohol industry and the tobacco one will not make that much money...

And you've been exposed to too much ignorance. Stop being a conspiracy theorist and get a grip on life please.

http://www.drugfreeworld.org/drugfacts/cocaine/why-is-cocaine-so-highly-addictive.html

http://abovetheinfluence.com/drugs/cocaine/

http://easyread.drugabuse.gov/meth-effects.php

+1million others along with peer reviewed studies showing the devastating effects of using drugs.

That makes absolutely no sense.

"If drugs are not available in the first place" LOL.

Beyond belief that you've never seen people using paint, glue, or any substance whatsoever to get high (and... low?)

There is a refutation here: https://www.nikcub.com/posts/analyzing-fbi-explanation-silk-road/ by somebody who claimed to have been poking at the login for months and didn't notice the same things the FBI supposedly noticed. I imagine now defense attorneys will argue about this until the end of days

And costs countless billions.....ruining the economy.

Exactly....always felt a bit drunk when i'd painted a room.

It's a valid point, but availability causes those with a propensity to become addicted to drug X, to become addicted to it.

But you're right to dismiss the other post. If you don't crave altered states, not even heroin will light your fire.

Drug addiction is complicated, and very rarely, if ever, a problem merely due to physical dependency (hardly any drugs are physically addictive).

Cigarettes, alcohol, benzos are the hardest to kick. Heroin is hardish. But they are the ones that give withdrawal.

The rest are only hard insofar as they are pleasurable for some people and they can't imagine life without them.

I got this from a post on one of the sites that talks about this.. i think this guy nailed it on the head..

From poster:

From a recent wired article (docket), it appears to me that the F.B.I. used brute force SQL injection to find out the necessary information

“As they typed “miscellaneous” strings of characters into the login page’s entry fields, Tarbell writes that they noticed an IP address associated with some data returned by the site didn’t match any known Tor “nodes,” the computers that bounce information through Tor’s anonymity network to obscure its true source. And when they entered that IP address directly into a browser, the Silk Road’s CAPTCHA prompt appeared, the garbled-letter image designed to prevent spam bots from entering the site. ”

“That discovery by the FBI, the prosecuting attorneys in Ulbricht’s case argue, means that no illegal spying techniques were needed to pinpoint the world’s largest anonymous bazaar for narcotics. In fact, they write, the evidence revealing its physical location was left in plain sight. ”

“After the initial revelation of the Silk Road server’s location in a data center in Reykjavik, Iceland, the filing explains that Reykjavik police accessed and secretly copied the server’s data. As agents of a foreign government, the prosecution argues, they weren’t required to seek a warrant from any US authority. And the prosecution writes that Ulbricht didn’t himself even own the server: He had allegedly rented it through a third-party service, which in turn rented space in the Icelandic data center. The brief goes on to quote the web host’s terms of service, which warned that “systems may be monitored for all lawful purposes, including to ensure that use is authorized.”

“But the prosecution’s motion goes on to request that all of Ulbricht’s claims of illegal evidence collection be dismissed. The defense had argued that a surveillance technique known as a pen register applied to Ulbricht’s Comcast internet connection without a warrant had also violated his privacy; the prosecution responds that it merely collected metadata rather than the actual content of his communications, and thus didn’t require proving probable cause to a judge. The defense’s earlier motion argued that when the FBI did get a warrant to seize and search Ulbricht’s Samsung laptop, it used an illegal “general” warrant rather than specifying the data it sought. The prosecution claims that it needed to see all data on the machine to establish Ulbricht’s alleged identity as the so-called “Dread Pirate Roberts” who had created and managed the Silk Road’s billion-dollar drug trade. ”

What is the government doing now ,violating people’s fourth amendment rights , then trying to find out ways to make T.O.R. less anonymous ?

Is this what we want the government to do?

End post:

I think its kind of weird, that they were messing with the code and discovered this hole.. I believe that there is much more to this story.. while I think its mostly true, i would like to know the real story as to how they discovered it.. Typing in miscellaneous items would take a shit load of time.. some big computer was doing something...

You're terribly misinformed. Using drugs(especially Heroin, Cocaine, Meth, etc etc) over a long period of time creates a dependency on them. Some countries even give long-term drug addicts free drugs, because the Physical withdrawal they'd receive if they stopped taking the drugs would kill them.

Some symptoms of withdrawal after short-term use include, anxiety or jumpiness; shakiness or trembling; sweating, nausea and vomiting; insomnia; depression; irritability; fatigue or loss of appetite and headaches.

Effects of withdrawal from Long-term use of heavy drugs can cause death.

Cocaine isn't physically addictive. So I guess you think people become psychologically dependent after wanting to ride on one night?

There are some drugs that require a slow taper, like any type of benzos (xanax) Alcohol. But drugs like Heroine, Meth, cocaine, can be stopped, you wont die, but you will want to die if the reports are correct they are hell and you feel like dying.. but there are some drugs that you cannot stop cold turkey..some will doctors will want you to stay on some drugs while your pregnant as if you stop the baby will go into distress, so there are truths to both sides.. but in general, not too many drugs cant be stopped cold turkey..youll just feel like shit...

What a stupid post. You've lumped "drugs" into a single category. Most mind-altering substances are not physically addictive. they can cause pain and anguish, the user can become irritable and anxious if access to them dries up. But as far as drugs causing physical addiction and leading to withdrawal, there are not many. Tobacco, alcohol, benzodiazapines and opiates are the ones that spring to mind.

All the above are available legally or by prescription.

Being physically or psychologically addicted is the same thing from a public policy standpoint (they are different from a medial standpoint). Both kinds of addictions cause horrible problems with society, increase crime rates cost the government money, and ruin lives.

Heroin gives youa serious shit feeling, but 3 days later and you're through it.

Xanax is the worst, goes on for weeks, even on a taper. The worst benzo out there. But the doctor's drug of choice in the US. They should switch to Valium. Much smoother to taper.

They are not the same thing from a public policy standpoint, unless public policy is poorly conceived.

They require different treatment programmes, and most that have psychological addictions continue to function in some form or other within society.

Here's just one example of the lives that have been needlessly lost due to the war on drugs:
http://truth-out.org/news/item/13001-calderon-reign-ends-with-six-year-mexican-death-toll-near-120000

The war on drugs, the prison sentences, the families split up, the children taken into care, the gossip, the loss of income, job and future.

Just a few more to add on.

darkota is a Troll, and serious attempts to engage him intellectually will end in tears (yours).

He is famous for his self-moderated "litecoin is officially dead" thread, where he deleted every post that disagreed with him.

He's also famous for asking users here for bitcoin to start his own exchange. He failed to get it off the ground.

Some of the "Dread Pirate Roberts" fanboys should not forget that he also hired hitmen to kill adversaries.  Nobody was actually killed, but that only because the FBI was setting up a trap including fake pictures of a "done job". He deserves any sentence for that.

No, someone who was in control of Silk Road did that. And DPR wasn't the only person in control after FBI seized it, when the nonexistent "hitmen", including one allegedly a "civilian", were "hired".

Evidence? I'm not saying that didn't happen, but I don't think the smoke has cleared yet.

Entrapment (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entrapment)?

Came across this article by nik.

https://www.nikcub.com/posts/analyzing-fbi-explanation-silk-road/

I can't and I don't need to provide a proof for this, but the FBI surely has some which I believe they have.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/andygreenberg/2013/11/21/alleged-silk-road-ross-ulbricht-creator-now-accused-of-six-murder-for-hires-denied-bail/

http://www.businessinsider.com/ross-ulbricht-charged-in-2nd-silk-road-murder-for-hire-plot-2013-10

So it begins..

"We won't abuse our complete surveillance of everything"

"Okay okay only here and there"

"Well we have it set up so now if you do anything wrong expect to get arrested by our new state of the art drones!!!"  Expect this with in 10 years if Russia can not free us.

They can keep trying, but they cannot corrupt Bitcoin. Math will protect it for life.

Everything that DPR has done has been pretty amateur to be honest. I don't think he knew what he was getting in to at the time.

Clearly he wasn't qualified to run such an operation. But he kept it going for a while so hats off to him I guess.

The technical details regarding the CAPTCHA program and TOR and how they work would likely be too advanced for a jury to understand. If the defense were to try to challenge it in court, it would only confuse the jury and there would be a 50/50 chance the jury would believe the agent regardless of if he was proven wrong or not.

That's actually pretty sad when you think about it.

Wouldn't the defense call an expert witness who would testify on their behalf that what happened was illegal though? And shouldn't the jury decide whether or not they believe that? I mean I guess this is probably exactly what you meant. And it's unfortunate that peoples lives can be dependent of whether a few average people have an understanding of a technical issue or not.

What exactly was done that was illegal?
If they don't know what was done, how can they testify that it was illegal?

The jury does decide, but if they do not fully understand the issues being described by the expert witnesses are too complex then they could easily side with either the government or the defense.

No witnesses are actually able to testify that someone broke the law. That is not something they are able to conclude. A witness needs to give facts and the jury can conclude if the law was broken or not.

They can question the FBI agent to get more information as to exactly what happened. If the FBI agent admits to doing something outright illegal then the defense can request that the evidence be thrown out and if the judge declines then the case can be appealed.

If the FBI agent does not admit to doing something illegal but leaves things out of his testimony then he could either be considered to not be credible or the defense could hire an expert witness to say that what the FBI agent is saying happened would not be possible 

From what I can tell it looks like he was somewhat inexperienced in being able to keep his identity secret. I think that some of his early customers (and likely mods) were more experienced  in security and likely helped him. From what the media reports have reported he would sometimes get advise as to security leaks and would get helps in "plugging" them