Bitcoin Forum

It would appear bots can cancel buy orders when you click sell before it actually registers a sell.. making many fake buy walls.

Anyone else noticed this?

Anyone notice this the other way creating fake sell walls?

This would be an AMAZING way to suppress the price.

Bots have been around for quite a while. Even I am contemplating about writing one, BUT in my case I have no experience in writing such programs so I might not do it after all.

I know.. I just figured they wouldn't be able to cancel a sell or buy order SO FAST that when you click buy or sell the order is gone before you can do either..  With that ablity you can minipulate with very little risk.

This is not possible at all. But they can cancel if they predict a market sell coming.

This depends on who is running the bot.

If it is a user of an exchange running their own trading bot, then they have no way of knowing that a sell is coming until it is already registered in the order book.  Therefore, they cannot "see an order coming" and cancel their own order before the other one registers.

If the exchange themselves are running a bot trading the exchanges own bitcoins, then they can react before the order is added to the order book.

Additionally they can queue up multiple orders their own hidden order book for a short time (fractions of a second?  a few seconds?) before adding them to the publicly visible order book.  If they see overlapping buy and sell orders during this "pre-processing" time, they can insert their own transactions in between to take advantage of the inside knowledge and acquire risk free guaranteed profits for themselves.

I do not believe in trading bot, I am afraid they installed software such as a keylogger and steal our account  :-\

yep.. do you really think that all the orders belong to real people.. or the exchange owner trying to control the price. i learnt this lesson early on as exchanges know how much dollar vs bitcoin sits in peoples accounts, knows who is logged in and ths can guess what direction the price is going to lead.

many exchanges have bots trading orders to make it look more active. thus i dont use crappy basement dweller exchanges no more. especially when their orders are satoshi dust / $5 a pop.. its not even worth trading proper amounts on those exchanges no more

What I meant was that a bot can see how the price is shifting and the market depth is moving. Of course it cannot know that any particular order is about to be made.


Not if you know how to make your own bot  ;)

The part that goes a little over my head is when bots are executing buy and sell orders in between each other so quickly sometimes that they don't even seem to affect the posted walls on the exchange.  Like for instance when the volumes are high, I have seen several couple hundred BTC purchases, that you would think would clear the whole sell wall, but nothing ends up happening to the wall...

The problem is especially noticable to exchanges with 0% trading fees.

Only a site admin could do such things (remove a wall after a order submission but before the order is inside the order book)

I Have written a Bot that actually works on 5 exchange + 2 in developement (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=507103.0)
There's no way to get data BEFORE they're inside the Order Book. So i can't remove an order before the user place an order.
I Can create a wall (anyone could create a wall) and works (create statistics) on current order book but nothing more.

Site API are very simple, you can get
- Market+Your Current Order
- Market+Your Current Trade
- Your balances
- Place/Delete Order

I like trading tool, but never use any trading bots

Most exchanges only allow like 1 request / 5s, or so. So no real HFT works there.

Curse those dreaded bots, I cant help but play with them when I see one in use.

Anybody come across Rebol, seems an 'old' ish programming language I've not seen much, been playing with it, seems interesting in that it's easy to set up 'scripts' to do what we'd probably want a Bot to do, or even just to assist with manual trading.

http://www.rebol.com/

Very interesting thought.

I don't think this is possible for trading bots controlled by random traders.

But perhaps if the bots belong to exchanges, then it is possible for sure.

In the stock market it already is possible to do such thing if you have an extremely high speed internet connection and if you're close to the stock exchange.

They can see incomming orders before they are executed, flash traders make millions if not billions via this.

Hey silversurfer,

Have you had a look at leonArdo? It comes bundled with 2 bots and is the best trading experience you can have trading bitcoin. Here
is the link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=807794.0

Best