Bitcoin Forum

Alternate cryptocurrencies => Announcements (Altcoins) => Topic started by: Dabs on October 09, 2014, 03:21:12 AM



Title: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: Dabs on October 09, 2014, 03:21:12 AM
Hi,

Background info:
http://www.msn.com/en-ph/money/business/bill-filed-to-create-e-peso-for-internet-payments/ar-BB85Tuk
http://www.philstar.com/business/2014/10/05/1376516/solon-pushes-e-peso-act

I'm looking for potential devs to code this. Then I will get in touch with someone in the PH government.

Note: This coin may probably never happen, since it involves politics and government and a central bank. Or it may take several months or years before something happens.

Specs:

1. What algo? Block Times? Pow? Pos? Etc?
2. 10,000 (ten thousand) full nodes on launch. (Every bank branch will have a full node.)
3. 1 billion E-Pesos in the first two years, probably all pre-mined by the Banko Sentral ng Pilipinas
4. Exchanges = every local Philippine bank
5. Anonymity = probably none for those who go to the bank. Everyone else, depends on how smart you are.
6. Value = 1 E-Peso = 1 Paper Peso. Approximately $22 Million USD in the first two years.

I guess, this thread is going to be a discussion on how this gets implemented, or on what is a good idea for a country coin, that is actually going to be backed by that country's government.

So here is our chance to get involved.

Crazy? Bad idea? Someone is going to do it, if not you.

As I saw in a giant robot movie - Pacific Rim -
Quote
"Haven't you heard Mr. Beckett? The world is coming to an end. So where would you rather die? Here? or in a Jaeger?"


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: n3lz0n on October 09, 2014, 03:55:48 AM
^^ watching  ;D


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: adoalli on October 09, 2014, 03:56:45 AM
Then I will get in touch with someone in the PH government :o :o :o :o

Niubi ;D


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: Breasal on October 09, 2014, 03:58:58 AM
Would love to see this happen. Please keep us posted as to who and how this will launch. Would love to take a holiday to Cebu funded by E-Peso


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: Dabs on October 09, 2014, 04:00:14 AM
I just thought, with 10,000 legally mandated full nodes, this might be good as a hybrid PoW/PoS coin.

So, some may be asking, what's in it for me?

Pros:
1. bragging rights
2. possible government job as crypto consultant / board member / whatever
3. ooooh, escrow contracts (1% of 1 billion isn't bad huh.)

Cons:
1. would need additional physical security

Someone else is going to be making money on the hardware procurement (10,000 computers, 10,000 hard drives, maybe SSDs). And if they all need to be mining Proof of Work, it's either 10,000 asics, or 10,000 GPU rigs.


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: Dabs on October 09, 2014, 04:02:26 AM
Then I will get in touch with someone in the PH government :o :o :o :o

Niubi ;D

Yeah, I know a few people*. Remember, this is just an idea. If not me, someone else will do it. I can see it happening, maybe not soon, but maybe in the next administration or two.

* local mayors, a few reps, a former governor, and every other previous AFP Chief of Staff and PNP Chief.


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: Breasal on October 09, 2014, 04:04:42 AM
I just thought, with 10,000 legally mandated full nodes, this might be good as a hybrid PoW/PoS coin.

So, some may be asking, what's in it for me?

Pros:
1. bragging rights
2. possible government job as crypto consultant / board member / whatever
3. ooooh, escrow contracts (1% of 1 billion isn't bad huh.)

Cons:
1. would need additional physical security

Someone else is going to be making money on the hardware procurement (10,000 computers, 10,000 hard drives, maybe SSDs). And if they all need to be mining Proof of Work, it's either 10,000 asics, or 10,000 GPU rigs.

In terms of cost efficiency for the Phil Gov, it seems likely that they will issue a fully minded POS and have 10,000 low energy consuming nodes. Herein the debate of POS vs POW security.


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: lionheart78 on October 09, 2014, 04:24:28 AM
-watching-  this is a very interesting idea


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: n3lz0n on October 09, 2014, 04:45:58 AM
how about create a coin with the specs above ^^ (has to be fork of DOGE/BitCoin/DarkCoin which are compatible with superNET) and contact jl777 so we can link this coin to superNET which has 100,000+ nodes + various projects of jl777?

maybe lower the coin supply as well, as people seems to hate super high cap?

thanks ;)


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: tobeaj2mer01 on October 09, 2014, 04:49:31 AM
It seems bitcoin has been banned by Philippines government.


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: n3lz0n on October 09, 2014, 05:09:10 AM
It seems bitcoin has been banned by Philippines government.

I don't think so, they are very busy with internal corruptions...


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: traderbit on October 09, 2014, 05:12:14 AM
good to see a trusted member launching a new currency , good luck !!!


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: payyy on October 09, 2014, 07:23:55 AM
Then I will get in touch with someone in the PH government :o :o :o :o

Niubi ;D

no no no, i have get in touch with US GOV ,And they will accept it .lol


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: Dabs on October 09, 2014, 07:28:51 AM
Actually, the BSP (Banko Sentral ng Pilipinas) seems to be against the idea of crypto currencies. Unless, of course, they can control it. PoS and they control all the nodes, and they control all the exchanges, and require everyone who buys to have a regular bank account or at least have verifiable government ID.

It might not even be mineable... depends on many things.


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: crazy-pilot on October 09, 2014, 07:50:48 AM
I think this E-Peso is more like ripple or stellar than bitcoin. I guess there would be no mining involved.


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: cryptochris88 on October 09, 2014, 07:56:09 AM
I think this E-Peso is more like ripple or stellar than bitcoin. I guess there would be no mining involved.

+1 on this one...
I think the ripple/stellar approach is much more beneficial for this IMHO...


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: toaster3 on October 09, 2014, 07:56:46 AM
Philippines Government?? lol, must be in your dream ;D


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: totoy on October 09, 2014, 08:01:49 AM
will watch this


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: *Sakura* on October 09, 2014, 09:06:06 AM
Philippines Government?? lol, must be in your dream ;D


All great discoveries began with a dream.


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: Snail2 on October 09, 2014, 09:14:03 AM
Yep! The Philippines govt. surely going to be happy to outsource this project to some random guys on BTT :).


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: thebenjamincode on October 09, 2014, 01:33:12 PM
Hi,

Background info:
http://www.msn.com/en-ph/money/business/bill-filed-to-create-e-peso-for-internet-payments/ar-BB85Tuk
http://www.philstar.com/business/2014/10/05/1376516/solon-pushes-e-peso-act

I'm looking for potential devs to code this. Then I will get in touch with someone in the PH government.

Note: This coin may probably never happen, since it involves politics and government and a central bank. Or it may take several months or years before something happens.

Specs:

1. What algo? Block Times? Pow? Pos? Etc?
2. 10,000 (ten thousand) full nodes on launch. (Every bank branch will have a full node.)
3. 1 billion E-Pesos in the first two years, probably all pre-mined by the Banko Sentral ng Pilipinas
4. Exchanges = every local Philippine bank
5. Anonymity = probably none for those who go to the bank. Everyone else, depends on how smart you are.
6. Value = 1 E-Peso = 1 Paper Peso. Approximately $22 Million USD in the first two years.

I guess, this thread is going to be a discussion on how this gets implemented, or on what is a good idea for a country coin, that is actually going to be backed by that country's government.

So here is our chance to get involved.

Crazy? Bad idea? Someone is going to do it, if not you.

As I saw in a giant robot movie - Pacific Rim -
Quote
"Haven't you heard Mr. Beckett? The world is coming to an end. So where would you rather die? Here? or in a Jaeger?"

i think ripple based coin is suitable for a country coin :D


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: provenceday on October 09, 2014, 01:38:44 PM
watch this now.

thanks


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: thebenjamincode on October 09, 2014, 03:14:54 PM
Finally, a  Pinoy coin! I would love to spread the news of this development :)

The logo of this coin should be PNOY :D


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: bitwarrior on October 10, 2014, 08:24:11 AM
Will be watching this. Once Bitcoin will go mainstream and mass adopted in the Philippines,

This idea implementation will not be so far-fetch in the country's setting.



Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: tagbond on October 10, 2014, 12:45:34 PM
Asked by Dabs to post this here as well as Philippines area:

If the BSP don't work on the epeso I idea, I might do it anyway, just as an experiment to see if it can be done - These are the general ideas:

PoW / PoS (1 or 1.5%) coin
1 epeso = 1 peso
I billion premined, with option to add more in future as need arises, but mining is done centrally. You cannot just have everyone printing money..:-)
Very transparent Block Explorer - other sites will no doubt spring up showing the amounts that public personas/politicians have if they have shared their public address, otherwise rich list would show patterns anyway. In other words, some control of AML.
Network of computers (probably AWS) to handle PoS and Stability of network, double spend etc.
Coins transferred through Tagcash network with no costs in our out (via Bank), or via cash, via EC Pay network (7/11 etc), for which there is a 1% charge to get the money into the network to buy the ePeso (their charges not mine). Tagcash revenues come from flat fees from merchants who do over 100 transactions a month in epesos, pesos, points or actions like stamps in the stamp books etc
Remittances would be easier, as BTC can be purchased abroad and there would be ways to purchase ePesos on exchanges but the rate would be fixed for cashout to bank in Philippines, so exchange rates on external sites would not fluctuate too much. We would handle KYC and AML through Tagcash or an exchange we ourselves would create to convert between BTC and ePesos
The amount of money held in the bank in Pesos should equal the amount of ePesos in circulation, possibly under supervision of a bank or us if we obtain an EMI. However, operating as EMNSP under UnionBank or SecurityBank are also options.

We would make 1.5% of the coins in stock via PoS, which would pay for the overheads of computers to handle PoS and therefore stability of network. Over time, this would be dispersed and the holders of ePesos would be making 1.5%, including the banks who would offer to hold coins in exchange for say 1 to 1.2%. Banking would not really be affected too much, but transfers of money would be much easier using the system. Anyone without computers or smartphones can use Tagcash to transfer back and forth using SMS. If there is a need to introduce more money into the system, that can be done. If the BSP want to take over the operation that also is not a problem. The idea is to introduce it and see how it fares. As long as everyone can get money back from the crypto at the same rate they paid and no fees, then I foresee no real problems.

I will be meeting with the Banco Sentral regarding our EMI Banking application anyway in the next couple of weeks, so I can raise the idea then and get some feedback. I will also be meeting with various other Bitcoin/crypto businesses for any input.

And if anyone asks what is in it for us, that is easy to answer. We are building Tagcash.com as an alternative to Paypal here in Philippines (outside Philipines it is a loyalty/virtual currency platform), so we need to grow our network for digital cash, biller payments, load purchasing, as well as a network of sites we are creating that use Tagcash digital payments and points. We already have the system in place to take in money and pay out from banks, KYC implementation that was OK with the BSP, NFC, QR codes, ID system etc etc...

So there's a few ideas - anyone have any constructive criticism?..

EDIT:
After discussion, research and feedback, it is just not viable to introduce this, at least from my point of view. Way too much hassle for no return - I am sure when the BSP is ready to create something they will ask for advice from us and others involved, and I will be happy to help. Personally, I see it as years away. Way too many problems with AML, capital flight and acceptance.


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: erwin45 on October 10, 2014, 12:52:27 PM
 ;D every new discovery start with a dream, but i think bank hate the concept of cryptocurrency literally


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: tagbond on October 10, 2014, 01:02:31 PM
The banks here don't "hate it literally"...anyone I talk to at the banks here have barely heard of cryptocurrency except what they might hear as background noise on the news... they just don't know enough about it, they need some education. The banks here make money from lending, mortgages etc. That won't change with the introduction of a cryptocurrency that matches the local Fiat. They would just be lending ePesos instead.

What changes is the dynamic of how things are paid for, which in this country is mostly cash. And also, VISA, Mastercard would not fare too well, but then use of credit cards is not that widespread yet.


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: Dabs on October 11, 2014, 12:14:07 AM
I think what they won't like is if it is truly decentralized, are the typically known properties of bitcoins, namely:

1. It's decentralized. They can fix this by centralizing production and mining, but #2
2. It's fungible, or no chargebacks, or not repudiable, or non freezable.

The legal system may not like #2, and if you fix that, then you lose all the properties of being a cryptocurrency.

Still, you have to hand it to the legislator of fixing most problems new coins have: all banks must have full peer to peer nodes. (Note, they it doesn't say they should have miners.)

That begs the question if there will still be PoW mining involved, or if it becomes Proof of Stake, then the banks and BSP will definitely have 100% of the coins, at the start.


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: majeis on October 11, 2014, 08:17:30 AM
Yep! The Philippines govt. surely going to be happy to outsource this project to some random guys on BTT :).

LOL apparently country-themed coins are no longer dead...

Now they're official.


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: mcgeal on October 23, 2014, 10:22:55 AM
Thats promising....hope politicians will not try to politicize this one...


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: fox19891989 on October 25, 2014, 06:25:43 AM
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=827826.0

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=827826.msg9318170#msg9318170

You can find it here, these guys are hired by by people who have congressional ties to the lawmakers.


Title: Re: [Pre-ANN] E-Peso Coin (Philippines Government Backed Proposal)
Post by: lobat999 on October 25, 2014, 07:12:12 AM
This could be a trailblazer in Philippine crypto currency scene. We should embrace and be ready for the future. :)