Bitcoin Forum

The main thread is located here (http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=8167.0).  For the most up-to-date information on SIN, and to get your questions answered the quickest, post there.

Well since no one else is replying...

It's an interesting idea... I know Amazon already offers a cloud GPU computing service for $2.10 an hour each rig comes with 2x Tesla Fermi GPUs but I'm not sure of the hashing power on those. Tests showed it was unprofitable or very little profit, however the tests were done when the exchange rate was far below $5 though.

So question #1: How profitable will this be if the exchange rates fall to say $1.50/btc?

question #2: I'm not sure why you need to start out on a large scale with $28k worth of mining rigs. Why not start the idea by yourself with your own investment capital at 1-2 rigs, then dump the profit from those into buying more rigs each month or however long it would take to mine enough BTC for a new rig (cba to do the math)

I don't know enough about bitcoin and the system and how the market works but in my opinion I wouldn't invest money for a future gain in bitcoins. It may be profitable this month or even 2 months from now. But I get the feeling it won't be profitable in the long run that would make it worth spending money on a mining rig. I prefer to just mine with what I got and take the 100% profit instead of spending $2,000 and hoping that 6 months later the bitcoin system will still be the same and the investment pays for itself.

Why not just call it Cyberdyne Systems?

This is a crosspost from http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=8208.0 btw.

Which is a cross post of http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=8167.0

it's not good nvidia, forget tesla and its 80 mh/Sec.

Thanks for your interest!  I messed around on Amazon EC2 for about a week and spent about $30 only to find out that the whole thing was a lost cause (Telsa GPUs, as mentioned earlier, are garbage for mining BTC.)


#1. If the exchange rate falls, the difficulty will probably fall, and make it easier to mine the coins.  But even if the difficulty stays the same, then mining at 1.5USD/1BTC with 39 rigs will be in the black almost $6000 at the end of each month, after electricity is paid for.  I think there would be a crisis mode at that point, and some serious discussion on the future of the business, but I don't think that that kind of drop in price is in the future, especially without a drop in difficulty to accompany it.

#2. The problem I see with this is that it takes a certain amount to beat the difficulty increases and make enough money before them to reinvest and grow.  I don't think that having only one or two rigs is enough to do that in the current climate, which is why I'm trying to get enough funds to make a lot of money and not only beat but lead the difficulty increases.  I will not be starting with $28k worth of rigs, I don't think anyone expects me to raise all the funds in a few short days.  As of this moment, 405 shares have sold, which is enough to buy 3 rigs, so I am going to be withdrawing those funds in the next few days and purchasing the first wave of rigs (which I'm hoping will help my legitimacy) and hopefully more people will buy into this once this occurs.


The number of rigs will not remain static, and portions of the profits of the company will be dedicated to growth in order to continue to produce a significant amount of BTC.  Investors are paying for the initial equipment, which will produce enough profit to expand and keep the business competitive.

Thanks again for your interest, I hope I answered your questions adequately.

Personally I think at a point these type of companies will take over the hashing power of pools (call it the next step in mining evolution). If such company manages to get ~6 blocks an hour (or maybe all) it will become very unprofitable for "home"-miners and pools (who mostly depend on the "home"-miners) and they will drop out of mining (unless they do it for the bitcoins themselves, but I doubt that). The question is if such company can get enough leverage to pull such trick.

That's a possibility, the main reasons that I think mining companies will make for a faster, more efficient system is because a company can get bulk discounts on capital and energy, can afford R&D, and can expand rapidly.

Stock update: 496 shares have been sold so far, which means that only ~250 more are needed before operations begin.  I project that this will be met by the end of the week, especially if the current rate of selling continues.

where do you plan on putting 30 rigs and how do you plan on keeping them cool

The rigs will be housed in a pole-barn that I own, and will be cooled using geothermal technology (already existing infrastructure.)

Do you have the capabilities to provide 21000 watts of power throughout said pole-barn.  If not, do you plan to have electricians bid on how much it would cost to upgrade the existing electrical infrastructure to support that many rigs?

Yes, I too would like to know how you expect to be able to provide proper power and cooling to these machines.

You seem to have left both out of all of your equations. In () are my expected answers. Please surprise me. I don't think you've thought this out as well as you think you have.

Do you have dedicated staff that will be monitoring these? (No?)
Do you have anyone familiar with datacenter design laying out your space? (No?)
Do you have commitment from electricians to properly wire your space? (No?)
What kind of network connection are you planning on providing for these machines? (None/Home DSL?)
How are you planning on attaching them to said network connection? (No plans.)
Do you actually understand what is necessary to cool the amount of jules you're talking about here? (No.)

Seriously, you are not going to cool something like this with any infrastructure already in place unless you were previously using it to host a nuclear reactor or something equally ridiculous.

I don't expect to be putting all 39 rigs in at once.  As it is, the 200A breaker box currently installed will provide sufficient power until the business grows enough to warrant upgrading it.  With the higher capacity box will come lower energy prices, but this is all well into the future and after the business is well established.


At first, no, mostly because there are only going to be around 5 rigs to start, but as the business grows, this will be something looked into.  That's not to say they won't be attended to when the business starts up, but there won't be a dedicated staff.
Yes.
Yes.
I'm not sure if you're asking for how I'm going to connect them within the LAN or the quality of my internet connection.  The former will be accomplished using switches and CAT5 cables, the second is a DSL connection.
Switches, CAT5 cables, and a wireless router.
Yes I do.  The existing infrastructure I spoke of is the open-loop geothermal cooling system in place, which can easily be upgraded as the business expands.

edit: 567 shares have been sold, less than 200 more needed to begin!

Ok, now I have to bite. What WERE you doing in there previously?

The people who owned it before went bankrupt, so I was able to pick it up really cheap at an auction.  They were using it for climate controlled storage I believe... but they took all of the fancy climate control equipment.  They left the geothermal well though.  It's been sitting empty since, property taxes on it are pretty cheap so I just considered it an investment.  I am happy that I am able to finally put it to good use.

200A measured in 120v, right?  Well that's 24000w right there (technically, 19200w usable using the 80% rule).  Regardless, sounds like it'll be a fine setup.

I'll buy a couple of shares if I can figure out how to use the silly stock exchange system.

That is correct, however I will also be experimenting with rigs with PSUs on 240V.  Like I said, this is going to be starting small, so upgrading the box will be something of a landmark point in the company's timeline.

Once the web interface comes into effect for GLBSE, I think there will be many more people involved who were turned off by the command line setup.  Nefario is very good about helping figure it out for those who are interested until that time though.

edit: Only 60 or so more shares are needed until the first rigs will be bought.  I am confident this will occur before the end of the week.

I have a feeling that inexperience is going to come around and bite you.

I'm going to bet that the geothermal climate control wasn't designed with that amount of internal heat generation in mind.  If it's like most then it's designed to keep the temperature constant vs outdoor temperatures if it was designed for storage.  It'll work for a bit but once the geothermal sink gets saturated with heat you'll loose most of your cooling capacity.  I'd have an engineer experienced with that system run the numbers you're looking at to see if it's even capable of handling that amount of heat on a constant basis.

Meh.  Open the windows = problem solved.  :P

No, but seriously, I'd get going with mining, THEN worry about adding additional cooling as necessary when the geothermal isn't able to keep up.  It'd be a waste of money to worry about the cooling system first.  Sure, it might not keep up.  Worst case scenario?  Some of the miners are shut down for a few days while a better cooling system is put in place.  Worst case scenario by worrying about it right now?  Fewer rigs to mine with, since funds would be used towards getting professional opinions.  And a later startup date, since he would be delaying the purchase of equipment until said professionals came back to him with info.

As a shareholder, I vote for getting mining rigs up and running ASAP, then deal with any issues that crop up as they arise.

Voting is up and running, so the share issuer can put motions to the shareholders. This seems like something that could use the voting feature.

Today, enough shares have been bought to give me the confidence that there is sufficient interest in this venture and that operations can commence.  I will be withdrawing the funds raised from GLBSE and converting them to USD on MtGox.com.  The funds will be transferred to a dwolla.com account and then deposited into my bank account.  At this point, I will order the rigs, and assemble them upon arrival.  The central computer they will be pointed at is already available.

The amount of BTC raised at the time of withdrawal is 483, or 644 shares worth of funds.  At the exchange rate of $7.4USD/BTC, this will raise over $3500USD.  I have revised the build used for the rig such that each rig will cost $1160 and is capable of producing > 1400 Mhash/sec.  The funds raised will allow for the purchase of 3 of these rigs, for a total output of ~4200 Mhash/sec.  Using a difficulty of 250000, the first 50 BTC will be generated in about 3 days. 

I have initiated a vote for shareholders of the business concerning the reissuing and repricing of unsold shares.  The file attached to the vote contains the following content:

Vote Start:   Wednesday May 18, 2011 - 2:00 AM
Vote End:      Friday May 20, 2011 - 12:00 AM
Vote Num:   000001
Vote issue:   Reissuing and repricing unsold shares

This vote is being held to determine the shareholders' opinions
on the matter of reissuing and repricing current unsold shares
from .75 BTC/share to 1.0 BTC/share.  These shares would be
offered until May 25, 2011, at which point another vote would
be taken on reissuing and repricing.  The purpose of this is
to reward early investors for their greater risks as well as
raise funds quicker once the reputation and legitimacy of the
business is solidified.

A vote in favor (yes) will support a reissuing and repricing
of unsold shares to 1.0 BTC/share.

A vote against (no) will support a continuation of current
pricing of the shares until May 25, 2011, at which point
another vote will be taken.

I would like to thank those who have invested this early in this business, because without you it never would have left the drawing board.  Together we will break new ground and pave the way to the future.  Others will follow where you have led, but you are the pioneers who blazed the trail, and I can not thank you enough.

I would also like to thank Nefario: I would like to thank you for the opportunities you've provided not only me but the entire Bitcoin community.  This has been a huge success, far greater than what I anticipated, and I feel that it's just the beginning.  We will grow together, each of us benefiting the other as much as we individually benefit.  You have provided the solid ground for others to build upon, the ability to reach untold heights that could not be reached alone.  You have my gratitude.

I will continue posting updates on the status of the funds/rigs/etc. as things progress.  The hardest part is over, but there is still much work to do.

Update: The vote to reissue and reprice the shares has passed.  A total of 3539 unsold shares were taken down and reissued for 1 BTC / share.  We have also made the purchases for the first five rigs, coming in under the expected costs/rig.  I would once again like to thank everyone who has invested in the company and put their trust in me.  You've shown more support than I could have ever dreamed, and this company will succeed because of you.

what rigs did you buy?

theses calculations are based on the current difficult of ~250000 aren't they? have you predictions for how the numbers work out as the difficulty increases? you could run some scenarios with a steady 20%, 30%, 40%, etc. increase in difficulty at each re-target. I saw in the video that there is 15% of the profit re-invested, so I guess your hashing rate will be increasing over time due to that but the hashing rate increase may not keep up with the difficulty increase so the BTC earned per share per month will be decreasing.

perhaps you could give some numbers with predictions like:
10 shares = 0.001 stake
month 1 = 2.63 BTC
month 2 = 2 BTC
month 3 = 1.2 BTC
month 4 = 0.5 BTC
etc.

then the potential investor could get a good idea how quickly they could expect to earn the inital investment back

to buy 100 shares i just need to do

bmc.py buy 100 SIN 1

correct?

You need to do:
bmc.py buy 100 SIN 100000000

The GLBSE client doesn't use decimal points yet, so 1 BTC is entered as "100000000".  If you type:
bmc.py buy 100 SIN 1

that would actually be entering a buy order for 100 shares at 0.00000001 BTC.

For more info and examples, check out the "Numbers" and "Buying" sections of the tutorial:
https://gitorious.org/black-market/pages/Tutorial

They weren't prebuilt computers, so I can't link you to a spec page.


Actually those numbers were based on the previous difficulty (~150000).  I am wary about speculating on the numbers as time goes on, for several reasons: its hard to tell how much of an increase will occur until the increase gets closer, it is hard to determine what effect that increase will have on network hashrate, and its impossible to speculate on what the value of BTC will be even in the next few days, let alone in the next few months.  All of this factors in to the profitability of the company.  The growth rate of 15% was a number that I pulled off the top of my head, the number will be much higher than that (probably around 45-60%) in order to stay competitive.  Once again, I try not to speculate too far into the future, but the predicted rate of return of investment was 4-6 months with the company operating at levels that would require all shares to be sold.  At this early stage, it will take longer until more people can trust in the validity of the business.

Hey - I'm interested in buying some shares, but the stock exchange client is *very* confusing - are they still selling at 0.75BTc or at 1.0BTc now?

I just checked, and most of them are selling at 1.0 BTC right now, but a few shares are available for 0.99999999 BTC.

If you do this command:
bmc.py buy 100 SIN 100000000

You'll be creating a buy order for 100 shares of SIN and you're saying you're willing to pay up to a maximum of 1.0 BTC per share.  If there are any shares available for less than 1.0 BTC, you'll get the lower asking price for those shares.

Tawsix how are the machines coming when will they be ready and what are their specs?

The inability of the stock exchange to use normal units (0.1 BTC, etc.) is indeed confusing and annoying.

+1

It displays in Satoshis and could probably be rewritten locally quickly to display the numbers in a more human-readable way... as this is planned for the next version of the client anyways afaik, that's not too much of an issue imho.

Also as a side note:
in some countries you have a decimal seperator that looks like this "," and in other countries you would use this "." - could easily lead to input errors or confusion (1.000 would mean one thousand for me and be equivalent to "1.000,00", but someone else might just say it's a one with 3 zeroes after the decimal point).

Thanks for your help, guys, I've managed to buy my shares :) If/when dividends are paid, how are you going to do so, Tawsix? Is it via GLBSE too? And I'd like to, at least, know what gfx card and how many you're putting in per rig - we'd also be able to help out with the math, that way. Also, which is your "main thread" where you'll be providing updates - is it this one?

i'd like some light shed on this matter too please.

Interesting - there's now 231 shares selling below Tawsix's main block at 1btc. 175 of those shares are selling below the original asking price of 0.75btc. All this uncertainty is making buying cheap right now. Wish I had more bitcoins to spare.

Indeed. I would buy more stock but I am not going to risk any more money without SOME proof. If I loose $10 I am not sad but despite logging in a few times in the last few days he has not responded to my PM nor to the other shareholders questions.

No confidence is bad for business indeed.

Dishwara is doing a reasonable job with the same type of business (at least he has something up and running). Some info would be nice, especially when things are not up and running yet.

I got a reply to my PM.
Seems updates are on the way.

I can confirm.
I got one too.

Update: The components for the rigs will be arriving on schedule tomorrow.  Once they arrive I will assemble them and get them up and running as quickly as possible.  Over the last few days I have been preparing for the units to arrive, so all infrastructure is already in place.

As outlined in the last vote concerning the price of unsold shares, there is another motion up which reads as follows:

Vote Start:   Wednesday May 25, 2011
Vote End:      Friday May 27, 2011
Vote Num:   000002
Vote issue:   Reissuing and repricing unsold shares

This vote is being held to determine the shareholders' opinions
on the matter of reissuing and repricing current unsold shares
from 1 BTC/share to 1.25 BTC/share.  These shares would be
offered until June 1, 2011, at which point another vote would
be taken on reissuing and repricing.  The purpose of this is
to reward early investors for their greater risks as well as
raise funds quicker once the reputation and legitimacy of the
business is solidified.

A vote in favor (yes) will support a reissuing and repricing
of unsold shares to 1.25 BTC/share.

A vote against (no) will support a continuation of current
pricing of the shares until June 1, 2011, at which point
another vote will be taken.

After the rigs are up and running, I will link to the account on the pool the miners are pointed to.

You did mention any machine specs.

As for the chosen pool, for the machines to operate on, could a motion used to choose the pool?

Each rig will be running 3 HD5850s, AMD Sempron processor, 1 GB ram, and Ubuntu 11.04.

The rigs will be mining in the bitcoinpool.com pool.

Does this also increase your dept towards the company (aka. "the other 4000 shares") or do you still plan to pay 0.75 BTC for these over time?

I will vote "nay" on my share(s), since currently a lot of offers are below your price (some even below the initial 75 Bitcents). Until these are sold, no money will come in to the company. I guess after the first rigs were assembled and you publish a nice (indoor) picture of that a few more ppl. might be interested in investing.

I will be paying back my shares at .75 BTC / share regardless of the price of the shares being sold.

Update: All components have been delivered.  Once we have the machines up and running, I'll be posting pictures and a link to the pooled miner account.  This post is from the template computer while Ubuntu builds itself up!

Awesome! When does the vote for the price increase expire / when do we have to vote by?

It expires tonight at midnight.

Great good to know. :)

Will you be overclocking?

Update: The first rig is set up and is currently mining at btcmine.com  We'll have the other 4 rigs up tomorrow.  The stats on the first rig can be downloaded here: http://btcmine.com/api/getstats/020d055f94131c4b29baeca9915c7e04917bb18e/ .

Once again, thank you to all of the people who have invested!

The vote to reissue and reprice the stocks that have so far gone unsold is 430 yes, 498 no, so we will not be changing the pricing.


Yes, as well as testing different miners and different arguments.

What hashrate are you seeing?

I'm currently seeing:

"total_payout": "3.90",
"total_bounty": "0.83973661",
"confirmed_bounty": "0.00459335",
"solved_blocks": 1,
"online_status": true,
"estimated_bounty": "0.22935040",
"round_shares": 1254,
"unconfirmed_bounty": "0.83514326",
"hashrate": "1651.91",
"solved_shares": 44491

Which is great. Excited to see more. A collection URLs of where things are running when more then one mining machine is up would be great for my stats.

Huh? Are you and Tawsix the same person?

I highly suggest you research Eligius.  Their payout system is far more intelligent and secure, rather than trusting the pool operator of btcmine.  They offer more transparency, which will cause a greater confidence in your business proposal.

Also, may I buy one share? :D

Why not point each rig to a different pool, that way if btcmine is having a bad day, less blocks solved. Not all the machines have a bad day.
Say point one to btcmine, another to eligius, another to bitcoinpool and so on.

How and when will payments be made? (i suppose at the end of each month?)

Update: Four machines are currently up and running.  The fifth rig is not currently running due to the aforementioned DOA PSU.  The replacement part has been ordered.  The next round of rigs are scheduled to be ordered within the next few days.


No, although I commend that person for the witty name.



Currently the main objective is to get all the rigs up and running at optimal speeds.  Once the rigs are up and running, we'll be looking into various avenues as far as pools go.


Dividends will be paid out monthly at the least.

I don't really know how to use the Glbse thing I'd like to purchase the shares. Think can run me thru briefly on using it? And how are you going to pay out to ur shareholders?

Currently GLBSE is using a very rudimentary command line program to operate, and it's very difficult to explain.  My advice to you is to try your best to follow the tutorial offered on the website, and contact Nefario if you have any problems.  In any case, GLBSE is down right now (hopefully to implement a web interface to make it user-friendly!) so even if you got it to work, you wouldn't be able to buy anything.

GLBSE's program has a "pay" command that pays out dividends to shareholders, which is what we'll be using.

Dividend payment is now functional, you can now use it to pay dividends to your shareholders.

bmc.py pay ASSET AMOUNT

Asset for you should be SIN, and the amount is the total amount, it will be taken from your account split across all shares (that you don't own) and paid to the shareholders.

Any problems just pm me.

With regards the web interface it should be available to use by June 6th.

Nefario.

This is probably in the thread somewhere and I just forgot about it, but once all of your own shares are "paid off", what will the payout be to investors?  Is it just a 50/50 distribution of profits between yourself and the other shareholders?

Yes he will receive based on the amount of shares he owns just like anyone else.

sell:3535@75000000:SIN:1306956626

ok....

i didnt think anyone owned that many shares.

If only I was making more than .05 bitcoins a day, I'd invest!

Good luck to you.

Kain, you could evaluate whether CentiMine fits your circumstances better. Bascially 1 bitcent shares into a mining contract. The GLBSE symbol is CM400, you can find the thread to evaluate the CentiMine proposal here: https://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=8642.0 (https://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=8642.0).

It doesn't really mean that someone really has. The way the system works is buy and sell orders can be placed even if you don't have the bitcoin or shares. However once a matching order has been found, it will try to process your order, and if by that time you don't have the needed btc or shares then it just removes your order from the market.

So somebody could place fake orders to simulate demand/supply? Hmmm not cool. Leaves the market open to manipulation.

indeed like this sell order here leads people into thinking that the company is going to crash or something, and thus trying to sell theirs as well, making prices go down a lot.
i think that at least sell orders should be checked before being put on the market.

It is something I could change but it would require the person making the order having the amounts in their account at all times until their order is fullfilled.

i don't see why that shouldn't happen, since if he doesn't have that amount the order will just be canceled any way.

I relisted the shares back to their original price.  The new price that was voted on by the shareholders was being exploited and I believe that made investment dried up.  I will also be taking direct orders for shares in the event of continued undercutting in the event someone wishes to invest directly into the company instead of saving a few milibits: if they send me a PM with their GLBSE user ID and the amount of shares they want, I'll send them an address and how much to send, then manually transfer the shares to them once I receive the BTC.  Hopefully that in conjunction with getting the rigs all operational will stimulate further investment.

I think its a good idea until all shares are sold.

And how is it going by the way? How many miners up, how many more planned, hashrate, and what is the dividend plan?

I think having more discussion and details would get more people interested, which would raise more capital for investing, which would generate more interest, etc. etc.

I know I check the forums a few times a day looking for updates.

Also, we should vote maybe on whether we want dividends or to re-invest in more miners? Or is are the miners just to be purchased from the proceeds of selling shares?

Anyway great job so far!

So... any of us who bought shares after the price raise got screwed.

Well that's the market, it goes up and down, and no one put a gun to your head to buy(did they?).

Right now, two miners are currently running consistently.  Replacement motherboards are currently being shipped so that the original five rigs can be up and running (the parts are scheduled to arrive on Monday.)  Along with that order are the parts for two more rigs, which will bring the total to seven.  Current hash rate can be found here (http://btcmine.com/api/getstats/020d055f94131c4b29baeca9915c7e04917bb18e).  Planned hashrate once all seven rigs are up should be over seven GHash/sec.  The dividend plan is currently being fleshed out, possibly a weekly dividend with a monthly bonus to cover the difference once expenses and growth are accounted for, or a straight monthly dividend.  Production of the rigs will first be used to pay for electricity, then for new miners.  The remaining profit will be paid in dividends.  The amount of growth will be discussed once all the current miners purchased from the initial selling of the IPO are up and running.


The short answer is yes, 25% of what you paid for your share went to someone who bought in for the sole purpose of undercutting the IPO.  I apologize for this, I did not foresee that happening.

Yes they did.

They had a 9mm and an extremely keen interest in new types of investing.

thats not the point here.
point is there was a vote to raise to 1BTC, then simply they were put back down to 0.75BTC, after we bought them with no vote no nothing, which means those of us who bought them at 1BTC, just lost 0.25BTC per share just like that no vote no nothing.
So yeah we did get kind of screwed...

Apology accepted and no hard feelings.

Well, you do put the desired purchase price when you run the transaction... If you put 1BTC there instead of .75BTC - who is there to blame?

Actually I did make a bid for .75 however it seems I was a few minutes late and they were not accepted as the price raise had already gone into affect.
So I had to bid at the raised price. So I blame the monkey that lives in the internet that made my transactions slow.

So, you willingly made your bid at a higher price. Not sure that you're entitled to blame anyone but yourself for this...

I bought a few shares recently for 50 Bitcents (after the increase to 1 BTC/share), so it's 100% your own "fault" for bidding a higher price. You would have gotten them cheaper too.

I told you already I blame the monkey!

GET OFF MY LAWN!

Update: new rigs are on schedule to arrive on Monday, along with replacement parts.  Also, forum user sharp was kind enough to put together some graphs showing various data collected from BTCmine.com concerning our rigs, it can be found here (http://shrp.me/sin/).

Here is a hotlink to one of the graphs:
http://shrp.me/sin/hashrate-daily.png

We are currently discussing dividend payout in anticipation of coming to full capacity, so any thoughts on the matter are welcome.

sell:9999@74999999:SIN:1307367040

http://twitter.com/#!/GLBSE/status/77729124382294016

i thought you were keeping 5001.

EDIT: looks just like another bogus sell

Shall I put up a sell order for 999999999999999999 shares?! ::)

Anyone can sell as many shares as they wish currently, after no more shares are in an account, the order will just vanish by becoming invalid. I believe the 3535@0.75 BTC is still the "original" sell order by Tawsix (who is the ONLY person who cannot put up arbitrarily large sell orders).

I'm really sorry about this guys.

When I started glbse I was unsure how to handle this sort of issue, should people have their buy and sell orders cancelled because the withdraw btc from their account?

So I decided that people could make any order they liked, and it would show, but only be processed if there was a matching order for it. If any order that matches doesn't have enough shares or btc in their account then the order is removed.

I though people would be civil about it but it has turned out not to be the case.

So from tomorrow I will make the change.

That to sell an asset you must have at least that number in your account, if you remove the asset from your account (using transfer) then your order will be removed, and the same will be for your bitcoin. You will be required to hold bitcoin in your account to cover all your positions.

Feedback is appreciated.

Nefario.

I think this is necessary, given the rather unprofessional attitude of some of the users of the exchange.  Honestly, there are few instances when over-asking would be necessary anyhow.

i think this is the best solution.

Good move!

I don't, as there might be the case that someone wants to buy for example up to 5000 shares, has only money for 3000 in his account and is in the process of setting up a transfer to get the money for the remaining 2000 too.

As timing can be very important, it might be that he buys already a few hundred shares and the rest after the money arrives due to some fluctuations.

I don't really see this as an issue honestly, it might be even better to just display values and no amounts of shares in offers and asks, as these cannot be relied on anyways. Also not with the new change (I could try to buy 1 share at SIN and another at dishwara while having only 1 BTC, so once one of these two is bought the other order goes the way of the dodo).

This would just lead to people with a lot of money on GLBSE trolling compared to anyone being able to put up inflated sells/orders.

A possible solution would be then to freeze any money/shares that you offer - but this again limits the ability to bid on several assets.

The IRL stock brokers I use only accept sell orders for up to the number of shares you presently hold. That's fair.
They will accept a buy order for any number of shares (subject to credit controls) and then bill you for whatever excess is not in your account should the buy order complete. They do have interest rates, the right to liquidate your other positions and a lien over your firstborn. I don't think GLBSE can do this and maintain it's anonymous nature so best to stop buy orders that are not matched by funds at hand.

The new rigs have arrived, getting on it right now.  I'll update later tonight once everything is settled, but I won't be able to respond to anything until quite late this evening.  Here we go!

This is the way it should be done.

If someone wants to post up a buy, but does not have enough BTC in their account, that is fine.  If they want to post up a sell, but do not have that many shares of the company to sell, they should not be able to post it.

Great job Tawsix. I'm a second vote for also having a miner on eligius.st, but pools are always changing, and you're in the best position to be monitoring what's best for the shareholders.

I also have a question, which I'm sure has been addressed before, but:

Assuming (locked out of my bmc machine currently for real numbers):
50% of the shares are yours
25% of the shares have been unsold
25% of the shares are in the hands of shareholders

Does that mean that 50% of the months dividends are evenly distributed amongst the 25% of shareholders (and your 50%), or are the open 25% of the shares going back into rigs?

So like, let's assume that I'm the only investor, owning 25% of the shares, and SIN generates 100 coins:

Does that mean I'd be getting 50 coins or 25?

You would get 50.  I only receive dividends worth the current sold shares + 1.

Update: Today is a good day, we've successfully gotten all seven rigs up and running!  Tomorrow we will be migrating from btcmine.com to other pools (mining simultaneously on more than one pool with each card.)  I will also be continuing work on a cooling system to allow for better overclocking.

Once again, thanks to everyone for your support and advice!  We rode out the bumps and have entered production mode!  Next on the agenda: dividends!

Great job getting more rigs up and running.

As for dividends: I'm for dividend payouts. It will boost investor confidence and hopefully encourage more new investment to fund expansion. Dividends will also reward your early investor who took a risk on your when the detractors were saying no. I still pledge to reinvest any initial dividend payout into SIN.

I wish I've found this earlier. Keep up the great job !

any news on payouts?

Check the other thread: http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=8167.300

There has only been 1 dividend payout thus far.